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LeatherTrumpet · 28-04-2016, 01:55 PM

that video of the interview with man is brilliant

Livingstone is a total twat

joeysteele · 28-04-2016, 02:01 PM

Jeremy Corbyn needs to get hold of this issue and quickly, he cannot be seen as just pussyfooting around on it.

If he fails to wipe out any views like this held by any in the Labour party,that will be the end of his leadership.

Normally I accept Livingstone as a bit of a maverick in politics but on the Daily Politics, he made a poor show of himself and I agree with his suspension.
This MP for Bradford should be thrown out the party.

Look, there is nothing wrong with saying there should be a 2 state solution in Israel/Palestine,I agree with that, there is nothing wrong with attacking an action carried out against the other in the area, there is nothing wrong with even attacking Israel's leaders for their policy.

When however you start suggesting and supporting publicly moving a whole Nation of people to elsewhere in the World, then that is wrong and for me shows a deeper and likely more unsavoury thinking behind it.

She should go and anyone who thinks like her should as well.

arista · 28-04-2016, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

that video of the interview with man is brilliant

Livingstone is a total twat

Its all a
Right Muddle LT

arista · 28-04-2016, 02:08 PM

Now John Mann
is in trouble

bitontheslide · 28-04-2016, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Jeremy Corbyn needs to get hold of this issue and quickly, he cannot be seen as just pussyfooting around on it.

If he fails to wipe out any views like this held by any in the Labour party,that will be the end of his leadership.

Normally I accept Livingstone as a bit of a maverick in politics but on the Daily Politics, he made a poor show of himself and I agree with his suspension.
This MP for Bradford should be thrown out the party.

Look, there is nothing wrong with saying there should be a 2 state solution in Israel/Palestine,I agree with that, there is nothing wrong with attacking an action carried out against the other in the area, there is nothing wrong with even attacking Israel's leaders for their policy.

When however you start suggesting and supporting publicly moving a whole Nation of people to elsewhere in the World, then that is wrong and for me shows a deeper and likely more unsavoury thinking behind it.

She should go and anyone who thinks like her should as well.

Jeremy is in a bit of a pickle, because I believe he actually sympathises with that anti-Semitic view. There is going to come a point where the finger will be pointed directly at him. I don't think all are anti-Semitic, but more than a few jumped on the Palestinian bandwagon because it fitted in with their anti- Israeli views as there has been a less than rational full on support for the Palestinians

arista · 28-04-2016, 02:47 PM

No Ken
LBC lost the clear signal.

Put your Finger down.

[Suspended by Labour after explosive row which saw him branded a 'Nazi apologist' over
claims Hitler backed moving the Jews to Israel 'before he went mad
and ended up killing six million Jews' ]

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz478IYXbA9

Livia · 28-04-2016, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Jeremy Corbyn needs to get hold of this issue and quickly, he cannot be seen as just pussyfooting around on it.

If he fails to wipe out any views like this held by any in the Labour party,that will be the end of his leadership.

Normally I accept Livingstone as a bit of a maverick in politics but on the Daily Politics, he made a poor show of himself and I agree with his suspension.
This MP for Bradford should be thrown out the party.

Look, there is nothing wrong with saying there should be a 2 state solution in Israel/Palestine,I agree with that, there is nothing wrong with attacking an action carried out against the other in the area, there is nothing wrong with even attacking Israel's leaders for their policy.

When however you start suggesting and supporting publicly moving a whole Nation of people to elsewhere in the World, then that is wrong and for me shows a deeper and likely more unsavoury thinking behind it.

She should go and anyone who thinks like her should as well.

I have to say it's refreshing, the faith you put in Corbyn, Joey. For my money he's just as anti-Semitic as all the leftie arse-kissers who've cozied up to one Muslim despot after another.

Maddeningly, crap likes this really muddies the waters when it comes to a rational discussion about Israel. People need to leave their animosity at the door and sit down together. Outsiders goading the Israelis though, won't help.

arista · 28-04-2016, 04:08 PM

Go On
Michael Crick of Ch4HD News
get in there

Corbyn: Labour Will Not Tolerate Anti-Semitism
http://news.sky.com/story/1686944/co...-anti-semitism

joeysteele · 28-04-2016, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia

I have to say it's refreshing, the faith you put in Corbyn, Joey. For my money he's just as anti-Semitic as all the leftie arse-kissers who've cozied up to one Muslim despot after another.

Maddeningly, crap likes this really muddies the waters when it comes to a rational discussion about Israel. People need to leave their animosity at the door and sit down together. Outsiders goading the Israelis though, won't help.

On the contrary,I actually do not feel as to having much faith in Corbyn on this

Anyone can pay lip service to issues and I have a niggling fear that is all he wants to do on this issue.
If it turns out to be the case I will likely be as eager as others to see a change of leadership.

I was watching back some old extracts from Labour party conferences and came across Neil Kinnock's speech against so called militants.
hat was fierce and forceful and in my view meant, not this pussyfooting about I am seeing from Jeremy Corbyn on this.

