Helen vulnerable side. Is this the reason of her growing popularity?

[Vanessa]

I loved it last night. I have been waiting for her to show her nicer side in ages! I have noticed the comments on facebook gradually warming. Now there are Helen fans there and i never thought it would happen! BOTS audience also liking her. Why do you think the tide is turning? She was the most hated housemate not long ago, but most people actually quite like her now.

[Macie Lightfoot]

The public has a ridiculously short term memory.

/thread

[rubymoo]

I think Helen is faced with who she truly is and she doesn't like it.

Pav told her in the toilet exactly what she was like and she had to face it.

I did feel sad for her last night when she said..."why is it always me?" and i think that's been the underpinning theme to most of her life.

She seems to gob off then get pulled up for it, then she cries, in the real world this wouldn't happen as she can walk away and get on with her life, whereas in BB she is faced with others criticism and she doesn't like it, but i do think when she looks back on her time she will learn something.

She has had to grow up very quickly due to bad decisions she has made, and has to now take responsibility for her bad behaviour as an adult, because her behaviour wasn't challenged as a teenager she has a lot of bad habits that she now needs to lose, in some ways she's still 16.

[Vanessa]

I think Helen is faced with who she truly is and she doesn't like it.

Pav told her in the toilet exactly what she was like and she had to face it.

I did feel sad for her last night when she said..."why is it always me?" and i think that's been the underpinning theme to most of her life.

She seems to gob off then get pulled up for it, then she cries, in the real world this wouldn't happen as she can walk away and get on with her life, whereas in BB she is faced with others criticism and she doesn't like it, but i do think when she looks back on her time she will learn something.

She has had to grow up very quickly due to bad decisions she has made, and has to now take responsibility for her bad behaviour as an adult, because her behaviour wasn't challenged as a teenager she has a lot of bad habits that she now needs to lose, in some ways she's still 16.

I like that nicer side. That's what i've been wanting to see. She's very flawed, but then aren't we all?

[kefln]

Short term memory.

People have been waiting to see her nicer side to justify supporting her.

[Vanessa]

Short term memory.

People have been waiting to see her nicer side to justify supporting her.

It's the side i've wanted Charley from BB8 to show, but sadly she never did. We all have it, but some people are much more guarded.

[rubymoo]

I like that nicer side. That's what i've been wanting to see. She's very flawed, but then aren't we all?

We are getting to see her underneath layers, if BB was to go on for another month, we would probably get to see more of her nicer side.

I think everyone forgets that we all have our flaws!
My husband would say i have many:laugh:

[poppsywoppsy]

I like that nicer side. That's what i've been wanting to see. She's very flawed, but then aren't we all?

That nicer side is only there if you go along with her demands. Otherwise she will call you all the names under the sun.

She was still ranting at Ashleigh even when she had been told all her own faults.

She can see faults in others but does not want to address her own, She agrees that she has some, then won't agree her faults are worse than others. Self serving, she won't change even after this, her tears were of anger that she has been found out.

[Vanessa]

We are getting to see her underneath layers, if BB was to go on for another month, we would probably get to see more of her nicer side.

I think everyone forgets that we all have our flaws!
My husband would say i have many:laugh:

I wanted to give her a hug last night and reassure her that we actually like this nicer side of her.

[Vanessa]

That nicer side is only there if you go along with her demands. Otherwise she will call you all the names under the sun.

She was still ranting at Ashleigh even when she had been told all her own faults.

She can see faults in others but does not want to address her own, She agrees that she has some, then won't agree her faults are worse than others. Self serving, she won't change even after this, her tears were of anger that she has been found out.

I disagree. She admits her faults and always says sorry when she does wrong.

[Cherie]

Helen was pissed in the toilet last night, her tears were of drunk self pity and jealousy of Ashleigh nothing more.

[kefln]

It's the side i've wanted Charley from BB8 to show, but sadly she never did. We all have it, but some people are much more guarded.
So bad behaviour is ok, if you are "guarded"?

But how do you know when someone is guarded? Especially when you haven't met them, spoken to them, spent any time with them?

And if others are put on the defensive because of their bad behaviour, because of this "guarded" personality trait, who should be pitied?

[Vanessa]

So bad behaviour is ok, if you are "guarded"?

But how do you know when someone is guarded? Especially when you haven't met them, spoken to them, spent any time with them?

And if others are put on the defensive because of their bad behaviour, because of this "guarded" personality trait, who should be pitied?

Ashleigh has behaved badly as well, but because she's 18 she gets away with it. That doesn't wash with me.

[Northern Monkey]

She's only crying now she knows the final is approaching and she's ****ting herself about what a **** she's been and all the boos she'll get.

[Sophiee]

The public has a ridiculously short term memory.

/thread
this, they move on very quickly. I also think it's because she's been shown crying and 'targeted' in some instances (eg. the judge task) and people are feeling sorry for her.

[Marsh.]

Yet when Ashleigh is the target of such tasks it's "Big Brother Bias!" "Producers want Ashleigh out!"

[kefln]

Ashleigh has behaved badly as well, but because she's 18 she gets away with it. That doesn't wash with me.
Ah, so you "blame" Ashleigh the girl living at home with her family, who raises funds for charity and runs workshops*to help young women improve their*confidence - see I can read bios too, and I don't need to embellish.

