Should we respect opinions we don't agree with?

[Ninastar]

Obviously going with what's going on tonight... Do you think it's right to boo and hate and argue with those who we don't agree with?

It really winds me up how awful everyone has been towards Winston. Yes he's pretty disgusting with his views, but do people really think that treating him they way they did would fix anything? Like surely, it's better to show people they are wrong, rather than try and make them feel **** for their opinions?

I honestly think that when you treat people like they are disgusting for having a different opinion to you, it doesn't solve anything... You can change peoples opinions by encouraging them and hoping for the best. If you try and force them, nothing will change.

Just my opinion... I'm sure I'm in the minority though.

[Lostie!]

I respect other opinions. I don't respect being insulting and offensive, people need to differentiate between the two.

If you can't form an opinion without offending people then you have no right to demand respect.

[LukeB]

Everyone is entitled to their opinions/views but some opinions/views offend others and people have the right to be annoyed and angry just as much as the person is entitled to have an opinion. You can't really expect gay people to not react to what his views are. They are disgusting and it's 2016 views like that will not go down well

[Tom4784]

Yes, people are allowed opinions but we do not need to respect those opinions and nor should we if we disagree. I'll never respect someone who would want to deny a child a loving home because they disagree with the parents' sexuality.

[MB.]

This a show that boos and hisses people for their boob size, of course we should judge people on who they are and what they think. It's Big Brother.

[Jake.]

come out with a stupid view and respect a reaction

[JoshBB]

It depends which topic their opinion is on.

If a person had the personal view that capitalism was the superior economic system and had actual arguments to back it up, fair enough. They can think that and I would continue to not. :laugh:

But having your own views on the rights of a social group is not acceptable as an 'opinion', and anyone suggesting we should restrict the rights of a grouping on the basis of their sex, sexuality, gender identity, race, religion, nationality, ability/disablity etc is not okay and I won't respect anyone who holds those views. I also would not respect a fascist, nazi, or stalinist's opinions because of historical oppression and mass-murder.

edit: oh wait this isn't SN&D.. erm yeah judge people if they fake or nasty

[Niamh.]

Yes, people are allowed opinions but we do not need to respect those opinions and nor should we if we disagree. I'll never respect someone who would want to deny a child a loving home because they disagree with the parents' sexuality.


In a nut shell

[Vicky.]

Nah I don't think we should 'respect' opinions such as what was aired tonight. But completely ostracizing someone and talking over them when they try to explain, thats crap.

[Ant.]

Better respect Hitler's opinions then

[Jake.]

Nah I don't think we should 'respect' opinions such as what was aired tonight. But completely ostracizing someone and talking over them when they try to explain, thats crap.

but this i agree with

[LukeB]

"the child doesn't get a choice" makes it child abuse because the couple are gay...

makes no sense whatsoever, they don't have a choice with straight couples either.. so how is it any different...

[Shaun]

Oh I'm tired of this argument.

There's a difference between holding views that are unpopular and holding views that are actively discriminatory. Yes he should be heard, yes he should have a platform, but whenever he's reacted to with boos or jeers or ridicule it's because he's said something stupid and wrong and that's that.

It is fairly amusing seeing all of the 'freedom of speech' campaigners never really once stepping foot into the other 'freedom' movements, be they gay, religious, gender-related or racial.

In short: should we respect him? No. Should we listen to him/others like him, and tackle him head on? Yes.

(I'm not basing any of this on the Emma interview bc I wasn't paying attention to it)

[Calderyon]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, whether it´s right or wrong.

[Ninastar]

Nah I don't think we should 'respect' opinions such as what was aired tonight. But completely ostracizing someone and talking over them when they try to explain, thats crap.

Exactly. I think what I meant when I made this thread is 'Should people just agree to disagree' about something and put it behind them.... Because I think the way Emma acted was a little bit ridiculous.

[reece(:]

His views will never get my respect.

It's good he's being exposed for his dire views though.

[Jordan.]

Nah I don't think we should 'respect' opinions such as what was aired tonight. But completely ostracizing someone and talking over them when they try to explain, thats crap.

2

Plus the fact they put him in knowing full well about stuff he'd said and then still played up the faux-outrage like they didn't expect it

[rubymoo]

I think everybody has a right to their opinion, however, Winstons opinion about gay couples adopting children being paramount to child abuse is ridiculous, with some opinions you can listen, raise your eyebrows and move on!

[Firewire]

His views will never get my respect.

It's good he's being exposed for his dire views though.

tbh

I think there's a difference between people not supporting gay marriage to those who call it "child abuse".

[Visage]

Saying that gay people shouldn't adopt because it's child abuse isn't just an opinion it's offensive and completely untrue, people will always hate on that kind of behaviour.

These comments should be exposed and it's up to Winston where he goes from here.

You can't just say "Oh, I don't agree with you, but carry on likening gay adoption to child abuse, that's fine"

[Vicky.]

2

Plus the fact they put him in knowing full well about stuff he'd still and then still played up the faux-outrage like they didn't expect it

He was set up completely. He was only put in there to be ejected anyway which was clear from his opening VT airing the comment he made on there too.

I actually sort of suspect that Nancy had less votes than him tonight and thats why the 'twist' happened.

Yes I am playing conspiracies :joker:

[Cherie]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, whether it´s right or wrong.

.

[Shaun]

The "everyone's entitled to an opinion" really is the last call of the defeated :laugh:

[Cherie]

Nah I don't think we should 'respect' opinions such as what was aired tonight. But completely ostracizing someone and talking over them when they try to explain, thats crap.

.

[EspeonBB]

When someone likens gay adoption to child abuse and then defends that point using Christianity I'm not going to respect their views ever

I'm not saying he's not entitled to hold his views, I'm just saying I don't respect it

[Cherie]

The "everyone's entitled to an opinion" really is the last call of the defeated :laugh:

Who is not entitled to an opinion then?

[GiRTh]

Of course we respect opinions we dont agree with. Then we rip them to pieces.

[Shaun]

No one ever says otherwise Cherie, it's just always banded about as a last resort when someone has nothing left to say or defend themselves or their beliefs.

[Calderyon]

The "everyone's entitled to an opinion" really is the last call of the defeated :laugh:

What do you mean?

I´m really confused.

I don´t agree with it (his opinion), but like everyone he has a right to voice his opinion, however outrageous and wrong it is.

[T*]

Yes, people are allowed opinions but we do not need to respect those opinions and nor should we if we disagree. I'll never respect someone who would want to deny a child a loving home because they disagree with the parents' sexuality.


.

[Kazanne]

I am not saying we should respect them,but hell no one can say anything now without being bloody offended,it's ridiculous ,so he said stuff we don't like,that's his problem everyone should ignore it, no one says how they really feel anymre they are too scared to do that,the PC brigade are bleeding dangerous.

[Ninastar]

I just think people are over reacting a little bit. Especially people who his opinions don't even affect. Like seriously, I want kids more than anything and its more than likely that I will have to adopt... But I know opinions like this exist and it doesn't bother me at all. Unless someone is threatening my life or wishing me death etc, then I just don't care. People are allowed to have a different opinion to me :shrug:

[JoshBB]

I am not saying we should respect them,but hell no one can say anything now without being bloody offended,it's ridiculous ,so he said stuff we don't like,that's his problem everyone should ignore it, no one says how they really feel anymre they are too scared to do that,the PC brigade are bleeding dangerous.

This forum..

Someone could write an essay on why slavery was wrong and even then you would all come out screaming "PC BRIGADE!! LOONY LEFT! YOU SHAG MARX"

[Kazanne]

Nah I don't think we should 'respect' opinions such as what was aired tonight. But completely ostracizing someone and talking over them when they try to explain, thats crap.

:clap1::clap1:100% correct

[rionablue]

Obviously going with what's going on tonight... Do you think it's right to boo and hate and argue with those who we don't agree with?

It really winds me up how awful everyone has been towards Winston. Yes he's pretty disgusting with his views, but do people really think that treating him they way they did would fix anything? Like surely, it's better to show people they are wrong, rather than try and make them feel **** for their opinions?

I honestly think that when you treat people like they are disgusting for having a different opinion to you, it doesn't solve anything... You can change peoples opinions by encouraging them and hoping for the best. If you try and force them, nothing will change.

Just my opinion... I'm sure I'm in the minority though.

