Notices

Serious Debates & News Debate and discussion about political, moral, philosophical, celebrity and news topics.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 04-10-2019, 07:25 PM #26
parmnion's Avatar
parmnion parmnion is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 41,486

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Hallie
BB18: Deborah


parmnion parmnion is offline
Senior Member
parmnion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 41,486

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Hallie
BB18: Deborah


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezzy View Post
Plenty of people go through terrible trauma that would break a person and they don't become abusers or racists or homophobes or whatever. To use that as an excuse is to insult those who have suffered trauma. Even people raised surrounded by bigotry can't blame their upbringing and I speak from experience. Blaming society, upbringing, trauma, it's all excuses to justify hatred. So many of us have suffered from these things yet we don't become fuelled by hatred and violence.

The gang in question have no one to blame but themselves.

I dunno, you might be right

but what about the media, Facebook, twiiter..Snapchat. ..etc etc....somethings made these kids act like that?


What is it?

They don't just wake up one day and do that?


Or do they?

Is this the UK society these days, bored kids...having a laugh?

Last edited by parmnion; 04-10-2019 at 07:28 PM.
parmnion is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 07:32 PM #27
Tom4784 Tom4784 is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 45,095
Tom4784 Tom4784 is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 45,095
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by parmnion View Post
I dunno, you might be right

but what about the media, Facebook, twiiter..Snapchat. ..etc etc....somethings made these kids act like that?
There's only one thing that 'made' these bigots do the things they have done, themselves. Everything else is just a scapegoat and an excuse to vindicate violent people unjustly.

It's no different to people that blame shootings in the US on video games, if video games could inspire such carnage then why isn't such displays of violence common in all countries? Why is it a distinct US problem and why hasn't there been a link between violence and video games proved thus far? All those studies that have been carried out since the 90's have only proved there's no link.

It's the same with social media and the media as a whole. Mary Whitehouse tried to make out that 'video nasties' were responsible for society's ills in the 80's and that was nothing other than a scapegoat too. You can't blame an outside element for someone's violent actions. The problem lies purely in the violent individual.
Tom4784 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 07:42 PM #28
Elliot's Avatar
Elliot Elliot is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 7,608

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Yinrun
Love Island 5: Amber
Elliot Elliot is offline
Senior Member
Elliot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 7,608

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Yinrun
Love Island 5: Amber
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver_W View Post
There's nothing societal we can pin blame on
i don't think thats 100% true. Homophobic scum are responsible for their own actions, but there are societal reasons as to why homophobia is continually perpetuated and acted upon
Elliot is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 07:45 PM #29
Oliver_W's Avatar
Oliver_W Oliver_W is online now
POW! BLAM!
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Bill's Secret Garden
Posts: 15,944

Favourites (more):
BBCanada 8: Chris
Apprentice 2019: Lottie


Oliver_W Oliver_W is online now
POW! BLAM!
Oliver_W's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Bill's Secret Garden
Posts: 15,944

Favourites (more):
BBCanada 8: Chris
Apprentice 2019: Lottie


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliot View Post
i don't think thats 100% true. Homophobic scum are responsible for their own actions, but there are societal reasons as to why homophobia is continually perpetuated and acted upon
Like what?
__________________


Oliver_W is online now   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 07:47 PM #30
parmnion's Avatar
parmnion parmnion is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 41,486

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Hallie
BB18: Deborah


parmnion parmnion is offline
Senior Member
parmnion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 41,486

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Hallie
BB18: Deborah


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezzy View Post
There's only one thing that 'made' these bigots do the things they have done, themselves. Everything else is just a scapegoat and an excuse to vindicate violent people unjustly.

It's no different to people that blame shootings in the US on video games, if video games could inspire such carnage then why isn't such displays of violence common in all countries? Why is it a distinct US problem and why hasn't there been a link between violence and video games proved thus far? All those studies that have been carried out since the 90's have only proved there's no link.

It's the same with social media and the media as a whole. Mary Whitehouse tried to make out that 'video nasties' were responsible for society's ills in the 80's and that was nothing other than a scapegoat too. You can't blame an outside element for someone's violent actions. The problem lies purely in the violent individual.