For Helen you have huge backstory about why she's so aggressive, and why she picks on people. But it doesn't wash with you when another HM complains about the very behaviour you are making excuses for.

[Vanessa]

Ah, so you "blame" Ashleigh the girl living at home with her family, who raises funds for charity and runs workshops*to help young women improve their*confidence - see I can read bios too, and I don't need to embellish.

For Helen you have huge backstory about why she's so aggressive, and why she picks on people. But it doesn't wash with you when another HM complains about the very behaviour you are making excuses for.

Sorry, but Ashleigh can be just as bad. She's no saint.

[kefln]

Sorry, but Ashleigh can be just as bad. She's no saint.
Where is saint coming from?

And how do you define just as bad?

Can Helen screaming “Slugworth” at Jale for the grievous crime of eating on a couch near her, or screaming obscenities in Mathews face that required BB intervention, be compared to Ashleigh saying “dick” and rolling her eyes?

[Vanessa]

Where is saint coming from?

And how do you define just as bad?

Can Helen screaming “Slugworth” at Jale for the grievous crime of eating on a couch near her, or screaming obscenities in Mathews face that required BB intervention, be compared to Ashleigh saying “dick” and rolling her eyes?

They can both be a nightmare, but i prefer Helen. At least she's honest and admits it when she's wrong. Plus she's a brilliant housemate.

[Beso]

NICER SIDE!!

I'd hate to see her bad side then.

[kefln]

They can both be a nightmare, but i prefer Helen. At least she's honest and admits it when she's wrong. Plus she's a brilliant housemate.
Again one sits quietly with her friends, not troubling anyone - unless she's recorded and played back. The other has started numerous aggressive fights.

And exactly how is Helen "honest"? Screaming at people you don't like isn't honest. Its how badly behaved children act.

[Vanessa]

Again one sits quietly with her friends, not troubling anyone - unless she's recorded and played back. The other has started numerous aggressive fights.

And exactly how is Helen "honest"? Screaming at people you don't like isn't honest. Its how badly behaved children act.

We'll have to agree to disagree on this.

[kefln]

We'll have to agree to disagree on this.
I have no problem with that. Its all good fun.

[Kizzy]

Yet when Ashleigh is the target of such tasks it's "Big Brother Bias!" "Producers want Ashleigh out!"

I thought the task was really heartless as she's more or less been put on trial by the public and the press over the rooney thing. It is bias they want to create drama and this was a way to do it it was totally unfair.
'It's always me' yes it is, getting 100% blame for that idiots infidelity and for creating the divide when it was clear ashleigh just disliked helen from the get go.

[wormsinfested]

Helen is a douchy scumbag who only cries when its herself that gets the heat and laugh at everybody else when they are sad.

[Marsh.]

I thought the task was really heartless as she's more or less been put on trial by the public and the press over the rooney thing. It is bias they want to create drama and this was a way to do it it was totally unfair.
'It's always me' yes it is, getting 100% blame for that idiots infidelity and for creating the divide when it was clear ashleigh just disliked helen from the get go.

Exactly. Even on night 1 Danielle was talking behind Helen's back about "seeing problems" creating negativity and who did she befriend? Ashleigh.

[kefln]

Exactly. Even on night 1 Danielle was talking behind Helen's back about "seeing problems" creating negativity and who did she befriend? Ashleigh.
Was that the same night that Helen and Tamara hid in the toilet and started calling Jale "Slugworth" based solely on her appearance? And the night that Pauline saw Chris's VT, in which he was clearly joking around, and she told everyone that he was going to piss in the kitchen. Which led to the most awkward looking for a bed scene ever.

So creating negativity, who did it best?

[Marsh.]

Was that the same night that Helen and Tamara hid in the toilet and started calling Jale "Slugworth" based solely on her appearance? And the night that Pauline saw Chris's VT, in which he was clearly joking around, and she told everyone that he was going to piss in the kitchen. Which led to the most awkward looking for a bed scene ever.

So creating negativity, who did it best?

Bless, because I said Helen was blameless didn't I? Don't jump to conclusions dear.

Slugsworth didn't happen until later in week 2 but no matter.

[Kizzy]

Was that the same night that Helen and Tamara hid in the toilet and started calling Jale "Slugworth" based solely on her appearance? And the night that Pauline saw Chris's VT, in which he was clearly joking around, and she told everyone that he was going to piss in the kitchen. Which led to the most awkward looking for a bed scene ever.

So creating negativity, who did it best?

Pauline without a doubt.

[bots]

I don't understand why more people aren't seeing that BB is messing with all the hm's heads, manipulating hm's into positions of conflict, testing the limits of acceptable human behaviour toward each other.

I'm not attempting to excuse Helen's or anyone elses behaviour, but BB has pushed the buttons and waited for the fur to fly. Many of the remaining hm's look completely drained to me, including Ash who is the most laid back of them all.

If we are starting to see peoples vulnerable sides, its no surprise to me. But the qualities I like in Helen, I have been noticing more and more for weeks now. She is pretty transparent in all she does, good and bad shine through pretty clearly. After that, its just personal opinion as to whether you like the person or not - same as it is with every other person on the planet.