I totally respect other opinions but what he said about gay people having a child is like child molestation it sickened me (and obviously many many others) to the absolute core. You live by the sword you die by the sword. You make a statement and when you have said it it has been said and there is no going back and he OBVIOUSLY wasn't retracting it. I have never seen such disgust ( and rightfully so) in Emmas face. That man has lost any support he had except of course vile little ninny Jeremy who obviously doesn't see much wrong in what Winston said. He kept trying to move the game on last night while the others were sitting there in shock.

Winston DESERVED everything he got last night and to be honest he didn't seen to give a TOSS

[Cherie]

I just think people are over reacting a little bit. Especially people who his opinions don't even affect. Like seriously, I want kids more than anything and its more than likely that I will have to adopt... But I know opinions like this exist and it doesn't bother me at all. Unless someone is threatening my life or wishing me death etc, then I just don't care. People are allowed to have a different opinion to me :shrug:

Sums up my feelings on it all

[Niamh.]

And equally people have the right to disagree with those opinions Caitlin :shrug:

[Jordan.]

I just think people are over reacting a little bit. Especially people who his opinions don't even affect. Like seriously, I want kids more than anything and its more than likely that I will have to adopt... But I know opinions like this exist and it doesn't bother me at all. Unless someone is threatening my life or wishing me death etc, then I just don't care. People are allowed to have a different opinion to me :shrug:

I agree. It makes no sense to get so worked up over one persons unpopular opinion, it's irrelevant.

[Kazanne]

This forum..

Someone could write an essay on why slavery was wrong and even then you would all come out screaming "PC BRIGADE!! LOONY LEFT! YOU SHAG MARX"

I rest my case,lol and stop shouting and who shagged Richard Marx ?:laugh:

[Cherie]

And equally people have the right to disagree with those opinions Caitlin :shrug:

But no one is trying to shut down your view :shrug:

[Kazanne]

I agree. It makes no sense to get so worked up over one persons unpopular opinion, it's irrelevant.

:clap1::clap1:

[Samm]

He's got a **** and outdated opinion so no, we shouldn't accept it!

[Pete.]

He would have been evicted over his attitude to women despite yesterday's task anyway

[Cherie]

He's got a **** and outdated opinion so no, we shouldn't accept it!

It's not a question of accepting it, it's a question of letting him air it so it can be challenged and debated

[Shaun]

I suppose much of the apparent overreaction to one person's "unpopular belief" is the fear that it's secretly held by the majority: let's not pretend that gay rights are the most stable thing in the world right now. So whilst to us it's just "WINSTON IS WRONG!!! EVICT HIM!!!! SICKO!!!" there's basically an underlying worry that he and his party are canvassing the votes of like-minded people. Which they are. Weren't they the 3rd largest party in terms of votes across the country?

It may be an overreaction but it's a fair one - maybe 50 years down the line when gay adoption isn't still a "new thing" that could very quickly and promptly be written out of law by a party on the extreme right, we can all look back and laugh at the idea of adoption rights being at jeopardy. Right now we can't, really.

[Ninastar]

And equally people have the right to disagree with those opinions Caitlin :shrug:

Obviously, lol. I'm not saying 'WE MUST UNDERSTAND HIS OPINIONS!!!11' I'm saying that you can't change someones opinion by publicly shaming them and telling them how wrong they are. You can disagree, of course, but doing what everyone is doing won't solve anything. I just don't understand why people are getting so worked up over it.

[Cherie]

He would have been evicted over his attitude to women despite yesterday's task anyway

I wasn't offended I found his view amusing

[totaldynamic]

Of course we should accept his opinions. Whether you choose to label them as "wrong" is entirely of your own volition and not some holier than thou world view that everybody needs to accept.

The reaction of some of the housemates to Winston's comments was embarrassing to watch and I'd argue that that sort of ganging up and the sort of bitchy faces being pulled by John Partridge do more damage to the cause they purport to care so deeply about than they'd like to expect.

One of my best friends is gay and totally disagrees with gay couples being allowed to adopt children, as do many others, does that make him a backwards homophobe too? Of course it doesn't.

[Amy Jade]

While I would agree he is entitled to his opinion I have 0 respect for a person who thinks gay couples adopting is child abuse.

I'm also a bit perplexed by the 'well it doesn't concern you' about I guess straight people being annoyed or disgusted by his opinions - I find that stupid actually - I've never experienced animal abuse but I'd be fuming if somebody said it was funny

[Pete.]

I wasn't offended I found his view amusing
You weren't voting though :p

[Ninastar]

When I say 'We should respect other peoples opinions' I don't mean we should say 'yaas you're so right, i totes agree', I mean that we should say 'Well I don't agree with your opinions but I can put that behind me and treat you like a human anyway.'

I just think the way Winston has been treated tonight has been completely OTT.

[LukeB]

When I say 'We should respect other peoples opinions' I don't mean we should say 'yaas you're so right, i totes agree', I mean that we should say 'Well I don't agree with your opinions but I can put that behind me and treat you like a human anyway.'

I just think the way Winston has been treated tonight has been completely OTT.

people have opinions over an opinion and some views/opinions do not go down well with others and the people who are angry have the right to be angry too. Respect has to be earned too. Can't really respect something that you don't agree with can you?

[Ninastar]

people have opinions over an opinion and some views/opinions do not go down well with others and the people who are angry have the right to be angry too. Respect has to be earned too. Can't really respect something that you don't agree with can you?

No, you can't 'respect' something you disagree with, but you can rise above it and treat people like humans either way. You can try and encourage them to see the light. You can show them how their opinions are wrong, and if at the end of the day, they don't change their opinions, you can shrug your shoulders and say you tried.

[Visage]

One of my best friends is gay and totally disagrees with gay couples being allowed to adopt children, as do many others, does that make him a backwards homophobe too? Of course it doesn't.


But does he compare it to child abuse?

[smudgie]

No, you don't have to respect their opinion, but I do respect their right to their opinion.

[Niamh.]

Obviously, lol. I'm not saying 'WE MUST UNDERSTAND HIS OPINIONS!!!11' I'm saying that you can't change someones opinion by publicly shaming them and telling them how wrong they are. You can disagree, of course, but doing what everyone is doing won't solve anything. I just don't understand why people are getting so worked up over it.


Well it's Big Brother, the whole way the show works is if we don't like a persons opinions we say so and get them out

[totaldynamic]

But does he compare it to child abuse?

No he doesn't but the main point I was making was that, in my opinion, the ridiculous overreaction by the housemates, John Partridge's awful facial expressions and Emma Willis' attacking of Winston McKenzie do far more damage to the cause of the LGBT community than the opinions of a powerless minority like McKenzie.

[Visage]

No he doesn't but the main point I was making was that, in my opinion, the ridiculous overreaction by the housemates, John Partridge's awful facial expressions and Emma Willis' attacking of Winston McKenzie do far more damage to the cause of the LGBT community than the opinions of a powerless minority like McKenzie.

But child abuse?


Coming from a seemingly intelligent guy?

[MrWong]

I am not saying we should respect them,but hell no one can say anything now without being bloody offended,it's ridiculous ,so he said stuff we don't like,that's his problem everyone should ignore it, no one says how they really feel anymre they are too scared to do that,the PC brigade are bleeding dangerous.

He said gay adoption is akin to child abuse. It's a statement that's beyond ignorant and offensive. He offered no evidence to show his view is correct and instead rambled on about his christian beliefs.

[joeysteele]

Respecting opinions is a 2 way track however, the View of Winston that gay adoption has any relevance to child abuse, doesn't command respect it warrants contempt.

He of course has the right to hold his views but once he makes them public then he opens that up to debate and criticism.

Respect for opinions of those who disagree with us is of course correct but not deliberate offence with no full and unreserved retraction of the offensive comments.

[Paul Kersey]

Obviously going with what's going on tonight... Do you think it's right to boo and hate and argue with those who we don't agree with?

It really winds me up how awful everyone has been towards Winston. Yes he's pretty disgusting with his views, but do people really think that treating him they way they did would fix anything? Like surely, it's better to show people they are wrong, rather than try and make them feel **** for their opinions?

I honestly think that when you treat people like they are disgusting for having a different opinion to you, it doesn't solve anything... You can change peoples opinions by encouraging them and hoping for the best. If you try and force them, nothing will change.

Just my opinion... I'm sure I'm in the minority though.

