USA :18 year old sons death :Parents sue amazon Caffeine Powder(bought on amazon)

[arista]

a Judge was just Live on FoxNewsHD
saying do not buy bulk Caffeine Powder
unless you know how to use it.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/03/06/2665459600000578-2982968-image-m-12_1425682962949.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/03/06/26653CAD00000578-2982968-image-a-7_1425682608043.jpg

[Parents sue Amazon for supplying their star wrestler son, 18,
'dangerous caffeine supplement powder' after
he died from overdosing on it days before graduation

Logan Stiner, 18, was found dead at his home in LaGrange, Ohio, in May
Died of cardiac arrhythmia and seizure due to acute caffeine toxicity
He had 23 times the amount of caffeine found in a typical coffee or soda
His parents filed a lawsuit against amazon the powder distributors Friday
They say the supplement was pharmaceutical grade
and not packaged properly, causing their son to poison himself ]


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2982968/Father-Ohio-teen-poisoned-caffeine-powder-files-suit.html#ixzz3ThscDDTL

[JoshBB]

how terrible, shocking how easy it was for something like this to happen

[Crimson Dynamo]

and he was taking this why?

[arista]

and he was taking this why?


To stay awake longer and get Fit for his Wrestling match

[arista]

how terrible, shocking how easy it was for something like this to happen

Not shocking for me

Rick Rude a Fit Wrestler
was in the bathroom of his Hotel
Room , his wife in the bedroom
he took some anabolic steroids
and died from from a Massive Heart Attack.
http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/Cards/Wrestling/58098/58098-97Fr.jpg
around 8 to 10 years before his sad death in 1999, aged 40
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rick_Rude
The reason I loved him
Rude appeared on both WWF Raw is War and WCW Monday Nitro on November 17, 1997.
which proved to public -- one was not Live
one of them he had a tash


If you can not be bothered to get a Trainer
to Professionally advise you
you are playing with Death.


I am shocked if Amazon pays them

[Crimson Dynamo]

To stay awake longer and get Fit for his Wrestling match

Sounds like death by stupidity to me

[Kizzy]

I remember buying some as a teen as my sis took it back and went mad with the chemists for selling them to kids.
Then pro plus got really popular in the 90s too.

[Livia]

Another ****wit out of the gene pool.

[Kizzy]

Wow... that's savage, what a disgusting thing to say.
There are those on this forum who admit to taking substances that are at best unidentified and at worst illegal, and that's met with almost fanatical hero worship.
I am constantly surprised on this forum.

[Liam-]

Wow... that's savage, what a disgusting thing to say.
There are those on this forum who admit to taking substances that are at best unidentified and at worst illegal, and that's met with almost fanatical hero worship.
I am constantly surprised on this forum.

:clap1:

[Livia]

Wow... that's savage, what a disgusting thing to say.
There are those on this forum who admit to taking substances that are at best unidentified and at worst illegal, and that's met with almost fanatical hero worship.
I am constantly surprised on this forum.

I said virtually the same thing as LT and you're on my case. What are you, my conscience? I don't need a ticking off from you thanks.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Wow... that's savage, what a disgusting thing to say.
There are those on this forum who admit to taking substances that are at best unidentified and at worst illegal, and that's met with almost fanatical hero worship.
I am constantly surprised on this forum.

we all take substances and caffeine probably the most common

[Livia]

we all take substances and caffeine probably the most common

And surely everyone with half a brain knows it's dangerous in large quantities.

[Kizzy]

I said virtually the same thing as LT and you're on my case. What are you, my conscience? I don't need a ticking off from you thanks.

I was addressing both of you, if I meant you directly I'd quote you.

[Crimson Dynamo]

And surely everyone with half a brain knows it's dangerous in large quantities.

death by stupidity

[Kizzy]

we all take substances and caffeine probably the most common

So... How does that then make him any more stupid than a kid who takes pool cleaner?
Caffeine is in many things and is maybe why he felt it was 'safe'.

[Crimson Dynamo]

the Hard Rhino label warned the powder “can be dangerous if abused” and that “failure to follow safety guidelines can result in serious injury or death.

[Kizzy]

It says that on paracetomol, what's your point?

He made an error like many teens do, why that preempts such heartless comments I don't know.

[Crimson Dynamo]

It says that on paracetomol, what's your point?

