Are white men discriminated against?

[the truth]

I cannot believe there is support for this behaviour....
Are we not living in an elightened age where intolerance is frowned upon?
I worry, we appear to be stuck firmly in reverse here ...If we allow the dark ages of forbidden love and dirty family secrets to be the way to live for same sex couples!
Children up and down the UK are crying out for loving families, how draconian to suggest that cannot nurture or provide the stability and guidence kids need!
I do not find it 'lazy' to compare them to the BNP either, this kind of influence that demonises people because of their sexual preference, is not a million miles from their views of foreigners to me.
What is happening to equality?
Has anyone actually asked the children in these cases their view?
No... It seems it is the blinkered, new right attitudes that in my opinion have no place in modern day society.


There is no equality there is only an attempt at equal opportunity...the word equality means nothing....2 equals 2 and thats about it....everyone is different, so what is equality meant to mean? The only group we are all allowed to abuse and streotype is white htrosexual men. This is because the liberal left have allowed themselves to be taken over by the militant left, who do not allow freedom of speech and try to outlaw all opinions that disagree or question theirs. This leads to foster families being destroyed because the parents vote for UKIP. the liberal left have become a bunch of radical biased hypocrites, this is why the far right and the mainstream are now so angry and polarised. Its the fault of both the militant left and the bigotted right.
Thw words Ive heard people call Christians, white hetrosexuals on here are disgusting. yet because this is a liberal majority they get away with it, but they wouldnt in the real world.

[Jesus.]

There is no equality there is only an attempt at equal opportunity...the word equality means nothing....2 equals 2 and thats about it....everyone is different, so what is equality meant to mean? The only group we are all allowed to abuse and streotype is white htrosexual men. This is because the liberal left have allowed themselves to be taken over by the militant left, who do not allow freedom of speech and try to outlaw all opinions that disagree or question theirs. This leads to foster families being destroyed because the parents vote for UKIP. the liberal left have become a bunch of radical biased hypocrites, this is why the far right and the mainstream are now so angry and polarised. Its the fault of both the militant left and the bigotted right.
Thw words Ive heard people call Christians, white hetrosexuals on here are disgusting. yet because this is a liberal majority they get away with it, but they wouldnt in the real world.


Can you please give some examples of all these nasty things people have been calling christians on this forum, please?

As a white, heterosexual (that's right ladies.....hop on), male, I can honestly say that we have been the privileged group for most of recorded history. It's about time that the balance has been redressed, somewhat. So now we have white males across the world claiming they are now victims of racism.

[the truth]

Can you please give some examples of all these nasty things people have been calling christians on this forum, please?

As a white, heterosexual (that's right ladies.....hop on), male, I can honestly say that we have been the privileged group for most of recorded history. It's about time that the balance has been redressed, somewhat. So now we have white males across the world claiming they are now victims of racism.

Two wrongs do not make a right. To redress the so called balance, by discriminating against the alleged oppressor is plain wrong. besides its the wrong target to start with. White men havent ruled the world, rich people have. As for discrimiantion, Ive read posters on here printing drivel like white men should burn etc I would also add what whiite men and women did hundreds of years ago is not the responsibility of todays white men and women. the law should be equally applied.

[Jake.]

Two wrongs do not make a right. To redress the so called balance, by discriminating against the alleged oppressor is plain wrong. besides its the wrong target to start with. White men havent ruled the world, rich people have. As for discrimiantion, Ive read posters on here printing drivel like white men should burn etc I would also add what whiite men and women did hundreds of years ago is not the responsibility of todays white men and women. the law should be equally applied.

What on earth?

[Jesus.]

Two wrongs do not make a right. To redress the so called balance, by discriminating against the alleged oppressor is plain wrong. besides its the wrong target to start with. White men havent ruled the world, rich people have. As for discrimiantion, Ive read posters on here printing drivel like white men should burn etc I would also add what whiite men and women did hundreds of years ago is not the responsibility of todays white men and women. the law should be equally applied.

You throw a lot of absurd accusations around. Maybe you should find these quotes that you claim exist, yet no one else seems to have seen. It's not about 2 wrongs making a right, it's about eeking some of the power out of the hands of white men, to help lift up the rest of the world. For one who believes in Christ, you really do seem angry all the time.

White men still hold the power today. Look at any statistics on work forces / ceo's / people in power etc. Overwhelmingly it's old, white men that dominate proceedings.

[the truth]

You throw a lot of absurd accusations around. Maybe you should find these quotes that you claim exist, yet no one else seems to have seen. It's not about 2 wrongs making a right, it's about eeking some of the power out of the hands of white men, to help lift up the rest of the world. For one who believes in Christ, you really do seem angry all the time.

White men still hold the power today. Look at any statistics on work forces / ceo's / people in power etc. Overwhelmingly it's old, white men that dominate proceedings.

Rubbish. what a dangerously oversimplified racist rewriting of 1000s of years of human history. for starters China is now probably the richest nation on earth, do you measure them all as white males? As for seeking the power out of white mens hands, a term I find racist, if you want to do it , do it legitimately not by allowing discrimination against the white man. The fact is the british built an empire due to their control of the seas and the ruthlessness of their monarchy. Its not a matter of skin colour or sexuality, its simply a matter of greed and competitive advantage. Im not remotely angry but thanks for pretending to care.

[the truth]

You throw a lot of absurd accusations around. Maybe you should find these quotes that you claim exist, yet no one else seems to have seen. It's not about 2 wrongs making a right, it's about eeking some of the power out of the hands of white men, to help lift up the rest of the world. For one who believes in Christ, you really do seem angry all the time.

White men still hold the power today. Look at any statistics on work forces / ceo's / people in power etc. Overwhelmingly it's old, white men that dominate proceedings.

how relevant is all this to allowing a man to have an opinion of gay adoption? youre off talking about how you want to take the world back from the white man? and Im being lectured for side tracking? what a joke

[Jesus.]

Rubbish. what a dangerously oversimplified racist rewriting of 1000s of years of human history. for starters China is now probably the richest nation on earth, do you measure them all as white males? As for seeking the power out of white mens hands, a term I find racist, if you want to do it , do it legitimately not by allowing discrimination against the white man. The fact is the british built an empire due to their control of the seas and the ruthlessness of their monarchy. Its not a matter of skin colour or sexuality, its simply a matter of greed and competitive advantage. Im not remotely angry but thanks for pretending to care.

Yet again, I'll ask you to explain your soundbytes. No one is discriminating against white people. It's the perception of white people who now have to compete in a global workplace, devoid of special privileges. I also said "eeking" rather than "seeking", but hey ho, I can let that slip. The USA is still the largest economy today, and will stay that way till about 2016ish.

Here's an example of what I mean, and I'll use the USA as an example.

They have just held an election for president, and throughout that time, you had rich republicans trying to suppress the vote in black areas of the country through the introduction of new voting laws, and the reduction in time allowed for voting. Why? Because black people would never vote for the extremely right wing republicans. White people are still racist, they're just cleverer about displaying it.

Watch Fox news for an hour, and see all the stereotypical code words used about black people.

[thesheriff443]

a lot of serious men talk going on here!
my world is simple leave me alone and i will leave you alone,
fcuk with me and i will do you serious damage!

[the truth]

Yet again, I'll ask you to explain your soundbytes. No one is discriminating against white people. It's the perception of white people who now have to compete in a global workplace, devoid of special privileges. I also said "eeking" rather than "seeking", but hey ho, I can let that slip. The USA is still the largest economy today, and will stay that way till about 2016ish.

Here's an example of what I mean, and I'll use the USA as an example.

They have just held an election for president, and throughout that time, you had rich republicans trying to suppress the vote in black areas of the country through the introduction of new voting laws, and the reduction in time allowed for voting. Why? Because black people would never vote for the extremely right wing republicans. White people are still racist, they're just cleverer about displaying it.

Watch Fox news for an hour, and see all the stereotypical code words used about black people.

so all white men are racist and all other people are not, because of fox news, which is a news network I utterly detest and I personaly supported Obama 100% all the way? so where does all that leave your streotyped view of me and all white men?

[Jesus.]

so all white men are racist and all other people are not, because of fox news, which is a news network I utterly detest and I personaly supported Obama 100% all the way? so where does all that leave your streotyped view of me and all white men?

I didn't say all white men are racist, did I? I am a white man, too. I also didn't say it was because of fox news. People hold their own racist views without a conservative news channel being required. My argument remains strong and valid.

[MTVN]

White men are pretty obviously the least discriminated group in this country

[the truth]

I didn't say all white men are racist, did I? I am a white man, too. I also didn't say it was because of fox news. People hold their own racist views without a conservative news channel being required. My argument remains strong and valid.

No it does it, its shallow and biased and doesnt hold to any scrutiny. Do you even know why britain ruled the waves?

[Jesus.]

No it does it, its shallow and biased and doesnt hold to any scrutiny. Do you even know why britain ruled the waves?

Seriously? You want to do history?

I'd say the enslavement of others, and the rape of resources was a fairly prevalent factor. I take no pride from our past as an empire.

[the truth]

White men are pretty obviously the least discriminated group in this country

I would say its white women who are the least discriminated against. Theres so many laws and law suits now, a woman can say virtually anything she likes to a man in this country and get away with it. The opposite is not the case. men lose their jobs their careers sometimes their families, often as a result of a biased culture that sees male humour as purely mysoginist and female humour as harmless fun. the bias is not just cultural , its enshrined in our institutions too. positive discrimination has meant men are forced to give up parliamentary seats and be outlawed from fighting to keep their seat? totally anti-democratic.