6 JAN 2016

http://www.mirror.co.uk/tv/tv-news/emma-willis-says-winston-mckenzie-7126431

[smudgie]

I would have liked to have heard more about his views on the child abuse issue.
Was he on about sexual abuse, physical abuse, or was he on about mental abuse?

[ScottyT]

It's quite clear Big Brother wanted him out. They literally dug out a really strange comment (even stranger that he still agrees with it) from the past to set him up and get him out.

There must of been a hell of a lot of OFCOM complaints...

[Vicky.]

I would have liked to have heard more about his views on the child abuse issue.
Was he on about sexual abuse, physical abuse, or was he on about mental abuse?

Yeah if he had been allowed to expand on this a bit, it might have made a bit more 'sense'

I don't mean it would justify it, but the child abuse thing just..I can't make any sense of at all. I cannot see anyway in which it is abuse. Nor did the 'the child can't cho0se' make any sense as an explanation.

[Niamh.]

Respecting opinions is a 2 way track however, the View of Winston that gay adoption has any relevance to child abuse, doesn't command respect it warrants contempt.

He of course has the right to hold his views but once he makes them public then he opens that up to debate and criticism.

Respect for opinions of those who disagree with us is of course correct but not deliberate offence with no full and unreserved retraction of the offensive comments.


Beautifully put as always Joey :love:

[jet]

I don't think an opinion should automatically be respected. Any ass can have one. I'd need to respect the person giving the opinion first, and secondly decide if they have valid points to make.
Winston lost on both counts.

[Braden]

I can accept other people's opinions, but I don't feel the need to respect someone for having one which differs from my own.

[Amy Jade]

Yeah if he had been allowed to expand on this a bit, it might have made a bit more 'sense'

I don't mean it would justify it, but the child abuse thing just..I can't make any sense of at all. I cannot see anyway in which it is abuse. Nor did the 'the child can't cho0se' make any sense as an explanation.

I felt he was given ample time to expand on it but he didn't do a good job of it and prattled on about nothing

[Amy Jade]

Yeah if he had been allowed to expand on this a bit, it might have made a bit more 'sense'

I don't mean it would justify it, but the child abuse thing just..I can't make any sense of at all. I cannot see anyway in which it is abuse. Nor did the 'the child can't cho0se' make any sense as an explanation.

I felt he was given ample time to expand on it but he didn't do a good job of it and prattled on about nothing

[mistybluesea]

I don't believe that all views should be respected. It's very dependant on the circumstance and how that certain opinion effects somebody personally. I don't think ignorant views like Winston's deserve much respect from anyone and I don't think he should expect to receive respect for them either.

[letmein]

I respect other opinions. I don't respect being insulting and offensive, people need to differentiate between the two.

If you can't form an opinion without offending people then you have no right to demand respect.

The word is ACKNOWLEDGE, NOT RESPECT.

[Ammi]

...hmmmm, it's interesting that so many of us always say how we would like the 'old style' BB back and the social experiment, type thing...surely, having Winston in the house with his extreme views on homosexuality, together with homeosexuals in there as well, is an inetersting social experiment..I mean, is that not a big part of it all...to see if there could be any understanding gained or any mind-set changes etc...yeah, we can hate on people who have the same views as Winston/we can boo them and scream get out... but if we do that, then all it'll cause is for nothing really to ever change because that hate will inevitably cause a defensiveness that will not leave an open door for listening...it's 2016, views like Winston's should not still be something that exist but they do exist and maybe that's partly because they're attacked, rather than discussed..a mind-set is a mind-set, something that isn't easy to change and I would doubt, would ever be changed through a BB experience but at least it's a beginning and an opening for questioning that mind-set...why do you believe a homosexual guy would be a sexual predator in any way, why would you have to have your 'back to the wall', while sharing the same house space/environment...why would it in any way be damaging for a child to have homosexual parents..?...all of these opportunities lost by hating on someone, by attacking what they believe...as abhorrent as it may be, it's their genuine belief and one that will continue sadly and be 'inherited' if all there is, is attack on it...the 'divide' will remain, the divide will widen because it's not just his beliefs, it's also the beliefs of others as well....we're kind of quite selective with our free speech because we don't like it when it offends and Winston's opinions are certainly very offensive and prejudice...but what really the importance of our own personal offence, compared to a possible changing of like-minded opinions to Winston's opinions...is that not the 'bigger picture', to not shut down the Winstons of the world, to not name call and attack...that's only going to re-inforce their mind-sets...if we want change, we have to allow change to happen and we have to hear and listen to some pretty unpleasant stuff...there will be no 'fix' unless that happens...I could not be more opposed to everything Winston seems to believe, which is why any possible house conversations with him would have interested me the most...there was a chance here for a real social experiment, something that I've always loved about BB from 'back in the day' but it's sadly been lost to a 'hero/villian' thing which has been manufactured by BB...let's hate on the villian, that's so fun and entertaining, well yes it is but it's kind of missing a great opportunity of something much more than entertaining by just fuelling more hate and more intolerance...

..anyways, it is what it is, an entertainment show but personally, I'd like to see less and less Winstons coming along in the future because they have listened and been listened to and mind-sets have been changed or at least questioned by themselves..that would be an ideal world, I guess..the sort of Hollywood ending which just doesn't happen, does it..but a step closer to it happening possibly..?...I don't know if anyone has watched the movie, Pride...and incredibly beautiful movie, that did have that 'Hollywood Ending'...except that it was real life as well, the coming together of an LGBT community and a very prejudice, 'nuclear family' mind-set in a Welsh village...quite a few 'Winstons' in that village, I would reckon...or at least, that's how the story started but progressed to a very different ending...there was no 'the villians were killed in the end' ending/I don't mean literally killed obviously, that would have been a bit extreme..what would that ending have achieved anyway, along would come another Winston and another and another and etc etc....because they do keep on a comin' when they're distracted (these homophobic mind-sets..) by defending, rather than to be made to think about...by living with somone/sharing house space with someone for instance, who is gay and who (they possibly) could come to think of as making a darn good parent to a child...just a possibility that was booed out with no understandings given any opportunity to happen...a possible 'oh actually, this John person would make an amazing parent, I think..he has great values and character etc..so much to enrich a child's life with...so if that's possible...could it also possibly be that other gay people would make great parents as well...OMG, OMG, OMG..., maybe, just maybe my 'Christian beliefs' need questioning..'...so much easier to 'hate back' I guess, show the same lack of tolerance...but that's not really ever going to do anything positive though, is it...and really, because his opinions/views were about parenting/gay parents and so extreme...what is any of this teaching our children...that we won't tolerate a 'bad man', darling..that we need to show the same intolerance that has been shown by them..that, that will 'fix', well it won't because it hasn't...these mind-sets have not been 'fixed'....


..anyways, just my opinion of course...

[waterhog]

Obviously going with what's going on tonight... Do you think it's right to boo and hate and argue with those who we don't agree with?

It really winds me up how awful everyone has been towards Winston. Yes he's pretty disgusting with his views, but do people really think that treating him they way they did would fix anything? Like surely, it's better to show people they are wrong, rather than try and make them feel **** for their opinions?

I honestly think that when you treat people like they are disgusting for having a different opinion to you, it doesn't solve anything... You can change peoples opinions by encouraging them and hoping for the best. If you try and force them, nothing will change.

Just my opinion... I'm sure I'm in the minority though.


but in this day and age - everyone should no what is acceptable.

[chuff me dizzy]

100% Yes

[bots]

of course we should. How do you think the LGBT community has come to be accepted now? By letting people speak and their views heard. I find it obscene that people forget that and are not capable of accepting anyone with a different view to their own.

[MrWong]

of course we should. How do you think the LGBT community has come to be accepted now? By letting people speak and their views heard. I find it obscene that people forget that and are not capable of accepting anyone with a different view to their own.

He can have any ignorant view he likes.

He was asked to explain his view. Hardly unreasonable.

How is gay adoption akin to child abuse? He couldn't answer because its not true.

