Muslim protesters burn poppy in 'emergency demonstration'

[Vicky.]

Islamic protesters sparked fury today after they burned a model of a poppy and deliberately broke the silence at Armistice Day commemorations in central London.

As millions of Britons fell silent to remember those who have died in war, members of a group called Muslims Against Crusades clashed with police during an 'emergency demonstration' in Kensington, west London.

As the clock struck 11am, the Islamic protesters burned a model of a poppy and chanted 'British soldiers burn in hell'.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1328703/Remembrance-Day-Poppy-burning-Muslim-protesters-mar-Armistice-Day.html#ixzz14zHlvVXs

----

Yes, I do realise this is the daily mail, so chance to be exaggerated. Just noticed the story on another website and though it might be of interest. The people who have done this are pathetic IMO. And the photos just show what animals they are.

[Vicky.]

They held banners which read 'Islam will dominate' and 'Our dead are in paradise, your dead are in hell'.

Charming eh? As usual.

[Niamh.]

Charming eh? As usual.

delusional more like

[MTVN]

It may be the Daily Mail but the pictures speak for themselves, it's disgusting behaviour.

It's clearly inciting hatred and violence, something should have been done. On the pictures you see EDL members being arrested but from what it seems there were nothing done about those extremists who instigated the whole thing.

They're completely clueless, they dont even understand what Remembrance day is about fgs.

[Novo]

Hate these ***** so much... expecting everything their way throughout the whole year and for one day only they can't have the decency to show some respect

If i was a policeman today i would of found it extremely hard to just not let the EDL tear them to pieces.

[Vicky.]

It may be the Daily Mail but the pictures speak for themselves, it's disgusting behaviour.


Yeah I just thought i would get the fact that it was a daily mail article out of the way before someone else came in and attempted to rubbish the whole thing by saying which paper it was in ;)

But yeah, the photos speak for themselves.

Pathetic bitter twisted individuals with nothing better to do that **** like this.

[Niamh.]

Yeah I just thought i would get the fact that it was a daily mail article out of the way before someone else came in and attempted to rubbish the whole thing by saying which paper it was in ;)

But yeah, the photos speak for themselves.

Pathetic bitter twisted individuals with nothing better to do that **** like this.

They're so brain washed though, I can't understand how they actually genuinely believe some of the stuff they do. The we're going to Heaven everyone else will burn in hell bit for example

[Novo]

I respect the EDL a lot after reading a lot about them on their forum and through people who go to the marches, people just don't know how much effort they put in.. and ignorant people with no idea just brand them Racists..

[Vicky.]

I have respect the EDL a lot after reading a lot about them on their forum and through people who go to the marches, people just don't know how much effort they put in.. and ignorant people with no idea just brand them Racists..

I dont know much about the EDL. Might actually go and have a read up as I have nothing much to do this afternoon. All I know is that members on here continually brand them as racist.

[Angus]

Yeah I just thought i would get the fact that it was a daily mail article out of the way before someone else came in and attempted to rubbish the whole thing by saying which paper it was in ;)

But yeah, the photos speak for themselves.

Pathetic bitter twisted individuals with nothing better to do that **** like this.

Throw the bastards out of the country - it is quite terrifying to think we have so many enemies in our midst who hate our guts yet are happy to exploit the freedom of speech they are denied in their own, oh so wonderful, countries. Why do we have to tolerate these treacherous, poisonous arseholes in this country? British soldiers died and are still dying to preserve the freedoms we ALL enjoy.
Let's see what would happen if we burned the Qu'ran, or stormed one of their mosques and disrupted their prayers? WW3 would break out, but we are expected to meekly accept this despicable and outrageous behaviour from people who hate our way of life yet insist on living here nonetheless.

[Livia]

Typical. People died so that scum can disrespect them, and have their human rights protected in the meantime.

How much longer is everyone going to stand for this, I wonder? It can't be left to the right wing lunatics like the BNP to deal with it. Ordinary people have got to make a stand, and in particular, ordinary Muslims. I would like to see more Muslims standing up and distancing themselves from the fanatics.

[arista]

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2010/11/11/article-1328703-0C0524CF000005DC-715_634x457.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2010/11/11/article-1328703-0C059A1C000005DC-61_306x465.jpg

Was on SkyNews and BBC News
I hope it is debated tonight on bbc1 Question Time.

[Barbie]

These are the people that should IMO be automatically deported to their native lands. How can you allow people who hate this country and our armed forces live here

[MissKittyFantastico]

And they wonder where racial hatred towards these people comes from?

We can't open our mouths and say anything though, oh no we just sit back and let this kind of thing go on because of the barmy PC/human rights brigade. Disgusting. Deport them all.

[Vicky.]

Thing is, noone can say anything about nutters like these, because they are branded racist for even uttering a bad word. No matter what you say some people think you are tarring ALL muslims with the same brush, when its simply not the case at all. Just waiting for all the apologists to come online and see what the excuse is this time/who to blame.

[ILoveTRW]

The should all be put on a ship and sent back to where ever they came from, then they will really have something to complain about.

[30stone]

Its a absolute disgrace.
So disrespectful, and completely crosses the line between protesting and being just plain wankers.

They should have been arrested and taken off the streets, better yet try burning a poppy in a british prison..

[Novo]

They would **** themselves if the police weren't there to protect them from getting seven shades of Shite kicked out of them..

[Jordan.]

Why did i get an infraction i only meant the ones that blow people up. :(

[MTVN]

These are the people that should IMO be automatically deported to their native lands. How can you allow people who hate this country and our armed forces live here

Trouble is most of them are actually British though

[Angus]

Trouble is most of them are actually British though

Then "Britishness" should be characterised and defined by some sort of loyalty to the country in which one lives. If they want to enjoy the same rights and freedoms as the rest of us, the least they can do is display some loyalty and respect for this country, otherwise why the hell are they here? There's plenty of places in the world they can go if they don't like our culture, traditions and way of life.

That's one thing the yanks have got right - they don't pander to such nonsense, since all potential US citizens have to swear allegiance to the United States, which includes learning English (no costly interpreters for immigrants there).

[BB_Eye]

Complete and utter arseholes. But in my opinion, jailing them would be the worst thing to could do. Religious ******* LOVE being 'persecuted' and leap at any opportunity to pain themselves as martyrs. This is why trolling Christian and Islamic fundamentalists on internet forums is actually surprisingly challenging.

[Boothy]

Cannot put my hate for this sub-human filth into words.

What annoys me even more is the lack of punishment we give out when things like this happen. I could guarantee that if a group of Englishmen went to the middle-east and started burning the Qu'ran there would be uproar and, most likely, death to all involved.

What happens here? The counter-demonstraters get marched away and arrested while the lowlife scum are free to spit there venom, offending most people up and down the country. Why do we still stand for this? When will we realise that 'people' like this need to be sent back to where they came from?

"British soliders burn in Hell"?!

****** off.

[InOne]

Sadly this doesn't really shock me. And nobody will do anything about it. I like ideas of the EDL but they don't really know which direction they're going or what they're fighting for at the moment, if they had more structure and stuff they'd be taken more seriously and listened to more. But this is the kind of thing that started the EDL in the first place, so I hope people take note. So British people are arrested for protesting against these animals, but where are the other Muslims speaking out against it too? Hmmmm

[MTVN]

Then "Britishness" should be characterised and defined by some sort of loyalty to the country in which one lives. If they want to enjoy the same rights and freedoms as the rest of us, the least they can do is display some loyalty and respect for this country, otherwise why the hell are they here? There's plenty of places in the world they can go if they don't like our culture, traditions and way of life.

That's one thing the yanks have got right - they don't pander to such nonsense, since all potential US citizens have to swear allegiance to the United States, which includes learning English (no costly interpreters for immigrants there).

But a lot of them are homegrown, they were born and raised here and are British whether we like it or not, so it's not really possible to just kick them out or anything like that.

[Tom4784]

I feel sorry for anyone who has lost people to war, it must have been quite distressing. I also feel sorry for the everyday normal Muslims that'll get associated with those waste of resources that did this.

[InOne]

I feel sorry for anyone who has lost people to war, it must have been quite distressing. I also feel sorry for the everyday normal Muslims that'll get associated with those waste of resources that did this.

I doubt they will, that is pretty much just a myth really. You never hear of Muslims being attacked in the street or anything just for cases like this.

[Tom4784]

I doubt they will, that is pretty much just a myth really. You never hear of Muslims being attacked in the street or anything just for cases like this.

But it builds up hate towards the whole, some peopee will use this as a reason to validate their hate against all Muslims. Although nothing might not come of it with this incident, but hate like that piles up eventually.

[Novo]

Muslims need to speak out more about the Minority that are disgracing them.. they always seem far to quiet when things like this happen.. it would help if they were more vocal about these protesters

[Boothy]

Muslims need to speak out more about the Minority that are disgracing them.. they always seem far to quiet when things like this happen.. it would help if they were more vocal about these protesters

This.

