Massive news announced about the formation of the Universe

[Crimson Dynamo]

The links have crashed at mo but check out BBC 24 and SKY News HD

HUGE NEWS:shocked:

[the truth]

let me guess everything the scientists told us last week was wrong and now they know everything this week lol

[Crimson Dynamo]

let me guess everything the scientists told us last week was wrong and now they know everything this week lol

No, but its not good news for you flat earthers :devil:

[Crimson Dynamo]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-26605974#TWEET1074415

[the truth]

No, but its not good news for you flat earthers :devil:

im not a flat earther but thanks for jumping to yet another wrong conclusion

[Jesus.]

let me guess everything the scientists told us last week was wrong and now they know everything this week lol

You do know that's how science works, right? When new evidence comes along to change or improve an existing theory, it is embraced by the scientific community because the only goal of the scientists is to find the truth.

It's better than believing the same thing on Wednesday as you believed on Monday, regardless of whatever happens on Tuesday.

[Z]

Just reading the article now, I find this topic difficult to get my head around because I'm not a scientifically minded person in any way :laugh: but my understanding is that they've essentially found the space equivalent of a jet stream that shows that the theory of inflation after the Big Bang occurred is true and therefore proves that the Big Bang Theory is undeniably fact?

[MTVN]

You do know that's how science works, right? When new evidence comes along to change or improve an existing theory, it is embraced by the scientific community because the only goal of the scientists is to find the truth.

It's better than believing the same thing on Wednesday as you believed on Monday, regardless of whatever happens on Tuesday.

Maybe in theory, in practice they can and often do have an agenda

[Z]

Maybe in theory, in practice they can and often do have an agenda

Has anyone told them that the truth is on TiBB?

[Crimson Dynamo]

You do know that's how science works, right? When new evidence comes along to change or improve an existing theory, it is embraced by the scientific community because the only goal of the scientists is to find the truth.

It's better than believing the same thing on Wednesday as you believed on Monday, regardless of whatever happens on Tuesday.

and the book is so badly typeset too - its not the crap thats in it that gets me its the way its presented. Type too small, 4 columns per page, thin bog roll paper - i mean if i were a god i would be putting a plague on my printers

[Crimson Dynamo]

Maybe in theory, in practice they can and often do have an agenda

I think we can rule this out here

[the truth]

You do know that's how science works, right? When new evidence comes along to change or improve an existing theory, it is embraced by the scientific community because the only goal of the scientists is to find the truth.

It's better than believing the same thing on Wednesday as you believed on Monday, regardless of whatever happens on Tuesday.

values dont change

[Jesus.]

Maybe in theory, in practice they can and often do have an agenda

Such as?

[Crimson Dynamo]

values dont change


sorry, can you explain?

[Jesus.]

values dont change

What do values have to do with science?

[the truth]

What do values have to do with science?

values have to do with everything.

[Kyle]

Struggling to see the agenda here tbh. :huh:

[Crimson Dynamo]

go to radio 5 now. Dickie Bacon is talking about it NOW

[Crimson Dynamo]

values have to do with everything.

i fear we are nearing "he works in mysterious ways territory" here :dog:

[Jesus.]

values have to do with everything.

That's just circular, and I'm going to step off this roundabout now.

[the truth]

That's just circular, and I'm going to step off this roundabout now.

yes having good values is too confusing for you

[Crimson Dynamo]

yes having good values is too confusing for you

just to confirm the result. you lost and your current form is not good. I think you could be looking at relegation to DS:bawling::bawling::bawling:

[Jesus.]

yes having good values is too confusing for you

The religious man with values takes aim at godless heathen.

[Kyle]

What is it with these religious people taking pot shots at humanity's scientific breakthroughs?

Why can't you just leave us atheists alone to our reason and logic? :bawling:

[Glenn.]

"Everything we see today - the galaxies, the stars, the planets - was imprinted at that moment"

[MTVN]

Such as?

Well in pretty much anything, scientists should really base their conclusions on their research but you'll often get those who base their research on trying to justify whatever preconceived ideas they hold. Like how historically the Nazis would use apparent science to support their claims of racial supremacy, or more recently how scientists have been shown to distort their findings for greater evidence of climate change. You could also say the fact there are Christian scientists proves this, that they maybe gear their research towards trying to show that scientific findings are not incompatible with their religion.

Not that this would just apply to science of course, it happens in everything, you see it a lot in history as well where people's political persuasions will influence the way they interpret certain events

[Jesus.]

