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Old 11-01-2019, 06:43 PM   #76
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My own kid is female to male trans... and we are just starting the process of undergoing those changes... and I know for a fact HE would want to start out and end up in a Male ward... (if Male wards are even necessary) because HE thinks, feels, and identifies as male. When you go into a hospital you get assigned a bed based on your recovery period... not based on your gender going in...so if location matters and he will need attention to his male physical body... then he needs to be where that can happen... not in labour, delivery, or hysterectomys.
This issue won't arise for your child, as there are already mixed wards in your hospitals. In the UK you can if you want choose to see either a male or female GP for instance, and most wards are single sex. As I have said umpteem times its self identification that I have an issue with as it open to abuse. If the person is transitioning or has transitioned I have no issue
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Old 11-01-2019, 06:44 PM   #77
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Of course I do!, itís lack of care killing patients not trans patients.

I donít think the average persons is going to be turned on by you taking a dump in a cardboard shaped hat behind the curtain let alone a trans one.
As I previously said that has to do with staffing, or people not doing their jobs properly it has nothing to do with the issue being discussed
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Old 11-01-2019, 06:45 PM   #78
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Didnít realise if you live in a different country it cancels out real life.
a cursory glance at the OP is your friend
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Old 11-01-2019, 06:56 PM   #79
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The problem with gender is that people are trying to make it out to be this unknowable and unclassifiable thing and it's just not feasible in situations like this. I think if you have transitioned or have already begun that journey than you should be allowed on your preferred gender's ward but somebody identifying as the other gender isn't enough to consider them that gender in situations like this.
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Old 11-01-2019, 07:00 PM   #80
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As I previously said that has to do with staffing, or people not doing their jobs properly it has nothing to do with the issue being discussed
Itís an example of how you are making out that you are at risk from a trans person being on a ward when in reality itís lack of staff putting you at risk.
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Old 11-01-2019, 07:02 PM   #81
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a cursory glance at the OP is your friend
Regardless of the country where is the evidence of trans attacking people on hospital wards.
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Old 11-01-2019, 08:02 PM   #82
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The problem with gender is that people are trying to make it out to be this unknowable and unclassifiable thing and it's just not feasible in situations like this. I think if you have transitioned or have already begun that journey than you should be allowed on your preferred gender's ward but somebody identifying as the other gender isn't enough to consider them that gender in situations like this.
Agree with this.
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Old 11-01-2019, 09:24 PM   #83
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The problem with gender is that people are trying to make it out to be this unknowable and unclassifiable thing and it's just not feasible in situations like this. I think if you have transitioned or have already begun that journey than you should be allowed on your preferred gender's ward but somebody identifying as the other gender isn't enough to consider them that gender in situations like this.
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Agree with this.
I think the issue here is that you're imagining some big burly bald bloke sat in a bed in a female ward saying "Wot of it luv? I'm a woman!" whilst aggressively gesturing at his penis and winking.

If someone can provide a real-world example of that or anything similar actually happening, rather than a bizarre concern that it COULD theoretically happen, then there's a discussion to be had. Until then it's frankly all just blind outrage about nothing.
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Old 11-01-2019, 09:44 PM   #84
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I think the issue here is that you're imagining some big burly bald bloke sat in a bed in a female ward saying "Wot of it luv? I'm a woman!" whilst aggressively gesturing at his penis and winking.
This sounds like LT in a Carry On film.
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Old 11-01-2019, 09:50 PM   #85
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I think the issue here is that you're imagining some big burly bald bloke sat in a bed in a female ward saying "Wot of it luv? I'm a woman!" whilst aggressively gesturing at his penis and winking.

If someone can provide a real-world example of that or anything similar actually happening, rather than a bizarre concern that it COULD theoretically happen, then there's a discussion to be had. Until then it's frankly all just blind outrage about nothing.
well I mean this did blow up recent..
Youtube video
Click to view this video on Youtube
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Old 11-01-2019, 10:12 PM   #86
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well I mean this did blow up recent..
Youtube video
Click to view this video on Youtube
Wow I knew things were bad in the English NHS but I didn't know they had resorted to opening up wards in GameStop in the United States! That's surely the more pressing issue here.
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Old 11-01-2019, 10:32 PM   #87
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well I mean this did blow up recent..
Youtube video
Click to view this video on Youtube
That's nothing to do with hospitals though.

That said, it is ****ing hilarious, it's up there with that guy who worked in a vape store chimping out over nothing
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Old 11-01-2019, 11:02 PM   #88
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Wow I knew things were bad in the English NHS but I didn't know they had resorted to opening up wards in GameStop in the United States! That's surely the more pressing issue here.
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That's nothing to do with hospitals though.

That said, it is ****ing hilarious, it's up there with that guy who worked in a vape store chimping out over nothing


Oh yeah transsexuals like that only exist in America of course, and donít go to hospitals, they only go GameStop. I guess trans people in the UK have access to far more advanced forms of hormone treatment, yeah thatís it
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Old 11-01-2019, 11:32 PM   #89
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This issue won't arise for your child, as there are already mixed wards in your hospitals. In the UK you can if you want choose to see either a male or female GP for instance, and most wards are single sex. As I have said umpteem times its self identification that I have an issue with as it open to abuse. If the person is transitioning or has transitioned I have no issue
First of all... my point was that the NEED for separate wards for gender doesnt exist...if Canada's free healthcare system can run this way...why not the NHS. There is no basic rights being violated by mixed wards.

