[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

do you not know how filming stuff works?


they do not point a gun at the other cast member, but at the camera, and they later on edit that as if he points the gun at the opponent, and i think this particular scene was a ''duel''

I was actually wondering if it could be a gun duel scene - as the main character firing directly towards camera is sort of a “classic shot” in that type of western scene.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

And this has happened 3 times now , most people know about Brandon Lee ,but apparently another horrific incident happened in the 80s where a guy shot himself in the head with what he thought was just a prop! .

Why were the safety protocols neglected so badly. Surely there must have been other ways ,they could have made the gun shots more realistic without it being fatal .

A blank at point blank range is likely to cause serious injury or death even with no projectile at all. At that range the muzzle flash itself (hot gas expelled from the gun barrel) is enough to penetrate and kill you.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by rusticgal

It said on the news just now...they were blanks not live ammo.

Absolute tragedy...

Has to have been debris in the gun then. I think it seems like this is maybe more common with revolver-type weapons? That’s what they’d be using in a Western; and is also the type of gun that killed Brandon Lee. I think maybe because they function in a relatively “simple” way. More modern-style guns would be more likely to jam than misfire if there was debris in them.

[Cherie]

Anyway however it happened it’s a tragedy for all involved

[Alf]

Interesting stat

Brandon Lee's funeral was on Alec Baldwin's birthday.

It doesn't mean anything, it's just an interesting stat.

[Alf]

[arista]

[parmnion]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

It could be a shot facing the camera with director and cinematographer stood behind the camera. It’s a western (I think?) so that would actually be quite a common framing for a shootout type scene (firing towards camera).

It's actually a western about a young man who shoots someone by mistake.

But everyones not picked up on that yet

[arista]

[arista]

[bitontheslide]

the responsibility is with the person who shoots the gun, not the person that handed him it. He is obviously going for the, it wasnt my fault defence

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

the responsibility is with the person who shoots the gun, not the person that handed him it. He is obviously going for the, it wasnt my fault defence

Really though? I wouldn't have thought so, he's trusting the people who deal with the guns

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

the responsibility is with the person who shoots the gun, not the person that handed him it. He is obviously going for the, it wasnt my fault defence

I think there#s actually quite a lot of precedent - assuming it was indeed an accident - for the responsibility in deaths during movie shoots/stunts for "stunts gone wrong" falling with stunt coordinators and health and safety people, and not the actors or stunt people themselves. In normal circumstances, the person handling the gun is ALWAYS responsible for knowing if that gun is loaded or not, that it's in good working order, etc. but that's different during something like a movie shoot.

Another example would be, if a stuntperson pushes another off a high fall and they're supposed to land safely on an air bag below - but the stunt handlers ****ed up and it's faulty or in the wrong place and they die or are severely injured - the other stuntperson who pushed them off the ledge is not guilty of murder or manslaughter but the people who set up the equipment might be guilty of criminal negligence.

[bitontheslide]

i would disagree with that. It is still the responsibility of the stunt man in your example to make sure that everything is in order, you never rely on other people in any safety issue, you always take your own responsibility

[Vicky.]

The press are going to hound this guy to death and then say its a huge shock and such a shame as it was clearly eating him up inside and he should have been left alone as it was obviously not on purpose. Can see it coming. I ****ing hope I am wrong but what a messed up situation..

[rusticgal]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

the responsibility is with the person who shoots the gun, not the person that handed him it. He is obviously going for the, it wasnt my fault defence

I read the gun was given to him by a director who believed it to be unloaded shouting out 'cold' gun...meaning safe and unloaded. The chief armourer on set is a young lady who was responsible for checking the firearms.
As an actor if your director hands you a gun he claims is unloaded you are going to believe him..

[bitontheslide]

Originally Posted by rusticgal

I read the gun was given to him by a director who believed it to be unloaded shouting out 'cold' gun...meaning safe and unloaded. The chief armourer on set is a young lady who was responsible for checking the firearms.
As an actor if your director hands you a gun he claims is unloaded you are going to believe him..

i can't agree, responsibility never rests with the most junior person. With something like a gun, the responsibility rests with the person firing it, it's not a toy

[rusticgal]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

i can't agree, responsibility never rests with the most junior person. With something like a gun, the responsibility rests with the person firing it, it's not a toy

I wouldnt say a chief Amourer is a junior person? He is there to do a job and getting paid to do a job properly.

[arista]

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

i can't agree, responsibility never rests with the most junior person. With something like a gun, the responsibility rests with the person firing it, it's not a toy

I just don’t think the same would apply on a film set - there are people whose entire job is ensuring stunt and equipment safety, and not all actors being asked to be in a scene involving firearms are going to have much (or sometimes, any) real experience in handling them and will purely be following direction.

Also, it’s not particularly easy for an inexperienced person to tell the difference between a blank and live round, nor to know if the gun is properly cleaned and maintained. You’re essentially saying that it should be the actors responsibility to ensure the weapon is in good order and load it themselves, instead of people with extensive firearms handling experience. That would almost certainly result in FAR more accidents.

When you consider how many hours of film/television are filmed every year using things like guns and explosives, fatal accidents are actually extremely rare. I can see that changing pretty quickly if all of a sudden Scarlett Johansson is loading and maintaining her own Glock 26.

[arista]

['I wasn't sure if I was ready': The 24-year-old armorer
who had doubts before being put in
charge of guns on Alec Baldwin film set
where he shot cinematographer dead - after
some crew walked out over safety
Armorer Hannah Gutierrez-Reed and
assistant director Dave Halls were named
in search warrant on Friday
Gutierrez-Reed, 24, laid out three guns,
and Halls picked up a Colt pistol
and handed it to Baldwin
'Cold gun!' shouted Halls,
a veteran assistant director who
worked on Fargo and The Matrix Reloaded
When Baldwin pulled the trigger,
a bullet was fired, killing the
cinematographer and injuring
the director
Gutierrez-Reed is the daughter
of legendary Hollywood armorer Thell Reed
who trained her from a young age
She recently served as head armorer on a film
for the first time, on The Old Way,
starring Nicolas Cage
In a podcast interview after filming ended,
she said she wasn't sure if she was
ready to be a head armorer
Meanwhile, troubling reports highlight
safety concerns on the set of
Baldwin's Western film, Rust
Production crew on the set of Rust walked
out on Thursday morning in a row over
safety and long hours
On Thursday, when they arrived to pack up,
they found a team of non-union workers
waiting to replace them
Halyna Hutchins decided to stay on the
set and film with Alec Baldwin
and the film director Joel Souza
She had been advocating on behalf
of her team for better working conditions,
but was killed by the bullet]


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...dwin-film.html


Not good on that film set
before the Death.
Having to bring in, Non Union Workers.


I wonder if this film will now be completed ?

[arista]

[Workers had been protesting over the
fact production wouldn't pay for them
to stay in hotels and motels in Sante Fe,
instead forcing them to drive an hour to Albuquerque]

[arista]

Its being called a Low Budget Western.

Meaning Cut Backs can effect the gear.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

feel sad for Alec

It must be awful for him.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

the responsibility is with the person who shoots the gun, not the person that handed him it. He is obviously going for the, it wasnt my fault defence

Nah they hire people to make sure that the Props are safe to use.

The responsibility lies with them over Alec imo.