So many racist status' on Facebook tonight. People don't understand that it's just a minority of Muslims who believe this and that the majority are decent folk with respect for our culture.

[InOne]

But it builds up hate towards the whole, some peopee will use this as a reason to validate their hate against all Muslims. Although nothing might not come of it with this incident, but hate like that piles up eventually.

Well plenty of incidents like this have happened. So the hate was probably already there anyway.

[Vicky.]

People who are going to hate a whole culture of people, based on the actions of a select few aren't worth bothering with either.

[InOne]

We always hear about these things but never know what happens to the people who did it, were any arrested or anything? I only skim read it

[Tom]

Deport anyone involved. They have no place in the UK.

[Angus]

But a lot of them are homegrown, they were born and raised here and are British whether we like it or not, so it's not really possible to just kick them out or anything like that.


I understand that, but what I am saying is that we need some sort of citizenship criteria which even the "homegrown brits" have to sign up to. There used to be an offence called "Treason" which seems to have died a death in the last couple of decades - it means betrayal of your country and used to carry the death penalty. These aresholes are traitors to this country and should be dealt with accordingly which, in today's politically correct climate, should merit at least a prison sentence.

[Angus]

As regards the "silent majority" of law abiding muslims, perhaps they ought to remember the saying "all it takes for evil to flourish, is for good men to stand by and do nothing". It's about time they spoke up in condemnation of the actions of these morons, that is if they are really opposed to the actions of the "minority".

[Patrick]

I'm not English there for I don't wear poppies or really give a ****** about it.

But,

That is disgusting.

Why don't these Muslims just get the ****** out of the UK?
I'm not sure any one even wants them here anyway the messes, and anyone that DID like them probably turned on them now after their disgusting behaviour today.

Who the ****** do they think they are?


First they try to get South Park axed and threaten to kill one of the creators over a Teddy Bear, and now this?

Just ****** off and take your stupid little hat things with you.

Oh my god yeah!

You all know what you got to do right?


Is there a Muslim celebration day or something like 'St Mohammed's Day?' Idk, but whenever it is...

You all march down there with big signs saying GT.FO!

Right? Stay with me now,
And then you throw one of them hat masks whatever they're called, into a fire and dance around it singing Kumbaya!


Don't ban me or call me racist TiBB Staff, I'm sticking up for you English.

[MTVN]

I understand that, but what I am saying is that we need some sort of citizenship criteria which even the "homegrown brits" have to sign up to. There used to be an offence called "Treason" which seems to have died a death in the last couple of decades - it means betrayal of your country and used to carry the death penalty. These aresholes are traitors to this country and should be dealt with accordingly which, in today's politically correct climate, should merit at least a prison sentence.

I think treason is a slightly outdated concept though, I dont think there should be a low forcing you to be loyal to the country you're born in. Although if a particular group is actually a threat to a country and its security then by all means actions should be taken, and Islam4UK were banned by the government.

[Livia]

Deport anyone involved. They have no place in the UK.

Absolutely agree. They're abusing the freedoms that people fought and died for.

Also, anyone taking part in any kind of march or protest with their face covered should be arrested.

[Mr XcX]

What sadistic sick people they are.

Why would ANY God allow them to do that.

[MTVN]

Absolutely agree. They're abusing the freedoms that people fought and died for.

Also, anyone taking part in any kind of march or protest with their face covered should be arrested.

Where do you deport them to though? They're our citizens so they're our respnisbility at the end of the day.

[Angus]

Where do you deport them to though? They're our citizens so they're our respnisbility at the end of the day.

They have no allegiance to this country, so they have forfeited their citizenship as far as I'm concerned. They can't have it both ways.

[Big Sexy]

I understand that, but what I am saying is that we need some sort of citizenship criteria which even the "homegrown brits" have to sign up to. There used to be an offence called "Treason" which seems to have died a death in the last couple of decades - it means betrayal of your country and used to carry the death penalty. These aresholes are traitors to this country and should be dealt with accordingly which, in today's politically correct climate, should merit at least a prison sentence.
Flawed thinking, though. The world is not that black and white a place. Think of all the great artists, comedians, musicians etc who have made a living from criticizing their countries and dressing them down [America being the predominant example]. What would you have done with them? I know in most cases these true patriots wanted simply to improve their country but does everyone really love the country they are in? I love my country but if I won the lottery I would be out of here. Shame on me?

I'm no PC nutter but freedom of speech is freedom of speech. No if's, no buts.

[Angus]

Flawed thinking, though. The world is not that black and white a place. Think of all the great artists, comedians, musicians etc who have made a living from criticizing their countries and dressing them down [America being the predominant example]. What would you have done with them? I know in most cases these true patriots wanted simply to improve their country but does everyone really love the country they are in? I love my country but if I won the lottery I would be out of here. Shame on me?

I'm no PC nutter but freedom of speech is freedom of speech. No if's, no buts.

What utter drivel! If their so called "freedom of speech" includes inciting violence and hatred towards the very country they live in, then they are traitors, plain and simple and should be dealt with accordingly. It's about time some commonsense and logic were applied to these arseholes, instead of the usual politically correct twaddle that is trotted out by people living in their ivory towers.

[Big Sexy]

What utter drivel! If their so called "freedom of speech" includes inciting violence and hatred towards the very country they live in, then they are traitors, plain and simple and should be dealt with accordingly. It's about time some commonsense and logic were applied to these arseholes, instead of the usual politically correct twaddle that is trotted out by people living in their ivory towers.
TWADDLE! OUTRAGE! RAPSCALIONS!

Nothing towards my point on the great artists, then? I know I'm clearly talking to a Daily Mail user message generation machine that thinks with it's balls but I'll try ...

Fair point on inciting violence which could lead to others harm. But are the EDF then and that whole hard headed patriotism culture in general responsible for inciting violence, knowingly or not, towards muslims? Where do you draw the line?

And that's the key isin't it. Where do you draw the line? Do you believe in free speech? You either do or you don't. Free speech is a very clear idea, IMO. And it's not one for PC morons living in 'ivory towers'. I also believe in the freedom for BNP jagoffs to have their little fantasy revolution marches.

You are going down a rocky, dark road denying the freedom of speech to a group of individuals. No matter how reprehensible they may be. Many ordinary people hate their countries too. Stop being so ****ing imperialistic about it.

Or screw it. We will censor them like many Arab countries would censor us. Oh the irony.

[Wonders how close Angus is to thinking I'm a muslim or a 'bleeding heart liberal'. I'm neither].

[Niall]

Ugh...so many people were going mad about this on Facebook earlier.

So many people were saying 'Muslims are *******s' 'Muslims should die' and I was trying to say to them, this is only a small minority of Muslims. But no-one would listen to me so I gave up. I feel sorry for those regular Muslims who have to put up with twats like this trying to cause trouble. And as usual the Daily Mail made it sound like World War III was about to break out. :rolleyes:

[Boothy]

We always hear about these things but never know what happens to the people who did it, were any arrested or anything? I only skim read it

Didn't look like it. Looked like the EDL were getting worse treatment if anything.

[Angus]

TWADDLE! OUTRAGE! RAPSCALIONS!

Nothing towards my point on the great artists, then? I know I'm clearly talking to a Daily Mail user message generation machine that thinks with it's balls but I'll try ...

Fair point on inciting violence which could lead to others harm. But are the EDF then and that whole hard headed patriotism culture in general responsible for inciting violence, knowingly or not, towards muslims? Where do you draw the line?

And that's the key isin't it. Where do you draw the line? Do you believe in free speech? You either do or you don't. Free speech is a very clear idea, IMO. And it's not one for PC morons living in 'ivory towers'. I also believe in the freedom for BNP jagoffs to have their little fantasy revolution marches.

You are going down a rocky, dark road denying the freedom of speech to a group of individuals. No matter how reprehensible they may be. Many ordinary people hate their countries too. Stop being so ****ing imperialistic about it.

Or screw it. We will censor them like many Arab countries would censor us. Oh the irony.

[Wonders how close Angus is to thinking I'm a muslim or a 'bleeding heart liberal'. I'm neither].

Can't be arsed to respond to such a ridiculous post - go look up the meanings of traitor and treason and you will understand that these arseholes are ABUSING the privilege and inciting violence against our armed forces and our country - but hey ho, so long as it satisfies the politically correct morons and "right on" brigade, that's okay I guess. Oh, and the only thing that offends me in your misinformed post is the accusation that I'm a Daily Mail reader - talk about stereotyping people, but then that's the M.O. of most intolerant bigots which is probably why you sympathise with this vermin:rolleyes:

By the way, the ignore feature is great for sparing me from having to even bother reading such utter apologistic crap:thumbs:

[Big Sexy]

Can't be arsed to respond to such a ridiculous post - go look up the meanings of traitor and treason and you will understand that these arseholes are ABUSING the privilege and inciting violence against our armed forces and our country - but hey ho, so long as it satisfies the politically correct morons and "right on" brigade, that's okay I guess. Oh, and the only thing that offends me in your misinformed post is the accusation that I'm a Daily Mail reader - talk about stereotyping people, but then that's the M.O. of most intolerant bigots which is probably why you sympathise with this vermin:rolleyes:
Quote to me the piece of text which you feel best shows I sympathise with them. Try and stay away from the bits where I call them 'reprehensible'. Go on. Go for it.

