Would you terminate?

[Kerry]

Prompted by an Emmerdale storyline - If you found out you were pregnant with a baby with Downs Syndrome, would you terminate the pregnancy?

Males - Would you want your partner to terminate the pregnancy?

[MeMyselfAndI]

yeah

[Miss Ivy Balls]

I wouldn't ever have a baby, but of course not.

If you plan to have a baby then the parents should know that anything could happen and if you're not willing to accept what might happen then don't make a baby.

[Stacey.]

Yep definitely. I wouldn't want a disabled baby or a baby with any condition like that.

[arista]

Yep definitely. I wouldn't want a disabled baby or a baby with any condition like that.



Yes Early Termination is Fine and Legal.
I back it.

[Ammi]

I would have to actually be in that situation to know for sure, but I think there is a good chance I would terminate

[joeysteele]

As a Male, I would personally be against any termination of a child but having said that,I would not be the person carrying the child, the female would be.

I would therefore hold my own counsel on the matter and give 100% support to any decision she made,it must be heart wrenching for any woman in that position and unless I was asked with insistence to say what I thought and felt,I would rather with no hesitation whatsoever support and be at the side of totally the person I was with.

[pinkmichk]

no i wouldnt i dont agree with abortions personally anyway but even if i did i wouldnt just cos of the child having a disability i would love it no matter what

[GypsyGoth]

I would have an abortion.

[MTVN]

Yes I would, I dont think I'd be fit or willing to raise a disabled child tbh, and all the difficulties it causes for both the child and the parents

[Novo]

Tough one really

I wouldn't want my Partner to terminate but i'd understand if she wanted to, bringing a child up with's Downs Syndrome would be so much harder and it would take so much getting use but saying that at the age i am now i would want her to terminate i don't think i would be ready for it but in another 10 years i reckon i would be much more up for it

[Iceman]

Tough one really

I wouldn't want my Partner to terminate but i'd understand if she wanted to, bringing a child up with's Downs Syndrome would be so much harder and it would take so much getting use but saying that at the age i am now i would want her to terminate i don't think i would be ready for it but in another 10 years i reckon i would be much more up for it

I would have the same view really.

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

i often do

[MTVN]

As a Male, I would personally be against any termination of a child but having said that,I would not be the person carrying the child, the female would be.

I would therefore hold my own counsel on the matter and give 100% support to any decision she made,it must be heart wrenching for any woman in that position and unless I was asked with insistence to say what I thought and felt,I would rather with no hesitation whatsoever support and be at the side of totally the person I was with.

I dont agree with that view at all, the father and the mother should have equal say over the fate of their child imo

[Kerry]

You also have to consider the operations and trauma a child with Downs may have to go through too. Bear in mind they are often very will with heart problems and such like. Is it fair to put them through that too? It's not only the parents who 'suffer' (if thats the right word to use)

[Tom]

Dont agree with abortion apart from situations like this. I think its the lesser of the two evils, if you let it live its purely for your own conscience or selfishness. I know they can lead OK lives but they'll never have normal lives and they'll always be ridiculed.

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

kerry your posts are always so jolly they brighten my day

[Kerry]

kerry your posts are always so jolly they brighten my day

I like to get people talking. Good for the site

Go to my smile thread - General chat

[Novo]

kerry your posts are always so jolly they brighten my day

:joker:

[Kerry]

You all love me really......

[Josy]

No, I dont think I could terminate tbh.

[Princess]

I could never have an abortion,no matter what was wrong with the baby.

[Grimnir]

i think killing your baby just because it has some disability is murder plain and simple

its no different than after birth seeing it has an illness and thinking oh cant cope with that and killing it

even if you cannot look after it yourself you can give it up for adoption

[Kerry]

When I was pregnant I refused the Downs test. I accepted what will be will be. Fate will decide what happens. My OH wanted me to have it though but as the test back then ran a high risk of miscarriage I said no

[Lee.]

