The youth of modern Britain vs the youth of modern America

[Verbal]

http://i2.cdnds.net/13/34/618x918/uktv-celebrity-big-brother-charlotte-crosby.jpg

http://i2.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article2208190.ece/ALTERNATES/s510b/Celebrity-Big-Brother--Courtney-2208190.png

Charlotte Crosby, to me epitomises everything that is wrong with the youth of modern Britain.

Courtney Stodden whilst having an annoyingly high pitched voice, I think is very sweet.

Discuss...

[Jesus.]

You do realise, that every member of these mythical "modern youth" groups, aren't like this?

[Verbal]

You do realise, that every member of these mythical "modern youth" groups, aren't like this?

Of course I do, but you only have to go to your local high street on a Saturday night or watch one of those teenagers abroad documentaries to realise that she equally represents a very large portion of them.

[Jesus.]

Of course I do, but you only have to go to your local high street on a Saturday night or watch one of those teenagers abroad documentaries to realise that she equally represents a very large portion of them.

Round it up for me, please.

There are approximately 7.4 million 16-24yr olds in the uk (http://www.ukyouth.org/stories/item/292-statistics-about-young-people-in-the-uk.html#.UhnFn3_9y). What portion is made up by the 50-100 people like this you might see on a Saturday night?

[Kyle]

I'm not with you on this one hermit I'm sure our American friends on here would tell you that they have youth drinking issues too.

The problem is you don't see the vast majority of people behaving themselves, just the rowdy drunken louts so it looks like its a lot worse than it is.

[Verbal]

Round it up for me, please.

There are approximately 7.4 million 16-24yr olds in the uk (http://www.ukyouth.org/stories/item/292-statistics-about-young-people-in-the-uk.html#.UhnFn3_9y). What portion is made up by the 50-100 people like this you might see on a Saturday night?

No:thumbs: I don't know, and I don't care. You only have to see the reaction she got when walking in to see that she is praised for the way she is. Not to mention that she has her own TV show.

She makes me want to vomit.

I've been a teenager, i've been through College, there were a lot more people who would be dribbling kebab juice over themselves at 2am on a Saturday night than sitting at home reading the bible. [at my college]

[Northern Monkey]

Tbf,I think the OP has a point.Things haven't changed much since i was going out and doing crazy ****(i'm 31),All my friends were exactly the same.I just grew out of it.I did'nt know many 'quiet stay at home types'

[Jesus.]

No:thumbs: I don't know, and I don't care. You only have to see the reaction she got when walking in to see that she is praised for the way she is. Not to mention that she has her own TV show.

She makes me want to vomit.

I've been a teenager, i've been through College, there were a lot more people who would be dribbling kebab juice over themselves at 2am on a Saturday night than sitting at home reading the bible. [at my college]


So if you don't know and/or care about the actual statistics, would you do the honourable thing and perhaps admit your bias may be clouding your judgment here?

Saying "I know because I've been there too", doesn't really mean anything. It's anecdotal, and anecdotal evidence is the worst kind. I've also been through university. I left a small rural village to move to a big city, so I've had massive culture shock, it doesn't mean that I get to label everyone as a waster.

[Ammi]

No:thumbs: I don't know, and I don't care. You only have to see the reaction she got when walking in to see that she is praised for the way she is. Not to mention that she has her own TV show.

She makes me want to vomit.

I've been a teenager, i've been through College, there were a lot more people who would be dribbling kebab juice over themselves at 2am on a Saturday night than sitting at home reading the bible. [at my college]

..you're talking about extremes though CH, most people aren't extreme..I'm sure they can be in that young people may sometimes dribble kebab juice on a Saturday etc..but lots of older people can and do as well...wisdom..?...good behaviour..?...bad behaviour..?..etc, is applicable to all ages...

[Verbal]

So if you don't know and/or care about the actual statistics, would you do the honourable thing and perhaps admit your bias mat be clouding your judgment here?

Saying "I know because I've been there too", doesn't really mean anything. It's anecdotal, and anecdotal evidence is the worst kind. I've also been through university. I left a small rural village to move to a big city, so I've had massive culture shock, it doesn't mean that I get to label everyone as a waster.

Bias towards what? I'm merely making an observation, based on experience. She is celebrated for basically being a twat. I at no point called anybody a waster, she clearly isnt. Its her image I have issues with.

[Jesus.]

Bias towards what? I'm merely making an observation, based on experience. She is celebrated for basically being a twat. I at no point called anybody a waster, she clearly isnt. Its her image I have issues with.

An observation that groups people together in nicely packaged dismissive soundbytes that make it easy to avoid thinking about.

I actually watch Geordie Shore (for my sins), and yeah, they are all a bit extreme in one way or another, but Charlotte actually appears to be a pretty genuine girl, with a really good heart.

If everyone was really like her, then people wouldn't watch it in a show.

Her image? Why does that concern you? She's a young girl doind what young guys have been doing (without being judged for) all of history.

She likes sex, bodily functions, and drinking.


I'm sure conversations with your friends happen to include these topics from time to time.

[Roy Mars III]

We are much better, stronger, smarter and more sexually attractive in the U.S.

[Kyle]

We are much better, stronger, smarter and more sexually attractive in the U.S.

There you see Hermit, he's drunk even as we speak :joker:

[Jesus.]

We are much better, stronger, smarter and more sexually attractive in the U.S.

America ranks top in confidence, but low in attainment. Who'd a thunk it?

[Roy Mars III]

We also brush our teeth in the States

[Verbal]

An observation that groups people together in nicely packaged dismissive soundbytes that make it easy to avoid thinking about.

I actually watch Geordie Shore (for my sins), and yeah, they are all a bit extreme in one way or another, but Charlotte actually appears to be a pretty genuine girl, with a really good heart.

If everyone was really like her, then people wouldn't watch it in a show.

Her image? Why does that concern you? She's a young girl doind what young guys have been doing (without being judged for) all of history.

She likes sex, bodily functions, and drinking.


I'm sure conversations with your friends happen to include these topics from time to time.