I would also add men, lose 90% of divorces, over 80% of custody cases and in over 70% they lose their homes. over 50% of homes are broken and the children often have no male role model, at home nor at school where less than 10% of primary teachers are men.......men on average work longer, yet women have far greater spending power....a factor totally ignored by the militant feminist driven mainstream media.....finally women retire at the same age, whereas for decades theyve been allowed the luxury of getting tjeir pension 5 years earlier? yet now theyve made it equal feminists still complain....In fact they should retire later as they live years longer....women have over 200 times as many outlets to help them in all areas of their lives (include cancer, health advice, shelters, advice lines etc). men die younger in every nation on earth and commit sucide at 3 to 4 times the rate in every country on earth....

so if you consider it trivial and justified rebalancing of society to see men, losing your children, your home, your worldy goods,having no right even to an opinion about aborting your unborn child, or abusing him/her with smoke and drugs, also being banned from running for parliament because youre male, killing yourself, getting no support and dying young. you call that a mans world?

[the truth]

Seriously? You want to do history?

I'd say the enslavement of others, and the rape of resources was a fairly prevalent factor. I take no pride from our past as an empire.

Neither do I. we actually agree on that. You dont think there was any enslavement and rape of resources in non white countries too?

[Black Dagger]

http://ecache.ilbe.com/files/attach/images/3740218/523/269/158/4b8340158a946b3c675f58c35a276a4c.jpg

[arista]

White men are pretty obviously the least discriminated group in this country


True.


This Thread should be Locked

[Jesus.]

Neither do I. we actually agree on that. You dont think there was any enslavement and rape of resources in non white countries too?

Well we "owned" about a fifth of the world in our peak, so I'm not sure what point you are trying to make.

[Jesus.]

True.


This Thread should be Locked

Why?

There is not a lot to debate on the site, so any opportunity should be left open.

[the truth]

Well we "owned" about a fifth of the world in our peak, so I'm not sure what point you are trying to make.

I asked you a simple question, which you ducked.

[Jesus.]

I asked you a simple question, which you ducked.

I didn't. I just don't get what you're trying to make. Ours wasn't the only Western empire, so of course non-white countries were abused. That's not even up for debate. How far do you want to go back in history?

[arista]

why

because its just you 2 poster fighting.

[Cherie]

a lot of serious men talk going on here!
my world is simple leave me alone and i will leave you alone,
fcuk with me and i will do you serious damage!

A very wise philosophy Sheriff.

[Jesus.]

why

because its just you 2 poster fighting.

Hardly fighting, Arista. It's in serious news debates, so we're seriously debating.

[Vicky.]

To be quite honest, a thread like this is long overdue. Maybe now people can discuss other issues without the topic always being somehow brought round to how badly white men are treated by society.

[Kizzy]

History aside for a moment, in The UK today there is not in my opinion discrimination towards white males.
There is however a case for positive discrimination in the workplace for ethnic minority groups, LGBT groups, women and disabled individuals.
Companies are now encouraged to, via equal opportunities, to be more represented by minority groups.
This could be seen as discrimination, it is however making sure the workforce in the UK is more representative in society.
I fail to see how women are seen to come out as benefitting more than men, almost 40 years after the Equal Pay Act it's still to be implamented in most sectors......

[the truth]

History aside for a moment, in The UK today there is not in my opinion discrimination towards white males.
There is however a case for positive discrimination in the workplace for ethnic minority groups, LGBT groups, women and disabled individuals.
Companies are now encouraged to, via equal opportunities, to be more represented by minority groups.
This could be seen as discrimination, it is however making sure the workforce in the UK is more representative in society.
I fail to see how women are seen to come out as benefitting more than men, almost 40 years after the Equal Pay Act it's still to be implamented in most sectors......

Thats because you have simply ignored all of the information that counters your opinion here. There are an infinite number of examples where women are allowed carte blanche to say anything they like about men and get away with it, whether its a sick joke or deemining or even a false accusation...men on the other hand say one say about a female lineswoman and they lose their career and their family home. thats just 1 tiny example. the major examples are in the male suicides, broken homes, the failure to educate boys, the lack of support systems for men compared to women, the loss of their homes and families and life savings in the vast majority of divorce caes, the fact men die so much younger worldwide etc Id suggest if you want any credibility you seriously consider these issues affecting men

As for your other points. Women have hijacked the positive discrimination and the assistance for minoroties from disabled people. The percentage of disabled people in work is still miniscule. disabled access is still lacking too in vast numbers of places.
I know all about disabled adaptions to vehicles as i take wheelchair bound customers in my buses etc The charge for these people is a national disgrace. webbing alone to clamp down wheelchairs properly can run to £1500 then electric tail lifts instaled can run to £3000 thats just the start. its a massive racket. I have enormous sympathy for these disabled people, they are a real true minority who not only suffer real discrimination unlike the make believe stuff many of these women complain about. they receive verbal and physical bullying and suffer emotional and physical problems plus financial difficulties as they often cant find work. they truly have a huge cross to bare

[Kizzy]

Thats because you have simply ignored all of the information that counters your opinion here. There are an infinite number of examples where women are allowed carte blanche to say anything they like about men and get away with it, whether its a sick joke or deemining or even a false accusation...men on the other hand say one say about a female lineswoman and they lose their career and their family home. thats just 1 tiny example. the major examples are in the male suicides, broken homes, the failure to educate boys, the lack of support systems for men compared to women, the loss of their homes and families and life savings in the vast majority of divorce caes, the fact men die so much younger worldwide etc Id suggest if you want any credibility you seriously consider these issues affecting men

As for your other points. Women have hijacked the positive discrimination and the assistance for minoroties from disabled people. The percentage of disabled people in work is still miniscule. disabled access is still lacking too in vast numbers of places.
I know all about disabled adaptions to vehicles as i take wheelchair bound customers in my buses etc The charge for these people is a national disgrace. webbing alone to clamp down wheelchairs properly can run to £1500 then electric tail lifts instaled can run to £3000 thats just the start. its a massive racket. I have enormous sympathy for these disabled people, they are a real true minority who not only suffer real discrimination unlike the make believe stuff many of these women complain about. they receive verbal and physical bullying and suffer emotional and physical problems plus financial difficulties as they often cant find work. they truly have a huge cross to bare

I ignored nothing...I gave my opinion on this topic is all.
If you don't like it that is your issue not mine.
I do not agree women are allowed to ride roughshod over men as you seem to be implying, and I would have said boys have exactly the same rights to education as girls.
It is frustrating that there are fewer job opportunities for the disabled, maybe if Mr Cameron had not scaled down remploy and the ATOS assement

[Mystic Mock]

White men are pretty obviously the least discriminated group in this country

It still can happen though.

[Munchkins]

You discriminate against women, and portray us all as evil, backstabbing people :rolleyes:
White men are not discriminated against, well they can be but i have not seen many cases of it

[Redway]

Black people were an opressed minority for years (and in some ways still are) and white people have by far been the most privileged and the race that have discriminated the most, not the other way around. Now come a few decades down the line, when there's more hope for minority groups, and you're all up in open arms.

Give me a break. :bored:

[Redway]

It still can happen though.

Well, you're right, it can ... but white men are the most racist, sexist group of people on the planet. I'm not saying that all white men are like that - I'm sure that the vast majority aren't, certainly here - but I see no reason for white people to moan about being discriminated against when they do most of it.

[Samuel.]

TG4f9zR5yzY

[MeMyselfAndI]

Don't men on average get paid more than women for the exact same job? sometimes by over £10,000 a year? I saw that on the news or something

[Munchkins]

Don't men on average get paid more than women for the exact same job? sometimes by over £10,000 a year? I saw that on the news or something

The_Truth will probably reply saying no thats false, and women get paid more for being sluts and showing their bodies to employers, he's such a woman hater, his threads all end the same..

[Suze]

Skin colour and discrimination of any sort really should not be an issue with people at all, especially in this day and age when you expect people to have moved forward from such stuff, and it is sad that it still is an issue with some.

[Mystic Mock]

Well, you're right, it can ... but white men are the most racist, sexist group of people on the planet. I'm not saying that all white men are like that - I'm sure that the vast majority aren't, certainly here - but I see no reason for white people to moan about being discriminated against when they do most of it.

I agree with this, I'm just saying though that alot of ethnic criminals can have it in for white people in general, especially the women more than anything though so I do think The Truth's argument is a bit invalid but I do see where his coming from that not all white men are racists pigs.

[Kizzy]

Right... Is this thread about sexism or racism?... :confused:

[the truth]

You discriminate against women, and portray us all as evil, backstabbing people :rolleyes:
White men are not discriminated against, well they can be but i have not seen many cases of it

Lies.

[the truth]

Black people were an opressed minority for years (and in some ways still are) and white people have by far been the most privileged and the race that have discriminated the most, not the other way around. Now come a few decades down the line, when there's more hope for minority groups, and you're all up in open arms.

Give me a break. :bored:

I have more sympathy for black people and disabled, as both have hugelylegitimate complaints for being discriminated against in the UK, women have none.

[BBfanUSA]

As long as they're not being racist themselves. Karma should bite them on the arse. I think it's wrong and a bit of a double standard if they're on the receiving end.

I don't think they're being discriminated in America. A example of this is American Idol. It's been a White Guy winner for the last 5 years.

[the truth]

I ignored nothing...I gave my opinion on this topic is all.
If you don't like it that is your issue not mine.
I do not agree women are allowed to ride roughshod over men as you seem to be implying, and I would have said boys have exactly the same rights to education as girls.
It is frustrating that there are fewer job opportunities for the disabled, maybe if Mr Cameron had not scaled down remploy and the ATOS assement

Its been proved that education and primary and junior levels massively favours girls, especially as 90% are female teachers and the gap grows every year. The boys have less and less chance and we end up with enormous problems with young men , many of whom lack the basics of being able to read and write propelry, let alone a decent education.

