Should any religion be taken seriously in the year 2015?

[Johnnyuk123]

Science has proved many many things about the world and still creationists from many religions refute the many facts about this world surrounding them. Has religion had it's day or should we still believe in the invisible man and more importantly Father Christmas? Discuss....:wavey:

[Glenn.]

It should be wiped from civilizations in every way.

[Cherie]

Is it Wine O Clock?

[Johnnyuk123]

It should be wiped from civilizations in every way.

:worship::worship::worship::clap1::clap1::clap1:

[Johnnyuk123]

Is it Wine O Clock?

Always, remember they ply you with vino in church too. :joker::joker::joker::wavey:

[Mokka]

It's threads like these that make me steer clear of Unrealistic Debates and News :idc:

[Jessica.]

I don't think religion should be encouraged but religious people shouldn't be scrutinised for their choice either. :) We don't need another thread hating on religious people.

[lewis111]

It has caused a lot of problems in the world but you can't exactly say to someone "you can't believe or think this", as long as it's not affecting people through war or opinions against things then people should be allowed to belve what they want, even if science proves other wise

[Johnnyuk123]

I remember going to sunday school and being told that 5000 people were fed with only 5 loaves and two fish. Coming from a large family i knew at 6yrs of age that this was simply not true. For one my brother always had 5 fish fingers and 6 slices of bread and thats from a family of nine kids at dinner time. So do the math.:joker::joker::joker:

[JoshBB]

Yes it should be taken seriously, because we should respect and tolerate other peoples' beliefs.. not just our own.

Threads like this are why people don't take atheists seriously.

[Cherie]

Always, remember they ply you with vino in church too. :joker::joker::joker::wavey:

Never had wine in church, each to their own, faith can provide a huge comfort to some, and if people are non believers I have no issue with that, personally I fall between the two, don't particularly have a strong faith but not exactly a non believer as I do like some aspects of Church services.

[Jay.]

I don't think religion should be encouraged but religious people shouldn't be scrutinised for their choice either. :) We don't need another thread hating on religious people.

This

Let people get on with whatever they want to do, and live their life however they wish.

[Johnnyuk123]

It has caused a lot of problems in the world but you can't exactly say to someone "you can't believe or think this", as long as it's not affecting people through war or opinions against things then people should be allowed to belve what they want, even if science proves other wise

I agree 100% people should be allowed to believe in whatever they want. If they want to believe that the world is flat that is fine with me. That is their choice.:wavey:

[JoshBB]

I agree 100% people should be allowed to believe in whatever they want. If they want to believe that the world is flat that is fine with me. That is their choice.:wavey:

I've never met a person who thinks the world is flat.. have you?

[Johnnyuk123]

I've never met a person who thinks the world is flat.. have you?

Read the Bible.It's in there.

[JoshBB]

Read the Bible.It's in there.

Where abouts? It's a long book.

Also just because it's in the bible doesn't mean that religious people believe it.. there are differences between liberal religion and literalism.

[Samuel.]

No.

[King Gizzard]

Yes

[Johnnyuk123]

Where abouts? It's a long book.

Also just because it's in the bible doesn't mean that religious people believe it.. there are differences between liberal religion and literalism.

I agree with you on that. But it is defo in there as is the talking snake and the man who lived inside a whale at the bottom of the ocean for 3 days and another man who parted the sea by waving his hands at the ocean.:wavey:

[JoshBB]

I agree with you on that. But it is defo in there as is the talking snake and the man who lived inside a whale at the bottom of the ocean for 3 days and another man who parted the sea by waving his hands at the ocean.:wavey:

I think the most important parts of those stories were the morals.. not their content. And tbf, it makes the book a bit more interesting anyway :laugh:

[Johnnyuk123]

If tomorrows headlines front page said...Kerry Katona slept for 3 days inside a whale in the north sea at the bottom of the ocean and lived to tell the tale we would all laugh.Even with picture evidence we would still laugh about it BUT remove KERRY KATONAS name from that headline and replace it with JESUS and people would take it as truth.:joker::joker::joker:

[Johnnyuk123]

I think the most important parts of those stories were the morals.. not their content. And tbf, it makes the book a bit more interesting anyway :laugh:

The book for me is moral based and thats a good thing. But to be fair all religions are moral based. Beyond the moral bases its a no no for me and that's down too science and their facts.:wavey:

[Livia]

You're all free to believe what you believe. Shalom, people.

[JoshBB]

The book for me is moral based and thats a good thing. But to be fair all religions are moral based. Beyond the moral bases its a no no for me and that's down too science and their facts.:wavey:

Most religious people in 2015 (in this country anyway) probably view it the same way.