While you are at it, do the same little exercise only this time for me insinuating that you read the Daily Mail. I never said that. I said you SOUND like a Daily Mail comment. A mere reflection on your 'I'm so angry, bro' language, rather than the views expressed therein. You are clearly making your assumptions about me in abundance too. Waving that stupid little PC flag and assuming I am sympathising with these people?

Are you high?

I don't sympathise with them. Not one bit. I just believe in freedom of speech. These days on planet earth most foward thinking countries have put treason to bed in favour of free speech. It comes with it's downsides - sure - but on the whole it's a pretty swell concept. You cannot destroy it with arguments that have no actual content or application in the real world. The word 'treason' is not an argument. Repeating it ad nauseum will not win you supporterz. My brother hates this country. He thinks it is a small minded, foul weathered ****hole that's on a mission to get stupider with each passing Saturday night TV slot. As soon as he finishes his degree he is leaving for Australia and never coming back.

But not before you can burn him at the stake apparently. You bitter old bastard.

Freedom of speech is freedom of speech. But if you don't believe in that then that is cool too, bro.

[Angus]

Ugh...so many people were going mad about this on Facebook earlier.

So many people were saying 'Muslims are *******s' 'Muslims should die' and I was trying to say to them, this is only a small minority of Muslims. But no-one would listen to me so I gave up. I feel sorry for those regular Muslims who have to put up with twats like this trying to cause trouble. And as usual the Daily Mail made it sound like World War III was about to break out. :rolleyes:

And still there's a deafening silence form the law abiding Muslim majority - no wonder people are pissed off. It just looks like the whole Muslim community are complicit in their behaviour because of their lack of condemnation of it.

[KG.]

They've just gone to further show how much of a mockery this country is becoming.

You'd get killed for pissing on a Qua'ran in any Islamic country, yet these mugs get police protection, and the people protesting against them come out worse? What a ****ing disgrace.

And it's only going to get worse... I need to go to NZ.

[Big Sexy]

You'd get killed for pissing on a Qua'ran in any Islamic country, yet
This is not an Islamic country though. That's. The. Point. Why does everyone relish missing the point? Saying 'yet ...' defeats the purpose. It signals that you would like some sort of censorship brought in just like oh I don't know ... those Islamic countries you just complained about!

I agree with the rest of your post though. They should not be getting police protection or any sort of advantaged over the EDL and co. Equal rights for all.

[Smithy]

This is not an Islamic country though. That's. The. Point. Why does everyone relish missing the point? Saying 'yet ...' defeats the purpose. It signals that you would like some sort of censorship brought in just like oh I don't know ... those Islamic countries you just complained about!

I agree with the rest of your post though. They should not be getting police protection or any sort of advantaged over the EDL and co. Equal rights for all.

:wavey: Stu

[MTVN]

This is not an Islamic country though. That's. The. Point. Why does everyone relish missing the point? Saying 'yet ...' defeats the purpose. It signals that you would like some sort of censorship brought in just like oh I don't know ... those Islamic countries you just complained about!

I agree with the rest of your post though. They should not be getting police protection or any sort of advantaged over the EDL and co. Equal rights for all.

Exactly. I hate it when people compare our nation to fundamentalist Islamic ones. What, just because they're intolerant enough to kill people for disrespecting their religion we should to? We should be grateful that we live in a democratic society, where you are allowed to freely express your views, instead of looking to Islamic countries for punishment tips.

[Niall]

And still there's a deafening silence form the law abiding Muslim majority - no wonder people are pissed off. It just looks like the whole Muslim community are complicit in their behaviour because of their lack of condemnation of it.

Thats true but their seriously is no need for half the hatred thrown at regular Muslims over this. Its just the media blowing everything out of proportion....as usual.

[spitfire]

Entirely predictable that there is a news blackout on this.
One man threatens to burn a Koran in the land of 9/11 and it makes international news and cries of racism.
A baying mob burns a Poppy on Armistice Day in the land of the infidel... No news.

[MTVN]

Thats true but their seriously is no need for half the hatred thrown at regular Muslims over this. Its just the media blowing everything out of proportion....as usual.

Yep, exactly. Unfortunately there's so many idiots in this country who are unable to distinguish between extrimists (of which there are very few) and normal Muslims.

Entirely predictable that there is a news blackout on this.
One man threatens to burn a Koran in the land of 9/11 and it makes international news and cries of racism.
A baying mob burns a Poppy on Armistice Day in the land of the infidel... No news.

Maybe it's because there were only 30 people there and it shouldnt be allowed to overshadow remembrance day?

[spitfire]

Maybe it's because there were only 30 people there and it shouldnt be allowed to overshadow remembrance day?

One man threatens to burn a Koran in the land of 9/11 and it makes international news and cries of racism.

[MTVN]

One man threatens to burn a Koran in the land of 9/11 and it makes international news and cries of racism.

Not really true though is it, he attempted to create a widespread and publicised book-burning event, and anyway the press reaction to that was ridiculous as well. This story is being covered as well, it's just proportionate to the signficance of the protest in most outlets i.e. skynews just gave it a brief mention in their article about remembrance sunday - it deserved nothing more.

[spitfire]

i.e. skynews just gave it a brief mention in their article about remembrance sunday - it deserved nothing more.
Yet it's the most talked about topic on most forums i've been on today.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cetGUdada8g
Scum bags.

[InOne]

Entirely predictable that there is a news blackout on this.
One man threatens to burn a Koran in the land of 9/11 and it makes international news and cries of racism.
A baying mob burns a Poppy on Armistice Day in the land of the infidel... No news.

I'm glad it wasn't mentioned in the news. The day wasn't about a few idiots burning poppys, it was about remembering our fallen hero's. Coverage is what they want. I'm glad the day didn't become about them.

[MTVN]

I'm glad it wasn't mentioned in the news. The day wasn't about a few idiots burning poppys, it was about remembering our fallen hero's. Coverage is what they want. I'm glad the day didn't become about them.

Well said.

[letmein]

Then "Britishness" should be characterised and defined by some sort of loyalty to the country in which one lives. If they want to enjoy the same rights and freedoms as the rest of us, the least they can do is display some loyalty and respect for this country, otherwise why the hell are they here? There's plenty of places in the world they can go if they don't like our culture, traditions and way of life.

That's one thing the yanks have got right - they don't pander to such nonsense, since all potential US citizens have to swear allegiance to the United States, which includes learning English (no costly interpreters for immigrants there).

English is not the national mandated language of the US though.

[letmein]

What utter drivel! If their so called "freedom of speech" includes inciting violence and hatred towards the very country they live in, then they are traitors, plain and simple and should be dealt with accordingly.
That may fly in the UK, but not in the US. People are allowed to say whatever they damn well please. However, in Britain, there is no protection of speech. So in essence, they don't have the right to say whatever they want.

[Shasown]

Muslims need to speak out more about the Minority that are disgracing them.. they always seem far to quiet when things like this happen.. it would help if they were more vocal about these protesters

The larger more peaceful Muslim communities did condemn this demonstration however most of the media decided not to run that part of the story.

They have no allegiance to this country, so they have forfeited their citizenship as far as I'm concerned. They can't have it both ways.

Yes they can and clearly do, such is the state of the British Statute books.

What utter drivel! If their so called "freedom of speech" includes inciting violence and hatred towards the very country they live in, then they are traitors, plain and simple and should be dealt with accordingly. It's about time some commonsense and logic were applied to these arseholes, instead of the usual politically correct twaddle that is trotted out by people living in their ivory towers.

That may fly in the UK, but not in the US. People are allowed to say whatever they damn well please. However, in Britain, there is no protection of speech. So in essence, they don't have the right to say whatever they want.

While it is true that freedom of speech isnt actually a direct part of a statutory instrument (that is enshrined in the law) it is referrred to in numerous laws within the laws of the UK. It is classed as an accepted right provided it doesnt offend or threaten.

They arent commiting treason, as thats defined as a serious act of betrayal, any lawyer would have them walking within minutes if they were charged with such. There slogans are in line with some of the Islamic schools teachings. In that allah will consign those to hell who make war on his believers. That would be their defence.

What they could be charged with is breach of the peace, in that they are carrying out acts which are likely to cause offense to a reasonable person.

However in charging them for such it would enable them to gain lots more publicity, which is probably the reason the police didnt arrest and charge them.

The major question to bear in mind is if non muslim members of the public held a little demonstration with placards that carried some slogan like "Taliban burn in hell" would the police protect them or would they charge them with a public order offence? If it is the latter then thats discriminatory.