This is an issue that riles me,whatever the rights and wrongs of Israel and what they do, they are surrounded as a Nation by other totally hostile Nations against them.
They virtually have be on guard all the time.

What they certainly do not need is from 'friendly' nations, pathetic people like this Bradford MP and then Livingstone sort of defending her making such statements as she shared and clearly agreed with.
Also her apology after being found out and the uproar in play,does not impress me, she should have apologised to the 'whole state of Israel' but then also stood down as an MP too.

If, as has been said her doing this had been known at her selection process, then she would not have been likely chosen to stand for to be an MP,well no difference for me, now it is known, she should not remain an MP pure and simple and she would be out of the whole Party for me.

This has to dealt with and anyone rooted out who hold these views and them then kicked out of the Party, they have no place in British politics.
If Corbyn is not really going to take a strong stand and deal with this properly and convincingly then he should hand over to another who can and also someone who has the will to want to as well.

bitontheslide · 28-04-2016, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeysteele

On the contrary,I actually do not feel as to having much faith in Corbyn on this

Anyone can pay lip service to issues and I have a niggling fear that is all he wants to do on this issue.
If it turns out to be the case I will likely be as eager as others to see a change of leadership.

I was watching back some old extracts from Labour party conferences and came across Neil Kinnock's speech against so called militants.
hat was fierce and forceful and in my view meant, not this pussyfooting about I am seeing from Jeremy Corbyn on this.

This is an issue that riles me,whatever the rights and wrongs of Israel and what they do, they are surrounded as a Nation by other totally hostile Nations against them.
They virtually have be on guard all the time.

What they certainly do not need is from 'friendly' nations, pathetic people like this Bradford MP and then Livingstone sort of defending her making such statements as she shared and clearly agreed with.
Also her apology after being found out and the uproar in play,does not impress me, she should have apologised to the 'whole state of Israel' but then also stood down as an MP too.

If, as has been said her doing this had been known at her selection process, then she would not have been likely chosen to stand for to be an MP,well no difference for me, now it is known, she should not remain an MP pure and simple and she would be out of the whole Party for me.

This has to dealt with and anyone rooted out who hold these views and them then kicked out of the Party, they have no place in British politics.
If Corbyn is not really going to take a strong stand and deal with this properly and convincingly then he should hand over to another who can and also someone who has the will to want to as well.

i think quite a few of us are making similar observations. Its like a ... if I really have to ... i will take action, rather than conviction that it should be stamped out. Does that make him anti-Semitic in itself? No, but he doesn't actively and passionately disagree with those that most certainly are

Mystic Mock · 28-04-2016, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

oh dear and there was silly me thinking ukip were the top racist party

They wasn't in front whilst the BNP are around.

But this MP should be ashamed of herself, she wouldn't like it if someone said for her to relocate to whatever country her family originates from would she?

The simple solution would be for Israel and Palestine to have half the land each instead of this childish squabbles that are getting their innocent civilians killed just because they're too proud to apologise to each other.

This feud is simply one of the most pathetic traits that Human kind display over and over again.

arista · 28-04-2016, 09:35 PM

DemolitionRed · 29-04-2016, 07:27 AM

Ken Livingstone has been suspended by the Labour Party over comments he made while defending an MP at the centre of an anti-Semitism row.

The ex-London mayor will be investigated for "bringing the party into disrepute".
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36160135

joeysteele · 29-04-2016, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

i think quite a few of us are making similar observations. Its like a ... if I really have to ... i will take action, rather than conviction that it should be stamped out. Does that make him anti-Semitic in itself? No, but he doesn't actively and passionately disagree with those that most certainly are

Apparently today he intends to say nothing more about it.
Sorry but that astounds me.
As Leader this is so urgent now and a week before elections take place too,either he has an electoral death wish or his heart is not in the fight against this one.
If it is a minority which I firmly believe it is, then it should be very easy to stamp it out
If it could be a growing problem then all the more reason to really grab hold of things now and demand action from all areas of the Party across the board, to identify and root out anyone with these views.

Or pay a very big price for allowing it to be there in any form in the first place.
Constituency members and the secretaries of same as also constituency wards also need to double check the people they have selected as candidates and also their membership too.

There should be no place for even one of anyone with such views in the Labour party or any credible UK party either for that matter, let alone several.
This is one issue that really does have to be strongly and instantly led by Jeremy Corbyn in clearing it out.

If he fails to rise to this challenge then he will warrant losing the support he has across the Party as to his leadership and I feel fairly sure now he will lose it too if he continues to just appear to be paying lip service to the issue.

LeatherTrumpet · 29-04-2016, 08:01 AM

Ken is brilliant tho, so an anti-Semitic row breaks out in the labour party - well what would be the worst thing you could possibly say to fan the flames?

er..talk about Hitler?

yes brilliant, anything else

how about claim me was in fact a Zionist?

wtf, are you mental?

