cannabis - will you sign the legalize petition ?

[waterhog]

cannabis - will you sign the legalize petition ? 09.08.15

over the years i do swap
so my views are contradictory
my latest is in favour of this crop
it now needs to be on the tax inventory.
importance is not on the scale
its not vital to the fuzz
what business is it if some inhale
while sitting at home for a little buzz.
yes money is going to dealers
but on reflection its minor
those in pain its one of the great healers
if its legal and legit the quality will be finer.
is it a gateway
will children start here and progress
while you have dodgy dealers in the alleyway
expect nothing less.
the petition is bringing it to parliament
in the house of commons they will debate
please don't think of John Buttifant Sewel and astonishment
a few MP's are not pot-kettle-black with infuriate.
wake up kingdom that's united
i am not promoting or trying to legitimize
but the law changes must be invited
in 2015 cannabis should be remembered for the legalize.

( the question is - will you sign this petition ? https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/104349 )

[Kizzy]

Nope, unless it's prescribed.

[smudgie]

:nono: No.

[GypsyGoth]

Drugs are bad.

[Samuel.]

Wait, people are still against it? Why?

I'm not interested in it at all personally but I don't see why others shouldn't be allowed. There's only benefits to legalising it.

[GypsyGoth]

It doesn't bother me to be honest. I just wanted to use Mr. Mackey's catchphrase from South Park.

[Natalie.]

Drugs are bad.


Mmkay

[Liam-]

No

[Xtopher]

It's one of my favorite things, yes.

[Ramsay]

It saddens me that it's 2015 and weed is still illegal

[Tom4784]

There's no real reason why it should be illegal when cigarettes and alcohol are more dangerous and are perfectly legal.

[LukeB]

Yes,Alcohol is worse tbh so i do not understand why it's not legal and alcohol is.

[Rob!]

Yes. There's a lot more benefits and sense in making it legal tbh.

[Jay.]

no the smell makes me gag as it is

[Liam-]

Both of my neighbours are potheads and they smoke it when they have kids in the house and it's actually disgusting, we can't let the kids in our family go out into the garden because the neighbours are out smoking it, I'd really rather not have them do it even more if it became legal so no thank you.

[LukeB]

Oh i didn't see the link, I've signed it

[Daniel.]

Yes

[Glenn.]

Can't see the problem with people smoking it if that's what they want to do.

[Wizard.]

People don't get in trouble for smoking it now anyway, it's only if you're selling it and tbh the punishment isn't even that bad for that. I don't see the point.

[waterhog]

Both of my neighbours are potheads and they smoke it when they have kids in the house and it's actually disgusting, we can't let the kids in our family go out into the garden because the neighbours are out smoking it, I'd really rather not have them do it even more if it became legal so no thank you.



this is a bit unfair as children should not have to smell it. they should have more consideration.

[Glenn.]

People shouldn't have to smell horse manure thats been spread over the fields. **** happens.

[Liam-]

Horse **** isn't illegal.

I'd rather smell horse **** than the chavs next door getting higher than kites.

[reece(:]

Let them get on with it.

[LukeB]

People shouldn't have to smell horse manure thats been spread over the fields. **** happens.

:clap1:

[Glenn.]

Horse **** isn't illegal.

I'd rather smell horse **** than the chavs next door getting higher than kites.

If it isn't affecting you then whats the problem.

[Liam-]

In the scenario I mentioned it does effect me, the people I live with and the other members of my family, I shouldn't have to sit with all my windows closed in the middle of the summer because some druggie is smoking weed in his garden, which would only get worse if it was made legal.

The whole idea that making weed legal will make everything better is ludicrous, if anything it'll make it worse, if they put it on the same level as fags you'll have people walking the streets smoking spliffs like it's the most normal thing in the world, when it's not and I don't think it should be glorified.

[LukeB]

Rather have people smoking weed in the streets, then cigarettes (which is way worse) tbh

[Liam-]

The idea of people walking freely around the streets smoking it is grim to me, if you want to smoke it in your own house away from people, fine whatever, but as soon as it starts bothering and effecting other people, that's where the issues begin.

[lily.]

There's no real reason why it should be illegal when cigarettes and alcohol are more dangerous and are perfectly legal.

Church.
http://images.sodahead.com/polls/003476053/395137736_tumblr_m7yeh8f7mt1qiocs5o1_1280_answer_1 1_xlarge.jpeg

[LukeB]

I've saw some articles of people saying weed has helped them with their illnesses like cancer etc. Weed is harmless compared to alcohol and fags.

[Nedusa]

No , cannabis is a dreadful drug to get hooked on, and hooked on it you will get for years possibly decades. It will rob you of your life, hopes dreams and ambitions to be replaced by endless days living in a comatose trancelike state.

Your life reduced to looking forward to that next spliff when you can get high and escape from everything.

It really quite an evil pernicious drug masquerading as an innocent drug in a par with alcohol. Truth is it is a nasty drug that promises you a rosy tinted take on life, a comfortable escape from the challenges of life but you are always the very last person to see the horrible truth of years of devotion to this weed.

A sad shallow empty existence living in a fog alone usually , unable to really function and eventually forced to accept that ones life has amounted to zilch

Harmless drug.... Get real

[Liam-]

I've saw some articles of people saying weed has helped them with their illnesses like cancer etc. Weed is harmless compared to alcohol and fags.

There might not be many deaths directly related to weed like there is with fags, but there are just as many bad side effects that go along with it, some that can last forever.

[lily.]

Smoke Weed Every Day For 50 Years And This Might Happen To You

CLICK (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/04/17/catherine-hiller-just-say-yes-marijuana-memoir_n_7086254.html)

[Samuel.]

Because it smells bad isn't a legitimate reason why something should stay illegal.

[joeysteele]

I can understand the viewpoints of those for and against the legalisation of cannabis.

Obviously speaking for myself and all I have come across as to the drug,I would not use it myself but I will sign the petition for it to be legalised.

I agree with Dezzys post earlier on where he said alcohol and smoking does a lot of harm yet is legal, so really its a strong point I think that cannabis should be too.

[Will.]

What's Cannabis?

