I'm going to be controversial - long post [Archive] - ThisisBigBrother.com

15-08-2009, 12:01 AM

Ultimately Freddie brought himself down by being too confident. Bea played a major part in his downfall and we've all seen it happening.

Now the controversial bit - I thin Marcus had a hand in Freddie's downfall.

I said a couple of days ago that I didn't believe Marcus wanted to go although he kept saying he did. Freddie should have trusted Siavash more. Marcus sewed a seed of doubt with Freddie and told him Siavash wasn't to be trusted. "Don't trust anyone in here - only me". This was done when Freddie was on a real low and he made the mistake of trusting Marcus totally. Marcus made himself Freddie's best and only friend in a similar way that he controlled Noirin

I also said, and still believe that on the night Marcus had the row with Bea he knew he was going to gain popularity. He told Freddie to go back to bed and not get involved because if Freddie had laid into Bea at that time he would have gained massive support. He trusted Marcus and went back to bed.

He trusted Marcus when he told him that Charlie wouldn't vote for him. Charlie has voted for Freddie every week as far as I can remember.

Marcus hugged Lisa last night. They dislike each other intensely but Lisa preferred Marcus to stay and they used each other.

Well played Marcus. Freddie made the mistake of putting too much trust in Bea and Marcus. He finished himself off by being too cocky.

Chels

15-08-2009, 12:03 AM

I think you're right to some extent...

eggdavid

15-08-2009, 12:04 AM

who was the one who defended freddie when bea and charlie were stealing his cider and his tea?? marcus

the dark horse has been great to halfwit and hasn't done anything recently to get freddie voted out or disliked at all, he has been sticking up for him over the past few days

15-08-2009, 12:09 AM

I'm not saying that Marcus got Freddie evicted just that he was knowingly instrumental in his eviction.

On the night of his argument with Bea, when they both knew they were up, yes Marcus did tell them "It's not right to steal" and he smiled. He also smiled or laughed at several negative things that were said about Freddie and I didn't think he said a great deal in his defence.

Of the people in the house I do think that Siavash and Marcus were his best friends but ultimately Marcus was looking after no. 1 and played a better game than Freddie and he did play a part in Freddie being evicted IMO

Addy

15-08-2009, 12:12 AM

The reason your point seemed very plausible is because Marcus did nominate Halfwit week 3 and week 6 so it is plausible Marcus is playing the best game in there!!!!!

jjj2

15-08-2009, 12:13 AM

Thats is Exactly what i thought when he sent freddie back to bed, he did not want to share the glory of taking on Bea with Freddie .i though this Guy dose not really want to go home

boomoo

15-08-2009, 12:15 AM

Freddie would not agree that marcus got Freddie evicted.

It was time for Freddie to go he was exhausted.
I hope he can deal with the footage he will watch.

He was great on the eviction interview and even better on BBBM.
For terry Christian to say he liked him is amazing as he automatically dislikes people like Freddie.

Marcus now thinks he is amazing because he thinks he has beaten the favourite. Freddie has not been top of the poles for awhile.
However the TV polls sent to me had Freddie to win. He might just have been removed because the rest of the housemates were getting back to the bullying syndrone led by bea od hiding things etc.
It was good for him that e went tonight. I think ke was glad.

Nebi

15-08-2009, 12:21 AM

You make some good points but I think that Freddie's time was up anyway. There's a limit to what we can support, he would have either took a knife and stab Bea or walk out the house.

Kazanne

15-08-2009, 12:27 AM

Originally posted by BJ
Ultimately Freddie brought himself down by being too confident. Bea played a major part in his downfall and we've all seen it happening.

Now the controversial bit - I thin Marcus had a hand in Freddie's downfall.

I said a couple of days ago that I didn't believe Marcus wanted to go although he kept saying he did. Freddie should have trusted Siavash more. Marcus sewed a seed of doubt with Freddie and told him Siavash wasn't to be trusted. "Don't trust anyone in here - only me". This was done when Freddie was on a real low and he made the mistake of trusting Marcus totally. Marcus made himself Freddie's best and only friend in a similar way that he controlled Noirin

I also said, and still believe that on the night Marcus had the row with Bea he knew he was going to gain popularity. He told Freddie to go back to bed and not get involved because if Freddie had laid into Bea at that time he would have gained massive support. He trusted Marcus and went back to bed.