Then we wonder why we have millions of angry young men who cant find work and we see drug use, alcohol abuse, violence and suicide sky rocket in young men, who kill themselves at 4 times the rate of women (A factor no one on here has the integroty to address). we then ignore this massive problem ruthlessly, we patronize these young men and tell them its a male problem all this suicide because men dont talk enough? well guess what? theres no institutions and support networks in place to listen to them and help them as there are for women. so what else do we do? recruit the poor and the uneducated boys for another futile war just as we have always done. dont worry boys youll come back depressed maybe lose a limb and suffering mental health problems for life. we will ignore you and keep every military hospital closed. mans world , what a sick joke.

[the truth]

As long as they're not being racist themselves. Karma should bite them on the arse. I think it's wrong and a bit of a double standard if they're on the receiving end.

I don't think they're being discriminated in America. A example of this is American Idol. It's been a White Guy winner for the last 5 years.

american idol winner? :conf: who cares?

[the truth]

History aside for a moment, in The UK today there is not in my opinion discrimination towards white males.
There is however a case for positive discrimination in the workplace for ethnic minority groups, LGBT groups, women and disabled individuals.
Companies are now encouraged to, via equal opportunities, to be more represented by minority groups.
This could be seen as discrimination, it is however making sure the workforce in the UK is more representative in society.
I fail to see how women are seen to come out as benefitting more than men, almost 40 years after the Equal Pay Act it's still to be implamented in most sectors......

the only reason they falsely claim men get paid more is by working out the career averages over a lifetime, where men overall will work for longer and more hours and due to this reason alone will end up rogressing slightly further on pay scales. there is barely any evidence of anyone illegally paying a man more for the identical work as a woman. in cases where it happens the law is there to protect them. however in truth, most jobs pay varies according to the quality of work produced as well as its reliability and how much profit it makes companies. Theres certain work women simply barley do at all...how many women plumbers, engineers, electricians, even basic jobs like gardening or paining and decorating or garden clearances? If women want to start these businesses I suggest they quit complaining and get off their backsides lose the chip on both shoulders and do it, like the rest of the entrepreneurs out there.

[Kizzy]

I have more sympathy for black people and disabled, as both have hugelylegitimate complaints for being discriminated against in the UK, women have none.

Really? thats in my opinion quite a discriminatory statement...
Especially considerating the wage comparisons.
For whatever reason women head a large percentage of households in the UK.
I have huge sympathy for these women attempting to raise families so disadvantaged by un- enforced wage laws.

[the truth]

Really? thats in my opinion quite a discriminatory statement...
Especially considerating the wage comparisons.
For whatever reason women head a large percentage of households in the UK.
I have huge sympathy for these women attempting to raise families so disadvantaged by un- enforced wage laws.

Ive already addressed your last point which is nonsense. how can you enforce wages laws on performance related pay/ commission jobs? You cant its up to how good the person is, how reliable the person is and also how dedictaed to the career they are long term. also have you studied why women are more likely to job hop and dont last in jobs on average as long as men? this doesnt offer employers much chance and costs them money to retrain people endlessly. why should employers keep spending thousands of their own money because female employees are on average less reliable? is this discrimination? no its fact, do your homework. stop preaching theory and look at the reality

If women get pregnant often to milk benefits, its up to them and the fathers to take care of those children. woman are luckythough as they know they can always fall back on a lifetime of benefits whilst getting Csa payments too. no wonder they have all the spending power and so little ambition

now while you pretend to be offended and pretend something Ive said is sexist which it isnt and whilst you continue to cruelly ignore all the male sufferings and suicides. Id ask you, how often has a women fixed your electricity in a power cut? how often has a women fixed your gas leak? how often has a women safed you or any of your friends and relatives from a burning building or cut you out of a car? how man women do you know who lost limbs in wars? how many women do you know who fix roads and tarmac them>? how many women do you know who build your walls, fix your roof, build your home? while youre thinking of a clever answer to avoid the question, Ill save you time, the answer is probably not far from zero

[Kizzy]

Its been proved that education and primary and junior levels massively favours girls, especially as 90% are female teachers and the gap grows every year. The boys have less and less chance and we end up with enormous problems with young men , many of whom lack the basics of being able to read and write propelry, let alone a decent education.

Then we wonder why we have millions of angry young men who cant find work and we see drug use, alcohol abuse, violence and suicide sky rocket in young men, who kill themselves at 4 times the rate of women (A factor no one on here has the integroty to address). we then ignore this massive problem ruthlessly, we patronize these young men and tell them its a male problem all this suicide because men dont talk enough? well guess what? theres no institutions and support networks in place to listen to them and help them as there are for women. so what else do we do? recruit the poor and the uneducated boys for another futile war just as we have always done. dont worry boys youll come back depressed maybe lose a limb and suffering mental health problems for life. we will ignore you and keep every military hospital closed. mans world , what a sick joke.

Firstly, can I say If you have proof that one gender is favoured over another you post
a link to this?
I have no idea why more young men choose not to go into teaching as there are no incentives for women over men as far as I know and they would be welcomed as positive male role models in some areas....
Socialization may have a part to play in why girls do better in schools than boys?
Peer pressure I would say plays a big part in that in inner city areas.
Children are now to stay at school or college till 18, they are encouraged much more now than ever before.
And having the 'integrity' to mention suicide rates of young men it is not right or fair to suggest that by not raising this members are ignorant to the plight of men affected...
There is a lot of help and information for men who are depressed due to many personal, social or mental issues.

[Kizzy]

the only reason they falsely claim men get paid more is by working out the career averages over a lifetime, where men overall will work for longer and more hours and due to this reason alone will end up rogressing slightly further on pay scales. there is barely any evidence of anyone illegally paying a man more for the identical work as a woman. in cases where it happens the law is there to protect them. however in truth, most jobs pay varies according to the quality of work produced as well as its reliability and how much profit it makes companies. Theres certain work women simply barley do at all...how many women plumbers, engineers, electricians, even basic jobs like gardening or paining and decorating or garden clearances? If women want to start these businesses I suggest they quit complaining and get off their backsides lose the chip on both shoulders and do it, like the rest of the entrepreneurs out there.

That is wrong, there is cases of council workers in yorkshire being found to be paid less.
I am not able to post links atm, but I assure you there is evidence of discrimination there.
There are traditionally male dominated professions... I don't understand what that has to do with this discussion?
However, the women in these jobs are as qualified as males in their professions obviously.

[Vanessa]

They are in my workplace. Most of my co workers are from India/Sri Lanka/Pakistan and they hate anyone who isn't from there.

[Kizzy]

Ive already addressed your last point which is nonsense. how can you enforce wages laws on performance related pay/ commission jobs? You cant its up to how good the person is, how reliable the person is and also how dedictaed to the career they are long term. also have you studied why women are more likely to job hop and dont last in jobs on average as long as men? this doesnt offer employers much chance and costs them money to retrain people endlessly. why should employers keep spending thousands of their own money because female employees are on average less reliable? is this discrimination? no its fact, do your homework. stop preaching theory and look at the reality

If women get pregnant often to milk benefits, its up to them and the fathers to take care of those children. woman are luckythough as they know they can always fall back on a lifetime of benefits whilst getting Csa payments too. no wonder they have all the spending power and so little ambition

now while you pretend to be offended and pretend something Ive said is sexist which it isnt and whilst you continue to cruelly ignore all the male sufferings and suicides. Id ask you, how often has a women fixed your electricity in a power cut? how often has a women fixed your gas leak? how often has a women safed you or any of your friends and relatives from a burning building or cut you out of a car? how man women do you know who lost limbs in wars? how many women do you know who fix roads and tarmac them>? how many women do you know who build your walls, fix your roof, build your home? while youre thinking of a clever answer to avoid the question, Ill save you time, the answer is probably not far from zero

Well... here we have the crux of the problem, where I have tried to answer you with reasoned responses.
This post seems to be nothing but an attack on women in general..
I am not offended, if thats your view then theres really nothing else to discuss is there?

[the truth]

Well... here we have the crux of the problem, where I have tried to answer you with reasoned responses.
This post seems to be nothing but an attack on women in general..
I am not offended, if thats your view then theres really nothing else to discuss is there?

I can back things up with practical examples and actual evidence, you clearly cannot

[Ammi]

..I don't really want to get into this thread too much..but there is just one thing I want to say with regards to education and males in the teaching profession....

..I've worked in education for many years...and on the whole, and certainly in my experience...boys get far more extra support and guidance than girls....the support is given where it is most needed and not to do with gender....

..and there are very few male teachers in primary schools...primary schools are not usually the career path of males...in all of the vacancies ever advertised in my school or any of the neighbouring schools..I could say that we've probably only ever had around 1 or 2% of male applicants...it is actually quite hard to move up from a primary school to a middle or upper school and that's the same for females as well....but of the very few applicants we have had....most of them have been offered to job first....but that's because they've been the right people and not because of gender....I wish there were more male primary school teachers, because they are a great asset...but unfortunately, it doesn't seem to be where they think their future career lies..and they have to do what's best for them...

[Kizzy]

I can back things up with practical examples and actual evidence, you clearly cannot

I asked you to post the actual evidence you said you had to back up your previous comments.
This thread was not intended as an attack on me or my opinions was it?
I have given my views, if you don't agree with them fine...

