Should paedophiles be named and shamed?

[Biggersister]

Ive been having a bit of a debate with the guys at work about the whole name and shame thing for convicted criminals. We found this: http://www.theratbook.com over the weekend, it looks like somebody has gone to alot of trouble putting it together. I personally believe that naming and shaming criminals in the press is a good thing, because it serves a number of benefits;


Should discourage criminals from committing the crime - once their name is out they cannot hide
Means that people (parents in particular) can protect themselves from dangerous people

However - some of the guys at work keep going on about vigilante threats, and people taking the law into their own hands. From what Ive seen, this is almost an urban myth (other than the occasional pediatrician having a brick thrown through their window...although I wonder did that ever even happen??).

What does everybody else think? Is naming and shaming right or wrong?

[Niamh.]

Well, for peadophiles and other dangerous criminals, I would say absolutely. I can see your friends point on the vigilante threat but, especially when it comes to peadophiles, Innocent childrens safety comes before dangerous criminals in my eyes.

[Enid]

The one thing the UK would benefit from is a public sex offenders registry. America has one. You can simply type in your address and view all the sex offenders in the area. Yet the government here seem to want to protect THEM and not US or our children.

[Niamh.]

The one thing the UK would benefit from is a public sex offenders registry. America has one. You can simply type in your address and view all the sex offenders in the area. Yet the government here seem to want to protect THEM and not US or our children.

Exactly, it's crazy!! I mean if they don't want to be on the registry don't do the crime......................simple.

[Enid]

Thing is, there is no level of "sex offence". Once you're on that registry, your life is screwed basically. Some people are put on the register for simply pissing in public. And unless there is that information, you're not going to know who is a paedophile and rapist and who went for a piss behind a building on a drunken night out.

[Niamh.]

Thing is, there is no level of "sex offence". Once you're on that registry, your life is screwed basically. Some people are put on the register for simply pissing in public. And unless there is that information, you're not going to know who is a paedophile and rapist and who went for a piss behind a building on a drunken night out.

Really? How can taking a piss be classed as a sex offence?? lol

Yeah obviously that would have to be sorted out

[setanta]

The beginnings of a police state darlings.... that's what all this named and shamed will eventually lead to.

[Enid]

Really? How can taking a piss be classed as a sex offence?? lol

Yeah obviously that would have to be sorted out
Because the offender exposed themselves, lol. It's very ****ed up.

[Niamh.]

The beginnings of a police state darlings.... that's what all this named and shamed will eventually lead to.

Nah, if it's people who are a danger to children they should be named. Most paedophiles re offend so kids need to be protected

[setanta]

Nah, if it's people who are a danger to children they should be named. Most paedophiles re offend so kids need to be protected

You have to eliminate emotion from this and think about it in a different way. The best policy for any state to adapt when trying to control it's citizens is to keep them in a perpetual state of fear or anxiety which makes it far easier for them to introduce drastic changes that curtail our freedom. That's all that this whole paedo thing is ultimately about. You don't think paedo's existed hundreds of years ago? You think it's a modern day phenomenon? They want to misdirect you with this fear mongering so that they can go about and brainwash you into apathy when it concerns radical changes that encroach upon your rights. I'm telling you, they do it all the time.

[Crimson Dynamo]

As it is a sexual proclivity crime, and sex drive is a powerful persuader, I think that if convicted twice they should be castrated. naming them would result in violence.

[Niamh.]

You have to eliminate emotion from this and think about it in a different way. The best policy for any state to adapt when trying to control it's citizens is to keep them in a perpetual state of fear or anxiety which makes it far easier for them to introduce drastic changes that curtail our freedom. That's all that this whole paedo thing is ultimately about. You don't think paedo's existed hundreds of years ago? You think it's a modern day phenomenon? They want to misdirect you with this fear mongering so that they can go about and brainwash you into apathy when it concerns radical changes that encroach upon your rights. I'm telling you, they do it all the time.

Of course it happened years ago, I'm not stupid. And fear that my kids aren't safe is my feeling along with every other parent, aunt,uncle etc.

[Niamh.]

As it is a sexual proclivity crime, and sex drive is a powerful persuader, I think that if convicted twice they should be castrated. naming them would result in violence.

Castration is a better solution, you're right LT

[NettoSuperstar!]

