HETEROPHOBIA and what it is

[sampvt]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homophobia#Distinctions_and_proposed_alternatives

The above pasted explanation is an insight into why some of us are at loggerheads with each other constantly and it ruins the enjoyment for many.

Older people brought up in places like Ireland, Palestine and even parts of Europe, have long since been indoctrinated with religious and gender issues and it is very hard for these old foggies to change. This is a fact and no matter how hard we try, it isn't that easy. So Just like the younger element of today find it strange that we should feel this way, turn the tables and try to understand that our view of your views are just as hard to swallow.

Example....My father was a staunch Orange man in Ulster and he tried to rear me with hatred for all things catholic. Did he succeed, no he didn't because to his dying day, he never knew my wife of 42 years was indeed catholic. We chose to keep this from him but my change was reached over many years. The same teachings regarding homosexuals is still ingrained into many older people and our thoughts on certain homosexual activities is harder to swallow than the views my kids have, but we are no less responsible for our actions or reactions due to the way we were raised and taught.

In years to come, the youth of today will have serious misgivings on certain political or religious practices in their old age and will maybe begin to understand how the world operates. Try telling a fundamentalist Muslim extremist that Christianity is the way to go and no matter how modern he is, he will go ape at your suggestion but if he is gay he will never accept a homophobes views like we are expecting him to accept Christians views.

I guess what I am trying to say is that we all should have a large degree of latitude against ach other and be safe in the knowledge that if you think someone os wrong for his views, he might be equally just as correct to like or dislike your views. There is no wrong or right in PC matters, it is the individuals own perception of the rules of the game that causes discernment, so lighten up guys, cut the other side a bit of slack and bypass anything that might not atone to your own particular views or personal beliefs.

I am not homophobic in any way, but my mind, gut and eyes will never accept the sight of 2 men kissing, so if that makes me a homophobe, then the world is truly a sad place to live. On the other side of the coin, if its ok for a gay to slate a straight, then why is it not ok for a straight to slate a gay. If you can answer this without thinking about it then you truly have a problem.

[Jamie89]

I am not homophobic in any way, but my mind, gut and eyes will never accept the sight of 2 men kissing, so if that makes me a homophobe, then the world is truly a sad place to live. On the other side of the coin, if its ok for a gay to slate a straight, then why is it not ok for a straight to slate a gay. If you can answer this without thinking about it then you truly have a problem.

To be honest, a lot of what I didn't quote read like excuses for why it's ok to be homophobic. This first bolded line is a contradiction, because if you can't accept it, then that's quite worrying. You don't have to like it, but to not be accepting of it isn't ok.

You're other point, well if someone doesn't accept a straight person simply because they're straight then yes, I suppose that would technically be heterophobic, but I hardly think it's a serious problem that society has ever faced. And even if it was, it doesn't mean it's ok for people to be homphobic. So I'm not sure what the point to all this is :conf:
Are you trying to say that because heterophobia exists, it's ok to be homophobic?

[sampvt]

To be honest, a lot of what I didn't quote read like excuses for why it's ok to be homophobic. This first bolded line is a contradiction, because if you can't accept it, then that's quite worrying. You don't have to like it, but to not be accepting of it isn't ok.

You're other point, well if someone doesn't accept a straight person simply because they're straight then yes, I suppose that would technically be heterophobic, but I hardly think it's a serious problem that society has ever faced. And even if it was, it doesn't mean it's ok for people to be homphobic. So I'm not sure what the point to all this is :conf:
Are you trying to say that because heterophobia exists, it's ok to be homophobic?

Of course its not ok to be homophobic just as well as its not ok to be heterophobic

[Tom4784]

I don't believe in Heterophobia at all, Heterosexuality will always be the norm, Gay/bi/whatever people will never outnumber straight people to such an extent that heterosexuality will be considered a minority and even if they did then society would still consider Heterosexuality the norm regardless.

Straight people do not face the same struggles as someone who identifies as another sexuality and they never will which makes claims of heterophobia sound ridiculous. Straight people never have to fear being rejected by their families for being straight, they've never had to fear walking down the street because they're in a relationship with someone of the opposite gender, they've never had their human rights denied to them because they are straight.

Heterosexuals simply will never face persecution and difficulties for being straight, they will never face the same issues that LGBT people will face on a regular basis.

[LukeB]

I don't believe in Heterophobia at all, Heterosexuality will always be the norm, Gay/bi/whatever people will never outnumber straight people to such an extent that heterosexuality will be considered a minority and even if they did then society would still consider Heterosexuality the norm regardless.

Straight people do not face the same struggles as someone who identifies as another sexuality and they never will which makes claims of heterophobia sound ridiculous. Straight people never have to fear being rejected by their families for being straight, they've never had to fear walking down the street because they're in a relationship with someone of the opposite gender, they've never had their human rights denied to them because they are straight.

Heterosexuals simply will never face persecution and difficulties for being straight, they will never face the same issues that LGBT people will face on a regular basis.


Yes this! :clap1:

Straight people are welcomed in every country.. homosexuals are not, Russia don't take too kindly to homosexuals and other places. They have been some BB3 documentaries about it

[Jack_]

If you are offended at the sight of two men kissing (even more so when I'd bet a lot of money that you, and many others, aren't at the sight of two women) then you are homophobic. The very definition of homophobia is a fear, aversion and disliking to homosexual activity and those who partake in it. If you are put off when you see it, deep within you is ingrained homophobia. However, it's whether you choose to express this distaste and/or become insulting that determines whether it's a problem or not. Keep it to yourself and you've offended no one, draw attention to it, make comments, make people feel uncomfortable, and then it's an issue.

You are of course well within your rights to hold any opinion on this matter you wish, that is the beauty of freedom of thought, and within reason the beauty of freedom of speech, but being homophobic for homophobic's sake is unjustifiable and is rightly condemned. Thankfully the people who are homophobic, in much the same way some are racist, sexist etc etc, are not long dying off, and so the practice of indoctrinating their children with such intolerance will soon be over and generationally we'll become the more tolerant and open minded society we have already started to be.

I too don't see what relevance this has to CBB though :shrug:

[Cal.]

Every single word of your post is loaded towards gay values with no consideration to straight values, which probably emphasises the need for more people to realise that Heterophobia is alive and kicking. Consigning this post to the annals of the SD bin proves that gay views are taken more seriously than straight views, especially on TIBB

And what are 'straight values' and what are 'gay values'? I'm pretty sure we're all people and we all (mostly and hopefully) have the same values.

[sampvt]

If you are offended at the sight of two men kissing (even more so when I'd bet a lot of money that you, and many others, aren't at the sight of two women) then you are homophobic. The very definition of homophobia is a fear, aversion and disliking to homosexual activity and those who partake in it. If you are put off when you see it, deep within you is ingrained homophobia. However, it's whether you choose to express this distaste and/or become insulting that determines whether it's a problem or not. Keep it to yourself and you've offended no one, draw attention to it, make comments, make people feel uncomfortable, and then it's an issue.

You are of course well within your rights to hold any opinion on this matter you wish, that is the beauty of freedom of thought, and within reason the beauty of freedom of speech, but being homophobic for homophobic's sake is unjustifiable and is rightly condemned. Thankfully the people who are homophobic, in much the same way some are racist, sexist etc etc, are not long dying off, and so the practice of indoctrinating their children with such intolerance will soon be over and generationally we'll become the more tolerant and open minded society we have already started to be.

I too don't see what relevance this has to CBB though :shrug:

Right back at you Jack. Your compelling views against my right to think and act like the person I was taught to be, is tantamount to the explanation that Heterophobia exists in greater numbers than we thought. The mere fact that you are pre programmed to argue with my views as opposed to debating them, wins the argument for me.

[armand.kay]

LOL why are people still trying to make this into a issue. **** like this and reverse racism bull just undermines the **** that actual oppressed groups have to go though.

[Tom4784]

Every single word of your post is loaded towards gay values with no consideration to straight values, which probably emphasises the need for more people to realise that Heterophobia is alive and kicking. Consigning this post to the annals of the SD bin proves that gay views are taken more seriously than straight views, especially on TIBB

Straight people aren't being victimised on a regular basis. If you're going to say that men kissing makes you uncomfortable then you have to accept that some people will not agree with you and dislike your opinion, to say that they are heterophobic for basically not agreeing with you is fairly ridiculous.

I moved this thread to SD because it had nothing but a strenous link to CBB at best, It's a thread that's better suited to SD. I'm certainly not succumbing to some gay cabal that controls Tibb. We don't honestly care about anyone's sexuality, we make our own decisions and that's it.

[MB.]

Sam, people aren't arguing your point because heterophobia is real, they're arguing your point because the opening post ends with something exactly along the lines of 'well if hating the sight of gays makes me homophobic nowadays then I give up!'

[Cal.]

Like anyone cares about people's sexuality on the forum. I only know like 1 person's sexuality in this whole thread.

[armand.kay]

Also I don't understand how you not being able to stand two men kissing is anyone else's problem but your own. They have a right to kiss just like any other couple and you're just gonna have to deal with that.

[Samm]

I'm screaming @ "straight values" anyway it's ****ing 2016, everybody is equal to there own rights.

[Jamie89]

And what are 'straight values' and what are 'gay values'? I'm pretty sure we're all people and we all (mostly and hopefully) have the same values.

:clap1: I'd quite like to see this answered tbh.

Right back at you Jack. Your compelling views against my right to think and act like the person I was taught to be, is tantamount to the explanation that Heterophobia exists in greater numbers than we thought. The mere fact that you are pre programmed to argue with my views as opposed to debating them, wins the argument for me.

Like Dezzy and others have said though, just because someone disagrees with you about it being ok to be homophobic (which I'm sorry, but that is basically what your OP says), that doesn't make them heterophobic. There's no logic in the connection your making.

[Kizzy]

I see where Sam is coming from and he explains it very well, over generations the law and the church condemned homosexuality, that condemnation was felt more strongly in some areas more than others.
There has to be a period of adjustment, reconciliation, information, education and acceptance before this become a new societal norm.
Nothing good ever happened overnight.

[Jamie89]

Also I don't understand how you not being able to stand two men kissing is anyone else's problem but your own. They have a right to kiss just like any other couple and you're just gonna have to deal with that.

Exactly (although personally I hate all pubic displays of affection, I'm an equal opportunities bigot in that respect)

[waterhog]

if you can not see the sight of 2 men or 2 ladys kissing - I think the problem is with you.

we need a bit of music

what is love - who sang it. can not even remember - someone help me out.

[Northern Monkey]

If you are offended at the sight of two men kissing (even more so when I'd bet a lot of money that you, and many others, aren't at the sight of two women) then you are homophobic. The very definition of homophobia is a fear, aversion and disliking to homosexual activity and those who partake in it. If you are put off when you see it, deep within you is ingrained homophobia. However, it's whether you choose to express this distaste and/or become insulting that determines whether it's a problem or not. Keep it to yourself and you've offended no one, draw attention to it, make comments, make people feel uncomfortable, and then it's an issue.

You are of course well within your rights to hold any opinion on this matter you wish, that is the beauty of freedom of thought, and within reason the beauty of freedom of speech, but being homophobic for homophobic's sake is unjustifiable and is rightly condemned. Thankfully the people who are homophobic, in much the same way some are racist, sexist etc etc, are not long dying off, and so the practice of indoctrinating their children with such intolerance will soon be over and generationally we'll become the more tolerant and open minded society we have already started to be.

I too don't see what relevance this has to CBB though :shrug:This would suggest that the majority of straight men are homophobic.Every straight man i know would be slightly repulsed by the sight of two men kissing and look away.I have nothing at all against anyone being gay and nothing against gay people.I don't consider myself to be homophobic.However i don't have any desire to watch it in action and would look the other way if two men kiss.Obviously two women kissing is a different story as women are my preference.
accusing people of being homophobic for not wanting to see men kissing is not really helpful for understanding between gay and straight people.

As for "heterophobia".I've never heard of that even being a thing.That would mean people hating even their own parents.I can't see it.

