This country is broken

[Blog Rider]

Seeing that this has worked well somewhere else, I bought it here:

Mark my words, There will be riots and protests over the next 5 years as people won't stand for this status quota. The election system is a shambles and should be replaced. Things that would happen under Tories would be rise in food banks and removal of the NHS and child benefit.

:blush:

[Denver]

This country is now a rich person country poor people will be left destroyed and forgotton

[Blog Rider]

This country is now a rich person country poor people will be left destroyed and forgotton

It will leave message boards like this quiet because rich don't watch BB.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Status quota?

:laugh2:

[Glenn.]

so melodramatic

[Livia]

Status quota?

:laugh2:

Status Quo tribute act?

[Kizzy]

We need not worry about protests.... Bojo bought us 3 water cannon.

[Kazanne]

This country is now a rich person country poor people will be left destroyed and forgotton

lots of people get rich from being poor Adam,they work hard to get their money,jobs are being created,so more people will be able to graft and get 'rich'

[joeysteele]

This country is now a rich person country poor people will be left destroyed and forgotton

That has a very sad truth to it.
I agree,not just the poor but the sick,disabled and vulnerable too,they will largely be cast aside and made to feel even less relevant and stripped of dignity.

The warnings were made loud enough and were ignored and will be ignored even moreso by who we have in power again now.
I almost despair at times for the UK.

[Josy]

lots of people get rich from being poor Adam,they work hard to get their money,jobs are being created,so more people will be able to graft and get 'rich'

Zero hour contracts shouldn't be classed as jobs and it's pretty impossible to get 'rich' when people are working all hours and still struggling to make ends meet, do you seriously think there are millions of people in the UK using food banks because they want to?

[joeysteele]

Zero hour contracts shouldn't be classed as jobs and it's pretty impossible to get 'rich' when people are working all hours and still struggling to make ends meet, do you seriously think there are millions of people in the UK using food banks because they want to?

I have to say,which is really little as to any surprise, all through this election,I have agreed with you Josy.

The above post is just another gem from you that says so much so quickly.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Zero hour contracts shouldn't be classed as jobs and it's pretty impossible to get 'rich' when people are working all hours and still struggling to make ends meet, do you seriously think there are millions of people in the UK using food banks because they want to?

Food banks are a new service and have been used politically to represent some sort of food poverty in the UK

Perhaps you have any proof that food poverty is on the rise the UK over the last 10 years?

Food banks are not proof they are just a new service that has risen up and have received a lot of publicity. Its a new service and people will make use of it but its not evidence that food poverty is on the rise (simply because they are too new a service).

I would wager that during the 1970s and the strikes or the 80s and the miners strikes it was a lot worse than today

[Livia]

One job in fifty is on a zero hours contract and some people actually prefer that type of contract. Also, plenty of people climb out of poverty, or go on to really good careers from humble beginnings. One of the best tricks is to get a good education. I've read on here many accounts of how people bunked off school or were obnoxious to teachers or were generally disruptive. I asked the question whether those people regretted it now and the reply was overwhelmingly no, not really.

It's perfectly possible to improve your lot, but you have to want it and you have to work for it. It will never be handed to you unless you're rich in the first place.

[Kizzy]

Perfect summation of the neo liberal ethos. 1 in 50 is a conservative estimate, and will no doubt make a sharp rise over the next 5yrs.
People are worse off, spending more and earning less regardless of any economic growth or boost to employment, how is that possible?

http://www.independent.co.uk/incoming/article10070658.ece/alternates/w460/web-zero-hours-graphic.jpg

http://visual.ons.gov.uk/economic-well-being-indicators-2014-q3/

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/mythbusting-zerohours-contracts-are-they-are-bad-as-we-are-told-10229040.html

[joeysteele]

Perfect summation of the neo liberal ethos. 1 in 50 is a conservative estimate, and will no doubt make a sharp rise over the next 5yrs.
People are worse off, spending more and earning less regardless of any economic growth or boost to employment, how is that possible?

http://visual.ons.gov.uk/economic-well-being-indicators-2014-q3/

Sorry but for me even one job in 50 being a zero hours contract is still way too many, even moreso if the people on them don't like it and would love more work.
Fine for those that do want them.

However for me, in both cases, one in 50 of those stated as being in full employment are not,they are still in effect not in full time work and should not be classed as being so either.

As was said in the election, David Cameron couldn't live on a zero hours contract as couldn't Miliband.
I couldn't and wouldn't,neither can most of those on them, so create the full working hours jobs and not use these contracts.
It is all a bit rich to expect people to live on something others couldn't and wouldn't.