He made an error like many teens do, why that preempts such heartless comments I don't know.

what is your point?

[kirklancaster]

And surely everyone with half a brain knows it's dangerous in large quantities.

I agree,and I think the key word here is; 'overdose'; "an excessive and dangerous dose of a drug."

It's no different to playing 'Russian Roulette' with a half loaded gun -- Sooner than later your luck runs out.

[Niamh.]

It was stupid of course but most of us were a little stupid when we were 18, I know I thought I was invincible back then. Poor kid and his family :(

[Kizzy]

what is your point?

I couldn't make it any clearer.

Let's just hope nobody close to you is ever as 'stupid'.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I couldn't make it any clearer.

Let's just hope nobody close to you is ever as 'stupid'.

as neem says 18 year old die by stupidity all the time, on roads mainly but in rivers, by drugs, drink etc

its a fact

[Kizzy]

as neem says 18 year old die by stupidity all the time, on roads mainly but in rivers, by drugs, drink etc

its a fact

I don't care what Niamh says... do you feel validated because a moderator backed your skewed view?
(No offence Niamh)

Anyone can die my misadventure in rivers or by substances 18 or not.

[Niamh.]

I don't care what Niamh says... do you feel validated because a moderator backed your skewed view?
(No offence Niamh)

Anyone can die my misadventure in rivers or by substances 18 or not.

I wasn't backing anyone, that's just my opinion :laugh: I still feel sorry for the poor kid and his family. Maybe that stuff shouldn't be so readily availible online like that. Even if it had to be sold at chemist, they could atleast speak to people who buy it and tell them the correct amounts to take and properly warn them about the risks of overdosing

[Crimson Dynamo]

I don't care what Niamh says... do you feel validated because a moderator backed your skewed view?
(No offence Niamh)

Anyone can die my misadventure in rivers or by substances 18 or not.

precisely

yes you can die by many means and stupidity is one

[smudgie]

Quite tragic, poor young man and his family.
However, the fact that he overdosed should not mean they can sue Amazon.
Plenty of people will buy it and use it as directed, why should they end up penalised for someone else's tragic mistake.
If lawsuits are taken out companies wil be put off selling anything.

[Kizzy]

I wasn't backing anyone, that's just my opinion :laugh: I still feel sorry for the poor kid and his family. Maybe that stuff shouldn't be so readily availible online like that. Even if it had to sold at chemist, they could atleast speak to people who buy it and tell them the correct amounts to take and properly warn them about the risks of overdosing

I know but you used the word stupid and that was enough to be quoted.

Lots of things are available online and at chemists that have the potential to kill, people can and have been killed by them.
It seemed hypocritical that drinking and drugs are seen as acceptable almost advocated pastimes and they poison 1000s every year.

[Kizzy]

precisely

yes you can die by many means and stupidity is one

Do you have any other examples of what you would consider a 'stupid death'?

[Tom4784]

I'd say the blame lies with the boy and his parents. The health risks and instructions are clearly stated on the front. It's his own fault for misusing it and his parents' fault for not keeping an eye on what supplements their son was taking and what the risks were.

The case will probably get thrown out of court, Amazon isn't to blame here.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Do you have any other examples of what you would consider a 'stupid death'?


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2885320/Police-Teen-shot-dead-shopper-wanted-shoes.html


http://www.cbsnews.com/news/teen-drowns-in-georgia-lake-when-game-goes-wrong/

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/man-holding-breath-in-oregon-tunnel-causes-three-car-crash/

[T*]

Tragic :sad: but it needs to be cleared up who sold it and who they need to sue..
If it was 'Supplied By Amazon'- Sure, sue them.
If it was a third party seller using Amazon for their business, they shouldn't be suing amazon itself.

[Kizzy]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2885320/Police-Teen-shot-dead-shopper-wanted-shoes.html


http://www.cbsnews.com/news/teen-drowns-in-georgia-lake-when-game-goes-wrong/

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/man-holding-breath-in-oregon-tunnel-causes-three-car-crash/

The first two were killed by other people, and the last one isn't dead...

[Crimson Dynamo]

The first two were killed by other people, and the last one isn't dead...

yes other stupid teenagers

[arista]

I'd say the blame lies with the boy and his parents. The health risks and instructions are clearly stated on the front. It's his own fault for misusing it and his parents' fault for not keeping an eye on what supplements their son was taking and what the risks were.