No I wouldn't.By the time you find out whether your baby has Downs Syndrome, you have already felt your baby move inside of you. I just couldn't.

[BB_Eye]

I would terminate the pregnancy whether or not they had downs syndrome.

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

I would terminate the pregnancy whether or not they had downs syndrome.

:joker::joker::joker::joker::joker:

[Jack_]

I would terminate the pregnancy whether or not they had downs syndrome.

:laugh2:

[Vicky.]

I would.

Or if I found out that it had any serious problem that would affect the quality of its life. I think its selfishness in a way actually, to bring a child into the world knowing full well their standard of living is likely to be bad.

[Tom4784]

I don't think disability would come into it for me unless it was something that meant they'd suffer a lot or had little quality of life. Other then that I'd only suggest an abortion if it endangered the mother or if we couldn't logistically wait until the baby is born to put it up for adoption. I don't think I'd be in a great position to raise a kid yet so I would prefere it if they went to a loving home that could do a better job of it instead.

[Shaun]

It's an interesting topic because it's essentially asking 'would you kill someone on the basis of their disability'? On the face of it it sounds like an absolutely disgusting thing to do - but with the emotional implications involved I could forgive anyone for wanting the abortion... (I'm generally in favour of the right to choice anyway).

[Niall]

If its purely because the baby is down syndrome then no way. Thats a bit harsh. If I or my partner couldn't handle a down syndrome child then I would at least want them to go through with the birth then give up the baby. But its up to them I guess.

[MissKittyFantastico]

I honestly don't know how I would feel/what I would do unless I was in that position. I'm pro choice but whether I could actually go through with a termination when the test isn't available until quite an advanced stage in the pregnancy, I just don't know.

[letmein]

I would terminate the pregnancy whether or not they had downs syndrome.

I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought this was hysterically funny! :joker:

[LemonJam]

On the basis that it had a disability, absolutley not. I'm really quite suprised at the amount of people who would to be honest. It's kindof sickening IMO that people are like "hmm, it's not quite right, bin it" like they're a snickers bar missing the caramel (apologies for the obscure anaolgy) Parents can still embrace the joy they have with a child with a disability as they could with a non-disabled child.

I dunno, I grew up around children with disabilities so maybe I'm more biased.

[Twilight]

I would have an abortion.

[Twilight]

I would.

Or if I found out that it had any serious problem that would affect the quality of its life. I think its selfishness in a way actually, to bring a child into the world knowing full well their standard of living is likely to be bad.

That's my opinion really.

[Ross]

Personally, no.

[MTVN]

On the basis that it had a disability, absolutley not. I'm really quite suprised at the amount of people who would to be honest. It's kindof sickening IMO that people are like "hmm, it's not quite right, bin it" like they're a snickers bar missing the caramel (apologies for the obscure anaolgy) Parents can still embrace the joy they have with a child with a disability as they could with a non-disabled child.

I dunno, I grew up around children with disabilities so maybe I'm more biased.

I dont think it's "sickening" tbh, if you dont think you are fit to raise a disabled child then it is an understandable decision. It's not like it's just going to affect the parents, the child will inevitably lead a very difficult life.

It's also important to remember that it is just a fetus that is being aborted, it is a non-sentient being and so I dont consider it morally wrong to have it removed

[LemonJam]

I dont think it's "sickening" tbh, if you dont think you are fit to raise a disabled child then it is an understandable decision. It's not like it's just going to affect the parents, the child will inevitably lead a very difficult life.

It's also important to remember that it is just a fetus that is being aborted, it is a non-sentient being and so I dont consider it morally wrong to have it removed

Fair points. I dunno, it's always a sensitive issue with me because I grew up with them and understand that it's not all difficult for them. As much as they experience hardship, they can still embrace joy, fulfillment and every other emotions that a non disabled person can. In todays society anyway many disabled people are accepted into society (or so I thought)

And definatley fair point on that last part, I just don't like the idea that people would have an abortion JUST because of it's disability. I'm aware 'survival of the fittest' has been around for generations but when people start to play God and just says "well that life isn't good enough" it really makes me quite sad.