He trusted Marcus when he told him that Charlie wouldn't vote for him. Charlie has voted for Freddie every week as far as I can remember.

Marcus hugged Lisa last night. They dislike each other intensely but Lisa preferred Marcus to stay and they used each other.

Well played Marcus. Freddie made the mistake of putting too much trust in Bea and Marcus. He finished himself off by being too cocky.

Well said and I'ts very interesting what you say I had not thought of it like that before,poor Freddie got stuffed everyway by the looks of it

15-08-2009, 12:29 AM

I'm not bitter because Freddie has gone although I would have preferred him to stay, mainly to rub Bea and Lisa's noses in it.

It really is purely an observation.

I want Rodrigo to win. He's been my favourite from the start

coolestrocknrollstar

15-08-2009, 12:30 AM

Originally posted by Addy
The reason your point seemed very plausible is because Marcus did nominate Halfwit week 3 and week 6 so it is plausible Marcus is playing the best game in there!!!!!

if this is the case then purely on best gameplan alone he should win,,,,,,but ive started to see his morals and i think they are genuine,,,,little things he has said has been the truth,,,i didnt want him to win at the start but his personality has grown on me.
Plus i cant smell him from here so that doesnt bother me lol

Patrick

15-08-2009, 12:32 AM

Freddies fault :whistle:

Novo

15-08-2009, 12:34 AM

Freddie's own arrogance was the downfall off him

Do not put the blame on marcus he has stuck up for freddie numerous times

shash

15-08-2009, 12:36 AM

Originally posted by BJ
Ultimately Freddie brought himself down by being too confident. Bea played a major part in his downfall and we've all seen it happening.

Now the controversial bit - I thin Marcus had a hand in Freddie's downfall.

I said a couple of days ago that I didn't believe Marcus wanted to go although he kept saying he did. Freddie should have trusted Siavash more. Marcus sewed a seed of doubt with Freddie and told him Siavash wasn't to be trusted. "Don't trust anyone in here - only me". This was done when Freddie was on a real low and he made the mistake of trusting Marcus totally. Marcus made himself Freddie's best and only friend in a similar way that he controlled Noirin

I also said, and still believe that on the night Marcus had the row with Bea he knew he was going to gain popularity. He told Freddie to go back to bed and not get involved because if Freddie had laid into Bea at that time he would have gained massive support. He trusted Marcus and went back to bed.

He trusted Marcus when he told him that Charlie wouldn't vote for him. Charlie has voted for Freddie every week as far as I can remember.

Marcus hugged Lisa last night. They dislike each other intensely but Lisa preferred Marcus to stay and they used each other.

Well played Marcus. Freddie made the mistake of putting too much trust in Bea and Marcus. He finished himself off by being too cocky.

I'm not being picky, but didn't Marcus say: "I don't trust anyone, only me" ? Or was this another conversation?

But he did say that about Siavash which I don't think was meant to preserve Marcus' time in the house but certainly did not help Freddie and his confusion in the scene which followed.

Mutteroo

15-08-2009, 12:41 AM

I'm a total Freddie fan but the ONLY reason I wanted him to stay was because I wanted to see Bea's face when she realized her scheme was failing.

It was time for Freddie to leave as he was no longer playing a good game and seeing a nasty piece of scum like Bea, constantly beatching about him, was becoming monotonous and unwatchable.

Marcus played a small part in the downfall of Freddie and I agree that someone who says they want to leave, never really wants that. Marcus was/is looking for reassurances by the public and appears to know more about the BB game than any of them. He makes sure he is last to bed thus gaining support from those who stay up to see if there's any night action; he also puts on acts to ensure further publicity. I don't think that getting Freddie evicted was a deliberate thought and believe ultimately Freddie only has himself to blame.

shash

15-08-2009, 12:41 AM

I did not want Freddie to go but what lost him his place in the house was Bea, and two disastrous scenes where he appeared too self-assured. Probably more to blame [inadvertantly] than anyone is Tom, who spilled the beans about Freddie's outside popularity. It probably gave him some much needed confidence at that time but he did not use this knowledge wisely imho

squinky

15-08-2009, 12:54 AM

i liked freddie,annoying as he could be sometimes.i didnt want him to leave,but,i wanted marcus to stay,as he can outdo bea every step of the way.despite her grandiose self love,he is far more intelligent that her,maybe not in education,but certainly in social aspects.her over inflated opinion of her own worth clouds her perspective of reality.i believe that marcus has integrity,and that he is a loyal and honest friend.