Well in pretty much anything, scientists should really base their conclusions on their research but you'll often get those who base their research on trying to justify whatever preconceived ideas they hold. Like how historically the Nazis would use apparent science to support their claims of racial supremacy, or more recently how scientists have been shown to distort their findings for greater evidence of climate change. You could also say the fact there are Christian scientists proves this, that they maybe gear their research towards trying to show that scientific findings are not incompatible with their religion.

Not that this would just apply to science of course, it happens in everything, you see it a lot in history as well where people's political persuasions will influence the way they interpret certain events

I wouldn't class cognitive dissonance as an agenda, necessarily, but you've raised some interesting points.

That nazi science you mentioned is actually a good example of how exactly science works. As scientists learned more about the physiological/cognitive/biological make up of our species, then old disciplines, such as eugenics were left behind. It's also important to remember what they were actually there to do - they didn't have to tender for grants from science organisations - they were given people to experiment on, and brainwashed into an ideology of occultism and norse blood mythology.

I'm not too sure there were any scientists that exaggerated their findings on climate change. I remember the story well, but not the finer details, and I also remember a massive investigation being done into examining those emails, and after looking at the complete sets of emails, there was nothing found that was either wrong played up. We may be talking about different things with this one, and you may have a better recollection of that issue than I do, so I accept I could be wrong.

Science is such a long winded process these days, that agenda's are weeded out pretty quickly.

[King Gizzard]

Why can't you just leave us atheists alone to our reason and logic? :bawling:

Same can be said if you spun it the other way around, and in most cases it is the other way round more often

[arista]

They think they know a second split
right after the start of the Universe

a special test

Ch4HD News tonight 7PM

[MTVN]

I wouldn't class cognitive dissonance as an agenda, necessarily, but you've raised some interesting points.

That nazi science you mentioned is actually a good example of how exactly science works. As scientists learned more about the physiological/cognitive/biological make up of our species, then old disciplines, such as eugenics were left behind. It's also important to remember what they were actually there to do - they didn't have to tender for grants from science organisations - they were given people to experiment on, and brainwashed into an ideology of occultism and norse blood mythology.

I'm not too sure there were any scientists that exaggerated their findings on climate change. I remember the story well, but not the finer details, and I also remember a massive investigation being done into examining those emails, and after looking at the complete sets of emails, there was nothing found that was either wrong played up. We may be talking about different things with this one, and you may have a better recollection of that issue than I do, so I accept I could be wrong.

Science is such a long winded process these days, that agenda's are weeded out pretty quickly.

I was thinking about that incident yeah though having just looked it up it seems that a full investigation showed results hadn't been distorted which I didn't realise, though there were still criticisms over how they conducted their research

I'm not a great expert on it but even at the time was eugenics science not considered questionable at best, but it served a very clear political purpose for it to be presented as credible. I still think that can be the case today, that scientific findings or research can get manipulated when it's convenient to do so. Motives should always be questioned imo and it should never be taken at face value that all a scientist cares about is the truth and that their research will never be prejudiced by their own preconceived ideas or to serve their own or somebody else's interests. In all things you'll have competing groups and ideas that are going to want supposed scientific research behind them because it will give greater weight to their argument. Like the tobacco industry would used to employ scientists to try and show smoking wasn't as bad for you as made out, if those scientists are relying on that industry for their living and if their findings are expected to support it, then you'd have to question how reliable their research is

Obviously as with eugenics no scientist worth their salt would argue something like that nowadays but it's just an example that could easily be repeated in a different field before a consensus has been reached on something

[Kyle]

Same can be said if you spun it the other way around, and in most cases it is the other way round more often

That was what I was portraying. Role reversal.

Knew somebody would take it seriously.

[smeagol]

i try not to take much notice of these crackpot scientists they are basically mystic megs who guess most of the time.
The best technology cant even find a plane at the moment on our own planet and they think they know this and that about the universe.
truth is they know sod all. and look into things far to deeply for answers to theories that are just that theories in the first place. which renders everything horse poo anyway.
my theory is until they cant even explain the most simple of things then they shouldn't be trying to explain the universe. when in fact its all conjecture .
ask 10 big shots get 10 different theories.

[Crimson Dynamo]

i try not to take much notice of these crackpot scientists they are basically mystic megs who guess most of the time.
The best technology cant even find a plane at the moment on our own planet and they think they know this and that about the universe.
truth is they know sod all. and look into things far to deeply for answers to theories that are just that theories in the first place. which renders everything horse poo anyway.
my theory is until they cant even explain the most simple of things then they shouldn't be trying to explain the universe. when in fact its all conjecture .
ask 10 big shots get 10 different theories.