[Niall]

I would.

Or if I found out that it had any serious problem that would affect the quality of its life. I think its selfishness in a way actually, to bring a child into the world knowing full well their standard of living is likely to be bad.

I sort-of agree. I think if the baby having a really bad life because of its disabilities is reason enough to stop it going through that pain all through its life.

[MTVN]

Fair points. I dunno, it's always a sensitive issue with me because I grew up with them and understand that it's not all difficult for them. As much as they experience hardship, they can still embrace joy, fulfillment and every other emotions that a non disabled person can. In todays society anyway many disabled people are accepted into society (or so I thought)

And definatley fair point on that last part, I just don't like the idea that people would have an abortion JUST because of it's disability. I'm aware 'survival of the fittest' has been around for generations but when people start to play God and just says "well that life isn't good enough" it really makes me quite sad.

Oh right, fair enough, I cant say the same for myself so maybe I'm not in the best position to comment but I just think that if a mother is certain she isnt fit couldnt bring up a disabled child then it can be the right decision.

I can see where you're coming from though and it is a shame that disabled children can be unwanted, but it's important not to over-emotionalise the topic here.

[Niamh.]

No, I dont think that I could ever have an abortion and alot of downs syndrome children have a good quality of life

[Kerry]

To turn the subject on it's head a little, how many of you who said you wouldn't terminate would adopt or offer a child with Downs a home?

[Niamh.]

To turn the subject on it's head a little, how many of you who said you wouldn't terminate would adopt or offer a child with Downs a home?

well, I'm not planning to adopt any children, with or without a disability

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

:joker:

[Kerry]

well, I'm not planning to adopt any children, with or without a disability

If you didn't have children I mean. If you'd not had your own children beforehand and were planning to adopt. Would you consider a Downs child?

[Kerry]

:joker:

Do you just sit around giggling?

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

ya mostly

[Niamh.]

If you didn't have children I mean. If you'd not had your own children beforehand and were planning to adopt. Would you consider a Downs child?

No I don't think so

[LemonJam]

To turn the subject on it's head a little, how many of you who said you wouldn't terminate would adopt or offer a child with Downs a home?

If myself and my partner weren't able to concieve a child and she had the wish to adopt then very possibly, yes.

[Kerry]

ya mostly

lol well, glad you're happy :)

[Kerry]

I know of a family who adopted three Downs children. Must be exhausting yet rewarding.

[Novo]

:joker:

:laugh3:

[Kerry]

Contagious giggles...

PS Novo if you're expecting a reply to the wall message yours is blocked to me so I can't

[Novo]

That was Basil's friend

[Kerry]

That was Basil's friend

Lassie

[Tom]

No, I dont think that I could ever have an abortion and alot of downs syndrome children have a good quality of life

I think thats just a myth

[AJ.]

On the basis that it had a disability, absolutley not. I'm really quite suprised at the amount of people who would to be honest. It's kindof sickening IMO that people are like "hmm, it's not quite right, bin it" like they're a snickers bar missing the caramel (apologies for the obscure anaolgy) Parents can still embrace the joy they have with a child with a disability as they could with a non-disabled child.

I dunno, I grew up around children with disabilities so maybe I'm more biased.

Agree with this & me to.

A friend of mine's parents was told that he would be downs but he turned out to be perfectly normal. What if your parents was told a similar thing & they decided to abort you? That's besides the point though, most disabled kids can enjoy life just as much as us & I think it might be a bit selfish to just assume otherwise, if you don't want the responsibility you can always just put them up for adoption.

[fruit_cake]

abortion = murder as far as I'm concerned.

I hope one day when the abortion madness finishes, they retrospectively round up everyone involved and charge them for crimes against humanity.