You might find this interesting - http://www.brin.ac.uk/news/2014/the-british-election-study-2015-religious-affiliation/

(more people have no religion than any other group, and 61.4% of 18-24 year-olds have no religion)

[kirklancaster]

PERHAPS THIS SUITS YOUR THEORY JOHNNY? IT'S A PASTE FROM ONE OF MY EARLIER POSTS - BUT EVERY WORD IS MEANT TO BE TAKEN LITERALLY - It Seems.:laugh:


CAPTAIN KIRK'S LOG - TIBB DATE 765,987.1

In the Year 18,980 B.T. (Before The Great Prophet TIBB) Our crew were assigned to Inter Stellar Investigatory Ship (ISIS) 6546. Our mission? To cruise the entire cosmos in search of intelligent life forms.

The first planet with signs of organic life which we encountered was one which we had classified as 3354 in the Sector 347 - a Solar System near the Andromeda Galaxy - a planet called EARTH.

The creatures were organic but very primitive. and probably the weirdest life forms we had ever encountered. They were elusive and very difficult to capture, but we eventually caught one specimen and beamed it up into our laboratory.

This strange alien was less than 1.5 meters tall and was at first, extremely ferocious, then suddenly timid, as if it was in awe of us. It had heavily wrinkled, leathery brown skin and two deep set obsidian eyes beneath thick long red eyebrows and a shock of thick red hair. The creature had one arm on one side of its slender body and what can only be described as a rudimentary winding handle fashioned from some type of metal on the other side of its body.

The creature seemed to have male genitalia though it was really tiny and obscured by a weird type of pouch hanging from a belt around its waist.

The strangest feature though was its three huge lobed ears - one on the left side, one on the right side, and a FINAL FRONT EAR.

Then the creature looked directly at me, and I said; "I am Kirk of the TIBB Federation. Who are you?" The creature spoke ,in low, guttural, quite aggressive tones which our green hulk of a Cyborg R. E-STAR (ARISTA - geddit?) translated:

"Him Leather Trumpet of Planet Earth. Yes. He Think You Are A God."

I replied "No, I am Kirk a Tibbian." But the creature persisted and R.E STAR translated: "Yes. He Is Sure. Kirk Is His God But No God Only Dawkins".

I raised my hand to halt the laughter from the crew and continued to communicate with our little friend, and it transpired that he came from a land on this planet called 'SCORT' - or as R.E. STAR said; "SCORT LAND". It was revealed that the alien only needed one arm because despite his superficial ferocity, he was half harmless, and that the strange metallic device on the other side of his body was, indeed an ancient winding crank, because Leather Trumpet was a cranky old 'winder upper' - apparently, he was famous among his people for this.

R.E. STAR also questioned him about the strange pouch covering his genitalia and it seemed that Leather Trumpet was some kind of Micro Biologist, because, he apparently used to keep some kind of Spore captive in the pouch but it must have escaped and fled at speed, because R.E. STAR said that the alien kept pointing to his pouch and saying; "MY SPORE RAN."

The strange little alien who had seemed so unfriendly at first soon endeared himself to us as we became used to his ways, and we studied him for over one Tibb Lunar Cycle, then it was time for us to let him go and return to our own world. We asked him where he wanted dropping off and I don't think he understood despite R.E. STAR's best efforts, and we ended up asking him where he would usually be right now if we had not captured him, but he kept referring to being trapped in boggy land - or as R.E. STAR probably misinterpreted it; "Stuck into MARSH".

Anyway, I parted company with the strange little primitive alien but not before patting his head and promising him that one day I would return and take him to my world - if he was good. As we blasted off I was sure that we'd never forget him.

CAPTAIN KIRK'S LOG: SUPPLEMENTAL - TIBB DATE 825,764.5

ISIS 5410 recently returned from 3354 in the Sector 347 of the Andromeda Galaxy - the strange world we visited all those years ago, and the Captain reports that the little alien Leather Trumpet is now the leader and Holy Prophet of the planet's main religion; KIRKISM, which worships a God who came down from the heavens in a fiery metal CABER and promised one day to return.

The sad part is that the prophet Leather Trumpet is carrying out mass slaughter of all those on his world who refuse to convert to Kirkism.
...............................................

Naw TIBBERS - This is just me, Kirk having a larf - don't worry, nothing like this could ever happen here..........................Could it?

[Johnnyuk123]

I think the most important parts of those stories were the morals.. not their content. And tbf, it makes the book a bit more interesting anyway :laugh:

As a child i enjoyed reading the Viz comic book but do not take it as factual? Are all slags fat? No. They too are JUST stories btw.:wavey:

[bots]

The argument being made by the OP seems to relate to the fact that a historical book appears to contain inaccuracies if examined with today's knowledge. Should the book be re-written making it more accurate?

My answer would be no, because it would then no longer be an historical work.

The other aspect is that in today's newspapers do we regard every word written to be the absolute truth? No, of course we don't. It is up to the reader to form their own opinion based on the knowledge that they have. Why should any religious text be treated any differently.

[Marsh.]

Always, remember they ply you with vino in church too. :joker::joker::joker::wavey:

Which church is this sweetie? :pat:

[Marsh.]

