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Old 25-09-2019, 09:08 PM #1
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Default Politicians using the publics emotions.

I am utterly disgusted at the left using the memory of Jo Cox as scare tactics in a discussion about language used in parliament. .

When you stop and think, she died a few years ago and there is not a person alive that would still want her dead!..things have got even more stressed and divided in the few years since her tragic and very hurtful death...but nothing like that since in the UK.

The left are using her memory to attack the right, using her as an example of what can happen with certain words used in parliament...
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Old 25-09-2019, 09:51 PM #2
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It is a bit tacky to invoke a woman's murder just because people are typing words on a screen. If someone like Katie Hopkins mentioned Jo Cox in reference to the online "abuse" she probably gets, she'd be rightly dragged across the coals.
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Old 25-09-2019, 10:15 PM #3
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Bojo has sunk even lower today.
What a ****ing disgrace he is
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Old 25-09-2019, 10:18 PM #4
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Originally Posted by Twosugars View Post
Bojo has sunk even lower today.
What a ****ing disgrace he is
It's OK, he has a snorkel.
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Old 26-09-2019, 01:09 AM #5
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We live in a world where Right Wing extremists and incels are often planning attacks on politicians and, more often then not, it's female politicians in particular that are targetted.

Leaders must be smart in the terminology they use, when you look at recent shootings in the US, the common link between most of them is that most of these shooters idolised and adhered to Trump's 'philosophies' and the language he uses resonated with them. When a person in power calls people traitors for not doing what he wants them to, when he uses terms of war to make out that Brexit is a battle situation and not an parliamentary procedure, he is inspiring the crazies to take action.

When you downplay the emotions and fears of these MPs who have lost a colleague and know all too well how easily it could have been them, you're not defending the right wing, you're defending the extremists, you're downplaying what happened to Jo Cox and you're downplaying the very real threat of Right Wing terrorism because you see 'Right Wing' and you automatically jump to it's defense out of nothing more than tribalism.
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Old 26-09-2019, 03:05 AM #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by parmnion View Post
I am utterly disgusted at the left using the memory of Jo Cox as scare tactics in a discussion about language used in parliament. .

When you stop and think, she died a few years ago and there is not a person alive that would still want her dead!..things have got even more stressed and divided in the few years since her tragic and very hurtful death...but nothing like that since in the UK.

The left are using her memory to attack the right, using her as an example of what can happen with certain words used in parliament...


Yes Labour are Struggling
and the Indie Party Women ex Conservative.
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Old 26-09-2019, 03:08 AM #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezzy View Post
We live in a world where Right Wing extremists and incels are often planning attacks on politicians and, more often then not, it's female politicians in particular that are targetted.

Leaders must be smart in the terminology they use, when you look at recent shootings in the US, the common link between most of them is that most of these shooters idolised and adhered to Trump's 'philosophies' and the language he uses resonated with them. When a person in power calls people traitors for not doing what he wants them to, when he uses terms of war to make out that Brexit is a battle situation and not an parliamentary procedure, he is inspiring the crazies to take action.

When you downplay the emotions and fears of these MPs who have lost a colleague and know all too well how easily it could have been them, you're not defending the right wing, you're defending the extremists, you're downplaying what happened to Jo Cox and you're downplaying the very real threat of Right Wing terrorism because you see 'Right Wing' and you automatically jump to it's defense out of nothing more than tribalism.


Sure
Its easy to attack a Female MP
but keep dragging Jo Cox up
is wrong
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Old 26-09-2019, 03:09 AM #8
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Originally Posted by Twosugars View Post
Bojo has sunk even lower today.
What a ****ing disgrace he is

No that is him
he ain't going to change.
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Old 26-09-2019, 05:07 AM #9
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i think censoring words such as surrender is absurd.

However, I do think all sides of the house need to dial down the temperature of arguments a lot. It is all their raging and shouting at each other that incites anger and violence. They are not setting a good example.
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Old 26-09-2019, 06:30 AM #10
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They are absolutely right, he knows full well what he's doing. The seeds of division he's sowing, its part of his people v parliament direction. Risking the safety and lives of the dissenting MPs by ramping up the pressure with these key phrases, to force them into the conciousness of the public via repetition and no doubt his friends in the media.