shash

15-08-2009, 12:58 AM

Originally posted by squinky
i liked freddie,annoying as he could be sometimes.i didnt want him to leave,but,i wanted marcus to stay,as he can outdo bea every step of the way.despite her grandiose self love,he is far more intelligent that her,maybe not in education,but certainly in social aspects.her over inflated opinion of her own worth clouds her perspective of reality.i believe that marcus has integrity,and that he is a loyal and honest friend.

You're right, Marcus is infinitely more intelligent than Bea, the only difference was in their education. Even without the same education Marcus can completely control and out-argue her in any debate. I don't mean argue in the heated row sense but its purest form of debate.

keithafc

15-08-2009, 01:06 AM

Im not an exclusive member of any Freddie club but what happened to Freddie was a disgrace. Bea single handly cost him any chance of winning. Everyone on earth has flaws and Freddie’s were shown up big time. She kept picking away and picking away and kept going at him and day by day, frustration built up inside him and he snapped. Simple as that. That day of the argument between Freddie V Lisa, Marcus V David is what cost Freddie from winning.

Lisa just dragged him into it, funnily enough it looked like Freddie was having a go at her but it was clear as day she just lured Freddie into it and the moment he said anything argumentive wise, the worst of him came out and there was no real turning back.

They nominated him, put him against Marcus and just rode the luck to see if he would go this time. Bea just kept playing with his emotions and Freddie is a clever lad, he didn’t forget about the original confrontations at the start with Lisa and Kris, Karly etc.

It’s a shame really but what’s done is done. Bea has played a pretty great but vile game so far.

luminoussun

15-08-2009, 01:06 AM

Marcus was his best friend in there when he was getting the worst of it.
He said straight that some things about freddie and siavash bugged him and said it too both of there faces.
But also defended both of them and halfwit killed himself thanks to bea and lisa

shash

15-08-2009, 01:11 AM

Originally posted by luminoussun
Marcus was his best friend in there when he was getting the worst of it.
He said straight that some things about freddie and siavash bugged him and said it too both of there faces.
But also defended both of them and halfwit killed himself thanks to bea and lisa

I think you are right on all points here. I think that Marcus and Siavash were Freddie's only 2 friends in the house. Going by what I have seen I genuinely believe that Marcus really liked Freddie. Sometimes even when he said "Hello Freddie" he said it in such a way that it sounded like the most positive thing I heard in the house. Really! Marcus is emotional and when he hears something he thinks is wrong he will then say so when that person has gone, but Marcus likes Siavash and especially Freddie, I don't believe he meant to harm his chances.

15-08-2009, 01:37 AM

I really do think Marcus was a friend to Freddie but when push came to shove I believe Marcus, who does understand the game, really didn't want to go . Although he probably actually has had enough, Marcus needs to prove to himself that he can win, although he probably won't even acknowledge to himself that's how he feels.

I think Freddie went tonight because he was too sure of himself but if he'd not listened to Marcus and gone back to bed, he might well have been in the house tonight. I think Marcus knew what he was doing when he told Freddie to go to bed and that is my main point.

shash

15-08-2009, 01:43 AM

Originally posted by BJ
I think Marcus knew what he was doing when he told Freddie to go to bed and that is my main point.

I did wonder about that too, and it could have been for several reasons. Either for what he said at face value to stop Freddie picking eviction votes - for his own needs as you suggest - or what I personally think, to get him out of the room before Bea returned from the diary room when it could have got really nasty indeed. Marcus was controlling the "argument" masterfully, and it might have gone really pear-shaped if it turned into the sort of shouting match that it was becoming when Charlie started. We will never know for sure, I guess.

Marcus did spend a lot of the evening defending Freddie to Bea, and I liked this loyalty.

I do agree with you though, I think Marcus is hoping for some kind of acceptance and approval, or at least understanding from this experience. There was a hint of this in that tender moment with Lisa on the highlights when his eyes sparkled when Lisa said something he liked hearing and he felt understood, to a degree.