I remember going to sunday school and being told that 5000 people were fed with only 5 loaves and two fish. Coming from a large family i knew at 6yrs of age that this was simply not true. For one my brother always had 5 fish fingers and 6 slices of bread and thats from a family of nine kids at dinner time. So do the math.:joker::joker::joker:

I don't believe for a second you've been to Sunday school or even stepped foot in a church.

Your little anecdotes are so transparent.

[Marsh.]

Read the Bible.It's in there.

Would you like to provide an extract because so far you're not even passing lesson one of troll academy.

Drop the cliches and delve into some substance if you wish your thread to fit into serious debates.

[Marsh.]

I agree with you on that. But it is defo in there as is the talking snake and the man who lived inside a whale at the bottom of the ocean for 3 days and another man who parted the sea by waving his hands at the ocean.:wavey:

If tomorrows headlines front page said...Kerry Katona slept for 3 days inside a whale in the north sea at the bottom of the ocean and lived to tell the tale we would all laugh.Even with picture evidence we would still laugh about it BUT remove KERRY KATONAS name from that headline and replace it with JESUS and people would take it as truth.:joker::joker::joker:

I'm so glad you know how to use google but I'm afraid that doesn't warrant a thread in serious debates.

[Ammi]

You're all free to believe what you believe. Shalom, people.

..Shalom baby..:love:..

[Ashley.]

Santa is nothing to do with religion lmao, it's an ancient myth that parents comply with once a year to give their children something to smile about.

[arista]

It should be wiped from civilizations in every way.



You Are Most Wise

[Northern Monkey]

I've never met a person who thinks the world is flat.. have you?Just look on Youtube.People have made vids on the world being flat.We're all being lied to yada yada yada.Not sure if they're religion based or not,I did'nt watch enough of it.
There are people who believe anything on there.There are people who believe the moon landings were fake etc.It's a crazy place.

[Northern Monkey]

I think people should be free to believe whatever they choose.We in the west are supposed to live in a free society after all.
When people are forced to believe a certain ideology(*cough Muslims in Arabic countries*) then i have a problem with it.
Also when religion guides people to kill people and blow **** up then i also have a problem with it.
Or when religion stirs up hatred for peoples sexuality or way of life(*cough Islam*) then i have a problem with it.
One mans religion should never infringe on anybody else.It's a personal thing.

[arista]

Just look on Youtube.People have made vids on the world being flat.We're all being lied to yada yada yada.Not sure if they're religion based or not,I did'nt watch enough of it.
There are people who believe anything on there.There are people who believe the moon landings were fake etc.It's a crazy place.



Fecking lemmings

[Northern Monkey]

Fecking lemmings
I see conspiracy theories as a replacement for religion in alot of people.Some people just are'nt content with the status quo.There has to be something else.Something deeper than boring old reality.

Edit:I saw a vid yesterday and there are actually people who believe The Matrix is real and that we live in a holographic reality.I rest my case.

[lostalex]

no. religions should all face constant public ridicule. Watching the pope visit america i thought it was the most ridiculous spectacle i've seen in a lone time.

[lostalex]

I see conspiracy theories as a replacement for religion in alot of people.Some people just are'nt content with the status quo.There has to be something else.Something deeper than boring old reality.

Edit:I saw a vid yesterday and there are actually people who believe The Matrix is real and that we live in a holographic reality.I rest my case.

This is definitely true. It's all cult thinking.

[joeysteele]

Never had wine in church, each to their own, faith can provide a huge comfort to some, and if people are non believers I have no issue with that, personally I fall between the two, don't particularly have a strong faith but not exactly a non believer as I do like some aspects of Church services.

I agree totally.

I also think religion has its place, and is relevant to millions even in the UK, and will be for generations to come too, even if some think or would wish that wasn't the case.

[lostalex]

I agree totally.

I also think religion has its place, and is relevant to millions even in the UK, and will be for generations to come too, even if some think or would wish that wasn't the case.

it doesn't really have a place though... what place do you think it has? all religions teach hate and racism and homophobia and sexism and segregation and above all, they teach false facts that are easily disproved by science... so what place do religions really have other than in history books?

[Ashley.]

all religions teach hate and racism and homophobia and sexism and segregation and above all, they teach false facts that are easily disproved by science

They also teach people not to commit crimes and do right by themselves and other people. Only discussing the negatives doesn't mean that the positives don't exist. Religion, in some cases, have actually made people better. I can assure you that the crime rate would probably be more than it is should religion not have existed.

I'm not religious but I don't ridicule people who are for going down a certain path that is not my own.

[Kizzy]

I think people should be free to believe whatever they choose.We in the west are supposed to live in a free society after all.
When people are forced to believe a certain ideology(*cough Muslims in Arabic countries*) then i have a problem with it.
Also when religion guides people to kill people and blow **** up then i also have a problem with it.
Or when religion stirs up hatred for peoples sexuality or way of life(*cough Islam*) then i have a problem with it.
One mans religion should never infringe on anybody else.It's a personal thing.