[GypsyGoth]

They should buy themselves plane tickets and leave.

[Shasown]

They should buy themselves plane tickets and leave.

Ah but if they did that and left good old blighty for some Islamic utopia, they would lose the right to demonstrate, and their entitlements to benefits!

[GypsyGoth]

Ah but if they did that and left good old blighty for some Islamic utopia, they would lose the right to demonstrate, and their entitlements to benefits!

:laugh: Very true.

[Angus]

Thats true but their seriously is no need for half the hatred thrown at regular Muslims over this. Its just the media blowing everything out of proportion....as usual.

That's a rather naive response to a clearly documented, factual event, yet you choose to diminish its impact and importance - no wonder this country is in the ****! Give these fanatics an inch, and they take a mile. We are always hearing about how muslims are "offended" by our culture, our way of life, our traditions etc, and we bend over backwards to avoid offence. Yet these disrespectful, ignorant people think its fine to disrupt remembrance day to make political brownie points. So your argument that "the media is just blowing everything out of proportion" doesn't fly - it happened, it was obscene, obnoxious and inflammatory - there was no excuse for it and no place in our society for hate filled mobs, of any religion, political persuasion or ethnicity, inciting violence against anyone.

If Muslims don't want to all be tarred with the same brush, it's about time that they were more proactive and vocal about condemning these people, otherwise the rest of the population are entitled to draw their own conclusions about a section of society that appears to think it is above the law, abusing our tolerance and exploiting freedom of speech to cause offence, and incite VIOLENCE against our troops, and in a broader context, our very way of life. If these Muslims are British born, there is even more concern for alarm, since they have grown up here, been educated here and lived amongst us, yet are demonstrating their HATRED about our way of life, culture and traditions without one ounce of consideration or respect for our sensibilities and beliefs.

Respect, tolerance and consideration is a TWO WAY STREET, it's about time Muslims in this country accepted that. They are quick to DEMAND respect for their religion and culture, but they do very little to EARN it.

[Angus]

English is not the national mandated language of the US though.


It is the de facto language of the USA, with the vast majority of US citizens citing it as their mother tongue and with a 96% of the population able to speak it. My point is quite clear - the US makes no provision for the nonsense of providing interpreters for immigrants who wish to settle in the US. Furthermore, in order to become a US citizen, immigrants MUST take the Oath of Allegiance:

"I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed Forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God."

It is also a requirement of US citizenship that they be able to speak ENGLISH.

[CaraRawr]

Could not ******ing believe this when I heard this. Deport these disgusting people, it's a complete and utter abomination to disrespect people who fight for the country they live in. If they don't liken it, they should just ****.

[Lee.]

I actually feel something close to hatred for these crazy, disrepectful tossers!

They shouldn't be allowed to get away with it! Round them all up and throw them on a plane back to Allah land.. (fling a rucksack or two in after them too!)

[Vicky.]

The major question to bear in mind is if non muslim members of the public held a little demonstration with placards that carried some slogan like "Taliban burn in hell" would the police protect them or would they charge them with a public order offence? If it is the latter then thats discriminatory.

I am almost certain it would be the latter. No way would the police protect british people who did something like that. Would probably be classed as a racial hate crime :rolleyes:

[Niamh.]

I am almost certain it would be the latter. No way would the police protect british people who did something like that. Would probably be classed as a racial hate crime :rolleyes:

or can you imagine If British protesters did that in a muslim country............

[Vicky.]

or can you imagine If British protesters did that in a muslim country............

Exactly

Or what if some brit went over there to live, and named their teddy bear mohammed :eek: Such a terrible crime, probably death penalty for it

Such tolerance :)

[Niamh.]

Exactly

Or what if some brit went over there to live, and named their teddy bear mohammed :eek: Such a terrible crime, probably death penalty for it

Such tolerance :)

:joker:

The main issue is the unfairness of it all, and how they would expect respect to be shown in their countries(which is fair enough) but don't feel they owe other countries the same courtesy.

[Vicky.]

Thats the thing, you move to another country and you adapt to their way of life. Even on holiday you do. I mean, a few years ago I went to tunisia...and obviously in the tourist areas they are used to seeing people in shorts and that, but it IS classed as disrespectful for women to 'flaunt themselves' by daring to expose legs or cleavage. When we went to the markets and that, I would make sure I was dressed respectfully, regardless of the weather, I nearly passed out at one point, but its what you do...why upset people just for the sake of it...

I realize a lot of these people are born here, but surely those would have adapted already, being brought up here :/

[Niamh.]

Thats the thing, you move to another country and you adapt to their way of life. Even on holiday you do. I mean, a few years ago I went to tunisia...and obviously in the tourist areas they are used to seeing people in shorts and that, but it IS classed as disrespectful for women to 'flaunt themselves' by daring to expose legs or cleavage. When we went to the markets and that, I would make sure I was dressed respectfully, regardless of the weather, I nearly passed out at one point, but its what you do...why upset people just for the sake of it...

I realize a lot of these people are born here, but surely those would have adapted already, being brought up here :/

Yes exactly, when in Rome and all that. If you don't like the countries ways then it's pretty simple really...............go home! Funny though these people I'm sure adapted quickly enough to all the good things that benefited them!!

[Vicky.]

Yes exactly, when in Rome and all that. If you don't like the countries ways then it's pretty simple really...............go home! Funny though these people I'm sure adapted quickly enough to all the good things that benefited them!!

Nice choice of words there ;)

[Niamh.]

Nice choice of words there ;)

:joker: Unintentional I promise!!

[Beso]

Sooooooooo...silly wee disrespectful laddies who urinate on war memorials are jailed for 6 months, which they should be.

Yet muslim fanatics are allowed to burn giant poppy's on remembrance day as they shout British troop burn in hell while the cops look on.

PRETTY SCARY TO THINK WHAT BRITAIN'S GOING TO BE LIKE IN 15 YRS TIME.

[Shasown]

Ah well

Two Islamic protesters, aged 30 and 25, were arrested for public order offences after the poppies were set alight and protesters chanted "British soldiers burn in hell" during the two-minute silence.......

The spokesman added that the two members of Muslims Against Crusades had been bailed until mid-December pending further inquiries.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/21/20101112/tuk-edl-founder-charged-with-assault-6323e80.html

No further action there then, charges discretely dropped in a couple of weeks.

[Niall]

That's a rather naive response to a clearly documented, factual event, yet you choose to diminish its impact and importance - no wonder this country is in the ****! Give these fanatics an inch, and they take a mile. We are always hearing about how muslims are "offended" by our culture, our way of life, our traditions etc, and we bend over backwards to avoid offence. Yet these disrespectful, ignorant people think its fine to disrupt remembrance day to make political brownie points. So your argument that "the media is just blowing everything out of proportion" doesn't fly - it happened, it was obscene, obnoxious and inflammatory - there was no excuse for it and no place in our society for hate filled mobs, of any religion, political persuasion or ethnicity, inciting violence against anyone.

If Muslims don't want to all be tarred with the same brush, it's about time that they were more proactive and vocal about condemning these people, otherwise the rest of the population are entitled to draw their own conclusions about a section of society that appears to think it is above the law, abusing our tolerance and exploiting freedom of speech to cause offence, and incite VIOLENCE against our troops, and in a broader context, our very way of life. If these Muslims are British born, there is even more concern for alarm, since they have grown up here, been educated here and lived amongst us, yet are demonstrating their HATRED about our way of life, culture and traditions without one ounce of consideration or respect for our sensibilities and beliefs.

Respect, tolerance and consideration is a TWO WAY STREET, it's about time Muslims in this country accepted that. They are quick to DEMAND respect for their religion and culture, but they do very little to EARN it.

Just stop for a second.

First of all, you are grouping together a massive section of people. I don't think you are realizing it isn't all Muslims who feel this way. Go out to a Mosque and ask a Muslim there and I'm pretty damn sure they will condemn this lot who burnt the poppy too.

Secondly, like Christianity, there are several different denominations of Islam. You can't just say that because a governing body or Islam didn't come out and speak out against this, they are condoning what has happened. Its like if for example, the Church of England did something wrong and you're waiting for the Pope to apologise.

Thirdly, ignorance and disrespect is also a two way street which I'm afraid YOU are walking on. Why don't you take some time to research something before you label it all sorts of horrible names. :rolleyes:

[InOne]

I actually feel something close to hatred for these crazy, disrepectful tossers!

They shouldn't be allowed to get away with it! Round them all up and throw them on a plane back to Allah land.. (fling a rucksack or two in after them too!)