[Redway]

I agree with this, I'm just saying though that alot of ethnic criminals can have it in for white people in general, especially the women more than anything though so I do think The Truth's argument is a bit invalid but I do see where his coming from that not all white men are racists pigs.

I agree with this. What I hate about black people is how homophobic and hypocritical they are and you're right that they make ridiculous comments about white people and gays...I'm not saying that all blacks are like that but I agree that it's a bit biased to have a go at white people when other ethnic groups are probably just as bad. Yes, not all black people are like that but a large proportion are, at the very minimum just as much as whites.

Edit - and don't even get me started on the "it's just cuz am black" thing. :bored:

[Vicky.]

Actually thinking about it it is quite rare to see a male primary school teacher. However senior schools seem dominated by men, our school most certainly was, there was about 30 male teachers and 5 female. I wonder why that is.

[Kizzy]

Are you suggesting that in both ethnic groups there are people that are stupid and ignorant redway?....interesting....

[Redway]

Are you suggesting that in both ethnic groups there are people that are stupid and ignorant redway?....interesting....

Of course. Dickheads exist in every shape, size and form so why limit it to just white people when all races have absolute morons? :p

[the truth]

Firstly, can I say If you have proof that one gender is favoured over another you post
a link to this?
I have no idea why more young men choose not to go into teaching as there are no incentives for women over men as far as I know and they would be welcomed as positive male role models in some areas....
Socialization may have a part to play in why girls do better in schools than boys?
Peer pressure I would say plays a big part in that in inner city areas.
Children are now to stay at school or college till 18, they are encouraged much more now than ever before.
And having the 'integrity' to mention suicide rates of young men it is not right or fair to suggest that by not raising this members are ignorant to the plight of men affected...
There is a lot of help and information for men who are depressed due to many personal, social or mental issues.


can you prvide back up for all your claims here and throughout this thread? There is very little support and help for males in any of these situations. Clearly in male dominated profressions we have seen years of peer pressure and legislation brought in to redress the balance. yet not with teaching of children? are you in favour of positive discrimination or quota systems so only men can apply for certain teaching positions?

as regards the fact men work long longer and achieve more in a vast number of career paths, there are a lot of reasons, sadly this hasnt been studied properly because the analysis has been hujacked by the hysteria of the millitant feminists. straight honest truth and facts need to be addressed.

the fact is the overall male wage is higher than women over the whole nation because overall men have worked longer and harder in far more career areas. the solution according to feminists is to denigrade all men for this. wrong. the only solution is for women to become better and to work harder and yes to try and allow them an opportunity to share their paternal duties. this has been damaged as the family courts are so biased towards mothers, they in effect close out fathers. the end result, everyone loses, the fathers, the children, the grandparents and the mother herself....this is the problem that grows when the culture and the law is biased towards one sex. the law must be fair , balanced and blind to gender

[the truth]

That is wrong, there is cases of council workers in yorkshire being found to be paid less.
I am not able to post links atm, but I assure you there is evidence of discrimination there.
There are traditionally male dominated professions... I don't understand what that has to do with this discussion?
However, the women in these jobs are as qualified as males in their professions obviously.

If that is true , they have the law on their side and can fight to get compensation, end of.

No doubt there are cases where women are paid more than men, yet this type of story is not part of the militant feminist agenda.

[Mystic Mock]

I agree with this. What I hate about black people is how homophobic and hypocritical they are and you're right that they make ridiculous comments about white people and gays...I'm not saying that all blacks are like that but I agree that it's a bit biased to have a go at white people when other ethnic groups are probably just as bad. Yes, not all black people are like that but a large proportion are, at the very minimum just as much as whites.

Edit - and don't even get me started on the "it's just cuz am black" thing. :bored:

I definitely agree with the bit in bold in particular, how they think The Police (who have alot of black Police Officers now) will arrest them because of the colour of there skin is quite ridiculous, if anyone gets arrested then there must be evidence.

[the truth]

I definitely agree with the bit in bold in particular, how they think The Police (who have alot of black Police Officers now) will arrest them because of the colour of there skin is quite ridiculous, if anyone gets arrested then there must be evidence.

there is a larger proportion of black people stopped and searched than white.
however the police are so frustrated as the law is clearly biased in favour of black people. if any word is said and is deemed racist agisnt a black person, the white person is destroyed. butwhat of the abuse against the white man? didnt jermaine jackson call some white people white trash on big brother? nothing was said. take shilpa gate, whilst I agree she was bullied , so too was dirk benedict. he was mocked fo rhaving cancer, having impotence through cancer, moced for being a former alcoholic, yet nothing was ever said...the bias in law and in culture makes the policeman/woman even more frustrated and angry

[Mystic Mock]

Now I agree with everything you've said there The Truth, I do think some people can blindly ignore when a black or asian person can be racist but when it's a white person being racist they get attacked.

If people weren't so scared of arresting black and asian people for hate crimes (like when the 3 muslim girls beat up the white girl and called her a white slag) then we probably could stop racism more, but the law is hopeless at stopping murderers, rapists, and paedophiles so this country will never be sorting out prejudice anytime soon until the 3 main crimes get better sentencing.

[the truth]

Now I agree with everything you've said there The Truth, I do think some people can blindly ignore when a black or asian person can be racist but when it's a white person being racist they get attacked.

If people weren't so scared of arresting black and asian people for hate crimes (like when the 3 muslim girls beat up the white girl and called her a white slag) then we probably could stop racism more, but the law is hopeless at stopping murderers, rapists, and paedophiles so this country will never be sorting out prejudice anytime soon until the 3 main crimes get better sentencing.

Well sometimes we agree, I just say it as I see it. there is also a bias in law in favour of women over men. so overall the white man gets it in the neck every time.

[Mystic Mock]

I'm not up on all the stats but I always find that if anything bad happens to a white girl (or any girl for that matter but especially white girls) the criminal always seems to get off in this country for the most ridiculous of reasons.

But I do feel that when any man get's sexually assaulted The Police and the civilians of the UK should take it more seriously than they do, myself included as when True Blood touched on the subject and I laughed at it then I realised that it really happens and that I'm glad True Blood highlighted it in a way, although they also treated it like a laughing matter which is shocking even for that show.

[the truth]

I'm not up on all the stats but I always find that if anything bad happens to a white girl (or any girl for that matter but especially white girls) the criminal always seems to get off in this country for the most ridiculous of reasons.

But I do feel that when any man get's sexually assaulted The Police and the civilians of the UK should take it more seriously than they do, myself included as when True Blood touched on the subject and I laughed at it then I realised that it really happens and that I'm glad True Blood highlighted it in a way, although they also treated it like a laughing matter which is shocking even for that show.

take luis suarez v patrice evra
everyone called suarez a racist , he got banned for months and nearly forced to leave the UK
yet evra also abused him and called him slave names , words suarez considered racist, yet his claim wasnt even taken seriously.
the whole culture is hysterical and biased now.
what of the false accusation by the chelsea player against the ref? he didnt even hear it, a brazillian black player who doesnt even speak english, said he heard the ref call the mikkel player monkey, in fact he called him mikkell....mikell then went berserk and allegedly started making threats in the referees room? all the white ref gets is his reputation destroyed and phenomenal stress for weeks. but not even an apology afterwardds

[Mystic Mock]

I don't know what Evra said so I can't comment.

And I agree about what Mikel's done to Clattenburg's career, even Clattenburg has been cleared from saying the word there will always be doubts in peoples minds about did he say it or not? a shame though as I just think Chelsea made a scapegoat out of him because of what happened with John Terry.

[Ammi]

Actually thinking about it it is quite rare to see a male primary school teacher. However senior schools seem dominated by men, our school most certainly was, there was about 30 male teachers and 5 female. I wonder why that is.

..because it's the best route to think ahead and further their career Vicky...it's actually very difficult to step up from a primary school...and males just don't apply.. we've only got one male teacher..but actually he's a brilliant teacher...the children absolutely adore him....it is a shame there aren't more...

[AnnieK]

..because it's the best route to think ahead and further their career Vicky...it's actually very difficult to step up from a primary school...and males just don't apply.. we've only got one male teacher..but actually he's a brilliant teacher...the children absolutely adore him....it is a shame there aren't more...

We only had one male teacher at primary school too and we all loved him. There was always one male and they tended to only stay a year...and then we'd get another man. The government have been trying to get more guys to apply to primary though so don't think it's descrimination, I just think guys prefer to work with high school children from the reports I have read on it.

[Kizzy]

can you prvide back up for all your claims here and throughout this thread? There is very little support and help for males in any of these situations. Clearly in male dominated profressions we have seen years of peer pressure and legislation brought in to redress the balance. yet not with teaching of children? are you in favour of positive discrimination or quota systems so only men can apply for certain teaching positions?

as regards the fact men work long longer and achieve more in a vast number of career paths, there are a lot of reasons, sadly this hasnt been studied properly because the analysis has been hujacked by the hysteria of the millitant feminists. straight honest truth and facts need to be addressed.

the fact is the overall male wage is higher than women over the whole nation because overall men have worked longer and harder in far more career areas. the solution according to feminists is to denigrade all men for this. wrong. the only solution is for women to become better and to work harder and yes to try and allow them an opportunity to share their paternal duties. this has been damaged as the family courts are so biased towards mothers, they in effect close out fathers. the end result, everyone loses, the fathers, the children, the grandparents and the mother herself....this is the problem that grows when the culture and the law is biased towards one sex. the law must be fair , balanced and blind to gender

I cannot post links as you know,
firstly, there was a government initiative announced recently, with I think it was 2mill of funding to aid men at risk of suicide.
Theres a thread mentioning it somewhere...I even think you commented in it.
secondly, I do agree with positive discrimination for men in primary schools, as annie touched on, there were news reports that in certain areas it was found that men were under represented.
Boys need positive role models and men were encouraged to teach at primary level.
What is putting men off..... accusations of abuse maybe?
Thirdly, What 'studies' were hijacked?...
If the outcome of a study is not attractive to you to suggest it is biased is wrong.
If two men applied for the same position,same hours, same duties and responsibilities you would expect them to be paid equally?
Why you have a hard time accepting women are as capable as men I have no idea, of course there are sectors that men are disproportionate to women and visa-versa.
lastly, I would say there does need to be an overhaul of the family courts.
When couples who are unmarried split it is very difficult for the dad to get access and this is wrong.
They emphasis is placed on getting money from the father rather maintaining contact with the children.
Unless there is a domestic violence issue then contact should be the main concern.