How many times did he repeat certain words? traitor, capitulation, surrender, treason?
This was not an error, it's a calculated strategy, we have seen the horrific outcome of someone incentivised to extreme violence by right wing rhetoric. The MPs are right never to let the name of Jo Cox fade! It's not getting any better, far from it, now the call to arms for right wing extremists comes from our own prime minister...

Many many members of parliament and their family are receiving abuse and death threats, they stood up and begged the PM to temper his language and his response was some nonsense word! I'm happy that the chair committed to dealing with the issue once the PM had scuttled from the chamber right before being challenged once more by Corbyn.

If we turn a blind eye to this I see more attacks on MPs and due to his attitude and language the PM will be directly responsible!
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Old 26-09-2019, 06:37 AM #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kizzy View Post
They are absolutely right, he knows full well what he's doing. The seeds of division he's sowing, its part of his people v parliament direction. Risking the safety and lives of the dissenting MPs by ramping up the pressure with these key phrases, to force them into the conciousness of the public via repetition and no doubt his friends in the media.

How many times did he repeat certain words? traitor, capitulation, surrender, treason?
This was not an error, it's a calculated strategy, we have seen the horrific outcome of someone incentivised to extreme violence by right wing rhetoric. The MPs are right never to let the name of Jo Cox fade! It's not getting any better, far from it, now the call to arms for right wing extremists comes from our own prime minister...

Many many members of parliament and their family are receiving abuse and death threats, they stood up and begged the PM to temper his language and his response was some nonsense word! I'm happy that the chair committed to dealing with the issue once the PM had scuttled from the chamber right before being challenged once more by Corbyn.

If we turn a blind eye to this I see more attacks on MPs and due to his attitude and language the PM will be directly responsible!

in a democracy you are entitled express yourself however you see fit, and that applies particularly in the house of commons. If his speech is inciting hatred, then make him accountable for it. Use the laws that exist. Attempting to censor the use of certain common words is not the way to go about it, and it certainly isn't democracy
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Old 26-09-2019, 06:54 AM #12
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The point wasn't specifically about whether or not anyone would still want to harm Jo Cox, it was about the Prime Minister using much of the same language as Jo Cox's killer used ("traitor" especially) with seemingly little regard for how this may impact on the death threats that female MPs from across the political spectrum have been getting ever since Jo's murder
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Old 26-09-2019, 06:56 AM #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bitontheslide View Post
in a democracy you are entitled express yourself however you see fit, and that applies particularly in the house of commons. If his speech is inciting hatred, then make him accountable for it. Use the laws that exist. Attempting to censor the use of certain common words is not the way to go about it, and it certainly isn't democracy
He will be held accountable that's been decided however should it ever come to that .. That the prime minister has to be investigated for his divisive conduct?
It's almost through the looking Glass bizarre that its in any way acceptable to shout down frightened predominantly female MPs.
His changing the name of the bill was tactical it was also childish. What if that happened regularly and tory bills on universal credit, bedroom tax and disability benefits were referred to as something else...The starve bill? The live in a box bill? The why won't you just die bill?

Whichever way you look at it Johnson is not fit to be prime minister, he's in no way shape or form democratic. He's proved that time and again in his attitude to parliament and now also the supreme Court.
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Old 26-09-2019, 06:58 AM #14
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One Labour MP used "Traitor"

But that was not used by this PM
that was Newspapers
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Old 26-09-2019, 07:05 AM #15
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Was it any worse than corbyns silly woman comment that he lied about saying....and Boris didn't scuttle out the chamber..he left after sitting there for hours upon hours whilst his opponents didn't. .they all came back in together to attack a tired man as one...he did the right thing by leaving..probably hungry and desperate for the toilet....but it's easy to dress it up a Boris scuttling away if that's the narrative you want to put forward or force...it almost comes across as hateful and inciteful. ..

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Old 26-09-2019, 07:06 AM #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arista View Post
One Labour MP used "Traitor"

But that was not used by this PM
that was Newspapers
'Other female MPs, including Paula Sherriff, attacked the prime minister for repeatedly calling the act put through parliament by Hilary Benn to take no-deal Brexit off the table the “surrender bill”.