But he's still The Irrepressible Dark Horse and not a total softy :laugh2:

jtalh2003

15-08-2009, 01:47 AM

Originally posted by BJ
Ultimately Freddie brought himself down by being too confident. Bea played a major part in his downfall and we've all seen it happening.

Now the controversial bit - I thin Marcus had a hand in Freddie's downfall.

I said a couple of days ago that I didn't believe Marcus wanted to go although he kept saying he did. Freddie should have trusted Siavash more. Marcus sewed a seed of doubt with Freddie and told him Siavash wasn't to be trusted. "Don't trust anyone in here - only me". This was done when Freddie was on a real low and he made the mistake of trusting Marcus totally. Marcus made himself Freddie's best and only friend in a similar way that he controlled Noirin

I also said, and still believe that on the night Marcus had the row with Bea he knew he was going to gain popularity. He told Freddie to go back to bed and not get involved because if Freddie had laid into Bea at that time he would have gained massive support. He trusted Marcus and went back to bed.

He trusted Marcus when he told him that Charlie wouldn't vote for him. Charlie has voted for Freddie every week as far as I can remember.

Marcus hugged Lisa last night. They dislike each other intensely but Lisa preferred Marcus to stay and they used each other.

Well played Marcus. Freddie made the mistake of putting too much trust in Bea and Marcus. He finished himself off by being too cocky.
or marcus could have just been watching his friends back
and you are privilege to information that marcus is not ie
marcus had no idea if it was a victory against bea because he lacks outside info you could just as easily say bea thought it was a victory
and the truth is who the hell could freddie trust?
lisa no
bea no
david no
charlie no
dog face no
siavash (well we all seen how trust worthy he is with noirn lol) so no
rodders no
and who has gone round saying how would you feel if you were up so many weeks and stuff marcus

15-08-2009, 01:59 AM

Originally posted by jtalh2003
Originally posted by BJ
Ultimately Freddie brought himself down by being too confident. Bea played a major part in his downfall and we've all seen it happening.

Now the controversial bit - I thin Marcus had a hand in Freddie's downfall.

I said a couple of days ago that I didn't believe Marcus wanted to go although he kept saying he did. Freddie should have trusted Siavash more. Marcus sewed a seed of doubt with Freddie and told him Siavash wasn't to be trusted. "Don't trust anyone in here - only me". This was done when Freddie was on a real low and he made the mistake of trusting Marcus totally. Marcus made himself Freddie's best and only friend in a similar way that he controlled Noirin

I also said, and still believe that on the night Marcus had the row with Bea he knew he was going to gain popularity. He told Freddie to go back to bed and not get involved because if Freddie had laid into Bea at that time he would have gained massive support. He trusted Marcus and went back to bed.

He trusted Marcus when he told him that Charlie wouldn't vote for him. Charlie has voted for Freddie every week as far as I can remember.

Marcus hugged Lisa last night. They dislike each other intensely but Lisa preferred Marcus to stay and they used each other.

Well played Marcus. Freddie made the mistake of putting too much trust in Bea and Marcus. He finished himself off by being too cocky.
or marcus could have just been watching his friends back
and you are privilege to information that marcus is not ie
marcus had no idea if it was a victory against bea because he lacks outside info you could just as easily say bea thought it was a victory
and the truth is who the hell could freddie trust?
lisa no
bea no
david no
charlie no
dog face no
siavash (well we all seen how trust worthy he is with noirn lol) so no
rodders no
and who has gone round saying how would you feel if you were up so many weeks and stuff marcus

I take on board the point you're making but I think Marcus did have a pretty good idea that there were points to be scored by having an argument with Bea. Remember, he made the point about the 4 million viewers and the sloppery slope right at the start of the discussion before it ever became an argument (I've said points a lot of times - sorry getting tired:laugh:

Insane_Spirit

15-08-2009, 02:53 AM

Originally posted by .Andy.
Freddie's own arrogance was the downfall off him

Do not put the blame on marcus he has stuck up for freddie numerous times

I agree, although I do feel Bea has been instrumental in his emotional downfall. :shrug:

quietman1963

15-08-2009, 03:04 AM

I think Bea only turned against Freddie after the Marcus fag-nicking incident. Marcus turned Freddie against Bea which caused her to hate Freddie so much. Marcus turned Freddie against Bea to deflect attention fom himself rather than to cause the other two to fall out.

