'My daughter is gay', reveals Jonathan Ross

[Crimson Dynamo]

Jonathan Ross has proudly revealed that his daughter Betty Kitten is a lesbian – despite once joking that gay children should be adopted.
The TV host, who is married to screenwriter Jane Goldman, made the revelation about 19-year-old Betty during a radio interview yesterday, adding that he just wanted his children to be ‘good and happy’.
Asked how he would feel if his daughter brought a woman home, he replied: ‘Well, my eldest daughter is gay so that’s a question I’ve dealt with on a regular basis already. And providing it’s a nice woman, I’m thrilled.’


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1348403/Jonathan-Ross-reveals-daughter-Betty-Kitten-gay.html#ixzz1BTYTnduh

Somehow I am not surprised..

[MrWong]

Jonathan Ross has proudly revealed that his daughter Betty Kitten is a lesbian – despite once joking that gay children should be adopted.
The TV host, who is married to screenwriter Jane Goldman, made the revelation about 19-year-old Betty during a radio interview yesterday, adding that he just wanted his children to be ‘good and happy’.
Asked how he would feel if his daughter brought a woman home, he replied: ‘Well, my eldest daughter is gay so that’s a question I’ve dealt with on a regular basis already. And providing it’s a nice woman, I’m thrilled.’


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1348403/Jonathan-Ross-reveals-daughter-Betty-Kitten-gay.html#ixzz1BTYTnduh

Somehow I am not surprised..

BIB - What do you mean by that?

[Crimson Dynamo]

BIB - What do you mean by that?

Upbringing.

[MrWong]

Upbringing.

Hmmm, ok. So what are you suggesting that her upbringing has contributed to?

[Lee.]

Hmm.. kind of a nothing news story that one. I like Johnathon Ross, but I have to admit I could'nt give a monkeys whether his daughter is gay or straight.

However... BETTY KITTEN?? What sort of name is that?? JR and wife should be shot by firing range for that!

[Crimson Dynamo]

Hmmm, ok. So what are you suggesting that her upbringing has contributed to?

I am of the belief that upbringing is a major influencer in homosexuality.

[Niamh.]

still not as bad as Bob Geldofs kids though ^

and also Nicole Ritchie, well I like Harlow for her daughter but Sparrow for her son??? :/

[Niamh.]

I am of the belief that upbringing is a major influencer in homosexuality.

but neither Jonathon or his wife are gay so how do you figure that?:conf:

[MrWong]

I am of the belief that upbringing is a major influencer in homosexuality.

<points and laughs> :joker:

Ok then.

[Lee.]

still not as bad as Bob Geldofs kids though ^

and also Nicole Ritchie, well I like Harlow for her daughter but Sparrow for her son??? :/

Sparrow? You're joking?? Jesus H Christ that's bad!!

Chris Martin and Gwyneth have a lot to anser for too.. Apple Martin!

[Crimson Dynamo]

<points and laughs> :joker:

Ok then.

It would have been less transparent to just admit that the debate had gone beyond you.

[Crimson Dynamo]

but neither Jonathon or his wife are gay so how do you figure that?:conf:

That is not the point. Often a gay male has a dominant mother figure and a poor father relationship. I suspect it could be the case with Betty, combine that with their lifestyle and it is not surprising.

[MrWong]

It would have been less transparent to just admit that the debate had gone beyond you.

Not really.

I've debated that paticular theory to death. So my only response now is to point and laugh.

I'm sure someone will be along who can be bothered to debate your paticular theory but that's not me.

[Niamh.]

That is not the point. Often a gay male has a dominant mother figure and a poor father relationship. I suspect it could be the case with Betty, combine that with their lifestyle and it is not surprising.

Well, if that's the case then I should be a lesbian:joker: well minus the show biz lifestyle of course!

I don't buy into that at all, you're attracted to who you're attracted to imo and it has nothing to do with upbringing

[Niamh.]

Sparrow? You're joking?? Jesus H Christ that's bad!!

