Gender neutral parenting - thoughts?

[Jack_]

Gender-Neutral or Wishful Thinking?
May 30, 2011
By Ulli K. Ryder

Can we raise gender-neutral children? A Toronto couple is attempting to do just that. Kathy Witterick and David Stocker have decided to allow their third child, Storm, to decide which gender he or she identifies with. This has caused some confusion. It is a basic impulse for people to approach the parents of babies and ask “So, is it a boy or girl?” It is very unusual for the parents to reply, as this couple does, “We’ve decided not to share Storm’s sex for now…” Many people applaud their decision and support the belief – gender equality – underlying the decision. A Facebook page has been created in support of the family. On the other hand, many people have expressed outrage over their decision and believe withholding this information is akin to child abuse. One man is so upset that he has created a Facebook page in opposition to this couple and has threatened to report them to child abuse investigators. At this time, the support page has twice as many “friends” as the opposition page.

Scholars have demonstrated that gender, like race, is socially constructed. While there are biological differences between males and females (such as their sex organs), the meaning of gender is a social construction. The values placed on males or females are dependent upon a number of factors which change over time. For example, we once thought that education would ruin women for wifehood and motherhood. Some scholars went so far as to suggest that women’s wombs would shrink if they exercised their brains. This was, in the end, proven false and exposed as just another way to keep women ignorant and subservient to men.

This Toronto couple are not the first to try to raise a gender-neutral child. The Discovery Health website lists gender-neutral parenting as one of its Top 10 Radical Parenting Methods and suggests that there is “movement” made up of like-minded parents who wish to circumvent traditional gender constructions by altering their parenting methods. Such parents eschew the usual pink or blue color scheme for nurseries; give toy trucks and baby dolls to both male and female children; and refuse to disclose the biological sex of their offspring. The problem is that we do not live in a gender-neutral world.

These parents readily admit that their biologically male children often prefer toy trucks and footballs and that feminine-acting males face bullying and teasing when they start school. We still expect females to be more nurturing and males to be tough and strong. Just as knowing that race is social construction does not immediately dismantle racism in our society, knowing that gender is a social construction does not eliminate sexism. But it does raise important questions about how children are socialized: How do baby boys and baby girls (who, as far as we know, do not think about their gender any more than they think about race) learn to be women and men? While parents may try to raise children in gender-neutral ways, is this really possible and do gender dynamics exist within families that have not been addressed? What happens when the children start to interact with others who have not been raised in gender-neutral households? What is the effect of the media or the school system on children’s gender identity? We do know that gender is not simply biology. We know that interactions, within and outside the home, forge gender (and other) identities. How can these couples shield their children from the sexism and gendered expectations that pervade every segment of our society?

The coverage of the Toronto couple, and parents like them, exposes biases within our media (and perhaps within ourselves). Articles about this couple are quick to point out that baby Storm was born “in a pool of water at home” and that his mother was attended by midwives. In addition, they disclose that Witterick home-schools her children (Storm has 2 older brothers) and that even her home-schooling does not conform to traditional home-schooling methods. In short, Storm’s parents – particularly his mother – are discussed in the press as if they are kooks. The truth is that home-birth is not a weird thing. Until the advent of modern medicine almost all babies were born at home. Home births are on the rise in the US – increasing 20% between 2004-2008. Even water births – while still not common – are becoming increasingly popular, are available in some hospitals and are often covered by insurance if done at home. Finally, home-schooling has become a viable alternative to over-crowded, underfunded schools and is not the fringe movement it once was. In 2007, 1.7 million children were home-schooled and researchers believe that number has continued to grow.

It is unlikely that Witterick and Stocker will be able to keep Storm’s gender undisclosed forever. He or she will begin to exhibit gender-identifying traits as part of the normal process of getting older. Hormones will cause Storm’s face and body to change; his or her gender identity will no longer be shielded by the androgyny of babyhood. Although Storm will likely be homeschooled like his or her siblings, Witterick and Stocker will not be able to keep this child away from all media or social interactions with others who will make assumptions and have expectations based on their own beliefs about gender roles.

Gender-neutral parenting may have limitations and, so far, it has not drastically altered gender relationships in society at large. But by raising children without gender assumptions, these parents may be working towards dismantling traditional gender roles. Their children, and those with whom they come into contact, will at the very least be forced to consider how and why they hold certain views of gender. Just as we have constructed gender over time, gender-neutral parenting may be part of deconstructing it in the future.