Such a depressing small minded post I just fail to see where to start. Take off your tinfoil hat and take a good look at the world beyond your bunker.

[smeagol]

Such a depressing small minded post I just fail to see where to start. Take off your tinfoil hat and take a good look at the world beyond your bunker.


your calling me small minded are you serious. please dont be another sheep ina world of sheep blindly following and listening to utter junk by so called experts.
small minded lol mirror time pal

[Marsh.]

Such a depressing small minded post I just fail to see where to start. Take off your tinfoil hat and take a good look at the world beyond your bunker.

You keep telling people their small minded and poke fun at their opinions, ask for clarifications but don't actually back up your own.

Come on Einstein, what is the world like beyond our bunkers?

Edit - And goodness knows why the thread's labelled "massive news", surely everyone's heard of the big bang before now?

[Crimson Dynamo]

You keep telling people their small minded and poke fun at their opinions, ask for clarifications but don't actually back up your own.

Come on Einstein, what is the world like beyond our bunkers?

Edit - And goodness knows why the thread's labelled "massive news", surely everyone's heard of the big bang before now?

Total facepalm at your last comment.

[Marsh.]

Total facepalm at your last comment.

Did the big bang theory take you by surprise?

http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Phoebe-Buffet-This-is-Brand-New-Information-Friends.gif

[the truth]

i try not to take much notice of these crackpot scientists they are basically mystic megs who guess most of the time.
The best technology cant even find a plane at the moment on our own planet and they think they know this and that about the universe.
truth is they know sod all. and look into things far to deeply for answers to theories that are just that theories in the first place. which renders everything horse poo anyway.
my theory is until they cant even explain the most simple of things then they shouldn't be trying to explain the universe. when in fact its all conjecture .
ask 10 big shots get 10 different theories.

Great post and totally right....these scientists act like theyre Gods themselves when in fact its all trial and error...I respect the work they do but their egos are way out of control and the way the try to state guess work as fact is frankly embarassing at times

[Kizzy]

lhTSfOZUNLo

[Crimson Dynamo]

Did the big bang theory take you by surprise?

http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Phoebe-Buffet-This-is-Brand-New-Information-Friends.gif

You dont even know what this thread is about do you


:laugh2:

[Crimson Dynamo]

Great post and totally right....these scientists act like theyre Gods themselves when in fact its all trial and error...I respect the work they do but their egos are way out of control and the way the try to state guess work as fact is frankly embarassing at times


Yes it was Einstein who first came up with the theory and he is like a total ego maniacal fool - him and his books -total vanity projects

:joker:

[Marsh.]

You dont even know what this thread is about do you


:laugh2:

What's that? Another vague non answer?

:joker: So much for your logic and reason.

[Livia]

I don't see why everyone can't celebrate every step, discovery and landmark made by science. After all, some of the most celebrated scientists through history have been people of religion. I don't feel that science and religion are necessarily exclusive of one another.

[Crimson Dynamo]

http://www.cfa.harvard.edu/sites/www.cfa.harvard.edu/files/styles/width720/public/images/pr//2014-05.jpg?itok=BnkjSDaz


"Almost 14 billion years ago, the universe we inhabit burst into existence in an extraordinary event that initiated the Big Bang. In the first fleeting fraction of a second, the universe expanded exponentially, stretching far beyond the view of our best telescopes. All this, of course, was just theory.

Researchers from the BICEP2 collaboration today announced the first direct evidence for this cosmic inflation. Their data also represent the first images of gravitational waves, or ripples in space-time. These waves have been described as the "first tremors of the Big Bang." Finally, the data confirm a deep connection between quantum mechanics and general relativity."


http://www.cfa.harvard.edu/news/2014-05

[thesheriff443]

this thread and its posts, made me think of back to the future and doc brown.

[smeagol]

speculation and theory finding any reason to state as fact. a wave is suddenly proof lol
14 billion years ago how do they know that. they cant even determine the age of our own earth history artifacts how things were made done dates and so forth. they cant even find a plane or cure the common cold or cancer that has various strains and waves of its own to work on.
yet behold a guy with a telescope says he knows the creation of the universe lol

cosmic inflation lol could be a billion things a billion reactions to a billion events a billion reasons that arn't even in our mindset. never mind evidence.

good to keep looking but they should really start stating its theory not proof. every proof gets crushed it always does whether its history or science its always turned over.