Chris Martin and Gwyneth have a lot to anser for too.. Apple Martin!

ew yeah and Moses (really? ffs!)

[Lee.]

Well, if that's the case then I should be a lesbian:joker: well minus the show biz lifestyle of course!I don't buy into that at all, you're attracted to who you're attracted to imo and it has nothing to do with upbringing

Me too! :joker:

[Crimson Dynamo]

Not really.

I've debated that paticular theory to death. So my only response now is to point and laugh.

I'm sure someone will be along who can be bothered to debate your paticular theory but that's not me.

Homosexuality and its cause is all debate, all theory.

perhaps you have the definitive answer, of course you would be the only person on earth to have found it, but wow, think of the kudos?

lol

[Crimson Dynamo]

Well, if that's the case then I should be a lesbian:joker: well minus the show biz lifestyle of course!

I don't buy into that at all, you're attracted to who you're attracted to imo and it has nothing to do with upbringing

is one theory but it leaves many questions - it also kind of flies in the face of many other aspects of your personality that are directly influenced by upbringing and other sexual preferences.

[Niamh.]

is one theory but it leaves many questions - it also kind of flies in the face of many other aspects of your personality that are directly influenced by upbringing and other sexual preferences.

well the reality of it is we will probably never know for sure but I personally don't believe it to be the case that up bringing causes homosexuality, simply because not all homosexuals have had the same or similar upbringings

[Crimson Dynamo]

well the reality of it is we will probably never know for sure but I personally don't believe it to be the case that up bringing causes homosexuality, simply because not all homosexuals have had the same or similar upbringings

There may be a common theme that can cause it in early life. It may be that it is in us all but is triggered by parental influence but as there are no studies it is easier to just say it is a random event, which it may be.

[Niamh.]

There may be a common theme that can cause it in early life. It may be that it is in us all but is triggered by parental influence but as there are no studies it is easier to just say it is a random event, which it may be.

then how would you explain a family with 3 boys or girls with the same upbringing but only one is gay?

[Crimson Dynamo]

then how would you explain a family with 3 boys or girls with the same upbringing but only one is gay?

they dont have the same upbringing, that is why children differ greatly in character, it depends on the relationship of the parents at crucial stages of their development - this can change greatly from one year to the next and explains why siblings can be very different but be just 2 years apart

[Angus]

It depends on whether you believe homosexuality is a learned behaviour, in which case all that is required is cognitive behaviour therapy to sort it out:rolleyes: Personally, I am of the belief it is biologically innate and genetic. Scientific researchers estimate that homosexuality is present in around 10% of the population and there is a similar percentage throughout the animal kingdom - there is documented scientific evidence of it being present in over 400 species. That being the case, it would follow that a person doesn't CHOOSE to be gay, they just ARE. If sexual orientation is determined within the womb, why castigate a person just for being who they were born to be?

[KG.]

Have you come out yet LeatherTrumpet?

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

lesbians :lovedup:

[Crimson Dynamo]

Have you come out yet LeatherTrumpet?

calling someone gay as a slur is actually homophobic and does not belong in this debate

[karezza]

No-one is gay apart from Quentin Tarantino.

[Niamh.]

they dont have the same upbringing, that is why children differ greatly in character, it depends on the relationship of the parents at crucial stages of their development - this can change greatly from one year to the next and explains why siblings can be very different but be just 2 years apart

It may not be exactly the same but in most cases kids growing up in the same household with the same parents will have very similar upbringings.

[Crimson Dynamo]

It depends on whether you believe homosexuality is a learned behaviour, in which case all that is required is cognitive behaviour therapy to sort it out:rolleyes: Personally, I am of the belief it is biologically innate and genetic. Scientific researchers estimate that homosexuality is present in around 10% of the population and there is a similar percentage throughout the animal kingdom - there is documented scientific evidence of it being present in over 400 species. That being the case, it would follow that a person doesn't CHOOSE to be gay, they just ARE. If sexual orientation is determined within the womb, why castigate a person just for being who they were born to be?

scientist need not have to estimate as a recent survey with a whopping sample size of 450,000 found that 1.5% is gay. gayness in animals is often t=related to dominance and lack of female or male suitors and it is very difficult to draw comparisons from the animal world if we dont for any other types of behavior.