Source (http://thefeministwire.com/2011/05/gender-neutral-or-wishful-thinking)

I find it quite a fascinating and liberating idea.

[Apple202]

obvs a boy if it's called Storm

[InOne]

A very hard thing to get my head around. Don't think I'll ever see stuff like that as normal.

[Kizzy]

How to mess your kids mind up in easy stages.... pffft!

I saw a docu on this it was redic.

[Smithy]

obvs a boy if it's called Storm

Xmen storm was a girl :shrug:

[Vicky.]

How to mess your kids mind up in easy stages.... pffft!


Yeah...I try to be openminded about stuff..but this was my first thought when I read the OP :/

[Kizzy]

Yeah...I try to be openminded about stuff..but this was my first thought when I read the OP :/

And the poor kid has two older brothers... I would say this is some problem of the mothers, I think she had her heart set on a girl and if she doesn't tell anyone that storm is a boy she can carry on the delusion.

[Ninastar]

I don't think it's fair in this day and age. Not for the kid anyway

[Marsh.]

But that's just stupid.

Doesn't make any sense and confuses children right from the start.

You are either a boy or a girl. Whether you grow up to wish you were the other gender is another matter entirely.

[MTVN]

Umm no I think it's best to raise the child as their biological sex, bringing them up as "gender neutral" would be an unnecessarily confusing and probably traumatic experience for the kid and hinder their chance to enjoy their childhood

[Jack_]

And the poor kid has two older brothers... I would say this is some problem of the mothers, I think she had her heart set on a girl and if she doesn't tell anyone that storm is a boy she can carry on the delusion.

Yeah, this is one case. I only used that article because it was the best one I found. Let's try and refrain from lumping all parents that carry this out into a particular assumption-based category.

This is quite good a piece that dispels some qualms people have with the idea - 5 Myths About Gender Neutral Parenting (http://everydayfeminism.com/2013/01/gender-neutral-parenting-myths/)

It's about liberating the child and enabling them to make their own choices and decide how they wish to live their life from as early an age as possible. By raising them in an environment free from stereotypes, they are not forced into living a particular way, adhering to certain gender norms and behaviours or liking particular things...they are free. I accept that this opens the doors for bullies to take advantage - but that's an argument that is regularly applied to gay adoption - the point is, the movement has to start somewhere, the only way the world will become as liberal as possible is by progressive moments pushing boundaries. Eventually, the more people that hop on the bandwagon, the more it is normalised and as such, the possibility of issues like bullying is completely eradicated.

There are evidently issues that need to be addressed, but I think that it's an interesting idea all the same. It doesn't need to be as radical as the article in the OP, like refusing to tell people the sex of the child. It can simply be dressing the child in non blue and pink clothes, and buying them both Action Man and Barbie dolls. I don't really see an issue with that - it's ridiculous to just prolong this ongoing circle of 'boys must dress in blue and like football' and 'girls must love pink and be compassionate one'. That in itself leads to as many problems as gender neutral parenting does.

[Marsh.]

Yeah, this is one case. I only used that article because it was the best one I found. Let's try and refrain from lumping all parents that carry this out into a particular assumption-based category.

This is quite good a piece that dispels some qualms people have with the idea - 5 Myths About Gender Neutral Parenting (http://everydayfeminism.com/2013/01/gender-neutral-parenting-myths/)

It's about liberating the child and enabling them to make their own choices and decide how they wish to live their life from as early an age as possible.

Kizzy was only commenting on that one mother, as she mentioned the older siblings.

It's not allowing a child to make their own choice. You're born the way you are.

If you're born with white skin, you're white. If you're born a girl, you're a girl. There is no choice.

If you decide later in life to change genders that's fair enough but it doesn't change the actual fact that you were born one specific gender. Confusing children from the start is basically telling them from the beginning "You're not going to like how you were born".

[Ninastar]

Honestly there's not much gender stereo typing that goes on anymore. Not in the UK anyway. Boys can play with dolls and dress up in dresses if they want to at the nursery I work at. Hell I think a lot of the time they like it more than the girls :D same goes for girls though, they play with cars and dirt and all the 'boy' stereotypes too.

[Jack_]

Kizzy was only commenting on that one mother, as she mentioned the older siblings.

It's not allowing a child to make their own choice. You're born the way you are.

If you're born with white skin, you're white. If you're born a girl, you're a girl. There is no choice.