I lol'd

[Pyramid*]

Throw the bastards out of the country - it is quite terrifying to think we have so many enemies in our midst who hate our guts yet are happy to exploit the freedom of speech they are denied in their own, oh so wonderful, countries. Why do we have to tolerate these treacherous, poisonous arseholes in this country? British soldiers died and are still dying to preserve the freedoms we ALL enjoy.
Let's see what would happen if we burned the Qu'ran, or stormed one of their mosques and disrupted their prayers? WW3 would break out, but we are expected to meekly accept this despicable and outrageous behaviour from people who hate our way of life yet insist on living here nonetheless.

This is the part that really irks be beyond belief. Our own Government allows protesters to act in this way the way the Poppy burners did....where the British are being targetted, the country in which has provided them with free medical care since birth, free (and high standard) education, and where needed, housing/benefits to live on should they be out of work etc. Never mind freedom of speech, freedom of movment etc.

What is worse however, is that some these people were actually born in Britain, raised here. The important part they seem to have missed altogether is that if it weren't for our troops, for our Government - they would not be allowed to publically protest, they would have no right to Free Speech, they would have no free high standard health care, no free education for 14/15 years.

If they dislike what our country is all about and wish to publically demonise - why do they stay? Because we are one of the pathetic countries so wrapped up in political correctness, who allow this type of thing to go unpunished, that nothing is done as long as it is not the 'white man' who is doing it.. If anything, if it were to be the opposite way around and the BNP (who btw I am against as much as these Muslim Extremists), you can be sure the police would be right in there with their tacky boots.

Extremists like these are not in the majority - they come in all shapes, sizes, creed, colour, background, religion regardless of country of birth. the very unfortunate part is that their actions impact on innocents who happen to share the same skin colour / race and or religion - that's the very sad part - so many others are viewed in the same way - and wrongly.

[Pyramid*]

Yes exactly, when in Rome and all that. If you don't like the countries ways then it's pretty simple really...............go home! Funny though these people I'm sure adapted quickly enough to all the good things that benefited them!!

Oh I agree, totally with the 'When in Rome' (I lived in the M.E. for years, behaved the way the Laws of the Country dictated, and I loved it).

That's fine and well for those who have exiled themselves from their 'homeland', but some (a lot) of these Muslim Extremists were actaully born and bred in Britain. Never having set foot outside of the country that they protest about. That's what pissed me off.... these are people who's own homelands don't allow such freedom of act/speech without being chucked in a hell hole called a jail - ie: a jail that is as it shoudl be, a place that people do not want to ever have to be sent to - unlike namby pamby British jails.

[Pyramid*]

Sooooooooo...silly wee disrespectful laddies who urinate on war memorials are jailed for 6 months, which they should be.

Yet muslim fanatics are allowed to burn giant poppy's on remembrance day as they shout British troop burn in hell while the cops look on.

PRETTY SCARY TO THINK WHAT BRITAIN'S GOING TO BE LIKE IN 15 YRS TIME.

Excellent comparision to show how precisely the cowardy and hypocritical people of our own Country have no consistentany when it comes to following the Laws of the Country.

Government pussies. That's all they are.

[Angus]

Just stop for a second.

First of all, you are grouping together a massive section of people. I don't think you are realizing it isn't all Muslims who feel this way. Go out to a Mosque and ask a Muslim there and I'm pretty damn sure they will condemn this lot who burnt the poppy too.

Secondly, like Christianity, there are several different denominations of Islam. You can't just say that because a governing body or Islam didn't come out and speak out against this, they are condoning what has happened. Its like if for example, the Church of England did something wrong and you're waiting for the Pope to apologise.

Thirdly, ignorance and disrespect is also a two way street which I'm afraid YOU are walking on. Why don't you take some time to research something before you label it all sorts of horrible names. :rolleyes:

Try reading my post more carefully before accusing others of ignorance. I am fully aware that there are thousands upon thousands of peaceful lawabiding muslims in this country, but unfortunately, there are thousands upon thousands of ignoramuses who don't know that and will just lump ALL muslims together. Therefore it is incumbent on the law abiding muslims amongst us to take some responsibility for this misapprehension and distance themselves from extremists by condemning them publicly.

Secondly, don't even bother attempting to lecture me about christianiity - go patronise someone else who gives a damn about your ridiculous analogies.

Thirdly, ignorance and disrespect might well be a two way street, but until you see me doing anything remotely disrespectful against Islam I suggest you keep your ridiculous assumptions to yourself. You are the very sort of politically correct idiot who has allowed this kind of inflammatory behaviour to flourish in this country unchallenged. As to calling the muslim extremists "horrible names", I thought they were more than apposite in view of the nature of their offensive behaviour.

[Pyramid*]

Just stop for a second.

First of all, you are grouping together a massive section of people. I don't think you are realizing it isn't all Muslims who feel this way. Go out to a Mosque and ask a Muslim there and I'm pretty damn sure they will condemn this lot who burnt the poppy too.

Secondly, like Christianity, there are several different denominations of Islam. You can't just say that because a governing body or Islam didn't come out and speak out against this, they are condoning what has happened. Its like if for example, the Church of England did something wrong and you're waiting for the Pope to apologise.

Thirdly, ignorance and disrespect is also a two way street which I'm afraid YOU are walking on. Why don't you take some time to research something before you label it all sorts of horrible names. :rolleyes:

What sorts of names do you suggest are given to Muslim Extremists, who chose to remain living in the very country that they are protesting about, who have so little respect for the men and women who are out risking their lives so that people in Britain can have rights of freedom? That they act in such a manner, publically and in the most disrespectful manner to the people that they in fact, owe their right to even appearing in public in this way - far less their despicable actions?

What label would you suggest we give, to the people spotlighted in this story (I'm not speaking of Muslims, I'm speaking of the Extremists - and people such as these mentally deranged asswipes - which are apparent in all race/creed/religion/). shall we refer to them as 'poor misguided little wee souls'???

Puhhllllleaase. :sleep:

[Wildcat!]

I am muslim. I have read a lot of the comments here, and frankly, I am not surprised by them. I am not surprised at some of the hate being shown. To me, I think its understandable. Its misguided, but its understandable, if you see it from the POV, of a non muslim. And I really believe, they should be arrested for such demonstrations. And prosecuted, like anybody who commits a hate act. But ask yourself, why is it allowed? I would go as far as to say that allowing it, is not doing muslims any favors. Even if its only a few people doing it, letting it happen, make it stick out like a sore thumb, in a period of remembrance for the dead. People have a hard time differenciating between muslims, and extremists for that reason. BEcause, all they hear, is muslims, and thats it. I dont know, what the law is on this, but why dont you arrest these people. I am even suspicious, that they dont just to make the hate for Islam in general, even that much stronger. Like I said, I dont know the law, and I dont get why these people are allowed to demonstrate, this level of disrespect, for a sovereign nation, which they belong to.

That was my first point, but secondly, these so called muslims, dont even now what they are talking about. Most of the time, they are just a bunch of Hooligans. Their labels are incorrect, they dont even know what their all religion really preaches. They are brandishing sayings like "we go to hell, and you go to heaven". ONly an idiot, who knows nothing about Islam would claim such a thing. Frst of all, you are not guaranteed a place in heaven as a muslim, in the islamic beliefs. Second of all, Islam, acknowledges all the biblical religions. As a muslim, I can marry in to christianity, or judaism, and she doesnt have to change her religion.

IN the Quran, Christians are often referred to as among the "People of the Book," i.e. people who have received and believed in previous revelation from God's prophets.

Here are a few mention of them : "Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the Christians, and the Sabians -- whoever believes in God and the Last Day and does good, they shall have their reward from their Lord. And there will be no fear for them, nor shall they grieve" (2:62, 5:69, and many other verses).

"...and nearest among them in love to the believers will you find those who say, 'We are Christians,' because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant" (5:82).

"O you who believe! Be helpers of God -- as Jesus the son of Mary said to the Disciples, 'Who will be my helpers in (the work of) God?' Said the disciples, 'We are God's helpers!' Then a portion of the Children of Israel believed, and a portion disbelieved. But We gave power to those who believed, against their enemies, and they became the ones that prevailed" (61:14).

So this goes to show you, that these people, and most extremists, use Islam, as a platform for their own agenda. It is just who they are, they are beligerent people, who dont like peace, and what they do, have nothing whatsoever to do with Islam. Anyone can just say, in the name of whatever, I am gonna do this. It doesnt mean that its true, AND I believe people should be more educated about that.
I also believe, Islamic leaders have the responsibility to stand up and condemn these acts. They should ban them from their mosque, so they can go and have their own sect, and can easily be located.
In this instance, they did condemn it, I even heard it from the Imam sermon, where I went on Friday, but obviously, that didnt make the news.

Bottom line is, Islam gets a bad rap because of these Criminals, thats really all I can call them. What religion would endorse such acts. The war was a world war, and muslims fought in it. SO not nly are these people ignorant about their religion, they are also ignorant about history in the first place. ANd thats why it pains me, that they are given importance, and I see from people's posts, that they simply class them as "those muslims".