Are you including the reformation in this?

[joeysteele]

it doesn't really have a place though... what place do you think it has? all religions teach hate and racism and homophobia and sexism and segregation and above all, they teach false facts that are ears.y disproved by science... so what place do religions really have other than in history books?

To those who believe and are a strong member of whatever religion they belong to, a great deal.

Who am I to tell anyone what they should believe, you are spot on as to religions in their doctrine and teaching that have corrupted even and been guilty of many bad things too.

However, faith has brought and given strength to many in their lives and to all those people that place for religion and faith is often vital.

Many fail to understand or even try to understand how so much comfort can be given to those with faith from that faith, just as to those with strong faith, where some can often fail to understand why those against religions cannot understand that too.

So for me that is why it has a place and is and should be still relevant.

[Crimson Dynamo]

keep it out of schools, out of politics and if people want to believe things like this, principally because it what their parents told them, grand

It should get no favour nor respect unless earned like anything else


and in schools it can be covered in perhaps 2 history lessons only.


simples

[Kizzy]

I have an unshakable faith, yet I find it almost impossible to forgive the atrocities committed in the name of religion, or by those using religion as a cover for their deviancy, it's this that colours my view.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I have an unshakable faith, yet I find it almost impossible to forgive the atrocities committed in the name of religion, or by those using religion as a cover for their deviancy, it's this that colours my view.

The fact that you can manipulate it to any means (as witnessed now and before) is the reason. The fact that no gods exist means that you have no come back and any nutter can just say "yes but it is what god wants"

You can also use this to persuade suicide bombers with the carrot of heaven and of course, again, no comeback.

[VanessaFeltz.]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm

I live in an islamic country and i am in minority. Since 3rd/4th grade i have had religion lessons every year and in turkey there are LOTS of religion schools and it does bother me because they are showing it down our throats. Also in june during lgbt pride they wrote pretty nasty words online and they stopped the pride because it happened during their religious holiday. And when it is time for their holidays we never disrespected them like they disrespect us.

It bothers me the way they are living their religion because they have no right to make other people uncomfortable because they are diffrent. So i think they should remove religion lessons from schools specially from middle school because young teenagers get manipulated and they dont decide what they are going to believe.

Religions are supposed to make people happy and they are supposed to guide people to do good things, they are not supposed to make people hate each other and make the world hell for the others. (ahem muslim countries)

With that being said religion can be a good thing or a bad thing and i feel like if i attack people or look down on people/religions then i am no better than them. I dont want anyone to feel bad or looked down based on who they are or what they believe.

[Cherie]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm

I live in an islamic country and i am in minority. Since 3rd/4th grade i have had religion lessons every year and in turkey there are LOTS of religion schools and it does bother me because they are showing it down our throats. Also in june during lgbt pride they wrote pretty nasty words online and they stopped the pride because it happened during their religious holiday. And when it is time for their holidays we never disrespected them like they disrespect us.

It bothers me the way they are living their religion because they have no right to make other people uncomfortable because they are diffrent. So i think they should remove religion lessons from schools specially from middle school because young teenagers get manipulated and they dont decide what they are going to believe.

Religions are supposed to make people happy and they are supposed to guide people to do good things, they are not supposed to make people hate each other and make the world hell for the others. (ahem muslim countries)

With that being said religion can be a good thing or a bad thing and i feel like if i attack people or look down on people/religions then i am no better than them. I dont want anyone to feel bad or looked down based on who they are or what they believe.


Very nicely put

[Kizzy]

When it's your faith that inspires love, hope, trust, compassion, empathy, charity, friendship.. then great. When its fear, hate, distrust, ignorance, suppression, oppression and repression then there's something amiss.

[Northern Monkey]

Are you including the reformation in this?

Correct me if i'm wrong but that was 500 years ago?
It does'nt quite fit with the thread title 'Should any religion be taken seriously in the year 2015?'
:conf:

[lostalex]

When it's your faith that inspires love, hope, trust, compassion, empathy, charity, friendship.. then great. When its fear, hate, distrust, ignorance, suppression, oppression and repression then there's something amiss.

religion doesn't inspire any of those things. all of those things exist without religion kizzy. religion is a scam for money and power. when you show me a religion that doesn't give anyone any kind of money and power, then i'll have an open mind about it, but i've never heard of a religion that doesn't claim any kind of money or power from it's followers.

[Daniel-X]

Can someone close this thread please it's painful and discrimatory to people who believe in the religion e.g myself as a Christian

[lostalex]

Can someone close this thread please it's painful and discrimatory to people who believe in the religion e.g myself as a Christian

are you crying? are you so upset that you are crying like an upset baby? Do you need your mommy to protect you?

Grow up. this is a forum for adults. If you can't handle it, then go to church and hide underneath a priests robes. he'd like that i'm sure.