[sampvt]

I see where Sam is coming from and he explains it very well, over generations the law and the church condemned homosexuality, that condemnation was felt more strongly in some areas more than others.
There has to be a period of adjustment, reconciliation, information, education and acceptance before this become a new societal norm.
Nothing good ever happened overnight.

Very well put and comes from an insight that is derived from an educational background that has obviously succeeded.

[sampvt]

This would suggest that the majority of straight men are homophobic.Every straight man i know would be slightly repulsed by the sight of two men kissing and look away.I have nothing at all against anyone being gay and nothing against gay people.I don't consider myself to be homophobic.However i don't have any desire to watch it in action and would look the other way if two men kiss.Obviously two women kissing is a different story as women are my preference.
accusing people of being homophobic for not wanting to see men kissing is not really helpful for understanding between gay and straight people.

Absolutely spot on. Now we are getting a true and responsive debate.

[Samm]

This would suggest that the majority of straight men are homophobic.Every straight man i know would be slightly repulsed by the sight of two men kissing and look away.I have nothing at all against anyone being gay and nothing against gay people.I don't consider myself to be homophobic.However i don't have any desire to watch it in action and would look the other way if two men kiss.Obviously two women kissing is a different story as women are my preference.
accusing people of being homophobic for not wanting to see men kissing is not really helpful for understanding between gay and straight people.

As for "heterophobia".I've never heard of that even being a thing.That would mean people hating even their own parents.I can't see it.

Nope all the staright male friends I have don't mind it all all

[MrWong]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homophobia#Distinctions_and_proposed_alternatives

The above pasted explanation is an insight into why some of us are at loggerheads with each other constantly and it ruins the enjoyment for many.

Older people brought up in places like Ireland, Palestine and even parts of Europe, have long since been indoctrinated with religious and gender issues and it is very hard for these old foggies to change. This is a fact and no matter how hard we try, it isn't that easy. So Just like the younger element of today find it strange that we should feel this way, turn the tables and try to understand that our view of your views are just as hard to swallow.

Example....My father was a staunch Orange man in Ulster and he tried to rear me with hatred for all things catholic. Did he succeed, no he didn't because to his dying day, he never knew my wife of 42 years was indeed catholic. We chose to keep this from him but my change was reached over many years. The same teachings regarding homosexuals is still ingrained into many older people and our thoughts on certain homosexual activities is harder to swallow than the views my kids have, but we are no less responsible for our actions or reactions due to the way we were raised and taught.

In years to come, the youth of today will have serious misgivings on certain political or religious practices in their old age and will maybe begin to understand how the world operates. Try telling a fundamentalist Muslim extremist that Christianity is the way to go and no matter how modern he is, he will go ape at your suggestion but if he is gay he will never accept a homophobes views like we are expecting him to accept Christians views.

I guess what I am trying to say is that we all should have a large degree of latitude against ach other and be safe in the knowledge that if you think someone os wrong for his views, he might be equally just as correct to like or dislike your views. There is no wrong or right in PC matters, it is the individuals own perception of the rules of the game that causes discernment, so lighten up guys, cut the other side a bit of slack and bypass anything that might not atone to your own particular views or personal beliefs.

I am not homophobic in any way, but my mind, gut and eyes will never accept the sight of 2 men kissing, so if that makes me a homophobe, then the world is truly a sad place to live. On the other side of the coin, if its ok for a gay to slate a straight, then why is it not ok for a straight to slate a gay. If you can answer this without thinking about it then you truly have a problem.

This part of your post is confusing.

Did the gay person slate the straight person for being straight or did the gay person just slate the straight person for their views?

What is being slated in the example you gave?

[Jamie89]

This would suggest that the majority of straight men are homophobic.Every straight man i know would be slightly repulsed by the sight of two men kissing and look away.I have nothing at all against anyone being gay and nothing against gay people.I don't consider myself to be homophobic.However i don't have any desire to watch it in action and would look the other way if two men kiss.Obviously two women kissing is a different story as women are my preference.
accusing people of being homophobic for not wanting to see men kissing is not really helpful for understanding between gay and straight people.

As for "heterophobia".I've never heard of that even being a thing.That would mean people hating even their own parents.I can't see it.

"Slightly repulsed" lol. Ok, as long it's low on the scale of repulsion then that's fine. This smacks of "I don't have a problem with it, as long as it's behind closed doors and no one speaks of it!".

You don't have to feel a "desire to watch it". Even if it happens out in the street, you don't have to stand there watching. But seeing it... and feeling repulsion?! I think that's pretty homophobic. You don't have to want to see it, but you can still be accepting of it if it does happen. But to try and justify a feeling of repulsion, exclusively towards gay men kissing, suggests that it isn't something you're accepting of. Fortunately, "every straight man you know" doesn't represent the entire straight male population.

[Northern Monkey]

Nope all the staright male friends I have don't mind it all all

That's just what they say so they don't appear homophobic.

[Kizzy]

Ah right, in a kind of man+ man thing does not compute from a base animal/human reproductive aspect?

[Northern Monkey]

"Slightly repulsed" lol. Ok, as long it's low on the scale of repulsion then that's fine. This smacks of "I don't have a problem with it, as long as it's behind closed doors and no one speaks of it!".

You don't have to feel a "desire to watch it". Even if it happens out in the street, you don't have to stand there watching. But seeing it... and feeling repulsion?! I think that's pretty homophobic. You don't have to want to see it, but you can still be accepting of it if it does happen. But to try and justify a feeling of repulsion, exclusively towards gay men kissing, suggests that it isn't something you're accepting of. Fortunately, "every straight man you know" doesn't represent the entire straight male population.
I totally accept it.It is cool whatever sexuality anyone is.Being 'slightly repulsed' is not a choice,It's just a feeling.I would feel slightly repulsed if two wrinkly grey grannies were getting jiggy too and would choose to look away.Am i ageist too?No i like old people,I just don't wanna see em getting down.

[Northern Monkey]

Ah right, in a kind of man+ man thing does not compute from a base animal/human reproductive aspect?

It probably is that.It is ingrained to not be a palletable thing to watch and my eyes would rather avert their attention somewhere else.Much the same as if my mum and dad started shagging in front of me.

[Kizzy]

It probably is that.It is ingrained to not be a palletable thing to watch and my eyes would rather avert their attention somewhere else.Much the same as if my mum and dad started shagging in front of me.

Maybe, even though you can accept it happens instinctively it feels a bit ew?

[Northern Monkey]

Maybe, even though you can accept it happens instinctively it feels a bit ew?

Yes.I am totally fine with it.Gay people should be free to kiss wherever they like.My eyes would just rather look in another direction.

[Ammi]

..I am accepting of different views/different generations but it's interesting though that there was a bringing up to hate Catholics, it was a hate that was actively tried to be instilled in you...and yet you didn't hate, you did the exact opposite and you found a life love with a Catholic...you saw there was no cause for any fears/intolerance/prejudice etc of Catholic people ....so is that not something to consider, that a mind-set is broke free of in some things, so why not others as well/why held onto with homosexuality for instance...that's something that I would certainly question in myself if I had the same views...

[sampvt]

Yes.I am totally fine with it.Gay people should be free to kiss wherever they like.My eyes would just rather look in another direction.

Sadly the view of the more verbal of our gay friends seem to think that we should alter our feelings to suit their agenda and if we don't, we deserve the label of Homophobic. My opinions are the same as yours but I suppose having opinions in a den of non conformists means defeat to the uninitiated.

The mere fact that all of my views have been discounted as the ranting of a loonie and homophobe, lends credence to my argument and therin lies the rub.

[MrWong]

..I am accepting of different views/different generations but it's interesting though that there was a bringing up to hate Catholics, it was a hate that was actively tried to be instilled in you...and yet you didn't hate, you did the exact opposite and you found a life love with a Catholic...you saw there was no cause for any fears/intolerance/prejudice etc of Catholic people ....so is that not something to consider, that a mind-set is broke free of in some things, so why not others as well/why held onto with homosexuality for instance...that's something that I would certainly question in myself if I had the same views...

Nicely put Ammi

[Kizzy]

I'd say that is exactly what the OP is questioning, the opposition to Catholics only came via primary socialisation there was no societal, governmental or inherent aspect to consider.

[sampvt]

..I am accepting of different views/different generations but it's interesting though that there was a bringing up to hate Catholics, it was a hate that was actively tried to be instilled in you...and yet you didn't hate, you did the exact opposite and you found a life love with a Catholic...you saw there was no cause for any fears/intolerance/prejudice etc of Catholic people ....so is that not something to consider, that a mind-set is broke free of in some things, so why not others as well/why held onto with homosexuality for instance...that's something that I would certainly question in myself if I had the same views...
Ammi you seem to subscribe to the view that I have a problem with homosexuality, I don't, I just cant fight my feelings of repulsion when I see 2 men kissing, just as I would if I saw two children French kissing. Some might say its acceptable, I don't and cant change my persona in view of political correctness. Whats good for the goose is always good for the gander and that's how my world works. I bow dwn to kiss no mans feet, nor will I be dictated to in affairs of the heart that cant be argued with or changed.

[JoshBB]

Wasn't Perez and his Gay fans Hetrophobic? Perez is definitely Hetrophobic so it does exist

Heterophobia does not exist. And it never will. It's offensive to suggest straight people face discrimination, because LGBT+ people actually do and it's quite horrific in some countries.. it really detracts from the actual horrors that so many gay people face. For straight people to wave their arms and state "i am oppressed by the gays!!11!" is ridiculous and really idiotic. Why do people want to be discriminated against so badly??

[Kizzy]

Sadly the view of the more verbal of our gay friends seem to think that we should alter our feelings to suit their agenda and if we don't, we deserve the label of Homophobic. My opinions are the same as yours but I suppose having opinions in a den of non conformists means defeat to the uninitiated.

The mere fact that all of my views have been discounted as the ranting of a loonie and homophobe, lends credence to my argument and therin lies the rub.

Ah I wouldn't worry, you've been as honest and open is you need to be Sam. Name calling is a knee jerk reaction, it's understandable for people to be on the defensive when their sexuality is being debated.

[Denver]

Heterophobia does not exist. And it never will. It's offensive to suggest straight people face discrimination, because LGBT+ people actually do and it's quite horrific in some countries.. it really detracts from the actual horrors that so many gay people face. For straight people to wave their arms and state "i am oppressed by the gays!!11!" is ridiculous and really idiotic. Why do people want to be discriminated against so badly??

Anybody can face discrimination end off

[Glenn.]

Heterophobia does not exist. And it never will. It's offensive to suggest straight people face discrimination, because LGBT+ people actually do and it's quite horrific in some countries.. it really detracts from the actual horrors that so many gay people face. For straight people to wave their arms and state "i am oppressed by the gays!!11!" is ridiculous and really idiotic. Why do people want to be discriminated against so badly??

This. I find it utterly disgusting.

[T*]

Heterophobia does not exist. And it never will. It's offensive to suggest straight people face discrimination, because LGBT+ people actually do and it's quite horrific in some countries.. it really detracts from the actual horrors that so many gay people face. For straight people to wave their arms and state "i am oppressed by the gays!!11!" is ridiculous and really idiotic. Why do people want to be discriminated against so badly??

I don't always agree with you but this is 100% correct

[JoshBB]

Anybody can face discrimination end off

In a completely different universe where homosexuality is the established norm, perhaps. Put honestly there's a lot of grabbing at straws here, and you've completely ignored my previous posts.

In what ways have you, as a straight person, been discriminated against in the last 12 months? I'd like examples please.

[Kizzy]

Anybody can face discrimination end off

Anybody can face prejudice, personally I feel claiming an 'ism' without the historical aspect unacceptable.

[Denver]

In a completely different universe where homosexuality is the established norm, perhaps. Put honestly there's a lot of grabbing at straws here, and you've completely ignored my previous posts.

In what ways have you, as a straight person, been discriminated against in the last 12 months? I'd like examples please.

There you go jumping to conclusions

[T*]

In a completely different universe where homosexuality is the established norm, perhaps. Put honestly there's a lot of grabbing at straws here, and you've completely ignored my previous posts.

In what ways have you, as a straight person, been discriminated against in the last 12 months? I'd like examples please.

