[sassysocks]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Someone who says "Go for it" after being told "You don't want to see me when I'm angry". How about that..... just for starters?

How about the fact that Hazel at no point shouted out despite the fact she knew half a dozen cameras were witnessing the scene and help was near to hand.

How about the fact that when BB called her in to the DR she merely said she was "A little bit scared"... and she had to think about that because BB were almost pressing her to say it.

I could go on!

The threat was all part of the playfight and Hazel knows that even if you don't.

Which is why charges are unlikely to be brought and unlikely to stick even if brought.

Standing up to an aggressive bully and putting on a 'brave face' does not mean she gave consent for his behaviour towards her. She is a strong woman and was not about to let that idiot intimidate her even if she felt a 'little scared'. You could see she was shocked at how things had got so out of hand - affecting her reaction when called into the diary room.

You seem to have a rather scewered view of what took place that night - and are hardly in a position to boldly state that the threat was all part of the a playfight, unless you know something the rest of us don't, which you clearly don't.

[Pincho Paxton]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Someone who says "Go for it" after being told "You don't want to see me when I'm angry". How about that..... just for starters?

How about the fact that Hazel at no point shouted out despite the fact she knew half a dozen cameras were witnessing the scene and help was near to hand.

How about the fact that when BB called her in to the DR she merely said she was "A little bit scared"... and she had to think about that because BB were almost pressing her to say it.

I could go on!

The threat was all part of the playfight and Hazel knows that even if you don't.

Which is why charges are unlikely to be brought and unlikely to stick even if brought.

That's not consent. That is an emotional response. "Go for it!" means go for it on TV with all of these witnesses.

[Seanbon]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Someone who says "Go for it" after being told "You don't want to see me when I'm angry". How about that..... just for starters?

How about the fact that Hazel at no point shouted out despite the fact she knew half a dozen cameras were witnessing the scene and help was near to hand.

How about the fact that when BB called her in to the DR she merely said she was "A little bit scared"... and she had to think about that because BB were almost pressing her to say it.

I could go on!

The threat was all part of the playfight and Hazel knows that even if you don't.

Which is why charges are unlikely to be brought and unlikely to stick even if brought.

It started as a playfight,and then Daley went to far!! Most people know that,even if you don't!!
If someone threatens to hit me,and in a fit of bravado I say "Go for it",and they then hit me,that is still assault!?! I didn't need to go to Uni to know that!!!

[CaudleHalbard]

Any rookie lawyer could get Daley off a charge of common assault. Had Hazel been injured, it would have been more difficult.

I know there is a desire to pigeon-hole Hazel as a poor abused woman, but she isn't. I can't believe how deluded some people are about this! Save your sympathy for those women who, because of economic circumstances are tied to men who beat them black and blue on a regular basis.

Since leaving the house what has Hazel said about Daley? That she "cannot totally rule out" a relationship with him in the future. Some 'abused woman' !!

[DanaC]

Who is talking about Hazel in those terms in here? I don't see it that way at all. She's not an 'abused woman'. That doesn't alter his guilt or lack of it.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Any rookie lawyer could get Daley off a charge of common assault. Had Hazel been injured, it would have been more difficult.

I know there is a desire to pigeon-hole Hazel as a poor abused woman, but she isn't. I can't believe how deluded some people are about this! Save your sympathy for those women who, because of economic circumstances are tied to men who beat them black and blue on a regular basis.

Since leaving the house what has Hazel said about Daley? That she "cannot totally rule out" a relationship with him in the future. Some 'abused woman' !!

Quite frankly your really bad attitude to Hazel and the whole incident is the thing hardest to understand.
Also the way you put down everyone else too as if they know nothing and you know it all!

[CaudleHalbard]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Quite frankly your really bad attitude to Hazel and the whole incident is the thing hardest to understand.
Also the way you put down everyone else too as if they know nothing and you know it all!

So give us your take then, Joey.

Do you think Daley has a 'consent' defence?

[Seanbon]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Any rookie lawyer could get Daley off a charge of common assault. Had Hazel been injured, it would have been more difficult.

I know there is a desire to pigeon-hole Hazel as a poor abused woman, but she isn't. I can't believe how deluded some people are about this! Save your sympathy for those women who, because of economic circumstances are tied to men who beat them black and blue on a regular basis.

Since leaving the house what has Hazel said about Daley? That she "cannot totally rule out" a relationship with him in the future. Some 'abused woman' !!