You're just arguing with me for the sake of it. You've basically just agreed with me without realising it.
She's a young girl doind what young guys have been doing (without being judged for) all of history.

Apart from the 'doing through all history' part, which quite frankly is rubbish. You've just said exactly what I am but in a different way.

Let me spell it out for you - why are people regardless of age, in this country celebrated for being louts?

The American girl, comes across as a sweet, naive, god fearing, girl whilst Britain has a burping, farting, foul mouthed chav representing.

[Roy Mars III]

America ranks top in confidence, but low in attainment. Who'd a thunk it?

As Plato said "fake it till you make it."

[Ammi]

Bias towards what? I'm merely making an observation, based on experience. She is celebrated for basically being a twat. I at no point called anybody a waster, she clearly isnt. Its her image I have issues with.

..I didn't have access to so much TV when I was younger but it's never been different in that my generation was always more interested in watching the 'rebel' type/anti establishment etc because it made for more interesting viewing,,it doesn't mean to say we role modelled ourselves on them or anything though or thought them as 'the norm' ..TV has always portrayed more extreme characters...

..I also remember my mum saying..'the youth of today....'.lol...

[Jemal]

Tbh, Charlotte is quite common around the uk lol.
Courtney is quite common around America. I prefer Courtney to Charlotte by far.

[Ammi]

You're just arguing with me for the sake of it. You've basically just agreed with me without realising it.


Apart from the 'doing through all history' part, which quite frankly is rubbish. You've just said exactly what I am but in a different way.

Let me spell it out for you - why are people regardless of age, in this country celebrated for being louts?

The American girl, comes across as a sweet, naive, god fearing, girl whilst Britain has a burping, farting, foul mouthed chav representing.

..I think she's been portrayed more as a 'plastic bimbo/shallow/air head/gold digger' type..that's not really better than Charlotte..it's equally as bad but just different...

[Verbal]

..I think she's been portrayed more as a 'plastic bimbo/shallow/air head/gold digger' type..that's not really better than Charlotte..it's equally as bad but just different...

That's not the impression i've got, not if you read between the lines at least. She spent hours on the first night worrying about her bloody stuffed toy for god sake. How more innocent can you get? She's also a Christian, which I didn't know before.

What have I learnt about the Geordie? She likes burping, farting, drinking and basically just being as obnoxious and 'outrageous' as she can.

[Verbal]

Tbh, Charlotte is quite common around the uk lol.
Courtney is quite common around America. I prefer Courtney to Charlotte by far.

Thank you!

I'm a Brit by the way

[Jesus.]

You're just arguing with me for the sake of it. You've basically just agreed with me without realising it.


Apart from the 'doing through all history' part, which quite frankly is rubbish. You've just said exactly what I am but in a different way.

Let me spell it out for you - why are people regardless of age, in this country celebrated for being louts?

The American girl, comes across as a sweet, naive, god fearing, girl whilst Britain has a burping, farting, foul mouthed chav representing.

We couldn't be further from agreeing on this point. You grouped this "modern youth" together and made out every young person was like that. I'm saying if every young person was like that, then no one would watch a show of them.

[Verbal]

We couldn't be further from agreeing on this point. You grouped this "modern youth" together and made out every young person was like that. I'm saying if every young person was like that, then no one would watch a show of them.

I specifically said I am not labeling 'every young person' just a very large majority.

[Jesus.]

I specifically said I am not labeling 'every young person' just a very large majority.

Not every young person, just a large majority.

So a majority is 51%. A large majority to me would be 60-70%, then I'd say a "very large majority" would be around 80% which would be just under 6million of the 7.4 million young people in the uk.

I don't agree with that at all. I think it's an easy thing to label people.

[Verbal]

Not every young person, just a large majority.

So a majority is 51%. A large majority to me would be 60-70%, then I'd say a "very large majority" would be around 80% which would be just under 6million of the 7.4 million young people in the uk.

I don't agree with that at all. I think it's an easy thing to label people.

When I have more time later on today, I will drag up some kind of stat that shows the amount of people that visit their local high st on a saturday night

[sassysocks]

http://i2.cdnds.net/13/34/618x918/uktv-celebrity-big-brother-charlotte-crosby.jpg

http://i2.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article2208190.ece/ALTERNATES/s510b/Celebrity-Big-Brother--Courtney-2208190.png

Charlotte Crosby, to me epitomises everything that is wrong with the youth of modern Britain.

Courtney Stodden whilst having an annoyingly high pitched voice, I think is very sweet.

Discuss...

I have to disagree. Thh I don't think much of either, but I do think that Courtney's lack of dignity and aspirations as a modern young woman, other than to hook a rich guy and look like a barbie doll is very harming to young vulnerable girls - this thread being testamy to that.

[Jemal]

I'm a Youth of Britain but im in no way like Charlotte. But then again im not a woman.
Tbfh just change the title to something more understanding cynical lool

[Jesus.]

When I have more time later on today, I will drag up some kind of stat that shows the amount of people that visit their local high st on a saturday night

OK. Just to clarify though, every young person visiting the town centre doesn't end up being air-tight in the toilets, before releasing their bowels in their knickers on the way home, whilst sucking the grease out of kebab meat.

[sassysocks]

That's not the impression i've got, not if you read between the lines at least. She spent hours on the first night worrying about her bloody stuffed toy for god sake. How more innocent can you get? She's also a Christian, which I didn't know before.

What have I learnt about the Geordie? She likes burping, farting, drinking and basically just being as obnoxious and 'outrageous' as she can.

You don't worry about a grown woman worrying about a soft toy? Just all part of the act. How anyone can call her innocent is so laughable it isn't even funny. Not innocent -either very calculating or completely thick.

[Jemal]

I won't lie Charlotte is so disgusting and repulsive.
She doesn't do the girls of Britain any favours in how they may come across. Then you have on launch night people cheering her name after the foul things she said. It does make you wonder if people in Britain are proud to have those kind of women in our society

[sassysocks]

I specifically said I am not labeling 'every young person' just a very large majority.