(he's not straight)

[Ammi]

Ammi you seem to subscribe to the view that I have a problem with homosexuality, I don't, I just cant fight my feelings of repulsion when I see 2 men kissing, just as I would if I saw two children French kissing. Some might say its acceptable, I don't and cant change my persona in view of political correctness. Whats good for the goose is always good for the gander and that's how my world works. I bow dwn to kiss no mans feet, nor will I be dictated to in affairs of the heart that cant be argued with or changed.

...two children French kissing is a bit different though, there are many people who that wouldn't sit right with/to see...obviously for their welfare and would that could possibly lead to/and illegal age etc...so I don't really get your analogy there...but I do respect your feelings on homosexuality and that you feel how you feel at the sight of two males kissing..what I find interesting really is how some mind-sets can change and others are found more difficult to...

[JoshBB]

(he's not straight)

Oops, I assumed he was. Didn't expect a gay person to honestly think heterophbia existed.. :umm2:

I pose my question to the OP then - when in the last 12 months have you been discriminated against in the last 12 months?

[Johnnyuk123]

Heterophobia does not exist. And it never will. It's offensive to suggest straight people face discrimination, because LGBT+ people actually do and it's quite horrific in some countries.. it really detracts from the actual horrors that so many gay people face. For straight people to wave their arms and state "i am oppressed by the gays!!11!" is ridiculous and really idiotic. Why do people want to be discriminated against so badly??

Hi Josh,
Sam's point is quite clear.
I wouldn't say he was attacking anyones sexuality.
He is talking about the actual term heterophobic.

The term is real., it exists.
It's meaning is...
having irrational hatred of heterosexuality, showing an irrational hatred, disapproval, or fear of heterosexual people,or their culture.

tbh i couldn't care less about the term because i don't see people in that way, i just see people, their sexual preference is none of my business.
:wavey:

[Northern Monkey]

Sadly the view of the more verbal of our gay friends seem to think that we should alter our feelings to suit their agenda and if we don't, we deserve the label of Homophobic. My opinions are the same as yours but I suppose having opinions in a den of non conformists means defeat to the uninitiated.

The mere fact that all of my views have been discounted as the ranting of a loonie and homophobe, lends credence to my argument and therin lies the rub.

I would'nt say that is "heterophobia" just a dismissive ignorance of your views perhaps?

I don't actually think people are discriminated against because they are straight.Maybe it has happened on a minute level in a predominantly gay enviroment which would indeed mean that it exists on some tiny level.However i don't think it exists on a scale where it could be called an issue.Although its existence is possible.It's not tangible imo.

[JoshBB]

Hi Josh,
Sam's point is quite clear.
I wouldn't say he was attacking anyones sexuality.
He is talking about the actual term heterophobic.

The term is real., it exists.
It's meaning is...
having irrational hatred of heterosexuality, showing an irrational hatred, disapproval, or fear of heterosexual people,or their culture.

tbh i couldn't care less about the term because i don't see people in that way, i just see people, their sexual preference is none of my business.
:wavey:

Terms can exist for a concept but that doesn't automatically mean the concept exists too.

[bots]

Heterophobia does exist. Is it an equivalent or as prevalent an issue as homophobia - no absolutely not, not even close.

Really, everyone needs to get off their high horse and agree on the principle that any form of persecution or prejudice is unwelcome in 2016 whatever name it is given

[Johnnyuk123]

Heterophobia does exist. Is it an equivalent or as prevalent an issue as homophobia - no absolutely not, not even close.

Really, everyone needs to get off their high horse and agree on the principle that any form of persecution or prejudice is unwelcome in 2016 whatever name it is given

I agree with this... 100% !

[AnnieK]

Straight people are regularly turned away from bars in the Village in Manchester on the basis of their sexuality. I guess that could be deemed as discrimination as no bar would be able to be "straights" only in the rest of Manchester (quite rightly so).

[Niamh.]

Ireland voted Yes to gay marriage by a large margin so don't lump us into the homophobic category, tyvm :idc:

[sampvt]

Oops, I assumed he was. Didn't expect a gay person to honestly think heterophbia existed.. :umm2:

I pose my question to the OP then - when in the last 12 months have you been discriminated against in the last 12 months?

Maybe you ought to look back at the attacks I get all the time on here if you want proof. If not then Perez left plenty of clues out there and other examples would be open to a differential interpretation to the subject which ultimately could open other cans of worms, so better left alone.

[Denver]

I can understand both sides but Hetrophobia does exist yes its nowhere near as big as Homo/Transphobia it is all wrong and nobody should be made to feel horrible for what sexuality they are.

[sampvt]

Ireland voted Yes to gay marriage by a large margin so don't lump us into the homophobic category, tyvm :idc:

The vote was subscribed to by mostly the gay community and the younger element. The old silent majority didn't see the need to oppose it as it was bound to happen one day and it made no difference to their lives anyway. Sometimes not arguing the indefensible is better than arguing for no reason.

If your point is that the older majority agreed with gay marriage, you are sadly wrong. It was a vote designed to win from the get go because it gave no platform for debate or motions against it mainly because to argue such things would be viewed as politically incorrect and some people rather not get into arguments especially when old and feeble.

[Niamh.]

How do you know? you don't live here. I've spoken to plenty of older people who had no problem with gay marriage, in fact in the Polls leading up to the vote the majority of over 50s were in favour, not as big a majority as younger people but still a majority

[Jamie89]

Oops, I assumed he was. Didn't expect a gay person to honestly think heterophbia existed.. :umm2:

I pose my question to the OP then - when in the last 12 months have you been discriminated against in the last 12 months?

To be fair to Adam, I think that heterophobia technically exists, in the sense that anyone can have a phobia of anything. It's just not something that needs to be taken seriously imo because, well like most people have said, it's not something that impacts people or society in any harmful way, whereas homophobia does. (Don't want to speak for you Adam, but I assume that's what you were saying?)

[Denver]

To be fair to Adam, I think that heterophobia technically exists, in the sense that anyone can have a phobia of anything. It's just not something that needs to be taken seriously imo because, well like most people have said, it's not something that impacts people or society in any harmful way, whereas homophobia does. (Don't want to speak for you Adam, but I assume that's what you were saying?)

As I've said above it does exists yet it's not as major problem as homophobia but nobody should be attacked for who they do or don't like

[MB.]

Homophobia isn't a phobia in the first place

[Denver]

Homophobia isn't a phobia in the first place

A phobia is something you dislike and/or fear

[MB.]

Nobody's scared of gay people

[armand.kay]

Can someone in support of hetrophobia existing actually give an example of how heterosexual people have every been marginalised or discriminated against? Other than "oh I don't like gays kissing"... I'll wait.

[Denver]

Nobody's scared of gay people

But people dislike them actually I'd say some straight men fear Gay men

[Tom4784]

Anybody can face prejudice, personally I feel claiming an 'ism' without the historical aspect unacceptable.

I'd agree with this tbh. I think there can be some resentment towards straight people from the gay community due to the fact that straight people are simply more privileged in this world. To call it Heterophobia is silly though as, like you said, there's no historical aspects or contexts. Straight people have never suffered injustices for being straight, they've never had to deal with discrimination on the grounds of their sexuality, they've never had their rights infringed because they are straight.

It's always going to be an emotionally charged topic because Homophobia is a real and present problem whilst Heterophobia is a concept that doesn't really apply to the real world.

[Denver]

Can someone in support of hetrophobia existing actually give an example of how heterosexual people have every been marginalised or discriminated against? Other than "oh I don't like gays kissing"... I'll wait.

I've seen a Gay Guy come on to a straight guy and when he is turned down calls the straight guy homophobic for not wanting to **** him surely that's Hetrophobic?

[Tom4784]

I've seen a Gay Guy come on to a straight guy and when he is turned down calls the straight guy homophobic for not wanting to **** him surely that's Hetrophobic?

No, that's just being a twat.

[Jamie89]

No, that's just being a twat.

Lmao :joker:

[Ross.]

No, that's just being a twat.

:joker:

[Niamh.]

I've seen a Gay Guy come on to a straight guy and when he is turned down calls the straight guy homophobic for not wanting to **** him surely that's Hetrophobic?


No that's just being an idiot lol

[Niamh.]

Or what Dezzy said :laugh:

[Kazanne]

I don't care what it's called.everyone to their own but personally two guys kissing or women is not something I want to see or would enjoy,it's just a matter of ones personal taste,it's not to mine,but others can get on with it,it doesn't bother me at all.

[Niamh.]

I'd agree with this tbh. I think there can be some resentment towards straight people from the gay community due to the fact that straight people are simply more privileged in this world. To call it Heterophobia is silly though as, like you said, there's no historical aspects or contexts. Straight people have never suffered injustices for being straight, they've never had to deal with discrimination on the grounds of their sexuality, they've never had their rights infringed because they are straight.



It's always going to be an emotionally charged topic because Homophobia is a real and present problem whilst Heterophobia is a concept that doesn't really apply to the real world.


Great post, completely agree

[arista]

G. O.B.
said
[Older people brought up in places like Ireland,
Palestine and even parts of Europe,
have long since been indoctrinated with religious and gender issues
and it is very hard for these old foggies to change. ]


Bang On Right

sampvt -- GrumpyOldBarstard now Grumpy Grandad ------------ You Are Worthy

[Denver]

I don't care what it's called.everyone to their own but personally two guys kissing or women is not something I want to see or would enjoy,it's just a matter of ones personal taste,it's not to mine,but others can get on with it,it doesn't bother me at all.

I understand this me personally I hate all types of kissing/holding hands in public but I just look the other way its is their business and we don't have to like it as long as we don't make them feel uncomfortable its all fine

[Kazanne]

I understand this me personally I hate all types of kissing/holding hands in public but I just look the other way its is their business and we don't have to like it as long as we don't make them feel uncomfortable its all fine

Exactly Adam.

[arista]

I don't care what it's called.everyone to their own but personally two guys kissing or women is not something I want to see or would enjoy,it's just a matter of ones personal taste,it's not to mine,but others can get on with it,it doesn't bother me at all.


Can you look down at your Mobile - at that time

[armand.kay]

I've seen a Gay Guy come on to a straight guy and when he is turned down calls the straight guy homophobic for not wanting to **** him surely that's Hetrophobic?

No it isn't.

If a gay guy turned down a girl and she called him hetrophobic would that be homophobic no lol

[sampvt]

How do you know? you don't live here. I've spoken to plenty of older people who had no problem with gay marriage, in fact in the Polls leading up to the vote the majority of over 50s were in favour, not as big a majority as younger people but still a majority

I have family there and you are wrong but lets leave it at that shall we.

[arista]

I understand this me personally I hate all types of kissing/holding hands in public but I just look the other way its is their business and we don't have to like it as long as we don't make them feel uncomfortable its all fine


How Nice

[MB.]

(also, why would a gay guy come onto someone straight if they were 'heterophobic' anyway?)

[arista]

I'd agree with this tbh. I think there can be some resentment towards straight people from the gay community due to the fact that straight people are simply more privileged in this world. To call it Heterophobia is silly though as, like you said, there's no historical aspects or contexts. Straight people have never suffered injustices for being straight, they've never had to deal with discrimination on the grounds of their sexuality, they've never had their rights infringed because they are straight.

It's always going to be an emotionally charged topic because Homophobia is a real and present problem whilst Heterophobia is a concept that doesn't really apply to the real world.

Which Zone or Sector is that?

I assume you mean Central London its all OK

[Tom4784]

I have family there and you are wrong but lets leave it at that shall we.

Well no, you can't tell someone they are wrong and then 'leave it at that.' What insider knowledge do you have that Niamh doesn't as an Irish citizen, what makes your family more knowledgeable on the matter than her?

Justify your statements, you can't just say something like that and then take the metaphorical ball home.

[Jamie89]

I don't care what it's called.everyone to their own but personally two guys kissing or women is not something I want to see or would enjoy,it's just a matter of ones personal taste,it's not to mine,but others can get on with it,it doesn't bother me at all.