[JoshBB]

Can someone close this thread please it's painful and discrimatory to people who believe in the religion e.g myself as a Christian

I think it should be closed too.

Don't let this anti-religion ignorants upset you dan :hug:

[Daniel-X]

are you crying? are you so upset that you are crying like an upset baby? Do you need your mommy to protect you?

No I'm not ****ing crying thank you very much! Don't be so ****ing rude! I don't need my mum to protect me at all.

Stop baiting

[lostalex]

No I'm not ****ing crying thank you very much! Don't be so ****ing rude! I don't need my mum to protect me at all.

Stop baiting

then stop trying to silence others just because you are so fragile and upset.

this is a very ;large forum, if you don't like this thread then there are plenty of other threads to join, there are even some threads about disney movies, maybe you'd feel more comfortable there.

Stop trying to shut down other people's opinions about religion though.

[JoshBB]

then stop trying to silence others just because you are so fragile and upset.

I think you're the fragile one who can't accept that not everyone has the same anti-religious attitudes, maybe you ought to stop pushing that down everyone's throats. :hee:

[Daniel-X]

I think it should be closed too.

Don't let this anti-religion ignorants upset you dan :hug:

It's not even a debate tbh it's just basically people calling religion

Thank you Josh :hug: I'd love to see what some people would say if the title was 'Should women/African-Americans/Muslims be taken seriously' just because it's religion doesn't mean it's not discrimatory

[Daniel-X]

then stop trying to silence others just because you are so fragile and upset.

Lmao I am not fragile and upset do you seriously think I am crying in a corner because two people who I don't even know are calling a religion.

I just think you're extremely and ignorant and rude. Maybe keep your views to yourself because I don't think anyone else is interested

[lostalex]

good lord, these people seem to think their religion is too precious to be criticized.

If you don't like it, make your own thread where everyone holds hands and sings religious Hymns.
I would not invade that thread and try to get it shut down.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Can someone close this thread please it's painful and discrimatory to people who believe in the religion e.g myself as a Christian



Can you explain how?

[Daniel-X]

then stop trying to silence others just because you are so fragile and upset.

this is a very ;large forum, if you don't like this thread then there are plenty of other threads to join, there are even some threads about disney movies, maybe you'd feel more comfortable there.

Stop trying to shut down other people's opinions about religion though.

Don't you dare try and patronise me, who the hell do you think you are?!

I am not I just think this thread is extremely discrimatory and prejudiced taking the piss out of Catholics etc it's not right!

[JoshBB]

good lord, these people seem to think their religion is too precious to be criticized.

If you don't like it, make your own thread where everyone holds hands and sings religious Hymns.
I would not invade that thread and try to get it shut down.

You can still be friendly towards religious people without singing hymns and going to church.. can't begin to imagine how limited your friendship group is.

[lostalex]

Lmao I am not fragile and upset do you seriously think I am crying in a corner because two people who I don't even know are calling a religion.

I just think you're extremely and ignorant and rude. Maybe keep your views to yourself because I don't think anyone else is interested

actually people are interest3d in my view, that's why this thread was made, for everyone to give their own personal view point. so obviously the person who made this thread wanted my opinion. they asked for it.

[Daniel-X]

Can you explain how?

Painful because it's not even a debate it's just extremely cringeworthy

Discrimatory because people are basically taking the ****ing piss out of Catholics

[lostalex]

You can still be friendly towards religious people without singing hymns and going to church.. can't begin to imagine how limited your friendship group is.

this is NOT a chat group hon, this is a serious debates thread. no one is here to make friends, we are here to share opinions. stick to the chat group threads if you just want to make friends.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Painful because it's not even a debate it's just extremely cringeworthy

Discrimatory because people are basically taking the ****ing piss out of Catholics

In your view...


Catholicism is a disgraceful cult and should be torn apart and exposed at every turn


I have never come across anyone on tibb who was prepared to try and defend its evil ways :conf:

[Daniel-X]

good lord, these people seem to think their religion is too precious to be criticized.

If you don't like it, make your own thread where everyone holds hands and sings religious Hymns.
I would not invade that thread and try to get it shut down.

No thanks because I don't wish to make a thread on that topic.

My religion can be criticised yes I myself criticise it sometimes but I think it's very ****ing rude to take this piss out of people's religions if you don't believe in it 'LOL fed the 5000' yeah it's not funny it's just rude and makes you come across as a dick

[Daniel-X]

In your view...


Catholicism is a disgraceful cult and should be torn apart and exposed at every turn


I have never come across anyone on tibb who was prepared to try and defend its evil ways :conf:

Okay Sinead O'Connor...

[lostalex]

Painful because it's not even a debate it's just extremely cringeworthy

Discrimatory because people are basically taking the ****ing piss out of Catholics

we take the piss out of religion because it's ridiculous. there is nothing respectable about a religion that has spent thousands of years oppressing people, spreading racism, sexism and homophobia. we take that kind of oppression very seriously in the SERIOUS DEBATE section of the forum.