The case will probably get thrown out of court, Amazon isn't to blame here.


Bang On Right Dezzy

[Kizzy]

yes other stupid teenagers

Ah, is stupid just your word of the day, like 'purp' was?
Ok I'll look forward to tomorrows word.

[T*]

I'd say the blame lies with the boy and his parents. The health risks and instructions are clearly stated on the front. It's his own fault for misusing it and his parents' fault for not keeping an eye on what supplements their son was taking and what the risks were.

The case will probably get thrown out of court, Amazon isn't to blame here.

:clap2:

[kirklancaster]

I'd say the blame lies with the boy and his parents. The health risks and instructions are clearly stated on the front. It's his own fault for misusing it and his parents' fault for not keeping an eye on what supplements their son was taking and what the risks were.

The case will probably get thrown out of court, Amazon isn't to blame here.

:clap1:

[Crimson Dynamo]

Ah, is stupid just your word of the day, like 'purp' was?
Ok I'll look forward to tomorrows word.

PERP

short for perpetrator: a person who perpetrates, or commits, an illegal, criminal, or evil act

factual word

[Niamh.]

I know but you used the word stupid and that was enough to be quoted.



Lots of things are available online and at chemists that have the potential to kill, people can and have been killed by them.

It seemed hypocritical that drinking and drugs are seen as acceptable almost advocated pastimes and they poison 1000s every year.


I think if someone overdosed on drink or drugs people would also be saying it was a bit stupid of the person :shrug: I don't see where this hypocrisy you're accusing people of is coming from tbqh

[Crimson Dynamo]

a pal of mine at school died when he choked on his own vomit after a mammoth drinking session

stupid way to die

[kirklancaster]

I think if someone overdosed on drink or drugs people would also be saying it was a bit stupid of the person :shrug: I don't see where this hypocrisy you're accusing people of is coming from tbqh

"It was stupid of course but most of us were a little stupid when we were 18, I know I thought I was invincible back then. Poor kid and his family "

I'm not denying any one else's right to interpret your post above in any way they see fit, but my own 2000% honest interpretation was that you were actually excusive and very sympathetic Niamh.

:shrug:

[kirklancaster]

a pal of mine at school died when he choked on his own vomit after a mammoth drinking session

stupid way to die

Death by lack of moderation - or as you quite correctly say; Death By Stupidity".

p.s.It's his own fault anyway for trying to drink a mammoth.:laugh:

[Crimson Dynamo]

Death by lack of moderation - or as you quite correctly say; Death By Stupidity".

p.s.It's his own fault anyway for trying to drink a mammoth.:laugh:

:joker:

[AnnieK]

I read a similar story recently about a girl dying after taking too many raspberry ketones.....which also contained high levels of caffeine. It is tragic and I don't think stupid is the right word to use, but if you are going to take supplements of any kind it's a little foolish not to know what the side effects of over use could be.

[Kizzy]

I think if someone overdosed on drink or drugs people would also be saying it was a bit stupid of the person :shrug: I don't see where this hypocrisy you're accusing people of is coming from tbqh

I seriously don't think they would...
Look at that fast and furious actor that drove into a tree, you could say he was stupid for driving erratically... but nobody did.

[Niamh.]

I seriously don't think they would...

Look at that fast and furious actor that drove into a tree, you could say he was stupid for driving erratically... but nobody did.


He wasn't driving the car

But I disagree, I think maybe people out of respect for a celebrity they like may just want to pay their respects without dwelling on the fact that their actions were stupid that doesn't mean people don't realise that it was their own actions that got them there, take the Peaches Geldof death for example or Amy Winehouse

[Kizzy]

He wasn't driving the car

But I disagree, I think maybe people out of respect for a celebrity they like may just want to pay their respects without dwelling on the fact that their actions were stupid that doesn't mean people don't realise that it was their own actions that got them there, take the Peaches Geldof death for example or Amy Winehouse

He put himself in that situation, I don't subscribe to the celebrity hero worship rubbish.
It's totally hypocritical, if those comments had been in his thread there would have been ructions, but because it was just some teenager it's totally acceptable to make those remarks?
Imo that's a blatant double standard.

[Niamh.]

He put himself in that situation, I don't subscribe to the celebrity hero worship rubbish.