No, lets run it up the flagpole and see who salutes?

ok, but there is going to be a sh1tstorm

nah, its all good...

Livia · 29-04-2016, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeysteele

On the contrary,I actually do not feel as to having much faith in Corbyn on this

Anyone can pay lip service to issues and I have a niggling fear that is all he wants to do on this issue.
If it turns out to be the case I will likely be as eager as others to see a change of leadership.

I was watching back some old extracts from Labour party conferences and came across Neil Kinnock's speech against so called militants.
hat was fierce and forceful and in my view meant, not this pussyfooting about I am seeing from Jeremy Corbyn on this.

This is an issue that riles me,whatever the rights and wrongs of Israel and what they do, they are surrounded as a Nation by other totally hostile Nations against them.
They virtually have be on guard all the time.

What they certainly do not need is from 'friendly' nations, pathetic people like this Bradford MP and then Livingstone sort of defending her making such statements as she shared and clearly agreed with.
Also her apology after being found out and the uproar in play,does not impress me, she should have apologised to the 'whole state of Israel' but then also stood down as an MP too.

If, as has been said her doing this had been known at her selection process, then she would not have been likely chosen to stand for to be an MP,well no difference for me, now it is known, she should not remain an MP pure and simple and she would be out of the whole Party for me.

This has to dealt with and anyone rooted out who hold these views and them then kicked out of the Party, they have no place in British politics.
If Corbyn is not really going to take a strong stand and deal with this properly and convincingly then he should hand over to another who can and also someone who has the will to want to as well.

I see I went off half-cocked in my earlier post to you, joey. I completely agree with your stance on this.

Mystic Mock · 29-04-2016, 01:02 PM

This guy tried to defend the Rioters in the London Riots so his not exactly the height of morality is he?

arista · 29-04-2016, 01:23 PM

DR

Its on this double header thread

DemolitionRed · 29-04-2016, 01:41 PM

We can hardly call Corbyn anti-Semitic when he refuses to tolerate any form of racism within The Labour Party. Criticising a country that has committed human rights abuses (including Israel ) is totally fine!

The fact that Corbyn has suspended Ken Livingstone and made the point very clearly that there is no place for anti-Semitism in the Labour party is a big plus for me, anti-Semitism on the Left needs to be challenged instead of muddling it up with anti-Israel and using that as a cloak to hide behind.

parmnion · 29-04-2016, 02:08 PM

I bet the IRA sympathiser is hurriedly scouring his past correspondence on such issues repeatedly visiting the shredding machine.

joeysteele · 29-04-2016, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

We can hardly call Corbyn anti-Semitic when he refuses to tolerate any form of racism within The Labour Party. Criticising a country that has committed human rights abuses (including Israel ) is totally fine!

The fact that Corbyn has suspended Ken Livingstone and made the point very clearly that there is no place for anti-Semitism in the Labour party is a big plus for me, anti-Semitism on the Left needs to be challenged instead of muddling it up with anti-Israel and using that as a cloak to hide behind.

I really think he is doing himself no great favours with his handling of this,imagine what he would be saying to any other party leader who decided on such a riding important issue,that they were not even going to discuss it today.

After the problems yesterday with John Mann and Ken Livingstone the party was left with little option after such a public airing but I am not at all of the view that Corbyn wanted him suspended.
If he handles this issue really wrong I will add my voice in Labour to maybe look at a change of Leader.
With the Conservatives in such a mess themselves,it is near soul destroying seeing the mess Labour has got itself into now and its sad for politics in the UK too.

DemolitionRed · 29-04-2016, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I really think he is doing himself no great favours with his handling of this,imagine why he would be saying to any other party leader who decided on such a riding important issue,that they were not even going to discuss it today.

After the problems yesterday with John Mann and Ken Livingstone the party was left with little option after such a public airing but I am not at all of the view that Corbyn wanted him suspended.
If he handles this issue really wrong I will add my voice in Labour to maybe look at a change of Leader.
With the Conservatives in such a mess themselves,it is near soul destroying seeing the mess Labour has got itself into now and its sad for politics in the UK too.

Allow me to be straight on how I feel about this....Anti Semitism or any other form of racism has no place within The Labour Party. If people do or say racist things then this needs to be dealt with. But then lets look at this in the cold light of day-lets put all of this into little boxes, little boxes which we can pull cards out to hate. We have a box for refugees, a box for asylum seekers, a box for Muslims, we used to have a box for Jews but that made us feel uncomfortable so we crossed out the word Jew on the front and wrote Israel over the top and now we can continue to pull the card out. Anti Semitism within the Labour party is a real problem, just as Islamophobia within the Conservative party is a real problem; I'm well aware of that.

But the silver lining is, Jeremy Corbyn is not anti-Semitic. When he referred to others as "our friends", that isn't anti-Semitic but the sort of words used by a knowing and wise diplomat and if you really want peace you can't get it by insulting others, whether you agree with them or not. It's still the case that one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter.