[SoBig]

But you guys do agree that he is a great player? He just lacks the social part.

[Marc]

Russell was amazing, but yeah his social game was poor. If the jury were to respect a good, deceitful player then he would (and IMO should) have won.

[Marc]

and I don't care about anybody else's opinion on him, because I know in my own mind that I'm right and if I were a juror then I would have voted Russell to win Samoa. You don't have to hate the person who stabbed you in the back, you vote for the best player

[Bluerang1]

Originally Posted by Marc

and I don't care about anybody else's opinion on him, because I know in my own mind that I'm right and if I were a juror then I would have voted Russell to win Samoa. You don't have to hate the person who stabbed you in the back, you vote for the best player

But you preferred Sophie over Coach?

[Marc]

I did, I personally thought she played a great game.

[Marc]

She had a great balance of everything, she won things, she had a good social side.

Coach made too many deals and messed up big time with them.

When you have Russell, he was so blatently the best player in Samoa because of what he managed to do at tribals, blindsiding Kelly and getting Laura voted off and saving Natalie.

[Macie Lightfoot]

Originally Posted by SoBig

This is why Russell Hantz is the greatest strategist and manipulator in the history of Survivor.

HvV

Youtube video

Samoa

Youtube video

Youtube video

WHO SAVED NATALIE THERE TROY!?!?!

If she was so good socially why was she on the chopping block? I thought she would charm her way to the end? Russell convinced people to flip their vote. He SAVED her. Natalie was going home. Same with Paravtii. He saved both of them.

You better respect that man.

In regards to Tyson's boot, that wasn't a good move at all. You'll see this a lot with Russell's supposed "good moves," they're actually not good at all, but he lucks out when someone else makes a blunder. Russell had NOTHING to do with getting Tyson to switch his vote, it's all editing. Read any post-game interview. Basically Russell thought that Danielle and Parvati would vote Russell and Russell vote for Parvati, making it 5-4. He hoped that their alliance would turn on each other and from there switched his own vote to make Parvati go home, not Russell. And besides, just because Russell giving Parvati the HII worked doesn't mean it was smart at all. It's actually one of the dumber moves to happen. Right there, he essentially sacrificed himself for Parvati considering nothing else crazy would happen. If you know the vote is going to be 3-3-3 and you have a HII and you're getting votes, why wouldn't you use it on yourself? It worked for Russell but by no means does that make it smart.

There's nothing extraordinary about Kelly being voted off in Samoa either. Russell played an HII, big whoop. Others have done it before too and you don't hear about them being the greatest players to ever win. There's nothing special about someone playing an Idol when they're targeted. How that's rocket science is beyond me. But besides, Russell wasted a HII right before that in the F12 by telling everyone about it. Had he not done that, he would've had two Idols and would've been an even better position. Plus the whole Galu tribe is to blame after they had the clue and didn't capitalize on it, allowing Russell to find the second Idol.

Likewise, the rest of Galu didn't make it much of a secret that John was 5th in their tribe. He flipped to avoid the Purple Rock once it was clear that Dave/Monica/Laura/Brett were a solid group of four, but he went about it the wrong way by trying to get Russell to vote Mick out the next round in return. A lot of the credit Russell gets in Samoa comes down to the stupidity of Galu. They made a lot of careless mistakes left and right that really shouldn't have happened.

And no, I'm not going to respect that man because there's nothing to respect.

[Macie Lightfoot]

Originally Posted by SoBig

But you guys do agree that he is a great player? He just lacks the social part.

Let's look at some of the few blunders Russell's made:

-Sabotaging Foa Foa on the first night and telling a ridiculous string of lies for no reason
-Voting out Liz over Natalie
-Bragging about an HII for no reason and being forced to play it
-Voting out Shambo and Jaison over Mick and Natalie
-Making an unnecessary, unrealistic deal with Brett at F4
-Going to the end with Natalie

-Playing his HII on Parvati rather than himself
-Alienating himself, Parvati, and Danielle from the other Villains
-Saying in Tribal Council that he, Parvati, and Danielle are a tight threesome right after he took Jerri under his wing
-Voting out Coach and Courtney over Sandra
-Playing a HII at F9 for no reason except for spiting Parvati
-Believing the rock in Rupert's pocket
-Making deals with all the Heroes right before backstabbing them
-Voting out Candice right after promising her F3
-Targeting Danielle for no reason
-Making a F3 deal with Colby/Rupert
-Refusing to vote out Sandra

Mmhmm, best player to never win.

[Macie Lightfoot]

Originally Posted by Marc

Russell was amazing, but yeah his social game was poor. If the jury were to respect a good, deceitful player then he would (and IMO should) have won.