[Loukas]

As a weed smoker, i would obviously say yes :thumbs:

[empire]

if legalize this drug, then the scumbag drug dealers will be out of there luck,

[bots]

2 wrongs don't make a right, and it is appropriate to apply it to tobacco, alcohol and cannabis.

People that say cannabis is harmless are deluded and ill informed, living in some cartoon fantasy land. No way it should be legal.

[Tom4784]

The idea of people walking freely around the streets smoking it is grim to me, if you want to smoke it in your own house away from people, fine whatever, but as soon as it starts bothering and effecting other people, that's where the issues begin.

I'd rather be around people smoking weed than cigarettes, the weed can't give me cancer.

[Tom4784]

Church.
http://images.sodahead.com/polls/003476053/395137736_tumblr_m7yeh8f7mt1qiocs5o1_1280_answer_1 1_xlarge.jpeg

<3

[Northern Monkey]

Smoked it for about 10 years as a teen and was bored of it by 21-22 and never touched it again.I don't see why it should be illegal tbh.Booze is much much worse.Why not cut the crime rates and just get it legalised already?Make some tax on it and provide quality stuff.

[Northern Monkey]

The idea of people walking freely around the streets smoking it is grim to me, if you want to smoke it in your own house away from people, fine whatever, but as soon as it starts bothering and effecting other people, that's where the issues begin.

People do anyway.Nobody's bothered anymore.

[billy123]

Marijuana is a terrible curse on society i was an addict and i was injecting 20 marijuanas a day straight into my eyeball. The naysayers are right they arent naive at all this evil must be stopped.

uGL9XYH8Ttg

[the truth]

no. hell no. but prescribed for certain medical conditions yes. drugs is insanely out of control in the uk already as is drug related crime which is 10,000 times per head worse than the usa

[Nedusa]

No , cannabis is a dreadful drug to get hooked on, and hooked on it you will get for years possibly decades. It will rob you of your life, hopes dreams and ambitions to be replaced by endless days living in a comatose trancelike state.

Your life reduced to looking forward to that next spliff when you can get high and escape from everything.

It really quite an evil pernicious drug masquerading as an innocent drug in a par with alcohol. Truth is it is a nasty drug that promises you a rosy tinted take on life, a comfortable escape from the challenges of life but you are always the very last person to see the horrible truth of years of devotion to this weed.

A sad shallow empty existence living in a fog alone usually , unable to really function and eventually forced to accept that ones life has amounted to zilch

Harmless drug.... Get real

Also.......as a footnote to the above the type of weed now grown and sold on the streets is usually the skunk type with very high levels of THC without the corresponding levels of CBD which can counter the potency of THC in some skunks.

Without the balance of CBD the THC runs riot causing extremely powerful "trips" which can result in triggering "psychosis" in youngsters who are not able to handle the effects.

These skunk variants are artificially grown to maximise the THC content only and are grown in adapted areas in disused houses factories etc under powerful artificial lighting.

This is not weed this is big business producing a dangerous version of an already dangerous drug designed specifically for younger people who already have all the normal problems of adolescence.

Legalise this dangerous toxic weed...........you've got to be kidding.

[the truth]

its ok because Russell brand says so....but when the **** hits the fan and we go back to Russell and said, wait a minute we have zillions more druggies now, more drug related crime everywhere, more addicts robbing people to pay for their addiction, more addicts who cant work and go onto harder drugs, more drug pushers growing their own unregulated thh mind altering skunk, none of which can be tested....more drug related deaths.........over to you Russell? his response? oh im just a comedian mate.....nice one Russell

[Tom4784]

no. hell no. but prescribed for certain medical conditions yes. drugs is insanely out of control in the uk already as is drug related crime which is 10,000 times per head worse than the usa

This is hilarious.

If you drink or smoke but you're against Weed then you're a hypocrite, end of discussion really.

There is no real reason why Weed should be considered an illegal drug, none at all.

[waterhog]

dezzy at present - weed is illegal - so it does not make a hypocrite- i get what you are saying as in terms of damage though.

[Tom4784]

dezzy at present - weed is illegal - so it does not make a hypocrite- i get what you are saying as in terms of damage though.

I don't think it's wrong to say it's hypocritical to want to keep weed illegal but still partake in alchohol and cigerettes especially when a lot of the arguments against weed apply even more so to those two.

[Nedusa]

This is hilarious.

If you drink or smoke but you're against Weed then you're a hypocrite, end of discussion really.

There is no real reason why Weed should be considered an illegal drug, none at all.

Really......!!!!!

Did you not read my post(s)

[Tom4784]

Really......!!!!!

Did you not read my post(s)

I did and it was entirely pointless because you assumed that it wouldn't be regulated and controlled in the same way alcohol and cigarettes are and that invalidates your whole argument. The variant of weed you are talking about wouldn't likely be sold anywhere official since chances are the plants would have to be grown to certain specifications in order to be sold to the public.

The kind of weed you're talking about though is no more or less hazardous than the risks of drinking home brewed beer. Liver failure is a lot more serious and common than the 'psychosis' argument spouted by the people who buy the PR bull****.

[Nedusa]

Well on more realistic level the powers that be will never legalise cannabis because they know it would have a pernicious affect on Society , turning an already lazy workforce into goodness knows what.

For that reason alone govts don't want half the Country's workforce on sedation.

[Tom4784]

Well on more realistic level the powers that be will never legalise cannabis because they know it would have a pernicious affect on Society , turning an already lazy workforce into goodness knows what.

For that reason alone govts don't want half the Country's workforce on sedation.

....You're not serious, right? THAT's your reasoning?

Would you say the same thing about alcohol? It's more addictive than weed, the dangers of consuming too much of it is worse for the person drinking it and the people around them but that's A-okay because Weed will cause the downfall of society?

There's millions of people that smoke weed and, surprisingly enough, they don't turn into Jay and Silent Bob for doing so. Your arguments are based on nothing but rather stupid scenarios, stereotypes and facts without context.

You are reaching for reasons and honestly it's hilarious.

[Anaesthesia]

Marijuana is a terrible curse on society i was an addict and i was injecting 20 marijuanas a day straight into my eyeball. The naysayers are right they arent naive at all this evil must be stopped.

uGL9XYH8Ttg

Bless you. The only obvious solution to that is drinking vodka straight through your eyeball. With a teeny weeny bit of lemon juice.