No they should be placed in specialist secure units and only released if they are considered by a large panel of experts to no longer be a danger to children...chemical castration, therapy, lie detectors etc should all be used

[setanta]

Of course it happened years ago, I'm not stupid. And fear that my kids aren't safe is my feeling along with every other parent, aunt,uncle etc.

But sure every parent throughout time has felt like that. This really doesn't change things in the slightest, except for adding additional fear and anxiety into society.

[Niamh.]

But sure every parent throughout time has felt like that. This really doesn't change things in the slightest, except for adding additional fear and anxiety into society.

No, it would be easing a fear from parents.

[BB_Eye]

Didn't the Sun do this years ago and end up putting a number of innocent people in danger?

[setanta]

No, it would be easing a fear from parents.

A fear of what though? I mean, most parents wouldn't be allowing their kids to talk to strangers in the first place. Once the proper precautions are taken and you have a good, healthy relationship with your children, then there's really nothing to be scared of. My worry is where this kind of tagging will end, you know? Police state baby.

[Niamh.]

A fear of what though? I mean, most parents wouldn't be allowing their kids to talk to strangers in the first place. Once the proper precautions are made and you have a good, healthy relationship with your children, then there's really nothing to be scared of. My worry is where this kind of tagging will end, you know? Police state baby.

Well, in alot of these situations, these people get jobs in schools or around children and become familiar not strangers to children

[NettoSuperstar!]

Well, in alot of these situations, these people get jobs in schools or around children and become familiar not strangers to children

They're shouldnt be anyone working with or around kids these days, the laws and checks have been tightened a lot since Ian Huntley

[Niamh.]

They're shouldnt be anyone working with or around kids these days, the laws and checks have been tightened a lot since Ian Huntley

That's in Britain though, what about in Ireland? I doubt it.

[setanta]

Well, in alot of these situations, these people get jobs in schools or around children and become familiar not strangers to children

That's different. Any service which works with children should always get in contact with a governing body to run a check on any new workers.

My concern is if all of this goes public you increase fear and worry in people.... that's when the trouble starts and when the state can really f£ck us over, in terms of new legislation, stricter laws etc, not to even think of what people will do to one another.

[NettoSuperstar!]

That's in Britain though, what about in Ireland? I doubt it.

Ah I dont know about Ireland, dont you have CRB checks?

[setanta]

Ah I dont know about Ireland, dont you have CRB checks?

I've taught in primary schools and I had to be checked for any record. That's how it works.

[Captain.Remy]

I have mixed feelings about it. On one hand, I agree to a certain extent with Setanta. The fact it becomes public will increase paranoia, accusations and tensions between neighbours, colleagues or others. Increasing fear isn't the most appropriate way, it'd rapidly become a huge mess.
On the other hand, it may be seen as a preventive way of keeping the children safe. Paedophiles don't even deserve to live nor having a "normal" life. I still don't understand how our governments (same thing in France and Italy) want to "protect them" to a certain extent.

So I don't know to be honest, it's a very tough situation.

[NettoSuperstar!]

I've taught in primary schools and I had to be checked for any record. That's how it works.

Yeh surely in this day and age you would have to do that. Here we also check if they have been questioned by the police for sex crimes etc even if they havent been convicted they still wouldnt be able to work with children (since Ian Huntley). I agree with you, disclosing that info should be on a need to know basis only. I still think there are people that are a real danger that should not be let out into the community just because their sentence is finished, we need to treat sex offenders differently in my opinion

[Niamh.]

Do you remember that case in Ireland James not so long ago, I'm a bit sketchy on all the details but basically this man molested 2 young girls, was found guilty and given a suspended sentence(wtf??) and was back behind the counter of his shop that afternoon. It just makes me angry that this type of crime which to me is as bad as murder doesn't seem to be taken seriously, something, if not a register than something else needs to change so our children are better protected.

[King Gizzard]

http://www.edp24.co.uk/content/edp24/news/story.aspx?brand=EDPOnline&category=News&tBrand=EDPOnline&tCategory=xDefault&itemid=NOED09%20Oct%202009%2017%3A44%3A50%3A917

use to live near me and was in the year above. ew

[Niamh.]

http://www.edp24.co.uk/content/edp24/news/story.aspx?brand=EDPOnline&category=News&tBrand=EDPOnline&tCategory=xDefault&itemid=NOED09%20Oct%202009%2017%3A44%3A50%3A917

use to live near me and was in the year above. ew

eewww, is right!