[Macie Lightfoot]

Originally Posted by Marc

and I don't care about anybody else's opinion on him, because I know in my own mind that I'm right and if I were a juror then I would have voted Russell to win Samoa. You don't have to hate the person who stabbed you in the back, you vote for the best player

Mhm, the ONLY reason the Jurors hated Russell was cause he backstabbed them, right? Nothing to do with horrendous personality or anything.

[SharkAttack]

Originally Posted by Marc

and I don't care about anybody else's opinion on him, because I know in my own mind that I'm right and if I were a juror then I would have voted Russell to win Samoa. You don't have to hate the person who stabbed you in the back, you vote for the best player

This, all the way. Sour grapes isn't for the mature.

[Macie Lightfoot]

Well if someone carried themselves in a respectable manner, then it wouldn't be an issue. Of course people are going to victimize Russell for always having to face bitter juries, but have you guys ever thought about it? A Jury is reactionary, based on what happens to them and to others. If you made the Jury hate you, that's your own fault. Nobody has ever won when the Jury hated their guts. A Jury's created by what happens to them during the game. Survivor's a social experiment, no Jury has ever been unfair.

[SoBig]

Originally Posted by troynuncdicit

In regards to Tyson's boot, that wasn't a good move at all. You'll see this a lot with Russell's supposed "good moves," they're actually not good at all, but he lucks out when someone else makes a blunder. Russell had NOTHING to do with getting Tyson to switch his vote, it's all editing. Read any post-game interview. Basically Russell thought that Danielle and Parvati would vote Russell and Russell vote for Parvati, making it 5-4. He hoped that their alliance would turn on each other and from there switched his own vote to make Parvati go home, not Russell. And besides, just because Russell giving Parvati the HII worked doesn't mean it was smart at all. It's actually one of the dumber moves to happen. Right there, he essentially sacrificed himself for Parvati considering nothing else crazy would happen. If you know the vote is going to be 3-3-3 and you have a HII and you're getting votes, why wouldn't you use it on yourself? It worked for Russell but by no means does that make it smart.

It was all luck. Riiiiiiiiight. Got to finals in back to back seasons off of pure luck.

That post makes no sense. If he thought that was going to happen WHY DID HE VOTE FOR TYSON AND NOT PARVATI!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!!?

He used the idol on Parvati for several reasons.

1. He knew Tyson was going to change to his vote.

2. He wanted to keep his alliance intact.

3. Wanted to get the numbers on his side. He thought by giving the idol to Parvati, Jerri and Coach would flip over to his side. He showed them, that he would do whatever it takes to keep his alliance intact. Including risking his own life in the game. Right after that move. Jerri flipped, followed by Coach.

But sure it was all luck.

[Marc]

Tried to clean up the other OneWorld thread, so all posts regarding Natalie/Russell/Samoa/Cirie etc. have been moved into this thread.

[Macie Lightfoot]

Oops... ***Basically Tyson thought that Danielle and Parvati would vote Russell and Russell vote for Parvati, making it 5-4.

No he didn't know Tyson was going to change his vote, he had nothing to DO with Tyson changing his vote. Tyson's vote change had to do with him thinking Russell and Danielle/Parvati would turn on each other, which happens a lot when there are two main targets. Instead, Tyson expected too much out of them and made a mistake in the end. Russell didn't make a brilliant move, he didn't make any move really. Russell, Parvati, and Danielle only benefited from Tyson's mistake.

And that's bogus to say he wanted to keep his alliance in tact. Russell and Parvati KNEW about the split vote, which is part of why Tyson figured they would fold and target after each other. If you know the vote is going to be 3-3-3 and you have a HII, why would you use it on your ally and not yourself? If Tyson didn't make his miscalculation, Russell would've sacrificed his game for Parvati. Everyone laughs at Erik giving Immunity in FvF and Brandon giving Immunity in South Pacific. Russell did the same thing, except he got lucky in the end. If Tyson voted along with the plan to go 3-3-3, everyone would put Russell in the same league as Erik and Brandon, people who get voted off with HIIs, etc.

And in regards to your #3 point, that's all irrelevant when you consider the fact that Russell would've been voted out. He merely dodged an assassination attempt and lucked out. It's fact. Just because a move works out for you doesn't mean it was smart.

[SoBig]

Originally Posted by troynuncdicit

Oops... ***Basically Tyson thought that Danielle and Parvati would vote Russell and Russell vote for Parvati, making it 5-4.

