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04-10-2018, 07:04 PM | #51 | |||
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You don't know India's life when she was a successful white male, so you're not qualified to reach the conclusion that her experience is comparable to being a "real" woman. Nor can my perception be changed by the fact that some people who face transsexuality suffer depression. I sympathise, but I don't believe their depression will end by insisting everyone pretends they are exactly the same as those of us born as women. You may have seen in my post that I have nothing at all against transsexual women. But they are just that, trans women. They are not the same as me. And like I said, although they are worth as much and are just as entitled to be happy and to full rights under the law as you have mentioned, they are not women in the sense that I am. I hope India has wonderful life. I wish her no ill will. But she is different from me. Women have been oppressed for centuries. And just as we're getting some kind of equality, men are dictating to us what we should call ourselves, and that any man who identifies as a woman should be regarded as one. I have never seen a female to male transsexual crusade on the telly, or anywhere else, insisting that they are "real men". And I believe that is because men are used to being heard and demanding things. Last edited by Livia; 04-10-2018 at 07:05 PM. |
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04-10-2018, 07:07 PM | #52 | |||
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04-10-2018, 07:45 PM | #53 | ||
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TBQFH I feel jealous of anyone who is as "privileged" as this lady, to actually feel anything at all about these issues which are realistically just paranoid ****ing nonsense with literally ZERO evidence base, because I sort of feel like she can't have many legitimate problems going on in their life whatsoever.
Well. She didn't until she did this. It sounds like she does now |
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04-10-2018, 07:50 PM | #54 | |||
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04-10-2018, 08:21 PM | #55 | ||
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I can see the woman's point. I don't actually see trans people the same as women, either. To be fair, as a heterosexual female, it doesn't really matter to me if a woman is a lesbian, or if a guy wants to be a woman, since anyone not an unmarried heterosexual male is not something I'd be interested in as other than a friend. But the thing is, people who were raised as men, even if they thought themselves female, have been socialized with all the advantages males are given when they are socialized as males in our society. They will always have those advantages, even if they remove their penises. They still act like men in ways that really matter (outside of the bedroom). Just look at India as an example. India constantly interrupted other women, talked constantly with that condescending attitude virtually all men have (and women don't). I mean, you can change your sex organs, but you're still the same person inside.
So sorry to disagree with the masses on this one. I'm not that bothered, though, about trans people. I feel that they can be good or bad, depending on the person, just like everyone else. I just don't think they're quite the same as people who were born a woman. (It's like the difference between someone who is straight or gay. They may have the same gender, but there's not that much real overlap). |
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04-10-2018, 09:49 PM | #56 | ||
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I didn't watch most of that series so I can't comment. |
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04-10-2018, 09:51 PM | #57 | ||
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Sexist and factually incorrect comment. People can be condescending, people of all variations. Genders and sexes, however, cannot.
Last edited by Marsh.; 04-10-2018 at 09:52 PM. |
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05-10-2018, 08:39 AM | #58 | |||
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And yes, she was quite calm and reasonable. But then when she was a man she had a career in broadcast television. One thing I've noticed... it's quite telling that the strongest posts, with the worst slurs against the "feminist", are from men. Last edited by Livia; 05-10-2018 at 08:50 AM. |
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05-10-2018, 08:40 AM | #59 | |||
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05-10-2018, 08:46 AM | #60 | |||
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I hope the police find them... and they could if they really wanted... and hit them with the full force of the law. And all penises to go to male prisons. Last edited by Livia; 05-10-2018 at 08:47 AM. |
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05-10-2018, 08:51 AM | #61 | |||
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self-oscillating
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The problem with that video was that it had 2 activists from polar extremes of the discussion. Neither are reflective of the norm and as such, anything they say should be treated with a large pinch of salt in relation to the topic.
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05-10-2018, 09:00 AM | #62 | |||
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Ahhhh… the voice of reason.