As I stated before,neither will be charged,but to suggest that they are equally to blame is nonsense! Hazel is not an abused woman,because BB stepped in when they did,and what would have happened is pure speculation. However,as stated by others,if Daley is capable of this on a reality TV show,what could he do behind closed doors?? A warning from the police might help to avoid a future incident!!

[Seanbon]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

So give us your take then, Joey.

Do you think Daley has a 'consent' defence?

Can't talk for Joey,but imo the answer is NO!!
She consented to the flirting. When he slapped her "arse" hard,she told him not to do that,which is a withdrawal of consent!?! QED!!

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

So give us your take then, Joey.

Do you think Daley has a 'consent' defence?

No I don't,I can see he could try it but I cannot see him winning with it,however I don't think it will get to court anyway.
In the unlikely event it were it too though, my guess is he would plead guilty anyway to some assault charge and would in fact be likely advised to do that too with the video evidence there is in existence.

Also my views on this incident are well documented in relevant threads on this throughout BB since the incident took place.
Of course not, as to a defence of consent though, she was alone with him,(despite the cameras), had she really fought against him, it could have been even worse for her, he not only laid his hands on her menacingly he verbally threatened her too.
All that would count heavily against him.

[CaudleHalbard]

Originally Posted by Seanbon

Can't talk for Joey,but imo the answer is NO!!
She consented to the flirting. When he slapped her "arse" hard,she told him not to do that,which is a withdrawal of consent!?! QED!!

Sorry but her "Go for it" comment came AFTER the bum slap. So that doesn't work.

But, I am inclined to agree with you that the bum slap was the actual assault/battery.

Anyway let's see what hotshot lawyer-to-be Joey has to say. I do not claim to know it all and I am genuinely interested to hear his comments.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Sorry but her "Go for it" comment came AFTER the bum slap. So that doesn't work.

But, I am inclined to agree with you that the bum slap was the actual assault/battery.

Anyway let's see what hotshot lawyer-to-be Joey has to say. I do not claim to know it all and I am genuinely interested to hear his comments.

I really think you need to cool your comments and stop being so offensive.
I am not a hot shot lawyer-to-be at all.

Although currently cnnected to a firm of Lawyers I have yet to decide whether I make Law my career or Politics which I also studied at Uni.

[Seanbon]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Sorry but her "Go for it" comment came AFTER the bum slap. So that doesn't work.

But, I am inclined to agree with you that the bum slap was the actual assault/battery.

Anyway let's see what hotshot lawyer-to-be Joey has to say. I do not claim to know it all and I am genuinely interested to hear his comments.

As stated before,the "Go for it" comment can be explained as bravado,and is not consent to be assaulted!
Also abusing posters is not on,cool it!!

[CaudleHalbard]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

[/B]

I really think you need to cool your comments and stop being so offensive.
I am not a hot shot lawyer-to-be at all.

Just a little leg-pull...... don't be over-sensitive! If you ever do get involved in real law you'll get much stronger stuff thrown at you!

Anyway, do you agree that Daley is likely to have a good chance of using the 'consent' defence to get any common assault charge dismissed?

If not, it would be helpful to know why you think not.

[Pincho Paxton]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Just a little leg-pull...... don't be over-sensitive! If you ever do get involved in real law you'll get much stronger stuff thrown at you!

Anyway, do you agree that Daley is likely to have a good chance of using the 'consent' defence to get any common assault charge dismissed?

If not, it would be helpful to know why you think not.

You already asked.. Joey already answered. A few posts up.

[Seanbon]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Just a little leg-pull...... don't be over-sensitive! If you ever do get involved in real law you'll get much stronger stuff thrown at you!

Anyway, do you agree that Daley is likely to have a good chance of using the 'consent' defence to get any common assault charge dismissed?

If not, it would be helpful to know why you think not.

I know you're gunning for Joey,but Hazel did not consent to being assaulted,and that would be obvious to most people,therefore not a defence!!
Anyway,pure conjecture,it's not going to happen!!!

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

Just a little leg-pull...... don't be over-sensitive! If you ever do get involved in real law you'll get much stronger stuff thrown at you!

Anyway, do you agree that Daley is likely to have a good chance of using the 'consent' defence to get any common assault charge dismissed?

If not, it would be helpful to know why you think not.

Oh no, don't hide behind the leg pull one,I have dealt with a lot at Uni already and in life as to leg pulls and indeed I will have lots thrown at me which I will deal with appropriately at the time as I am now.

