[LeatherTrumpet]

St John Ambulance to let volunteers wear white remembrance poppy



St John Ambulance is allowing its volunteers to wear the pacifist white poppy for the first time.

The 141-year-old first-aid organisation’s dress code change, a month before the centenary of the first world war armistice, was welcomed by the Peace Pledge Union (PPU), which distributes the alternative to the Royal British Legion’s red poppy.

The history of St John Ambulance is tightly bound up with the Battle of the Somme, the horrors of which inspired the red poppy tradition. Its volunteers died trying to save lives in the trenches.

The PPU is hoping more than 100,000 white poppies will be sold from Monday. It believes the red poppy symbolises remembrance of British armed forces and its allies, rather than enemies and civilians who also died in wars.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/...emembrance-day

I think i will file this in the "i want to believe in an ideal world but will willfully ignore the real world in which I live" category (as my "you could not make this sh1t up" section is chokka)

thoughts?

[montblanc]

it’s so pretty

[MB.]

You've reminded me to buy one closer to the time, thanks

[Toy Soldier]

I don't see anything wrong with remembrance being for every innocent person who gets caught up and killed because of the bullsh*t of people in positions of power and authority. Obviously when we're talking WW1 and 2 that does include the various armed forces, because of conscription, but isn't it worth remembering that most of the poor buggers on the other side who died on the battlefield didn't want to be there either?

WW2 specifically its all too easy to paint the conflict as a fantasy style "good versus evil" clash, because undeniably, the motives and actions of the Nazis were indeed evil. But it IS very much worth remembering that most German soldiers were in fact not Nazis... They were bewildered young men who had rifles thrust into their arms, thrown into battle without any real choice. Like the vast majority of conscripted armies throughout history.

You talk about living in the real world LT but that is the real world. Just people being people, most not any better or worse than any other.

You can paint past wars as some sort of Tolkien-esque quest against a horde of snarling Orcs if you want. I personally don't find that to be very realistic.

[Northern Monkey]

I’d say the only problem i’d have with it is if it’s taking money away from the Royal British Legion.It’s adding competition to the original red poppy charity.

[AnnieK]

My grandfather's both fought in WW2, one being a PoW for 3 years. I will always wear a red poppy with pride. I respect the right of people to choose the white poppy but I will always respect the red poppy and what that symbolises to the families of those who fought, died or came home

[LeatherTrumpet]

Originally Posted by MB.

You've reminded me to buy one closer to the time, thanks

Welcome to who you would love to have been in a trench with, episode. 2

[bitontheslide]

I don't have a problem with a white poppy, peace is a wonderful thing

Also, if it engages more people in to remembering what happened, and raises awareness and money for those that served, it's got to be a good thing. Although, I still feel it is the government who should contribute rather than needing a charity.

[Cherie]

People could wear both? We can't change the past but we should remember the sacrifice and support the charity, and the white poppy could be a message for the future, agree with BOTs that a charity should not be needed

[smudgie]

You wear the red poppy in remembrance on Remembrance Sunday. To remember the sacrifice so many people gave. Lest we forget.
Why not have the peace poppy on a different day.
I am all for peace, but you can’t change history, those lost won’t come back.

[JoshBB]

why not?

Let people remember in their own way. And, tbf, it sucks how the far-right have managed to dirty the red poppy which was always intended to remember the losses & how we need to ensure to never let it happen again

[LeatherTrumpet]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

why not?

Let people remember in their own way. And, tbf, it sucks how the far-right have managed to dirty the red poppy which was always intended to remember the losses & how we need to ensure to never let it happen again

what on earth are you on about?

[Northern Monkey]

What has “the far right” got to do with anything

[LeatherTrumpet]

maybe its the FLA

[Nicky91]

poppy's are usually red though, although a white poppy looks nice, but better stick to traditions, and go with the red poppy

[Livia]

Have a look at what the Royal British Legion does with the money raised from poppy sales. It helps ex-servicemen and their families and it focuses our minds to the sacrifice of the armed forces. It does not honour war, it honours those who fought, and who are still fighting, to keep us safe.

So if you want to wear a white poppy, please remember the people who died giving you the freedom to wear a symbol that is designed also to honour those whose tyranny we fought against, and who we are currently fighting against... all those poor dead Nazis and ISIS followers.

[Tom4784]

I won't wear either poppy, it's meaning has been cheapened by people over the years using it as a tool to shame and judge others. It's become a shallow virtue signalling exercise in my eyes and I'd rather show my respects privately in my own way with a direct charity donation.

[Shaun]

It believes the red poppy symbolises remembrance of British armed forces and its allies, rather than enemies and civilians who also died in wars.

I never really gathered that impression from the red poppy, tbh - just figured it was a simple symbol of remembrance that reflected the actual poppy fields rather than any specific sides to the war. I understand the Legion is a charity that supports our troops but I wouldn't take that as an extension to mean "...but **** the Germans, Japanese and Italians, right?"

Think the red poppy just looks nicer as well, from a purely aesthetic standpoint

[Twosugars]

why not wear both?
have no problem with the white poppy, see it as aspirational, a wish that a supposedly civilized humanity stopped solving conflicts by killing each other

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Twosugars

why not wear both?
have no problem with the white poppy, see it as aspirational, a wish that a supposedly civilized humanity stopped solving conflicts by killing each other

Sadly, although it's being claimed that the red poppy has been hijacked - although I don't see that much evidence of it apart from a few jingoistic trolls who've probably never done any kind of military service - I've seen more evidence of the white poppy being hijacked by anti-army left wingers. I remember this vividly when I worked for an east London college after leaving uni... the place was awash with "eat the rich" anarchists and socialists. And that was just the staff.

If people want to know what the red poppy symbolises (this isn't aimed at you particularly 2S), maybe watch the Festival of Remembrance from the Albert Hall, and the parade past the cenotaph. There is no glorification of war, and everyone who suffered is remembered... civilians, ambulance drivers, soldiers, Merchant Navy... And from a personal point of view, the
Royal British Legion were amazing when my husband died so there's not way I would not support the work they do.

And once again... remember that it was the very people the red poppy honours whose sacrifice allows people the freedom now to wear any symbol they like.