I knew you would say that...can you answer the bottom half of my post you didn't quote now please?...with a fresh head...
parmnion is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 07:48 PM #31
parmnion's Avatar
parmnion parmnion is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 41,486

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Hallie
BB18: Deborah


parmnion parmnion is offline
Senior Member
parmnion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 41,486

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Hallie
BB18: Deborah


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliot View Post
i don't think thats 100% true. Homophobic scum are responsible for their own actions, but there are societal reasons as to why homophobia is continually perpetuated and acted upon
This is what we have to find out.
parmnion is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 09:58 PM #32
Tom4784 Tom4784 is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 45,095
Tom4784 Tom4784 is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 45,095
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by parmnion View Post
I knew you would say that...can you answer the bottom half of my post you didn't quote now please?...with a fresh head...
I didn't quote it because you added it afterwards and you'll get the same answer because it's the only answer. Bored kids don't suddenly become bigoted and violent. There is no outside cause, a person of sound mind's actions are their own and being bigoted is not a mental illness, it's just a piss poor attitude and the mark of a **** personality.

If you keep asking the same questions, you'll get the same answers. You can't vindicate a violent bigot of blame for their actions. We are all responsible for our own choices, Parm. No amount of scapegoats or mental gymnastics is going to change that Parm. Instead of trying to defend bigots like that gang, you should accept that everyone makes their own choices.

Now, instead of saying 'I knew you'd say that' try actually responding to what I'm saying, this is a debate after all.
Tom4784 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 10:00 PM #33
Tom4784 Tom4784 is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 45,095
Tom4784 Tom4784 is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 45,095
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliot View Post
i don't think thats 100% true. Homophobic scum are responsible for their own actions, but there are societal reasons as to why homophobia is continually perpetuated and acted upon
Excuses and nothing more, that mindset doesn't fix anything, it just makes ***** like that gang out to be victims of circumstance when there are plenty of people with circumstances like theirs' that aren't violent bigots.
Tom4784 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 10:12 PM #34
parmnion's Avatar
parmnion parmnion is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 41,486

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Hallie
BB18: Deborah


parmnion parmnion is offline
Senior Member
parmnion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 41,486

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Hallie
BB18: Deborah


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezzy View Post
I didn't quote it because you added it afterwards and you'll get the same answer because it's the only answer. Bored kids don't suddenly become bigoted and violent. There is no outside cause, a person of sound mind's actions are their own and being bigoted is not a mental illness, it's just a piss poor attitude and the mark of a **** personality.

If you keep asking the same questions, you'll get the same answers. You can't vindicate a violent bigot of blame for their actions. We are all responsible for our own choices, Parm. No amount of scapegoats or mental gymnastics is going to change that Parm. Instead of trying to defend bigots like that gang, you should accept that everyone makes their own choices.

Now, instead of saying 'I knew you'd say that' try actually responding to what I'm saying, this is a debate after all.
Ok..Im not really sure what you are saying so I will ask an outright question.

So what are these kids?

Bored kids seeing a target, or kids out looking for gay couples to assault?
parmnion is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 10:35 PM #35
Tom4784 Tom4784 is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 45,095
Tom4784 Tom4784 is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 45,095
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by parmnion View Post
Ok..Im not really sure what you are saying so I will ask an outright question.

So what are these kids?

Bored kids seeing a target, or kids out looking for gay couples to assault?
They are violent homophobes.

Keep asking the same question and you'll get the same answer. You cannot phrase your question in a way to get the specific response you want.
Tom4784 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 10:59 PM #36
parmnion's Avatar
parmnion parmnion is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 41,486

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Hallie
BB18: Deborah


parmnion parmnion is offline
Senior Member
parmnion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 41,486

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Hallie
BB18: Deborah


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezzy View Post
They are violent homophobes.

Keep asking the same question and you'll get the same answer. You cannot phrase your question in a way to get the specific response you want.


I think they are bored kids..seeing an easy target..
parmnion is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 11:24 PM #37
Twosugars Twosugars is offline
Stiff Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: London
Posts: 9,384
Twosugars Twosugars is offline
Stiff Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: London
Posts: 9,384
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezzy View Post
They are violent homophobes.