[Jessica.]

I would never consider murdering a helpless young child just because I happened to give it an extra chromosome which lead to him/her having such a condition.

[Ammi]

This topic is a bit confusing because it seems to be going down the route of pro/anti termination but surely the OP is being more specific than that and posing the question of the child being downs syndrome and whether that affects peoples views. Tbh I think its hard for anyone to know for sure unless they're in that situation so views are generally based on whether they are pro or anti termination. I know a young down syndrome girl and I also know that her mother did not know before she was born that she would be DS, so I asked her whether she thinks, she would have still had her. She said even though she adores her daughter, weighing up everything (the father abandoned them, her daughter has had over 20 surgeries already and she is only 5) if she had actually known the reailities of coping with a severely(and she is more severe downs syndrome) disabled child she would not have had her if she had known beforehand. This might seem like a callous thing to say in some peoples view, but it is based on personal experience and she feels how she feels. Its good to think we would all do 'the right thing' and be amazing, caring, compassionate parents and give our child as high a quality of life as possible, but some of us wouldn't and couldn't cope and its that simple.

[Niamh.]

I think thats just a myth

what is? that downs syndrome kids can have a good quality of life? It completely depends on the severity of it but the way they are is their normality. I know plenty of downs syndrome people who are capable of doing plenty on their own and are very happy people.

[Captain.Remy]

Yes Early Termination is Fine and Legal.
I back it.

So do I. I don't think I'd be able to deal with it.

[Ammi]

what is? that downs syndrome kids can have a good quality of life? It completely depends on the severity of it but the way they are is their normality. I know plenty of downs syndrome people who are capable of doing plenty on their own and are very happy people.

Thats true, as with lots of disabilities, people can still live a happy and fulfilling life within their restriction, whatever they are. But we are talking about people that 'are' as opposed to terminating a pregnancy. Imo there are so many thing to be factored in but it seems to be a pro/anti termination thing, regardless of whether it is a disabled child or not. Perhaps if the tests where not available and therefore the parents would not know until the child was born then they would (hopefully) cope and be the sort of parent the child needs - in an ideal world. I mean we all think we wouldn't be able to cope with lots of things, then they happen to us and we do cope. As I said before I spoke to someone who has a DS daughter and she didn't know beforehand so she had her daughter and is a brilliant parent - but had she known she would have terminated. This is a really interesting topic

[Niamh.]

Thats true, as with lots of disabilities, people can still live a happy and fulfilling life within their restriction, whatever they are. But we are talking about people that 'are' as opposed to terminating a pregnancy. Imo there are so many thing to be factored in but it seems to be a pro/anti termination thing, regardless of whether it is a disabled child or not. Perhaps if the tests where not available and therefore the parents would not know until the child was born then they would (hopefully) cope and be the sort of parent the child needs - in an ideal world. I mean we all think we wouldn't be able to cope with lots of things, then they happen to us and we do cope. As I said before I spoke to someone who has a DS daughter and she didn't know beforehand so she had her daughter and is a brilliant parent - but had she known she would have terminated. This is a really interesting topic

I understand that and I can only go on what I think I might do in the situation, I have never been so I couldn't say with 100% certainty though I am as sure as I can be that I wouldn't be able to do it.

[Miss Ivy Balls]

How about, all the people who wouldn't accept a down syndrome child to not bother having a child in the first place, unless due to an accident such as the condom splitting or something of a similar sort.

Put something on the end of it and don't bother looking to make children if this is your view.

Fair point?

[fruit_cake]

The only thing I can say in the favour of people who choose to murder their own children, is that if they are going to be the parents, perhaps the kid really is better of dead.

[ElProximo]

Prompted by an Emmerdale storyline - If you found out you were pregnant with a baby with Downs Syndrome, would you terminate the pregnancy?
Males - Would you want your partner to terminate the pregnancy?