This is why, I am a little perplexed, of the fact that they gave them an escort, basically showing them acting like animals, while normal people reflected.
Thats why, they should just be arrested, not given any press (at least the BBC didnt, they had the right idea), and treated, like any people who try to disturbe a religious event. Again, I dont understand why they are allowed!


As for the people asking them to be deported, dont be ridiculous, you are being just as ignorant as they are. These people arent from another country. Their parents maybe originated from somewhere else, just like a lot of British nowadays. They arent going anywhere, they are British, no matter how you put it. They dont belong to another country. BUt they should be held accountable, and prosecuted. I just dont get it!

[Wildcat!]

Dang!! I didnt realise my post was so big!

[Wildcat!]

Thats the thing, you move to another country and you adapt to their way of life. Even on holiday you do. I mean, a few years ago I went to tunisia...and obviously in the tourist areas they are used to seeing people in shorts and that, but it IS classed as disrespectful for women to 'flaunt themselves' by daring to expose legs or cleavage. When we went to the markets and that, I would make sure I was dressed respectfully, regardless of the weather, I nearly passed out at one point, but its what you do...why upset people just for the sake of it...

I realize a lot of these people are born here, but surely those would have adapted already, being brought up here :/

Which Tunisia is this? From a parallel universe? Tunsia, is not a prudish country, or a fundamental muslim country. You will stick out more if you did dress conservatively! Women there dress the exact same way, as people do in the UK, probably wear even less, because its not cold over there. A few wear Hijab and stuff, but they are the exceptions. MOst of them dont.
Another big misconception, there are only a few opredominantly muslim countries, where you see all women covered up from head to toe. Obviously, those are the ones people like to identify muslims with. This fable, proves it even more.

[Pyramid*]

Dang!! I didnt realise my post was so big!

TBH, your post is fair. The thing that all people need to understand is that these people are EXTREMISTS. And extremists exist everywhere, in every colour, in every religon,in every creed ('White Christian man' included). You are correct when you say they should be punished - in the same manner in which the 'disrespectful twats who urintated on the War Memorial' were punished.

The unfair meting out (or not as the case) of punishment is as much of a problem as the Extremists.

In defence of the point being made by some about 'deporting'... I (in my view) think that comes more from the understandable reaction that if these type of Extremists loathe Britain and it's ways so much: they should be asked to leave British shores.

We have a government that don't have the guts to do this - so in the meantime, Extremists like this, will continue.

[Pyramid*]

Which Tunisia is this? From a parallel universe? Tunsia, is not a prudish country, or a fundamental muslim country. You will stick out more if you did dress conservatively! Women there dress the exact same way, as people do in the UK, probably wear even less, because its not cold over there. A few wear Hijab and stuff, but they are the exceptions. MOst of them dont.
Another big misconception, there are only a few opredominantly muslim countries, where you see all women covered up from head to toe. Obviously, those are the ones people like to identify muslims with. This fable, proves it even more.


There is no need for you to be so bloody patronising.

Tunisia may be a very liberal country, however the fact remains that 98% of the 10million population of Tunisia follow the Islamic faith(Sunni) and to that end, Westerners will afford a high level of respect, for which you appear to be ridiculing somewhat in your post (as well as trying belitte another fm). You post here suggests that it would be more than acceptable to wander around Tunisian souks wearing a bikini top - when this is not the case.

I visited Tunisa about 15 years ago, and let me tell you right now, outside of the 'more Cosmopolitan areas', I can assure you, I felt as restricted there as I did when I lived in Saudi Arabia So please.... your own opinoin doesn't speak for the experience others may have had.

[Shasown]

And I really believe, they should be arrested for such demonstrations. And prosecuted, like anybody who commits a hate act. But ask yourself, why is it allowed? ....

I am even suspicious, that they dont just to make the hate for Islam in general, even that much stronger. Like I said, I dont know the law, and I dont get why these people are allowed to demonstrate, this level of disrespect, for a sovereign nation, which they belong to......


Its called freedom of speech/expression. People can voice their opinions regardless of how unsavoury it is until they break the law. One of the joys of living in a reasonable democracy, I suppose.

If the police decided to arrest in order to prevent trouble they would be accused of being oppresive, wouldnt they? Not only that but the human/civil rights brigade would soon have the lawyers on the case. Public Order, demonstrations etc are a no win situation for them in most cases. (Except for the overtime pay)


That was my first point, but secondly, these so called muslims, dont even now what they are talking about. Most of the time, they are just a bunch of Hooligans. Their labels are incorrect, they dont even know what their all religion really preaches.......

As a muslim, I can marry in to christianity, or judaism, and she doesnt have to change her religion.

Doesnt that depend on the School of Islam you follow?


I also believe, Islamic leaders have the responsibility to stand up and condemn these acts. They should ban them from their mosque, so they can go and have their own sect, and can easily be located.
In this instance, they did condemn it, I even heard it from the Imam sermon, where I went on Friday, but obviously, that didnt make the news.

Very true but it doesnt carry the same interest for news editors and the like. One or two newspapers and news programs did convey moderate mainstream muslim community leaders condemning the demonstration and actions.

This is why, I am a little perplexed, of the fact that they gave them an escort, basically showing them acting like animals, while normal people reflected.
Thats why, they should just be arrested, not given any press (at least the BBC didnt, they had the right idea), and treated, like any people who try to disturbe a religious event. Again, I dont understand why they are allowed!

They are escorted for two reasons to reduce/deter any trouble rowdier elements within their members may wish to start. But also to protect them in the event people they do upset with their views decide to take the law into their own hands.

Its a bad idea when the state interferes with what the press can and cant show, it leads to a lot of criticism both here and abroad. It also undermines foreign policy etc.


BUt they should be held accountable, and prosecuted. I just dont get it!
Two of them were arrested and bailed. Whether any prosecution ensues will be down to the Police and the CPS.

[MTVN]

Dang!! I didnt realise my post was so big!

It was a good post Wildcat, I particularly agreed with the last bit about the protestors being British; All over Facebook rcently I've seen people saying "why dont they go back where they came from" and "they should be deported" etc. when they were born here, raised here and are British citizens. We might hate what they were doing but they are still British whether people like it or not.

Just on the issue of why it was allowed to happen, the difficulty is that there is a very fine line between free speech and hate speech. Everyone should have a right to protest but it's quite hard to determine when that protest becomes a hate crime. It's never an easy decision to make, and it's not just been an issue with Islamic extremists, the same problem has existed with the EDL, BNP etc. I really dont think it was allowed just so Islamophobia would increase.

[Ithinkiloveyoutoo]

Thats the thing, you move to another country and you adapt to their way of life. Even on holiday you do. I mean, a few years ago I went to tunisia...and obviously in the tourist areas they are used to seeing people in shorts and that, but it IS classed as disrespectful for women to 'flaunt themselves' by daring to expose legs or cleavage. When we went to the markets and that, I would make sure I was dressed respectfully, regardless of the weather, I nearly passed out at one point, but its what you do...why upset people just for the sake of it...

I realize a lot of these people are born here, but surely those would have adapted already, being brought up here :/

This.

[Angus]

[QUOTE=Shasown;3909658]Its called freedom of speech/expression. People can voice their opinions regardless of how unsavoury it is until they break the law. One of the joys of living in a reasonable democracy, I suppose

So now its called freedom of speech instead of incitement to violence and hatred, when they call for the killing of British troops? How low has this country sunk?

[Shasown]

[QUOTE=Shasown;3909658]Its called freedom of speech/expression. People can voice their opinions regardless of how unsavoury it is until they break the law. One of the joys of living in a reasonable democracy, I suppose

So now its called freedom of speech instead of incitement to violence and hatred, when they call for the killing of British troops? How low has this country sunk?

I may be missing something here but where in the original article do they call for the killing of British Troops?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1328703/Two-faces-Armistice-Day-Boy-brimming-pride-fanatics-burning-hate.html

Their comments were unpalatable, offensive and given the time and place designed to create as much publicity and offense as possible, but going by the article in this case they werent inciting violence and hatred. Unless of course you know better.

[Niall]

Try reading my post more carefully before accusing others of ignorance. I am fully aware that there are thousands upon thousands of peaceful lawabiding muslims in this country, but unfortunately, there are thousands upon thousands of ignoramuses who don't know that and will just lump ALL muslims together. Therefore it is incumbent on the law abiding muslims amongst us to take some responsibility for this misapprehension and distance themselves from extremists by condemning them publicly.

Secondly, don't even bother attempting to lecture me about christianiity - go patronise someone else who gives a damn about your ridiculous analogies.

Thirdly, ignorance and disrespect might well be a two way street, but until you see me doing anything remotely disrespectful against Islam I suggest you keep your ridiculous assumptions to yourself. You are the very sort of politically correct idiot who has allowed this kind of inflammatory behaviour to flourish in this country unchallenged. As to calling the muslim extremists "horrible names", I thought they were more than apposite in view of the nature of their offensive behaviour.