You are simply being really offensive and have been told you are too, not just from myself either.
You are also not listening to anything anyone says that disagrees with you while presenting your own distorted view of the law.

I answered you above, though lord knows why I am bothering,as to no he would not win the consent defence route in my view, he could try but I believe the video evidence and facts of the incident would have him in a corner which in his best interests he would likely be better admitting to some assault or in my view risk strongly losing the case by not doing so.

[Seanbon]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Oh no, don't hide behind the leg pull one,I have dealt with a lot at Uni already and in life as to leg pulls and indeed I will have lots thrown at me which I will deal with appropriately at the time as I am now.

You are simply being really offensive and have been told you are too, not just from myself either.
You are also not listening to anything anyone says that disagrees with you while presenting your own distorted view of the law.

I answered you above, though lord knows why I am bothering,as to no he would not win the consent defence route in my view, he could try but I believe the video evidence and facts of the incident would have him in a corner which in his best interests he would likely be better admitting to some assault or in my view risk strongly losing the case by not doing so.

[courses]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

I know there is a desire to pigeon-hole Hazel as a poor abused woman, but she isn't. I can't believe how deluded some people are about this! Save your sympathy for those women who, because of economic circumstances are tied to men who beat them black and blue on a regular basis.

No there isn't! Stop using that to try to make Hazel the villain. And it's ridiculous and offensive to suggest that anyone who IS abused must be a 'poor abused woman.' Being a victim of assault won't change your character and it hasn't changed Hazel's.

[CaudleHalbard]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I believe the video evidence and facts of the incident would have him in a corner which in his best interests he would likely be better admitting to some assault or in my view risk strongly losing the case by not doing so.

A straight answer at last! Thank you.... phew!

I believe the video evidence should actually form part of Daley's defence as it would show Hazel's activities and statements as well. I believe it would be very detrimental to the prosecution case, given the onus of proof is upon them, i.e. they have to prove lack of consent. It is not 'beyond reasonable doubt' that there was no consent.

We shall have to agree to disagree.

[My final word on this topic, as people seem to be getting unnecessarily wound up and taking things too personally.]

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by DanaC

Who is talking about Hazel in those terms in here? I don't see it that way at all. She's not an 'abused woman'. That doesn't alter his guilt or lack of it.

Exactly. Really this probably has nothing at all to do with Hazel. I seriously doubt she's the one pursuing these charge (if it's even true)

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by courses

No there isn't! Stop using that to try to make Hazel the villain. And it's ridiculous and offensive to suggest that anyone who IS abused must be a 'poor abused woman.' Being a victim of assault won't change your character and it hasn't changed Hazel's.

ikr? It was almost as if, because Hazel wasn't a jibbering mess afterwards then what Daley did was ok

[Marmalite]

Originally Posted by Vanessa

She was goading him and then pulled his pants down. Not exactly blameless.

How very wrong you are and I hope you never find yourself in the situation that Hazel was in.

There is NEVER under any circumstances the right for ANYONE no matter who they are or what they are to grab a woman around the throat and threaten to hit them if they do not do as they say.

What Hazel did to Daley did NOT give him the right to be verbally and physically abusive to her. She did not goad him as you like to say, what she did, she did thinking that they were having a bit of a laugh.

In my opinion Daley should have been removed from the house immediately and not allowed back into the same room to be alone with Hazel. Unfortunately they didn't and this led to many people brushing off Daley's obvious abuse and lack of control and many people like you assuming she only had herself to blame.

[Vanessa]

Originally Posted by Marmalite

How very wrong you are and I hope you never find yourself in the situation that Hazel was in.

There is NEVER under any circumstances the right for ANYONE no matter who they are or what they are to grab a woman around the throat and threaten to hit them if they do not do as they say.

What Hazel did to Daley did NOT give him the right to be verbally and physically abusive to her. She did not goad him as you like to say, what she did, she did thinking that they were having a bit of a laugh.

In my opinion Daley should have been removed from the house immediately and not allowed back into the same room to be alone with Hazel. Unfortunately they didn't and this led to many people brushing off Daley's obvious abuse and lack of control and many people like you assuming she only had herself to blame.

I didn't say that. Daley is to blame, but Hazel is not without fault.

[Marmalite]

Originally Posted by Vanessa

I didn't say that. Daley is to blame, but Hazel is not without fault.

Why exactly?