If you want to have a thread to just say nice things about religion, go to general chat, and i promise i won't bother you. You won't see me post there at all.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Okay Sinead O'Connor...

and that reply is your idea of a debate?


:umm2:

[Crimson Dynamo]

No thanks because I don't wish to make a thread on that topic.

My religion can be criticised yes I myself criticise it sometimes but I think it's very ****ing rude to take this piss out of people's religions if you don't believe in it 'LOL fed the 5000' yeah it's not funny it's just rude and makes you come across as a dick

believing that one loaf of bread can feed 5000 people makes you what then?

do you not see how ridiculous that sounds?


you cannot respect fairy tales

its like coming on here and defending Rapunzel

[Daniel-X]

we take the piss out of religion because it's ridiculous. there is nothing respectable about a religion that has spent thousands of years oppressing people, spreading racism, sexism and homophobia. we take that kind of oppression very seriously in the SERIOUS DEBATE section of the forum.

If you want to have a thread to just say nice things about religion, go to general chat, and i promise i won't bother you. You won't see me post there at all.

You keep persisting that this is the part of the forum for debates. I'm sorry but the first paragraph you posted saying that there is nothing respectable about my religion is so ****ing ignorant.

My religion is not ridiculous YOU are!

[Daniel-X]

and that reply is your idea of a debate?


:umm2:

No I just can't take your reply serious enough to bother debating with it

[Scarlett.]

This forum is obsessed with religion bashing, lol.

[JoshBB]

we take the piss out of religion because it's ridiculous. there is nothing respectable about a religion that has spent thousands of years oppressing people, spreading racism, sexism and homophobia. we take that kind of oppression very seriously in the SERIOUS DEBATE section of the forum.

If you want to have a thread to just say nice things about religion, go to general chat, and i promise i won't bother you. You won't see me post there at all.

Can I just say something?

I have friends who are strongly religious - christians who pray every day&night, muslims who wear the hijab and pray throughout the day, a hindu friend who is a really lovely person..

NONE of these people have ever suggested to me that being gay is wrong. They love and embrace me for who I am, as I do them. Funnily enough, most of the homophobic remarks I have thrown at me in life come from atheists.

[Crimson Dynamo]

No I just can't take your reply serious enough to bother debating with it

No Daniel you cant debate it that is why you are getting angry, and frankly I know you cant defend your beliefs as they have no evidential basis other than a bible and that is insufficient and has been for a long, long time.

[Jack_]

Organised religion? No. One's personal and private faith? Yes.

I have nothing against religious people and can absolutely see the benefits it provides individuals with a sense of comfort and belonging - it is not for me and I struggle to ever believe any of it - but if it makes you happy, that's your prerogative.

However when religion is involved in the state, has influence upon politics, is rooted in law, causes international conflicts, terrorism...I have a problem.

Religion should be a personal, private and individualistic choice of faith. Nothing more, nothing less.

[lostalex]

You keep persisting that this is the part of the forum for debates. I'm sorry but the first paragraph you posted saying that there is nothing respectable about my religion is so ****ing ignorant.

My religion is not ridiculous YOU are!

this is the debates section. We debate IDEAS and IDEALOGIES. I have not said anything personally attacking you or anyone else., just attacking the absolutely EVIL ideas of your religions.

This part of the forum is about debating the ideologies, and religions are all based on hateful exclusionary evil ideologies, IMO.

[VanessaFeltz.]

Some people have so much hate in them to the point they attack other users for no reason... really sad.

[Daniel-X]

You can't make everything so black and white also and throw everybody in the same boat. I think you are forgetting that some Christians like myself don't take the bible word for word but some do.

Not everything is so plain and simple

[Crimson Dynamo]

Can I just say something?

I have friends who are strongly religious - christians who pray every day&night, muslims who wear the hijab and pray throughout the day, a hindu friend who is a really lovely person..

NONE of these people have ever suggested to me that being gay is wrong. They love and embrace me for who I am, as I do them. Funnily enough, most of the homophobic remarks I have thrown at me in life come from atheists.

He is talking about the views and teachings about homosexuals in the koran and bible. they dont make good reading.

[lostalex]

Some people have so much hate in them to the point they attack other users for no reason... really sad.

I haven't seen anyone attack another user. All of the attacks have been on ideologies and belief systems.
I have seen some users try to shut down the debate when it wasn't going in their way though.

Censorship is another part of most religions, so it's not surprising that it's the religious people trying to get the thread shut down to censor the ideas they don't like.

[Crimson Dynamo]

You can't make everything so black and white also and throw everybody in the same boat. I think you are forgetting that some Christians like myself don't take the bible word for word but some do.

Not everything is so plain and simple


Have you actually read the bible?

[JoshBB]

He is talking about the views and teachings about homosexuals in the koran and bible. they dont make good reading.