The falling out meant Bea joining the 'other side'.

jtalh2003

15-08-2009, 03:21 AM

Originally posted by BJ
Originally posted by jtalh2003
Originally posted by BJ
Ultimately Freddie brought himself down by being too confident. Bea played a major part in his downfall and we've all seen it happening.

Now the controversial bit - I thin Marcus had a hand in Freddie's downfall.

I said a couple of days ago that I didn't believe Marcus wanted to go although he kept saying he did. Freddie should have trusted Siavash more. Marcus sewed a seed of doubt with Freddie and told him Siavash wasn't to be trusted. "Don't trust anyone in here - only me". This was done when Freddie was on a real low and he made the mistake of trusting Marcus totally. Marcus made himself Freddie's best and only friend in a similar way that he controlled Noirin

I also said, and still believe that on the night Marcus had the row with Bea he knew he was going to gain popularity. He told Freddie to go back to bed and not get involved because if Freddie had laid into Bea at that time he would have gained massive support. He trusted Marcus and went back to bed.

He trusted Marcus when he told him that Charlie wouldn't vote for him. Charlie has voted for Freddie every week as far as I can remember.

Marcus hugged Lisa last night. They dislike each other intensely but Lisa preferred Marcus to stay and they used each other.

Well played Marcus. Freddie made the mistake of putting too much trust in Bea and Marcus. He finished himself off by being too cocky.
or marcus could have just been watching his friends back
and you are privilege to information that marcus is not ie
marcus had no idea if it was a victory against bea because he lacks outside info you could just as easily say bea thought it was a victory
and the truth is who the hell could freddie trust?
lisa no
bea no
david no
charlie no
dog face no
siavash (well we all seen how trust worthy he is with noirn lol) so no
rodders no
and who has gone round saying how would you feel if you were up so many weeks and stuff marcus

I take on board the point you're making but I think Marcus did have a pretty good idea that there were points to be scored by having an argument with Bea. Remember, he made the point about the 4 million viewers and the sloppery slope right at the start of the discussion before it ever became an argument (I've said points a lot of times - sorry getting tired:laugh:
i dont think you did take my point on because the point is marcus would be guessing you are not and i bet if you asked bea did she win i bet she would say yes to

and marcus had no idea off how people see him on the out side but bea did and was playing on the bully bit(sree)

and marcus had no idea how it would go if freddie joined in it could go bad it could go good so to tell him to go back to bed would definitely do freddie no damage and that is what marcus would be wanting going by your theroy

i just think you were shocked at the result and and started looking for reasons but it was already decided before that just look at polldaddy for one 6000 votes and and more wanted freddie out and that was before the argument

charliegimbert

15-08-2009, 03:23 AM

Originally posted by BJ
Ultimately Freddie brought himself down by being too confident. Bea played a major part in his downfall and we've all seen it happening.

Now the controversial bit - I thin Marcus had a hand in Freddie's downfall.

I said a couple of days ago that I didn't believe Marcus wanted to go although he kept saying he did. Freddie should have trusted Siavash more. Marcus sewed a seed of doubt with Freddie and told him Siavash wasn't to be trusted. "Don't trust anyone in here - only me". This was done when Freddie was on a real low and he made the mistake of trusting Marcus totally. Marcus made himself Freddie's best and only friend in a similar way that he controlled Noirin

I also said, and still believe that on the night Marcus had the row with Bea he knew he was going to gain popularity. He told Freddie to go back to bed and not get involved because if Freddie had laid into Bea at that time he would have gained massive support. He trusted Marcus and went back to bed.

He trusted Marcus when he told him that Charlie wouldn't vote for him. Charlie has voted for Freddie every week as far as I can remember.

Marcus hugged Lisa last night. They dislike each other intensely but Lisa preferred Marcus to stay and they used each other.

Well played Marcus. Freddie made the mistake of putting too much trust in Bea and Marcus. He finished himself off by being too cocky.

http://www.graphpaper.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/the_manual.gif

delta

15-08-2009, 06:00 AM

Or

He could have just believed that he was on his way out and he wanted to get across what he actually thought, sort of making his peace before he was evicted, with both Bea and Lisa.