Secondly, transitioning doesnt happen overnight. At what point would you like to declare they are transitioned? The surgery takes years of planning and meds previous and multiple surgeries... but because someone else might be "uncomfortable" with someone in transition being in a shared hospital room... that's taking the pale. They aren't at any higher risk of being violated by a transgender person than they are by any stranger of any gender sharing a room or ward with them.
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Old 12-01-2019, 01:20 AM   #90
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Oh yeah transsexuals like that only exist in America of course, and donít go to hospitals, they only go GameStop. I guess trans people in the UK have access to far more advanced forms of hormone treatment, yeah thatís it
You're comparing an extreme incident in a retail establishment to what is realistically happening in hospital wards. I can only assume because you have an agenda. Again, if you have an example of something like this happening in a hospital ward then there's something to discuss. If not then you're just adding to the pile of assumptions and bull**** media hysteria.
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Old 12-01-2019, 01:22 AM   #91
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well I mean this did blow up recent..
Youtube video
Click to view this video on Youtube
I'm sorry... this has what to do with a male to female transperson molesting women in a hospital?
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Old 12-01-2019, 01:24 AM   #92
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I do laugh though. Just noticed the "MEN GET ACCESS" part of the title. As though female wards are under lock and key and a line of dribbling pervs have just been given special privileges.
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Old 12-01-2019, 01:32 AM   #93
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They aren't at any higher risk of being violated by a transgender person than they are by any stranger of any gender sharing a room or ward with them.
And realistically, that risk is absolutely miniscule, even if there WERE hoards of men posing as women because they want to assault people. It logically fails on so many levels. First of all these people have to exist in any large number (which obviously they do not). Then they need to either somehow FAKE an illness or condition to get into a hospital ward, which is ludicrous, or perhaps just carry out an opportunistic sex attack whilst being ill enough to be a hospital inpatient .

But wait.

They also have to carry out that attack in a ward, which almost universally in the UK, have four beds per room and an open door to a staffed corridor.

And there's yet more!

The assumption is that these wards are otherwise secure. They are not. I could literally drive to the nearest hospital and walk onto a ward, for any gender, and into a room on that ward, at more or less any time, and no one would stop me.

But having transsexuals on the ward as patients? Far too dangerous!

I honestly don't think more than two seconds of snap reaction outrage goes into these opinions, it's such utter nonsense.

So... With all that in mind, it's pretty clear that the problem is not ACTUAL physical safety; it's about "safe space" and the perception / comfort of being safe (much like the women's toilets debate, with the bizarre logic that a man can't just walk into one at any time anyway).

And yes of course, everyone has the right to feel safe and comfortable, especially when ill. So what's making them feel unsafe? Is it the "presence of disguised penis"?

Or are they feeling nervous precisely because of the media hysteria, the bull****, the demonising, and people online winding each other up. Hmmm.
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Old 12-01-2019, 01:36 AM   #94
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I do laugh though. Just noticed the "MEN GET ACCESS" part of the title. As though female wards are under lock and key and a line of dribbling pervs have just been given special privileges.
Indeed Merch, like I said in the last post, if someone desperately wants to assault women in a hospital they can just go to any hospital and walk in the door! The idea that you have to pose as a pre-op transexual to get onto a women's hospital ward is just... Well... It's just incorrect. If it's not a secure ward (and if it's not a psych ward, it's not a secure ward) then it's not restricted access! They don't even have set visiting hours any more.
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Old 12-01-2019, 05:29 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by Dezzy View Post
The problem with gender is that people are trying to make it out to be this unknowable and unclassifiable thing and it's just not feasible in situations like this. I think if you have transitioned or have already begun that journey than you should be allowed on your preferred gender's ward but somebody identifying as the other gender isn't enough to consider them that gender in situations like this.
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Old 12-01-2019, 08:14 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by Toy Soldier View Post
I think the issue here is that you're imagining some big burly bald bloke sat in a bed in a female ward saying "Wot of it luv? I'm a woman!" whilst aggressively gesturing at his penis and winking.

If someone can provide a real-world example of that or anything similar actually happening, rather than a bizarre concern that it COULD theoretically happen, then there's a discussion to be had. Until then it's frankly all just blind outrage about nothing.
i think page 2 of the article and already in this thread!
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Old 12-01-2019, 08:15 AM   #97
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and its not about anyone attacking anyone its about respect for the women. men and women are not the same
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Old 12-01-2019, 08:58 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by Dezzy View Post
The problem with gender is that people are trying to make it out to be this unknowable and unclassifiable thing and it's just not feasible in situations like this. I think if you have transitioned or have already begun that journey than you should be allowed on your preferred gender's ward but somebody identifying as the other gender isn't enough to consider them that gender in situations like this.
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Do people get their Dulux colour chart out to classify housemates?
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Old 12-01-2019, 09:04 AM   #99
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Indeed Merch, like I said in the last post, if someone desperately wants to assault women in a hospital they can just go to any hospital and walk in the door! The idea that you have to pose as a pre-op transexual to get onto a women's hospital ward is just... Well... It's just incorrect. If it's not a secure ward (and if it's not a psych ward, it's not a secure ward) then it's not restricted access! They don't even have set visiting hours any more.
You are the one talking about attacks which is not the main issue what about for cultural reasons reasons how do you shoehorn in the needs and rights of women to be separate on those occasions
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Last edited by Cherie; 12-01-2019 at 09:14 AM.
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Old 12-01-2019, 12:19 PM   #100
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You are the one talking about attacks which is not the main issue what about for cultural reasons reasons how do you shoehorn in the needs and rights of women to be separate on those occasions
What cultural reasons?

Wards are not private areas. They are open to countless people of both genders passing through day and night.

For modesty, they have screens, rooms and bathrooms.
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