Keep asking the same question and you'll get the same answer. You cannot phrase your question in a way to get the specific response you want.
Twosugars is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 04-10-2019, 11:32 PM #38
Toy Soldier Toy Soldier is offline
-
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 30,350


Toy Soldier Toy Soldier is offline
-
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 30,350


Default

It's probably homophobes but just to throw another suggestion out there - they reduced the amount of sugar in Lucozade a few years ago and it tastes like crap now. Might be coincidence obviously.
Toy Soldier is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 07:15 AM #39
Kizzy's Avatar
Kizzy Kizzy is offline
Likes cars that go boom
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 41,755


Kizzy Kizzy is offline
Likes cars that go boom
Kizzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 41,755


Default

I think it's alt right influence, if the motive for attack is race, religion or sexual orientation then in my opinion that makes it a fascist inspired act. The reason that they are on the rise is because there are more and louder fascist mouthpieces in the UK and beyond.
__________________

Last edited by Kizzy; 05-10-2019 at 07:18 AM.
Kizzy is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 08:59 AM #40
Alf's Avatar
Alf Alf is offline
Sod orf
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Wapping
Posts: 34,356


Alf Alf is offline
Sod orf
Alf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Wapping
Posts: 34,356


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kizzy View Post
I think it's alt right influence, if the motive for attack is race, religion or sexual orientation then in my opinion that makes it a fascist inspired act. The reason that they are on the rise is because there are more and louder fascist mouthpieces in the UK and beyond.
Let me be your fantasy.
Alf is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 09:24 AM #41
Kizzy's Avatar
Kizzy Kizzy is offline
Likes cars that go boom
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 41,755


Kizzy Kizzy is offline
Likes cars that go boom
Kizzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 41,755


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alf View Post
Let me be your fantasy.
Bury your head all you want alf, your mocking blinkered posts don't detract from what's reported every day.
__________________
Kizzy is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 09:28 AM #42
Liam-'s Avatar
Liam- Liam- is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Cardiff.
Posts: 23,003

Favourites (more):
BB19: Lewis F
CBB21: Shane Jenek


Liam- Liam- is offline
Senior Member
Liam-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Cardiff.
Posts: 23,003

Favourites (more):
BB19: Lewis F
CBB21: Shane Jenek


Default

Homophobia has always been present, every time a bigot breeds, they more than likely pass down their attitude to their offspring, but the spike in hate crimes/speech? That can be placed solely at the feet of prominent right wing faces in the media who have waged a war on decency allowing people to be more comfortable being openly bigoted because ‘free speech innit’
__________________

Last edited by Liam-; 05-10-2019 at 09:29 AM.
Liam- is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 09:41 AM #43
AnnieK's Avatar
AnnieK AnnieK is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Manchester
Posts: 14,150


AnnieK AnnieK is offline
Senior Member
AnnieK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Manchester
Posts: 14,150


Default

Homophobic abuse has always been rife sadly. The spike in cases being reported is a combination of things in my opinion. The rise in prevalence of social media makes it far easier for cases of abuse being reported, the current unrest in the country means all violent crime has risen, the general acceptance of same sex relationships now means more people will report the crimes rather than be embarrassed they happen etc etc.

However, the only people to blame for homophobic crimes are homophobic people.
__________________
AnnieK is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 09:46 AM #44
Kazanne's Avatar
Kazanne Kazanne is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Gerard Butlers Undercrackersx
Posts: 61,531

Favourites (more):
Love Island 4: Eyal
DOI 2018: Alex Beresford


Kazanne Kazanne is offline
Senior Member
Kazanne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Gerard Butlers Undercrackersx
Posts: 61,531

Favourites (more):
Love Island 4: Eyal
DOI 2018: Alex Beresford


Default

I think it's down to education,parenting and peers, i think it's worse now as many kids are not educated ,and have bad parents , they are ferel and really dont care or have no fear of what they do, mainly they have been brought up in an enviroment that teaches them that certain things are wrong.
__________________