[Jesus.]

there is a larger proportion of black people stopped and searched than white.
however the police are so frustrated as the law is clearly biased in favour of black people. if any word is said and is deemed racist agisnt a black person, the white person is destroyed. butwhat of the abuse against the white man? didnt jermaine jackson call some white people white trash on big brother? nothing was said. take shilpa gate, whilst I agree she was bullied , so too was dirk benedict. he was mocked fo rhaving cancer, having impotence through cancer, moced for being a former alcoholic, yet nothing was ever said...the bias in law and in culture makes the policeman/woman even more frustrated and angry

Completely agree. I'm fed up with black people in this country having it so good with the criminal justice system. Coming over 'ere, nicking our justice.

I pine for the good old days when black people were systematically abused and demeaned by the police force that supposedly represents all of the citizens on this island.

[Kizzy]

I do think the police are terrified of any bad press, that has gone some way to explaining why the abuses discovered in Rochdale were allowed to fester as long as they were.
There are people hammering home the message that most sexual abuse cases are by white males, however when you consider that the men involved in these cases are in an ethnic minority group who account for only 8% of the population, then the proportionality shows that there is a problem.

[Munchkins]

I would say that Asian men have the stigma of being accused of being paedophiles/rapists not white men

[Munchkins]

Lies.

Nope. on all your threads you also try to make it a woman hating thread.

[Jesus.]

I do think the police are terrified of any bad press, that has gone some way to explaining why the abuses discovered in Rochdale were allowed to fester as long as they were.
There are people hammering home the message that most sexual abuse cases are by white males, however when you consider that the men involved in these cases are in an ethnic minority group who account for only 8% of the population, then the proportionality shows that there is a problem.

Mohammed married Aisha aged 6, and had sex with her when she was 9, and he was 54. When this man is your moral guide, then one thing follows the other.

[Munchkins]

Mohammed married Aisha aged 6, and had sex with her when she was 9, and he was 54. When this man is your moral guide, then one thing follows the other.

Oh my god... i studied Islam as part of my RS GCSE, and i knew she was a lot younger but not that much

[Jesus.]

Oh my god... i studied Islam as part of my RS GCSE, and i knew she was a lot younger but not that much

It's not really spoken about publicly, so we can avoid having a discussion about the things Mohammed actually did in his life. She was his friends daughter, and his friend wasn't keen, but Mohammed used his power to talk him in to it.

That's the final messenger from god, right there.

That's why the age of consent has been so low in many Muslim countries - although this is now being addressed bit by bit. In Yemen, for a long time, the age of consent was 9.

[Munchkins]

It's not really spoken about publicly, so we can avoid having a discussion about the things Mohammed actually did in his life. She was his friends daughter, and his friend wasn't keen, but Mohammed used his power to talk him in to it.

That's the final messenger from god, right there.

That's why the age of consent has been so low in many Muslim countries - although this is now being addressed bit by bit. In Yemen, for a long time, the age of consent was 9.

Just awful..
I did really well in RS GCSE but we never got told that
and omg the age of consent in Yemen is STILL 9? :shocked:

[Vicky.]

It's not really spoken about publicly, so we can avoid having a discussion about the things Mohammed actually did in his life. She was his friends daughter, and his friend wasn't keen, but Mohammed used his power to talk him in to it.

That's the final messenger from god, right there.

That's why the age of consent has been so low in many Muslim countries - although this is now being addressed bit by bit. In Yemen, for a long time, the age of consent was 9.

That is absolutely disgusting.

[Jesus.]

They've increased it now, so it is no longer 9. But it was for many years. All based on the example set by the so-called prophet.

[Kizzy]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-20409229
The report noted that unless a perpetrator has actually been arrested, it is difficult to be sure of their ethnicity. However, analysis of the reported ethnicity of more than 1,500 alleged perpetrators showed that about a third were white, the largest ethnic group.

"The reality is that each year thousands of children in England are raped and abused by people seeking to humiliate, violate and control them," said Ms Berelowitz.

"These have included children who have been abducted, trafficked, beaten and threatened after being drawn into a web of sexual violence by promises of love and others who have suffered in silence for years as they are casually and routinely raped by the boys in their neighbourhoods."

Andrew Flanagan, chief executive of the NSPCC, said: "Sex offenders come from all backgrounds but if there is a problem with one community in a particular areas we must be bold enough to address it and not just turn a blind eye.
Omah posted this info a couple of weeks ago, but it has relevance here.

[Redway]

I definitely agree with the bit in bold in particular, how they think The Police (who have alot of black Police Officers now) will arrest them because of the colour of there skin is quite ridiculous, if anyone gets arrested then there must be evidence.

Now I agree with everything you've said there The Truth, I do think some people can blindly ignore when a black or asian person can be racist but when it's a white person being racist they get attacked.

If people weren't so scared of arresting black and asian people for hate crimes (like when the 3 muslim girls beat up the white girl and called her a white slag) then we probably could stop racism more, but the law is hopeless at stopping murderers, rapists, and paedophiles so this country will never be sorting out prejudice anytime soon until the 3 main crimes get better sentencing.

And you can't even say anything about it without being accused of being a racist.

[Kizzy]

And you can't even say anything about it without being accused of being a racist.

Well people are saying things about it now....
After the police were branded 'institutionally racist' they were naturally hesitant to be seen as the bearer of bad news.......
suck it up!
this is our doing.

[the truth]

Dare I say it Im glad Im a follower of Christianity and not islam or Judaism as theyre way more hard line.

[Redway]

Are you seriously suggesting that Christianity isn't as bad? The same religion that asks for gays to be stoned, and women to shut up in church, etc?

[Livia]

Everyone discriminates and everyone is discriminated against in one way or another.

[Brother Leon]

Mohammed married Aisha aged 6, and had sex with her when she was 9, and he was 54. When this man is your moral guide, then one thing follows the other.

You do realise life was alot difference back then to now,right? Situations similar to this were common even in England too.

It's also ridiculous to assume a small minority of Asian men who do this is due to what you stated.

It's not really spoken about publicly, so we can avoid having a discussion about the things Mohammed actually did in his life.

It's used as a smear campaign all the time...

[the truth]

Are you seriously suggesting that Christianity isn't as bad? The same religion that asks for gays to be stoned, and women to shut up in church, etc?

1) thats a lie and 2) yes Christianity is fantastic and infinitely more enlightened than these other religions imho and more enlightened than most posters on here.

[Kizzy]

Thats what I don't like about religion, the attitudes of those who abide these dilutions of ancient texts, most of which I would suggest bear no resemblance to the original documents.
This inflated sense of entitlement, assumed authority, and ultimately superiority over others is what christianity has come to mean to me.
Over the years it has been used as a tool of social control using indoctrination to specific 'sects' for want of a better word.
Each with their own unique set of provisos, prejudices, and punishments.
Far and away from any resemblance of spirituality or enlightenment.
Christians are as guilty as any other faith of fundamentalism.
I have my god given free will, and I don't like the abuses of power by those who assume elevated status due to their position in the christian churches of every denomination.
Well.... I think thats all I have to say about that. :)

[thesheriff443]

Everyone discriminates and everyone is discriminated against in one way or another.

this all the way!

[Redway]

1) thats a lie and 2) yes Christianity is fantastic and infinitely more enlightened than these other religions imho and more enlightened than most posters on here.

No, it's not. Go and check out the Bible yourself. I cba posting links right now but you know exactly what I mean.

[the truth]

Thats what I don't like about religion, the attitudes of those who abide these dilutions of ancient texts, most of which I would suggest bear no resemblance to the original documents.
This inflated sense of entitlement, assumed authority, and ultimately superiority over others is what christianity has come to mean to me.
Over the years it has been used as a tool of social control using indoctrination to specific 'sects' for want of a better word.
Each with their own unique set of provisos, prejudices, and punishments.
Far and away from any resemblance of spirituality or enlightenment.
Christians are as guilty as any other faith of fundamentalism.
I have my god given free will, and I don't like the abuses of power by those who assume elevated status due to their position in the christian churches of every denomination.
Well.... I think thats all I have to say about that. :)

absolute rubbish, as usual you twist and exagerrate the opinions of religions.

This site over liberal military left wing site is far more fundamental, hundreds of thousands of abortions, all mothers should smoke during pregnancy, hetrosexual men must burn, etc

as for Christians, theyre not fundamentalists and certainly not as radical as the muslims and the Jews in their beliefs. But when Christians come on to sites like this and show they are more flexible and not fundamentalsts, the radical liberals hate that too. they say its either 100% believe and live by every word of the Bble or nothing. Its the militant left who show no compromise or flexibility. They are the fundamentalists.

[the truth]

No, it's not. Go and check out the Bible yourself. I cba posting links right now but you know exactly what I mean.