So instead you would prefer British women to have minds like children but with their boobs and crotch on display for all to see. Really not much to choose between them is there?

Oh please tell me you are being sarky when you refer to Courtney as innocent and god fearing, I just might give up on the human race altogether otherwise. :nono:

[Yayita]

Both are extreme and exagerated depictions of some young people and that is that. American teens are not like Courtney or Charlotte and I'm sure the UK teens arent either. END OFF!!

[smudgie]

Too much generalisation.

Neither girl represents all of their peer group. We will all have our own opinion n them both and that is what matters to us I suppose.

Charlotte is a bit ott with her bad manners etc but I can't help wondering if a lot of it is to do with the show she is on.
You have always had the "youth of the day" that will go out and drink too much, as indeed quite a few older people do.
The difference between today and in my day is that they have more money to spend nowadays.
Underneath all the bad manners and foul language etc I can actually see a canny lass, hopefully she will grow up into a more self respecting young lady one day.

Courtney comes across as a nice enough girl,rather dull for her age if I am honest. I do find it had to believe she has just turned 19. She looks a lot older, maybe she has had a hard life, it can't be easy getting married at 16 and more or less missing out on your youth.
Hoping she will open up a bit more and enjoy herself.....but quietly, the voice is awful.

[Verbal]

So instead you would prefer British women to have minds like children but with their boobs and crotch on display for all to see. Really not much to choose between them is there?

Oh please tell me you are being sarky when you refer to Courtney as innocent and god fearing, I just might give up on the human race altogether otherwise. :nono:

I am commenting on her/their character. Their dress sense is of no concern to me.

God fearing = respectful of God. Yes, she is.

Innocent = being concerned over a toy of hers. Yes.

Mind like a child? Are you suggesting she has some kind of mental retardation ? Odd

[Verbal]

OK. Just to clarify though, every young person visiting the town centre doesn't end up being air-tight in the toilets, before releasing their bowels in their knickers on the way home, whilst sucking the grease out of kebab meat.

In response, I would like to refer you to this thread

http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/showthread.php?t=236241

Or maybe this one

http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/showthread.php?t=236182

I have no intention of searching for stats, I was being sarcastic.

[Kizzy]

There are some that are like those two, for some it's just a phase I've seen Geordie shore once they aren't all like them though, we can't write off a whole generation haha!

[Niamh.]

Back on topic everyone, I don't want to have to close the thread

[Kyle]

Back on topic everyone, I don't want to have to close the thread

Apologies Niamh.

[sassysocks]

I am commenting on her/their character. Their dress sense is of no concern to me.

God fearing = respectful of God. Yes, she is.

Innocent = being concerned over a toy of hers. Yes.

Mind like a child? Are you suggesting she has some kind of mental retardation ? Odd

Innocent does not equal looking like a barbie with all that surgery and dressing like a tart. She can dress how she pleases, but lets not pretend she is innocent.

A grown woman being concerned about a toy is not normal or innocent - it is weird, either calculated to make her appear innocent or maybe she is even two pennies short of a sixpence. If the cap fits.

[Kazanne]

Didn't Courtney do some porn at some point?

[Northern Monkey]

Charlotte farts.If Courtney farts(which i doubt),It would smell like strawberry Bon Bons and Peaches.When Charlotte farts i would imagine it smells like 4 day old sewage.Charlotte pisses herself and ****s herself.I can't imagine that Courtney even goes to the toilet and if she does she excretes rose petals and fairy dust.

[Verbal]

Innocent does not equal looking like a barbie with all that surgery and dressing like a tart. She can dress how she pleases, but lets not pretend she is innocent.

A grown woman being concerned about a toy is not normal or innocent - it is weird, either calculated to make her appear innocent or maybe she is even two pennies short of a sixpence. If the cap fits.

So by your assumption all adults that are into toys, games, comics, anime etc are weird, right? Ok

Doesn't make it wrong. She is harming nobody.

I have seen nothing that suggests she is calculating in any way. Drawing that conclusion says more about you than it does her.


Two pennies short of a sixpence? She is 18 years old and a millionaire.

[Niamh.]

Didn't Courtney do some porn at some point?

Jeez I hope not, she's only 18 and she's been married since she was 16 to a pretty wealthy man

[Verbal]

Didn't Courtney do some porn at some point?

No idea, using what she has to earn a living is not a crime. There are men out there stupid enough to line her pockets, so good luck to her.

[DanaC]

Ok, I'll bite.

Setting aside the fact that neither of these two young women represent the youth of their country in any real sense: I think Courtney is more worrying than Charlotte.

I like her. She is very sweet. But she plays to the 'little girl' sweetness. The thing with the bunny, the artificially high pitched voice.

I see in her a kind of infantilised sexuality.

Charlotte is coarse. Though much of what she talks about (getting so drunk she pisses herself, or vomits) is not much different to a kind of 'laddishness'. With lads, we roll our eyes and say they'll grow out of it. Boys being boys. It is more shocking when it comes from a young lady.

Now, I see a kind of innocence in Charlotte. More so in some ways than with Courtney, who seems to have a very clear idea of how to use every head tilt, leg lift and giggle to her advantage. But Charlotte is not infantilised, she is just young. And her body is a natural body, over which she has absolute control. Her sexuality is one of self-empowerment, it is not hidden behind pink princess naivety.

Of the two, to me, Courtney seems to represent a form of femininity that is deeply damaging to society. An unnatural physical shape achievable only through radical surgery; a sexuality founded in childlike helplessness.

[Kazanne]

Jeez I hope not, she's only 18 and she's been married since she was 16 to a pretty wealthy man

I'm sure I saw or heard somewhere she did a bit,but not 100%,unless it was someone else:hugesmile:

[Verbal]

Ok, I'll bite.

Setting aside the fact that neither of these two young women represent the youth of their country in any real sense: I think Courtney is more worrying than Charlotte.

I like her. She is very sweet. But she plays to the 'little girl' sweetness. The thing with the bunny, the artificially high pitched voice.