[setanta]

Do you remember that case in Ireland James not so long ago, I'm a bit sketchy on all the details but basically this man molested 2 young girls, was found guilty and given a suspended sentence(wtf??) and was back behind the counter of his shop that afternoon. It just makes me angry that this type of crime which to me is as bad as murder doesn't seem to be taken seriously, something, if not a register than something else needs to change so our children are better protected.

I don't remember the case but I fully agree with you on your feelings towards it. Unfortunately that's problem with our government and legal system which is a seperate issue to this whole idea of making certain data accessible to the general public. I just think that could lead to very murky waters.

[Niamh.]

I don't remember the case but I fully agree with you on your feelings towards it. Unfortunately that's problem with our government and legal system which is a seperate issue to this whole idea of making certain data accessible to the general public. I just think that could lead to very murky waters.

Our legel system is a joke that's for sure. I'm all for the return of Chain gangs

[NettoSuperstar!]

And another reason against it, is it would drive them underground, theyd be constantly moving from place to place and it would be hard for the authorities to keep tabs on them, not that they do the best job of that now!

[InOne]

Well they do have a level of risk system in the UK. Sometimes it has worked sometimes it hasn't. The News of The World did 'Name and Shame' thing some years ago - it went horribly wrong. It funny when Britian suddenly takes on the mob mentality and confuses Paedotrition with Paedophile. Naming and shaming would get a mob of thugs out side houses literally buring tourches and grunting. Believe or not some do want help, not alot but some. It is a compulsion, and no matter what list, or what level of risk they are on, they would most likely still do it. I believe they should be put in secure units, and also should be studied to find the early warning signs. Beating the up on some street won't get you anywhere, there is always more going to be born. So it may be to late to save a child or something, but work on saving children of the present and future.

[Niamh.]

Well they do have a level of risk system in the UK. Sometimes it has worked sometimes it hasn't. The News of The World did 'Name and Shame' thing some years ago - it went horribly wrong. It funny when Britian suddenly takes on the mob mentality and confuses Paedotrition with Paedophile. Naming and shaming would get a mob of thugs out side houses literally buring tourches and grunting. Believe or not some do want help, not alot but some. It is a compulsion, and no matter what list, or what level of risk they are on, they would most likely still do it. I believe they should be put in secure units, and also should be studied to find the early warning signs. Beating the up on some street won't get you anywhere, there is always more going to be born. So it may be to late to save a child or something, but work on saving children of the present and future.

very good idea Joe.

[Tom4784]

Well they do have a level of risk system in the UK. Sometimes it has worked sometimes it hasn't. The News of The World did 'Name and Shame' thing some years ago - it went horribly wrong. It funny when Britian suddenly takes on the mob mentality and confuses Paedotrition with Paedophile. Naming and shaming would get a mob of thugs out side houses literally buring tourches and grunting. Believe or not some do want help, not alot but some. It is a compulsion, and no matter what list, or what level of risk they are on, they would most likely still do it. I believe they should be put in secure units, and also should be studied to find the early warning signs. Beating the up on some street won't get you anywhere, there is always more going to be born. So it may be to late to save a child or something, but work on saving children of the present and future.

No they should be placed in specialist secure units and only released if they are considered by a large panel of experts to no longer be a danger to children...chemical castration, therapy, lie detectors etc should all be used

I agree with these posts completely. Mob Mentality helps no one.

[Biggersister]

The beginnings of a police state darlings.... that's what all this named and shamed will eventually lead to.

I think the beginnings of a police state happened long long ago!!!

[Biggersister]

It funny when Britian suddenly takes on the mob mentality and confuses Paedotrition with Paedophile.

OK I want to challenge you to think outside the box for a second. What if, just for one moment, that story was fabricated? I mean, its a great story, everyone remembers it...a perfect way to set the tone for how dumb the British public are...and a perfect way to argue against naming and shaming paedophiles...but do you really, deep down inside, believe that such a vast amount of the British public are;

A) Really that illiterate
and
B) Quite so eager to form mobs and take the law into their own hands?

Naming and shaming would get a mob of thugs out side houses literally buring tourches and grunting.

You can imagine how easily the government (who control the mainstream media)..could drip-feed the odd vigilante story into the press...to keep job public thinking this way...but the best thing to do is look around you. Do you, or anybody in the office where you work, suddenly feel like grabbing a pitchfork and burning down the house of the nearest paedophile? If I ask myself the question, the answer is NO, of course not.