It's totally hypocritical, if those comments had been in his thread there would have been ructions, but because it was just some teenager it's totally acceptable to make those remarks?

Imo that's a blatant double standard.


Yes he did, who's denying that? :shrug:

It's not hero worship, it's a sense of feeling like you know the person a bit more as you knew who they were, listened to their music etc. Anyway, now you've changed what you were saying originally from people thinking it's not "stupid" when It comes to drink and drugs to people just not saying it is stupid because they're worshipping a celebrity. If you want to compare like with like and stick to your original point, then if it was a non celebrity who drank themselves to death, yes I would fully expect a similar (if not stronger) response to this. The whole not speaking badly about the death of a celebrity is a different argument altogether

[Cherie]

He put himself in that situation, I don't subscribe to the celebrity hero worship rubbish.
It's totally hypocritical, if those comments had been in his thread there would have been ructions, but because it was just some teenager it's totally acceptable to make those remarks?
Imo that's a blatant double standard.

I can see where your point Kizzy :smug:

[Niamh.]

I can see where your point Kizzy :smug:


She may have a point but it's not even the point we were discussing, I don't know why this has suddenly changed from drink/drugs deaths being acceptable to Celebrity Deaths V's Random Stranger Death lol

[Cherie]

She may have a point but it's not even the point we were discussing, I don't know why this has suddenly changed from drink/drugs deaths being acceptable to Celebrity Deaths V's Random Stranger Death lol

:laugh: ooop I must pay more attention, I did my own pet hate and only read a few of the lastest posts

[Northern Monkey]

You gotta be careful and do your research.I weight train regularly.A few years ago(maybe 10)I was sold a bottle of capsules in a supplement shop which were over the counter and sold as a 'supplement' to help with my training.I took these things for a month and i blew up,I put a stone of muscle on,I got big.It was only later after doing my research on these things that i found out that these were basically steroids and are banned now.I was not offered any liver support which is recommended or post cycle therapy(which is prescription only) or anything.I thought i was taking a natural supplement.I would not have taken these had i known,I could've got steroids if i wanted easily but chose not to.
As i learned,You have to research any of these so called 'supplements' and how to dose them before you put them inside your body.

[Niamh.]

Also the reason his death is being debated like this more so then a typical celeb rip thread is because his parents are suing Amazon so in effect putting the blame on them for their sons death :shrug:

[Kizzy]

She may have a point but it's not even the point we were discussing, I don't know why this has suddenly changed from drink/drugs deaths being acceptable to Celebrity Deaths V's Random Stranger Death lol

It's the principle, and it has relevance I don't see any difference in whether they were known or a member of the public personally but this is how I see the two.

Joe publics unintentional death= stupid

Celebrity unintentional death= tragedy

I'm drawing a comparison between the two, and raised the point to highlight the deference in reactions to them.
No matter how preventable their death was.
Just because the guy was a stranger it's ok to suggest he was stupid yet had it been anyone you had even the most tenuous connection with... you'd seen their film or read something about them then their death is suddenly elevated to such a pointless waste of potential.

[Niamh.]

It's the principle, and it has relevance I don't see any difference in whether they were known or a member of the public personally but this is how I see the two.



Joe publics unintentional death= stupid



Celebrity unintentional death= tragedy



I'm drawing a comparison between the two, and raised the point to highlight the deference in reactions to them.

No matter how preventable their death was.

Just because the guy was a stranger it's ok to suggest he was stupid yet had it been anyone you had even the most tenuous connection with... you'd seen their film or read something about them then their death is suddenly elevated to such a pointless waste of potential.


But that isn't the point we were discussing lol that's a whole other subject. In regards to what we were talking about, yes I think people would have reacted similarly or more strongly even if drink/drugs had been the cause if this boys death and no I don't think it's more acceptable to people when it drink/drugs

But if you want to talk about celebrity deaths V's strangers deaths and if you want to discuss like with like, if lets say after Amy Winehouse died and her father was planning to sue the off licence where she bought her drink from, then I think people would have been more forth coming with their opinions on who's fault her death was

[user104658]

It is obviously his own fault but that doesn't make it any less tragic. I'm concerned need I od'd on caffeine at University - I stupidly drank 20 (yes, 20!) vodka red bulls on a night out. I've never felt so wretched in my entire life. I couldn't sleep properly for 4 days - I would dose off for 15 minutes or so and then wake-up with my heart pounding. My muscles were twitching, I was utterly exhausted, but totally broken. It was stupid. I laughed about it at the time but I could easily have done myself serious damage. Plus plenty of other occasions with alcohol consumption - my tolerance levels were stupidly high mid-Uni and I was frequently knocking back a litre of whiskey and then heading out and having 10 - 15 pints on top of it.