[Ninastar]

...hmmmm, it's interesting that so many of us always say how we would like the 'old style' BB back and the social experiment, type thing...surely, having Winston in the house with his extreme views on homosexuality, together with homeosexuals in there as well, is an inetersting social experiment..I mean, is that not a big part of it all...to see if there could be any understanding gained or any mind-set changes etc...yeah, we can hate on people who have the same views as Winston/we can boo them and scream get out... but if we do that, then all it'll cause is for nothing really to ever change because that hate will inevitably cause a defensiveness that will not leave an open door for listening...it's 2016, views like Winston's should not still be something that exist but they do exist and maybe that's partly because they're attacked, rather than discussed..a mind-set is a mind-set, something that isn't easy to change and I would doubt, would ever be changed through a BB experience but at least it's a beginning and an opening for questioning that mind-set...why do you believe a homosexual guy would be a sexual predator in any way, why would you have to have your 'back to the wall', while sharing the same house space/environment...why would it in any way be damaging for a child to have homosexual parents..?...all of these opportunities lost by hating on someone, by attacking what they believe...as abhorrent as it may be, it's their genuine belief and one that will continue sadly and be 'inherited' if all there is, is attack on it...the 'divide' will remain, the divide will widen because it's not just his beliefs, it's also the beliefs of others as well....we're kind of quite selective with our free speech because we don't like it when it offends and Winston's opinions are certainly very offensive and prejudice...but what really the importance of our own personal offence, compared to a possible changing of like-minded opinions to Winston's opinions...is that not the 'bigger picture', to not shut down the Winstons of the world, to not name call and attack...that's only going to re-inforce their mind-sets...if we want change, we have to allow change to happen and we have to hear and listen to some pretty unpleasant stuff...there will be no 'fix' unless that happens...I could not be more opposed to everything Winston seems to believe, which is why any possible house conversations with him would have interested me the most...there was a chance here for a real social experiment, something that I've always loved about BB from 'back in the day' but it's sadly been lost to a 'hero/villian' thing which has been manufactured by BB...let's hate on the villian, that's so fun and entertaining, well yes it is but it's kind of missing a great opportunity of something much more than entertaining by just fuelling more hate and more intolerance...

..anyways, it is what it is, an entertainment show but personally, I'd like to see less and less Winstons coming along in the future because they have listened and been listened to and mind-sets have been changed or at least questioned by themselves..that would be an ideal world, I guess..the sort of Hollywood ending which just doesn't happen, does it..but a step closer to it happening possibly..?...I don't know if anyone has watched the movie, Pride...and incredibly beautiful movie, that did have that 'Hollywood Ending'...except that it was real life as well, the coming together of an LGBT community and a very prejudice, 'nuclear family' mind-set in a Welsh village...quite a few 'Winstons' in that village, I would reckon...or at least, that's how the story started but progressed to a very different ending...there was no 'the villians were killed in the end' ending/I don't mean literally killed obviously, that would have been a bit extreme..what would that ending have achieved anyway, along would come another Winston and another and another and etc etc....because they do keep on a comin' when they're distracted (these homophobic mind-sets..) by defending, rather than to be made to think about...by living with somone/sharing house space with someone for instance, who is gay and who (they possibly) could come to think of as making a darn good parent to a child...just a possibility that was booed out with no understandings given any opportunity to happen...a possible 'oh actually, this John person would make an amazing parent, I think..he has great values and character etc..so much to enrich a child's life with...so if that's possible...could it also possibly be that other gay people would make great parents as well...OMG, OMG, OMG..., maybe, just maybe my 'Christian beliefs' need questioning..'...so much easier to 'hate back' I guess, show the same lack of tolerance...but that's not really ever going to do anything positive though, is it...and really, because his opinions/views were about parenting/gay parents and so extreme...what is any of this teaching our children...that we won't tolerate a 'bad man', darling..that we need to show the same intolerance that has been shown by them..that, that will 'fix', well it won't because it hasn't...these mind-sets have not been 'fixed'....


..anyways, just my opinion of course...

Beautifully said Ammi. As always :love:

[cheapbbfan]

He didnt bring these views into the house though. Big Brother did

[MTVN]

Meh I don't respect his opinion but then that means that I just wouldn't engage with him about it. He believes what he believes and will continue to do so whether you try and lambast him and shout him down or not. Ultimately he is a throwback but there will always be people like him in any generation who are unable to come to terms with changes in society.

[rusticgal]

Everyone has the right to an opinion...it's called freedom of speech.
However we don't have to like or respect anyone's opinion...we have to respect the fact that they are entitled to one.

[jennyjuniper]

We don't have to respect the opinions, however the right to express those opinions should be respected.

[jet]

...hmmmm, it's interesting that so many of us always say how we would like the 'old style' BB back and the social experiment, type thing...surely, having Winston in the house with his extreme views on homosexuality, together with homeosexuals in there as well, is an inetersting social experiment..I mean, is that not a big part of it all...to see if there could be any understanding gained or any mind-set changes etc...yeah, we can hate on people who have the same views as Winston/we can boo them and scream get out... but if we do that, then all it'll cause is for nothing really to ever change because that hate will inevitably cause a defensiveness that will not leave an open door for listening...it's 2016, views like Winston's should not still be something that exist but they do exist and maybe that's partly because they're attacked, rather than discussed..a mind-set is a mind-set, something that isn't easy to change and I would doubt, would ever be changed through a BB experience but at least it's a beginning and an opening for questioning that mind-set...why do you believe a homosexual guy would be a sexual predator in any way, why would you have to have your 'back to the wall', while sharing the same house space/environment...why would it in any way be damaging for a child to have homosexual parents..?...all of these opportunities lost by hating on someone, by attacking what they believe...as abhorrent as it may be, it's their genuine belief and one that will continue sadly and be 'inherited' if all there is, is attack on it...the 'divide' will remain, the divide will widen because it's not just his beliefs, it's also the beliefs of others as well....we're kind of quite selective with our free speech because we don't like it when it offends and Winston's opinions are certainly very offensive and prejudice...but what really the importance of our own personal offence, compared to a possible changing of like-minded opinions to Winston's opinions...is that not the 'bigger picture', to not shut down the Winstons of the world, to not name call and attack...that's only going to re-inforce their mind-sets...if we want change, we have to allow change to happen and we have to hear and listen to some pretty unpleasant stuff...there will be no 'fix' unless that happens...I could not be more opposed to everything Winston seems to believe, which is why any possible house conversations with him would have interested me the most...there was a chance here for a real social experiment, something that I've always loved about BB from 'back in the day' but it's sadly been lost to a 'hero/villian' thing which has been manufactured by BB...let's hate on the villian, that's so fun and entertaining, well yes it is but it's kind of missing a great opportunity of something much more than entertaining by just fuelling more hate and more intolerance...

..anyways, it is what it is, an entertainment show but personally, I'd like to see less and less Winstons coming along in the future because they have listened and been listened to and mind-sets have been changed or at least questioned by themselves..that would be an ideal world, I guess..the sort of Hollywood ending which just doesn't happen, does it..but a step closer to it happening possibly..?...I don't know if anyone has watched the movie, Pride...and incredibly beautiful movie, that did have that 'Hollywood Ending'...except that it was real life as well, the coming together of an LGBT community and a very prejudice, 'nuclear family' mind-set in a Welsh village...quite a few 'Winstons' in that village, I would reckon...or at least, that's how the story started but progressed to a very different ending...there was no 'the villians were killed in the end' ending/I don't mean literally killed obviously, that would have been a bit extreme..what would that ending have achieved anyway, along would come another Winston and another and another and etc etc....because they do keep on a comin' when they're distracted (these homophobic mind-sets..) by defending, rather than to be made to think about...by living with somone/sharing house space with someone for instance, who is gay and who (they possibly) could come to think of as making a darn good parent to a child...just a possibility that was booed out with no understandings given any opportunity to happen...a possible 'oh actually, this John person would make an amazing parent, I think..he has great values and character etc..so much to enrich a child's life with...so if that's possible...could it also possibly be that other gay people would make great parents as well...OMG, OMG, OMG..., maybe, just maybe my 'Christian beliefs' need questioning..'...so much easier to 'hate back' I guess, show the same lack of tolerance...but that's not really ever going to do anything positive though, is it...and really, because his opinions/views were about parenting/gay parents and so extreme...what is any of this teaching our children...that we won't tolerate a 'bad man', darling..that we need to show the same intolerance that has been shown by them..that, that will 'fix', well it won't because it hasn't...these mind-sets have not been 'fixed'....


..anyways, just my opinion of course...

Fantastic post Ammi. I always love reading your thoughts. :clap1:
I too long for the early BB days of the social experiment without interference from producers forcing issues and instead letting us get to know them simply through their conversations and interactions with each other. If it had been the old style BB, I think that Winston's views on gay adoption could well have come to light naturally anyway given time as he was already showing homophobia in his VT and in the house before the task was carried out so he obviously wanted his views on the subject known to some extent.