[bots]

....You're not serious, right? THAT's your reasoning?

Would you say the same thing about alcohol? It's more addictive than weed, the dangers of consuming too much of it is worse for the person drinking it and the people around them but that's A-okay because Weed will cause the downfall of society?

There's millions of people that smoke weed and, surprisingly enough, they don't turn into Jay and Silent Bob for doing so. Your arguments are based on nothing but rather stupid scenarios, stereotypes and fact without context.

You are reaching for reasons and honestly it's hilarious.

with respect, this is all just fluff from someone who I presume takes cannabis illegally already and wants to justify it.

[Anaesthesia]

Here's my take though.I'm a middle class professional, and I mix with a range of other middle class professionals (doctors, lawyers, programmers...) and we all use MJ. More often than not because of work stress and needing to sleep, and not enjoying alcohol and its effects.

When we're all together at a party or BBQ and playing a silly parlour game like Words against Humanity it can be really funny because everyone's inhibitions are down and it's just fun.

On a creative scale it can also be wonderful, if you write then you'll get some amazing ideas. Just remember to write them down.

Never been attacked by anyone on MJ, but have been assaulted by drunks on too many occasions to count. Legalise MJ, get rid of alcohol.

[Tom4784]

with respect, this is all just fluff from someone who I presume takes cannabis illegally already and wants to justify it.

I've never done any drugs in my life and probably never will, I have no interest in doing so. I just think it's ridiculous that weed is treated like it is when we're all fine and dandy with people puffing on cancer sticks and drinking vehicular manslaughter juice.

It's hypocritical.

[Anaesthesia]

I've never done any drugs in my life and probably never will, I have no interest in doing so. I just think it's ridiculous that weed is treated like it is when we're all fine and dandy with people puffing on cancer sticks and drinking vehicular manslaughter juice.

It's hypocritical.

If you've ever drunk alcohol, smoked cigarettes, or drunk coffee, you've "done drugs". It's just a matter of what's acceptable on the day, as I'm sure you know and recognise.

[Tom4784]

If you've ever drunk alcohol, smoked cigarettes, or drunk coffee, you've "done drugs". It's just a matter of what's acceptable on the day, as I'm sure you know and recognise.

I was obviously referring to the currently illegal kind but I understand what you're getting at.

[Anaesthesia]

I was obviously referring to the currently illegal kind but I understand what you're getting at.

Yeah I was pretty sure you were. For me, it's about what should be legal / illegal, and who decides.

[Anaesthesia]

And on what basis.

[lostalex]

i hate being high. it makes me feel like ****, and dizzy, and paranoid... but i totally support everyone else's right to do it.

it's about time they started paying taxes.

[lily.]

no. hell no. but prescribed for certain medical conditions yes. drugs is insanely out of control in the uk already as is drug related crime which is 10,000 times per head worse than the usa

Yeah, but they balance it out with their gun crime stats.

[Will.]

I would sign it

[the truth]

Yeah, but they balance it out with their gun crime stats.

maybe but it doesn't make our absurd drug related crime and violent crime stats any better....our figures are way worse than the yanks. plus although I detest guns, ill play devils advocate here and point out whilst theres 13000 yanks shot dead on the streets and even worse rates in s America and s Africa...but how many lives do guns actually save? old people are often left defensless in the uk against drug users and violent thieves, I bet theyd love a pistol in their hands and I bet it would ward off some of these thugs

[Northern Monkey]

Well on more realistic level the powers that be will never legalise cannabis because they know it would have a pernicious affect on Society , turning an already lazy workforce into goodness knows what.

For that reason alone govts don't want half the Country's workforce on sedation.
I can guarantee that more people skip work due to alchohol than weed.I've know quite a few people who smoke a J on their breaks.People smoke every night and go to work fine the next day.How many people pull sickies with a hangover?

[the truth]

I can guarantee that more people skip work due to alchohol than weed.I've know quite a few people who smoke a J on their breaks.People smoke every night and go to work fine the next day.How many people pull sickies with a hangover?


booze does enormous damage I agree, its dirt cheap in the supermarket, no one is regulating these rabid alcoholics, its rife , the advertising should be regulated tighter far tighter and kids should be taught about the massive dangers, which they are not. meanwhile it costs the nhs billions

[waterhog]

booze does enormous damage I agree, its dirt cheap in the supermarket, no one is regulating these rabid alcoholics, its rife , the advertising should be regulated tighter far tighter and kids should be taught about the massive dangers, which they are not. meanwhile it costs the nhs billions

don't forget - they who buy it are paing tax on it - therefor funding own treatment.

[Kizzy]

Haha of course they'll legalise it if they can tax it, you can already be stopped for 'drug driving' so it's the next logical step I guess.
So it relaxes you... so does diazapam :laugh:

[waterhog]

i am sure if stopped while driving under the influence of that as well you will be done.

[bots]

I've never done any drugs in my life and probably never will, I have no interest in doing so. I just think it's ridiculous that weed is treated like it is when we're all fine and dandy with people puffing on cancer sticks and drinking vehicular manslaughter juice.

It's hypocritical.

They made a mistake making alcohol and tobacco freely available and relatively unregulated. Where I am coming from is that we shouldn't sink to the lowest common denominator and just make anything and everything legal. Its not a justification in itself to say that cannabis should be legal because tobacco and alcohol are.

To me its a very strange bandwagon to be on. We know the issues there are with non prescribed drugs in whatever format, so suggesting we add to the mess by making cannabis legal is just illogical.

I should add that any government that positively makes a drug legal which was previously illegal, risks getting their asses sued in this day and age if some unfortunate event can be associated with it. For that reason alone, it will never be legalised

[Nedusa]

....You're not serious, right? THAT's your reasoning?

Would you say the same thing about alcohol? It's more addictive than weed, the dangers of consuming too much of it is worse for the person drinking it and the people around them but that's A-okay because Weed will cause the downfall of society?

There's millions of people that smoke weed and, surprisingly enough, they don't turn into Jay and Silent Bob for doing so. Your arguments are based on nothing but rather stupid scenarios, stereotypes and facts without context.

You are reaching for reasons and honestly it's hilarious.

Nobody's laughing except you..........perhaps you are a victim also of this scourge....