Yeah you don't have to want to see or enjoy seeing it, there's a big difference between that and not accepting it. I remember when I took my first bf home to meet my parents, they were both accepting of him, and us being in a relationship, but I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have wanted to see us doing anything :laugh: That doesn't make them homophobic though. I just don't like it when people call it things like disgusting etc because it's incredibly belittling. Even if that's how they genuinely feel.

[arista]

Well no, you can't tell someone they are wrong and then 'leave it at that.' What insider knowledge do you have that Niamh doesn't as an Irish citizen, what makes your family more knowledgeable in the matter than her?

Justify your statements, you can't just say something like that and then take the metaphorical ball home.


I love a Man that can Strap another Up
Dezzy - You Are Worthy

[armand.kay]

Chances of seeing two guys holding hands let alone kissing are low because of the very real threat of being looked at funny or even being attacked.

[Niamh.]

I have family there and you are wrong but lets leave it at that shall we.


How am I wrong? Lol did you not see the Polls before the Vote? You're family in Ireland clearly didn't

[Denver]

(also, why would a gay guy come onto someone straight if they were 'heterophobic' anyway?)

Because some people think they can have anyone

[sampvt]

Well no, you can't tell someone they are wrong and then 'leave it at that.' What insider knowledge do you have that Niamh doesn't as an Irish citizen, what makes your family more knowledgeable on the matter than her?

Justify your statements, you can't just say something like that and then take the metaphorical ball home.

Dezzy I am 63 now and was born bred and raised in Ireland for most of my life so that gives me the right. \I am Irish living in England. I wont argue with you two, end of.

[Denver]

Chances of seeing two guys holding hands let alone kissing are low because of the very real threat of being looked at funny or even being attacked.

I get it loads by me

[arista]

Chances of seeing two guys holding hands let alone kissing are low because of the very real threat of being looked at funny or even being attacked.


Central London
Old Compton Street

They are safe there

Butch Gays do Kung Fu

[Ross.]

Because some people think they can have anyone

But if this person was heterophobic then why would they want a straight person

[Margarine.]

Animalphobia.

Oh look, I've said the word so it must be real and the poor animals can be discriminated against.

Heterophobia is a myth.

[sampvt]

How am I wrong? Lol did you not see the Polls before the Vote? You're family in Ireland clearly didn't

So Polls are never wrong now. Sorry but my telephone tells a different story, not some spotty geek on a high street soliciting poll opinions whilst most of the oldies are housebound.

[Tom4784]

Because some people think they can have anyone

But surely a supposed heterophobe would want nothing to do with a straight person? I don't think many homophobes would want to cosy up to a gay person.

The guy in your example was just a dick that used the Homophobe card as soon as he didn't get his way. If he truly disliked straight people then I don't think he'd waste much time on trying to **** them.

[Denver]

But if this person was heterophobic then why would they want a straight person

The same reason a straight man wants a lesbian if you fancy someone of the same sex then of course you will try your luck but ig they say knoe you dont go calling them any names possibly

[Niamh.]

Yeah you don't have to want to see or enjoy seeing it, there's a big difference between that and not accepting it. I remember when I took my first bf home to meet my parents, they were both accepting of him, and us being in a relationship, but I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have wanted to see us doing anything :laugh: That doesn't make them homophobic though. I just don't like it when people call it things like disgusting etc because it's incredibly belittling. Even if that's how they genuinely feel.


Yeah I'm pretty sure most parents wouldn't be over joyed watching their kids kiss or whatever with their partner regardless of whether they were straight or gay :laugh:

[Niamh.]

So Polls are never wrong now. Sorry but my telephone tells a different story, not some spotty geek on a high street soliciting poll opinions whilst most of the oldies are housebound.


You're in contact with some family by phone and I actually live here, who knows more I wonder . . .?

[Denver]

But surely a supposed heterophobe would want nothing to do with a straight person? I don't think many homophobes would want to cosy up to a gay person.

The guy in your example was just a dick that used the Homophobe card as soon as he didn't get his way. If he truly disliked straight people then I don't think he'd waste much time on trying to **** them.

I guess your right but im not sure if he even knew the guys sexuality tbh the guy himself was a joke arounf our town because the way he acts like hisgods gift so maybe it hurt him being turned down

[Tom4784]

So Polls are never wrong now. Sorry but my telephone tells a different story, not some spotty geek on a high street soliciting poll opinions whilst most of the oldies are housebound.

That's quite a strawman argument, you're also basically rejecting a reliable source because it doesn't suit your agenda. Can polls be wrong? Sometimes but not enough to discredit them as a whole.

At the end of the day the polls matched the results which does more than suggest that the polls were largely correct.

[sampvt]

You're in contact with some family by phone and I actually live here, who knows more I wonder . . .?

You know what I mean and taking the piss out of me isn't the way to win a debate. Ill leave that thought with you because \I cant afford a ban, you win, all of Ireland loves gays.

[Kizzy]

...two children French kissing is a bit different though, there are many people who that wouldn't sit right with/to see...obviously for their welfare and would that could possibly lead to/and illegal age etc...so I don't really get your analogy there...but I do respect your feelings on homosexuality and that you feel how you feel at the sight of two males kissing..what I find interesting really is how some mind-sets can change and others are found more difficult to...

I think the analogy was a metaphor for the feeling it invokes more than a direct comparison. There are others that hold similar views, can identify on some level or understand what is being suggested.
Mindsets can and do change, on all kinds of issues some quicker than others, it's no bad thing to admit you struggle due to complex conditioning.

[Niamh.]

Dezzy I am 63 now and was born bred and raised in Ireland for most of my life so that gives me the right. \I am Irish living in England. I wont argue with you two, end of.


Northern Ireland not Southern Ireland, I'm talking about Southern Ireland

[Niamh.]

You know what I mean and taking the piss out of me isn't the way to win a debate. Ill leave that thought with you because \I cant afford a ban, you win, all of Ireland loves gays.


Super, I knew you'd agree eventually

[Kizzy]

You're in contact with some family by phone and I actually live here, who knows more I wonder . . .?

He was brought up there, and in a different generation to you, bit much to attempt to dismiss his experiences or view because you're Irish and don't feel the same.

[Samm]

People living in a different "generation" doesn't matter they need to move out of there olden ways.

[Tom4784]

He was brought up there, and in a different generation to you, bit much to attempt to dismiss his experiences or view because you're Irish and don't feel the same.

She's justified her points of view, she's quoted the polls as her source, she's discounting his opinion because he is making statements without backing them up.

[sampvt]

People living in a different "generation" doesn't matter they need to move out of there olden ways.

Or maybe youngsters need to respect elders views, cuts both ways or does the world exist on the present only and discounts the pasts history. let me remind you that the present is built on the past and what we did gave you a platform to live on.

[chuff me dizzy]

Or maybe youngsters need to respect elders views, cuts both ways or does the world exist on the present only and discounts the pasts history. let me remind you that the present is built on the past and what we did gave you a platform to live on.

:clap1: Totally agree with this

[Tom4784]

Or maybe youngsters need to respect elders views, cuts both ways or does the world exist on the present only and discounts the pasts history. let me remind you that the present is built on the past and what we did gave you a platform to live on.

I think it's important to remember the past so that we do not repeat the MANY mistakes of the previous generation.

[JoshBB]

Or maybe youngsters need to respect elders views, cuts both ways or does the world exist on the present only and discounts the pasts history. let me remind you that the present is built on the past and what we did gave you a platform to live on.

Ah yes, thank you so much for growing up during the time of a flourishing welfare state and no university fees and then getting rid of most of it by the time it's our generation's chance. But don't worry you guys have your pensions never mind us :)

[sampvt]

:clap1: Totally agree with this

Im glad you do chuff but obviously someone does not, I got infracted. That's a blatant abuse of power and now will probably get a ban. I didn't invite Niamphs comments, she came in and insulted me now I get infracted. Delete this post if you want but everyone knows how this site is run now. Goodbye

[Ammi]

..you really can't explain everything away though by opinions 'back in the day' because those were opinions then and yes, factored by many things but there's a huge long distance of the in between to now and what our opinions are now...and if we feel it's just how we were brought up etc, then how will anything ever change/advance/and move because we're just justifying it not to and not looking any more deeply into it/why we feel as we do...people can live in the same place/have similar upbringings and feel entirely different about many things, look at siblings who have the same environment but can have opposing opinions on many things/be so different..?...anyways, my dad was born in Northern Ireland also and lived there until he was an adult and had no prejudices whatsoever on anything that I ever knew of, I can truly say that...so it's not times/places at all really, it's people and the differences of people and how they absorb differently...

[Jamie89]

Or maybe youngsters need to respect elders views, cuts both ways or does the world exist on the present only and discounts the pasts history. let me remind you that the present is built on the past and what we did gave you a platform to live on.

And when things change, they change for a reason.

I have respect for the past, but I don't want to live in it.

[Jack_]

People living in a different "generation" doesn't matter they need to move out of there olden ways.

As I said earlier in the thread, these people won't be around for much longer. It's a generational thing, with every passing one things will become more tolerant and open minded and that can only be a good thing

I think it's important to remember the past so that we do not repeat the MANY mistakes of the previous generation.

Quite right.

Ah yes, thank you so much for growing up during the time of a flourishing welfare state and no university fees and then getting rid of most of it by the time it's our generation's chance. But don't worry you guys have your pensions never mind us :)

:joker:

[Kizzy]

She's justified her points of view, she's quoted the polls as her source, she's discounting his opinion because he is making statements without backing them up.

How can you back up a personal opinion though?

[Ammi]

Yeah you don't have to want to see or enjoy seeing it, there's a big difference between that and not accepting it. I remember when I took my first bf home to meet my parents, they were both accepting of him, and us being in a relationship, but I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have wanted to see us doing anything :laugh: That doesn't make them homophobic though. I just don't like it when people call it things like disgusting etc because it's incredibly belittling. Even if that's how they genuinely feel.

Yeah I'm pretty sure most parents wouldn't be over joyed watching their kids kiss or whatever with their partner regardless of whether they were straight or gay :laugh:

..kissing is ok, they often kiss their partners in front of us and I find it really sweet and touching/that display of their love but beyond that, that would be all kinds of weird to imagine...I would say just as ick, as them imagining their dad and I...I mean, just no...

[Kazanne]

Ah yes, thank you so much for growing up during the time of a flourishing welfare state and no university fees and then getting rid of most of it by the time it's our generation's chance. But don't worry you guys have your pensions never mind us :)

I believe Sam worked for his pension,the world does not owe anyone a living,if you want something get out there and work for it as people did in Sams day,I am sure you have it much easier now tbh.

[Tom4784]

How can you back up a personal opinion though?

These are statements, a lot of what he posted on the Ireland issue are unqualified statements.

I have family there and you are wrong but lets leave it at that shall we.

So Polls are never wrong now. Sorry but my telephone tells a different story, not some spotty geek on a high street soliciting poll opinions whilst most of the oldies are housebound.

[user104658]

Wow. A whole thread dedicated to lumping people into categories. Gay, Straight, Catholic, Protestant, English, Northern Irish, Southern Irish... will there ever be a day when these things become tiny aspects of how people define themselves and others as individuals? It drives me nuts on both sides. Can't stand it when people judge others based on their sexuality. But I equally can't stand it when people define themselves by their own sexuality (or gender, or race, or country of origin). This should NOT be the over-riding component of who you are as a free-thinking human being, and it seems to be for far too many.

I personally don't have time for any of it, it's ridiculous. There are, and should be, individuals, and humans, and that's it. Further subcategories are unnecessary and problematic.

So yeah... I don't have time for anyone who can't "accept" homosexuality (or anything else) because they were "raised that way" or are "from another generation" - unless they are simpletons, they can sit down and actually think about the issue for themselves rationally and logically. If they come to the (obvious) conclusion that it is perfectly fine, and also none of their business what anyone else does so long as it isn't harming others then they are a good and reasonable person. If they come to the conclusion that it is somehow "wrong" then they are piece of ****.