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05-10-2018, 10:50 AM | #63 | |||
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05-10-2018, 11:03 AM | #64 | |||
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laura carter stan
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Of course technically trans women aren't the same as other women, but I don't get why some people continually go on about it. "YOU ARE DIFFERENT FROM ME AND YOU WERE NOT BORN A WOMAN!!!!" Like yeah that's kind of what being trans means. Just all seems a bit pointless and nasty really
Last edited by Greg!; 05-10-2018 at 11:04 AM. |
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05-10-2018, 11:53 AM | #65 | ||
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Secondly, I didn't say she was calm and reasonable in the house, hence why I stated I didn't watch all of her time in the BB house. I don't think in this instance it's got anything to do with it. Man or woman in broadcast television would be media trained well enough to hold a civil televised debate. Last edited by Marsh.; 05-10-2018 at 11:58 AM. |
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05-10-2018, 12:22 PM | #66 | ||
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I don't think it is sexist. I think you're living in la la land, if you don't think that the vast majority of women in the world are brought up that men are better, smarter, etc. Women are expected to spend their lives being what men want them to be. That's an overwhelming message coming through right now, and it was even worse when I was growing up. You can't spend the formative years of your life getting these messages, and be the same as someone who didn't. Nothing sexist about saying so. Turn on the TV. How much TV allotment is for men playing sports? How much are those men paid? How much for women? How much are they paid? Am I making sense yet? When women have equal opportunities and are treated equally by the media, that would bea societal start. But even if children are brought up by parents who try to raise their child in a nonsexist way, school and the media will socialize them by their gender.
Last edited by Chero; 05-10-2018 at 12:26 PM. |
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05-10-2018, 12:33 PM | #67 | ||
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You said men are condescending and women are not. That's incorrect and a sexist statement. You want to fight sexism, maybe start with your own attitudes. Last edited by Marsh.; 05-10-2018 at 12:59 PM. |
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05-10-2018, 12:44 PM | #68 | |||
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05-10-2018, 12:45 PM | #69 | |||
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05-10-2018, 12:58 PM | #70 | ||
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05-10-2018, 01:05 PM | #71 | |||
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Every time there's someone on TV campaigning hard for transsexual rights, it's going to be a trans female insisting she's a woman. Never, ever, heard a female to male do it. Maybe that's why transwoman have SO much support from men? The fact that the "feminist" in the OP has had death threats and pictures of her children posted online, as happens to a lot of women who stand up against the idea that trans woman and born woman are exactly the same, demonstrates the kind of response born women get when they disagree. Where is the outrage over that? Maybe their not screaming in our faces, but their tactics are ****ing hysterical and outrageous.* * I have to say I don't find all transwoman to be this way. Just the militants. Last edited by Livia; 05-10-2018 at 01:06 PM. |
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05-10-2018, 01:28 PM | #72 | ||
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I don't condone anything that has happened to the "feminist" in the OP. But I daresay the strong response she has received isn't something that women will get in general for having a different opinion, but because she gives that opinion alongside all of her offensive views in her higher profile and militant ways. Just as those trans people who put themselves forward as the campaigners for what they believe in are the ones that get the most abuse too. Never heard a female to male say it, because they don't need to. Maybe they're more accepted. Last edited by Marsh.; 05-10-2018 at 01:29 PM. |
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05-10-2018, 01:47 PM | #73 | ||
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0_o
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05-10-2018, 01:48 PM | #74 | ||
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It's not one sided. I don't think there are many men who speak out about the rights of women/transwomen for me to make any comparison as to their treatment. Last edited by Marsh.; 05-10-2018 at 01:49 PM. |
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05-10-2018, 01:49 PM | #75 | ||
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Its one side of the debate recieving abuse. Check out the replies under any transactivists twitter post on this topic, for example. Then contrast it with a feminists. And then contrast that with a man saying the same thing as the feminist. Seriously, everyone who thinks this is two way should do this...
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Last edited by Vicky.; 05-10-2018 at 01:50 PM. |
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