RIP Pyramid, Andyman ,Kerry and Lex xx

https://www.facebook.com/JamesBulgerMT/?fref=photo

"If slaughterhouses had glass walls, most people would be vegetarian"
Kazanne is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 09:56 AM #45
Niamh.'s Avatar
Niamh. Niamh. is offline
I Love my brick
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Ireland-The peoples Republic of Cork!
Posts: 142,142

Favourites (more):
BB19: Cian
IAC2018: Rita Simons


Niamh. Niamh. is offline
I Love my brick
Niamh.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Ireland-The peoples Republic of Cork!
Posts: 142,142

Favourites (more):
BB19: Cian
IAC2018: Rita Simons


Default

Has it risen? I would have thought there would be much more homophobia years ago?
__________________

Spoiler:

Quote:
Originally Posted by GiRTh View Post
You compare Jim Davidson to Nelson Mandela?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesus. View Post
I know, how stupid? He's more like Gandhi.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Isaiah 7:14 View Post



Katie Hopkins reveals epilepsy made her suicidal - and says she identifies as a MAN
Quote:
Originally Posted by Livia View Post
Just because she is a giant cock, doesn't make her a man.
Niamh. is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 10:06 AM #46
Alf's Avatar
Alf Alf is offline
Sod orf
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Wapping
Posts: 34,356


Alf Alf is offline
Sod orf
Alf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Wapping
Posts: 34,356


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kizzy View Post
Bury your head all you want alf, your mocking blinkered posts don't detract from what's reported every day.
Reported everyday by whom?

Show me today's, show me yesterday's, and show me Christmas day 2017.
Alf is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 10:47 AM #47
Kizzy's Avatar
Kizzy Kizzy is offline
Likes cars that go boom
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 41,755


Kizzy Kizzy is offline
Likes cars that go boom
Kizzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 41,755


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Niamh. View Post
Has it risen? I would have thought there would be much more homophobia years ago?
It's on the rise again, personally I don't think there have been as many far right wing commentators or politicians as in the days of Enoch powell! :/
__________________
Kizzy is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 10:55 AM #48
Nicky91's Avatar
Nicky91 Nicky91 is offline
TeamIsrael <3 <3 <3
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Brabant, Netherlands
Posts: 62,777

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Paul
Strictly 2020: HRVY


Nicky91 Nicky91 is offline
TeamIsrael <3 <3 <3
Nicky91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Brabant, Netherlands
Posts: 62,777

Favourites (more):
BB2023: Paul
Strictly 2020: HRVY


Default

here in my country you got all sorts of senseless violence, not just homophobic hate crimes

few people also had been beaten, kicked to death after intervening in some fights

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOERov10GH0

few rappers here had made a song about useless, senseless violence back then
__________________

Taking part in Strictly Jake's Tibb does Strictly Game.


Spoiler:





Israel we Love You
Nicky91 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 03:32 PM #49
Oliver_W's Avatar
Oliver_W Oliver_W is online now
POW! BLAM!
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Bill's Secret Garden
Posts: 15,944

Favourites (more):
BBCanada 8: Chris
Apprentice 2019: Lottie


Oliver_W Oliver_W is online now
POW! BLAM!
Oliver_W's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Bill's Secret Garden
Posts: 15,944

Favourites (more):
BBCanada 8: Chris
Apprentice 2019: Lottie


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kizzy View Post
It's on the rise again, personally I don't think there have been as many far right wing commentators or politicians as in the days of Enoch powell! :/
Which right wing politicians or commentators have been using Homophobic language or rhetoric?
__________________


Oliver_W is online now   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 04:20 PM #50
Kizzy's Avatar
Kizzy Kizzy is offline
Likes cars that go boom
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 41,755


Kizzy Kizzy is offline
Likes cars that go boom
Kizzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 41,755


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver_W View Post
Which right wing politicians or commentators have been using Homophobic language or rhetoric?
Did I say any had specifically made any homophobic comments?... Your comprehension is lacking.
__________________
Kizzy is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Reply

Bookmark/share this topic

Tags
blame, crime, hate, homophobic

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 11:25 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
 

About Us ThisisBigBrother.com

"Big Brother and UK Television Forum. Est. 2001"

 

© 2023
no new posts