[Crimson Dynamo]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/sep/23/gay-bisexual-population-uk

[karezza]

We are all Thetans. All sexualities are in every Thetan.

[Crimson Dynamo]

It may not be exactly the same but in most cases kids growing up in the same household with the same parents will have very similar upbringings.

by similar you are meaning all the other things bar parental relationships

[Niamh.]

by similar you are meaning all the other things bar parental relationships

I suppose so, and I do see what you're trying to say but I don't think what relationship you have with your parents would determine if you're gay or not. personally I think it's something that happens when you're being made or formed or whatever the term is.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I suppose so, and I do see what you're trying to say but I don't think what relationship you have with your parents would determine if you're gay or not. personally I think it's something that happens when you're being made or formed or whatever the term is.

but lots of other sexual preferences are to do with circumstance: for instance when and where you have your first orgasm is a main determinant to your future sexual preference.

[Niamh.]

but lots of other sexual preferences are to do with circumstance: for instance when and where you have your first orgasm is a main determinant to your future sexual preference.

And that's a proven fact is it? I never heard that before

[Crimson Dynamo]

And that's a proven fact is it? I never heard that before

Books by Desmond Morris

The Naked Ape (1967) — an unabashed look at the human species. The book is notable for its focus on humanity's animalistic qualities and our similarity with other apes. Reprinted many times and in many languages, it continues to be a best-seller.
The Human Zoo (1969) — a continuation of the previous book, analysing human behaviour in big modern societies and their resemblance to animal behaviour in captivity.
Intimate Behaviour (1971) — this book examines and analyses any physical contact acted out by human animals. From clapping, to having a hair cut, to hand jive, to patting on the back, to hugging, to babe suckling, to copulation...

[Niamh.]

Books by Desmond Morris

The Naked Ape (1967) — an unabashed look at the human species. The book is notable for its focus on humanity's animalistic qualities and our similarity with other apes. Reprinted many times and in many languages, it continues to be a best-seller.
The Human Zoo (1969) — a continuation of the previous book, analysing human behaviour in big modern societies and their resemblance to animal behaviour in captivity.
Intimate Behaviour (1971) — this book examines and analyses any physical contact acted out by human animals. From clapping, to having a hair cut, to hand jive, to patting on the back, to hugging, to babe suckling, to copulation...

well, I can't really comment on those as I haven't read them but I don't know is sexual behaviour and sexual orientation the same thing tbh

[Angus]

scientist need not have to estimate as a recent survey with a whopping sample size of 450,000 found that 1.5% is gay. gayness in animals is often t=related to dominance and lack of female or male suitors and it is very difficult to draw comparisons from the animal world if we dont for any other types of behavior.

I mentioned the animal kingdom to emphasise that homosexuality is a natural occurrence across all species, not an aberration that occurs only in humans, nor is it dependent upon upbringing or environment etc since it is an innate, biological and genetic fact of life. If sexual orientation is determined before birth, it can hardly be a learned behaviour.

[Shaun]

karezza and LT in the same thread. too much.

[Tom4784]

I believe it's a random genetic factor, you can't learn or unlearn homosexuality just like you can't learn or unlearn Hetrosexuality. Sexuality just is, nothing can affect it either way.

[Angus]

Books by Desmond Morris

The Naked Ape (1967) — an unabashed look at the human species. The book is notable for its focus on humanity's animalistic qualities and our similarity with other apes. Reprinted many times and in many languages, it continues to be a best-seller.
The Human Zoo (1969) — a continuation of the previous book, analysing human behaviour in big modern societies and their resemblance to animal behaviour in captivity.
Intimate Behaviour (1971) — this book examines and analyses any physical contact acted out by human animals. From clapping, to having a hair cut, to hand jive, to patting on the back, to hugging, to babe suckling, to copulation...