What you say makes great sense and I love your understanding and thoughtfulness, but personally I'm glad I don't have to look or hear from that disgusting arrogant man for even another day. :laugh:
In my real life I don't go all guns blazing against homophobic remarks, well not often....probably most of us don't and we just say we disagree and say why, because attacking someone's beliefs doesn't get you anywhere - and you might get your face rearranged lol - (I once got into a heated argument with a big guy in a bar about his anti gay views and got head butted for my trouble, by the time I came to my senses he was gone so I didn't even get a go at him haha) so I think forums like this are a kind of outlet to safely let off steam...
I wish you would post more often, I always look out for your take on things....:lovedup:

[Pink Pegasus]

...hmmmm, it's interesting that so many of us always say how we would like the 'old style' BB back and the social experiment, type thing...surely, having Winston in the house with his extreme views on homosexuality, together with homeosexuals in there as well, is an inetersting social experiment..I mean, is that not a big part of it all...to see if there could be any understanding gained or any mind-set changes etc...yeah, we can hate on people who have the same views as Winston/we can boo them and scream get out... but if we do that, then all it'll cause is for nothing really to ever change because that hate will inevitably cause a defensiveness that will not leave an open door for listening...it's 2016, views like Winston's should not still be something that exist but they do exist and maybe that's partly because they're attacked, rather than discussed..a mind-set is a mind-set, something that isn't easy to change and I would doubt, would ever be changed through a BB experience but at least it's a beginning and an opening for questioning that mind-set...why do you believe a homosexual guy would be a sexual predator in any way, why would you have to have your 'back to the wall', while sharing the same house space/environment...why would it in any way be damaging for a child to have homosexual parents..?...all of these opportunities lost by hating on someone, by attacking what they believe...as abhorrent as it may be, it's their genuine belief and one that will continue sadly and be 'inherited' if all there is, is attack on it...the 'divide' will remain, the divide will widen because it's not just his beliefs, it's also the beliefs of others as well....we're kind of quite selective with our free speech because we don't like it when it offends and Winston's opinions are certainly very offensive and prejudice...but what really the importance of our own personal offence, compared to a possible changing of like-minded opinions to Winston's opinions...is that not the 'bigger picture', to not shut down the Winstons of the world, to not name call and attack...that's only going to re-inforce their mind-sets...if we want change, we have to allow change to happen and we have to hear and listen to some pretty unpleasant stuff...there will be no 'fix' unless that happens...I could not be more opposed to everything Winston seems to believe, which is why any possible house conversations with him would have interested me the most...there was a chance here for a real social experiment, something that I've always loved about BB from 'back in the day' but it's sadly been lost to a 'hero/villian' thing which has been manufactured by BB...let's hate on the villian, that's so fun and entertaining, well yes it is but it's kind of missing a great opportunity of something much more than entertaining by just fuelling more hate and more intolerance...

..anyways, it is what it is, an entertainment show but personally, I'd like to see less and less Winstons coming along in the future because they have listened and been listened to and mind-sets have been changed or at least questioned by themselves..that would be an ideal world, I guess..the sort of Hollywood ending which just doesn't happen, does it..but a step closer to it happening possibly..?...I don't know if anyone has watched the movie, Pride...and incredibly beautiful movie, that did have that 'Hollywood Ending'...except that it was real life as well, the coming together of an LGBT community and a very prejudice, 'nuclear family' mind-set in a Welsh village...quite a few 'Winstons' in that village, I would reckon...or at least, that's how the story started but progressed to a very different ending...there was no 'the villians were killed in the end' ending/I don't mean literally killed obviously, that would have been a bit extreme..what would that ending have achieved anyway, along would come another Winston and another and another and etc etc....because they do keep on a comin' when they're distracted (these homophobic mind-sets..) by defending, rather than to be made to think about...by living with somone/sharing house space with someone for instance, who is gay and who (they possibly) could come to think of as making a darn good parent to a child...just a possibility that was booed out with no understandings given any opportunity to happen...a possible 'oh actually, this John person would make an amazing parent, I think..he has great values and character etc..so much to enrich a child's life with...so if that's possible...could it also possibly be that other gay people would make great parents as well...OMG, OMG, OMG..., maybe, just maybe my 'Christian beliefs' need questioning..'...so much easier to 'hate back' I guess, show the same lack of tolerance...but that's not really ever going to do anything positive though, is it...and really, because his opinions/views were about parenting/gay parents and so extreme...what is any of this teaching our children...that we won't tolerate a 'bad man', darling..that we need to show the same intolerance that has been shown by them..that, that will 'fix', well it won't because it hasn't...these mind-sets have not been 'fixed'....


..anyways, just my opinion of course...

Just read this now, just want to say fantastic post Ammi, you raise some great points there and made me think about the situation and some aspects more closely. I find you a very good debater and at getting me to look at at alternative viewpoints by how you lay out your posts. I did want him evicted because he was my least favourite of the 3 nominees not solely because of his comments but also because I just liked the other 2 ladies a bit more as housemates and thought he was a little bit sleazy so I'm still glad it was him gone out of the 3 that were up. However I too wonder though if a few weeks living with gay people would have made Winston question some of his own negative beliefs? I know that there might not have been a high likelihood of that but it would be something that would have been interesting to witness if it did happen. Alternatively things could have escalated even further and he could have gone on to really upset some of the housemates further or gotten into bigger arguments that also damaged himself more with the public, but I didn't get the impression it was something he wanted to fight and argue about so maybe his opinions might have changed a little over time...

[Jamie89]

...hmmmm, it's interesting that so many of us always say how we would like the 'old style' BB back and the social experiment, type thing...surely, having Winston in the house with his extreme views on homosexuality, together with homeosexuals in there as well, is an inetersting social experiment..I mean, is that not a big part of it all...to see if there could be any understanding gained or any mind-set changes etc...yeah, we can hate on people who have the same views as Winston/we can boo them and scream get out... but if we do that, then all it'll cause is for nothing really to ever change because that hate will inevitably cause a defensiveness that will not leave an open door for listening...it's 2016, views like Winston's should not still be something that exist but they do exist and maybe that's partly because they're attacked, rather than discussed..a mind-set is a mind-set, something that isn't easy to change and I would doubt, would ever be changed through a BB experience but at least it's a beginning and an opening for questioning that mind-set...why do you believe a homosexual guy would be a sexual predator in any way, why would you have to have your 'back to the wall', while sharing the same house space/environment...why would it in any way be damaging for a child to have homosexual parents..?...all of these opportunities lost by hating on someone, by attacking what they believe...as abhorrent as it may be, it's their genuine belief and one that will continue sadly and be 'inherited' if all there is, is attack on it...the 'divide' will remain, the divide will widen because it's not just his beliefs, it's also the beliefs of others as well....we're kind of quite selective with our free speech because we don't like it when it offends and Winston's opinions are certainly very offensive and prejudice...but what really the importance of our own personal offence, compared to a possible changing of like-minded opinions to Winston's opinions...is that not the 'bigger picture', to not shut down the Winstons of the world, to not name call and attack...that's only going to re-inforce their mind-sets...if we want change, we have to allow change to happen and we have to hear and listen to some pretty unpleasant stuff...there will be no 'fix' unless that happens...I could not be more opposed to everything Winston seems to believe, which is why any possible house conversations with him would have interested me the most...there was a chance here for a real social experiment, something that I've always loved about BB from 'back in the day' but it's sadly been lost to a 'hero/villian' thing which has been manufactured by BB...let's hate on the villian, that's so fun and entertaining, well yes it is but it's kind of missing a great opportunity of something much more than entertaining by just fuelling more hate and more intolerance...