[kefln]

Bless, because I said Helen was blameless didn't I? Don't jump to conclusions dear.
Thats sweet...dropping Daneille and Ashleigh together, along with the words "night 1" and "creating negativity"...and when someone comes along and points out they were all at it...


Slugsworth didn't happen until later in week 2 but no matter.
Actually Helen came up with the name Slugsworth on June 7th, with Tamara in the toilet. But why let facts get in the way?

And in case you need reminding, in the toilet, after slating Chris, calling him a dick and wanting him to ****** off, based solely on what Pauline had reported about the VT's. Helen said that she liked everyone else, and to quote "apart from the slug, slugsworth, can that be our own private nickname?".

And we are back to creating negativity, something that you said was an issue.

[kefln]

Pauline without a doubt.
And I'd agree. Pauline was a total nightmare of an individual.

[Kizzy]

And I'd agree. Pauline was a total nightmare of an individual.

She poisoned the minds against many HMs early on, chris, jale mainly, did that have an effect as the power housemate as to how they were treated by the rest of the house? Yes.

[Marsh.]

Actually Helen came up with the name Slugsworth on June 7th, with Tamara in the toilet. But why let facts get in the way?

And in case you need reminding, in the toilet, after slating Chris, calling him a dick and wanting him to ****** off, based solely on what Pauline had reported about the VT's. Helen said that she liked everyone else, and to quote "apart from the slug, slugsworth, can that be our own private nickname?".

And we are back to creating negativity, something that you said was an issue.

Responding to someone else's point about something else entirely. But you can't handle it so let's drag a load of other people into it. Yes, they were negative, does that somehow mean Ashleigh and Danielle weren't? No.

My main point is that Danielle and Ashleigh didn't need any encouraging before they immediately put a divide/wall between themselves and Helen, Danielle doing it within minutes. Helen/Pauline/Jale/Chris has zero to do with it.

But then she's come out and admitted to a fully fledged game plan so we know it for a fact anyway.

Thats sweet...dropping Daneille and Ashleigh together, along with the words "night 1" and "creating negativity"...and when someone comes along and points out they were all at it...

Because when a discussion is based on a particular topic/person, I stick to it. I don't feel the need to constantly drag other things into it.

Whether Helen, Pauline or bloody Tamara were being negative doesn't change the point about Danielle and Ashleigh.

[kefln]

Responding to someone else's point about something else entirely. But you can't handle it so let's drag a load of other people into it. Yes, they were negative, does that somehow mean Ashleigh and Danielle weren't? No.

My main point is that Danielle and Ashleigh didn't need any encouraging before they immediately put a divide/wall between themselves and Helen, Danielle doing it within minutes. Helen/Pauline/Jale/Chris has zero to do with it.

But then she's come out and admitted to a fully fledged game plan so we know it for a fact anyway.
And I could say that you can't handle when some brings up a point contrary to your own. Its easily said.

You put Danielle and Ashleigh into a statement about "creating negativity" on day one. What you completely failed to mention was that the conversation that Daneille had was about Tamara, that she had a sixth sense that they weren't going to get on. Something that she admitted was based on first impressions. And she had this conversation with Matthew after he asked her if there was anyone she didn't like from their initial meetings. This was part of a larger conversation where they were discussing Pauline having to make snap judgements on people based on VT's, and how difficult that would be.

Ashleigh had nothing to do with that conversation. You chose to make that link. Daneille's point wasn't made maliciously, it was part of a conversation and she was answering a question, based on how you would chose to punish and reward someone after just meeting them.


Because when a discussion is based on a particular topic/person, I stick to it. I don't feel the need to constantly drag other things into it.

Whether Helen, Pauline or bloody Tamara were being negative doesn't change the point about Danielle and Ashleigh.
In response to your misleading points and connections, I brought up actual conversations that created negativity, both those aren't what you want to talk about.

If you want to talk about creating negativity in the house at least try to find actual examples, instead of making tenuous links, based on half facts.

[Daffodil]

All of the housemates have vulnerable sides, but Helen's assertive dominance makes her vulnerability look greater than normal people's.

[Marsh.]

And I could say that you can't handle when some brings up a point contrary to your own. Its easily said.

You put Danielle and Ashleigh into a statement about "creating negativity" on day one. What you completely failed to mention was that the conversation that Daneille had was about Tamara, that she had a sixth sense that they weren't going to get on. Something that she admitted was based on first impressions. And she had this conversation with Matthew after he asked her if there was anyone she didn't like from their initial meetings. This was part of a larger conversation where they were discussing Pauline having to make snap judgements on people based on VT's, and how difficult that would be.

Ashleigh had nothing to do with that conversation. You chose to make that link. Daneille's point wasn't made maliciously, it was part of a conversation and she was answering a question, based on how you would chose to punish and reward someone after just meeting them.


In response to your misleading points and connections, I brought up actual conversations that created negativity, both those aren't what you want to talk about.

If you want to talk about creating negativity in the house at least try to find actual examples, instead of making tenuous links, based on half facts.

Oh dear, like a dog with a bone.

Your points were irrelevant to the discussion you joined in with. Accept it and move on.

[kefln]

Oh dear, like a dog with a bone.

Your points were irrelevant to the discussion you joined in with. Accept it and move on.
Aaawww...Its hard when people refute made up points with detailed facts isn't it? Easier to dismiss them...call them irrelevant...