Desmond Morris is a Zoologist and his main area of expertise lies in animal behaviour, including that of humans. He is not qualified to comment on the biology or genetics of sexual orientation.

[KG.]

calling someone gay as a slur is actually homophobic and does not belong in this debate

I just thought this obsession with homosexuality you have was a bit suspect, that's all :xyxwave:

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

karezza and LT in the same thread. too much.

:joker:

[Crimson Dynamo]

I just thought this obsession with homosexuality you have was a bit suspect, that's all :xyxwave:

It's probably the most debated subject in this area and there are 2 good stories in the media. Again, however, you debase the discussion by using homosexuality as a slur to put down a poster. :conf:

[Crimson Dynamo]

Desmond Morris is a Zoologist and his main area of expertise lies in animal behaviour, including that of humans. He is not qualified to comment on the biology or genetics of sexual orientation.

oh jeez, are you serious? read his books and reconsider. lol

[KG.]

It's probably the most debated subject in this area and there are 2 good stories in the media. Again, however, you debase the discussion by using homosexuality as a slur to put down a poster. :conf:

Lol, you don't debate, you speak your opinion as truth with no consideration for any other argument, that isn't what a debate is about.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Lol, you don't debate, you speak your opinion as truth with no consideration for any other argument, that isn't what a debate is about.

if i spoke my opinion as untruths what would they then be?

do you just mean you dont like what I say as they dont fit your world view?

[Grimnir]

All human behaviour is learned. From the day we are born the brain starts to receive information and is conditioned throughout our life to create our personality which includes our sexuality.

Sex is all in the mind. Ask yourself this question - what turns me on and makes me sexually stimulated. Think of everything, then ask yourself why? Its because the brain became conditioned to associate that thought with sexual arousal.

[Crimson Dynamo]

All human behaviour is learned. From the day we are born the brain starts to receive information and is conditioned throughout our life to create our personality which includes our sexuality.

Sex is all in the mind. Ask yourself this question - what turns me on and makes me sexually stimulated. Think of everything, then ask yourself why? Its because the brain became conditioned to associate that thought with sexual arousal.

Good post

and we are finding more and more that males and females are mostly similar and that all the differences are learned (just think of the stereotypes "girls like... or girls are good at...)

[Niamh.]

All human behaviour is learned. From the day we are born the brain starts to receive information and is conditioned throughout our life to create our personality which includes our sexuality.

Sex is all in the mind. Ask yourself this question - what turns me on and makes me sexually stimulated. Think of everything, then ask yourself why? Its because the brain became conditioned to associate that thought with sexual arousal.

I agree with your post but I think orientation and behaviour are different. I don't think people learn to be heterosexual anymore than people learn to be homosexual

[GypsyGoth]

All human behaviour is learned. From the day we are born the brain starts to receive information and is conditioned throughout our life to create our personality which includes our sexuality.

Sex is all in the mind. Ask yourself this question - what turns me on and makes me sexually stimulated. Think of everything, then ask yourself why? Its because the brain became conditioned to associate that thought with sexual arousal.

Good post

and we are finding more and more that males and females are mostly similar and that all the differences are learned (just think of the stereotypes "girls like... or girls are good at...)



But we are born with our sexuality. Sure we learn behavior, but that doesn't mean you can learn to be straight, didn't someone try to electrocute gay people to try and make them straight, that thinking comes from the idea that we choose our sexuality; and I don't believe we do.

[Crimson Dynamo]

But we are born with our sexuality. Sure we learn behavior, but that doesn't mean you can learn to be straight, didn't someone try to electrocute gay people to try and make them straight, that thinking comes from the idea that we choose our sexuality; and I don't believe we do.


there is no evidence to suggest we are born with any innate sexuality. heterosexuality is what keeps us going as a species via evolution.

it has nothing to do with choice. do you think we are born to love or choose to be exclusively turned on by rubber, born to only have an orgasm if we see a jet aircraft take off (one case is known) born to only like to be submissive, born to like to be bound and gagged?

it is an interesting debate. would you suggest that one is born to be a rapist or a peadophile or is that learned?