Matthew 7 - "7 Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."

Koran (idk what verse this is) - "O you who believe, let not a people ridicule [another] people; perhaps they may be better than them; nor let women ridicule [other] women; perhaps they may be better than them. And do not insult one another and do not call each other by [offensive] nicknames. Wretched is the name of disobedience after [one's] faith. And whoever does not repent - then it is those who are the wrongdoers."

also "Is not Allah the wiset of Judges?"
At-Tin 95 Verse 8

[Daniel-X]

Have you actually read the bible?

Yes I have, I have one in my bedroom and regularly we look at them in school o help us with our work :) Guess what? I go to a Catholic school I guess maybe that is evil also and I should move schools...

[Crimson Dynamo]

Matthew 7 - "7 Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."

Koran (idk what verse this is) - "O you who believe, let not a people ridicule [another] people; perhaps they may be better than them; nor let women ridicule [other] women; perhaps they may be better than them. And do not insult one another and do not call each other by [offensive] nicknames. Wretched is the name of disobedience after [one's] faith. And whoever does not repent - then it is those who are the wrongdoers."

also "Is not Allah the wiset of Judges?"
At-Tin 95 Verse 8

Josh anyone can quote lines of any large book to suit there means but if you are trying to say that Islam and Christianity are gay friendly then I am afraid you are making an error


Did you not see what happened to the senior Vatican priest who came out this week?


He was immediately sacked


what does that tell you?

[Jack_]

Oh, and faith schools should absolutely not exist.

Almost, but not quite as bad as private schools.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Yes I have, I have one in my bedroom and regularly we look at them in school o help us with our work :) Guess what? I go to a Catholic school I guess maybe that is evil also and I should move schools...

Reading snippets is not what I mean. Have you read all of the OT for example and then all of the NT - I have,have you?

[Kizzy]

Correct me if i'm wrong but that was 500 years ago?
It does'nt quite fit with the thread title 'Should any religion be taken seriously in the year 2015?'
:conf:

You are confused truly, the premise of religion is that you should follow a book/books constructed millennia ago is it not?
It's as apt now as it was then, used as a tool of social control by the powers that be and little more.

[JoshBB]

Josh anyone can quote lines of any large book to suit there means but if you are trying to say that Islam and Christianity are gay friendly then I am afraid you are making an error


Did you not see what happened to the senior Vatican priest who came out this week?


He was immediately sacked


what does that tell you?

It tells me that the people who sacked him don't know their own book. It explicitly says that you shouldn't judge people because it is not your place and we're not all perfect.

Also, I haven't researched the Koran enough, but I know for a fact that there is a possibility of mistranslation with the Bible from Hebrew to English.. the trouble is that the word they translated to gay could also mean pedophile/rapist which is why it's difficult to know what they were meaning. But paired up with the 'do not judge' quote, you do the thinking..

[Daniel-X]

Reading snippets is not what I mean. Have you read all of the OT for example and then all of the NT - I have,have you?

No I haven't but I know the majority of the teachings in the bible?

Do I need to know it word for word to have a valid opinion?

[lostalex]

Reading snippets is not what I mean. Have you read all of the OT for example and then all of the NT - I have,have you?

I HAVE, and it's the OT is completely full of sheet. It makes no sense physically, it's clear that whoever wrote it had no concept of science or physics, there are too many examples of BS to even list, and it's full of racism, sexism homophobia and just general violent HATE.

The OT of the Bible is a disgusting hateful text that should be condemned by any sane person.

[Kizzy]

Organised religion? No. One's personal and private faith? Yes.

I have nothing against religious people and can absolutely see the benefits it provides individuals with a sense of comfort and belonging - it is not for me and I struggle to ever believe any of it - but if it makes you happy, that's your prerogative.

However when religion is involved in the state, has influence upon politics, is rooted in law, causes international conflicts, terrorism...I have a problem.

Religion should be a personal, private and individualistic choice of faith. Nothing more, nothing less.

:worship:

[Daniel-X]

@lostalex all your arguments are based on EXTREMIST forms of religion also so I don't even know why I am arguing because 99% of people who believe in their religion probably are not extremists and to reiterate my former point not everything is so black and white and you can't tarnish everyone with the same brush.

[Daniel-X]

I HAVE, and it's the OT is completely full of sheet. It makes no sense physically, it's clear that whoever wrote it had no concept of science or physics, there are too many examples of BS to even list, and it's full of racism, sexism homophobia and just general violent HATE.

The OT of the Bible is a disgusting hateful text that should be condemned by any sane person.

Apparentley this isn't offensive...

[VanessaFeltz.]

I haven't seen anyone attack another user. All of the attacks have been on ideologies and belief systems.
I have seen some users try to shut down the debate when it wasn't going in their way though.

Censorship is another part of most religions, so it's not surprising that it's the religious people trying to get the thread shut down to censor the ideas they don't like.