[jessicadanielle]

I disagree. She admits her faults and always says sorry when she does wrong.

I'd have to disagree. Quite often she does, but in this trial task she couldn't even admit that she's played a part in the divide... Almost every hm has played their part in the divide imo, and because Helen and Ashleigh are stronger characters it's been pinned on them.

[Marsh.]

Aaawww...Its hard when people refute made up points with detailed facts isn't it? Easier to dismiss them...call them irrelevant...

Responding to "Danielle was negative" with "Helen is negative too" isn't refuting made up points, it's derailing what was said. Helen being negative has no effect on the point I was making about Danielle.

But continue to derail.

[kefln]

Responding to "Danielle was negative" with "Helen is negative too" isn't refuting made up points, it's derailing what was said. Helen being negative has no effect on the point I was making about Danielle.

But continue to derail.
I'm sorry, but making things up about Danielle, taking a conversation out of context, changing who the conversation was about and linking it to someone that wasn't there, is derailing.

If you can't stick to events that actually happened and need to make stuff up to prove a point, then the debate has no meaning.

[Liam-]

I'm sorry, but making things up about Danielle, taking a conversation out of context, changing who the conversation was about and linking it to someone that wasn't there, is derailing.

If you can't stick to events that actually happened and need to make stuff up to prove a point, then the debate has no meaning.

It's pretty common knowledge that Danielle was a miserable ballsack the entire time she was there.. apart from the time that she was creeping on Winston :idc:

[billy123]

I loved it last night. I have been waiting for her to show her nicer side in ages! I have noticed the comments on facebook gradually warming. Now there are Helen fans there and i never thought it would happen! BOTS audience also liking her. Why do you think the tide is turning? She was the most hated housemate not long ago, but most people actually quite like her now. :thumbs: Helen attracted so much hate just because of the free pass which wasnt her fault.
I think there were a lot of people that liked her but were afraid to say so because of some of the aggression aimed at her by so many others.
Im glad that snideleighs reign of terror is oven and everyone has seen her for the horrible malicious girl she really is.

Helen deserves this.
She might not win but a top 3 finish will be a victory for all her supporters.

[Marsh.]

I'm sorry, but making things up about Danielle, taking a conversation out of context, changing who the conversation was about and linking it to someone that wasn't there, is derailing.

If you can't stick to events that actually happened and need to make stuff up to prove a point, then the debate has no meaning.

Yeah, I completely made that up. :rolleyes: Danielle wasn't negative at all.

She didn't spend the first week isolating herself and anyone she could ensnare whining with her fake offence at bad language and sex. Which she's admitted to as her game plan so is proving my point.

Who caused Helen's first outburst? Oh yeah, Danielle calling the girls slags. I imagined that too. :rolleyes:

[kefln]

It's pretty common knowledge that Danielle was a miserable ballsack the entire time she was there.. apart from the time that she was creeping on Winston :idc:
My statement was a direct reply to Marsh's, saying that Danielle was talking behind Helen's back on day one, spreading negativity, and that it relates to Ashleigh.

[kefln]

Yeah, I completely made that up. :rolleyes: Danielle wasn't negative at all.
Actually you did:

Exactly. Even on night 1 Danielle was talking behind Helen's back about "seeing problems" creating negativity and who did she befriend? Ashleigh.

This never happened. And because it never happened what has it got to do with Ashleigh.


She didn't spend the first week isolating herself and anyone she could ensnare whining with her fake offence at bad language and sex. Which she's admitted to as her game plan so is proving my point.
And who's derailing the conversation now?

You "point" was on what happen on the first night. And at what point did I "defend" Danielle, I simply pointed out that your statement was wrong and that others were far worse on the first/second night.


Who caused Helen's first outburst? Oh yeah, Danielle calling the girls slags. I imagined that too. :rolleyes:
Derailing...as you would put it...

[Marsh.]

My statement was a direct reply to Marsh's, saying that Danielle was talking behind Helen's back on day one, spreading negativity, and that it relates to Ashleigh.

Danielle befriended Ashleigh, which coincided with Ashleigh starting to feature in the highlights more after being wallpaper for two weeks.

She then spent the highlights shows in the bedroom and pod isolated from the rest of the house right through to Toya then Danielle's evictions.

[Marsh.]

Derailing...as you would put it...

Well when you insist on pursuing an irrelevant point, I answered you to to put an end to it. :)

[Kizzy]

I can't move for straw men..... :)

[kefln]

Danielle befriended Ashleigh, which coincided with Ashleigh starting to feature in the highlights more after being wallpaper for two weeks.

She then spent the highlights shows in the bedroom and pod isolated from the rest of the house right through to Toya then Danielle's evictions.
But your point was that Daneille was taking behind Helen's back on day one, spreading negativity. And the follow up to that point was that she befriended Ashleigh. Linking the two. Creating negativity, Daneille, Ashleigh and how it all began on day one.

I called you on that point and now you are talking about weeks later, fights and wallpaper.

[kefln]

Well when you insist on pursuing an irrelevant point, I answered you to to put an end to it. :)
How is correcting you on something that didn't happen irrelevant? Especially when you tried to link something that didn't happen to another HM?

[Marsh.]