You do understand that there is a difference between sex and gender though, don't you? Sex is the biological fact and gender is the social construct.

Then again I recall you making transphobic comments in the past so perhaps you're not the best person to discuss this issue with.

[InOne]

Yeah, this is one case. I only used that article because it was the best one I found. Let's try and refrain from lumping all parents that carry this out into a particular assumption-based category.

This is quite good a piece that dispels some qualms people have with the idea - 5 Myths About Gender Neutral Parenting (http://everydayfeminism.com/2013/01/gender-neutral-parenting-myths/)

It's about liberating the child and enabling them to make their own choices and decide how they wish to live their life from as early an age as possible. By raising them in an environment free from stereotypes, they are not forced into living a particular way, adhering to certain gender norms and behaviours or liking particular things...they are free. I accept that this opens the doors for bullies to take advantage - but that's an argument that is regularly applied to gay adoption - the point is, the movement has to start somewhere, the only way the world will become as liberal as possible is by progressive moments pushing boundaries. Eventually, the more people that hop on the bandwagon, the more it is normalised and as such, the possibility of issues like bullying is completely eradicated.

There are evidently issues that need to be addressed, but I think that it's an interesting idea all the same. It doesn't need to be as radical as the article in the OP, like refusing to tell people the sex of the child. It can simply be dressing the child in non blue and pink clothes, and buying them both Action Man and Barbie dolls. I don't really see an issue with that - it's ridiculous to just prolong this ongoing circle of 'boys must dress in blue and like football' and 'girls must love pink and be compassionate one'. That in itself leads to as many problems as gender neutral parenting does.

The thing is, kids become their own people anyway. It just seems a bit over the top to go that far. They will obviously gravitate towards what other boys/girls do because when they make friends trends will pop up and what not. Society will have the most impact, the parents can only do so much. It's almost like you're creating problems that aren't there.

[lostalex]

I'd just try to expose my children to as much as possible, despite gender stereotypes, and encourage them in the things they took an interest in. I don't know if that's the same thing as trying to be "gender neutral", but that would be my philosophy as a parent.

I saw an interesting article the other day about 2 tribes in Africa, one where the men traditionally grow their hair in long dreadlocks and color them red with mud, and the women traditionally shave their heads. And another tribe in Africa is the exact oppossite, the women grow the long dred locks, and the men traditionally shave their heads.

It's just about tradition really. There is nothing that is inherently masculine or inherently feminine.

[Marsh.]

Then again I recall you making transphobic comments in the past so perhaps you're not the best person to discuss this issue with.

Did I? Link to it.

What qualifies you as someone able to discuss it? Bring it on a public forum and we can all discuss it.

I'm not against transsexuals, I just think if people are free to explore then they find their own way.

This type of thing is like immediately instilling ideas in their head and confusion as opposed to allowing them to figure out for themselves.

I liken it to a mother who bought her 13 year old a voucher to get a boob job when she's 18. Immediately telling your child "You won't be happy with your boobs, you'll want to change your body" before they've even fully developed physically and mentally.

[swinearefine]

I completely agree with gender-neutral parenting, and I have arguments with my family on the regular about how my nieces are being raised and what sexist bastards they and everyone except for me is in general. At the same time I think it's pretty douchey to make it a point to not say the sex of your child... doing that kind of highlights gender... just ignore gender stereotypes and raise the kid to be open-minded.

[Marsh.]

^^^ Yeah, I agree with not forcing your son to take up footie just because he's a boy or not automatically thinking your daughter will like all things fluffy and pink but making it an actual point to not do things is another extreme.

Just leave them be.

[Vicky.]

^^^ Yeah, I agree with not forcing your son to take up footie just because he's a boy or not automatically thinking your daughter will like all things fluffy and pink but making it an actual point to not do things is another extreme.

Just leave them be.

Yup. Agreed.

I didnt think people still did things like that tbh anyway (forcing boys to play football, expecting all girls to like barbie..that kinda thing)

[Jack_]

The thing is, kids become their own people anyway. It just seems a bit over the top to go that far. They will obviously gravitate towards what other boys/girls do because when they make friends trends will pop up and what not. Society will have the most impact, the parents can only do so much. It's almost like you're creating problems that aren't there.

Of course society has the most impact, that's the point of it, to kill these predetermined gender roles that everybody is just automatically meant to sign up to. But there are problems with this, people that fall outside of the gender binary and wish not to identify themselves as one particular gender face all sorts of psychological issues.