My sympathies if that is the case.

[Kizzy]

If drug driving is a thing then does the vehicular manslaughter label not apply to cannabis too?
Will legalising lessen the associated risk? As said 2 wrongs don't make a right, it's available to those who need it and tolerated for personal use, only mass production of skunk is still investigated.

[waterhog]

ohhhhhhhhhhhhh you no your stuff miss.

[Daniel.]

I don't even smoke it often as I have class but the smell slays me here for it smothering the streets

[Tom4784]

They made a mistake making alcohol and tobacco freely available and relatively unregulated. Where I am coming from is that we shouldn't sink to the lowest common denominator and just make anything and everything legal. Its not a justification in itself to say that cannabis should be legal because tobacco and alcohol are.

To me its a very strange bandwagon to be on. We know the issues there are with non prescribed drugs in whatever format, so suggesting we add to the mess by making cannabis legal is just illogical.

I should add that any government that positively makes a drug legal which was previously illegal, risks getting their asses sued in this day and age if some unfortunate event can be associated with it. For that reason alone, it will never be legalised

Tobacco and Alcohol are 'relatively' unregulated? Ermm.....no.

There's no reason why weed should be illegal, it's pretty damn harmless (it actually has benefits when it comes to diseases) and the risk to other people is minimal. Obviously when it comes to driving and such it should be treated the same as alcohol but aside from that, when's the last time you heard someone attacking someone else because they were high?

When did ANYONE, let alone me, say that 'anything and everything' should be made legal? I'm not saying we should legalise Heroin or coke or whatever. Weed is basically harmless, keeping it classified as an illegal drug just because is completely and utterly pointless.

Nobody's laughing except you..........perhaps you are a victim also of this scourge....

My sympathies if that is the case.

Maybe one day you'll actually have a point to make, dear.

[Kizzy]

I don't believe skunk is harmless, will this be included in the legalisation?

[Tom4784]

I don't believe skunk is harmless, will this be included in the legalisation?

Well it goes without saying so I don't know why you bring this up when I covered it in the last page. If it was legalised it would also likely be heavily regulated in terms of how it's made and distributed just like Alcohol and Tobacco is, even more so really, given that it would have been a previously illegal drug.

Of course it doesn't stop people from growing their own skunk but then would you want to ban alcohol because some people will brew dangerous batches at home? Of course not. It's reaching and it's a desperate argument overall.

There's no real reason why weed should remain an illegal drug. Any argument against it applies doubly so against Tobacco and Alcohol.

[Livia]

Well it goes without saying so I don't know why you bring this up when I covered it in the last page. If it was legalised it would also likely be heavily regulated in terms of how it's made and distributed just like Alcohol and Tobacco is, even more so really, given that it would have been a previously illegal drug.

Of course it doesn't stop people from growing their own skunk but then would you want to ban alcohol because some people will brew dangerous batches at home? Of course not. It's reaching and it's a desperate argument overall.

There's no real reason why weed should remain an illegal drug. Any argument against it applies doubly so against Tobacco and Alcohol.

I'm with you all the way on this one.

[lily.]

I've yet to hear a valid argument against legalising it.

[LukeB]

my friend says she doesn't want to do weed because it's really bad but I see her drinking and getting pissed every weekend and smoking cigarettes. It's fine she doesn't smoke weed but I just don't understand why she does drinking/smoking cigarettes since she said weed is bad for people when cigarettes can give you cancer and things and alcohol can damage your liver/kidney w.e

[lily.]

Yup. There seems to be a lot of anti-weed people who are happy to fill their bodies with cigarettes and alcohol.

[Kizzy]

Well it goes without saying so I don't know why you bring this up when I covered it in the last page. If it was legalised it would also likely be heavily regulated in terms of how it's made and distributed just like Alcohol and Tobacco is, even more so really, given that it would have been a previously illegal drug.

Of course it doesn't stop people from growing their own skunk but then would you want to ban alcohol because some people will brew dangerous batches at home? Of course not. It's reaching and it's a desperate argument overall.

There's no real reason why weed should remain an illegal drug. Any argument against it applies doubly so against Tobacco and Alcohol.

It's a debate... I offer my point and you yours, my view isn't reaching or desperate.
It wouldn't address the substance which is the root of the problem with the production of cannabis in the UK then? Seems not so how is this going to be the big solution to the cannabis issue .. it isn't.

[the truth]

when booze was banned and later legalised.....the difference in boozing fell massively, though crime such as bootlegging rose. make of that what you will

[lostalex]

cannabis for ALL!

they should pump cannabis smoke through the air vents in every building.

[waterhog]

cannabis for ALL!

they should pump cannabis smoke through the air vents in every building.



lostalex - you are more extreme then me - i would not go that far :joker:

[Cherie]

Yet another debate ruined because views are not respected and countered with proper argument but the usual insults..but that's another thread I guess :unsure:

[Tom4784]

It's a debate... I offer my point and you yours, my view isn't reaching or desperate.
It wouldn't address the substance which is the root of the problem with the production of cannabis in the UK then? Seems not so how is this going to be the big solution to the cannabis issue .. it isn't.

Again, how is it any different to homebrewed alcohol? You've conveniently ignored that in favour of one line that doesn't even have any bearing on the discussion because you know you can't argue against it.

You're making the skunk issue bigger than it actually is because it's the only point you have and, like all anti-weed arguments, it applies more to alcohol and tobacco than weed.

[Tom4784]

Yet another debate ruined because views are not respected and countered with proper argument but the usual insults..but that's another thread I guess :unsure:

I'd say baiting comments like yours that actually add nothing to the debate run the risk of ruining it more than anything anyone else has said so far.

[waterhog]

i think i need to do a "love of my life" for all forum members ?


this could be heaven for everyone forum user ? if we want ? lets try it ?

[Cherie]

I'd say baiting comments like yours that actually add nothing to the debate run the risk of ruining it more than anything anyone else has said so far.

Just expressing a view, you need look no further than yourself for baiting and constantly insulting members while you hide behind your mod status

[Cherie]

i think i need to do a "love of my life" for all forum members ?


this could be heaven for everyone forum user ? if we want ? lets try it ?

:laugh: sounds good.