She said: “The prime minister has continually used pejorative language to describe an act of parliament passed by this house. We should not resort to using offensive, dangerous, inflammatory language for legislation we do not like.”

Recalling the memory of her friend Cox, she said many MPs had received death threats.

And let me tell the prime minister – they often quote his words, ‘surrender act’, ‘betrayal,’ ‘traitor’: we must moderate our language and it has to come from the prime minister first.”
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.the...-on-the-attack
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Old 26-09-2019, 07:09 AM #17
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we have had words like traitor and surrender in our vocabulary for centuries. One deranged man uses those words and they should never be used again? That's what people are basically saying. It's the height of stupidity.
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Old 26-09-2019, 07:11 AM #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kizzy View Post
'Other female MPs, including Paula Sherriff, attacked the prime minister for repeatedly calling the act put through parliament by Hilary Benn to take no-deal Brexit off the table the “surrender bill”.

She said: “The prime minister has continually used pejorative language to describe an act of parliament passed by this house. We should not resort to using offensive, dangerous, inflammatory language for legislation we do not like.”

Recalling the memory of her friend Cox, she said many MPs had received death threats.

And let me tell the prime minister – they often quote his words, ‘surrender act’, ‘betrayal,’ ‘traitor’: we must moderate our language and it has to come from the prime minister first.”

No Kizzy We Must have a General Election
to clear the decks.

Both Sides of Parliament are Getting Death Threats
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Old 26-09-2019, 07:12 AM #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bitontheslide View Post
we have had words like traitor and surrender in our vocabulary for centuries. One deranged man uses those words and they should never be used again? That's what people are basically saying. It's the height of stupidity.
The height of stupidity for me is accepting the prime minister if your county is deranged, but not being overly concerned by it.
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Old 26-09-2019, 07:15 AM #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kizzy View Post
They are absolutely right, he knows full well what he's doing. The seeds of division he's sowing, its part of his people v parliament direction. Risking the safety and lives of the dissenting MPs by ramping up the pressure with these key phrases, to force them into the conciousness of the public via repetition and no doubt his friends in the media.

How many times did he repeat certain words? traitor, capitulation, surrender, treason?
This was not an error, it's a calculated strategy, we have seen the horrific outcome of someone incentivised to extreme violence by right wing rhetoric. The MPs are right never to let the name of Jo Cox fade! It's not getting any better, far from it, now the call to arms for right wing extremists comes from our own prime minister...

Many many members of parliament and their family are receiving abuse and death threats, they stood up and begged the PM to temper his language and his response was some nonsense word! I'm happy that the chair committed to dealing with the issue once the PM had scuttled from the chamber right before being challenged once more by Corbyn.

If we turn a blind eye to this I see more attacks on MPs and due to his attitude and language the PM will be directly responsible!
Quote:
Originally Posted by bitontheslide View Post
we have had words like traitor and surrender in our vocabulary for centuries. One deranged man uses those words and they should never be used again? That's what people are basically saying. It's the height of stupidity.



Yet many of those shouting the loudest remain silent when a beheaded Boris is paraded across the papers.
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Old 26-09-2019, 07:16 AM #21
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No Kizzy We Must have a General Election
to clear the decks.

Both Sides of Parliament are Getting Death Threats
Are they.. Did I miss that? who on the consevasive benches stated they had recieved death threats?

AFTER no deal is off the table... then that's when the consensus in the commons want an election.
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Old 26-09-2019, 07:17 AM #22
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The speaker made it very clear that all sides had received death threats.
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Old 26-09-2019, 07:20 AM #23
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The speaker made it very clear that all sides had received death threats.

Yes the Conservative Chair MP
on TV News this morning confirmed that
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Old 26-09-2019, 07:25 AM #24
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Yet many of those shouting the loudest remain silent when a beheaded Boris is paraded across the papers.
Are you suggesting I would be happy with this?... is this how your mind has twisted my words?.. Sorry that is beyond feeble.
You correlated what i said to mean i dont want them dead, so I must want him dead?
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Old 26-09-2019, 07:33 AM #25
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Yes the Conservative Chair MP
on TV News this morning confirmed that
As far as I'm aware none spoke last night, if they have this morning then I wouldn't know that would I?
It might have been helpful if theyd spoke up for their colleagues on the opposite benches last night then?
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