The government are constantly trying to manipulate us through the media...and its frustrating when I hear people regurgitating what could just as well be "old wives tales" of the 21st century...the pediatrician story being such a prime example.

Sorry to get all conspiracy theory on you all...but keep an open mind!!

[NettoSuperstar!]

OK I want to challenge you to think outside the box for a second. What if, just for one moment, that story was fabricated? I mean, its a great story, everyone remembers it...a perfect way to set the tone for how dumb the British public are...and a perfect way to argue against naming and shaming paedophiles...but do you really, deep down inside, believe that such a vast amount of the British public are;

A) Really that illiterate
and
B) Quite so eager to form mobs and take the law into their own hands?



You can imagine how easily the government (who control the mainstream media)..could drip-feed the odd vigilante story into the press...to keep job public thinking this way...but the best thing to do is look around you. Do you, or anybody in the office where you work, suddenly feel like grabbing a pitchfork and burning down the house of the nearest paedophile? If I ask myself the question, the answer is NO, of course not.

The government are constantly trying to manipulate us through the media...and its frustrating when I hear people regurgitating what could just as well be "old wives tales" of the 21st century...the pediatrician story being such a prime example.

Sorry to get all conspiracy theory on you all...but keep an open mind!!

Balls it was reported in the papers because it happens, you honestly think the papers have some hidden agenda where they dont want us to name and shame paedo's...lol I bet theyre looking forward to it being allowed more like! The Sun ran a campaign in support of naming and shaming!! oooh but was that a front too? lol

[InOne]

OK I want to challenge you to think outside the box for a second. What if, just for one moment, that story was fabricated? I mean, its a great story, everyone remembers it...a perfect way to set the tone for how dumb the British public are...and a perfect way to argue against naming and shaming paedophiles...but do you really, deep down inside, believe that such a vast amount of the British public are;

A) Really that illiterate
and
B) Quite so eager to form mobs and take the law into their own hands?



You can imagine how easily the government (who control the mainstream media)..could drip-feed the odd vigilante story into the press...to keep job public thinking this way...but the best thing to do is look around you. Do you, or anybody in the office where you work, suddenly feel like grabbing a pitchfork and burning down the house of the nearest paedophile? If I ask myself the question, the answer is NO, of course not.

The government are constantly trying to manipulate us through the media...and its frustrating when I hear people regurgitating what could just as well be "old wives tales" of the 21st century...the pediatrician story being such a prime example.

Sorry to get all conspiracy theory on you all...but keep an open mind!!

I know what you mean, but i've seen on facebook groups, say like about Peter, the first reaction in violence. Almost everyone on that group wanted an eye for an eye. Also don't forget many people don't really understand paedophilia. But people see themselves as vigalaties alot of the time, especially parents, they would be heros of the village. I'm not saying they'd all get up and do it that instant. It would most likely be planned, and the sickos would show up. It is a very very strong label to put on someone and alot of people are very quick to believe to, and they would quickly turn to violence. And I know the media creates myths but this one did happen. People just to conclusions quick and it can ruin lives. Half the time they would not even be bothered about the kid, mostly the violence.

[arista]

Well they do have a level of risk system in the UK. Sometimes it has worked sometimes it hasn't. The News of The World did 'Name and Shame' thing some years ago - it went horribly wrong. It funny when Britian suddenly takes on the mob mentality and confuses Paedotrition with Paedophile. Naming and shaming would get a mob of thugs out side houses literally buring tourches and grunting. Believe or not some do want help, not alot but some. It is a compulsion, and no matter what list, or what level of risk they are on, they would most likely still do it. I believe they should be put in secure units, and also should be studied to find the early warning signs. Beating the up on some street won't get you anywhere, there is always more going to be born. So it may be to late to save a child or something, but work on saving children of the present and future.



'Paedotrition with Paedophile. '

Yes that is why it will not change
Unless the Police go on Strike , of course.

[InOne]

'Paedotrition with Paedophile. '

Yes that is why it will not change
Unless the Police go on Strike , of course.

That is why what will not change?

[setanta]

I think the beginnings of a police state happened long long ago!!!

Very true.

[arista]

That is why what will not change?

The Current Laws.

[InOne]

The Current Laws.

Ahhhh right. Because they don't trust the public?

[Chels]

yeah, they're vile *****.
'nuff said.