I can't move for straw men..... :)

It's suffocating isn't it?

But your point was that Daneille was taking behind Helen's back on day one, spreading negativity. And the follow up to that point was that she befriended Ashleigh. Linking the two. Creating negativity, Daneille, Ashleigh and how it all began on day one.

I called you on that point and now you are talking about weeks later, fights and wallpaper.

Yes, it began on day 1. Key word "began". Danielle spread to Ashleigh who went from being fairly quiet amongst the louder housemates to feeding on Danielle's vitriol and becoming the two whinging pod dwellers.

But deny it all you wish.

[Marsh.]

How is correcting you on something that didn't happen irrelevant? Especially when you tried to link something that didn't happen to another HM?

It did happen. Re-watch any video from day 1 to Danielle's eviction and there isn't one containing her that isn't her being negative and spreading it.

Unless you're closer to the end of her time, in which case her game plan switches and she attempts some feeble catholic virgin showmance.

[Miranda123]

I like that nicer side. That's what i've been wanting to see. She's very flawed, but then aren't we all?

A flawed housemate is what we want

Miss Prissy knickers is the most boring bitch ever, and if she won, it would be worse than Rachel Rice winning cause at least when she won, there were no real competitors that deserved it. Thank God for Helen

HELEN TO WIN!

[Kizzy]

It's suffocating isn't it?

.

Let the crows have em... :hehe:

[kefln]

Yes, it began on day 1. Key word "began". Danielle spread to Ashleigh who went from being fairly quiet amongst the louder housemates to feeding on Danielle's vitriol and becoming the two whinging pod dwellers.

But deny it all you wish.
Or...after a couple of weeks of listening to fight after fight, fingerblasting conversations, Ashleigh and Daneille had enough.

It can be spun both ways.

[Marsh.]

Or...after a couple of weeks of listening to fight after fight, fingerblasting conversations, Ashleigh and Daneille had enough.

It can be spun both ways.

Going back to my original point Danielle "had enough" on day 1. Negative from the start, thank you very much for bringing us full circle in this thread. Danielle was negative from the start due to no other housemate's actions or words. As she said on BOTS that was her game plan, to fake the offence and be against all the swearers and sex talk. All of which then resulted in her and Helen coming to blows, Helen's first argument, caused by Danielle bitching and Steven's stirring.

Her game plan failed horribly though as she couldn't keep the act up for more than a couple of hours at a time.

[kefln]

It did happen.
No it didn't.

There was no conversation on day one involving Daneille about Helen that was "creating negativity", as you claimed.

Re-watch any video from day 1 to Danielle's eviction and there isn't one containing her that isn't her being negative and spreading it.

Unless you're closer to the end of her time, in which case her game plan switches and she attempts some feeble catholic virgin showmance.
Now that's irrelevant.

You said it yourself:
My main point is that Danielle and Ashleigh didn't need any encouraging before they immediately put a divide/wall between themselves and Helen, Danielle doing it within minutes.
Your main point was that Danielle and Ashleigh immediately created a divide.
Immediately. This never happened. Total fabrication.

You can talk about Ashleigh being wallpaper all you want. You can discuss how things developed, in your opinion, all you want. But you stated that YOUR MAIN POINT was that it started on day one. Within minutes.

The only negativity that started immediately was from Pauline and her reaction to the VT's and Helen's comments about Jale.

[kefln]

Going back to my original point Danielle "had enough" on day 1. Negative from the start, thank you very much for bringing us full circle in this thread. Danielle was negative from the start due to no other housemate's actions or words. As she said on BOTS that was her game plan, to fake the offence and be against all the swearers and sex talk. All of which then resulted in her and Helen coming to blows, Helen's first argument, caused by Danielle bitching and Steven's stirring.

Her game plan failed horribly though as she couldn't keep the act up for more than a couple of hours at a time.
I have no interest in Daneille. What her "game plan" was means nothing to me. She was evicted. She's not in the running any more.

Your original point Danielle, your MAIN point to use your own words, was that Daneille started spreading negativity within minutes. This is completely wrong.

[Marsh.]

You have no interest in Danielle, despite starting a debate over my post about Danielle.

Ok love. :pat:

[Marsh.]

I have no interest in Daneille. What her "game plan" was means nothing to me. She was evicted. She's not in the running any more.

Your original point Danielle, your MAIN point to use your own words, was that Daneille started spreading negativity within minutes. This is completely wrong.

Really? Telling Matthew she felt something was off with two housemates within minutes isn't being negative? Ok then. :pat:

[kefln]

You have no interest in Danielle, despite starting a debate over my post about Danielle.

Ok love. :pat:
Your incorrect post about Daneille, Ashleigh and Helen. Yes.

Does the little smiley help with your lack of a point?

[kefln]

Really? Telling Matthew she felt something was off with two housemates within minutes isn't being negative? Ok then. :pat:
So did you look it up and realise that it had nothing to do with Helen or Ashleigh then? Or did you just reread what I posted earlier?

Did you understand the context of what she said? In relation to the conversation about how difficult it would to be in Pauline's position? Having to pick two people out? Did you spot how it was Matthew that asked the question, then had to ask it a couple more times before she responded. And how she admitted that it was a "sixth sense" gut instinct.