[Cherie]

Zero hours contracts have always existed though, many services could not operate without having Agency or Bank staff to fall back on, working in a school what do you do if the number of adults in a class is not at the correct ratio due to illness or bereavement or family care? Where I work we are employed by the Borough there was a lot of rumblings that no new staff would be employed on contracts when Labour lost the last election, that has not been the case, when staff retire or leave they are replaced by staff on contracts, however there are also a number of staff on zero hours, some are happy with the arrangement, others are not and apply for full or part time post as they come up, the school could not operate without Agency staff, same goes for a whole range of services and businesses.

[arista]

We need not worry about protests.... Bojo bought us 3 water cannon.


The Lady Home Secretary Stopped that

[Livia]

Perfect summation of the neo liberal ethos. 1 in 50 is a conservative estimate, and will no doubt make a sharp rise over the next 5yrs.
People are worse off, spending more and earning less regardless of any economic growth or boost to employment, how is that possible?

http://www.independent.co.uk/incoming/article10070658.ece/alternates/w460/web-zero-hours-graphic.jpg

http://visual.ons.gov.uk/economic-well-being-indicators-2014-q3/

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/mythbusting-zerohours-contracts-are-they-are-bad-as-we-are-told-10229040.html

Pretty graphs... but zero hours contracts was just one point in my post. The majority of it was that, if you get a good education, if you work had, people can do well. You have to work at it though, you can't sit on your backside and expect something great to come to you. Not everyone employed in good jobs carving out good careers went to Eton, some of us went to inner city comprehensives. I suppose you have to want to help yourself and give yourself a hand up instead of expecting a hand out.

[Kizzy]

Zero hours contracts have always existed though, many services could not operate without having Agency or Bank staff to fall back on, working in a school what do you do if the number of adults in a class is not at the correct ratio due to illness or bereavement or family care? Where I work we are employed by the Borough there was a lot of rumblings that no new staff would be employed on contracts when Labour lost the last election, that has not been the case, when staff retire or leave they are replaced by staff on contracts, however there are also a number of staff on zero hours, some are happy with the arrangement, others are not and apply for full or part time post as they come up, the school could not operate without Agency staff, same goes for a whole range of services and businesses.

Yes they have for specific types of employment in some sectors such as part time hospitality, agency or seasonal work.
Of course if you're happy and or require what is essentially unsecure employment then there are positions to fill, what is being highlighted by the exponential rise of 0hr contracts is that these are expanding across all sectors full and part time.
This impacts on the living standards and financial stability of families, those starting out and those with established financial needs.

[Kizzy]

Pretty graphs... but zero hours contracts was just one point in my post. The majority of it was that, if you get a good education, if you work had, people can do well. You have to work at it though, you can't sit on your backside and expect something great to come to you. Not everyone employed in good jobs carving out good careers went to Eton, some of us went to inner city comprehensives. I suppose you have to want to help yourself and give yourself a hand up instead of expecting a hand out.

Yes I 've heard you mention your pygmalionesque rise before, it's not an option for many due to generations of regional socioeconomic depravity, life choices are complex yes it's can happen but in actuality without family or other support network it's nigh on impossible.

[Livia]

Yes I 've heard you mention your pygmalionesque rise before, it's not an option for many due to generations of regional socioeconomic depravity, life choices are complex yes it's can happen but in actuality without family or other support network it's nigh on impossible.

That's so rude, Kizzy. I'm very proud of what I've achieved so please don't make yourself look small by trying to ridicule me.

[Kizzy]

That's so rude, Kizzy. I'm very proud of what I've achieved so please don't make yourself look small by trying to ridicule me.

Have you misinterpreted my post? What offended you Pygmalion created something, wanted it and made it real. It was just an analogy, not a slur.

[Kazanne]

IF something is broken it can be fixed,as it is being fixed slowly and surely,it takes time.It could be worse had Labour got in it would have been shattered which is far more difficult to fix.imo.

[Cherie]

Yes they have for specific types of employment in some sectors such as part time hospitality, agency or seasonal work.
Of course if you're happy and or require what is essentially unsecure employment then there are positions to fill, what is being highlighted by the exponential rise of 0hr contracts is that these are expanding across all sectors full and part time.
This impacts on the living standards and financial stability of families, those starting out and those with established financial needs.

Yes I get that being on a zero hours contract is unstable and can be a nightmare for some, on the other side of the coin you get workers especially in the public sector who take the total pee, they go off on long term sick and re emerge just as their pay is about to be halved miraculously recovered :laugh: It happens at work all the time, I've never known so many people with back problems :idc: so in some ways you can blame small businesses especially protecting them selves from having to pay two people to do one persons job, I don't really know what the answer is, all I try to instill in my kids is that any work however menial will help towards getting a better job, education is good yes but a fist of A Stars and a degree won't do you any good unless you get out there and show willing to get your hand dirty

[Kizzy]

Yes they have for specific types of employment in some sectors such as part time hospitality, agency or seasonal work.
Of course if you're happy and or require what is essentially unsecure employment then there are positions to fill, what is being highlighted by the exponential rise of 0hr contracts is that these are expanding across all sectors full and part time.
This impacts on the living standards and financial stability of families, those starting out and those with established financial needs.