You go and check it. Youre lying plain and simple. Show me where jesus said stone gays?

[InOne]

Hmmmm, starting to think thetruth is another personality of LT/President/Gavin

[the truth]

Hmmmm, starting to think thetruth is another personality of LT/President/Gavin

as usual ignore the smessage and attack the messenger. typical militant left.

[Kizzy]

absolute rubbish, as usual you twist and exagerrate the opinions of religions.

This site over liberal military left wing site is far more fundamental, hundreds of thousands of abortions, all mothers should smoke during pregnancy, hetrosexual men must burn, etc

as for Christians, theyre not fundamentalists and certainly not as radical as the muslims and the Jews in their beliefs. But when Christians come on to sites like this and show they are more flexible and not fundamentalsts, the radical liberals hate that too. they say its either 100% believe and live by every word of the Bble or nothing. Its the militant left who show no compromise or flexibility. They are the fundamentalists.

Those were my views.. not those of the site.
My personal opinion, I may not follow a faith but that does not mean I do not have spiritual beliefs.
Do you understand how you just proved my point?
You attacked me in an offensive post suggesting i'm a radical, militant and a fundamental for daring to disagree with you.
Is that right, fair or a christian thing to do?
What happened to turning the other cheek?...
What I find most ridiculous is your insistance that my post suggests I hate men, heterosexuals and all christians are fundamentals...
To be fair you have not given me anything in your above post to show me you are flexible in your approach to the thoughts and feelings of others in all honesty.

[Jesus.]

You do realise life was alot difference back then to now,right? Situations similar to this were common even in England too.

It's also ridiculous to assume a small minority of Asian men who do this is due to what you stated.



It's used as a smear campaign all the time...

Point 1 - Life may have been different, but this is a so-called prophet who supposedly had an angel Gabriel iphone with god on speed dial. If you're saying that the morality of humanity has changed to frown upon these things over time, then we are in agreement. What I find difficult to believe, is that you seem to be excusing his behaviour in the context of the time period. Either he was a prophet who should know better, or he's a power crazy peedophile. He can't be both.

I didn't say they did it because of the Aisha, I just gave context for it to happen. When their prophet is a child molester, who Muslims believe was the final messenger from God, and his actions in life (through the hadiths) are just as important as the Koran, then he can't be bound to the norms of that period in history.

If he was talking and receiving messages from god, why didn't the big man upstairs tell him "Oi, Mohammed, no marrying 6 year old girls, and ****ing them when they are 9.

I can be repulsed by the whole thing and see it for what it is. I don't have to try and play historical gymnastics to try and excuse the behaviour of men supposedly inspired by the creator of the universe.

Rather than worrying about the smear, maybe you'd care to counter it with a point other than, they were all paedo's back then?

[the truth]

Those were my views.. not those of the site.
My personal opinion, I may not follow a faith but that does not mean I do not have spiritual beliefs.
Do you understand how you just proved my point?
You attacked me in an offensive post suggesting i'm a radical, militant and a fundamental for daring to disagree with you.
Is that right, fair or a christian thing to do?
What happened to turning the other cheek?...
What I find most ridiculous is your insistance that my post suggests I hate men, heterosexuals and all christians are fundamentals...
To be fair you have not given me anything in your above post to show me you are flexible in your approach to the thoughts and feelings of others in all honesty.

try reading some of my other posts then. I didnt say you were radical militant either, youre precious ego is taking it way too personally. i was speaking of the general culture on this radical militant left wing site. I dont water it all down to pacify the left wing. I say what I believe. You shouldnt take offence.

[the truth]

Point 1 - Life may have been different, but this is a so-called prophet who supposedly had an angel Gabriel iphone with god on speed dial. If you're saying that the morality of humanity has changed to frown upon these things over time, then we are in agreement. What I find difficult to believe, is that you seem to be excusing his behaviour in the context of the time period. Either he was a prophet who should know better, or he's a power crazy peedophile. He can't be both.

I didn't say they did it because of the Aisha, I just gave context for it to happen. When their prophet is a child molester, who Muslims believe was the final messenger from God, and his actions in life (through the hadiths) are just as important as the Koran, then he can't be bound to the norms of that period in history.

If he was talking and receiving messages from god, why didn't the big man upstairs tell him "Oi, Mohammed, no marrying 6 year old girls, and ****ing them when they are 9.

I can be repulsed by the whole thing and see it for what it is. I don't have to try and play historical gymnastics to try and excuse the behaviour of men supposedly inspired by the creator of the universe.

Rather than worrying about the smear, maybe you'd care to counter it with a point other than, they were all paedo's back then?

is there a reason why you continue to smear Christianity and Islam, yet appear to support Judaism?

[Jesus.]

is there a reason why you continue to smear Christianity and Islam, yet appear to support Judaism?

I don't support Judaism. It's just developed into more of a secular presence in every day life. Christianity and Islam want to have a say in the public sphere.

I'm an anti-theist. I don't believe any of it is true, and I'm glad it's not. I favour religions that are happy to keep themselves to themselves and aren't continually looking to grow.

When was the last time you saw a bunch of Jews out in the city centre trying to convert people? You don[t, and you never would. Religion in private, and staying out of the public debate is fine with me. Religion that wants to shape our public policy on abortion or anything else, is not OK with me.

[Jesus.]

try reading some of my other posts then. I didnt say you were radical militant either, youre precious ego is taking it way too personally. i was speaking of the general culture on this radical militant left wing site. I dont water it all down to pacify the left wing. I say what I believe. You shouldnt take offence.

If there was a post of the week, I would nominate this.

Radical militant left wing site? I'd probably put myself about the furthest left, or certainly close to it, but how do you explain people like Arista or Joeysteele etc, that are complete Tories?

Anyway, I'll be in the communism section of the site if you want to find me.

Dasvidaniya comrade.

[Kizzy]

try reading some of my other posts then. I didnt say you were radical militant either, youre precious ego is taking it way too personally. i was speaking of the general culture on this radical militant left wing site. I dont water it all down to pacify the left wing. I say what I believe. You shouldnt take offence.

You don't feel your guilty of taking things personally?
you are allowed to have your say, but everyone else has a radical militant left wing agenda?...
I'm not offended don't worry.

[Redway]

is there a reason why you continue to smear Christianity and Islam, yet appear to support Judaism?
The vast majority of Jews are lovely people and don't try and convert everyone. You wonder why most Christians and Muslims can't be more like the Jews, Hindus, Sikhs, who don't try and force religion on others.

[MTVN]

The vast majority of Jews are lovely people and don't try and convert everyone. You wonder why most Christians and Muslims can't be more like the Jews, Hindus, Sikhs, who don't try and force religion on others.

That's not true at all, are you not familiar with the actions of Ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel?

Judaism is no more free of fanatics and extremists than Christianity and Islam are

[Redway]

That's not true at all, are you not familiar with the actions of Ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel?

Judaism is no more free of fanatics and extremists than Christianity and Islam are
That may be true, but Jews don't try and convert us, do they? At least not as much as the other religions I stated.

[Mystic Mock]

Christians and Muslims are really bad for trying to force other people into there beliefs, they are the two religions aswell that have caused a load of trouble these past 10 to 15 years with terrorist acts aswell because they are so insane about there beliefs that if nobody fits the bill they would bomb them.

[MTVN]

Sure some Jews will try and convert people, the ultra-Orthodox ones like I mentioned are very strong in trying to force their beliefs onto others, obviously in this country there's a small Jewish population and a much larger Christian one so you're more likely to have a Christian accost you, it might be a different story if you lived in Israel

[MTVN]

Although I can say I've never had someone of any religion try and convert me, the overwhelming majority of religious people whether Christian, Muslim, Jewish etc. will respect your beliefs

[Redway]

Christians and Muslims are really bad for trying to force other people into there beliefs, they are the two religions aswell that have caused a load of trouble these past 10 to 15 years with terrorist acts aswell because they are so insane about there beliefs that if nobody fits the bill they would bomb them.

I tend to agree but it's only a very small minority of Muslims who are actually terrorists. Putting aside your own personal thoughts on the religion, those extremists are the ones who use religion to somehow alleviate and justify their stupidity.

[Mystic Mock]

Although I can say I've never had someone of any religion try and convert me, the overwhelming majority of religious people whether Christian, Muslim, Jewish etc. will respect your beliefs

I know that but it's the radicals that don't help these religions, I just have my own beliefs I don't really believe in any type of religion though as they all have stuff in them that make no sense to me, like Adam & Eve having two Sons and no Daughter, if that is true then are we all related to one another then? I would like to hope not as it's just wrong.

[Redway]

Although I can say I've never had someone of any religion try and convert me, the overwhelming majority of religious people whether Christian, Muslim, Jewish etc. will respect your beliefs

I wish I was you lol. Walking around Toxteth there are always people handing you leaflets on coming to Church and the mosque lol.

[Mystic Mock]

I tend to agree but it's only a very small minority of Muslims who are actually terrorists. Putting aside your own personal thoughts on the religion, those extremists are the ones who use religion to somehow alleviate and justify their stupidity.

I know, but I always find that the radicals are really high up in these religions so it doesn't make them look good.

[Livia]

Sure some Jews will try and convert people, the ultra-Orthodox ones like I mentioned are very strong in trying to force their beliefs onto others, obviously in this country there's a small Jewish population and a much larger Christian one so you're more likely to have a Christian accost you, it might be a different story if you lived in Israel

Jews welcome converts, but do not recruit converts.

Of course, I can't speak for the nuttier sects.

[Marsh.]