[Niamh.]

there is no evidence to suggest we are born with any innate sexuality. heterosexuality is what keeps us going as a species via evolution.

it has nothing to do with choice. do you think we are born to love or choose to be exclusively turned on by rubber, born to only have an orgasm if we see a jet aircraft take off (one case is known) born to only like to be submissive, born to like to be bound and gagged?

it is an interesting debate. would you suggest that one is born to be a rapist or a peadophile or is that learned?

I believe that most of us are born heterosexual (not learned to be) as you said because of procreation. I think some people for one reason or another when they are being formed within the womb for some reason or another, maybe some sort of extra hormone or whatever are born gay.

As for rapists, I think that is less to do with sexuality and more to do with power and control.

[GypsyGoth]

there is no evidence to suggest we are born with any innate sexuality. heterosexuality is what keeps us going as a species via evolution.

So you are saying that all people who are attracted to the same sex have been influenced by the way they grew up?


it has nothing to do with choice. do you think we are born to love or choose to be exclusively turned on by rubber, born to only have an orgasm if we see a jet aircraft take off (one case is known) born to only like to be submissive, born to like to be bound and gagged?
Maybe you're mixing up being attracted to a gender and stuff like the specifics of what turn people on and fetishes.


it is an interesting debate. would you suggest that one is born to be a rapist or a peadophile or is that learned?
Both groups should be castrated, and have those radio transmitters on their ankles. And to answer your question I think they are born that way.

[Niamh.]

So you are saying that all people who are attracted to the same sex have been influenced by the way they grew up?


Maybe you're mixing up being attracted to a gender and stuff like the specifics of what turn people on and fetishes.



Both groups should be castrated, and have those radio transmitters on their ankles. And to answer your question I think they are born that way.

I don't think that rapists are born that way, I think it's something learned and don't even necessarily believe it's sexual but a warped way of feeling powerful and in control.

Paedophiles, I don't know, I mean alot of times paedophiles were victims themselves when they were younger so that would suggest that, in those cases anyway, it was learned

[30stone]

Who would have thunk it.

[Patrick]

Of course she's gay with a name like Kitten.

http://www.bigbrotheronline.co.uk/bb5/contestants/images/kitten_lge.jpg

[Crimson Dynamo]

So you are saying that all people who are attracted to the same sex have been influenced by the way they grew up?

I am suggesting so yes, i dont see any difference in any other break from the norm sexual proclivity


Maybe you're mixing up being attracted to a gender and stuff like the specifics of what turn people on and fetishes.

I use that as an example of a powerful, unconmtrolled sexual urge that is learned



Both groups should be castrated, and have those radio transmitters on their ankles. And to answer your question I think they are born that way.

But as neeeeeeeve suggests it seems to be that it is a leaned aspect ie being abused themselves

I dont want to get into a paedophile/gay argument as it is not one that any gay person would like and i would not like to be in the same argument if i were gay but it does lend itself to the debate, and debate it is currently

[Niamh.]

But as neeeeeeeve suggests it seems to be that it is a leaned aspect ie being abused themselves

I dont want to get into a paedophile/gay argument as it is not one that any gay person would like and i would not like to be in the same argument if i were gay but it does lend itself to the debate, and debate it is currently

Yeah, I don't see them as being similar anyway. Rape and Paedophilia are both forms of abuse and control over another person, and as I've said I don't necessarily see them as a primarily sexual thing.

Being gay imo is exactly the same as being heterosexual in the sense that it doesn't hurt others and it's simply being with a different gender to the "norm".

[Crimson Dynamo]

Yeah, I don't see them as being similar anyway. Rape and Paedophilia are both forms of abuse and control over another person, and as I've said I don't necessarily see them as a primarily sexual thing.

Being gay imo is exactly the same as being heterosexual in the sense that it doesn't hurt others and it's simply being with a different gender to the "norm".

i get that but it is only seen as abuse and control at the moment, in ancient greek times it was seen as normal and in other parts of the world it is seen as normal.