[lostalex]

i really don't understand how this is such a long thread. weed is being legalized, get over it. i don't know why anyone can be against it.

its the year 2015. people that smoke weed don't hurt anyone else, let them smoke!

it's stupid to me to spend more tax payer's money on putting people in jail just for smoking weed. so stupid. leave the pot heads alone! let
s use our tax money for better things, please!

i don't like smoking weed, i think it's stupid, i think it makes people act stupid and sound stupid.... but i certainly don't think we should be wasting money on putting them in jail! They are harmless.

[Tom4784]

Just expressing a view, you need look no further than yourself for baiting and constantly insulting members while you hide behind your mod status

Ah, you're just looking for a argument then. Typical.

Funny that you adding nothing to the topic but baiting remarks and insults aimed at me and you call that 'expressing a view' yet my posts, in which I've discussed this topic and posted very valid points is deemed 'baiting and insulting'.

Bit strange that.

[lostalex]

i can think of plenty of people that should be put in jail, marijuana smokers is not at the top of my list though. it's a total waste of resources to keep criminalizing those people.

[Kizzy]

Again, how is it any different to homebrewed alcohol? You've conveniently ignored that in favour of one line that doesn't even have any bearing on the discussion because you know you can't argue against it.

You're making the skunk issue bigger than it actually is because it's the only point you have and, like all anti-weed arguments, it applies more to alcohol and tobacco than weed.

The isn't about alcohol though :/
That is legal and people can get high strength alcohol very cheaply in stores.. that's why people don't all fork out for the equipment to brew hooch.
As I've said the issue will be with skunk that won't be included in the legalisation ( most likely) due to the difference in the THC and CBD levels.

I've ignored your straw man debate because it has no bearing on the discussion. To be honest with you Cherie is right you can be insulting in your replies to those you disagree with.. me for one, this thread is just one example. I'm not reaching, making a desperate argument or ignoring anything you say... I just have my own opinion and I just don't happen to agree with your view.

[Cherie]

Ah, you're just looking for a argument then. Typical.

Funny that you adding nothing to the topic but baiting remarks and insults aimed at me and you call that 'expressing a view' yet my posts, in which I've discussed this topic and posted very valid points is deemed 'baiting and insulting'.

Bit strange that.

Typical? Not really.

[Tom4784]

Typical? Not really.

Hmm, I see you've got nothing useful to add to the topic so I'm just gonna ignore your blatant baiting attempts from now on.

[Josy]

Only people with little or no real experience of weed seem to be against legalising it.

[Tom4784]

The isn't about alcohol though :/
That is legal and people can get high strength alcohol very cheaply in stores.. that's why people don't all fork out for the equipment to brew hooch.
As I've said the issue will be with skunk that won't be included in the legalisation ( most likely) due to the difference in the THC and CBD levels.

I've ignored your straw man debate because it has no bearing on the discussion. To be honest with you Cherie is right you can be insulting in your replies to those you disagree with.. me for one, this thread is just one example. I'm not reaching, making a desperate argument or ignoring anything you say... I just have my own opinion and I just don't happen to agree with your view.

The reason why I keep bringing up alcohol is because it's a much dangerous substance than weed yet it's legal. The skunk argument is the true strawman argument here. You've not been able to offer up one reason why weed should be illegal aside from what essentially boils down to 'some people might abuse it and grow skunk' which is no reason to ban it at all when, if you legalise it you can tax and regulate it and make the official stuff more preferable to the homegrown stuff.

'That is legal and people can get high strength alcohol very cheaply in stores.. that's why people don't all fork out for the equipment to brew hooch.'
Why can't this quote from your post also apply to weed if it was legalised? If it was legal to be sold then people wouldn't bother with the cheap homegrown stuff unless they knew what they were doing.

Your last paragraph as it's just another attempt to demean my argument by saying I've insulted you when I haven't because you can't win this debate by tackling the points I've made head on.

I've never insulted you, I said that the skunk argument as a whole was reaching and desperate. I never actually called you desperate or reaching, you just chose to interpret it that way so you could try to derail the thread by saying I was insulting you when you knew you couldn't win. Really, you and Cherie should apologise to me for trying take things off topic and insulting me because it's only you two that's guilty of the things you're branding me with.

[Livia]

Only people with little or no real experience of weed seem to be against legalising it.

This whole thread... in a nutshell.

[bots]

The reason why I keep bringing up alcohol is because it's a much dangerous substance than weed yet it's legal. The skunk argument is the true strawman argument here. You've not been able to offer up one reason why weed should be illegal aside from what essentially boils down to 'some people might abuse it and grow skunk' which is no reason to ban it at all when, if you legalise it you can tax and regulate it and make the official stuff more preferable to the homegrown stuff.



Although i've mentioned it several times already, it doesn't seem you have considered it. Whether alcohol or tobacco are currently legal or not is completely irrelevant. Tobacco won't be legal for much longer, I would say that within 1 or 2 generations it will be completely illegal. There is a general move to tighten up alcohol too, so measures are becoming more restrictive in general, not less so. So why, under those circumstances do you believe that cannabis should buck that trend.

Personally, I think it is primarily an age related issue around entitlement. In my youth I dabbled plenty with cannabis so I know with personal experience the effects that it has and I'm an ex-smoker too. I wouldn't under any circumstances suggest that cannabis be legalised, it will cause many, many more issues than it solves.

[Livia]

Although i've mentioned it several times already, it doesn't seem you have considered it. Whether alcohol or tobacco are currently legal or not is completely irrelevant. Tobacco won't be legal for much longer, I would say that within 1 or 2 generations it will be completely illegal. There is a general move to tighten up alcohol too, so measures are becoming more restrictive in general, not less so. So why, under those circumstances do you believe that cannabis should buck that trend.

Personally, I think it is primarily an age related issue around entitlement. In my youth I dabbled plenty with cannabis so I know with personal experience the effects that it has and I'm an ex-smoker too. I wouldn't under any circumstances suggest that cannabis be legalised, it will cause many, many more issues than it solves.