I see in her a kind of infantilised sexuality.

Charlotte is coarse. Though much of what she talks about (getting so drunk she pisses herself, or vomits) is not much different to a kind of 'laddishness'. With lads, we roll our eyes and say they'll grow out of it. Boys being boys. It is more shocking when it comes from a young lady.

Now, I see a kind of innocence in Charlotte. More so in some ways than with Courtney, who seems to have a very clear idea of how to use every head tilt, leg lift and giggle to her advantage. But Charlotte is not infantilised, she is just young. And her body is a natural body, over which she has absolute control. Her sexuality is one of self-empowerment, it is not hidden behind pink princess naivety.

Of the two, to me, Courtney seems to represent a form of femininity that is deeply damaging to society. An unnatural physical shape achievable only through radical surgery; a sexuality founded in childlike helplessness.

I maybe wrong, but are you suggesting that she is pandering to paedophilic ideals that are upheld by the male race?

[DanaC]

No. I am saying she falls into an ages old cultural pattern. It is no accident that the holy book of Christianity has its messiah born to a virgin girl.

Female sexuality has been a source of unease for our culture for a very, very long time. Infantilising femininity makes it less dangerous and threatening.

Not just our culture. Plenty of cultures remove adulthood from female sexuality. Footbinding in China was from the basic desire.

[thediaryroomchair]

Some of the youth in Britain today behave appallingly and have no respect for themselves and for their elders. I have a younger sister and she is an absolute credit, she worked hard in her GCSEs and BTEC and does not answer back and is very career minded. Unlike some I see in my local town who insult me for the team I support using four letter expletives to boot.

[Niamh.]

Ok, I'll bite.

Setting aside the fact that neither of these two young women represent the youth of their country in any real sense: I think Courtney is more worrying than Charlotte.

I like her. She is very sweet. But she plays to the 'little girl' sweetness. The thing with the bunny, the artificially high pitched voice.

I see in her a kind of infantilised sexuality.

Charlotte is coarse. Though much of what she talks about (getting so drunk she pisses herself, or vomits) is not much different to a kind of 'laddishness'. With lads, we roll our eyes and say they'll grow out of it. Boys being boys. It is more shocking when it comes from a young lady.

Now, I see a kind of innocence in Charlotte. More so in some ways than with Courtney, who seems to have a very clear idea of how to use every head tilt, leg lift and giggle to her advantage. But Charlotte is not infantilised, she is just young. And her body is a natural body, over which she has absolute control. Her sexuality is one of self-empowerment, it is not hidden behind pink princess naivety.

Of the two, to me, Courtney seems to represent a form of femininity that is deeply damaging to society. An unnatural physical shape achievable only through radical surgery; a sexuality founded in childlike helplessness.

Great post again Dana, I agree, eventhough I quite like Courtney, I do think it's awful that she felt the need to do what she's done to her body at such a young age and also her marrying so young to an old man, with, preumably her parents consent? It's quite sad

[DanaC]

I maybe wrong, but are you suggesting that she is pandering to paedophilic ideals that are upheld by the male race?

Incidentally, I think this points to a fairly fundamental misunderstanding of what is meant by the term patriarchy.

Men do not create the world for women. We, men and women, create the world for ourselves and each other. We are also created by that world. It is not a case of what men to do to women. But what we do to ourselves.

[Kazanne]

It's probably stories like this that has fuelled some speculation,it's bliddy Louies fault for saying "She's so porn" lol
http://new-magazine.co.uk/posts/view/54373/CBB-2013-Courtney-Stodden-hiding-X-rated-past-

[Roy Mars III]

Great post again Dana, I agree, eventhough I quite like Courtney, I do think it's awful that she felt the need to do what she's done to her body at such a young age and also her marrying so young to an old man, with, preumably her parents consent? It's quite sad

I feel bad for her. I think she is another example of the price of fame. Her and her parents. You can't get married here intill you are 18 unless your parents okay it. No matter what she may have felt at the time, you can't make a decision like that at 16 IMO.

[DanaC]

Some of the youth in Britain today behave appallingly and have no respect for themselves and for their elders. I have a younger sister and she is an absolute credit, she worked hard in her GCSEs and BTEC and does not answer back and is very career minded. Unlike some I see in my local town who insult me for the team I support using four letter expletives to boot.

And so it has always been. yea, even unto the middle ages. And further back in fact.

For as long as people have written down their thoughts on the world, there have been people writing complaints about the 'youth of today'.

“Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers.” Socrates [469BC-399BC]

[Verbal]

Incidentally, I think this points to a fairly fundamental misunderstanding of what is meant by the term patriarchy.

Men do not create the world for women. We, men and women, create the world for ourselves and each other. We are also created by that world. It is not a case of what men to do to women. But what we do to ourselves.

I'm not quite sure what that has to do with anything I have said, but ok. I took issue with your use of the word infantilised. Which to me, is you suggesting that anybody who doesnt like the kind of woman Charlotte is, is mentally damaged in such a way that they can only be around women who they can feel superior to.

[DanaC]

No, that's really not what I meant, CH.



The tradition of infantilised female sexuality is a very long one. In Christian cultures we have a strange dichotomy of respect for motherhood and disdain for female sexuality: Mary is both a mother (good) and a virgin (good). She is innocence and motherhood combined.

[Niamh.]

I feel bad for her. I think she is another example of the price of fame. Her and her parents. You can't get married here intill you are 18 unless your parents okay it. No matter what she may have felt at the time, you can't make a decision like that at 16 IMO.

absolutely agree, what kind of parents think A - It's a good idea for their 16 year old to get married at all but B- to a 50 year old man?? That's pretty sickening if you ask me

[MachoPoodle]

I maybe wrong, but are you suggesting that she is pandering to paedophilic ideals that are upheld by the male race?

Male race? What is that supposed to mean?

[Verbal]

No, that's really not what I meant, CH.