These two blogs explain the distinction between sex and gender that people must first comprehend before they can fully understand gender neutral parenting. I would really recommend everyone reading these, they explain it very well and articulate it better that I'll be be able to in this topic.

http://genderbinary.wikidot.com/living-loving-without-labels

http://genderbinary.wikidot.com/gender-binary-outside-mold

[swinearefine]

I think the problem is less that parents forcing their kids to do gender-specific things, and more that kids are more inclined to perform these gender-specific things because since birth they've had it instilled in their minds that they are a certain gender, they are different from the other gender, that there is a set of rules for this gender that everyone follows, and that to be accepted in society you follow these rules. There's usually no need to force a girl to wear make-up, for example, because she's known since a very young age that that's what a girl does and that to be accepted she would have to do it.

[Kizzy]

Has anyone even bothered to ask the kid what they want?...
It's ok to play amature psychologists and sociologists trying to redefine gender socialisation, but does the kid want to be gender neutral?

[GypsyGoth]

Even if we got rid of words like girls or boys, kids who are different will still get bullied.

Maybe more education is needed and not so much focus on labels.

[Ninastar]

Even if we got rid of words like girls or boys, kids who are different will still get bullied.

Maybe more education is needed and not so much focus on labels.

:love: :worship:

[swinearefine]

Has anyone even bothered to ask the kid what they want?...
It's ok to play amature psychologists and sociologists trying to redefine gender socialisation, but does the kid want to be gender neutral?

This doesn't make sense at all. The whole point of gender-neutral parenting is letting your child make their own decisions and not restricting them to the domain of boys or girls.

[lostalex]

I think the problem is less that parents forcing their kids to do gender-specific things, and more that kids are more inclined to perform these gender-specific things because since birth they've had it instilled in their minds that they are a certain gender, they are different from the other gender, that there is a set of rules for this gender that everyone follows, and that to be accepted in society you follow these rules. There's usually no need to force a girl to wear make-up, for example, because she's known since a very young age that that's what a girl does and that to be accepted she would have to do it.

Exactly, and also other kids, who's parents have been very forceful about generstereotypes bully other kids into stuff. A kid who grew up with parents who told them, don't play with dolls, that's GAY! then those kids go to school, see another kid playing with dolls, and bully's that kid saying "why are you playing with dolls? that's gay!".

So the peer pressure from other kids still affects the kid who has parents that are trying to raise them gender neutral. It's basically impossible to raise your child gender neutral, because the rest of society is still enforcing those gender stereotypes.

[swinearefine]

Exactly, and also other kids, who's parents have been very forceful about generstereotypes bully other kids into stuff. A kid who grew up with parents who told them, don't play with dolls, that's GAY! then those kids go to school, see another kid playing with dolls, and bully's that kid saying "why are you playing with dolls? that's gay!".

So the peer pressure from other kids still affects the kid who has parents that are trying to raise them gender neutral. It's basically impossible to raise your child gender neutral, because the rest of society is still enforcing those gender stereotypes.

I don't think it's impossible, I just thing progress will be slow. We're leaps and bounds more evolved in our beliefs about gender roles than we were a few decades back.

[Kizzy]

This doesn't make sense at all. The whole point of gender-neutral parenting is letting your child make their own decisions and not restricting them to the domain of boys or girls.

That may be possible in different circs to this, if they were a first born or had siblings and/or family and friends who were raised similarly.
However in this example you have a child who has two brothers not raised gender neutral, this adds further confusion as it sets the child apart from their brothers.

[lostalex]

That may be possible in different circs to this, if they were a first born or had siblings and/or family and friends who were raised similarly.
However in this example you have a child who has two brothers not raised gender neutral, this adds further confusion as it sets the child apart from their brothers.

Right... because brothers raised in gender-stereotypical homes NEVER have competition or difference between them, YOU NEVER hear about brothers not getting along in "normal" homes, right? lol

[Shaun]

I think it's a lose-lose situation.

The idea of it is nice but there's so much judgment in the world about gender, sexuality and even fashion, that it's bound to be counter-intuitive.

Obviously for a child that grows up today and realises that they are transgender it can be a huge mountain to climb, and maybe genderless upbringings are going to be some comfort to those, but those who aren't... well what's the point?

Ultimately I think it's an adult decision being forced upon unwilling children and I don't really feel comfortable with that. If a teenager becomes so aware of and active in gender politics, then it should be an organic process.