..anyways, it is what it is, an entertainment show but personally, I'd like to see less and less Winstons coming along in the future because they have listened and been listened to and mind-sets have been changed or at least questioned by themselves..that would be an ideal world, I guess..the sort of Hollywood ending which just doesn't happen, does it..but a step closer to it happening possibly..?...I don't know if anyone has watched the movie, Pride...and incredibly beautiful movie, that did have that 'Hollywood Ending'...except that it was real life as well, the coming together of an LGBT community and a very prejudice, 'nuclear family' mind-set in a Welsh village...quite a few 'Winstons' in that village, I would reckon...or at least, that's how the story started but progressed to a very different ending...there was no 'the villians were killed in the end' ending/I don't mean literally killed obviously, that would have been a bit extreme..what would that ending have achieved anyway, along would come another Winston and another and another and etc etc....because they do keep on a comin' when they're distracted (these homophobic mind-sets..) by defending, rather than to be made to think about...by living with somone/sharing house space with someone for instance, who is gay and who (they possibly) could come to think of as making a darn good parent to a child...just a possibility that was booed out with no understandings given any opportunity to happen...a possible 'oh actually, this John person would make an amazing parent, I think..he has great values and character etc..so much to enrich a child's life with...so if that's possible...could it also possibly be that other gay people would make great parents as well...OMG, OMG, OMG..., maybe, just maybe my 'Christian beliefs' need questioning..'...so much easier to 'hate back' I guess, show the same lack of tolerance...but that's not really ever going to do anything positive though, is it...and really, because his opinions/views were about parenting/gay parents and so extreme...what is any of this teaching our children...that we won't tolerate a 'bad man', darling..that we need to show the same intolerance that has been shown by them..that, that will 'fix', well it won't because it hasn't...these mind-sets have not been 'fixed'....


..anyways, just my opinion of course...

https://i.imgur.com/2PXcfoM.jpg?1

[lostalex]

should you tolerate people being intolerant? no.

any injustice can be justified by belief. Dicks fit vaginas, and it's natural for men to get horny and want sex, so a rapist could say he was just doing what nature intended. does that mean we should tolerate rape?

[Withano]

I dont really see how its possible to respect one mans opinion if his opinion is we should disrespect 10% of humanity. So, no, not always.

[Macie Lightfoot]

When I say 'We should respect other peoples opinions' I don't mean we should say 'yaas you're so right, i totes agree', I mean that we should say 'Well I don't agree with your opinions but I can put that behind me and treat you like a human anyway.'

I just think the way Winston has been treated tonight has been completely OTT.

I'm just picking this post without reading much of the thread, but as a gay person I don't feel the need to respect Winston's opinion since he clearly doesn't have respect for someone like me.

[ThriceShy]

I dont really see how its possible to respect one mans opinion if his opinion is we should disrespect 10% of humanity. So, no, not always.

Where did he say we should disrespect all gays? Why make that up?:shrug:

[Crimson Dynamo]

5%

[Livia]

I don't respect his opinion. I respect his right to an opinion but that's an entirely different thing. I have no respect for Winston in general.

[Glenn.]

No we shouldn't respect their opinions. If you spill stupid filth expect to be treated like filth.

[chuff me dizzy]

He didnt bring these views into the house though. Big Brother did

True

[sampvt]

Big Brother knew exactly what they were doing. They booked him, recorded the views they wanted to air, they put him in the house and put him in a game they knew would create conflict. They then fed him to the wolves and maybe even changed the eviction procedures to make sure he was evicted. They even then probably forced Emma to do the interview she did and probably prompted Rylan and the heavily biased panel. In short he was stitched up like a kipper and fed to the lions and for what, a few extra viewers and a human interest story that disgusted many of the GBP.

If you want to know who the real villain is here, look no further than BB itself. Winston is purely a nobody with ****y views and he was bought and sold as a sacrificial lamb by a turd of an organisation that will grovel in dustbins for viewing figures.

[Macie Lightfoot]

True

his views are still pertinent bc they're entirely why he was cast in the first place

[chuff me dizzy]

his views are still pertinent bc they're entirely why he was cast in the first place

And he's allowed "his views"

[Macie Lightfoot]

did anyone say he isn't?

[Glenn.]

And he's allowed "his views"

He's certainly allowed them. But have them respected? No.

[EspeonBB]

Big Brother knew exactly what they were doing. They booked him, recorded the views they wanted to air, they put him in the house and put him in a game they knew would create conflict. They then fed him to the wolves and maybe even changed the eviction procedures to make sure he was evicted. They even then probably forced Emma to do the interview she did and probably prompted Rylan and the heavily biased panel. In short he was stitched up like a kipper and fed to the lions and for what, a few extra viewers and a human interest story that disgusted many of the GBP.

If you want to know who the real villain is here, look no further than BB itself. Winston is purely a nobody with ****y views and he was bought and sold as a sacrificial lamb by a turd of an organisation that will grovel in dustbins for viewing figures.

I don't disagree with your point that BB put him in for controversy and publicity but that doesn't change the fact that Winston still has very outdated and harmful views.

[LukeB]

And he's allowed "his views"

so are the people who don't agree with them, because it's their view too :shrug: can't have a view and expect people to be please with it. Respect has to be earned.

[Tom4784]

Big Brother knew exactly what they were doing. They booked him, recorded the views they wanted to air, they put him in the house and put him in a game they knew would create conflict. They then fed him to the wolves and maybe even changed the eviction procedures to make sure he was evicted. They even then probably forced Emma to do the interview she did and probably prompted Rylan and the heavily biased panel. In short he was stitched up like a kipper and fed to the lions and for what, a few extra viewers and a human interest story that disgusted many of the GBP.

If you want to know who the real villain is here, look no further than BB itself. Winston is purely a nobody with ****y views and he was bought and sold as a sacrificial lamb by a turd of an organisation that will grovel in dustbins for viewing figures.

His homophobic remarks are the only reason why he's notable in the first place and he knows it. He knew what he was getting himself in to and he did nothing but show himself to be a bigoted twat that's incapable of accepting responsibility for his own actions and words.

Acting like BB is the villain when it was his words that got him in trouble is just ignoring the facts. BB brought it up but Winston dug his own grave in the aftermath. We haven't even touched on the fact that he was a creeper that blamed the women in the house for his own actions or the fact that he's a disablist prick.

He's indefensible.

[sampvt]

His homophobic remarks are the only reason why he's notable in the first place and he knows it. He knew what he was getting himself in to and he did nothing but show himself to be a bigoted twat that's incapable of accepting responsibility for his own actions and words.

Acting like BB is the villain when it was his words that got him in trouble is just ignoring the facts. BB brought it up but Winston dug his own grave in the aftermath. We haven't even touched on the fact that he was a creeper that blamed the women in the house for his own actions or the fact that he's a disablist prick.

He's indefensible.

Im guessing you have crossed him off your xmas card list then, lol.

[jet]

His homophobic remarks are the only reason why he's notable in the first place and he knows it. He knew what he was getting himself in to and he did nothing but show himself to be a bigoted twat that's incapable of accepting responsibility for his own actions and words.

Acting like BB is the villain when it was his words that got him in trouble is just ignoring the facts. BB brought it up but Winston dug his own grave in the aftermath. We haven't even touched on the fact that he was a creeper that blamed the women in the house for his own actions or the fact that he's a disablist prick.

He's indefensible.

Well said!

[ThriceShy]

I don't disagree with your point that BB put him in for controversy and publicity but that doesn't change the fact that Winston still has very outdated and harmful views.

Who does his views harm?

[ThriceShy]

His homophobic remarks are the only reason why he's notable in the first place

You mean apart from his professional boxing career and politics and charity work.

What has the likes of Gemma Collins ever done?

[Glenn.]

Who does his views harm?

What? Is this for real?

[ThriceShy]

What? Is this for real?

Why not answer the question instead of responding with another one?

Who has been harmed by winston's views?

[Tom4784]

You mean apart from his professional boxing career and politics and charity work.

What has the likes of Gemma Collins ever done?

Yes because we all obviously knew him from his boxing and his charity work and not from him describing Gay adoption as child abuse.

[ThriceShy]

Yes because we all obviously knew him from his boxing and his charity work and not from him describing Gay adoption as child abuse.

I certainly knew him from Boxing before he went into the house.

He is one of the few genuine celebrities in there.

I knew nothing of his adoption views until it came up in that task.

[Glenn.]

Why not answer the question instead of responding with another one?

Who has been harmed by winston's views?

Well gay people to start with? I would have thought that was obvious. Well it is for those content to see him for what he is and not embarrassingly defend his every action.

[Tom4784]

I certainly knew him from Boxing before he went into the house.

He is one of the few genuine celebrities in there.

I knew nothing of his adoption views until it came up in that task.

Hmm, I don't really buy that.

It was his homophobia that got him attention, nobody gives a **** about anything else he's done or he'd be known for it instead.