The tradition of infantilised female sexuality is a very long one. In Christian cultures we have a strange dichotomy of respect for motherhood and disdain for female sexuality: Mary is both a mother (good) and a virgin (good). She is innocence and motherhood combined.

No problem, Dana. I completely respect your viewpoints and the way you are able to put them across, which is a rarity on here. Thank you for clarifying.

[Northern Monkey]

Male race? What is that supposed to mean?

Haha!We Males are the master race!lol

[Roy Mars III]

I find Charlotte's personality and manners disgusting, but I would think the same if she was a man. There is no need to talk like that in a civilized society. I do not even want to hear the word pee mentioned ever. Her manners are appalling, and I am almost sick even thinking about them.

Courtney is immature, but I can totally understand her. She grew up in a small town Christian American town and was homeschooled part of her life. She grew up differently than anyone else in there. She has never really grew up or had a chance too. She got married at 16, she never had a chance to fend for herself

[Verbal]

Male race? What is that supposed to mean?

Case in point.

[sassysocks]

So by your assumption all adults that are into toys, games, comics, anime etc are weird, right? Ok

Doesn't make it wrong. She is harming nobody.

I have seen nothing that suggests she is calculating in any way. Drawing that conclusion says more about you than it does her.


Two pennies short of a sixpence? She is 18 years old and a millionaire.

You seem to be contradicting yourself - one minute she is 'innocent' and childlike - the next your comments about her age and financial status - by marriage - suggest she is calculating and knows exactly what she is doing, which is what the majority of people have thought all along.

She is simply conforming to an image that many men seem to find attractive and got her a very wealthy hubby. A sexy body together with an innocent and obedient mind seems to wreak havoc with male hormones. Many are intimidated by strong, intelligent women - hardly rocket science.

[Verbal]

You seem to be contradicting yourself - one minute she is 'innocent' and childlike - the next your comments about her age and financial status - by marriage - suggest she is calculating and knows exactly what she is doing, which is what the majority of people have thought all along.

She is simply conforming to an image that many men seem to find attractive and got her a very wealthy hubby. A sexy body together with an innocent and obedient mind seems to wreak havoc with male hormones. Many are intimidated by strong, intelligent women - hardly rocket science.

It does not suggest she is calculating, it suggests she is intelligent. A person can be both innocent and intelligent.

[sassysocks]

No idea, using what she has to earn a living is not a crime. There are men out there stupid enough to line her pockets, so good luck to her.

That is completely at odds with you comments of her being 'innocent'. So now porn stars are innocent. I don't think our definitions of 'innocent' are in tune.

[Ammi]

..I really don't see any comparison between Charlotte and Courtney to say that one is a 'good person' and one is a 'bad person' because neither or 'typical' representatives of young people in general but in a completely different way...

..I would be devastated if my daughter used language/behaved like Charlotte did but I would be equally devastated if she was married at 16yrs to a guy almost three times her age and had surgery to her body by 18yrs when she was a totally beautiful girl in the first place..I do see in Charlotte a nice person as well though, as I do with Courtney...what she does/how she behaves doesn't hurt society, it only hurts herself in what people think of her because of it...

[Verbal]

That is completely at odds with you comments of her being 'innocent'. So now porn stars are innocent. I don't think our definitions of 'innocent' are in tune.

She is not a porn star. Yet more assumptions.

[sassysocks]

It does not suggest she is calculating, it suggests she is intelligent. A person can be both innocent and intelligent.

Your argument is all over the place and makes no sense. If as you suggest she is intelligent enough to pick a wealthy husband - that is calculating. Innocent people marry for love, not money.

[MachoPoodle]

Case in point.

How, exactly?

[Verbal]

Your argument is all over the place and makes no sense. If as you suggest she is intelligent enough to pick a wealthy husband - that is calculating. Innocent people marry for love, not money.

How do you know she didn't marry for love? Were you there?

[sassysocks]

How do you know she didn't marry for love? Were you there?

How predictable was that comment - evidence of your meandering arguments.

You were the one who said she was intelligent enough to be a millionaire at 18 - implying she knew exactly what she was doing. Bearing in mind the way she achieved that millionare status was by marrying a very wealthy man old enough to be her father- your words speak for themselves.

[Verbal]

How predictable was that comment - evidence of your meandering arguments.

You were the one who said she was intelligent enough to be a millionaire at 18 - implying she knew exactly what she was doing. Bearing in mind the way she achieved that millionare status was by marrying a very wealthy man old enough to be her father- your words speak for themselves.

How do you know the way she acquired her wealth was purely through her husband?

[sassysocks]

How do you know the way she acquired her wealth was purely through her husband?

Unless her family were wealthy or she had some kind of high profile 'career' (please enlighten) - then she married into money. Not complicated. If she did have a 'career' at 16 - what was it - glamour modelling or porn? Very innocent.

You can't have it both ways - all the evidence points to her either being very calculating or as thick as a brick.

[Verbal]

Unless her family were wealthy or she had some kind of high profile 'career' (please enlighten) - then she married into money. Not complicated. If she did have a 'career' at 16 - what was it - glamour modelling or porn? Very innocent.

You can't have it both ways - all the evidence points to her either being very calculating or as thick as a brick.

Your entire argument for the past 3 or 4 posts has been nothing but assumptions.

She married for love, it happened to be to a millionaire. In order to be socialising in those kinds of circles her family must also be wealthy. She can't help being born into it.

Christians take the institution of marriage very seriously. I doubt very much she is as fickle as you would like her to be.

Please, show me 'all this evidence'

[sassysocks]

Your entire argument for the past 3 or 4 posts has been nothing but assumptions.

She married for love, it happened to be to a millionaire. In order to be socialising in those kinds of circles her family must also be wealthy. She can't help being born into it.

Christians take the institution of marriage very seriously. I doubt very much she is as fickle as you would like her to be.

Please, show me 'all this evidence'

Whose making assumptions now. You are assuming her family are rich and she moved in those circles, just as you assume she married for love. You also make a lot of assumptions about the character of so called Christians.