But let me also add, I also have very little time for individuals who happen to be homosexual whining that they are the only ones (along with ethnic minorities, apparently) who can face discrimination or hardship. Heterophobia exists. It is far less serious than homophobia. This does not mean it can't exist. It's reactionary and emotionally driven nonsense to suggest that this is the case.

"OW I've cut my finger!"
"Errrr no me and several other people in the world have suffered the loss of a limb. You can't begin to understand that. Cuts on the finger simply do not exist."

Derp. No.

There is absolutely no inherent suggestion of equivalence in pointing out that the the term heterophobia exists. The suggestion of equivalence pretty much always comes from those who adamantly state that it doesn't exist, and in a reactionary fashion. It is, again, unnecessary.

[chuff me dizzy]

I believe Sam worked for his pension,the world does not owe anyone a living,if you want something get out there and work for it as people did in Sams day,I am sure you have it much easier now tbh.

:worship:

[Margarine.]

Im glad you do chuff but obviously someone does not, I got infracted. That's a blatant abuse of power and now will probably get a ban. I didn't invite Niamphs comments, she came in and insulted me now I get infracted. Delete this post if you want but everyone knows how this site is run now. Goodbye

I'm sure that there has been no abuse of power here at all.

Your infraction isn't because you offered a differing opinion, it's most likely because of the way you have conducted yourself whilst delivering that opinion.

[chuff me dizzy]

Wow. A whole thread dedicated to lumping people into categories. Gay, Straight, Catholic, Protestant, English, Northern Irish, Southern Irish... will there ever be a day when these things become tiny aspects of how people define themselves and others as individuals? It drives me nuts on both sides. Can't stand it when people judge others based on their sexuality. But I equally can't stand it when people define themselves by their own sexuality (or gender, or race, or country of origin). This should NOT be the over-riding component of who you are as a free-thinking human being, and it seems to be for far too many.

I personally don't have time for any of it, it's ridiculous. There are, and should be, individuals, and humans, and that's it. Further subcategories are unnecessary and problematic.

So yeah... I don't have time for anyone who can't "accept" homosexuality (or anything else) because they were "raised that way" or are "from another generation" - unless they are simpletons, they can sit down and actually think about the issue for themselves rationally and logically. If they come to the (obvious) conclusion that it is perfectly fine, and also none of their business what anyone else does so long as it isn't harming others then they are a good and reasonable person. If they come to the conclusion that it is somehow "wrong" then they are piece of ****.

But let me also add, I also have very little time for individuals who happen to be homosexual whining that they are the only ones (along with ethnic minorities, apparently) who can face discrimination or hardship. Heterophobia exists. It is far less serious than homophobia. This does not mean it can't exist. It's reactionary and emotionally driven nonsense to suggest that this is the case.

"OW I've cut my finger!"
"Errrr no me and several other people in the world have suffered the loss of a limb. You can't begin to understand that. Cuts on the finger simply do not exist."

Derp. No.

There is absolutely no inherent suggestion of equivalence in pointing out that the the term heterophobia exists. The suggestion of equivalence pretty much always comes from those who adamantly state that it doesn't exist, and in a reactionary fashion. It is, again, unnecessary.

So only straight people put people in catergories? What a load of utter rubbish

[Tom4784]

Im glad you do chuff but obviously someone does not, I got infracted. That's a blatant abuse of power and now will probably get a ban. I didn't invite Niamphs comments, she came in and insulted me now I get infracted. Delete this post if you want but everyone knows how this site is run now. Goodbye

We haven't abused anything and you know that, it's not our fault that you are incapable of accepting blame for your own actions.

[Ninastar]

My view on this (and I know many disagree, but hey ho, das the internet for you) is that there are gay people out there who look down on straight people. And yes, it is absolutely no where near as bad, its silly to even suggest so, But for anyone to look down on anyone for whatever reason is just plain awful, no matter how privileged/unprivileged the person is.

I think this whole 'Black people/Gay people have it so much worse than 'White/Straight people' so white people/straight people issues are no where near as important' idea actually does more damage than good. It makes me think of these militant feminists who make on that the worst thing in the world is a man, when they have a lot of issues they face too, yet aren't allowed to voice their opinions about it.

My view is that anyone can be racist/homophobic/xenophobic/hetereophobic/whatever and it doesn't matter what your background is :shrug:

[Jack_]

I believe Sam worked for his pension,the world does not owe anyone a living,if you want something get out there and work for it as people did in Sams day,I am sure you have it much easier now tbh.

:joker: yes it's so much easier now! Much easier to get on the housing market before the age of 25, much easier to graduate and go into full time employment immediately, much easier to acquire a stable, secure job with employment rights, much easier to be supported if you're struggling to make ends meet, the list goes on.

It's oh so very easy to throw clichéd remarks like 'get out there and earn a living' around but not everyone is afforded an equal opportunity to do so.

[user104658]

Or maybe youngsters need to respect elders views, cuts both ways or does the world exist on the present only and discounts the pasts history. let me remind you that the present is built on the past and what we did gave you a platform to live on.

:sleep: Also don't have time for people defining themselves by their age; "Respect your elders" is a phrase that I have absolutely no time for at all.

I will respect those who demonstrate that they are individuals deserving of my respect... whether they are my age, 10 years younger or 40 years older.

Age is entirely arbitrary. I have met some elderly people with some amazing stories, vast experience of the world, kind and generous natures and brilliant humour. I have HUGE respect for them. I have also met plenty of elderly individuals who have never left their home town, harbour endless prejudices and toxic opinions, which they spout aggressively at any opportunity, along with just being aggressive and unpleasant in general.

Do I respect those people, just because they happen to have been doing these repulsive things for "quite a long time"? Err... no. In fact, I judge them more harshly than I do a 20 year old with the same opinions, because they have had a lifetime to gain wisdom and perspective, but have failed to do so.

[Jack_]

:sleep: Also don't have time for people defining themselves by their age; "Respect your elders" is a phrase that I have absolutely no time for at all.

I will respect those who demonstrate that they are individuals deserving of my respect... whether they are my age, 10 years younger or 40 years older.

Age is entirely arbitrary. I have met some elderly people with some amazing stories, vast experience of the world, kind and generous natures and brilliant humour. I have HUGE respect for them. I have also met plenty of elderly individuals who have never left their home town, harbour endless prejudices and toxic opinions, which they spout aggressively at any opportunity, along with just being aggressive and unpleasant in general.

Do I respect those people, just because they happen to have been doing these repulsive things for "quite a long time"? Err... no. In fact, I judge them more harshly than I do a 20 year old with the same opinions, because they have had a lifetime to gain wisdom and perspective, but have failed to do so.

:clap1:

[Margarine.]

:joker: yes it's so much easier now! Much easier to get on the housing market before the age of 25, much easier to graduate and go into full time employment immediately, much easier to acquire a stable, secure job with employment rights, much easier to be supported if you're struggling to make ends meet, the list goes on.

It's oh so very easy to throw clichéd remarks like 'get out there and earn a living' around but not everyone is afforded an equal opportunity to do so.

I'm training to be a paramedic and by the time I retire, at an age that God only knows, I will probably have a piss poor pension

But obviously, I can't complain because life is so much easier for me than it would have been 30 years ago

[user104658]

So only straight people put people in catergories? What a load of utter rubbish

"But I equally can't stand it when people define themselves by their own sexuality (or gender, or race, or country of origin). This should NOT be the over-riding component of who you are as a free-thinking human being, and it seems to be for far too many."

"But let me also add, I also have very little time for individuals who happen to be homosexual whining that they are the only ones (along with ethnic minorities, apparently) who can face discrimination or hardship. Heterophobia exists. It is far less serious than homophobia. This does not mean it can't exist. It's reactionary and emotionally driven nonsense to suggest that this is the case."


Try actually reading the post before you quote it?

[sampvt]

We haven't abused anything and you know that, it's not our fault that you are incapable of accepting blame for your own actions.

If standing up for what I believe and defending my principles is wrong, then shoot me but all of my defences where in response to vitriolic rhetoric that went un noticed. I will not be painted into a corner as a homophobe just as much as you wont be regarded as a bad person. My punishment was uncalled for in the face of the barrage of hidden digs \I was getting. \the difference here \Dezzy is I am old school and cant fight dirty, \I say whats on my mind. No I am going off line now and wont be c]back till the series starts. hopefully it will be a pleasant one.

[Niamh.]

He was brought up there, and in a different generation to you, bit much to attempt to dismiss his experiences or view because you're Irish and don't feel the same.


He wasn't brought up in the Republic of Ireland actually

[Jamie89]

Toy Soldier :worship:

[EspeonBB]

:sleep: Also don't have time for people defining themselves by their age; "Respect your elders" is a phrase that I have absolutely no time for at all.

I will respect those who demonstrate that they are individuals deserving of my respect... whether they are my age, 10 years younger or 40 years older.

Age is entirely arbitrary. I have met some elderly people with some amazing stories, vast experience of the world, kind and generous natures and brilliant humour. I have HUGE respect for them. I have also met plenty of elderly individuals who have never left their home town, harbour endless prejudices and toxic opinions, which they spout aggressively at any opportunity, along with just being aggressive and unpleasant in general.

Do I respect those people, just because they happen to have been doing these repulsive things for "quite a long time"? Err... no. In fact, I judge them more harshly than I do a 20 year old with the same opinions, because they have had a lifetime to gain wisdom and perspective, but have failed to do so.

:clap1:

I'm not going to respect a person who has outdated views whether they are old or not

[Jack_]

I'm training to be a paramedic and by the time I retire, at an age that God only knows, I will probably have a piss poor pension

But obviously, I can't complain because life is so much easier for me than it would have been 30 years ago

You have iPad's and Netflix and the internet and Candy Crush and weren't caned at school, your life is so easy work for your ****ing living you scrounger!!!!!!

[Kazanne]

:joker: yes it's so much easier now! Much easier to get on the housing market before the age of 25, much easier to graduate and go into full time employment immediately, much easier to acquire a stable, secure job with employment rights, much easier to be supported if you're struggling to make ends meet, the list goes on.

It's oh so very easy to throw clichéd remarks like 'get out there and earn a living' around but not everyone is afforded an equal opportunity to do so.

Does your mother wash your clothes in a wash house in a dolly tub,do you have to go outside to the toilet,do you have coats on the bed to keep you warm,do you bath in a tin bath by the fireside,do you have limited food stuffs? answer ,NO,(no offence meant by those things Sam,lol) You have far more today than you've ever had, nothing is impossible if you really want it. but you have to help yourself a little sometimes,yes it might be a struggle but perseverance will get you far.

[Kizzy]

These are statements, a lot of what he posted on the Ireland issue are unqualified statements.

It was just one contributory factor into his own personal account, it was honest, frank and quite refreshing to hear in all honesty.

[Ammi]

:sleep: Also don't have time for people defining themselves by their age; "Respect your elders" is a phrase that I have absolutely no time for at all.

I will respect those who demonstrate that they are individuals deserving of my respect... whether they are my age, 10 years younger or 40 years older.

Age is entirely arbitrary. I have met some elderly people with some amazing stories, vast experience of the world, kind and generous natures and brilliant humour. I have HUGE respect for them. I have also met plenty of elderly individuals who have never left their home town, harbour endless prejudices and toxic opinions, which they spout aggressively at any opportunity, along with just being aggressive and unpleasant in general.

Do I respect those people, just because they happen to have been doing these repulsive things for "quite a long time"? Err... no. In fact, I judge them more harshly than I do a 20 year old with the same opinions, because they have had a lifetime to gain wisdom and perspective, but have failed to do so.



....hmmm, I don't really agree with that bit because it's basically intolerance against intolerance and that's never the way to change views or have anything move forward...it's just showing the same thing...

[Ammi]

:clap1:

I'm not going to respect a person who has outdated views whether they are old or not

..but then, the old teach the young and the young teach the old, that's the only way with intolerances so lack of respect (from either person..).. won't really help there either...

[user104658]

I believe Sam worked for his pension,the world does not owe anyone a living,if you want something get out there and work for it as people did in Sams day,I am sure you have it much easier now tbh.

It's pretty widely accepted that the "boomer generation" and slightly beyond had more opportunity and an "easier ride" in general than at any time in history previously, or than we probably ever will again...