No he didn't know Tyson was going to change his vote, he had nothing to DO with Tyson changing his vote.

Russell convinced Tyson that he was going to vote for Parvati. Just watch the youtube video that I posted. That's why he changed his vote.

[Roy Mars III]

Originally Posted by SoBig

This is why Russell Hantz is the greatest strategist and manipulator in the history of Survivor.

HvV

Youtube video

Say what you will about Russell but he knows how to put on a show. That whole tribal council was amazing watching for the first time two or so years ago.

[SoBig]

Originally Posted by Roy Mars III

Say what you will about Russell but he knows how to put on a show. That whole tribal council was amazing watching for the first time two or so years ago.

Russel Da Gawd.

[Macie Lightfoot]

Originally Posted by SoBig

Russell convinced Tyson that he was going to vote for Parvati. Just watch the youtube video that I posted. That's why he changed his vote.

No he didn't, that's not why he voted for Parvati. When the vote is split, it's not a terrible idea for the people being targeted to fold in and target each other. Tyson assumed that Parvati/Danielle would vote for Russell and Russell would vote for Parvati since they knew about the vote split. That would make it 5-4 for Russell. Tyson, however, wanted Parvati out more than Russell (Russell had the advantage of people not knowing who he was in HvV) so he figured if he switched his vote, it would be 5-4 Parvati. Considering all other things the same, if Tyson kept his original vote, Russell would be voted out after GIVING a HII to someone else. He just got extremely lucky because someone else made an error. If that wouldn't have happened, Russell would be in the same league as Erik and his nephew (whom he hypocritically criticizes), no doubt about that. The editors made it look like a big triumph for Russell but it was hardly that.

[Marc]

I'm pretty sure that's wrong and what SoBig said was right. Russell lied to Tyson and made him vote Parvati so that she would have majority votes, Tyson wanted to stay on the side of the majority and went with her too. Russell used HII and Tyson went.

[Macie Lightfoot]

Originally Posted by Marc

I'm pretty sure that's wrong and what SoBig said was right. Russell lied to Tyson and made him vote Parvati so that she would have majority votes, Tyson wanted to stay on the side of the majority and went with her too. Russell used HII and Tyson went.

Well you're wrong and you're disregarding what I'm saying about editing. You have 72 hours worth of footage to put into 45 minutes. Production can make it look like whatever they want it to look like. The editors gave Russell credit for it because they love doing that. But if you read any exit interview, you find out the real truth (what I've been saying this whole time.) Tyson put too much faith in Danielle/Parvati being smart and targeting Russell to save themselves and he took a calculated risk and went home because of it. Russell had nothing to do with what Tyson's decision, he had no influence in it. Tyson really wanted Parvati out so he took the initiative to switch his vote to get his way. Had that not happened and Russell gave his HII to Parvati, Russell would be going home and he'd be up there in the highest echelon of Survivor idiots with James Clement, Jason Siska, Erik Reichenbach, Brandon Hantz (whom he ironically criticizes and practically disowns for his poor gameplay.)

[Marc]

Hmmm

[ILoveTRW]

Just watched Heroes vs Villans, previous to this I had only seen 1 full season that being Palau. I loved Parvati, she should have won, although I was expected her to be all guns blazing from the way people go on about her but she was actually quite shy and reserved. Reading JT's letter was her best moment, hilarious. The 2 tribal councils where Russell used the idol on Parvati and Parvati using the idols on Jerri and Sandra were amazing moments. Not really much else to say about the season other than I swear half the guys are in the closet.

[DrunkerThanMoses]

Only seen 2, 3, 6, 7 and 8 so far

My favourite so far is 6 because its had so many power turns, one episode one person was top dog, the next episode they was out, and the bitchy princess drama queen ended up winning, good season as it was unpredictable.

I also liked 8 as Rob and Amber totally owned the game, but the juries bitterness was the best but most awkward thing I have seen so far.

7 and 2 was okay as well

3, although I liked the winner, the season has been my least favourite so far. Not that interesting apart from the younger generation vs the old people at the start.

Look forward to watching more seasons.

[DrunkerThanMoses]

Only seen 2, 3, 6, 7 and 8 so far

My favourite so far is 6 because its had so many power turns, one episode one person was top dog, the next episode they was out, and the bitchy princess drama queen ended up winning, good season as it was unpredictable.

I also liked 8 as Rob and Amber totally owned the game, but the juries bitterness was the best but most awkward thing I have seen so far.

7 and 2 was okay as well

3, although I liked the winner, the season has been my least favourite so far. Not that interesting apart from the younger generation vs the old people at the start.

Look forward to watching more seasons.