Coming from a 'Christian' family does not make you a true Christian, calling yourself a 'Christian' does not make you a true Christian.

Having lots of plastic surgery and having fake enormous boobs and exposing them and the rest of her body at every given opportunity - is not very Christian is it? Actions speak louder than words.

[DanaC]

Her parents were not especially wealthy. But she didn't meet and marry this man because she was moving in those circles.

She was an aspiring actress who, as a young teenager, signed up for an online acting class taught by her current husband. He, at the time, was not aware of her age. They began a correspondence and fell in love during that correspondence. On finding out her age, he contacted her mother and apologised, and said he would back away, having had no idea how young she was when they were corresponding. Her parents instead decided to allow the courtship to progress.

The two of them sought couples counselling through a reality TV therapy show. What the counsellor had to say about them is interesting. From wiki:

The couple appeared as cast members in the second season of the VH1 reality television series Couples Therapy, which premiered in October 2012. The series features publicly known couples receive therapy for relationship problems. According to Stodden, the couple enrolled in therapy in order to resolve issues that arose in their marriage from their age difference.[11] Despite the criticism leveled at the couple, and her own reservations about the dynamic of their relationship,[17] Dr. Jenn Berman, the Marriage, Family, and Child Therapist who worked with the couple during their appearance on the show, stressed that she does not believe that Hutchison is, or was, seeking out young people, saying, "He's not a predator. He's not someone, who if Courtney left him, would be trolling the Internet or high schools for underage girls. That's not his m.o. This is not a guy who was seeking out teenagers. He was teaching a class, she wanted to be an actress, it was an acting class… And that’s how it started." Though Berman was eventually surprised by the dynamic between the two, she commented on her initial hesitations about working with the couple, saying, "I believe it was the wrong decision to let a 16-year-old marry a man in his 50s. It’s uncomfortable to see… [at first] I said to my producer, ‘I think this guy is a pedophile…I don’t know if I can work with these people.’ I don’t condone it, but I do see that this is a married couple that is genuinely married and they have marital issues that needed to be worked on. I came in saying, 'She’s a victim, he’s a predator.' What I found out was that she has a lot more power in this relationship and he is far more powerless than I expected. His family has completely disowned him… He unfortunately has nothing besides her." Hutchison was also defended by Stodden's mother, Krista Keller, who praised Hutchison for the kindness with which he treats Stodden.[7]



Incidentally, the reason she was homeschooled during the latter part of her schooling was because she was bullied at school for her looks. Which may go some way to explaining why she feels the need to change her body.

[Josy]

Your entire argument for the past 3 or 4 posts has been nothing but assumptions.

She married for love, it happened to be to a millionaire. In order to be socialising in those kinds of circles her family must also be wealthy. She can't help being born into it.

Christians take the institution of marriage very seriously. I doubt very much she is as fickle as you would like her to be.

Please, show me 'all this evidence'

She wasn't socialising in any circles..

She attended an acting class that he was teaching and it went from there.

[Josy]

Ah Dana we posted at the same time...

[Verbal]

Whose making assumptions now. You are assuming her family are rich and she moved in those circles, just as you assume she married for love. You also make a lot of assumptions about the character of so called Christians.

Coming from a 'Christian' family does not make you a true Christian, calling yourself a 'Christian' does not make you a true Christian.

Having lots of plastic surgery and having fake enormous boobs and exposing them and the rest of her body at every given opportunity - is not very Christian is it? Actions speak louder than words.

I'm not making assumptions, i'm merely countering yours. Could I ask what exactly makes a person a 'true Christian' then please?

Again, where has she exposed herself?

[Daffodil]

Charlotte: Does not represent the youth of this country. She represents a specific type of youth who have been allowed to grow up with either no parental control or bad parents who encourage the foul language because it is funny. No dignity.

Courtney: Represents all that is bad about American culture. Young girls smothering themselves in make-up. Boob jobs for heaven's sake! And that is before having children. How the hell will they feed the baby? Oh sorry... breast isn't best over there. Her shoes are designed to stop her running from her leering understained husband. Her hair appears to be extensions. Her voice in many interviews on Youtube appears to be badly affected by drugs and the need to pout and breathe with every word. She is constantly playing with her oversized and overweight breasts. It makes me want to scream. And the sad thing is youngsters will try and be like her. (Find yourself a lonely, leering and understained actor first). No dignity.

Final Thought: I am assuming that her disgusting 'husband' is behind the decision to have her already quite sizeable breasts enlarged. I wish someone would take her in hand, remove the boobs, remove the extensions and the eyelashes, throw the shoes on a fire and hide the dye bottle. Then hand the girl a pair of jeans, some trainers and a tee shirt. I guarantee she will wonder why it took her so long to find out!

[sassysocks]

Her parents were not especially wealthy. But she didn't meet and marry this man because she was moving in those circles.

She was an aspiring actress who, as a young teenager, signed up for an online acting class taught by her current husband. He, at the time, was not aware of her age. They began a correspondence and fell in love during that correspondence. On finding out her age, he contacted her mother and apologised, and said he would back away, having had no idea how young she was when they were corresponding. Her parents instead decided to allow the courtship to progress.

The two of them sought couples counselling through a reality TV therapy show. What the counsellor had to say about them is interesting. From wiki:





Incidentally, the reason she was homeschooled during the latter part of her schooling was because she was bullied at school for her looks. Which may go some way to explaining why she feels the need to change her body.

The above may or may not be true - but still comes down to one person's opinion on whether he was a predator, not on her motves for marrying him.

He had no idea of how young she was - who is he trying to kid. Even if she didn't look 16, it would have been obvious to anyone she was certainly way too young for him.

Did she pursue her acting career - or simply marry the millionaire acting teacher? Are people trying to suggest she had no idea of his wealth so therefore it could not have been a factor in her decision? You make it sound like some kind of Romeo and Juliet, but that seems extremely unlikely.

Yes, she is clearly insecure - that is obvious by the 'work' she has had done, but we are not talking about some kind of corrective surgery, she has gone for the oh so predictable bleached blonde, hugh boobs look. That speaks more than insecure, that speaks attention-seeking and looking for male attention of the wealthy kind.