I think the true figures of how many people actually partake would be a surprise. I know lots and lots of people who use it recreationally, not feckless, paranoid unemployables, but high-functioning professionals. It is less damaging than tobacco and alcohol, that's a fact. By making it legal firstly, it can be regulated and taxed, secondly it takes it out of the hands of criminals. If things are, as you put it, "tightened up" with tobacco and alcohol to such an extent that people can't get hold of it , it'll just send it underground and into the hands of the criminal element where cannabis is at the moment. It's been the case throughout history.

[Tom4784]

Although i've mentioned it several times already, it doesn't seem you have considered it. Whether alcohol or tobacco are currently legal or not is completely irrelevant. Tobacco won't be legal for much longer, I would say that within 1 or 2 generations it will be completely illegal. There is a general move to tighten up alcohol too, so measures are becoming more restrictive in general, not less so. So why, under those circumstances do you believe that cannabis should buck that trend.

Personally, I think it is primarily an age related issue around entitlement. In my youth I dabbled plenty with cannabis so I know with personal experience the effects that it has and I'm an ex-smoker too. I wouldn't under any circumstances suggest that cannabis be legalised, it will cause many, many more issues than it solves.

I doubt that Tobacco will ever be made illegal, it brings far too much tax to the pot for the government to truly consider making it illegal, same with alcohol. They'll make token gestures (making it illegal to display cigarettes in stores etc) to show that they're trying to cut down on it but that's all it is.

I fail to see the issues that would come of legalising it, like Liv said it would take the power out of the criminal element's hands and as a whole it's a safer alternative to Alcohol and Tobacco. You don't get millions of people dying every year due to weed related illnesses, in fact I don't think anyone has actually ever died directly due to Weed usage, you can't overdose on it, it doesn't cause Liver Failure or Lung Cancer or any kind of terminal illness. The only health related concern you can say about it is that bad batches can cause mental issues through repeated use which wouldn't be a problem if it's legalised and sold officially.

[lily.]

I'd say baiting comments like yours that actually add nothing to the debate run the risk of ruining it more than anything anyone else has said so far.

Yup. I would agree with this.

It's kinda the norm around here.

[joeysteele]

I think the true figures of how many people actually partake would be a surprise. I know lots and lots of people who use it recreationally, not feckless, paranoid unemployables, but high-functioning professionals. It is less damaging than tobacco and alcohol, that's a fact. By making it legal firstly, it can be regulated and taxed, secondly it takes it out of the hands of criminals. If things are, as you put it, "tightened up" with tobacco and alcohol to such an extent that people can't get hold of it , it'll just send it underground and into the hands of the criminal element where cannabis is at the moment. It's been the case throughout history.


I have been amazed at some of the 'professional' people who use it,like you state above Livia.

The rest of your post is also totally spot on. I would agree it is less damaging than alcohol particularly too.
Already at only 23, I have come across innumerable people whose lives have been devastated by alcohol, both in the physical and mental health situations, and then also as to their lives and relationships as a knock on to it too.

[user104658]

I smoked it fairly regularly at University, I'd say most students at least give it a go tbh.

That said, I'm not actually a huge fan, I don't really enjoy the effect, haven't and wouldn't do it again since then... However... I totally agree with the argument that alcohol is a FAR worse drug than cannabis and it's accepted in the majority of cultures globally. If you're OK with alcohol being legal then you literally have no argument against cannabis being legalised.

[the truth]

Only people with little or no real experience of weed seem to be against legalising it.

yes put the junkies in charge of decisions and ignore the clean living people? insane liberalism :shrug::shrug:

[AProducer'sWetDream]

yes put the junkies in charge of decisions and ignore the clean living people? insane liberalism :shrug::shrug:

Not everyone who has ever touched cannabis is a junkie. :shrug: That's the same as me saying that everyone who has ever had a drink in their life is an alcoholic. I am pro legalisation by the way- alcohol is incredibly damaging to people's physical and mental health, and costs the NHS billions- cannabis use carries much less risk and they only reason I think alcohol and tobacco are still legal is the amount of money the government earn by taxing these substances.

[Kizzy]

Only people with little or no real experience of weed seem to be against legalising it.

That's very presumptuous of you Josy, and for me anyway wrong too.

[Kizzy]

The reason why I keep bringing up alcohol is because it's a much dangerous substance than weed yet it's legal. The skunk argument is the true strawman argument here. You've not been able to offer up one reason why weed should be illegal aside from what essentially boils down to 'some people might abuse it and grow skunk' which is no reason to ban it at all when, if you legalise it you can tax and regulate it and make the official stuff more preferable to the homegrown stuff.


Why can't this quote from your post also apply to weed if it was legalised? If it was legal to be sold then people wouldn't bother with the cheap homegrown stuff unless they knew what they were doing.

Your last paragraph as it's just another attempt to demean my argument by saying I've insulted you when I haven't because you can't win this debate by tackling the points I've made head on.

I've never insulted you, I said that the skunk argument as a whole was reaching and desperate. I never actually called you desperate or reaching, you just chose to interpret it that way so you could try to derail the thread by saying I was insulting you when you knew you couldn't win. Really, you and Cherie should apologise to me for trying take things off topic and insulting me because it's only you two that's guilty of the things you're branding me with.

So comparisons to alcohol are relevant but when I compare skunk to legalised cannabis it's a straw man tactic?...

Discussing skunk which is a huge problem in my area in a thread relating to cannabis is not reaching and/or desperate in my view and is the reason I found your dismissal of my opinion so insulting.

I know alcohol is dangerous unfortunately you can't put that genie back in the bottle, however as drug driving is now an offence and skunk farms still prevalent how would legalising cannabis benefit the UK apart from making some filthy rich?