Cause if you did you'd realise she wasn't telling Matthew anything. And that your "MAIN POINT" is completely wrong.

[Pete.]

If Ashleigh can be accused of game playing then so can Helen 'creating' this nicer side of her. Whether it's her real nature or not, the argumentative side of her is who she really is. It's a shame people have forgotten what she's really like

[Marsh.]

So did you look it up and realise that it had nothing to do with Helen or Ashleigh then? Or did you just reread what I posted earlier?

Did you understand the context of what she said? In relation to the conversation about how difficult it would to be in Pauline's position? Having to pick two people out? Did you spot how it was Matthew that asked the question, then had to ask it a couple more times before she responded. And how she admitted that it was a "sixth sense" gut instinct.

Cause if you did you'd realise she wasn't telling Matthew anything. And that your "MAIN POINT" is completely wrong.

And around in circles she goes despite not being interested in discussing Danielle apparently.

Are you finished yet? Has the derailed train not hit a wall?

SHE brought it up my love. They were discussing Pauline having a tough decision and then she made a separate comment about knowing she would have problems with two housemates. Negativity, negativity, negativity.

You disagreed she was negative from the start and now finally admit it. Take your straw man home.

[Marsh.]

If Ashleigh can be accused of game playing then so can Helen 'creating' this nicer side of her. Whether it's her real nature or not, the argumentative side of her is who she really is. It's a shame people have forgotten what she's really like

As opposed to real people having more than one side. She obviously isn't "just" argumentative.

[kefln]

And around in circles she goes despite not being interested in discussing Danielle apparently.

Are you finished yet? Has the derailed train not hit a wall?

SHE brought it up my love. They were discussing Pauline having a tough decision and then she made a separate comment about knowing she would have problems with two housemates. Negativity, negativity, negativity.

You disagreed she was negative from the start and now finally admit it. Take your straw man home.
Of course I'm going in circles, its what happens when you are debating with people who have fictitious points.

There was a whole running conversation, during which she was laughing, as was Matthew. It had nothing to do with Helen. It had nothing to do with Ashleigh. It had nothing to do with creating a divide.

But you will keep reiterating it, despite much worse examples of others on the opening nights, for your own reasons.

PS
Is your straw man related to your smilies? Do you feel like it adds to the point? Somehow makes a debate better? Or do they just come out when you are backtracking?

[Marsh.]

Of course I'm going in circles, its what happens when you are debating with people who have fictitious points.

There was a whole running conversation, during which she was laughing, as was Matthew. It had nothing to do with Helen. It had nothing to do with Ashleigh. It had nothing to do with creating a divide.

But you will keep reiterating it, despite much worse examples of others on the opening nights, for your own reasons.

PS
Is your straw man related to your smilies? Do you feel like it adds to the point? Somehow makes a debate better? Or do they just come out when you are backtracking?

Hi again! Still continuing a conversation that 12 pages ago you said you had no interest in? :pat:

Says it all when you resort to talking about smilies. Bless.


There was a whole running conversation, during which she was laughing, as was Matthew. It had nothing to do with Helen. It had nothing to do with Ashleigh. It had nothing to do with creating a divide.

But you will keep reiterating it, despite much worse examples of others on the opening nights, for your own reasons.


There you go misunderstanding AGAIN. It wasn't about who was "worse" it was about Danielle's negativity from the start, then befriending Ashleigh and together causing a divide between themselves and the rest of the group. Fact.

But take comments and spiral them into something I didn't say. :pat: I'll leave you to it.

[kefln]

Hi again! Still continuing a conversation that 12 pages ago you said you had no interest in? :pat:

Says it all when you resort to talking about smilies. Bless.



There you go misunderstanding AGAIN. It wasn't about who was "worse" it was about Danielle's negativity from the start, then befriending Ashleigh and together causing a divide between themselves and the rest of the group. Fact.

But take comments and spiral them into something I didn't say. :pat: I'll leave you to it.

Of couse you didn't say it...

My main point is that Danielle and Ashleigh didn't need any encouraging before they immediately put a divide/wall between themselves and Helen, Danielle doing it within minutes.

Exactly. Even on night 1 Danielle was talking behind Helen's back about "seeing problems" creating negativity and who did she befriend? Ashleigh.

You just keep denying it and bringing out your smiles, but its there in Quotes.

You keep denying that other HMs said far worse on night one/two, claiming to be irrelevant in a conversation where you want to "prove" who created the negative feelings on day one.

And to top it all off you talk about me saying something 12 pages ago, in a 3 page thread, making things up again. But don't worry, a smilie face will make up for you inconsistencies. :joker:

[JoshBB]

I think it may have helped, but I've liked her all along.. so.

[Marsh.]

Of couse you didn't say it...





You just keep denying it and bringing out your smiles, but its there in Quotes.

You keep denying that other HMs said far worse on night one/two, claiming to be irrelevant in a conversation where you want to "prove" who created the negative feelings on day one.

And to top it all off you talk about me saying something 12 pages ago, in a 3 page thread, making things up again. But don't worry, a smilie face will make up for you inconsistencies. :joker:

:facepalm: My god, how old are you?

I never denied anyone was worse, I said it's irrelevant because we're discussing the divide centring around Helen and Ashleigh, Danielle had a huge effect on Ashleigh as Danielle was negative from the start. I didn't say Ashleigh was negative from the start, she was wallpaper for 2 weeks.