Yes you did. You attacked me based on the people my country when we were talking about whole another subject where i was explaining my point of view without attacking you said in my country there are women who get beat for no reason to use that against me like i approve whats happening here.

And now you are attacking to another user who did not disrespecting you even though we actually have very similar views on this one, i am going to defend them because you are actually spreading hate about this topic when you have every right to hate religions due to what is happening to us minorities (I hate religion as well but i dont have to bash it) but you dont have a right to bash people.

[Crimson Dynamo]

No I haven't but I know the majority of the teachings in the bible?

Do I need to know it word for word to have a valid opinion?

I think you should read it is you want to understand the over-arching messages. The OT is not the NT.


But can I ask are you happy that 2000 years ago (in the middle east) people could recall events from 100 years ago from when they lived and be trusted to write them down accurately - that people could be trusted to accurately record events based solely on hearsay?

[JoshBB]

I HAVE, and it's the OT is completely full of sheet. It makes no sense physically, it's clear that whoever wrote it had no concept of science or physics, there are too many examples of BS to even list, and it's full of racism, sexism homophobia and just general violent HATE.

The OT of the Bible is a disgusting hateful text that should be condemned by any sane person.

I think you need to learn the concepts of liberal, fundamentalist, and literalist christianity.

The vast vast majority of christians (and jewish people) are the first two.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Homosexuality is treated in Roman Catholic Church teaching under two forms: homosexual orientation is considered an "objective disorder" because Catholicism views it as being "ordered toward an intrinsic moral evil", but not sinful unless acted upon.

Homosexual sexual activity, by contrast, is viewed as a "moral disorder" and "homosexual acts" as "[B]contrary to the natural law.

They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity."

The Catholic Church teaches that marriage can only be between a man and a woman

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_and_Roman_Catholicism

[JoshBB]

Homosexuality is treated in Roman Catholic Church teaching under two forms: homosexual orientation is considered an "objective disorder" because Catholicism views it as being "ordered toward an intrinsic moral evil", but not sinful unless acted upon.

Homosexual sexual activity, by contrast, is viewed as a "moral disorder" and "homosexual acts" as "[B]contrary to the natural law.

They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity."

The Catholic Church teaches that marriage can only be between a man and a woman

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_and_Roman_Catholicism

This is a literalist viewpoint.

Did you even read my post on the translation thing??

[Ashley.]

This forum is obsessed with religion bashing, lol.

Not really.

Just some of the people on this forum. It's the same people.

[JoshBB]

Not really.

Just some of the people on this forum. It's the same people.

:laugh:

this is like #notallmen all over again

[Crimson Dynamo]

This is a literalist viewpoint.

Did you even read my post on the translation thing??

Josh many people have tried to justify the outrages of the koran and bible by saying " well i dont see it that way, i interpretate it a different way"

but that is not how it works, that is not how its taught to children, not how its taught in mosques and churches


the cherry pickers have been around for a long time

[VanessaFeltz.]

Josh many people have tried to justify the outrages of the koran and bible by saying " well i dont see it that way, i interpretate it a different way"

but that is not how it works, that is not how its taught to children, not how its taught in mosques and churches


the cherry pickers have been around for a long time

I have to agree tbh quran is actually very hateful

[lostalex]

Josh many people have tried to justify the outrages of the koran and bible by saying " well i dont see it that way, i interpretate it a different way"

but that is not how it works, that is not how its taught to children, not how its taught in mosques and churches


the cherry pickers have been around for a long time

exactly, what matters is how it affects real people in real life. Guess what, the people killing themselves or dying for religions are not interested in the intricacies of philosophical debate, they are just brainwashed by their religion and die and kill for it. and that's NOT okay. It's just wrong.

[Crimson Dynamo]

and I hope people here relise that calling out religion for the fake cult it is is not religion bashing its just doing what any sane and civilised society should do, just as we do with mediums, con-artists, frausters etc


note the only defence so far in this thread is to say "oh stop attacking me"

as usual

:rolleyes:

[Crimson Dynamo]

ask any Muslim

"what is the punishment for apostasy"?

[JoshBB]

exactly, what matters is how it affects real people in real life. Guess what, the people killing themselves or dying for religions are not interested in the intricacies of philosophical debate, they are just brainwashed by their religion and die and kill for it. and that's NOT okay. It's just wrong.

??? nobody has said that killing and brainwashing is okay in this thread though

You are jumping on the typical anti-religion bandwagon, and instead of replying to my posts properly,you are just continuing your hateful monologue. I give up trying to explain this to you.

[Crimson Dynamo]

??? nobody has said that killing and brainwashing is okay in this thread though

You are jumping on the typical anti-religion bandwagon, and instead of replying to my posts properly,you are just continuing your hateful monologue. I give up trying to explain this to you.

Josh do you really believe all the supernatural claims of the Bible?

like walking on water, feeding the 5000, resurrection etc?