[the truth]

Not everyone who has ever touched cannabis is a junkie. :shrug: That's the same as me saying that everyone who has ever had a drink in their life is an alcoholic. I am pro legalisation by the way- alcohol is incredibly damaging to people's physical and mental health, and costs the NHS billions- cannabis use carries much less risk and they only reason I think alcohol and tobacco are still legal is the amount of money the government earn by taxing these substances.

yes you have your petty play on words whilst the country falls apart with record drug related crime....and of course only drug takers are allowed an opinion on drugs under the liberal loony left ? and of course because people are allowed to get drunk off their faces lets allow them to get drugged up to their eyeballs too , yes that will help? the usual insane moral relativism of the loony left. booze should have a far higher minimum price. id be more than happy to see it banned from all supermarkets....at least when people drink in pubs its managed by staff to a degree. but the argument if we have booze on the shelves we should have drugs too, is insane in the membrane. drugs destroy lives, increase crime, increase drug dealing , increasing irrational erratic violent behaviour and is a gateway to harder drugs which kill people and create enormous social problems too. you throw in liberal booze and liberal drugs laws and you have a concoction that will see the country go to hell in a handbasket.....and all you can worry about is what do we call junkies? get a grip

[Josy]

yes put the junkies in charge of decisions and ignore the clean living people? insane liberalism :shrug::shrug:

The majority of people that smoke cannabis aren't junkies, a lot of professional, hard working people that live very normal lives enjoy having the odd smoke and most people have the willpower to not become an addict and by that I'm not in anyway saying all addicts lack willpower as some get so sucked into the addiction that it then becomes dangerous for them to stop, with all drugs and also alcohol but with cannabis most people don't become addicted to start with and can easily control how much they wish to have and when to stop.

That's very presumptuous of you Josy, and for me anyway wrong too.

Not presumptuous at all, that's my experience of the whole cannabis debate.

[Kizzy]

Not presumptuous at all, that's my experience of the whole cannabis debate.

You have no idea what the experience of cannabis is for those who are against legalisation though, those who are for it who think that the issues are down to a 'bad batch' don't appear to be that clued up either tbh.

[Tom4784]

So comparisons to alcohol are relevant but when I compare skunk to legalised cannabis it's a straw man tactic?...

Discussing skunk which is a huge problem in my area in a thread relating to cannabis is not reaching and/or desperate in my view and is the reason I found your dismissal of my opinion so insulting.

I know alcohol is dangerous unfortunately you can't put that genie back in the bottle, however as drug driving is now an offence and skunk farms still prevalent how would legalising cannabis benefit the UK apart from making some filthy rich?

Yes because, like you said when it we were talking about alcohol, if it was legalised and sold, the process of growing it would become standardised and regulated which would mean that, like you said when it came to the home brewed, people would be more likely to buy the legal variety due to simply being easier to get.

You can buy cheap knockoff fags that are hazardous to your health, you can buy knockoff beer that's just as dangerous too but these aren't huge widespread issues because the vast majority of people will go for the legal options. If they legalised weed then chances are your area's skunk problem would end becoming less of a problem since people would just end up buying the legit stuff.

If you legalise something, you can control it and you remove the power from the criminal element who would otherwise have control over how much skunk makes it into the public's hands. Weed is basically harmless, certainly more harmless than tobacco or alcohol so why shouldn't it be legalised? Legalising it will reduce the amount of skunk that's around.

[AProducer'sWetDream]

yes you have your petty play on words whilst the country falls apart with record drug related crime....and of course only drug takers are allowed an opinion on drugs under the liberal loony left ? and of course because people are allowed to get drunk off their faces lets allow them to get drugged up to their eyeballs too , yes that will help? the usual insane moral relativism of the loony left. booze should have a far higher minimum price. id be more than happy to see it banned from all supermarkets....at least when people drink in pubs its managed by staff to a degree. but the argument if we have booze on the shelves we should have drugs too, is insane in the membrane. drugs destroy lives, increase crime, increase drug dealing , increasing irrational erratic violent behaviour and is a gateway to harder drugs which kill people and create enormous social problems too. you throw in liberal booze and liberal drugs laws and you have a concoction that will see the country go to hell in a handbasket.....and all you can worry about is what do we call junkies? get a grip

My point is that a lot of people who use cannabis use it for recreational use in moderation. There are many cannabis users who are professional, hard-working and the many problems you identified if we legalised this drug (increase in drug dealing, increase in crime, and violent and erratic behaviour) would be much less of a problem if the drug was legalised and controlled like tobacco and alcohol. There wouldn't be very much drug dealing as it could be sold openly by regulated businesses, a lot of crime related to drugs (burglary, theft etc) is caused by the dealers exploiting some people's addictions and charging these people ridiculous prices. Changing the law to make cannabis legal will not cause everybody to start using cannabis and 'the country go to hell in a handbasket', if you think that then I think you may seriously underestimate the number of people who ignore the law and use these drug anyway.

[Kizzy]

Yes because, like you said when it we were talking about alcohol, if it was legalised and sold, the process of growing it would become standardised and regulated which would mean that, like you said when it came to the home brewed, people would be more likely to buy the legal variety due to simply being easier to get.

You can buy cheap knockoff fags that are hazardous to your health, you can buy knockoff beer that's just as dangerous too but these aren't huge widespread issues because the vast majority of people will go for the legal options. If they legalised weed then chances are your area's skunk problem would end becoming less of a problem since people would just end up buying the legit stuff.

If you legalise something, you can control it and you remove the power from the criminal element who would otherwise have control over how much skunk makes it into the public's hands. Weed is basically harmless, certainly more harmless than tobacco or alcohol so why shouldn't it be legalised? Legalising it will reduce the amount of skunk that's around.

I disagree, I don't think if both were available and they were already regularly illegally using the high THC content skunk they would switch to the regulated brand no.
I think those who want it will still seek it out therefore the legalisation will have no baring on that issue, nor do I think those producing it will stop.

If it's harmless then why can you not smoke cannabis and drive?

[Cherie]

Kizzy makes some very valid points

[Tom4784]

I disagree, I don't think if both were available and they were already regularly illegally using the high THC content skunk they would switch to the regulated brand no.
I think those who want it will still seek it out therefore the legalisation will have no baring on that issue, nor do I think those producing it will stop.

If it's harmless then why can you not smoke cannabis and drive?

It was obvious that meant that is was harmless in the fact that you can't die from it. Obviously operating heavy machinery is an issue for a lot of substances, legal and otherwise....

Most people would make the switch to the regulated kind, using fringe examples as an argument against the majority is pointless. Skunk isn't as big of a problem as you make it out to be and it would be even less of an issue if weed was legalised.

Once again, there are no reasons why weed should continue to be banned.

[Alf]

Balls to that

If it were made legal it would cost a bomb, the tax the criminals in Westminster would take.

I'm happy how it is.