Imagine if Marcus had thrown a hissy fit when Lisa was saying what he was like in the pool, the way that Marcus had offered back handed criticism to Bea.

I think that all these plots are way too Machiavellian for any of them, they are just resorting to what they know, and we are reading way too much into it, they only artificial interference is when BB sticks its size 10's in.

charmingmissc

15-08-2009, 06:49 AM

Originally posted by delta
Or

He could have just believed that he was on his way out and he wanted to get across what he actually thought, sort of making his peace before he was evicted, with both Bea and Lisa.

Imagine if Marcus had thrown a hissy fit when Lisa was saying what he was like in the pool, the way that Marcus had offered back handed criticism to Bea.

I think that all these plots are way too Machiavellian for any of them, they are just resorting to what they know, and we are reading way too much into it, they only artificial interference is when BB sticks its size 10's in.

:thumbs:

ElProximo

15-08-2009, 07:13 AM

I will say it again:
Bea and Marcus 'argument' was NOT really an 'argument between Bea and Marcus'.
That was Bea masterfully ensuring Freddy's defeat.
Marcus was Beas tool.
I will agree with the OP in this sense - Marcus was a perfectly willing tool. He almost blew it several times (watch the entire episode to see a dozen fukktard things from meek Marcus),
but,
He was meek enough and played along even if he wasn't entirely sure how and why.
So yes, in that sense Marcus helped by being a proper tool for Bea to work.

Terry Christian has got this entire series spot-on over and over again and is entirely accurate last night:
Marcus is a manipulator and a sneak.

Watch Bea use Marcus like a tool again this week and watch Marcus be happy to do so. He doesn't need to know 'how' he is being used because that is for the Master Craftsman (Bea) to know,
but,
He will happily drill holes into Siavash as she guides him into it.

*someone did point out that while Rodrigo may not have been the next intended victim he did make the mistake of getting a bit to 'snoopy' and in Beas way... ...so she might have to switch priorities.

delta

15-08-2009, 07:26 AM

Originally posted by ElProximo
I will say it again:
Bea and Marcus 'argument' was NOT really an 'argument between Bea and Marcus'.
That was Bea masterfully ensuring Freddy's defeat.
Marcus was Beas tool.
I will agree with the OP in this sense - Marcus was a perfectly willing tool. He almost blew it several times (watch the entire episode to see a dozen fukktard things from meek Marcus),
but,
He was meek enough and played along even if he wasn't entirely sure how and why.
So yes, in that sense Marcus helped by being a proper tool for Bea to work.

Terry Christian has got this entire series spot-on over and over again and is entirely accurate last night:
Marcus is a manipulator and a sneak.

Watch Bea use Marcus like a tool again this week and watch Marcus be happy to do so. He doesn't need to know 'how' he is being used because that is for the Master Craftsman (Bea) to know,
but,
He will happily drill holes into Siavash as she guides him into it.

*someone did point out that while Rodrigo may not have been the next intended victim he did make the mistake of getting a bit to 'snoopy' and in Beas way... ...so she might have to switch priorities.

You have been reading way too many novels mate.

Non of them are that clever in there.

But let the week play out and see if your theory is proven.

Imho, it's quantam maths in there, anything could and will happen. All they know it what they were on the outside and that's the way they are conducting themselves in the BB house.

masonbason

15-08-2009, 07:31 AM

Originally posted by BJ
Ultimately Freddie brought himself down by being too confident. Bea played a major part in his downfall and we've all seen it happening.

Now the controversial bit - I thin Marcus had a hand in Freddie's downfall.

I said a couple of days ago that I didn't believe Marcus wanted to go although he kept saying he did. Freddie should have trusted Siavash more. Marcus sewed a seed of doubt with Freddie and told him Siavash wasn't to be trusted. "Don't trust anyone in here - only me". This was done when Freddie was on a real low and he made the mistake of trusting Marcus totally. Marcus made himself Freddie's best and only friend in a similar way that he controlled Noirin

I also said, and still believe that on the night Marcus had the row with Bea he knew he was going to gain popularity. He told Freddie to go back to bed and not get involved because if Freddie had laid into Bea at that time he would have gained massive support. He trusted Marcus and went back to bed.

He trusted Marcus when he told him that Charlie wouldn't vote for him. Charlie has voted for Freddie every week as far as I can remember.