[Marsh.]

The reports all say "believe to be" "theory suggests".

Bit early to claim a massive discovery.

[Shaun]

well it was renewed for 3 seasons

[Kizzy]

http://scottishgeeks.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/reddwarf12_jpg.jpg

EmERGENCY.. EMERGENCY......THERE'S AN EMERGENCY GOING ON.

[Kizzy]

http://scottishgeeks.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/reddwarf12_jpg.jpg

It'S STILL GOING ON.....

[lostalex]

scientists could come out tomorrow and say that our entire universe is just the dream world of an ant colony in the amazon, and i'd still believe it more than anything any religion had to say.

I know FOR SURE that religion is a lie, i still have some faith in science though.

[Crimson Dynamo]

speculation and theory finding any reason to state as fact. a wave is suddenly proof lol
14 billion years ago how do they know that. they cant even determine the age of our own earth history artifacts how things were made done dates and so forth. they cant even find a plane or cure the common cold or cancer that has various strains and waves of its own to work on.
yet behold a guy with a telescope says he knows the creation of the universe lol

cosmic inflation lol could be a billion things a billion reactions to a billion events a billion reasons that arn't even in our mindset. never mind evidence.

good to keep looking but they should really start stating its theory not proof. every proof gets crushed it always does whether its history or science its always turned over.


And yet if you were to end up in hospital with a life threatening disease you would happily gobble up all the drugs that those scientists have developed to keep you alive.

Criticising scientific endeavor to boost your self confidence is never a good idea.

[the truth]

And yet if you were to end up in hospital with a life threatening disease you would happily gobble up all the drugs that those scientists have developed to keep you alive.

Criticising scientific endeavor to boost your self confidence is never a good idea.

some science is great some is a waste of enormous money.....it doesnt mean you cant criticize anything scientific fo fear of losing your medication, what an absurd argeument

[lostalex]

some science is great some is a waste of enormous money.....it doesnt mean you cant criticize anything scientific fo fear of losing your medication, what an absurd argeument

it's not an absurd argument though, if you believe that God controls of the universe, then only god can save you, so why would you need science if you have God on your side?

and you might say "god is working through my surgeon" but what if your surgeon is an atheist or a muslim, would you allow him/her to work on you? how could god be working through a surgeon who is not your religion, are you saying that god is taking over atheists or muslim bodies against their will? and performing miracles against their will? that seems wrong don't you think? it's like god is using atheist or muslim surgeons as a slave to do his work, does God approve of slavery?

[Crimson Dynamo]

some science is great some is a waste of enormous money.....it doesnt mean you cant criticize anything scientific fo fear of losing your medication, what an absurd argeument

Its what i thought you would say. The science that directly benefits me and that I can comprehend is great but the stuff I dont get or questions the beliefs i have inherited from my parents is bad.

:rolleyes:

[lostalex]

I've not seen any compelling evidence for the validity of any religion.

I'll just leave it at that.

but if anyone has any compelling evidence to prove a religion, i'm certainly open to it.

and no, personal anecdotes don't qualify as "compelling evidence", sorry. feeling your grandma's presence, or seeing a butterfly because your grandma loved butterflies, does not count as evidence.

[Nedusa]

scientists could come out tomorrow and say that our entire universe is just the dream world of an ant colony in the amazon, and i'd still believe it more than anything any religion had to say.

I know FOR SURE that religion is a lie, i still have some faith in science though.

I agree most science has a good degree of factual evidence to support it ie it is testable, reproduceable and universally agreed.

Whereas organised Religion is just a scam, the mad rantings of mad people who lived over 2,000 years ago in a world that bears no relation to the world we now live in.

And now we have to follow these ludicrous instructions, we have to adopt wierd practices and engage in strange behaviour or eat certain foods because thats what we believe in....??? really show me some proof...any proof...anything at all !!!

[Kazanne]

I don't know if this will help anyone,but I found it fascinating,I was asked once if scientists could make a blade of grass,I didn't know,I said I didn't think they could,I guess this kind of answers that ,although it's a long read it is interesting and offers some different opinions as to whether science is the answer to everything,
http://backtogodhead.in/todays-scientists-making-life-or-taking-life/

[Kazanne]

I agree most science has a good degree of factual evidence to support it ie it is testable, reproduceable and universally agreed.