[Niamh.]

i get that but it is only seen as abuse and control at the moment, in ancient greek times it was seen as normal and in other parts of the world it is seen as normal.

What, rape and paedophilia?

well, whatever the opinion of the time is doesn't matter to me really, If one participant is being forced and is not enjoying it then it's abuse.

[Crimson Dynamo]

What, rape and paedophilia?

well, whatever the opinion of the time is doesn't matter to me really, If one participant is being forced and is not enjoying it then it's abuse.

the former not the latter and it was the norm and evidence suggests that it was mutual!

[Niamh.]

the former not the latter and it was the norm and evidence suggests that it was mutual!

well, If it was mutual than it's not really rape is it?:joker:

[LemonJam]

I'm in the minority here, I'm with LT on this one.

Most of the gay people I know have had little/poor relationships with one of their parental figures. My male friends who are bought up around predominantly female figures turned out gay and my female friend who was bought up around predominantly male figures turned out gay. This is just from my friends and I'm not saying they're a study sample. :p

Also if there was something in the genetics from birth, wouldn't scientists have found it by now?

[Crimson Dynamo]

but it being to do with your upbringing does not make it any less valid, if you see what i mean

i know that if it were a fact that you are born that way it would make being gay easier

[cub]

Being gay has nothing to do with upbringing or personality. You sexuality makes you gay and everyone is slightly different. Whether you are attracted to white people, black people or asians is based on your sexual make up/personal desires.

My father was the dominant person in our household - not that he was aggressive; he was just the boss. He certainly wasn't absent and was there all through my upbringing. My mother worked so she wasn't a stay at home parent.

My brother is heterosexual. I am gay. Were it true than upbringing or nurture decided one's sexuality. We'd both be straight or gay.

[Jackie]

Doesn't matter if shes gay as long as shes happy.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Being gay has nothing to do with upbringing or personality. You sexuality makes you gay and everyone is slightly different. Whether you are attracted to white people, black people or asians is based on your sexual make up/personal desires.

My father was the dominant person in our household - not that he was aggressive; he was just the boss. He certainly wasn't absent and was there all through my upbringing. My mother worked so she wasn't a stay at home parent.

My brother is heterosexual. I am gay. Were it true than upbringing or nurture decided one's sexuality. We'd both be straight or gay.

we have been through this pov

the fact that 2 close siblings often have different personalities and traits is evidence enough that no 2 children have the same upbringing or relationship with their parents. Your parents relationship can change in 1 week, month, year and greatly influences who you are.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Doesn't matter if shes gay as long as shes happy.

it does matter greatly to her

[MTVN]

What, rape and paedophilia?

well, whatever the opinion of the time is doesn't matter to me really, If one participant is being forced and is not enjoying it then it's abuse.

Yeah in some parts of the world it's considered acceptable for a husband to be able to rape his wife, the same with paedophillia. It was acceptable in this country only a few hundred years ago; in Romeo and Juliet for example, Juliet is only 13 and (although noone knows for sure) Romeo is presumed to be late teens/early 20's.

Whether they're born that way I'd say that rapists are not. I'm not sure about peadophilia though.

[cub]

we have been through this pov

the fact that 2 close siblings often have different personalities and traits is evidence enough that no 2 children have the same upbringing or relationship with their parents. Your parents relationship can change in 1 week, month, year and greatly influences who you are.


I'm sorry if I've not read every post of this long thread.

However, you're just making an excuse for a flawed argument that absent father and over bearing mother makes a gay. I had neither. My brother is straight. Therefore another "Ah, but!" is raised and that conflicts with the augument.

My parents influenced me as a personality, but not my sexuality. My sexuality has nothing to do with learned behaviour or personality. Sorry.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I'm sorry if I've not read every post of this long thread.

However, you're just making an excuse for a flawed argument that absent father and over bearing mother makes a gay. I had neither. My brother is straight. Therefore another "Ah, but!" is raised and that conflicts with the augument.