Easier access to home ownership, better employment rights, easier access to (meaningful) qualifications and employment... This isn't hypothesis, it's just history :shrug:. Now, it's hardly those people's fault that they were able to take advantage of those opportunities and I'm not really on board with "generational jealousy" - but it's very flippant not to appreciate that there are very real barriers for young adults today.

[chuff me dizzy]

:joker: yes it's so much easier now! Much easier to get on the housing market before the age of 25, much easier to graduate and go into full time employment immediately, much easier to acquire a stable, secure job with employment rights, much easier to be supported if you're struggling to make ends meet, the list goes on.

It's oh so very easy to throw clichéd remarks like 'get out there and earn a living' around but not everyone is afforded an equal opportunity to do so.

Not all young people work, they live off the state and think its their right to be lazy and slobs ,something Sam and his generation would never have done, its called self respect

[Kazanne]

You have iPad's and Netflix and the internet and Candy Crush and weren't caned at school, your life is so easy work for your ****ing living you scrounger!!!!!!

Damn right and I'll bet margarine will make a great paramedic he/she is at least doing something worthwhile, life is what we make it,you get out of it what you put in.

[arista]

Or maybe youngsters need to respect elders views, cuts both ways or does the world exist on the present only and discounts the pasts history. let me remind you that the present is built on the past and what we did gave you a platform to live on.


No the Youngsters
are making Robots for the Old Folks


I hope to be in China this year
as I want production increased
I want Mega World sales

each Nation must have there own programmers
or they will not get them

[chuff me dizzy]

It's pretty widely accepted that the "boomer generation" and slightly beyond had more opportunity and an "easier ride" in general than at any time in history previously, or than we probably ever will again...

Easier access to home ownership, better employment rights, easier access to (meaningful) qualifications and employment... This isn't hypothesis, it's just history :shrug:. Now, it's hardly those people's fault that they were able to take advantage of those opportunities and I'm not really on board with "generational jealousy" - but it's very flippant not to appreciate that there are very real barriers for young adults today.

Bull****

[Firewire]

Not all young people work, they live off the state and think its their right to be lazy and slobs ,something Sam and his generation would never have done, its called self respect

Not all middle aged people work either

[Smithy]

Not all young people work, they live off the state and think its their right to be lazy and slobs ,something Sam and his generation would never have done, its called self respect

Maybe the previous generation should have raised this one better then :shrug:

[Jack_]

Does your mother wash your clothes in a wash house in a dolly tub,do you have to go outside to the toilet,do you have coats on the bed to keep you warm,do you bath in a tin bath by the fireside,do you have limited food stuffs? answer ,NO,(no offence meant by those things Sam,lol) You have far more today than you've ever had, nothing is impossible if you really want it. but you have to help yourself a little sometimes,yes it might be a struggle but perseverance will get you far.

Well I don't have to do any of that, but struggling to heat one's home and having limited food are still very much a reality for many people today. Difference is, just because I'm lucky enough that it doesn't affect me personally it doesn't mean I don't care.

Just because we've had some technological advances and new definitions of poverty have come to fruition, it doesn't mean that tired rhetoric and meritocratic fallacies about 'putting the work in' and 'anything is achievable' can solve some deep rooted societal problems. Some people are seriously lacking in opportunity for reasons beyond their control, and unless they are provided with one, they are destined for a life on the poverty line and unjustified abuse for being a 'scrounger'. Problems need solutions, not sayings.

[EspeonBB]

..but then, the old teach the young and the young teach the old, that's the only way with intolerances so lack of respect (from either person..).. won't really help there either...

Oops maybe that came across wrong. I mean that I won't respect a person's outdated views but if they are capable of change then they will have my full respect

[arista]

If standing up for what I believe and defending my principles is wrong,then shoot me but all of my defences where in response to vitriolic rhetoric that went un noticed. I will not be painted into a corner as a homophobe just as much as you wont be regarded as a bad person. My punishment was uncalled for in the face of the barrage of hidden digs \I was getting. \the difference here \Dezzy is I am old school and cant fight dirty, \I say whats on my mind. No I am going off line now and wont be c]back till the series starts. hopefully it will be a pleasant one.


Yes In WW3
I will have you up the back helping Army Robots get ready
to assist the youngers on the Front line.


Sorry to "Cherry Pick" your thread
I can not Stop myself

[user104658]

....hmmm, I don't really agree with that bit because it's basically intolerance against intolerance and that's never the way to change views or have anything move forward...it's just showing the same thing...

I tend to assume that anyone who has made it to their 70's still blindly following hand-me-down opinions is a bit of a lost cause, especially if they do so forcefully and aggressively. To be entirely blunt... it's more efficient to just wait for them to die, and work on the younger generations, than it is to try to change them.

[EspeonBB]

Not all young people work, they live off the state and think its their right to be lazy and slobs ,something Sam and his generation would never have done, its called self respect

Actually a lot young people work hard for a living and a lot are looking for work and struggle to find jobs due to the state of the job market right now

[sampvt]

In my day if my dad didn't work we went hngry, In my day if I didn't work my kids went hungry. In these days if a man does not work, he has only to use his ipad or smart phone and get hundreds of benefit dollars to feed his habbits. \in my day, the dole office wasn't a place anyone liked to be seen. these days they hand out staff discounts and invites to the staff xmas parties for long term claimants. And just for the record, \I have paid hundreds of thousands in tax and never signed on for one penny also \I don't get a pension, my status does not qualify me for one as I earned my money playing abroad and have no duty paid over here. \I live off my savings and my witts.

[arista]

"Respect your elders" is a phrase that I have absolutely no time for at all."


TS is it because they Drive to Slow?


I was in a Car with a Young Lady Driver in Florida
and she was cussing at the old folks
it was shocking in a way

[user104658]

Bull****

An excellent and well thought-out counter argument, elegantly stated. You have convinced me. Bravo.

[arista]

In my day if my dad didn't work we went hngry, In my day if I didn't work my kids went hungry. In these days if a man does not work, he has only to use his ipad or smart phone and get hundreds of benefit dollars to feed his habbits. \in my day, the dole office wasn't a place anyone liked to be seen. these days they hand out staff discounts and invites to the staff xmas parties for long term claimants. And just for the record, \I have paid hundreds of thousands in tax and never signed on for one penny also \I don't get a pension, my status does not qualify me for one as I earned my money playing abroad and have no duty paid over here. \I live off my savings and my witts.


Yes helped them later in Life

You Are Worthy

[Jack_]

Not all young people work, they live off the state and think its their right to be lazy and slobs ,something Sam and his generation would never have done, its called self respect

With all due respect, you have no idea what you are talking about. I would suggest reading less of the Sun, Express and the Mail and more of the very real facts and figures that depict a severe lack of opportunities for many underprivileged people (not all of them young), and an abundance of exploitation and systematic abuse they face as a result.

Not all middle aged people work either

Young people are the root of all evil though! Scum!!!!!

Maybe the previous generation should have raised this one better then :shrug:

ooOOooooOoHhHhhhhh you went there :hehe:

[Kazanne]

Actually a lot young people work hard for a living and a lot are looking for work and struggle to find jobs due to the state of the job market right now

Of course they do,no one is disputing that ,but c'mon there are a certain section that do NOT want to work or better themselves , they prefer life on benefits,some even admit that, those are the people I am talking about.

[Jack_]

An excellent and well thought-out counter argument, elegantly stated. You have convinced me. Bravo.

:joker:

[billy123]

It does quite amuse me that some young people haven't got the awareness to realise that before they know it some little brat will be cringing at the things they say and do and calling them outdated. :laugh:

[chuff me dizzy]

Actually a lot young people work hard for a living and a lot are looking for work and struggle to find jobs due to the state of the job market right now

And a lot don't

[user104658]

In my day if my dad didn't work we went hngry, In my day if I didn't work my kids went hungry. In these days if a man does not work, he has only to use his ipad or smart phone and get hundreds of benefit dollars to feed his habbits. \in my day, the dole office wasn't a place anyone liked to be seen. these days they hand out staff discounts and invites to the staff xmas parties for long term claimants. And just for the record, \I have paid hundreds of thousands in tax and never signed on for one penny also \I don't get a pension, my status does not qualify me for one as I earned my money playing abroad and have no duty paid over here. \I live off my savings and my witts.

In that case, you are lucky that "in your day" and "in your dad's day" there was work available and that it paid enough to support a family.

Your rhetoric about the "party dole office" is so out-of-touch and ludicrous that it doesn't even dignify a response, and it is massively offensive to anyone who has had to / is having to degrade themselves by signing on even though they are fully capable of working, and have every desire to find permanent full-time employment. There are hundreds of thousands of those people in this country right now, whether that "sits well with you" or not. It's a fact. There are some people who can and do exploit the system, that is also true, but to suggest that anyone who doesn't just "go and get a job" falls into that category only demonstrates your own complete ignorance of the current world of work.

[user104658]

It does quite amuse me that some young people haven't got the awareness to realise that before they know it some little brat will be cringing at the things they say and do and calling them outdated. :laugh:

Those young people, presumably, being the modern counterpart of the same inflexible morons who are now outdated because they couldn't move with the times?

[Ammi]

I tend to assume that anyone who has made it to their 70's still blindly following hand-me-down opinions is a bit of a lost cause, especially if they do so forcefully and aggressively. To be entirely blunt... it's more efficient to just wait for them to die, and work on the younger generations, than it is to try to change them.

..okay...well their grandchildren might want to communicate with them about their view though because they don't get many grandparents..:laugh:..if there is any mind-set changes, then they will be from the 'intolerant' and only through understanding and mutual respect/tolerance of each other, no matter how opposing their views...

[chuff me dizzy]

In my day if my dad didn't work we went hngry, In my day if I didn't work my kids went hungry. In these days if a man does not work, he has only to use his ipad or smart phone and get hundreds of benefit dollars to feed his habbits. \in my day, the dole office wasn't a place anyone liked to be seen. these days they hand out staff discounts and invites to the staff xmas parties for long term claimants. And just for the record, \I have paid hundreds of thousands in tax and never signed on for one penny also \I don't get a pension, my status does not qualify me for one as I earned my money playing abroad and have no duty paid over here. \I live off my savings and my witts.

My Dad worked all his life, HE kept his family not the state,my husband has worked everyday since he left school, no ones brought his kids up, its called SELF PRIDE sadly lacking today Sam

[Firewire]

anyway back to str8 h8

I've never seen a genuine case of it so as far as I can see it doesn't really exist. If someone can convince me otherwise then I'll take it into consideration.

But in any case, there is a difference between generations and I don't see why it's such a deal to educate to make people see differently.

But it's interesting that employment has been brought up when this isn't a thread about employment...

[Firewire]

My Dad worked all his life, HE kept his family not the state,my husband has worked everyday since he left school, no ones brought his kids up, its called SELF PRIDE sadly lacking today Sam

and that's good, I'm glad you're proud of your family and your husband.

[user104658]

My Dad worked all his life, HE kept his family not the state,my husband has worked everyday since he left school, no ones brought his kids up, its called SELF PRIDE sadly lacking today Sam

It's called "more available employment due to less competition, less automation, and the presence of industry". If all else failed, there were always abundant manual labour jobs and factories requiring production line staff. That is no longer the case. Your husband and father did not grow up in a consumer economy. The fact that you can't accept that the world we live in now has completely changed, and that you now actually seem to have ZERO understanding of the realities of employment, is no one's problem but your own.

[Ninastar]

changed my mind, this thread it making me hate straight people

[Jack_]

Of course they do,no one is disputing that ,but c'mon there are a certain section that do NOT want to work or better themselves , they prefer life on benefits,some even admit that, those are the people I am talking about.

You are talking about a tiny percentage (under 1%) of another tiny percentage of people of which we pay job seekers allowance to, which is a minute part of a huge welfare spending bill, largely made up by pensions. The idea that there are millions of people lying around watching Cash in the Attic rather than getting a job is a convenient media myth. These people are a tiny minority and do not represent anyone or any community, nor do they have any kind of seismic effect on our economy.