And I'm far from the only one. There's no one really to "blame" but himself but I don't think it makes him stupid or deserving of death... Just young and naive. Very sad.

[Niamh.]

I agree completely with your post TS, I think the reason people are discussing it though is because his parents are suing Amazon

[Kizzy]

But that isn't the point we were discussing lol that's a whole other subject. In regards to what we were talking about, yes I think people would have reacted similarly or more strongly even if drink/drugs had been the cause if this boys death and no I don't think it's more acceptable to people when it drink/drugs

But if you want to talk about celebrity deaths V's strangers deaths and if you want to discuss like with like, if lets say after Amy Winehouse died and her father was planning to sue the off licence where she bought her drink from, then I think people would have been more forth coming with their opinions on who's fault her death was

It isn't a different subject at all... it's this one.

The onus was on the death and the fact some labeled it 'stupid' and him stupid for misunderstanding the dosage.
Regardless of what his parents did subsequently.

So yes I feel that preventable deaths both famous and non famous are entirely comparable in the same context, I don't know why you have a problem with this.

All preventable deaths can be put down to 'stupidity' regardless of who they are and how they occurred.. or none of them.

[Niamh.]

It isn't a different subject at all... it's this one.



The onus was on the death and the fact some labeled it 'stupid' and him stupid for misunderstanding the dosage.

Regardless of what his parents did subsequently.



So yes I feel that preventable deaths both famous and non famous are entirely comparable in the same context, I don't know why you have a problem with this.



All preventable deaths can be put down to 'stupidity' regardless of who they are and how they occurred.. or none of them.

The title of this thread includes the fact that the parents are suing Amazon so obviously people are going to discuss who was at fault for the boys death, it's actually the subject of the thread lol

[Kizzy]

The title of this thread includes the fact that the parents are suing Amazon so obviously people are going to discuss who was at fault for the boys death, it's actually the subject of the thread lol

They may do lol... That's not the point, I still don't see the need to brand him 'stupid' and a '*******wit' it's rude, unnecessary and distasteful.

[Niamh.]

They may do lol... That's not the point, I still don't see the need to brand him 'stupid' and a '*******wit' it's rude, unnecessary and distasteful.


I didn't actually say any of those things though, I said what he did was a bit stupid, I also said that most people did stupid things at that age :fist:

[Kizzy]

I didn't actually say any of those things though, I said what he did was a bit stupid, I also said that most people did stupid things at that age :fist:

Never said you did. lol

[Niamh.]

Never said you did. lol

fair enough :laugh:

[Livia]

I said he was a ****wit. And I stand by it.

[Nedusa]

Another late entrant to Darwin Awards, congratulations... I'm sure his demise will only strengthen the gene pool.

[Kizzy]

:facepalm:

[lostalex]

keep clapping for a dead kid who was actually motivated and trying to accomplish something. shame on him for actually being so focused on a goal.

too bad he wasn't just another lazy kid sitting around eating mcdonalds and drinking and going after girls. if only he wasn't so motivated, he'd still be alive.

shame on him for not being a typical drunk flunkie teen.

[Kizzy]

The lawsuit says the package informed users that a cup of coffee contains about 1/32nd of a teaspoon of caffeine.
The package label also warned that the powder 'can be dangerous if abused,' and 'failure to follow safety guidelines can result in serious injury or death,' the lawsuit said.
The lawsuit claims that the label lacked specific instructions on proper use.
'The difference between life and death is a pinch and a smidgen,' Balser said.
Hard Rhino sold the powder as a dietary supplement, which allows the company to bypass FDA regulations, Balser said.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/03/06/2665459600000578-2982968-image-m-12_1425682962949.jpg


I would say they had a point too, how they got away with selling this dangerous substance as a 'supplement' is unbelievable.

The packaging has no way to measure out any dosage, and the information is tiny and inadequate. The picture takes up half the label and the address a quarter of that.