Whereas organised Religion is just a scam, the mad rantings of mad people who lived over 2,000 years ago in a world that bears no relation to the world we now live in.

And now we have to follow these ludicrous instructions, we have to adopt wierd practices and engage in strange behaviour or eat certain foods because thats what we believe in....??? really show me some proof...any proof...anything at all !!!

People believe aliens exist and life beyond ours without proof,and no one HAS to follow anything,we have a choice.

[lostalex]

People believe aliens exist and life beyond ours without proof,and no one HAS to follow anything,we have a choice.

I believe aliens exist, and i believe in UFOs, but i would never condemn or harass or discriminate against someone who does't agree with me. that's the difference.

i would never say that people who don't believe in UFOs should have less rights, or be put in concentration camps, or put in insane asylums and lobotomized just because they don't agree with me about UFOs.\\

Religions have done that to people who don't believe in Jesus though, they have put them in insane asylums and concentration camps, and tortured them, lobotomized them, raped them. especially gay men.

[Kazanne]

I believe aliens exist, and i believe in UFOs, but i would never condemn or harass or discriminate against someone who does't agree with me. that's the difference.

i would never say that people who don't believe in UFOs should have less rights, or be put in concentration camps, or put in insane asylums and lobotomized just because they don't agree with me about UFOs.\\

Religions have done that to people who don't believe in Jesus though, they have put them in insane asylums and concentration camps, and tortured them, lobotomized them, raped them. especially gay men.

Not everyone who believes is like that though,that's what is objectionable the sweeping generalization ,I believe in God, but would never berate those who don't,we have a choice.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Not everyone who believes is like that though,that's what is objectionable the sweeping generalization ,I believe in God, but would never berate those who don't,we have a choice.

Were you brought up by parents who believe?

[sassysocks]

values dont change

Hugh cop-out.

[sassysocks]

I agree most science has a good degree of factual evidence to support it ie it is testable, reproduceable and universally agreed.

Whereas organised Religion is just a scam, the mad rantings of mad people who lived over 2,000 years ago in a world that bears no relation to the world we now live in.

And now we have to follow these ludicrous instructions, we have to adopt wierd practices and engage in strange behaviour or eat certain foods because thats what we believe in....??? really show me some proof...any proof...anything at all !!!

Religion is basically superstition. Some people simply need to believe in something and believe that some greater power will protect them if they believe.

Sadly others use it as a way of controlling others, through fear and intimidation. Just your common and garden bully boys.

[lostalex]

Not everyone who believes is like that though,that's what is objectionable the sweeping generalization ,I believe in God, but would never berate those who don't,we have a choice.

well i think the church is moving in that direction, and i know that the extremists are a minority in the chirstian religion, unfortunately in other religions it's not moving in that direction, in other parts of the world it's moving in the wrong direction. and you have to take accountability when things are done in your name, and it's up to you to speak out against things that are done in the name of your god.

[Kizzy]

I honestly can't see the difference between believing in god and believing aliens exist.... they are both supposed entities in the stars, what's the difference?
I prefer to keep an open mind, it would be ignorant to dismiss everything just as I haven't witnessed it.

[lostalex]

I honestly can't see the difference between believing in god and believing aliens exist.... they are both supposed entities in the stars, what's the difference?
I prefer to keep an open mind, it would be ignorant to dismiss everything just as I haven't witnessed it.

really you can't see a difference? how many millions of people have been killed in wars because people believe in UFOs?? oh yea, none. that's the difference. Millions have been killed in religious wars though.

that's a pretty big difference, right Kizzy?

there is no "Pope" of UFOs and if anyone claims to be a Pope of UFOs he's laughed off the stage. when christians laugh the Pope of christianity off the stage, then we'll be on the same page.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I honestly can't see the difference between believing in god and believing aliens exist.... they are both supposed entities in the stars, what's the difference?
I prefer to keep an open mind, it would be ignorant to dismiss everything just as I haven't witnessed it.

There is a huge difference. To understand how the universe was made, how planets are formed from space materials and how stars and galaxies form - to understand the chemistry needed for life to start on certain planets under certain conditions like in this galaxy and then to understand the number of similar galaxies that are around it would be mathematically folly to not think there was life elsewhere. To compare that to believing in a god based on some 2000 year old bog standard superstition is just not comparable.

Its not ignorant to dismiss religion, most people do so on the evidence that is set before them as they would about believing in anything. You can have an open mind but by your definition you are also open to leprechauns, giant hay eating dinosaurs that live in the earths core, moomins, clangers, dragons who live in the welsh hills and all sorts of crazy bat**** stuff.