Okay so I'm gonna go ahead and assume your a Christian (please correct me if I'm wrong). I'm Catholic, do you expect me to go and give the Pope or any of those child-molesting Priests a piece of my mind about what has been going on behind closed doors? I hope not, because its a ridiculous thing to expect.

I actually know plenty of Muslims to know that the majority of them are decent, hard working people like anyone else. I just can't stand it when people start having kittens because an extremely small group like this who claim to be Muslim go and do something extremely controversial. In fact the majority of Muslim's wouldn't even consider this lot Muslim for the simple fact their views do not match those upheld in the Qur'an. I think its extremely unfair for a minority of people to get the blame for something like this.

And don't you dare call me politically correct. Just because I think its derogatory for someone to call a person from Pakistan for example a 'pak!' doesn't make me politically correct. I only am this way because of the way my father and brother refer to Islam - I've grown up in a very politically incorrect family, hell my brother even votes BNP. I can't stand it when anybody dislikes a certain group of people because of their religion etc, and I've had plenty of arguments about this stuff before.

And by horrible names I meant you saying (or what it looked like to me what you were saying) is saying that they incite violence and hatred.

Also I do believe they should be punished. I'm just trying to defend something because the way people have been talking about this as of late makes me think people really are a lot more ignorant then I thought.

Lastly, no hard feelings right? :)

[Wildcat!]

There is no need for you to be so bloody patronising.

Tunisia may be a very liberal country, however the fact remains that 98% of the 10million population of Tunisia follow the Islamic faith(Sunni) and to that end, Westerners will afford a high level of respect, for which you appear to be ridiculing somewhat in your post (as well as trying belitte another fm). You post here suggests that it would be more than acceptable to wander around Tunisian souks wearing a bikini top - when this is not the case.

I visited Tunisa about 15 years ago, and let me tell you right now, outside of the 'more Cosmopolitan areas', I can assure you, I felt as restricted there as I did when I lived in Saudi Arabia So please.... your own opinoin doesn't speak for the experience others may have had.


OK, I guess that was a little rude. But my point is, Tunisia, is a very liberal country. But to compare it to Saudi Arabia, is really not informed is it? I go to Tunisia often, maybe every year, with a few exceptions. MY brother lives there. Its restricted, in the form of sensure, and things like that, but culturally, its completely relaxed. And I am talking from experience, not just hearsay.

But again, if that was rude, I apologize. I ust know, its not a country you go into, and think, oh I better cover up!

[Wildcat!]

Doesnt that depend on the School of Islam you follow?




.


Fair enough, I can see your other points!

But as for, is it a matter of school? No its not! When it comes to how we see Christians, or Jewish people, its all in the Quran. And faction of muslims, would obey by that! Christianity, and Judaism, are still ancestors, of Islam. ANd most of their teachings, are similar. The quran acknowledges that these other teachings, come from the same source. And for that, when it mentions non believers, it doesnt include Jewish and Christians.

[Pyramid*]

OK, I guess that was a little rude. But my point is, Tunisia, is a very liberal country. But to compare it to Saudi Arabia, is really not informed is it? I go to Tunisia often, maybe every year, with a few exceptions. MY brother lives there. Its restricted, in the form of sensure, and things like that, but culturally, its completely relaxed. And I am talking from experience, not just hearsay.

But again, if that was rude, I apologize. I ust know, its not a country you go into, and think, oh I better cover up!

First off, I didn't say you were not speaking from experience.

Secondly, I'd say I was far more informed that you. How many M.E. countries have you lived (not just visited - LIVED) to allow you to make sweeping generalisation? I am interested to know as it makes a very big difference to having an 'informed' opinion.

One minute you are giving it big licks saying Tunisia is very liberal, no need for women to cover up, and now since I pointed out that Tunisia is not quite as liberal all over - you now are saying "it's restricted, in the form of censure and things like that'. What pray tell, do you think the word 'censure' means and in what context precisely in respect to Tunisia?

It's very difficult to have a reasonable meaningful discussion with a person who changes their opinion or view every other post.

[Shasown]

Fair enough, I can see your other points!

But as for, is it a matter of school? No its not! When it comes to how we see Christians, or Jewish people, its all in the Quran. And faction of muslims, would obey by that! Christianity, and Judaism, are still ancestors, of Islam. ANd most of their teachings, are similar. The quran acknowledges that these other teachings, come from the same source. And for that, when it mentions non believers, it doesnt include Jewish and Christians.

Oh right I stand corrected, and here was me thinking some Islamic schools look upon Christians and Jews as infidel.

Wouldnt it be fairer to say they believe in the same god as being worshipped by all three branches of Abraham but their's is the only true correct belief. Why do they not allow churches and synagogues in Mecca/Medina etc, well in Saudi in general? Why are christians and jews also prohibited from entering Mecca and Medina? After all if Islam views them as the same they would be allowed access to the harams wouldnt they?

[Vicky.]

Which Tunisia is this? From a parallel universe? Tunsia, is not a prudish country, or a fundamental muslim country. You will stick out more if you did dress conservatively! Women there dress the exact same way, as people do in the UK, probably wear even less, because its not cold over there. A few wear Hijab and stuff, but they are the exceptions. MOst of them dont.
Another big misconception, there are only a few opredominantly muslim countries, where you see all women covered up from head to toe. Obviously, those are the ones people like to identify muslims with. This fable, proves it even more.

I was in hammamet, which was obviously a tourist area. I was advised by the holiday reps that if venturing OUT of hammamet to dress appropriately. So I did.

I never said it was a muslim country either...and no, the women did not dress the same way as we do, infact, I didnt see many women outside of the actual tourist area :/

[BB_Eye]

Muslims Against Crusades are planning to interrupt the ceremony at 11 tomorrow morning with an online protest. Still don't know what they plan to do.

4chan are trying to hack muslimsagainstcrusades.com right now and get the site shut down. They still haven't gotten there yet, but I hope it works. 12 hours to go. :joker:

[Smithy]

someone should throw a bacon bun at them

[MTVN]

Muslims Against Crusades are planning to interrupt the ceremony at 11 tomorrow morning with an online protest. Still don't know what they plan to do.


Dont have a clue how they intend to do that :laugh:

[MTVN]

From their website:

"In light of this, a special and unique online campaign has been organised to coincide with Remembrance Sunday 2010. At precisely 11am (GMT), muslimsagainstcrusades.com will fill the (second) annual two minutes silence, with an unrelenting condemnation of the British Armed Forces. Simply log on to www.muslimsagainstcrusades.com at 11am (GMT) and hear what we have to say about your government and in particular, your army."

I guess it will just be a video of them up on their homepage or something :/

[InOne]

Let a few idiots try ruin tomorrow. But the heroes will shine through.

[BB_Eye]

From their website:

"In light of this, a special and unique online campaign has been organised to coincide with Remembrance Sunday 2010. At precisely 11am (GMT), muslimsagainstcrusades.com will fill the (second) annual two minutes silence, with an unrelenting condemnation of the British Armed Forces. Simply log on to www.muslimsagainstcrusades.com (http://www.muslimsagainstcrusades.com) at 11am (GMT) and hear what we have to say about your government and in particular, your army."

I guess it will just be a video of them up on their homepage or something :/This is the latest thread on /b/. Do NOT enter this site if you are easily offended.

http://boards.4chan.org/b/res/286961025

Sadly, the instructions for hacking MAC from previous threads are gone now. Worth keeping an eye on though.

[MTVN]

This is the latest thread on /b/. Do NOT enter this site if you are easily offended.

http://boards.4chan.org/b/res/286961025

Sadly, the instructions for hacking MAC from previous threads are gone now. Worth keeping an eye on though.

The MAC site is down now actually so it could be working

Are those boards safe btw, my computer seems to think they're not?

[BB_Eye]

The MAC site is down now actually so it could be working

Are those boards safe btw, my computer seems to think they're not?
I've never had any problems on it. I also use Norton on my browser and it's listed as a safe site.

[fruit_cake]

maybe they could go and live in Afganistan????

Oh yeah I forgot.. they prefer living here!! duh!!

[BB_Eye]

So what did MAC end up doing this morning? Anyone know?

[MTVN]

So what did MAC end up doing this morning? Anyone know?

I looked on their site just after the minutes silence and they had a pic of a small kid saying "British soldiers kill one Muslim child every 6 hours" then just loads of pictures of injured/dying children, a vid showing soldiers beating up someone and a load of ranting about the Army

I'm not sure if anything else was actually happening during the minutes silence. It's all still on their site (http://muslimsagainstcrusades.com/breaking-the-silence-part2.html)now if you want a look

[Livia]

I hate the poppy-burning gob****es. How dare they try to ruin an act of remembrance? Some of my family - some who are still living - were liberated, barely alive, from a concentration camp by the British at the end of the war... a war where millions of people died fighting the tyrany of the nazi regime. I heard on the TV yesterday that there is only one year since the end of World War 2 where a British soldier has not died as a result of a conflict. So I'd just like to say...