This is the last I'll say on it as you seem determined to argue over the pettiest of things because you took a fit over what I said about Danielle (and then laughably stating you had no interest in Danielle when it was her that sparked your input).

I have no inconsistencies, hardly my problem that you choose to focus on smilies and other such diversionary tactics because you lack the logic to see Danielle's effect on Ashleigh.

Danielle was negative from day 1 and spread it around her group. The end.

[Jordan.]

The public can't help but always support the insecure 'victim' and that's the role Helen is playing atm

[kefln]

:facepalm: My god, how old are you?

I never denied anyone was worse, I said it's irrelevant because we're discussing the divide centring around Helen and Ashleigh, Danielle had a huge effect on Ashleigh as Danielle was negative from the start. I didn't say Ashleigh was negative from the start, she was wallpaper for 2 weeks.

This is the last I'll say on it as you seem determined to argue over the pettiest of things because you took a fit over what I said about Danielle (and then laughably stating you had no interest in Danielle when it was her that sparked your input).

I have no inconsistencies, hardly my problem that you choose to focus on smilies and other such diversionary tactics because you lack the logic to see Danielle's effect on Ashleigh.

Danielle was negative from day 1 and spread it around her group. The end.
I suppose when in doubt, have a go at the poster. And call "the end".

This is a forum and people come here to debate. I disagree with your point, but I won't question you age, talk about you having fits over points, or tell a fellow board member that they are derailing an open conversation when they refute a point, or tell them to take their strawman home.

And that is "the end" from me.

[kefln]

The public can't help but always support the insecure 'victim' and that's the role Helen is playing atm

I wouldn't say she's playing the victim, she seemed genuinely upset. Its just a question on whether her reasons for being upset take into account all she has done in the house.

[JoshBB]

The public can't help but always support the insecure 'victim' and that's the role Helen is playing atm

Let's be honest. That's the only reason everyone supports Chris and Ashleigh. This whole pro-ashleigh thing is just anti-Helenism.

[kefln]

Let's be honest. That's the only reason everyone supports Chris and Ashleigh. This whole pro-ashleigh thing is just anti-Helenism.
Not true, I like her in a general sort of way, just like chris.

But I know where you are coming from, both sides tend to claim that the other side is only voting becayse if the other one. :laugh:

[Marsh.]

:joker: You're the one who got personal with me. Come back when you even know what you're trying to argue about.

[Marsh.]

Let's be honest. That's the only reason everyone supports Chris and Ashleigh. This whole pro-ashleigh thing is just anti-Helenism.

:clap1:

[poppsywoppsy]

Let's be honest. That's the only reason everyone supports Chris and Ashleigh. This whole pro-ashleigh thing is just anti-Helenism.

There is a tad of truth in this, but I like Ashleigh anyway

[Sophiee]

Let's be honest. That's the only reason everyone supports Chris and Ashleigh. This whole pro-ashleigh thing is just anti-Helenism.
this is not the reason that she's my favourite left. I actually liked helen for a long time and much more than ashleigh, but even when they were arguing, it's only lately that I've gone off her. she's starting to irritate me and is proving to be a massive hypocrite.

[Tom4784]

Her growing popularity is due to people falling for her act. She's about as vulnerable as a Pit Viper and slightly less friendly than one too.

[Mrjrb2014]

They can both be a nightmare, but i prefer Helen. At least she's honest and admits it when she's wrong. Plus she's a brilliant housemate.

Helen is vile...there is no mind changing of the majority of the reasonable public now

[M X]

Helen on last night's show was a classic case of bully playing the victim.

[Marsh.]

Helen on last night's show was a classic case of bully playing the victim.

As opposed to a bully pretending to have been a victim at school? :hehe:

[Cherie]

Let's be honest. That's the only reason everyone supports Chris and Ashleigh. This whole pro-ashleigh thing is just anti-Helenism.

:umm2:links please for the basis of this statement?

[M X]

As opposed to a bully pretending to have been a victim at school? :hehe:

And you are referring to?

[Kazanne]

They can both be a nightmare, but i prefer Helen. At least she's honest and admits it when she's wrong. Plus she's a brilliant housemate.

Vanessa,you are correct about Helen,it shows YOU have a forgiving and compassionate side to you:hug:

[Kazanne]

Helen is vile...there is no mind changing of the majority of the reasonable public now

That's fine . but have the grace to concede some people like her

[M X]

They can both be a nightmare, but i prefer Helen. At least she's honest and admits it when she's wrong. Plus she's a brilliant housemate.

Helen admits when she's wrong? What show have you been watching?
She spent the whole trial task placing all of the blame on Ashleigh, saying categorically 'I have played no part in creating the divide in the house'. :joker::joker::joker::joker::joker:

[Tom4784]

Vanessa,you are correct about Helen,it shows YOU have a forgiving and compassionate side to you:hug:

She's unrepentant about her actions and the only time she's sorry is when she's caught out. She's never sorry about what she's done, only that she gets caught which is why she always goes back to old habbits. Why should people be applauded to forgive someone when they aren't sorry and will never learn? It's complete and utter foolishness. 'Fool me once..' and all that.