[user104658]

really you can't see a difference? how many millions of people have been killed in wars because people believe in UFOs?? oh yea, none. that's the difference. Millions have been killed in religious wars though.

that's a pretty big difference, right Kizzy?

there is no "Pope" of UFOs and if anyone claims to be a Pope of UFOs he's laughed off the stage. when christians laugh the Pope of christianity off the stage, then we'll be on the same page.

"The Pope of UFOs" would be the best username. Ever.

[Kizzy]

There is a huge difference. To understand how the universe was made, how planets are formed from space materials and how stars and galaxies form - to understand the chemistry needed for life to start on certain planets under certain conditions like in this galaxy and then to understand the number of similar galaxies that are around it would be mathematically folly to not think there was life elsewhere. To compare that to believing in a god based on some 2000 year old bog standard superstition is just not comparable.

Its not ignorant to dismiss religion, most people do so on the evidence that is set before them as they would about believing in anything. You can have an open mind but by your definition you are also open to leprechauns, giant hay eating dinosaurs that live in the earths core, moomins, clangers, dragons who live in the welsh hills and all sorts of crazy bat**** stuff.

2000? try 15,000 that's when ancient civilisations were trying to leave us information.... What I'm suggesting is that what we call 'god' is an alien and they have been here.
If you can open your mind enough to contemplate the infinate nature of the universe that doesn't seem so unlikely does it?

[Kizzy]

really you can't see a difference? how many millions of people have been killed in wars because people believe in UFOs?? oh yea, none. that's the difference. Millions have been killed in religious wars though.

that's a pretty big difference, right Kizzy?

there is no "Pope" of UFOs and if anyone claims to be a Pope of UFOs he's laughed off the stage. when christians laugh the Pope of christianity off the stage, then we'll be on the same page.

Nowhere in my post was I suggesting there was or had been alex, I was just drawing a comparison between god and aliens is all.... I am aware there have been many conflicts in the name of religion.

[Crimson Dynamo]

2000? try 15,000 that's when ancient civilisations were trying to leave us information.... What I'm suggesting is that what we call 'god' is an alien and they have been here.
If you can open your mind enough to contemplate the infinate nature of the universe that doesn't seem so unlikely does it?

Which ancient 15,000 year old civilizations were leaving "us" messages? :conf:

[Kizzy]

Which ancient 15,000 year old civilizations were leaving "us" messages? :conf:

Well not 'us' in particular, I wasn't intending on that to be taken so literally you understand?
But the ancient Egyptians and the Mayans have both alluded to beings in their writings.

[Josy]

Which ancient 15,000 year old civilizations were leaving "us" messages? :conf:

Sumerians from the Mesopotamian area

[Crimson Dynamo]

Sumerians from the Mesopotamian area

and what messages are meant to have been left?

[Crimson Dynamo]

oh, i just read - unproven hokum

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_astronauts

[Kizzy]

To be fair the whole concept of aliens remains 'hokum' if you're looking for concrete proof?
And when searching for information wiki isn't gospel...... lol.

You wondered if there was evidence of religion prior to 2000yrs ago, as josy stated there was 3000+ yrs prior that.
What were they worshipping?

[Kyle]

To be fair the whole concept of aliens remains 'hokum' if you're looking for concrete proof?
And when searching for information wiki isn't gospel...... lol.

You wondered if there was evidence of religion prior to 2000yrs ago, as josy stated there was 3000+ yrs prior that.
What were they worshipping?

I assume they would just take a look at the world around them, be unable to explain it and so conjure up some form of ethereal creature/s to fill in the gaps. 'Let's have a God for the big bright yellow thing in the sky, let's have one for making babies and one that allows me to murder that tribe over there and not feel bad about it.'

[Crimson Dynamo]

To be fair the whole concept of aliens remains 'hokum' if you're looking for concrete proof?
And when searching for information wiki isn't gospel...... lol.

You wondered if there was evidence of religion prior to 2000yrs ago, as josy stated there was 3000+ yrs prior that.
What were they worshipping?

I was referring to organised religion not tribes idol worshiping or sunworship.