[arista]

Ahhhh right. Because they don't trust the public?



The Public go Wild and are not under the control of a Head Officer.

So Police have to Rule everything.

[eye sea]

YES. They should be named and shamed.

[pinkmichk]

as a mother i am very mixed about this part of me thinks naming and shaming would be good but on other hand there is such a thing as too much info would you really want to know that one lived on your street (esp if a parent) like i say it could be a case of too much info
part of me would want to know but then a equal part would rather continue as i am

[Biggersister]

as a mother i am very mixed about this part of me thinks naming and shaming would be good but on other hand there is such a thing as too much info would you really want to know that one lived on your street (esp if a parent) like i say it could be a case of too much info
part of me would want to know but then a equal part would rather continue as i am

When it comes to the safety of children and proximity of paedophiles, I am of the opinion that ignorance is not bliss!

[bananarama]

No they should be placed in specialist secure units and only released if they are considered by a large panel of experts to no longer be a danger to children...chemical castration, therapy, lie detectors etc should all be used


Excellent and sensible response........The problem with naming and shaming is that there are even sicker people out there that will want to take the law into there own hands......And in some cases make a wrong identity and put in danger or harm an innocent person.......

[Biggersister]

The problem with naming and shaming is that there are even sicker people out there that will want to take the law into there own hands......


Do you consider physical violence to a grown man, to be more sick than the sexual abuse a young child?

[bananarama]

Do you consider physical violence to a grown man, to be more sick than the sexual abuse a young child?


Physical violence can kill so yes.,.......And if its an innocent person then yes they are worse than paedo's.......

[Biggersister]

Physical violence can kill so yes.,.......And if its an innocent person then yes they are worse than paedo's.......

Clearly we live on different planets!
:xyxwave:

[InOne]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8477310.stm

[WOMBAI]

Pros and cons. There is a down side - when vigilante groups attack the wrong people - but despite that, I think parents have the right to know when there are such people living near them! Protecting children gets priority in my book!

[Tom]

In an ideal world, yes. But we don't live in an ideal world. Too many people are wrongly convicted or accused and that stigma stays with them for life (see Michael Jackson)

[Biggersister]

An interesting link for those who are propagating the "pediatrician" story;

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/4719364.stm

[InOne]

An interesting link for those who are propagating the "pediatrician" story;

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/4719364.stm

Hmmm interesting. To be honest there has been rumours about paedophiles in my village but no mobs have ever gone to them. You get all these internet Psychopaths that say they would torture them, when they couldn't even torture a frog. Realistically most people don't take action until it directly affects them, they just gasp at the news, until the next Baby P comes along.

[spitfire]

Yes they should be named and shamed.Ten minutes before being hung.

[Angus]

Physical violence can kill so yes.,.......And if its an innocent person then yes they are worse than paedo's.......

:shocked:Unbelievable!

[Shasown]

I think we are looking at it from the wrong angle. perhaps we should ask should certain types of sex offenders, eg paedophiles be given a sentence of a predetermined length, in other words is it right to tie the hands of rehabilation services to a given length of time to correct certain types of behaviour within individuals.

If a paedophile was sentenced to be imprisoned or held in a secure treatment unit until it was established they wouldnt/couldnt or were incapable of committing the offences again would we need to name and shame?

As has been previously mentioned naming and shaming is only effective when the exact location of the offender is known, people can and do move, if a paedophile felt the urge to reoffend he goes into hiding and moves, disguising himself and taking an assumed name, he is then free to reoffend.

If we keep them in secure units they cant reoffend if before we release them we chemically castrate them, they wont feel the need to reoffend. Simples.

[bananarama]

Clearly we live on different planets!
:xyxwave:

Hope you are able to get back soon........:xyxwave:

[bananarama]

:shocked:Unbelievable!

The possibility of killing an innocent person not worse well you have a right to your opinion. Even though I find it unbelievable............

[Mystic Mock]

what if it turned out they were innocent

[zelda]

i think they should be named and shamed

[bananarama]

i think they should be named and shamed


In an ideal world I agree but there are nut cases out there who could harm or kill an innocent victim......In view of the probable dangers I think the present policy is unavoidable.....But like you I wish it could change.......

[karezza]

Is the Pope the King of the Paedos?:nono:

[Jessica.]

Is the Pope the King of the Paedos?:nono:

:nono: Leave Pope Benedict alone!