[Firewire]

changed my mind, this thread it making me hate straight people

Heterophobic!

[Jamie89]

changed my mind, this thread it making me hate straight people

Down with straights tbh

[bots]

If I may, as a fully paid up straight member of the old farts club. I would like to point out that the issues around homophobia haven't changed in a couple of generations. People were accepting and compassionate back in the day too, its always been minorities that took issue and caused problems.

Each generation has its own challenges, they are not comparable. I will leave it at that, as there is no way I'm getting in to another phobia debate :joker:

[chuff me dizzy]

It's called "more available employment due to less competition, less automation, and the presence of industry". If all else failed, there were always abundant manual labour jobs and factories requiring production line staff. That is no longer the case. Your husband and father did not grow up in a consumer economy. The fact that you can't accept that the world we live in now has completely changed, and that you now actually seem to have ZERO understanding of the realities of employment, is no one's problem but your own.

Its called PRIDE .......lacking today in young people, they think the world owes them ,and it doesn't ,there is a job out there for everyone who wants one

[Ninastar]

down with str8whitemales!!!

[arista]

changed my mind, this thread it making me hate straight people


I like You

[user104658]

But it's interesting that employment has been brought up when this isn't a thread about employment...

This is SD&N, threads never stay on track long.

That said, in this case, TBH the thread started out as being about generational prejudice...

[arista]

down with str8whitemales!!!


What way are you down on us?

[Ninastar]

I like You

go away you privileged swine!!!

[user104658]

there is a job out there for everyone who wants one

This is factually inaccurate, the figures demonstrating so are freely available. There are fewer jobs than there are unemployed adults. Unless you're going to argue with simple numbers?

[Firewire]

down with str8whitemales!!!

str8 = AIDS!

[chuff me dizzy]

This is factually inaccurate, the figures demonstrating so are freely available. There are fewer jobs than there are unemployed adults. Unless you're going to argue with simple numbers?

I stand by my comments there ARE jobs out there for anyone who can put their mobile phones down,get out of their beds.... get a bit of self respect and go and find one

[billy123]

Time to leave the thread. Its taken a nosedive.

[Kyle]

down with str8whitemales!!!


We love to go down... :smug:

[Ammi]

Time to leave the thread. Its taken a nosedive.

..yes indeed...

[Cherie]

Wow. A whole thread dedicated to lumping people into categories. Gay, Straight, Catholic, Protestant, English, Northern Irish, Southern Irish... will there ever be a day when these things become tiny aspects of how people define themselves and others as individuals? It drives me nuts on both sides. Can't stand it when people judge others based on their sexuality. But I equally can't stand it when people define themselves by their own sexuality (or gender, or race, or country of origin). This should NOT be the over-riding component of who you are as a free-thinking human being, and it seems to be for far too many.

I personally don't have time for any of it, it's ridiculous. There are, and should be, individuals, and humans, and that's it. Further subcategories are unnecessary and problematic.

So yeah... I don't have time for anyone who can't "accept" homosexuality (or anything else) because they were "raised that way" or are "from another generation" - unless they are simpletons, they can sit down and actually think about the issue for themselves rationally and logically. If they come to the (obvious) conclusion that it is perfectly fine, and also none of their business what anyone else does so long as it isn't harming others then they are a good and reasonable person. If they come to the conclusion that it is somehow "wrong" then they are piece of ****.

But let me also add, I also have very little time for individuals who happen to be homosexual whining that they are the only ones (along with ethnic minorities, apparently) who can face discrimination or hardship. Heterophobia exists. It is far less serious than homophobia. This does not mean it can't exist. It's reactionary and emotionally driven nonsense to suggest that this is the case.

"OW I've cut my finger!"
"Errrr no me and several other people in the world have suffered the loss of a limb. You can't begin to understand that. Cuts on the finger simply do not exist."

Derp. No.

There is absolutely no inherent suggestion of equivalence in pointing out that the the term heterophobia exists. The suggestion of equivalence pretty much always comes from those who adamantly state that it doesn't exist, and in a reactionary fashion. It is, again, unnecessary.


.

[arista]

go away you privileged swine!!!


Why
I like You

[Ninastar]

We love to go down... :smug:

so do i :flutter:

although after last night, never again tbh

[Kyle]

so do i :flutter:

although after last night, never again tbh

What happened?

[Ninastar]

What happened?

i went to this girls house and there were other people about so it was just awkward

[Kyle]

i went to this girls house and there were other people about so it was just awkward

Ah right, would kill the mood a bit that would.

[Ninastar]

yeah and the rest is too explicit for this forum really tbh

[Northern Monkey]

yeah and the rest is too explicit for this forum really tbh

Now i'm curious:laugh:

[Cherie]

Now i'm curious:laugh:

I doubt it's anything you haven't done!

[Northern Monkey]

I doubt it's anything you haven't done!

Lol.What are you trying to suggest?I am still sweet and innocent.

[Ninastar]

Now i'm curious:laugh:

its nothing special, lol, i just don't wanna post the proper deets in here

[Niamh.]

If I may, as a fully paid up straight member of the old farts club. I would like to point out that the issues around homophobia haven't changed in a couple of generations. People were accepting and compassionate back in the day too, its always been minorities that took issue and caused problems.



Each generation has its own challenges, they are not comparable. I will leave it at that, as there is no way I'm getting in to another phobia debate :joker:


That's true enough BOTS

[Kizzy]

He wasn't brought up in the Republic of Ireland actually

I'm sure I remember he said he moved when young from Ireland to England :/
I may be wrong.

[kirklancaster]

I will respect those who demonstrate that they are individuals deserving of my respect... whether they are my age, 10 years younger or 40 years older.

Age is entirely arbitrary. I have met some elderly people with some amazing stories, vast experience of the world, kind and generous natures and brilliant humour. I have HUGE respect for them. .

:lovedup: I KNEW your love, respect and admiration for me would surface one day T.S. :hehe:

[Kazanne]

Quote:


Originally Posted by Toy Soldier View Post

I will respect those who demonstrate that they are individuals deserving of my respect... whether they are my age, 10 years younger or 40 years older.

Age is entirely arbitrary. I have met some elderly people with some amazing stories, vast experience of the world, kind and generous natures and brilliant humour. I have HUGE respect for them.
.................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ....................................

Well surely the same can be said for the young people too,I will respect those who try and move forward,who have drive and passion to succeed in life and are respectful of people (who deserve it) whatever their age, the disrespect for the older members in here is quite frankly not nice.

[arista]

"the disrespect for the older members in here is quite frankly not nice. "


Yes Kaz
Old Folks need Love



Feel The Force

[user104658]

Old Folks need Love

That's a new reality show right there. Someone call ITV2HD 1080p Dolby 5.1 surround sound.

[lostalex]

when gay parents start throwing their kids out onto the street for being straight, or groups of young gay boys go around beating the hell out of straight people, then maybe we can talk about heterophobia. til then, don't be ridiculous. seriously.

[Niamh.]

when gay parents start throwing their kids out onto the street for being straight, or groups of young gay boys go around beating the hell out of straight people, then maybe we can talk about heterophobia. til then, don't be ridiculous. seriously.


Indeed.

[Niamh.]

I'm sure I remember he said he moved when young from Ireland to England :/

I may be wrong.


Northern Ireland

[Kizzy]

Northern Ireland

Yes it was, even until last year they were having the prejudice purged from them via the courts, so Sams confessions of childhood influence comes as no surprise to me.

[Niamh.]

Yes it was, even until last year they were having the prejudice purged from them via the courts, so Sams confessions of childhood influence comes as no surprise to me.


Yes but the conversation I was having with him was about the Republic of Ireland and our recent referendum on Gay marriage

[Kizzy]

Yes but the conversation I was having with him was about the Republic of Ireland and our recent referendum on Gay marriage

Yes very recent, there were dissenters too, so not everyone was in agreement therefore it's safe to say there are those who still have an out moded view.
Not everyone in the republic is enlightened, not everyone here (Britain) is either.
Whether or not we have legislation in place, that's just paper..it's nice just to be able to shine a light on some reasons for the slower transition I'd say.

[Niamh.]

Yes very recent, there were dissenters too, so not everyone was in agreement therefore it's safe to say there are those who still have an out moded view.

Not everyone in the republic is enlightened, not everyone here (Britain) is either.

Whether or not we have legislation in place, that's just paper..it's nice just to be able to shine a light on some reasons for the slower transition I'd say.


Obviously not everyone agrees, I never said that they did, what I said was that according to opinion Polls more older people agreed than disagreed with gay marriage (although not as high a percentage as younger people)

[Kizzy]

Polls shmolls...

[lostalex]

Polls shmolls...

That's not a word. :nono:

[Northern Monkey]

That's not a word. :nono:

Word Shmord.

[LemonJam]

It exists yeah, as it's prejudice, but I find the whole concept of it just insulting. I'll let you know why with personal insight of a real life homosexual:

Today I was affectionate in public with someone I'm seeing and someone politely shouted "GAYBOYS" out of their moving car (I'd also like to state at this point whenever I've been affectionate with a male in public more than 50% of the time someone will comment).

I had to share a hostel room with 5 people who were talking about why so many gay people have AIDS including such delightful comments as "All those gay guys were in the clinic with their boyfriends, made me feel uncomfortable." and "It's a big deal for ***** though the HIV innit."

When I came back from a guys house the next morning I was greeted with "Was he gentle with you?" as if I was less of a human being as the room laughed. They didn't know I was gay until after they said this so that was awkward but kinda funny to see them try cover themselves and failing miserably ("I couldn't tell because you're not high pitched and annoying as ****" was a personal favourite.)

When talking to a friends girlfriend she said "I could tell you were gay because you walk like you've taken it up the ass."

You know how long all of that has happened in? 3 days. In one of the gayest cities in the world.

Every day we experience prejudice for who we are. Heterosexuals will very rarely get any hatred or even microaggresions thrown towards them because they are the majority. They will always feel comfortable holding hands with their partner wherever they are, they can marry anywhere in the world, they don't face the death penalty for who they are in certain countries. I don't let my sexuality define me, but I always feel like if I say my piece about how I feel I'm just another whiney fag who feels sorry for myself. If I don't speak up then I'm letting other people win. It's oppressive and something people in the majority don't have to deal with generally speaking.

TL;DR, it exists but it's just insulting to actually take it seriously.

[Ninastar]

It exists yeah, as it's prejudice, but I find the whole concept of it just insulting. I'll let you know why with personal insight of a real life homosexual:

Today I was affectionate in public with someone I'm seeing and someone politely shouted "GAYBOYS" out of their moving car (I'd also like to state at this point whenever I've been affectionate with a male in public more than 50% of the time someone will comment).

I had to share a hostel room with 5 people who were talking about why so many gay people have AIDS including such delightful comments as "All those gay guys were in the clinic with their boyfriends, made me feel uncomfortable." and "It's a big deal for ***** though the HIV innit."

When I came back from a guys house the next morning I was greeted with "Was he gentle with you?" as if I was less of a human being as the room laughed. They didn't know I was gay until after they said this so that was awkward but kinda funny to see them try cover themselves and failing miserably ("I couldn't tell because you're not high pitched and annoying as ****" was a personal favourite.)

When talking to a friends girlfriend she said "I could tell you were gay because you walk like you've taken it up the ass."

You know how long all of that has happened in? 3 days. In one of the gayest cities in the world.

Every day we experience prejudice for who we are. Heterosexuals will very rarely get any hatred or even microaggresions thrown towards them because they are the majority. They will always feel comfortable holding hands with their partner wherever they are, they can marry anywhere in the world, they don't face the death penalty for who they are in certain countries. I don't let my sexuality define me, but I always feel like if I say my piece about how I feel I'm just another whiney fag who feels sorry for myself. If I don't speak up then I'm letting other people win. It's oppressive and something people in the majority don't have to deal with generally speaking.

TL;DR, it exists but it's just insulting to actually take it seriously.

Sorry to hear this has happened to you :sad: people truly ****ing suck sometimes. I was told by a very flamboyant gay military boy, that he's actually faced more homophobic abuse in places that it's considered okay (the UK, basically) than in places like Arizona and Texas. I actually couldn't believe it, but he swore to me it was true. It's weird, isn't it?