I would imagine that is why I said this "Often a gay male has a dominant mother figure and a poor father relationship." and not used the word "always"

My parents influenced me as a personality, but not my sexuality. My sexuality has nothing to do with learned behaviour or personality. Sorry.

Well you would have no idea about that as you would not have been aware. As stated in this thread studies have already been done that link awakening sexuality and circumstance but never is the person aware.

[BB_Eye]

I think it's important that gay people don't fear the suggestion that upbringing is a part of their sexuality (there really is no black and white answer to this as nature and nurture are so closely intertwined). This reminds me of the time the lesbian writer Julie Bindel got a serious backlash from the gay community for daring to suggest "if we really wanted to be straight, we would be".

Personally, I think it needed to be said. There is a whole world out there of differing worldviews, personalities, aesthetic tastes and religious views (or lack thereof). Therefore, even if we had any measure of control over our sexual preference, then so what? Take ownership of it. Why so anxious to reassure the moral majority that 'okay my taste in partners might seem disgusting to you, but it's not my fault... honest'? To me, same sex partners are infinitely preferable to those of the opposite sex. That's how inclinations work. It might not be a 'choice', but I dislike that word anyway as it presupposes that old Catholic misnomer; 'free will'.

[letmein]

there is no evidence to suggest we are born with any innate sexuality. heterosexuality is what keeps us going as a species via evolution.


Yes, there is. The majority of scientists are convinced that it occurs due to certain genetic makeup. It's a mixture of genes.

Sexuality is hard wired. That's a fact, and not up for debate. Sexuality has been studied for centuries.

Homosexuality controls population growth.

Homosexuality exists throughout the entire animal kingdom. Are you saying that they learned it from somewhere?

You're incredibly ignorant. Either educate yourself with the facts, or don't bother commenting.

[letmein]

I think it's important that gay people don't fear the suggestion that upbringing is a part of their sexuality (there really is no black and white answer to this as nature and nurture are so closely intertwined). This reminds me of the time the lesbian writer Julie Bindel got a serious backlash from the gay community for daring to suggest "if we really wanted to be straight, we would be".

Personally, I think it needed to be said. There is a whole world out there of differing worldviews, personalities, aesthetic tastes and religious views (or lack thereof). Therefore, even if we had any measure of control over our sexual preference, then so what? Take ownership of it. Why so anxious to reassure the moral majority that 'okay my taste in partners might seem disgusting to you, but it's not my fault... honest'? To me, same sex partners are infinitely preferable to those of the opposite sex. That's how inclinations work. It might not be a 'choice', but I dislike that word anyway as it presupposes that old Catholic misnomer; 'free will'.

No. There is science, and then there is bigotry. It's not up for debate. People who think homosexuality is learned, and/or can be "cured", are bigots. End of discussion.

[letmein]

I'm in the minority here, I'm with LT on this one.

Most of the gay people I know have had little/poor relationships with one of their parental figures. My male friends who are bought up around predominantly female figures turned out gay and my female friend who was bought up around predominantly male figures turned out gay. This is just from my friends and I'm not saying they're a study sample. :p

Also if there was something in the genetics from birth, wouldn't scientists have found it by now?

They have. :joker:

[Grimnir]

No. There is science, and then there is bigotry. It's not up for debate. People who think homosexuality is learned, and/or can be "cured", are bigots. End of discussion.


definition of bigot

a person who is intolerant of any ideas other than his or her own
a prejudiced person who is intolerant of any opinions differing from his own
a person who constantly and stubbornly holds a particular point of view

in my opinion, you yourself sound the most bigoted person in this thread

im off to look up the definition or ironic now :xyxwave:

[Kerry]

Not read all the thread but who cares? She could be gay, straight or fecking hexagonal for all I care. Leave people to their lives.....

[Crimson Dynamo]

Not read all the thread but who cares? She could be gay, straight or fecking hexagonal for all I care. Leave people to their lives.....

It was announced to the media. Her parents make their living from media exposure. This is a forum for discussion.

do you see where i am going here?