[Josy]

I don't think it's right for parents to make this choice for their young children, growing up is confusing enough already for some without parents unnecessarily adding to it, in this case not only the child in question will be affected but also the siblings, it's also complete hypocrisy imho, enforcing neutrality is in fact not very neutral at all is it?

[Marsh.]

it's also complete hypocrisy imho, enforcing neutrality is in fact not very neutral at all is it?

Precisely.

[Kizzy]

Right... because brothers raised in gender-stereotypical homes NEVER have competition or difference between them, YOU NEVER hear about brothers not getting along in "normal" homes, right? lol

Well of course you find brothers disagree in every family, however thats down to personality differences or even where they are in the natural pecking order.
In this instance you have this added difference that could (not saying it has) changed the dynamic of the siblings relationships with each other.

[swinearefine]

I don't see why everyone is treating this like it's some massive decision being made for a kid, when actually the massive, restricting, oppressive decision is pressuring a kid to follow a fabricated gender binary. Like I said, I think the couple in this article is making gender an issue in a way, but gender-neutral parenting in general is actually the absence of forcing your child into doing something.

[Shaun]

I can see what you mean swinearefine, but to me it just seems like a social experiment. Maybe if it's the first awkward step to a freer and more liberated childhood then it might be a good one. I'm not really judging them (although I admit it sounds like it in my above psot), I'm just pointing out the obvious I suppose :laugh:

[lostalex]

It's also complete hypocrisy imho, enforcing neutrality is in fact not very neutral at all is it?

ummm, what? How is it not neutral? Enforcing gender stereotypes is not neutral at all, so how could trying to be gender neutral be less neutral than being gender stereotypical?

[Kizzy]

As said many parents do this now anyway, my kids played with whatever they liked and I happen to believe the brain decides what children play with. Right brained boys may love to play dolls and left brained girls the construction set, mum and dad have no say in that its nature not nurture.
Bit late for this isn't it?....haha

[lostalex]

Let's just let kids be kids is basically the premise of "gender neutrality" i think. And i don't see how that could be a bad thing.

I think some people are making this political. There is definitely an element of homophobia with the people who are against gender neutral parenting. They think that you can turn a kid gay, and that there is a gay agenda to "create" more homosexuals.

[Kizzy]

Let's just let kids be kids is basically the premise of "gender neutrality" i think. And i don't see how that could be a bad thing.

I think some people are making this political. There is definitely an element of homophobia with the people who are against gender neutral parenting. They think that you can turn a kid gay, and that there is a gay agenda to make more homosexuals.

That's not it at all, alex have you read anyone elses posts?
nobody is saying anything of the sort....

[lostalex]

That's not it at all, alex have you read anyone elses posts?
nobody is saying anything of the sort....
we are talking about the issue in general Kizzy, not just what epople on this forum have said, and yes i have seen people on other websites that have a homophobic stance. I said SOME PEOPLE, i didn't say YOU. There are lots of people that think that homosexuals are trying to "turn kids gay" by using gender neutral parenting.

[Marsh.]

I could just as easily say lots of gay people will jump at the chance to shout homophobia.

[Tom4784]

I'm completely against it as it sounds ****ing moronic. They're turning their own child into a godamn social experiment. It just all sounds like a great way to confuse and completely screw up a child in their formulative years. I just don't see any benefits to it.

[Kizzy]

we are talking about the issue in general Kizzy, not just what epople on this forum have said, and yes i have seen people on other websites that have a homophobic stance. I said SOME PEOPLE, i didn't say YOU. There are lots of people that think that homosexuals are trying to "turn kids gay" by using gender neutral parenting.

You could have made yourself clear on that then alex, Of course there is going to be those who see this as a way to spread ignorance and prejudice, that's just how it is unfortunately.

[lostalex]

I'm completely against it as it sounds ****ing moronic. They're turning their own child into a godamn social experiment. It just all sounds like a great way to confuse and completely screw up a child in their formulative years. I just don't see any benefits to it.


wait, so not forcing harmful gender stereotypes on children is a social experiment? It sounds a lot more natural than forcing children into roles they don't belong in just because it's tradition.

That's basically like saying all boys should be circumcised just so they don't get made fun of in the gym locker room. Are you pro-circumcision?

[lostalex]

I could just as easily say lots of gay people will jump at the chance to shout homophobia.