I have thought about this scenario. The retarded kid thing. I can't imagine killing the baby but I would like to find out what options are available in having someone else raise the kid. Not saying those old world mental hospitals but there must be something dignified out there?
Like a seniors care or we call them 'group homes' where nurses and social workers raise them almost like a family together.

but no, of course I can't imagine killing the kid.

Thats true, as with lots of disabilities, people can still live a happy and fulfilling life within their restriction,

One day I was saying (about the retarded kid) that I felt so bad for him and how his life must suck. Then someone (non-tarded) said 'They are happier than we are".
It made sense when you watched how damn happy they were to get some hamburgers. I mean, for them, life is always 'in the moment'.
All they know is this hamburger is just great. They are never thinking about the cost, they don't feel guilty about their weight, they are not watching a clock because they got something pressing their schedule.
They just enjoy the ****in hamburger in that moment and only that.
And when they are done they go are enjoying the next thing. Some shiny objects. And they are only in that moment.
EVEN IF they get angry because another one took the shiny paper? It's pure and simple. Then its over. They are not up at night trying to find out why Howard the retarded paper-remover is out to get them. They don't grind teeth vowing to teach Howard a lesson next time.
They don't go to doctors for benzos, prozacs or anxiety medications.
None of them ever became depressed because they agonize over their 'specialness' and what the meaning of life is.
Truth is - we wish we could do that.

My problem is that I have no idea how to communicate with these people. Sure, they do make me laugh sometimes but I just don't know how I could raise one.
I actually admire people that can. I just can't imagine pulling that off.

[MTVN]

The only thing I can say in the favour of people who choose to murder their own children, is that if they are going to be the parents, perhaps the kid really is better of dead.

Aborting a fetus is not murder.

[fruit_cake]

Aborting a fetus is not murder.

as far as I am concerned, it is.

[MTVN]

as far as I am concerned, it is.

But it's a non-sentient being, it cannot feel anything, a fetus or an embryo is not a human being and should not be considered one

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

this reminded me of that silent scream video thing you watch in school

did anybody else see that where it shows an abortion like a scan and you can you the abortion happening and you can see the baby open its mouth likes its screaming :bawling:

its the saddest thing i have ever seen :bawling:

[Niall]

But it's a non-sentient being, it cannot feel anything, a fetus or an embryo is not a human being and should not be considered one

This. The child cannot even feel pain until at least 5 weeks in. It would also have no chance of surviving and in no way can be considered a human.

Abortion is not murder when all your getting rid of is a fertilised cell.

[Niall]

this reminded me of that silent scream video thing you watch in school

did anybody else see that where it shows an abortion like a scan and you can you the abortion happening and you can see the baby open its mouth likes its screaming :bawling:

its the saddest thing i have ever seen :bawling:

Nope.

That sounds ****ed up O_o

[Lee.]

But it's a non-sentient being, it cannot feel anything, a fetus or an embryo is not a human being and should not be considered one

By the time a pregnant mother is tested for Downs Syndrome, her baby IS very much a living being though. It has a heart beat and moves, the movements which can be felt inside her. I don't agree with abortion personally anyway, but I don't understand how a mother can choose to have her baby removed from her body ater she has felt those first few fluttery movements and listened to his or her heartbeat. I just couldn't bear it

[Tom4784]

To turn the subject on it's head a little, how many of you who said you wouldn't terminate would adopt or offer a child with Downs a home?

I don't think I could look after any children that well, nevermind one that would require extra care. Maybe if I grew more confident in the future then yes but I'd leave it to the families that could give the kids a better life.

[Lee.]

This. The child cannot even feel pain until at least 5 weeks in. It would also have no chance of surviving and in no way can be considered a human.

Abortion is not murder when all your getting rid of is a fertilised cell.


It's not just a cell though.. woman is 3 -5 months pregnant when the Downs test is done

[Niall]

It's not just a cell though.. woman is 3 -5 months pregnant when the Downs test is done

I was on about the earlier stages of pregnancy.