[Verbal]

The above may or may not be true - but still comes down to one person's opinion on whether he was a predator, not on her motves for marrying him.

He had no idea of how young she was - who is he trying to kid. Even if she didn't look 16, it would have been obvious to anyone she was certainly way too young for him.

Did she pursue her acting career - or simply marry the millionaire acting teacher? Are people trying to suggest she had no idea of his wealth so therefore it could not have been a factor in her decision? You make it sound like some kind of Romeo and Juliet, but that seems extremely unlikely.

Yes, she is clearly insecure - that is obvious by the 'work' she has had done, but we are not talking about some kind of corrective surgery, she has gone for the oh so predictable bleached blonde, hugh boobs look. That speaks more than insecure, that speaks attention-seeking and looking for male attention of the wealthy kind.

I feel like I am no longer worthy of my username and you should take it, or at least the first part of it.

There is literally a thread on here right now with people expressing their disbelief at her age. She does not look 18 to me, infact if I didnt know I would comfortably add 10 years to her. So, at 16 she could have easily passed for 25 at least.

Your talking like this is an odd thing, there are dozens of examples of older men marrying younger women and the other way around, and being perfectly happy.

This is the kind of thing that annoys me about this forum, people just look at everything hoping to find something to be offended about. God sake.

[Jesus.]

I just want to make a general comment. This is a forum, and people have the right to express their opinions however they feel mirrors their actual feelings on any topic.

If I disagree with someone, I'll raise it in their post, and show why I think they are wrong, and where their errors are. I'm not always right, and I've admitted being wrong in the past (I think I was wrong once in 2011), and I've acknowledged that the other persons information is correct.

People don't get to decide what offends others on here.

[sassysocks]

I'm not making assumptions, i'm merely countering yours. Could I ask what exactly makes a person a 'true Christian' then please?

Again, where has she exposed herself?

Mine are not just assumptions, they are based on the way she presents herself. She has her boobs hanging out and flashing her knickers and you ask how she exposed herself.

Someone also said they thought she may have done some porn, for which you said you saw nothing wrong with that and good luck to her if she wanted to use her 'assets' (bought and paid for) to make money.

If that's the kind of lifestyle she wants, that's fine - but you have attempted to define her as wholesome and innocent - which she clearly isn't.

Then you say she is intelligent enough to be a millionaire at 18, when marrying a wealthy old man put her in that position, but then claim she is not calculating. If you say so. :nono:

[MachoPoodle]

The above may or may not be true - but still comes down to one person's opinion on whether he was a predator, not on her motves for marrying him.

He had no idea of how young she was - who is he trying to kid. Even if she didn't look 16, it would have been obvious to anyone she was certainly way too young for him.

Did she pursue her acting career - or simply marry the millionaire acting teacher? Are people trying to suggest she had no idea of his wealth so therefore it could not have been a factor in her decision? You make it sound like some kind of Romeo and Juliet, but that seems extremely unlikely.

Yes, she is clearly insecure - that is obvious by the 'work' she has had done, but we are not talking about some kind of corrective surgery, she has gone for the oh so predictable bleached blonde, hugh boobs look. That speaks more than insecure, that speaks attention-seeking and looking for male attention of the wealthy kind.

Her husband is a creeper. I don't care how they met or what age he thought she was. Courtney herself though, I'm not comfortable judging so harshly. She's very young, clearly immature and getting married that age, even w/o that ridiculous age difference, is not exactly ideal for personal growth. I don't think she has any idea who she is, because she's had no chance of finding out.

As for the attention seeking, many young girls going about it in the way that she does, have a warped idea of love/intimacy/validation. That does not automatically translate into being greedy for money and/or a bad person.

[sassysocks]

Her husband is a creeper. I don't care how they met or what age he thought she was. Courtney herself though, I'm not comfortable judging so harshly. She's very young, clearly immature and getting married that age, even w/o that ridiculous age difference, is not exactly ideal for personal growth. I don't think she has any idea who she is, because she's had no chance of finding out.

As for the attention seeking, many young girls going about it in the way that she does, have a warped idea of love/intimacy/validation. That does not automatically translate into being greedy for money and/or a bad person.

I'm not saying I think she is a bad person, but I responded to the drivel about how sweet and innocent she was, as I do not agree with that at all.

[Northern Monkey]

So what if Courtney got her boobs done?They're HERS to do as SHE chooses.So what if she fell in love with an older man?It's HER decision to marry who she chooses.So what if she has bleached blonde hair?That's HER choice and it looks nice on her.So much female jealousy in here.She seems a lovely lass and she's done nothing wrong or nasty as of yet.

[Verbal]

[QUOTE=sassysocks;6329834]Mine are not just assumptions, they are based on the way she presents herself. She has her boobs hanging out and flashing her knickers and you ask how she exposed herself.

Would you like all women to dress in Hijabs? Maybe you should move to the middle east.


Someone also said they thought she may have done some porn, for which you said you saw nothing wrong with that and good luck to her if she wanted to use her 'assets' (bought and paid for) to make money.

If that's the kind of lifestyle she wants, that's fine - but you have attempted to define her as wholesome and innocent - which she clearly isn't.

My point in her being innocent was purely based on me seeing her being all concerend about a stuffed doll. I don't know what her lifestyle is and I don't particularly care.

The post you are referring to is someone who thinks she 'may' have done porn. An assumption.

Then you say she is intelligent enough to be a millionaire at 18, when marrying a wealthy old man put her in that position, but then claim she is not calculating. If you say so. :nono:

Again, for about the fourth time, how do you know her wealth is down just to her husband? She is a model, I doubt she is on minimum wage.

Honestly

[Verbal]

So what if Courtney got her boobs done?They're HERS to do as SHE chooses.So what if she fell in love with an older man?It's HER decision to marry who she chooses.So what if she has bleached blonde hair?That's HER choice and it looks nice on her.So much female jealousy in here.She seems a lovely lass and she's done nothing wrong or nasty as of yet.