Yes I get that being on a zero hours contract is unstable and can be a nightmare for some, on the other side of the coin you get workers especially in the public sector who take the total pee, they go off on long term sick and re emerge just as their pay is about to be halved miraculously recovered :laugh: It happens at work all the time, I've never known so many people with back problems :idc: so in some ways you can blame small businesses especially protecting them selves from having to pay two people to do one persons job, I don't really know what the answer is, all I try to instill in my kids is that any work however menial will help towards getting a better job, education is good yes but a fist of A Stars and a degree won't do you any good unless you get out there and show willing to get your hand dirty

I see, you're in favour of the erosion of workers rights due to a percentage of what you believe are those who exploit them?
If you look at my pretty little graph it shows it isn't only small businesses using these contracts, only 10% of businesses with under 20 employees use 0hr contracts whereas those with over 250 employees employ 50% of their workforce this way.
However menial the work people deserve job security.

[joeysteele]

I say again, zero hours are fine for those who want them,for when it suits them.
Agency work is fine too,as long as people are able to cope on such a situation.
All work is good for gaining experience, contacts and possible, I stress, possible better employment in the future.

What all those people on zero hours contracts should not be however, is included in official full employment figures.

Also anyone who wants full time work really,should not be hogtied by these zero hours contracts of then not being able to do any work for any other company.
Having to be contactable daily,even hourly, just in case someone rings in sick and at short notice they have to go to work that day,or for any other reason the company or business demands them to.

That is in my view ridiculous exploitation.

[sampvt]

Zero hour contracts shouldn't be classed as jobs and it's pretty impossible to get 'rich' when people are working all hours and still struggling to make ends meet, do you seriously think there are millions of people in the UK using food banks because they want to?

The vast majority of food bank users are tossers that go there so they can buy more booze and ciggies with the money they save on the weekly shopping bill.

[sampvt]

That's so rude, Kizzy. I'm very proud of what I've achieved so please don't make yourself look small by trying to ridicule me.

I thought Kizzy's post was well thought out. Your personal circumstances had nothing to do with her analogy.

[Kazanne]

The vast majority of food bank users are tossers that go there so they can buy more booze and ciggies with the money they save on the weekly shopping bill.

There's many a true word said in jest Sam,but what's not funny is ,it's probably true.

[Cherie]

[QUOTE=Cherie;7749584]

I see, you're in favour of the erosion of workers rights due to a percentage of what you believe are those who exploit them?
If you look at my pretty little graph it shows it isn't only small businesses using these contracts, only 10% of businesses with under 20 employees use 0hr contracts whereas those with over 250 employees employ 50% of their workforce this way.
However menial the work people deserve job security.

No I am not in favour of erosion of workers right :laugh: but it is not as black and white as you paint and there are rights and wrongs on both sides, and the pretty little graph is based on how many businesses in the UK?

[Kizzy]

[QUOTE=Kizzy;7749645]

No I am not in favour of erosion of workers right :laugh: but it is not as black and white as you paint and there are rights and wrongs on both sides, and the pretty little graph is based on how many businesses in the UK?

Ah you can't challenge the information I provide when you provide none except your scurrilous opinion :laugh:

[Cherie]

[QUOTE=Cherie;7749766]

Ah you can't challenge the information I provide when you provide none except your scurrilous opinion :laugh:

:laugh: I do see what you are saying but businesses have so many other options open to them now not least moving parts of their business to other countries where labour is cheaper, so trying to eradicate zero hours contracts is tricky, I agree with Joey that zero hours contracts should not be counted in the "jobs" figures.

[letmein]

The young'uns will experience Thatcher's Britain. Enjoy.

[Blog Rider]

The young'uns will experience Thatcher's Britain. Enjoy.

Apart from the fact that they not taking the status quota.

[the truth]

This country is now a rich person country poor people will be left destroyed and forgotton

better than new labour where the working people were left destroyed and forgotten and the rest did well

[Livia]

I thought Kizzy's post was well thought out. Your personal circumstances had nothing to do with her analogy.

No one asked you to stir the pot, thanks very much.

[Crimson Dynamo]

i think that if you smoke you should be banned from foodbanks

or is that happening now?

[Livia]

i think that if you smoke you should be banned from foodbanks

or is that happening now?

If it's not it should be.