[Kazanne]

Hi again! Still continuing a conversation that 12 pages ago you said you had no interest in? :pat:

Says it all when you resort to talking about smilies. Bless.



There you go misunderstanding AGAIN. It wasn't about who was "worse" it was about Danielle's negativity from the start, then befriending Ashleigh and together causing a divide between themselves and the rest of the group. Fact.

But take comments and spiral them into something I didn't say. :pat: I'll leave you to it.

:clap1::clap1::clap1::worship::worship:

[hijaxers]

I am absolutely sick to death of the name Helen - I can't wait for her to lose and this nasty BB to be over !

[MrWong]

I loved it last night. I have been waiting for her to show her nicer side in ages! I have noticed the comments on facebook gradually warming. Now there are Helen fans there and i never thought it would happen! BOTS audience also liking her. Why do you think the tide is turning? She was the most hated housemate not long ago, but most people actually quite like her now.

That wasn't vulnerability, it was self pity.

[Marsh.]

And you are referring to?

:hehe: Can't you guess?

[M X]

:hehe: Can't you guess?

No as I'm not sure who 'pretended to be bullied at school'?

If you mean Ashleigh, you have no reason to doubt that she was.
At least with Helen we have evidence that she's a bully outside of the house as well as in:

http://oi61.tinypic.com/2gvopxi.jpg

[Marsh.]

Oh dear, you say one comment about Ashleigh and they get all defensive and open a can of worms. :hehe:

[M X]

Oh dear, you say one comment about Ashleigh and they get all defensive and open a can of worms. :hehe:

Or I just said the truth, and you had nothing to say that could prove me wrong. :hehe: Yep.

[Marsh.]

Or I just said the truth, and you had nothing to say that could prove me wrong. :hehe: Yep.

Why would I want to "prove" you wrong? :conf:

My comment concerned Ashleigh not Helen.

[joeysteele]

Let's be honest. That's the only reason everyone supports Chris and Ashleigh. This whole pro-ashleigh thing is just anti-Helenism.

Again a well said post, I am really glad for one you are on this forum JoshBB.

[M X]

Why would I want to "prove" you wrong? :conf:

My comment concerned Ashleigh not Helen.

Surely in defence of Helen? Yet none of Helen's fans can defend her, because she has no redeeming qualities, there's no excuse for her behaviour and yet her fans are plucking at straws trying to find them.

[hijaxers]

No as I'm not sure who 'pretended to be bullied at school'?

If you mean Ashleigh, you have no reason to doubt that she was.
At least with Helen we have evidence that she's a bully outside of the house as well as in:

http://oi61.tinypic.com/2gvopxi.jpg

My she really does excel herself sometimes - sweet sweet helen - get Helen of Pendle out

[Marsh.]

Surely in defence of Helen? Yet none of Helen's fans can defend her, because she has no redeeming qualities, there's no excuse for her behaviour and yet her fans are plucking at straws trying to find them.

Ahem, I've never "excused" Helen's behaviour. Don't presume things about people. :pat:

Instead of lumping people into categories, take each poster as you find them. Just because I don't excuse Ashleigh's vileness doesn't mean I support Helen's. :)

[HelensPIMP]

Remember that she has a son she's mentioned....twice, maybe thrice. I hope she goes back to being a gash merchant, wouldn't my getting her to shout at me whilst I strum her harp.

[abhorson]

Which side did she show Rooney :laugh:

[M X]

Remember that she has a son she's mentioned....twice, maybe thrice. I hope she goes back to being a gash merchant, wouldn't my getting her to shout at me whilst I strum her harp.

The son she cried about only in the final week.....when people could vote for her to win.....oh. :smug:

[Marsh.]

Live feed link somewhere so we can say how often any of them have mentioned family members?

[HelensPIMP]

Her backside then the side door of her council house :hehe:
Which side did she show Rooney :laugh:

[M X]

Live feed link somewhere so we can say how often any of them have mentioned family members?

Even on the HL's show we've heard Ashleigh talk about her family countless times, Ash talk about his mother, Mark talk about his family, Christopher talk about his family, we heard Pauline talking about her son, the list goes on really.

[joeysteele]

Even on the HL's show we've heard Ashleigh talk about her family countless times, Ash talk about his mother, Mark talk about his family, Christopher talk about his family, we heard Pauline talking about her son, the list goes on really.

That is what has been shown what you list above, fair enough.
However as housemates have left the house they have said Helen has talked about her son,for some reason it appears BB decided not to show any of until recently however.

[abhorson]

Her backside then the side door of her council house :hehe:

Mr Pimp, how much does your girl charge?

[HelensPIMP]

£30 for the weekend, in VAT. She also does bachelor parties along with my fleet of midgets.
Mr Pimp, how much does your girl charge?

[abhorson]

£30 for the weekend, in VAT. She also does bachelor parties along with my fleet of midgets.


Can i book her please.

PS. Will the price go up if she COMES fifth.

[Lstan]

I loved it last night. I have been waiting for her to show her nicer side in ages! I have noticed the comments on facebook gradually warming. Now there are Helen fans there and i never thought it would happen! BOTS audience also liking her. Why do you think the tide is turning? She was the most hated housemate not long ago, but most people actually quite like her now.

from the sounds of it she always had fans but they are being vocal now because now is the first time shes up for noms.