But back on topic, those who have down syndrome can actually be regular normal people. It just depends on the degree of down syndrome you have which can be very widely varying. We were discussing this in R.S the other day :)

[ElProximo]

But it's a non-sentient being, it cannot feel anything, a fetus or an embryo is not a human being and should not be considered one

You can just 'announce' that standard but it can't become a defining definition for what is or is not a 'human being'.
Look at it this way:
- It certainly can 'feel' something somehow in the sense it most definitely reacts or responds to outside 'stimuli' (going with that word).

- Okay, but if we mean it cannot register and respond to pain that doesn't make one a living human or not. We might refer to Leprosy patients or for that matter any number in hospitals tonight sedated or we could even take an example of a paraplegic.. we don't suppose their body from the neck down is anything but a valuable living human body.

- 'Sentience' is interesting though its unhelpful in defining a human being in this sense (we are attempting) because it is more a philosophical concept than its tangible.
Here again, we could point to many people in our town who are in comas, stages of dementia, severe brain damage and in some sense are incapable of being 'aware' of pain and pleasure (physical or emotional or spiritual etc). Are they anything less than human beings?
For that matter we might wonder - is a child less 'sentient' than an adult and therefore 'less human'?

- Speaking of definition there is something where people say 'Its a FETUS not a BABY'. Right.
The word 'Fetus' is a soft of 'stage term'. We say 'Infants' or 'Teenagers'. The word 'Fetus' is one of those words. It would be like saying "Its a Prepubescent not a Fetus!'.

- but all of these things together don't even really dictate or change or mitigate calling an 'unborn person' or 'fetus' or 'water baby' anything but a 'human being'.
That's not making a political statement or anything. I could be 100% for aborting everyone but I still have no choice but to call this a 'Human Being'. It is a 'Being'.
Its not a rodent being, animal being, outer-space being. I can't get around it when it comes to a defining description.

I don't get involved in these 'abortion' debates too often. I rarely discuss it. I find it horrifying or 'bad' regardless of any political or religious views I ever had. Nobody should ever 'want' an abortion no matter what.
OK,
but here is actually how I look at this sometimes and just bear with the unusual angle:
Let's completely forget this idea of it being a human being or not. Say it is not. We all agree.
OK.
Just imagine the amazing headlines next month: Scientists find LIFE FORMS on meteors!!!
In a stunning discovery there is a tiny sort of microscopic inorganic 'spore' found on a rock in the Amazon.
To the astonishment it was seen to transform into some organic 'drip'. After months of intense science the drip (fed simple sugars) began to transfer DNA coding from a researchers skin cells!!!
Under exact circumstances and work the 'blob' began mimicking a 'humanoid shape' blood vessels...
... a year later the alien life-form was a living breathing alien being!!!

Scientists, politicians, social workers cannot express the astonishing implications of this!
BILLIONS would be spent. Money and Time! Every one of our greatest minds and top geniuses would be marshaled to invest in this!
Almost immediately the meteorites would become nothing short of the most valuable matter on Earth!
The region the original 'dust spores' were found is now nothing short of a trillion dollar UN protected security zone with 10,000 agents spending 1000s of hours literally going through blades of grass with a fine-tooth comb!
Men would die for this.
Governments who mishandled the 'life form issue' may be defeated over this issue!
hell, some religion would start. Scientologists would become respectable FFS!
The 'alien spore', if found, would have the most astonishing security, protection.. again, every military defense, top-secret labs, billion dollars care facility, thousands of researchers in every sanitary protection, locked rooms ventilated in exact %s of air and heat etc.

Do you see this now?
EVEN IF the fetus were totally agreed upon as something 'inhuman' it is nothing short of amazing that with some simple science it can turn into a human being.
Something that can turn into a sentient human being by just adding some simple common substances?
To me and (seen in example) most people that is a highly valuable 'object' in itself.
Go ahead and suppose it isn't a human being. That, by simply NOT interfering and throwing some salt, sugar and water in it for a few month it becomes a human being?
Priceless!