They grow not old as we who are left grow old
Age shall not weary them nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun, and in the morning,
We Will Remember Them.

[BB_Eye]

I looked on their site just after the minutes silence and they had a pic of a small kid saying "British soldiers kill one Muslim child every 6 hours" then just loads of pictures of injured/dying children, a vid showing soldiers beating up someone and a load of ranting about the Army

I'm not sure if anything else was actually happening during the minutes silence. It's all still on their site (http://muslimsagainstcrusades.com/breaking-the-silence-part2.html)now if you want a look
Wow, they really set the world alight there. Rememberance Sunday is ruined for me now. :joker:

[ange7]

I hate the poppy-burning gob****es. How dare they try to ruin an act of remembrance? Some of my family - some who are still living - were liberated, barely alive, from a concentration camp by the British at the end of the war... a war where millions of people died fighting the tyrany of the nazi regime. I heard on the TV yesterday that there is only one year since the end of World War 2 where a British soldier has not died as a result of a conflict. So I'd just like to say...

They grow not old as we who are left grow old
Age shall not weary them nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun, and in the morning,
We Will Remember Them.

Ummm Hitler was a facist who wanted to control and censure political thought. He was an enemy of democracy. Those who died in WW2 died fighting against totalitarianism and political oppression.
The irony that you now want to shut up political protesters who are against the war with the memories of those who passed away in WW2 is frighting. As is the idea that you and the rest of you would like to censor and even deport people with political views that don't follow the government line... sound familiar? It would if you knew your German history.

Because the UK isn't a fascist dictatorship people are allowed protest against a whole bunch of things.... funnily enough that includes wars... lol. This was what people in WW2 fought for.
Other parties in ( German) history have had the idea you guys have of expelling those with political beliefs that don't sit well with the current government.
The irony of this thread was only "funny" at first. Then it became monumental when the above poster used the memory of those who were persecuted in WW2. Please join the ******ing dots people.

[MTVN]

Ummm Hitler was a facist who wanted to control and censure political thought. He was an enemy of democracy. Those who died in WW2 died fighting against totalitarianism and political oppression.
The irony that you now want to shut up political protesters who are against the war with the memories of those who passed away in WW2 is frighting. As is the idea that you and the rest of you would like to censor and even deport people with political views that don't follow the government line... sound familiar? It would if you knew your German history.

Because the UK isn't a fascist dictatorship people are allowed protest against a whole bunch of things.... funnily enough that includes wars... lol. This was what people in WW2 fought for.
Other parties in ( German) history have had the idea you guys have of expelling those with political beliefs that don't sit well with the current government.
The irony of this thread was only "funny" at first. Then it became monumental when the above poster used the memory of those who were persecuted in WW2. Please join the ******ing dots people.

Livia didnt actually say anything about shutting them up or deporting them, you could have used a lot more posts in this thread to highlight your point.

Did you even read what they were protesting about? It wasnt the war, if they wanted to protest against merely the war then I'm sure noone would have a problem with that, after all they've been doing that on Parliamentary square for 9 years until they were removed in June.

Chanting "British soldiers burn in hell", and burning poppys is not "not following the government line" or being "against the war", it is spitting on the grave of every single man and woman who has ever died in warfare, be that WWI, WWII or in Korea, the Falklands, Northern Ireland, and then Iraq and Afghanistan. That is what remembrance day is about after all. It isnt about whether a war is right or wrong, it's about respecting the fact that people sacrficied themselves and laid down there lives for us.

I'm not big into patriotism, I disagree with the concept, nor do I lambast anyone for not wearing a poppy, I only wear mine one day a year, but to express disgust at this protest is to be human, and to actually have a shred of respect and decency in your body.

I actually agree with everyone having a right to protest, providing it doesnt cross the fine line between free speech and hate speech but large parts of your post were just ridiculous, and you are obviously ignorant both of what they were "protesting" against if you think it was the war, and what remembrance sunday is about

[Angus]

Ummm Hitler was a facist who wanted to control and censure political thought. He was an enemy of democracy. Those who died in WW2 died fighting against totalitarianism and political oppression.
The irony that you now want to shut up political protesters who are against the war with the memories of those who passed away in WW2 is frighting. As is the idea that you and the rest of you would like to censor and even deport people with political views that don't follow the government line... sound familiar? It would if you knew your German history.

Because the UK isn't a fascist dictatorship people are allowed protest against a whole bunch of things.... funnily enough that includes wars... lol. This was what people in WW2 fought for.
Other parties in ( German) history have had the idea you guys have of expelling those with political beliefs that don't sit well with the current government.
The irony of this thread was only "funny" at first. Then it became monumental when the above poster used the memory of those who were persecuted in WW2. Please join the ******ing dots people.

What a dick! and what a crass comments about a Jewish poster who has more rights than most to condemn fascism and intolerance. Since when do lawbreakers and hatefilled inciters of violence merit the same rights as the rest of us? Oh wait, your an Aussie, a land built on immigrant misfits and convicts - guess that explains it:rolleyes:

[Big Sexy]

What a dick! and what a crass comments about a Jewish poster who has more rights than most to condemn fascism and intolerance. Since when do lawbreakers and hatefilled inciters of violence merit the same rights as the rest of us? Oh wait, your an Aussie, a land built on immigrant misfits and convicts - guess that explains it:rolleyes:
You are a complete ****ing idiot.

[Angus]

You are a complete ****ing idiot.


I take that as a massive compliment from someone who is clearly an uneducated, illiterate, mentally challenged and ill-informed moron.:laugh3: I can only be offended by people on the same intellectual level as myself which you, my sad little tosser, obviously are not:pat:

[InOne]

Nobody ruined today so it was all good. Anyone can protest, let's just laugh at the sad twats who burn poppies and not give them anymore attention.

[BB_Eye]

Ummm Hitler was a facist who wanted to control and censure political thought. He was an enemy of democracy. Those who died in WW2 died fighting against totalitarianism and political oppression.
The irony that you now want to shut up political protesters who are against the war with the memories of those who passed away in WW2 is frighting. As is the idea that you and the rest of you would like to censor and even deport people with political views that don't follow the government line... sound familiar? It would if you knew your German history.
Leaving aside the fact that Livia didn't say anything about censoring the protestors (viva blanket statements :rolleyes:), I don't remember you loudly celebrating freedom of speech during the Quran burnings a couple of months ago. You were too busy being so butthurt over it. You said nothing explicit about prosecuting him, but that doesn't appear to matter to you either way.

Because the UK isn't a fascist dictatorship people are allowed protest against a whole bunch of things.... funnily enough that includes wars... lol. This was what people in WW2 fought for.
Other parties in ( German) history have had the idea you guys have of expelling those with political beliefs that don't sit well with the current government.
The irony of this thread was only "funny" at first. Then it became monumental when the above poster used the memory of those who were persecuted in WW2.What a twisted thing to say.

So nobody has a right to feel angry at the grotesque self-pity and ingratitude on display in this story and those who do have a malicious agenda to manipulate history?

Please join the ******ing dots people.What and ironic and condescending way to end a post so clearly out of touch with logic and reality.

[Livia]

What a dick! and what a crass comments about a Jewish poster who has more rights than most to condemn fascism and intolerance. Since when do lawbreakers and hatefilled inciters of violence merit the same rights as the rest of us? Oh wait, your an Aussie, a land built on immigrant misfits and convicts - guess that explains it:rolleyes:

Thank you MTVN, angus and BB_Eye, for replying to ange7's post so eloquently.

Ange7 is on my ignore list and has been for a while. I've said a couple of times don't bother replying to anything I say because I find you offensive, but maybe I've been too subtle. You know how thick-skinned stupid people can be. I never see ange7's posts unless someone quotes a comment. I have as little regard for what that person says as something I may have picked up on my shoe. People who sit in their room (probably in their mother's house) and actively post to cause annoyance and upset makes them a waste of good organs in my book. What was said shows up that poster's complete misunderstanding of the topic posted here, which is why I found the "join the dots, people" comment rather amusing and more than a little ironic.

[Beso]

I see the founder of the edl was arrested for police assault because he jumped a barrier and ripped a flag from these scum ****ers.

Same scum ****ers were then led away with a police escort to a tube station. ****ing hate this country.

Reminds me of the footage of farmers being batoned until bloody during a peaceful protest a few years back when in the same year muslims smashed windows at some theatre that dared to show a play they disliked while the police stood back and let them.

****ing joke.

One big sick kick in the teeth.

[Beso]

And here we have the police assault.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiZv3wkSfyU

[Grimnir]

they should all be arrested and then the armed forces can use them in their training exercises

[letmein]

Uh, Britain does not guarantee freedom of speech. You can be arrested for saying all sort of things. Britain is pretty Fascist, not to mention a full blown Nanny State. So, why do these people get to do whatever the hell that they want, while anyone else would be led away by police?!