[Livia]

Oi Trumpet... stop cracking on like you understand all this new-fangled science stuff.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Oi Trumpet... stop cracking on like you understand all this new-fangled science stuff.

lol

I listened to an explanation today on Jeramey Vine about how the universe went from an atom to a marble at first - sounds not too big but its the same as going from an ink dot to something bigger than out own galaxy. Stephen Hawkins also was on - by the end blood was coming out of my ears, i had wet myself and the dog was barking and trying to catch her tail. :dog::umm2:


I had to have 30 minutes of Bargain Hunt to equalize my own space time consortium

[Livia]

LOL... Bargain Hunt.

You should try The Big Bang Theory. I get all my scientific information and knowledge from that programme, and from Monty Python's Galaxy Song. In fact, scientifically speaking, The Big Bang Theory theme and the Galaxy Song combined contain more scientific information than I left school with.

[Marsh.]

I know FOR SURE that religion is a lie.

Of course you do.

I've not seen any compelling evidence for the validity of any religion.

I've not seen any evidence for the invalidity of any religion? :conf:


Religions have done that to people who don't believe in Jesus though, they have put them in insane asylums and concentration camps, and tortured them, lobotomized them, raped them. especially gay men.

Whether you believe he was the son of God or not, Jesus did exist so that's a bit of a non-argument.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Of course you do.



I've not seen any evidence for the invalidity of any religion? :conf:



Whether you believe he was the son of God or not, Jesus did exist so that's a bit of a non-argument.

There is very little evidence if any that Jesus existed apart from his baptisation and crucifixion - in between little is really know and most made up - like him being supernatural.

[Marsh.]

There is very little evidence if any that Jesus existed apart from his baptisation and crucifixion - in between little is really know and most made up - like him being supernatural.

There is evidence this man existed, I said regardless of whether you believe him as the son of god.

[arista]

http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film2/dvdreviews38/life%20of%20brian%20blu-ray/c2.jpg

[lostalex]

Whether you believe he was the son of God or not, Jesus did exist so that's a bit of a non-argument.

Jim Jones really did exist too, that doesn't make him a prophet.

wanna know how i know that jim jones, and jesus, and moses, and mohammed were not prophets?

because THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS PROPHETS.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and considering there are millions of people in the world who want to believe in these prophets, and not one single person can come up with any kind of evidence... not even the most minute shred of evidence (and no, burnt toast that looks like jesus doesn't count)... there is nothing there. nothing. zero, zilch.

it's not real.

[Kizzy]

I assume they would just take a look at the world around them, be unable to explain it and so conjure up some form of ethereal creature/s to fill in the gaps. 'Let's have a God for the big bright yellow thing in the sky, let's have one for making babies and one that allows me to murder that tribe over there and not feel bad about it.'

Where did the concept of 'god' come from?

[lostalex]

Where did the concept of 'god' come from?

it came from egomaniacal men that wanted more power, so they frightened people by telling them that they knew all of their deepest darkest secret (god is always watching) so they used God as an excuse to make people feel guilty about themselves, and therefore submit to them (and 10% of their income)

it's a scam, and it's always been a scam.

oh and they threw in the added bonus that God loves you, and is always taking care of you, and you are a very special person who God loves. and if he doesn't take care of you, it's because of the Devil, so God never actually has to take accountability for anything bad that happens, let's just blame it on the Devil if something bad happens.

[Marsh.]

Jim Jones really did exist too, that doesn't make him a prophet.

Try reading what I post in future.

I said whether anybody believes in the "supernatural" stuff, Jesus himself did exist. It was response to your comment about "don't believe in Jesus".

[Marsh.]

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and considering there are millions of people in the world who want to believe in these prophets, and not one single person can come up with any kind of evidence... not even the most minute shred of evidence (and no, burnt toast that looks like jesus doesn't count)... there is nothing there. nothing. zero, zilch.

Hence why it's called "faith". Nobody needs to prove or explain any of their personal beliefs.

It can't be proven beyond doubt that it's impossible for there to be a god, so either way the argument hits a dead end.

[Kizzy]

it came from egomaniacal men that wanted more power, so they frightened people by telling them that they knew all of their deepest darkest secret (god is always watching) so they used God as an excuse to make people feel guilty about themselves, and therefore submit to them (and 10% of their income)

it's a scam, and it's always been a scam.

oh and they threw in the added bonus that God loves you, and is always taking care of you, and you are a very special person who God loves. and if he doesn't take care of you, it's because of the Devil, so God never actually has to take accountability for anything bad that happens, let's just blame it on the Devil if something bad happens.


That's a rather jaded modern take on religion, for thousands of years people have worshipped and revered the 'spirits in the sky'...in just the same way UFO watchers do now. Watching and waiting.