[ThriceShy]

Well gay people to start with? I would have thought that was obvious. Well it is for those content to see him for what he is and not embarrassingly defend his every action.


How has he harmed gay people?

Do you actually realise how hysterical this sounds?:shrug:

[Tom4784]

Why not answer the question instead of responding with another one?

Who has been harmed by winston's views?

Gay people, deaf people, women in general for his wanton victim blaming.

[sampvt]

You mean apart from his professional boxing career and politics and charity work.

What has the likes of Gemma Collins ever done?

She had a designer fanny probably with a virgazzle. It probably looks like the entrance to santas grotto but the question begs......WHY......Her chances of getting laid are on a par with Winston getting an invite to the next gay pride march.

[ThriceShy]

Hmm, I don't really buy that.

It was his homophobia that got him attention, nobody gives a **** about anything else he's done or he'd be known for it instead.

I don't care what you buy. He is well known in the boxing world and I closely follow boxing.

Unlike all these hysterical reactionaries, I don't tend to give a toss what people's opinions are. Why would I? It doesn't affect me.

[Glenn.]

How has he harmed gay people?

Do you actually realise how hysterical this sounds?:shrug:

It's not hysterical. If everyone allowed or accepted this sort of ignorance there would be no equality.

[ThriceShy]

She had a designer fanny probably with a virgazzle. It probably looks like the entrance to santas grotto but the question begs......WHY......Her chances of getting laid are on a par with Winston getting an invite to the next gay pride march.


:joker::joker::joker:

I certainly think "twat" when I see her.:laugh:

[Tom4784]

I don't care what you buy. He is well known in the boxing world and I closely follow boxing.

Unlike all these hysterical reactionaries, I don't tend to give a toss what people's opinions are. Why would I? It doesn't affect me.

You aren't representative of the general public, you may claim to know who he was prior to the homophobia but most of the GP wouldn't know him from Adam otherwise.

[ThriceShy]

It's not hysterical. If everyone allowed or accepted this sort of ignorance there would be no equality.

Allowed? Are you saying he shouldn't be allowed his view?

This country frightens me it really does.

[ThriceShy]

You aren't representative of the general public, you may claim to know who he was prior to the homophobia but most of the GP wouldn't know him from Adam otherwise.

Eh?

He was a champion boxer. And has been in several political parties. Why would you assume that people only know him from his opinions on gays?


This gets more bizarre.:shrug:

[Glenn.]

Allowed? Are you saying he shouldn't be allowed his view?

This country frightens me it really does.

He's allowed a view of course. He's entitled to his ignorant opinions. When it discriminates against a minority? He should be hung up to dry.

[thesheriff443]

Big brother set winston up and broadcast his views.
For me it's like the fireman who set houses on fire so he could put them out.

[ThriceShy]

He's allowed a view of course. He's entitled to his ignorant opinions. When it discriminates against a minority? He should be hung up to dry.


What do you mean by "hung up to dry?"

How should his life be affected by having these views?

[Glenn.]

What do you mean by "hung up to dry?"

How should his life be affected by having these views?

Because he discriminates against people. No one should be allowed to express opinions that are derogatory towards people. No one.

I've come to the conclusion you are trolling when it comes to this waste of space. Literally no one is that idiotic to think Winston is actually right in what he preaches?

Are you homophobic yourself? Do you believe in his views? Please god answer me because if you do then I shan't be continuing this discussion with you.

[chuff me dizzy]

Yes because we all obviously knew him from his boxing and his charity work and not from him describing Gay adoption as child abuse.

I didn't know him full stop ....but BB "CHOSE"to highlight his beliefs ,they didn't mention anyone else's beliefs did they ?

[Ninastar]

plz dont get my thread closed

[Tom4784]

Eh?

He was a champion boxer. And has been in several political parties. Why would you assume that people only know him from his opinions on gays?


This gets more bizarre.:shrug:

Because most people don't follow boxing outside of major fights and the general public don't really keep track of a minor MP's movements through the parties. The reason why he was notable prior to CBB were his comments on gay couples and adoption. Accept it or not, it's the truth.

[chuff me dizzy]

Big brother set winston up and broadcast his views.
For me it's like the fireman who set houses on fire so he could put them out.

:clap1: As usual an excellent post form Sheriff !!

[Tom4784]

What do you mean by "hung up to dry?"

How should his life be affected by having these views?

You know what he meant, being overly obtuse is a good way of broadcasting that your argument doesn't have a leg to stand on.

[Tom4784]

I didn't know him full stop ....but BB "CHOSE"to highlight his beliefs ,they didn't mention anyone else's beliefs did they ?

Because that's the only reason why he's notable, dear.

Really, it's like no one thinks that Winston is accountable for his own words or actions.

[Beso]

Hmm, I don't really buy that.

It was his homophobia that got him attention, nobody gives a **** about anything else he's done or he'd be known for it instead.

hmmm, just a wild guess but the homless probably care. a community far more persecuted than the gays.

[chuff me dizzy]

Because that's the only reason why he's notable, dear.

Really, it's like no one thinks that Winston is accountable for his own words or actions.

Dont patronize me .......... HE didn't say the words on the show BB did .....God is it that hard to sink in ?

[bots]

Gay people, deaf people, women in general for his wanton victim blaming.

Arguably, Katie Hopkins was much more offensive to a broader cross section of society and yet she was celebrated by Emma and the producers.

Two wrongs clearly don't make a right, but there is a distinct lack of consistency.

I think Winston is a prize ass, and I would never defend his views, but if KH could get away with saying what she did, how on earth is the same privilege not provided to Winston.

[chuff me dizzy]

hmmm, just a wild guess but the homless probably care. a community far more persecuted than the gays.

So true,homeless have lot worse life than gays !!

[LukeB]

So true,homeless have lot worse life than gays !!

It's not a competition. I bet you don't even know the things that happen to gay people because of who they are...I don't know how you can compare the two really.

[jet]

Dont patronize me .......... HE didn't say the words on the show BB did .....God is it that hard to sink in ?

He displayed his homophobia on his VT so he wanted it known as part of who he was going into the house. Although he now denies saying it even though it's on tape. He's a trainwreck.

[chuff me dizzy]

It's not a competition. I bet you don't even know the things that happen to gay people because of who they are...I don't know how you can compare the two really.

My opinion and its as valid as yours

[Macie Lightfoot]

Arguably, Katie Hopkins was much more offensive to a broader cross section of society and yet she was celebrated by Emma and the producers.

Two wrongs clearly don't make a right, but there is a distinct lack of consistency.

I think Winston is a prize ass, and I would never defend his views, but if KH could get away with saying what she did, how on earth is the same privilege not provided to Winston.

I've blocked out a lot of CBB15 from my memory but I'm pretty sure Emma laid into KH a bit during her eviction interview? Correct me if I'm wrong.

[LukeB]

My opinion and its as valid as yours

Obviously but it's quite a bizarre comparison.

[Tom4784]

hmmm, just a wild guess but the homless probably care. a community far more persecuted than the gays.

Why are you trying to turn this into a 'who's got it worse' competition? I can only assume you're desperate and you want to take the discussion away from homophobia since you know you can't win otherwise.

Arguably, Katie Hopkins was much more offensive to a broader cross section of society and yet she was celebrated by Emma and the producers.

Two wrongs clearly don't make a right, but there is a distinct lack of consistency.

I think Winston is a prize ass, and I would never defend his views, but if KH could get away with saying what she did, how on earth is the same privilege not provided to Winston.

Well, KH isn't exactly the nation's sweetheart is she? I can't remember much of her time in the house since I found that series a bore but I think she was smart enough to at least play the game and leave her views out of it when she could.

BB brought up Winston's comments and he could have easily diffused the situation but then he just made it worse for himself.

Dont patronize me .......... HE didn't say the words on the show BB did .....God is it that hard to sink in ?

BB brought it up but he tried to justify his hate by using religion, saying that he didn't agree with it because 'the children don't get a choice' and then on top of it all he acts like a victim whilst using phrases such as 'Deaf and Dumb'.

He's a grown man, he should take responsibility for his actions, it was his comments in the VT and then after the task that sealed his fate. He could have recovered if he handled the task better.

[chuff me dizzy]

Obviously but it's quite a bizarre comparison.