The vast majority of Jews are lovely people and don't try and convert everyone. You wonder why most Christians and Muslims can't be more like the Jews, Hindus, Sikhs, who don't try and force religion on others.

Ridiculous generalisation.

You can't speak for the "majority" of any religion or group of people.

It's like saying all Liverpudlians are thieves, unsubstantiated hyperbole. You get crackpots everywhere, religious or not.

[Redway]

Ridiculous generalisation.

You can't speak for the "majority" of any religion or group of people.

It's like saying all Liverpudlians are thieves, unsubstantiated hyperbole. You get crackpots everywhere, religious or not.

I know but I'm on about the ones I've come across.

[InOne]

I know but I'm on about the ones I've come across.

Do you live in the 'Little Israel' area of Liverpool?

[Redway]

No, I actually live in Anfield (not too far from the stadium) but I do have friends I visit down there. Used to live not too far from it though (the Dingle).

[the truth]

Its nonsense comparism. there are 2 billion Christians and only a few million Jews so gues swhat there will be more Christians who you bump into and maybe try to persuade you to their views. however Christians are nowhere near as hardline as muslims in general and Jews to a lesser extend. Though the Jewish approach in Israel is totally hard line and saldy doomed to failiure.

[the truth]

Ridiculous generalisation.

You can't speak for the "majority" of any religion or group of people.

It's like saying all Liverpudlians are thieves, unsubstantiated hyperbole. You get crackpots everywhere, religious or not.

100% agree with that. I would add Christians do laugh at themselves and do take criticism better than other religions such as Islam. they did a show on bbc jerry springer the opera, portraying Christ as an alcoholoic incontinent and Joseph as a paedophile. yes people polutely complained by letter but the show went on. they did a show criticizing Mohammad on stage and the muslims burnt the place down. Jews do have great humour but again the hardliners are too quick to accuse some of anti-semitism, sometimes its too the detriment of healthy debate imho

[Marsh.]

I know but I'm on about the ones I've come across.

Well I find it difficult to believe you've come across and spent enough time with people from all these different religious groups to come to the conclusion you did.

Either way, you should refrain from using phrases like "vast majority" when it's nowhere near the case.

[Redway]

Fair enough.

[Kizzy]

I tend to agree but it's only a very small minority of Muslims who are actually terrorists. Putting aside your own personal thoughts on the religion, those extremists are the ones who use religion to somehow alleviate and justify their stupidity.

Only a small amount of muslims are terrorists?....
Thats good to know... Is this state the bleeding obvious day? :)
Those who are indoctrinated into extremist muslim fundamentalism are in a sense groomed into hating the west.
It's not stupid to them then is it?
They see us as the enemy.

[Marsh.]

Is this state the bleeding obvious day? :)


:laugh:

[the truth]

Only a small amount of muslims are terrorists?....
Thats good to know... Is this state the bleeding obvious day? :)
Those who are indoctrinated into extremist muslim fundamentalism are in a sense groomed into hating the west.
It's not stupid to them then is it?
They see us as the enemy.

the rise in the radicals is purely the fault of corrupt war mongering politicians and the corrupt war wongering media moguls theyve empowered to spread the hate and promote and finance the wars. as you say its a small minority who are war mongers in all religions yet it is these radicals who seem to haev huge control and get most attention. theyre a dreadful example to younger people and a menace to all society....I say lets grab back religions for the silent moderate majority who are more inclined to preach love and peace.

[Kizzy]

the rise in the radicals is purely the fault of corrupt war mongering politicians and the corrupt war wongering media moguls theyve empowered to spread the hate and promote and finance the wars. as you say its a small minority who are war mongers in all religions yet it is these radicals who seem to haev huge control and get most attention. theyre a dreadful example to younger people and a menace to all society....I say lets grab back religions for the silent moderate majority who are more inclined to preach love and peace.

When you fly planes into buildings it attracts a lot of attention though...

[the truth]

When you fly planes into buildings it attracts a lot of attention though...

It sure does, then again so does an illegal invasion of Iraq, the decades of exploitationin the middle east, the illegal occupation of Palestine, then theres cambodia , east timor , hiroshima, vietnam oh and the 60 odd poor nations america has bombed in the past 60 years

[Kazanne]

there is a larger proportion of black people stopped and searched than white.
however the police are so frustrated as the law is clearly biased in favour of black people. if any word is said and is deemed racist agisnt a black person, the white person is destroyed. butwhat of the abuse against the white man? didnt jermaine jackson call some white people white trash on big brother? nothing was said. take shilpa gate, whilst I agree she was bullied , so too was dirk benedict. he was mocked fo rhaving cancer, having impotence through cancer, moced for being a former alcoholic, yet nothing was ever said...the bias in law and in culture makes the policeman/woman even more frustrated and angry

Jermain did not actually call her 'white trash' he said "She is what THEY call white trash" by they ,I presume he meant the Brits.

[Jesus.]

It sure does, then again so does an illegal invasion of Iraq, the decades of exploitationin the middle east, the illegal occupation of Palestine, then theres cambodia , east timor , hiroshima, vietnam oh and the 60 odd poor nations america has bombed in the past 60 years

The most Christian country on the planet, no less.

[Jesus.]

the rise in the radicals is purely the fault of corrupt war mongering politicians and the corrupt war wongering media moguls theyve empowered to spread the hate and promote and finance the wars. as you say its a small minority who are war mongers in all religions yet it is these radicals who seem to haev huge control and get most attention. theyre a dreadful example to younger people and a menace to all society....I say lets grab back religions for the silent moderate majority who are more inclined to preach love and peace.

Not true. It's all about the dogma. You could never get a Jainist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jainism) to bomb an abortion hospital, or fly a plan into a building.

Unless there is validation in the scriptures (which there are with the Abrahamic monotheisms), then there is no where for religious extremists to hide.

The scriptures of of Judaism/Christianity/Islam are appalling documents, written by ignorant people before we knew any better.

[Kizzy]

Oh lets just cut to the chase... the truth is white, heterosexual and christian. The thread is called 'are white men discriminated against?'
It's just a guess but maybe he feels he personally is discriminated against or feels in some way persecuted...
Well, what is it the truth?

[the truth]

Not true. It's all about the dogma. You could never get a Jainist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jainism) to bomb an abortion hospital, or fly a plan into a building.

Unless there is validation in the scriptures (which there are with the Abrahamic monotheisms), then there is no where for religious extremists to hide.

The scriptures of of Judaism/Christianity/Islam are appalling documents, written by ignorant people before we knew any better.

You were praising Judaism a few days ago, how pitifully fickle. ps stop preaching hypocrite

[Redway]

You were praising Judaism a few days ago, how pitifully fickle. ps stop preaching hypocrite

I believe he said that he doesn't believe in Judaism but that they don't demand as much of a public say as Christianity and Islam. How's that praising the religion? By pointing out its merits and shortcomings? Do you actually bother reading people's posts or have a quick look and proceed to post your semi-literate bollocks?

[the truth]

The most Christian country on the planet, no less.

wow so you admit the UK is the most Christian country on the planet? Or are you saying we brits didnt play any part? The radicals in ameria have hijacked Christianity just as the fundamentalists in the middle east and Israel have hijacked their religions.

The fact is this has been accelerated by war mongering news stations, corrupt corporations and corrupt media moguls who have bought off politicians to stoke up endless war and supply all sides wepaonry whilst pilfering the natural resources of these nations. Its nothing to do with religion or the fantastic preaching of jesus about love truth, tolerance, empathy , compassion etc things you seem to detest. These wars are purely to do with greed, corruption, exploitation by the wealthiest over the poorest. They will try and use anything as a wepaon, not just guns and bombs, but news stations, newspapers, false propoganda and they will corrupt religion and enable and empower the crazy violent radicals. meanwhile good men do too little and the evil spreads.

[the truth]

I believe he said that he doesn't believe in Judaism but that they don't demand as much of a public say as Christianity and Islam. How's that praising the religion? By pointing out its merits and shortcomings? Do you actually bother reading people's posts or have a quick look and proceed to post your semi-literate bollocks?

Thats not what he said, do you really think hes so weka he needs you to back him up? meanwhile you also lied about the teachings of Christ and failed 100% to prove your lies.

[Redway]

Thats not what he said, do you really think hes so weka he needs you to back him up? meanwhile you also lied about the teachings of Christ and failed 100% to prove your lies.

"If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

"You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination."

"Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God."

"For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error. And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper."

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/gay/long.htm
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Leviticus+20%3A13&version=KJV

"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law."

http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/14-34.htm

:)

[the truth]

"If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

"You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination."

"Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God."

"For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error. And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper."

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/gay/long.htm
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Leviticus+20%3A13&version=KJV

"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law."

http://bible.cc/1_corinthians/14-34.htm

:)

Not the words of jesus!

[Livia]

Jesus said that he upholds the Torah and the Laws of Moses.

[Redway]

Not the words of jesus!

Are you seriously suggesting that Christianity isn't as bad? The same religion that asks for gays to be stoned, and women to shut up in church, etc?

No mention of Jesus in my post so I don't see where you're getting that from. I see you're avoiding all of my post, only picking on trivial matters. Care to explain why your book pretty much upholds the same views as all other religious books - including Judaism - without spouting the usual: "it wasn't from jesus!" crap - totally avoiding my entire post? Or are you just going to nit-pick and state things that bear absolutely no correlation or contextual relation with the argument - considering I never once mentioned Jesus?