[Marsh.]

oh and they threw in the added bonus that God loves you, and is always taking care of you, and you are a very special person who God loves. and if he doesn't take care of you, it's because of the Devil, so God never actually has to take accountability for anything bad that happens, let's just blame it on the Devil if something bad happens.

There is no blame though, due to the free will parts of some religions.

The above explanation would be that the "devil" is the bad in anything, the temptation etc and "God" is the good. It's down to the person themselves which path they tread down as with anything. So if you lead a good life, it's not "credited" to God as you made your own decisions.

[the truth]

Jim Jones really did exist too, that doesn't make him a prophet.

wanna know how i know that jim jones, and jesus, and moses, and mohammed were not prophets?

because THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS PROPHETS.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and considering there are millions of people in the world who want to believe in these prophets, and not one single person can come up with any kind of evidence... not even the most minute shred of evidence (and no, burnt toast that looks like jesus doesn't count)... there is nothing there. nothing. zero, zilch.

it's not real.

everything he said was real, the value and meaning its had for billions for 2000 is real, the tens of thousands of temples and churches built in his name are real....Jesus had a greater impact on the world than anyone in history....especially a poster on TIBB who spreads nothing by cynicism

[sassysocks]

everything he said was real, the value and meaning its had for billions for 2000 is real, the tens of thousands of temples and churches built in his name are real....Jesus had a greater impact on the world than anyone in history....especially a poster on TIBB who spreads nothing by cynicism

The only things that are 'real' are the bricks and mortar the temples and churches are built with. The rest is hearsay and belief, nothing more. At the end of the day we are all posters on TIBB, whatever we believe and whatever we preach.

[Kizzy]

Still doesn't explain why some are 100% certain there are aliens and 100% certain there isn't a god... if we're going by concrete evidence as there's none for either?

[the truth]

The only things that are 'real' are the bricks and mortar the temples and churches are built with. The rest is hearsay and belief, nothing more. At the end of the day we are all posters on TIBB, whatever we believe and whatever we preach.

according to that logic everything we ever learn isnt real?

[Kyle]

Where did the concept of 'god' come from?

Humans are very creative animals. Faced by the complexity of life it's not beyond the realms of possibility they would construct deities or spirits or other mythological creatures to fill in the gaps.

[Jesus.]

There were people in the desert
with nothing much to do,
so they created god
and he created you.

[Kizzy]

Humans are very creative animals. Faced by the complexity of life it's not beyond the realms of possibility they would construct deities or spirits or other mythological creatures to fill in the gaps.

How complex could life have been thousands of years ago?
That's one theory yes, it's surprising that joined up across the globe the same images were being replicated on continents that weren't aware of each others existance?...

[Crimson Dynamo]

How complex could life have been thousands of years ago?
That's one theory yes, it's surprising that joined up across the globe the same images were being replicated on continents that weren't aware of each others existance?...

"How complex could life have been thousands of years ago? "


say wha? :think:

[Kizzy]

"How complex could life have been thousands of years ago? "


say wha? :think:

Am I supposed to understand what you mean by this? ...I don't.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Am I supposed to understand what you mean by this? ...I don't.

"How complex could life have been thousands of years ago? "

what do you mean by ^^^^^

[Kizzy]

"How complex could life have been thousands of years ago? "

what do you mean by ^^^^^

I would have thought it was obvious, then the onus was on basic survival food, clothing and shelter for most.

[Kyle]

Complex because they have ******* all answers for anything. When little baby choo choo asks his elder what the yellow thing in the sky is and what it does and how it got there he can say it's some God that did it instead of 'how the ******* do I know go away and stop asking me loads of questions'.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I would have thought it was obvious, then the onus was on basic survival food, clothing and shelter for most.

I would have thought starting each day with with i need food to survive and I need to avoid dying which is a distinct possibility as very complex, its us today that have uncomplicated easy lives.

[Kizzy]

Complex because they have ******* all answers for anything. When little baby choo choo asks his elder what the yellow thing in the sky is and what it does and how it got there he can say it's some God that did it instead of 'how the ******* do I know go away and stop asking me loads of questions'.

Again funny how the answers across the globe were very similar?... It's just a thought.

And LT then they didn't have as much time to contemplate the universe did they? They were busy just surviving.

[the truth]

yesterday it was 60 billion todays its 14 billion.....tomorrow it may be yesterday and were supposed to take what they say as fact lol