[Jords]

They dont have much of a life, and it would be a lot of hard work.
I dont like the idea of abortion, but yes I would.

[Barbie]

Not 100% sure where i stand on this,

I think for a first child, its going to be tough and a downs baby tougher. A second child i think i'd be more prepared to take on a downs child. If i struggled i couldn't give the baby up for adoption or put the baby through my failures. So i think i would abort if it was my first baby. Hard to say because im not in the situation.

[Beastie]

When I was pregnant I refused the Downs test. I accepted what will be will be. Fate will decide what happens. My OH wanted me to have it though but as the test back then ran a high risk of miscarriage I said no

This. If I was pregnant I would refuse the Down Syndrome test as well. Especially if there is a risk of a miscarriage. What will be will be. I would love my child no matter what. My godparent has a downs syndrome child. Well he's like 16/17 now. But he is lovely! There are worse things that could happen.

[Beastie]

I dont agree with that view at all, the father and the mother should have equal say over the fate of their child imo

This. However it's the woman's body who is carrying the baby. Therefore she will make the final decision. If it was the other way around and men were carrying a baby then they would have the final say.

[Kerry]

Rather irrelevant of a serious subject but the Emmerdale character has now decided to keep her Downs baby. It will be interesting to see how the story pans out. Then again, they did a similar storyline in EE didn't they with Billy's daughter Janet. However they soon ferreted her away to live with her mother ...... (I do know they can't use babies/toddlers beyond certain work hours but they didn't really need to write her character out??)

[heretoday]

I had a termination 7 years ago for similar reasons and it was a VERY difficult decision to make. I found out at 17 weeks that my baby had severe spina bifida and fluid on the brain. I got a 2nd opinion and spoke to staff at Alder Hey who work with children affected by neural tube defects to try and help me with my decision. I was told my baby would have no quality of life, it would be paralysed and have bowel and bladder incontinence as well as problems with the brain.

At 18 weeks 6 days I was induced and gave birth to a sleeping daughter, my first child with my husband of just 4 months, and a very much wanted baby. It was very very sad and traumatic and it took me a long time to come to terms with.

All I can say is, what happened to me has changed me as a person into a much more compassionate and non-judgemental soul, and I am thankful for this. My husband and I never survived the year following this (and a move overseas) but I now have two healthy boys thanks to a prescription of high strength folic acid in both pregnancies.

I don't know what I would have done if it had been Down's Syndrome, but I don't envy anyone parent who finds themself in a position of trying to do what they believe is best for the child, the parents and other siblings.

[Claymores]

that is a wow of a post heretoday and sorry for your loss. A very great post

[Kerry]

I had a termination 7 years ago for similar reasons and it was a VERY difficult decision to make. I found out at 17 weeks that my baby had severe spina bifida and fluid on the brain. I got a 2nd opinion and spoke to staff at Alder Hey who work with children affected by neural tube defects to try and help me with my decision. I was told my baby would have no quality of life, it would be paralysed and have bowel and bladder incontinence as well as problems with the brain.

At 18 weeks 6 days I was induced and gave birth to a sleeping daughter, my first child with my husband of just 4 months, and a very much wanted baby. It was very very sad and traumatic and it took me a long time to come to terms with.

All I can say is, what happened to me has changed me as a person into a much more compassionate and non-judgemental soul, and I am thankful for this. My husband and I never survived the year following this (and a move overseas) but I now have two healthy boys thanks to a prescription of high strength folic acid in both pregnancies.

I don't know what I would have done if it had been Down's Syndrome, but I don't envy anyone parent who finds themself in a position of trying to do what they believe is best for the child, the parents and other siblings.