Marcus hugged Lisa last night. They dislike each other intensely but Lisa preferred Marcus to stay and they used each other.

Well played Marcus. Freddie made the mistake of putting too much trust in Bea and Marcus. He finished himself off by being too cocky.

Exactly my thought, i posted the same thing. Marcus + channel 4 cause channel 4 should have booted out Marcus cause broke the rules so many times.

delta

15-08-2009, 08:03 AM

Just to add, if Bea was that clever, she wouldn't have freaked out when Marcus told her that 4 million people would hate her.

This demonstrates it is not a 'game plan' and is just operating the way she only knows how.

All Lisa has done is temper her behavior, the real Lisa keeps rearing its ugly head every now and then.

Linto99

15-08-2009, 08:42 AM

Originally posted by BJ
Ultimately Freddie brought himself down by being too confident. Bea played a major part in his downfall and we've all seen it happening.

Now the controversial bit - I thin Marcus had a hand in Freddie's downfall.

I said a couple of days ago that I didn't believe Marcus wanted to go although he kept saying he did. Freddie should have trusted Siavash more. Marcus sewed a seed of doubt with Freddie and told him Siavash wasn't to be trusted. "Don't trust anyone in here - only me". This was done when Freddie was on a real low and he made the mistake of trusting Marcus totally. Marcus made himself Freddie's best and only friend in a similar way that he controlled Noirin

I also said, and still believe that on the night Marcus had the row with Bea he knew he was going to gain popularity. He told Freddie to go back to bed and not get involved because if Freddie had laid into Bea at that time he would have gained massive support. He trusted Marcus and went back to bed.

He trusted Marcus when he told him that Charlie wouldn't vote for him. Charlie has voted for Freddie every week as far as I can remember.

Marcus hugged Lisa last night. They dislike each other intensely but Lisa preferred Marcus to stay and they used each other.

Well played Marcus. Freddie made the mistake of putting too much trust in Bea and Marcus. He finished himself off by being too cocky.

I agree with a lot of points you make. I also wondered about Marcus's request that Freddie go back to bed, even when he said it I thought ' Is this Marcus being tactical or just looking after his friend'

I do think though that ultimately Freddie's downfall was his cockiness about he was staying 100% and the fact he just could not deal with Queen Bea Biatch. If he had handled her properly then he would still be there, as people would have overlooked his cockiness - But like most people who are hurt by someone who they loved, He let his emotions get in the way and could not 'see the wood for the trees'

seansmc

15-08-2009, 04:47 PM

Marcus considers Charlie a friend.Marcus often says Charlie, Freddie, Siavash are his friends.He just hasn't found Charlie out as a saccharine [Falsely sweet] character yet.As he considers Charlie a friend that is why he didn't beleive Charlie would nominate Freddie.

"Siavash wasn't to be trusted." Marcus never trusted Siavash, his friendship with Siavash was damaged after the whole Noirin saga.He felt Siavash betrayed his trust when he went with Noirin so hence he warns Freddie about Siavash.

Lisa is closest in age to Marcus then anyone else in the house, he feels comfortable having conversations with her as opposed to the youth in the house.Lisa and Marcus share the same similarity of looking hard on the outside but rwally been soft on the inside.Marcus showed a bit of affection giving her a hug which just signifies that Marcus realises it is a game show and in the real world they would find each other ok they only difference they have is by the way they approach the game.Marcus didn't join Lisa's crew he created his own path and therefore his path collides with Lisa's on the ultimate goal of making it to the final.
Every now and then Marcus and Lisa put their Game brains away and come together and talk as if its the real world.They then separate and go back into Game mode until the next time out.

Marcus told Freddie to go back to bed, that was the best decision.You have to be a fool if you can't see this.If Bea came out and Freddie was there the house would of erupted in arguments.Marcus saw the damaging effect these had on Freddie, he didn't want to see his friend hurt again or for a huge argument to take off.I also honestly do think that Marcus believed that the public vote would go against Freddie if he stayed and argued.

Marcus is genuine.He doesn't act in away to please the public or the other house mates.He chooses to be himself.
At this moment Marcus is the only one in the house without a game plan.Yes he definitely wants to win but at the same time he is fed up and part of him wants to leave.

WOMBAI

15-08-2009, 05:03 PM