Well it's not hard to find homophobia, it's an epidemic. And the fact that you don't like people pointing it out would imply that you have an issue with homophobia yourself.

[Marsh.]

Well it's not hard to find homophobia, it's an epidemic. And the fact that you don't like people pointing it out would imply that you have an issue with homophobia yourself.

Where did I say you couldn't point it out?
I was pointing out the flip side of it, people will always find fault/something controversial with everything.

[lostalex]

Where did I say you couldn't point it out?
I was pointing out the flip side of it, people will always find fault/something controversial with everything.

well saying epople are "screaming about homophobia" which makes it sound like a petulant child screaming makes it sound like you don't take the complaints about homophobia seriously. Like the boy who cried wolf or something.

[Marsh.]

well saying epople are "screaming about homophobia" which makes it sound like a petulant child screaming makes it sound like you don't take the complaints about homophobia seriously. Like the boy who cried wolf or something.

:conf: The flipside of what you said was some people jump at the chance to "shout homophobia", that's the other side of what you said about people jumping at the chance to be homophobic.

Me taking these seriously or not is irrelevant to the point.

[Kizzy]

Well it's not hard to find homophobia, it's an epidemic. And the fact that you don't like people pointing it out would imply that you have an issue with homophobia yourself.

Ignorance is an epidemic alex, can you appreciate the irony in what you just did there?...

[lostalex]

:conf: The flipside of what you said was some people jump at the chance to "shout homophobia", that's the other side of what you said about people jumping at the chance to be homophobic.

Me taking these seriously or not is irrelevant to the point.


but you are basically saying both sides are equal. That both sides are as bad as each other. Both sides are NOT equal. People complaining (or screaming as you put it) about homophobia are telling the truth and standing up for civil rights. The people that are homophobic don't have a point. They are just being bigots. So you can't equate the 2 sides. They are NOT equal.

[Tom4784]

wait, so not forcing harmful gender stereotypes on children is a social experiment? It sounds a lot more natural than forcing children into roles they don't belong in just because it's tradition.

That's basically like saying all boys should be circumcised just so they don't get made fun of in the gym locker room. Are you pro-circumcision?

I just think it's confusing for the child, I'm not saying every boy has to play Football and every girl must play with dolls but this method of parenting to me just feels like it'll create more problems then it'll solve.

I'll ignore the rest of your post since that comparison and accusation is pretty ridiculous and laughable.

[Marsh.]

but you are basically saying both sides are equal. That both sides are as bad as each other. Both sides are NOT equal. People complaining (or screaming as you put it) about homophobia are telling the truth and standing up for civil rights. The people that are homophobic don't have a point. They are just being bigots. So you can't equate the 2 sides. They are NOT equal.

People screaming homophobia towards people who aren't being homophobic is the equality.

What you just said implies if a gay person says someone is homophobic they are never wrong.

Someone who loves to blame anything on gays is just as bad as someone who loves to get on the defensive and shout "racism", "homophobia" etc.

But we're derailing the thread.

[Kizzy]

but you are basically saying both sides are equal. That both sides are as bad as each other. Both sides are NOT equal. People complaining (or screaming as you put it) about homophobia are telling the truth and standing up for civil rights. The people that are homophobic don't have a point. They are just being bigots. So you can't equate the 2 sides. They are NOT equal.

Not sure I understand your point here, are you saying anyone who is against this practice is a bigot and a homophobe, why are you waving that word around like a banner?

[lostalex]

Not sure I understand your point here, are you saying anyone who is against this practice is a bigot and a homophobe, why are you waving that word around like a banner?

I don't see how it's not homophobic to be against letting young boys or girls go against gender stereotypes. It's clearly inherently homophobic.

Saying that "boys should be boys and girls should be girls" is inherently homophobic imo. because society's view of what a "boy" is and what a "girl" is, is inherently homophobic and sexist.

[Jake.]

Let kids chose who they want to be when they get to the right age. Don't go ****ing up their development because you feel the need to be different, it doesn't mean that every boy has to play football etc

[lostalex]

Let kids chose who they want to be when they get to the right age. Don't go ****ing up their development because you feel the need to be different, it doesn't mean that every boy has to play football etc

Eggggsactly. expose them to everything, and let them choose their own interests.

[Niamh.]

But that's just stupid.

Doesn't make any sense and confuses children right from the start.

You are either a boy or a girl. Whether you grow up to wish you were the other gender is another matter entirely.

This. The parents are ****ing idiots, I feel bad for the child