So sorry about your little girl and also the break up. It must have been devastating :( :hug:

[Patrick]

i often do

:joker::joker:

[Patrick]

They dont have much of a life, and it would be a lot of hard work.
I dont like the idea of abortion, but yes I would.

rofl You make them sound like Dead Hamsters.

The babies don't have much life, but when they grow up they're a pocket full of sunshine.

...Well sometimes.

My mate has Down Syndrome and he's abit..awkward at times but you know.

Billy's Daughter in EastEnders, Now she's lifeless so I see what you mean.

[Beastie]

It all depends how severe Downs Syndrome is. Look at Becky on Glee. She is a little actress who has Downs Syndrome. They would get as good as a quality life like the rest of us. Just that for them it would be a bit harder. However they are not worth terminating. Plenty of children who go to these special schools seems happy with themselves. They feel sh!t when ordinary people bully them. However anyone can get bullied.

[abbey97]

No, it shouldn't matter if they have down syndrome, it's still your baby!

[Patrick]

No, it shouldn't matter if they have down syndrome, it's still your baby!

But if you don't want you're baby then you don't have to have it, if it's like handicap.

If you don't want it because your a young ******ing chavy tart who couldn't afford free contraception, then tough you're keeping it.

But if you can't deal with a retarded baby then, there's nothing you can do, you could always put it up for adoption though.

[Kerry]

Patrick whats got into you tonight, seriously?

[Patrick]

Patrick whats got into you tonight, seriously?

Well I had a talk with UKTurtle and he sort of showed me the light it was like seeing Jesus.

So basically I've calmed down alot now and I'm not as aggressive towards people as I apparently once was constantly.

[Kerry]

Well I had a talk with UKTurtle and he sort of showed me the light it was like seeing Jesus.

So basically I've calmed down alot now and I'm not as aggressive towards people as I apparently once was constantly.

OK. Just you seem edgy tonight. Not yourself anyway

[Patrick]

OK. Just you seem edgy tonight. Not yourself anyway

Is that bad? :shocked:

[Patrick]

I'm worried now.

[Kerry]

Is that bad? :shocked:

Nothing to do with me. Just an observation.

[Beastie]

Yeah I prefer the more fun Patrick. It gets bugging when Paddy get aggressive! :hugesmile:

[Patrick]

Yeah I prefer the more fun Patrick. It gets bugging when Paddy get aggressive! :hugesmile:

I'm calmer tonight than I've ever been? :conf:

[Kerry]

Yeah I prefer the more fun Patrick. It gets bugging when Paddy get aggressive! :hugesmile:

I'm not used to seeing it, hence noticing

[Kerry]

I'm calmer tonight than I've ever been? :conf:

You're not. For a couple of days you've been rather ranty. Even swearing at admin

Anyway, not a discussion for here really :)

[Beastie]

I'm calmer tonight than I've ever been? :conf:

Yeah right. Okay then.

[Patrick]

ew.

I need to die or something, I thought I was calm tonight after I spoke to UKTurtle.
I can't believe I swore at an Admin, I hope it wasn't Kaz she's lovely.

But yes you're right, We can't have this topic going off...topic, so let's get back to the discussion of babies.

[Lee.]

Sorry, just to keep it off topic for just one more post.. Bu t I think Patrick has his reasonable head on tonight :conf:

[Locke.]

Patrick has been a lot calmer tonight than most of the people complaining usually are :bored:

[Kerry]

Sorry, just to keep it off topic for just one more post.. Bu t I think Patrick has his reasonable head on tonight :conf:

It was earlier stuff. Patricks fine. Just a little odd tonight and yesterday. Again, just an observation :) I did ask if he was OK

[Kerry]

Patrick has been a lot calmer tonight than most of the people complaining usually are :bored:

I've just never seen him like that. Simple. For heavens sake. I don't read all his posts!

[Kerry]

FFS the packs in town

[Locke.]

I've just never seen him like that. Simple. For heavens sake. I don't read all his posts!

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