She may have had a 'boob job' because she was suffering confidence issues. It strikes me as female jealousy to be honest, all this.

[MachoPoodle]

I'm not saying I think she is a bad person, but I responded to the drivel about how sweet and innocent she was, as I do not agree with that at all.

I'm not agreeing with the OP, mind. But I don't see why she can't be sweet? I think so far, she and Charlotte both seem to be, in their own ways. Alas, early days. Innocent, that depends on how you define it. Exactly whom over the age of 8 is innocent, really? I see what you're getting at, but I'm not too fond of the rhetoric, I guess.

[sassysocks]

[QUOTE]

Would you like all women to dress in Hijabs? Maybe you should move to the middle east.




My point in her being innocent was purely based on me seeing her being all concerend about a stuffed doll. I don't know what her lifestyle is and I don't particularly care.

The post you are referring to is someone who thinks she 'may' have done porn. An assumption.



Again, for about the fourth time, how do you know her wealth is down just to her husband? She is a model, I doubt she is on minimum wage.

Honestly

She isn't a model, she does glamour modelling. There is a hugh difference.

[Verbal]

[QUOTE=CynicalHermit;6329840]

She isn't a model, she does glamour modelling. There is a hugh difference.

Oh for crying out loud

[sassysocks]

She may have had a 'boob job' because she was suffering confidence issues. It strikes me as female jealousy to be honest, all this.

Sorry, but it is pathetic how some blokes will pull the old jealousy card out when running out of valid arguments. I was a fan of Hazel and said how jealous I was of her natural beauty, and I meant it. So that kinda of throws that nonsense out the window then.

Alternatively it could be said that some men think with a certain part of their anatomy and like Courtney for the more obvious reasons, colouring their judgement. Just a thought.

[Verbal]

Sorry, but it is pathetic how some blokes will pull the old jealousy card out when running out of valid arguments. I was a fan of Hazel and said how jealous I was of her natural beauty, and I meant it. So that kinda of throws that nonsense out the window then.

Alternatively it could be said that some men think with a certain part of their anatomy and like Courtney for the more obvious reasons, colouring their judgement. Just a thought.

Ok, you are becoming tedious now and starting to border on offensive. I am Asexual, I can assure you my opinions on the girl have absolutely nothing to do with her sexual presence.

I'm out

[DanaC]

She may have had a 'boob job' because she was suffering confidence issues. It strikes me as female jealousy to be honest, all this.

That bit is a cop out. A way of utterly dismissing any cultural concern a woman might feel over the plastification of womanhood.

That said, I agree with the rest of your point.

The reason I posted that wiki stuff was because it is important to have balance in these things. We can all question the age gap and the motives of these two people but since none of us know either of them we cannot reach conclusions.

In many, possibly most, unions between an exceptionally young woman and a much older man there may be an element of conscious or unconscious exploitation. But that doesn't mean always and in every case.

Most of what I talk about in here relates to cultural and societal norms and trends. But we as individual humans relate to each other in a multiplicity of ways. Our decisions are multi-layered, sometimes entirely contradictory. We are capable of being many things at once and seeing the world in many ways at once. trying to pin individuals down within a cultural context is useful at one level, but at another level it also removes the human from that equation.

As a woman I find much of what I see in Courtney troubling. And the idea of a 16 year old girl marrying a 51 year old man worrying for a number of reasons. But let's not fall into total assumption here about who these two people are. Otherwise we risk robbing this girl of her agency in our own minds.

[sassysocks]

Ok, you are becoming tedious now and starting to border on offensive. I am Asexual, I can assure you my opinions on the girl have absolutely nothing to do with her sexual presence.

I'm out

Fair enough, I meant no offence - but there is no denying is has had that effect on the judgement of some on here.

[Verbal]

That bit is a cop out. A way of utterly dismissing any cultural concern a woman might feel over the plastification of womanhood.

That said, I agree with the rest of your point.

The reason I posted that wiki stuff was because it is important to have balance in these things. We can all question the age gap and the motives of these two people but since none of us know either of them we cannot reach conclusions.

In many, possibly most, unions between an exceptionally young women and a much older man there may be an element of conscious or unconscious exploitation. But that doesn't mean always and in every case.

Most of what I talk about in here relates to cultural and societal norms and trends. But we as individual humans relate to each other in a multiplicity of ways. Our decisions are multi-layered, sometimes entirely contradictory. We are capable of being many things at once and seeing the world in many ways at once. trying to pin individuals down within a cultural context is useful at one level, but at another level it also removes the human from that equation.

As a woman I find much of what I see in Courtney troubling. And the idea of a 16 year old girl marrying a 51 year old man worrying for a number of reasons. But let's not fall into total assumption here about who these two people are. Otherwise we risk robbing this girl of her agency in our own minds.
That part you highlighted Dana, was a cheap, intentional, poorly thought out swipe, purely to get a reaction. I don't actually believe that.

[DanaC]

Fair enough CH :0

It's one of my bugbears. It seems to get rolled out anytime any woman has a problem with another woman.

[Tozzie]

Tbh, Charlotte is quite common around the uk lol.
Courtney is quite common around America. I prefer Courtney to Charlotte by far.

me too

[billy123]

Xe1a1wHxTyo

[smudgie]

Xe1a1wHxTyo

:joker: Excellent. Those were the days:hugesmile:

[Jack_]

Isn't it funny how sexual promiscuity is celebrated if it's a man but if it's a female they're a 'vile slut'? That's sexism for you :rolleyes: pathetic prudish sexism

[anne666]

You do realise, that every member of these mythical "modern youth" groups, aren't like this?

This.

[MachoPoodle]

Isn't it funny how sexual promiscuity is celebrated if it's a man but if it's a female they're a 'vile slut'? That's sexism for you :rolleyes: pathetic prudish sexism

Pretty much.

I'll never understand why getting your rocks off is different from taking care of other needs like blowing your nose, taking a ****, sleeping or eating.