I'm also glad to see that even though you're facing abuse, you can be open minded and say this type of 'phobia' towards straight people 'exists'. I totally agree with you. It's insulting to suggest it's anything near as bad as what us homo's will endure, but either way, no matter how small, it does exist.

Hope you're having a nice time other there anyway :love:

[LemonJam]

Sorry to hear this has happened to you :sad: people truly ****ing suck sometimes. I was told by a very flamboyant gay military boy, that he's actually faced more homophobic abuse in places that it's considered okay (the UK, basically) than in places like Arizona and Texas. I actually couldn't believe it, but he swore to me it was true. It's weird, isn't it?

I'm also glad to see that even though you're facing abuse, you can be open minded and say this type of 'phobia' towards straight people 'exists'. I totally agree with you. It's insulting to suggest it's anything near as bad as what us homo's will endure, but either way, no matter how small, it does exist.

Hope you're having a nice time other there anyway :love:

I mean my attitude towards homophobia is different now than how it used to be. Me a year ago would've got pretty sad about it but now I just think "Why is their opinion important?" and move on. It hasn't really affected me, just giving examples :bigsmile:

I'm having the time of my life here by the way thank you :love:

[Shaun]

Today I was affectionate in public with someone I'm seeing and someone politely shouted "GAYBOYS" out of their moving car

sorry </3

[LemonJam]

:joker::joker::joker:

[Niamh.]

It exists yeah, as it's prejudice, but I find the whole concept of it just insulting. I'll let you know why with personal insight of a real life homosexual:

Today I was affectionate in public with someone I'm seeing and someone politely shouted "GAYBOYS" out of their moving car (I'd also like to state at this point whenever I've been affectionate with a male in public more than 50% of the time someone will comment).

I had to share a hostel room with 5 people who were talking about why so many gay people have AIDS including such delightful comments as "All those gay guys were in the clinic with their boyfriends, made me feel uncomfortable." and "It's a big deal for ***** though the HIV innit."

When I came back from a guys house the next morning I was greeted with "Was he gentle with you?" as if I was less of a human being as the room laughed. They didn't know I was gay until after they said this so that was awkward but kinda funny to see them try cover themselves and failing miserably ("I couldn't tell because you're not high pitched and annoying as ****" was a personal favourite.)

When talking to a friends girlfriend she said "I could tell you were gay because you walk like you've taken it up the ass."

You know how long all of that has happened in? 3 days. In one of the gayest cities in the world.

Every day we experience prejudice for who we are. Heterosexuals will very rarely get any hatred or even microaggresions thrown towards them because they are the majority. They will always feel comfortable holding hands with their partner wherever they are, they can marry anywhere in the world, they don't face the death penalty for who they are in certain countries. I don't let my sexuality define me, but I always feel like if I say my piece about how I feel I'm just another whiney fag who feels sorry for myself. If I don't speak up then I'm letting other people win. It's oppressive and something people in the majority don't have to deal with generally speaking.

TL;DR, it exists but it's just insulting to actually take it seriously.

Thanks for sharing though LJ :hug: I think you perfectly illustrated the point with that post. As a straight woman i can tell you the amount of times I've experienced hate for being heterosexual in my 37 years on this planet is Zero

[Kizzy]

It is shocking to think though that mockery and jibes are the experience, not long ago gay men would have been subjected to imprisonment and/or a severe beating LJ :(
Bizarrely you have documented progression, but also the fact that ignorance is not generationally exclusive .

[JoshBB]

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2016/01/05/cartoon-network-censored-intimate-lesbian-dance-for-uk-broadcast/

Another example of homophobia with no equivalent for straight people..

[Kizzy]

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2016/01/05/cartoon-network-censored-intimate-lesbian-dance-for-uk-broadcast/

Another example of homophobia with no equivalent for straight people..

That's not homophobia...That's section 28.

[user104658]

It exists yeah, as it's prejudice, but I find the whole concept of it just insulting. I'll let you know why with personal insight of a real life homosexual:

Today I was affectionate in public with someone I'm seeing and someone politely shouted "GAYBOYS" out of their moving car (I'd also like to state at this point whenever I've been affectionate with a male in public more than 50% of the time someone will comment).

I had to share a hostel room with 5 people who were talking about why so many gay people have AIDS including such delightful comments as "All those gay guys were in the clinic with their boyfriends, made me feel uncomfortable." and "It's a big deal for ***** though the HIV innit."

When I came back from a guys house the next morning I was greeted with "Was he gentle with you?" as if I was less of a human being as the room laughed. They didn't know I was gay until after they said this so that was awkward but kinda funny to see them try cover themselves and failing miserably ("I couldn't tell because you're not high pitched and annoying as ****" was a personal favourite.)

When talking to a friends girlfriend she said "I could tell you were gay because you walk like you've taken it up the ass."

You know how long all of that has happened in? 3 days. In one of the gayest cities in the world.

Every day we experience prejudice for who we are. Heterosexuals will very rarely get any hatred or even microaggresions thrown towards them because they are the majority. They will always feel comfortable holding hands with their partner wherever they are, they can marry anywhere in the world, they don't face the death penalty for who they are in certain countries. I don't let my sexuality define me, but I always feel like if I say my piece about how I feel I'm just another whiney fag who feels sorry for myself. If I don't speak up then I'm letting other people win. It's oppressive and something people in the majority don't have to deal with generally speaking.

TL;DR, it exists but it's just insulting to actually take it seriously.

I think this is the fairest and most accurate summing up of it. It's awful (and infuriating) that gay people have to go through these things. One of my best friends is gay (that sounds like a total soundbite, but genuinely one of my very best friends from childhood came out about 10 years ago) and I think I've mentioned on here before, I find it heartbreaking to see what him and his boyfriend go through, even in the subtle day to day things... like being hesitant to be affectionate in public, and really cringing before introducing his boyfriend as his partner at a wedding we were at. Nobody was weird about it at all or even blinked, but it was that moment just before he said it when I could tell that he was sort of bracing himself for a bad response, or even just a shocked / strange response. I can't even imagine it, really, such tension in everyday things.

But, as you say, that doesn't mean heterophobia as a concept doesn't exist and I agree with the way you've stated it; "it exists but it's just insulting to actually take it seriously". It's something that happens, but to act like it really negatively affects anyone's life in any major way is ridiculous.

[Vicky.]

Straight people are regularly turned away from bars in the Village in Manchester on the basis of their sexuality. I guess that could be deemed as discrimination as no bar would be able to be "straights" only in the rest of Manchester (quite rightly so).

Interesting that this seems to have been completely overlooked. Its not a rare thing either, up in Newcastle it happens quite regularly too. Not that this means heterophobia exists as such, but there is definitely discimination going on.

Also wtf at what this thread has turned into? Young dont want to work, older people would never have not worked...seriously?! The jobs market is massively different these days to what it was even 10 years ago. 10 years back I quit my job and quite literally walked into another within 5 minutes. Now hundreds of people apply for every damn job. I am sick to death of seeing about how the youth of today are lazy bastards when its just not true. yeah SOME are, same as SOME back when you 60 year olds were young were also lazy bastards. And don't say this didn't happen either, this is what 'pension credit' is for...yeah, those older people who didn't ****ing work when they were younger. I know this because...shock horror I know a 65 year old who never worked a day in his life. OMGZ...yeah,. these people have always been around. What a revelation. Some really need to stop lapping up the bollocks the sun and the star give out tbh.

[Kizzy]

:clap1: :clap1: :clap1: well said Vicky!

[smudgie]

Interesting that this seems to have been completely overlooked. Its not a rare thing either, up in Newcastle it happens quite regularly too. Not that this means heterophobia exists as such, but there is definitely discimination going on.

Also wtf at what this thread has turned into? Young dont want to work, older people would never have not worked...seriously?! The jobs market is massively different these days to what it was even 10 years ago. 10 years back I quit my job and quite literally walked into another within 5 minutes. Now hundreds of people apply for every damn job. I am sick to death of seeing about how the youth of today are lazy bastards when its just not true. yeah SOME are, same as SOME back when you 60 year olds were young were also lazy bastards. And don't say this didn't happen either, this is what 'pension credit' is for...yeah, those older people who didn't ****ing work when they were younger. I know this because...shock horror I know a 65 year old who never worked a day in his life. OMGZ...yeah,. these people have always been around. What a revelation. Some really need to stop lapping up the bollocks the sun and the star give out tbh.

Well said Vicky.
Nothing new about SOME people not wanting to work, or never having worked.
We have estates of third generation families that have never wanted to work, apart from the fiddle that is. So the older generation can't get off Scott free.
We have also had mass unemployment and no jobs over the generations as well.
Nothing really changes that much...apart from the ridiculously high house prices.
How on earth the younger ones are expected to buy a house, or even afford the high rent prices is just beyond me.

[Ninastar]

BZ6UF-3rNDI

I'm watching this video and literally sobbing. I was actually completely shocked by the end statistics... They did the same test in New York (one of the most accepting states in the US) and Texas, which is known for being extremely conservative/homophobic... However, twice as many people in Texas stuck up for the gay couple, and only about 13 people out of 100 stuck up for the gay couple in New York.

It kinda proves that the media likes to make on how awful these conservative countries are. Like I mentioned earlier, (and this still surprises me) my gay friend in the military experienced more abuse here in the UK and in California than he ever did in Arizona and Texas.

I'm happy with how much the world is progressing. You hear bad things happening an awful lot too, but considering that 5/6 years ago there was only openly one gay kid in my whole school (my best friend) and now it's so widely accepted, it truly gives me hope.

[user104658]

BZ6UF-3rNDI

I'm watching this video and literally sobbing. I was actually completely shocked by the end statistics... They did the same test in New York (one of the most accepting states in the US) and Texas, which is known for being extremely conservative/homophobic... However, twice as many people in Texas stuck up for the gay couple, and only about 13 people out of 100 stuck up for the gay couple in New York .

See, there are other explanations for this that have nothing to do with homophobia though. A few generalisations here but Texas is a state where the culture is for people to stand up and speak their mind. If they see or experience something happening that they don't like, they will say so. Loudly.

New York is a large and very "anonymous" city where you're going to have a lot more people who just want to keep themselves to themselves and therefore won't say anything even if inside they're upset or angry about what's going on. Afraid of getting drawn into it and targeted / hurt, themselves.

That's the major problem with a lot of these "tests", I guess. Whether or not someone will say something or try to help has as much to do with their bravery / confidence as it does their opinions.

I used to be a LOT quieter than I am now. My job has now basically hammered it out of me :joker:. If I for example saw someone sitting near me on a train being harassed or abused I'd step in. Just 5 years ago, I'd have put my earphones in, sunk into my seat and tried to ignore it. I'd still have been just as angry about it inside but in all honesty didn't have the balls to handle someone getting in my face back then.

[Kizzy]

I don't see it as being due to confidence or conservatism, from the vid I would say that the majority of those intervening were part of the gay community.
We can't judge New York a we saw nothing of them but the 'stats' from the presenter.

[lostalex]

BZ6UF-3rNDI

I'm watching this video and literally sobbing. I was actually completely shocked by the end statistics... They did the same test in New York (one of the most accepting states in the US) and Texas, which is known for being extremely conservative/homophobic... However, twice as many people in Texas stuck up for the gay couple, and only about 13 people out of 100 stuck up for the gay couple in New York.

It kinda proves that the media likes to make on how awful these conservative countries are. Like I mentioned earlier, (and this still surprises me) my gay friend in the military experienced more abuse here in the UK and in California than he ever did in Arizona and Texas.

I'm happy with how much the world is progressing. You hear bad things happening an awful lot too, but considering that 5/6 years ago there was only openly one gay kid in my whole school (my best friend) and now it's so widely accepted, it truly gives me hope.

Ive seen this video before, and it still makes me cry. so proud of that guy with the earrings, that even though he did;txt make a scene about it, he wrote a really nice note to let them know they were not alone and he sympathized. it isn't until the waitress got more aggressive that he finally got more aggressive.