[Josy]

You have no idea what the experience of cannabis is for those who are against legalisation though, those who are for it who think that the issues are down to a 'bad batch' don't appear to be that clued up either tbh.

I know what the experience is of the majority of people I have had discussions with about it and most if not all that are against it have little to none, hence my opinion that I first posted in the thread.

[Josy]

Kizzy why do you keep mentioning skunk? do you have experience of this strain of cannabis or are you going by what you have read in the papers about it?

There are numerous strains that have high levels of THC, but then anything above roughly 12% is regarded as high and for each different strain you get they all affect users slightly different, you also get different effects again depending on which plant was used in the first place.

A lot of the anti legalisation prejudice today is based on the same claims some here are using about THC levels and the weed being more potent than that of a few decades ago, which is just complete garbage tbh.

Years ago the argument was 'Ohh cannabis is a gateway drug' hahah :joker:

Here in the UK most people that say they are smoking skunk aren't btw, they are just using it as a word to describe whatever type of generic weed they have.

[Kizzy]

Kizzy why do you keep mentioning skunk? do you have experience of this strain of cannabis or are you going by what you have read in the papers about it?

There are numerous strains that have high levels of THC, but then anything above roughly 12% is regarded as high and for each different strain you get they all affect users slightly different, you also get different effects again depending on which plant was used in the first place.

A lot of the anti legalisation prejudice today is based on the same claims some here are using about THC levels and the weed being more potent than that of a few decades ago, which is just complete garbage tbh.

Years ago the argument was 'Ohh cannabis is a gateway drug' hahah :joker:

Here in the UK most people that say they are smoking skunk aren't btw, they are just using it as a word to describe whatever type of generic weed they have.

Because it's a big issue, I have experience of it both in my family and in my community, from speaking to youth groups and the police. Why do you presume those who are against have no knowledge of the subject and those that are for it are some kind of cannabis gurus?
As I said it's not only the high THC content but the low CBD in this stain that is causing issues, in many cases they are smoking skunk and farms are being discovered in Leeds almost daily.

[Kizzy]

It was obvious that meant that is was harmless in the fact that you can't die from it. Obviously operating heavy machinery is an issue for a lot of substances, legal and otherwise....

Most people would make the switch to the regulated kind, using fringe examples as an argument against the majority is pointless. Skunk isn't as big of a problem as you make it out to be and it would be even less of an issue if weed was legalised.

Once again, there are no reasons why weed should continue to be banned.

Yes lots of substances are which is why it's either illegal to operate a vehicle or operate machinery while under the influence or they are regulated via prescription. The 'lots of things are legal' argument for something illegal becoming legal is weak.

Would they... How do you know this, people want more bang for their buck, why pay more for something weaker or less of it?
What majority.. Are you sure the majority in the UK want it legalised? It is a big problem where I live for example, you can choose to ignore or deny that fact if you want.

I believe there are many reasons why cannabis should continue to be tightly regulated.

[the truth]

The majority of people that smoke cannabis aren't junkies, a lot of professional, hard working people that live very normal lives enjoy having the odd smoke and most people have the willpower to not become an addict and by that I'm not in anyway saying all addicts lack willpower as some get so sucked into the addiction that it then becomes dangerous for them to stop, with all drugs and also alcohol but with cannabis most people don't become addicted to start with and can easily control how much they wish to have and when to stop.



Not presumptuous at all, that's my experience of the whole cannabis debate.

wheres your facts and figures to back up your claim that most are hard working professionals? also your incredibly generalized claims that most people don't become addicted? really? any proof?

[Josy]

wheres your facts and figures to back up your claim that most are hard working professionals? also your incredibly generalized claims that most people don't become addicted? really? any proof?

I never claimed that 'most' were hard working professionals, I said many are, which is true.

I know many people that enjoy smoking some weed every now and then, none of them are addicted and all live very normal lives and definitely could not be generalised into one category and classed as junkies, that's all the proof I need tbh, do you have any facts that prove otherwise?

[the truth]

I never claimed that 'most' were hard working professionals, I said many are, which is true.

I know many people that enjoy smoking some weed every now and then, none of them are addicted and all live very normal lives and definitely could not be generalised into one category and classed as junkies, that's all the proof I need tbh, do you have any facts that prove otherwise?

I know of 100s of junkies, I know where they live, I know it all....and I know the cops turn a blindeye to it all and the residents have to suffer as to the paramedics , fire service when all hell breaks loose as it always does

[Josy]

I know of 100s of junkies, I know where they live, I know it all....and I know the cops turn a blindeye to it all and the residents have to suffer as to the paramedics , fire service when all hell breaks loose as it always does

The junkies youre referring to must take more than weed then because all hell does not break loose when people are only smoking cannabis lol

[Tom4784]

I know of 100s of junkies, I know where they live, I know it all....and I know the cops turn a blindeye to it all and the residents have to suffer as to the paramedics , fire service when all hell breaks loose as it always does

Oh, so you know hundreds of 'junkies' that apparently riot when they do weed and the police just lets them get on with it? You don't honestly expect anyone to believe that right? It's just more lies and not even good ones.

[bots]

The junkies youre referring to must take more than weed then because all hell does not break loose when people are only smoking cannabis lol

the music gets loud and groovy though and thats hell :laugh:

[Samuel.]

I know of 100s of junkies, I know where they live, I know it all....and I know the cops turn a blindeye to it all and the residents have to suffer as to the paramedics , fire service when all hell breaks loose as it always does

This is gold

[the truth]

Oh, so you know hundreds of 'junkies' that apparently riot when they do weed and the police just lets them get on with it? You don't honestly expect anyone to believe that right? It's just more lies and not even good ones. I don't what you choose to disbelief I speak the truth, I live in the real world, not some fantasy student world. My data is primary , ive employed people for donkeys years and Ive seen all the anti social behaviour and drugs first hand. I have infinitely more first hand experience in this situation than you judging by your naïve nonsense. drugs are rife, people take them all over the place in open and the cops turn a blind eye all day long. the police is not even a police force any more, its a service. take your head out of the left wing loony books and look at what is actually happening....drug related crime rates are 100s of times worse than America. people are sticking plants up their noses without even knowing the consequences. youre the mirror image of a daily mail right winger, youre a naïve lefty who hasn't visited planet earth