[the truth]

No mention of Jesus in my post so I don't see where you're getting that from. I see you're avoiding all of my post, only picking on trivial matters. Care to explain why your book pretty much upholds the same views as all other religious books - including Judaism - without spouting the usual: "it wasn't from jesus!" crap - totally avoiding my entire post? Or are you just going to nit-pick and state things that bear absolutely no correlation or contextual relation with the argument - considering I never once mentioned Jesus?

Greetings liar. You lied previously in claiming jesus wanted to stone gays. a 100% lie, which if you had any integrity at all you would apologize for and withdraw. you will of course fail to do either. maybe youll decide instead to hurl more verbal abuse at me? that would be really impressive.

[Jesus.]

You were praising Judaism a few days ago, how pitifully fickle. ps stop preaching hypocrite

You really should engage your brain before your fingers. What I actually said, was that Judaism isn't as bad as Christianity and Islam. Hardly praise. It's like being the skinniest kid in fat camp as far as I'm concerned. I also feel that Judaism, because of the age of it, has been through many reformations, and has become more secular on the whole.

There is absolutely no hypocrisy in my words, just an intentional desire on your part to see what you wish to see.

[Jesus.]

wow so you admit the UK is the most Christian country on the planet? Or are you saying we brits didnt play any part? The radicals in ameria have hijacked Christianity just as the fundamentalists in the middle east and Israel have hijacked their religions.

The fact is this has been accelerated by war mongering news stations, corrupt corporations and corrupt media moguls who have bought off politicians to stoke up endless war and supply all sides wepaonry whilst pilfering the natural resources of these nations. Its nothing to do with religion or the fantastic preaching of jesus about love truth, tolerance, empathy , compassion etc things you seem to detest. These wars are purely to do with greed, corruption, exploitation by the wealthiest over the poorest. They will try and use anything as a wepaon, not just guns and bombs, but news stations, newspapers, false propoganda and they will corrupt religion and enable and empower the crazy violent radicals. meanwhile good men do too little and the evil spreads.

No - I was on about America. America is the most Christian country in the world. I didn't see George Bush offering his other cheek on 9/11. Like I've said before. You'll struggle to find a Christian that is actually Christ-like.

Jesus wasn't the first to preach about compassion, love, and empathy. I have no issues with the philosophies of Jesus. They were just neither special, or new.

[the truth]

You really should engage your brain before your fingers. What I actually said, was that Judaism isn't as bad as Christianity and Islam. Hardly praise. It's like being the skinniest kid in fat camp as far as I'm concerned. I also feel that Judaism, because of the age of it, has been through many reformations, and has become more secular on the whole.

There is absolutely no hypocrisy in my words, just an intentional desire on your part to see what you wish to see.

Judaism is more secular? Tell that to the palestinians. Are the 611 commandments more secular? Is the decision by Israel to ignore the democratic vote in the united nations by 138 nations to 9 , to give Palestine statehood? Isnt this what Israel asked for? a 2 state solution? the moment it gets closer to reality, they build more illegal settlements, steal more land and declare it as a deliberate act of revenge against the united nations democratic vote? tell us whats so secular about all this?

[the truth]

No - I was on about America. America is the most Christian country in the world. I didn't see George Bush offering his other cheek on 9/11. Like I've said before. You'll struggle to find a Christian that is actually Christ-like.

Jesus wasn't the first to preach about compassion, love, and empathy. I have no issues with the philosophies of Jesus. They were just neither special, or new.

George w bush is a nutter. The fact he is a war womngering nutjob doesnt in any way diminish the great teachings of jesus. Bush was merely a man who corrupted Jesus teachings for hiw own purpose. the saddest part of all is how americans allowed him to get to power and how we brits empored him even more in his illegal wars.

As for Christ, ok so we are agreed jesus us awesome , have a thanks. as for whether his teachings were special or new? well put it this way, he was still more enlightened than anyone else on the planet 2000 years later. And he is still celebrated and loved by 2 billlion Christians and even atheists admire and respect him. How many will be remembering your words and mine in 2 years , let alone 2000? very few.

[Nedusa]

Now this thread has turned into a religious discussion as well.. This seems to be catching as a pattern is developing in recent threads...!!

[Redway]

Greetings liar. You lied previously in claiming jesus wanted to stone gays. a 100% lie, which if you had any integrity at all you would apologize for and withdraw. you will of course fail to do either. maybe youll decide instead to hurl more verbal abuse at me? that would be really impressive.
I didn't even say Jesus and maybe the Bible doesn't talk about stoning gays but nothing to say for the Bible ordering for gays to be put to death? Nothing to say for the Bible calling it an abomination or anything? Nothing to say for women being ordered to be quiet in church?

And actually, the truth, you're right. I'm not going to apologise for daring to say a bad word against your precious Jesus and wacky religion.

[the truth]

I didn't even say Jesus and maybe the Bible doesn't talk about stoning gays but nothing to say for the Bible ordering for gays to be put to death? Nothing to say for the Bible calling it an abomination or anything? Nothing to say for women being ordered to be quiet in church?

And actually, the truth, you're right. I'm not going to apologise for daring to say a bad word against your precious Jesus and wacky religion.

You're lying again, you said jesus wanted to stone gays, I accept youre a liar, but failing to acknowledge your own lies is just pathetic.
Shame on you for that, but I still forgive you!

[Redway]

You're lying again, you said jesus wanted to stone gays, I accept youre a liar, but failing to acknowledge your own lies is just pathetic.
Shame on you for that, but I still forgive you!

Where did I say that? Because I believe I was referring to the Bible, not Jesus.

[the truth]

Where did I say that? Because I believe I was referring to the Bible, not Jesus.

Look back at your posts, Im not doing it for you

[Redway]

Look back at your posts, Im not doing it for you

Oh I have done that sir, which is why I'm asking you.

I said: "Are you seriously suggesting that Christianity isn't as bad? The same religion that asks for gays to be stoned, and women to shut up in church, etc?"

Regardless of whatever bastard it came out of from the Bible, it's there in black and white that the Bible has extremely homophobic tendencies.

[the truth]

Oh I have done that sir, which is why I'm asking you.

I said: "Are you seriously suggesting that Christianity isn't as bad? The same religion that asks for gays to be stoned, and women to shut up in church, etc?"

Regardless of whatever bastard it came out of from the Bible, it's there in black and white that the Bible has extremely homophobic tendencies.

No you havent, otherewise you would have found it already. Unless of course youve deleted it. Youre lying again.

[the truth]

Oh I have done that sir, which is why I'm asking you.

I said: "Are you seriously suggesting that Christianity isn't as bad? The same religion that asks for gays to be stoned, and women to shut up in church, etc?"

Regardless of whatever bastard it came out of from the Bible, it's there in black and white that the Bible has extremely homophobic tendencies.

regardless of whatever bastard? 1) you respond to other peoples opinions by verbally abusing them 2) you dont differnetiate between different people, you label everyone as the same bastard. total prejudice, total hypocrisy.

[Iceman]

-was gonna come in and post some eminem lyrics from cleanin out my closet, but read last few pages-

-leaves-

[Redway]

Why can't you answer a straight ****ing question? I've had a look at my post history and I didn't see anything about Jesus. I gave you a reply to back up my views on the Bible and then you brought up the whole Jesus debate.

As I said before, even if it didn't come from Jesus, the Bible still said it. Fact. End of discussion. Don't try and make Judaism seem the greater of the two evils when Christianity is (as the very minimum) just as sexist and homophobic. That is ... unless you classify your holy book commanding for gays to be put to death to be loving and accepting - which totally counteracts your crap argument?

[the truth]

Why can't you answer a straight ****ing question? I've had a look at my post history and I didn't see anything about Jesus. I gave you a reply to back up my views on the Bible and then you brought up the whole Jesus debate.

As I said before, even if it didn't come from Jesus, the Bible still said it. Fact. End of discussion. Don't try and make Judaism seem the greater of the two evils when Christianity is (as the very minimum) just as sexist and homophobic. That is ... unless you classify your holy book commanding for gays to be put to death to be loving and accepting - which totally counteracts your crap argument?

yet more foul abuse. I suggest you wind your neck in and learn to speak to people without the abuse. You really need to learn to deal with your bigotry and anger. Your argument is to be abusive to anyone who holds a different opinion and to castigate all Biblical characters as bastards. Its really embarassing. You also slander jesus by saying he wants to stone gays, a total lie. A lie you have failed to retract, shameful. But I still forgive you.

[Redway]

regardless of whatever bastard? 1) you respond to other peoples opinions by verbally abusing them 2) you dont differnetiate between different people, you label everyone as the same bastard. total prejudice, total hypocrisy.

I didn't verbally abuse you. I just pointed out the sheer stupidity of Christianity (and religion in general) - not you. Just your religion and your hypocrisy by having a go at Judaism whilst Christianity has the exact same shortcomings and, as Livia excellently put, Jesus upholds the teachings of the Torah and all?

And, no, I don't care who said what. Bottom line is it came from your book, not the Torah or the Qu'ran - the Bible. I see you are yet to reply to 95% of my post and carry on nit-picking at trivial matters.

[Redway]

yet more foul abuse. I suggest you wind your neck in and learn to speak to people without the abuse. You really need to learn to deal with your bigotry and anger. Your argument is to be abusive to anyone who holds a different opinion and to castigate all Biblical characters as bastards. Its really embarassing. You also slander jesus by saying he wants to stone gays, a total lie. A lie you have failed to retract, shameful. But I still forgive you.

For the last time, I don't see anywhere where I mentioned anything about Jesus calling for gays to be stoned. How many more times do I have to repeat myself?

And, yeah, I classify anyone with bigoted and homophobic views to be a total bastard, so, yeah, all these Biblical figures are total tools in my eyes.