No its not bizarre at all

[Beso]

It's not a competition. I bet you don't even know the things that happen to gay people because of who they are...I don't know how you can compare the two really.

things happen to people from all walks of life, take me, i once got my head kicked in for being myself.:shrug:

[Kizzy]

If it's just a random opinion on something generic then yes, if it's an opinion that represses, oppresses or suppresses an entire subgroup then no.

[Tom4784]

No its not bizarre at all

Well yes it is, you're trying to compare two communities who both had it bad so you can defend a wretched disablist homophobe creeper, it's quite awful really.

[chuff me dizzy]

Well yes it is, you're trying to compare two communities who both had it bad so you can defend a wretched disablist homophobe creeper, it's quite awful really.

Because he dared to say the words deaf and dumb Sweet Jesus !!!!

[LukeB]

things happen to people from all walks of life, take me, i once got my head kicked in for being myself.:shrug:

But Gays are discriminated against, certain countries don't welcome gay/lesbian people... like Russia have you seen how they treat people because of their sexuality?

[Tom4784]

Because he dared to say the words deaf and dumb Sweet Jesus !!!!

Wow, now you're downplaying it?

Just wow.

[Beso]

Why are you trying to turn this into a 'who's got it worse' competition? I can only assume you're desperate and you want to take the discussion away from homophobia since you know you can't win otherwise.



Well, KH isn't exactly the nation's sweetheart is she? I can't remember much of her time in the house since I found that series a bore but I think she was smart enough to at least play the game and leave her views out of it when she could.

BB brought up Winston's comments and he could have easily diffused the situation but then he just made it worse for himself.



BB brought it up but he tried to justify his hate by using religion, saying that he didn't agree with it because 'the children don't get a choice' and then on top of it all he acts like a victim whilst using phrases such as 'Deaf and Dumb'.

He's a grown man, he should take responsibility for his actions, it was his comments in the VT and then after the task that sealed his fate. He could have recovered if he handled the task better.
threads about respectinng opinions or not dear, not homophobia. you're hatred is effecting your mind, doll.

[chuff me dizzy]

But Gays are discriminated against, certain countries don't welcome gay/lesbian people... like Russia have you seen how they treat people because of their sexuality?

So do a LOT more people too I can't see you campaigning for them

[LukeB]

So do a LOT more people too I can't see you campaigning for them

obviously, but we are not on about racism are we.. it's a bit irrelevant when you are comparing homeless people to gay people making out it's the same.

[Tom4784]

threads about respectinng opinions or not dear, not homophobia. you're hatred is effecting your mind, doll.

I'm not the one desperate to defend a homophobe but k I'm obviously the hateful one here...

This topic has been about homophobia since the beginning, to think otherwise to to live in denial. To try to downplay the homophobia by bringing in homelessness reeks of desperation.

[chuff me dizzy]

Wow, now you're downplaying it?

Just wow.

Yes WOW what is wrong with calling someone deaf and dumb ?

[ThriceShy]

Why are you trying to turn this into a 'who's got it worse' competition? I can only assume you're desperate and you want to take the discussion away from homophobia since you know you can't win otherwise.



Well, KH isn't exactly the nation's sweetheart is she? I can't remember much of her time in the house since I found that series a bore but I think she was smart enough to at least play the game and leave her views out of it when she could.

BB brought up Winston's comments and he could have easily diffused the situation but then he just made it worse for himself.



BB brought it up but he tried to justify his hate by using religion, saying that he didn't agree with it because 'the children don't get a choice' and then on top of it all he acts like a victim whilst using phrases such as 'Deaf and Dumb'.

He's a grown man, he should take responsibility for his actions, it was his comments in the VT and then after the task that sealed his fate. He could have recovered if he handled the task better.

How odd that you see this as winning and losing. It tells us everything we need to know really.

[jet]

How odd that you see this as winning and losing. It tells us everything we need to know really.

And what is that?
On another note, what do you think of Winston's memory loss?

[Beso]

I'm not the one desperate to defend a homophobe but k I'm obviously the hateful one here...

This topic has been about homophobia since the beginning, to think otherwise to to live in denial. To try to downplay the homophobia by bringing in homelessness reeks of desperation.

if you're going to slaver random generalizations like "no one gives a **** what hes done" then expect it to be challenged. especially in a thread about challenging peoples opinions you disagree with.:hehe:

[Tom4784]

Yes WOW what is wrong with calling someone deaf and dumb ?

Wow...

How odd that you see this as winning and losing. It tells us everything we need to know really.

That avoidance.

if you're going to slaver random generalizations like "no one gives a **** what hes done" then expect it to be challenged. especially in a thread about challenging peoples opinions you disagree with.:hehe:

How is it a generalisation? He's not a well known boxer, he's not a well known MP, he's not well known for his charity work. The only reason why the general public is aware of his existence is because he was involved in one of the many controversies that followed UKIP throughout the election. To pretend that that the public knows who he is for any other reason than his views is silly.

I can only assume that you're imagining what I've written and are arguing with that because I've never made out that I don't expect anyone to challenge me so perhaps you should try reading my posts in future? Just a thought.

[ThriceShy]

What is wrong with the phrase "deaf and dumb"? It is totally accurate. Dumb means unable to speak as in being "dumbstruck."

Is there nothing these delicate flowers won't find some offence in?

[Livia]

I'm TeamDezzy on this one.

[Beso]

Wow...



That avoidance.



How is it a generalisation? He's not a well known boxer, he's not a well known MP, he's not well known for his charity work. The only reason why the general public is aware of his existence is because he was involved in one of the many controversies that followed UKIP throughout the election. To pretend that that the public knows who he is for any other reason than his views is silly.

I can only assume that you're imagining what I've written and are arguing with that because I've never made out that I don't expect anyone to challenge me so perhaps you should try reading my posts in future? Just a thought.
you claimed no one cared, i said who would care. now you're ranting:conf:

[Tom4784]

you claimed no one cared, i said who would care. now your ranting:conf:

So you're being obtuse and pedantic, I see. Just another sign that you're circling the drain on this discussion then.

[Beso]

So you're being obtuse and pedantic, I see. Just another sign that you're circling the drain on this discussion then.
another example of people being abused for nothing more than contributing to a thread.:shocked:

[Tom4784]

another example of people being abused for nothing more than contributing to a thread.:shocked:

What?

I explained my points fully and you ignored them for pedantic reasons, that's not me abusing you. Your desperation is growing if you're going to try to make out I'm attacking you when you can't win an argument.

[Glenn.]

.
You still haven't responded to my earlier post.

[ThriceShy]

You still haven't responded to my earlier post.

Which one?

[Glenn.]

Because he discriminates against people. No one should be allowed to express opinions that are derogatory towards people. No one.

I've come to the conclusion you are trolling when it comes to this waste of space. Literally no one is that idiotic to think Winston is actually right in what he preaches?

Are you homophobic yourself? Do you believe in his views? Please god answer me because if you do then I shan't be continuing this discussion with you.

This one. But you knew that already.

[jet]

Which one?

You haven't responded to mine either about Winston's memory loss just up the page.

[Beso]

there was nothing to argue.

you were given an example of people who would care, then you and you alone went off on one.



go re read again before you delete it to save your embarrassment.

[ThriceShy]

This one. But you knew that already.

I think missed it with the new page.

I will address it now.

[ThriceShy]

Because he discriminates against people. No one should be allowed to express opinions that are derogatory towards people. No one.

I've come to the conclusion you are trolling when it comes to this waste of space. Literally no one is that idiotic to think Winston is actually right in what he preaches?

Are you homophobic yourself? Do you believe in his views? Please god answer me because if you do then I shan't be continuing this discussion with you.



And there we have it. The thought police are alive and well.

I wonder though if you will see the irony in you being allowed to give opinions on here that are derogatory about Winston.

You say that Winston shouldn't be allowed to express such an opinion about gays. How do you propose that he be prevented from doing so?

[Kazanne]

You haven't responded to mine either about Winston's memory loss just up the page.

He forgot :laugh: c'mon guys lighten up

[Glenn.]

And there we have it. The thought police are alive and well.

I wonder though if you will see the irony in you being allowed to give opinions on here that are derogatory about Winston.

You say that Winston shouldn't be allowed to express such an opinion about gays. How do you propose that he be prevented from doing so?

I find anybody that will discriminate against someone based on their sexuality completely vile and disgusting. Someone like that doesn't deserve respect for their ignorant opinions. He is of course entitled to his ignorant opinions which I have already stated. This topic of this thread is whether he deserves respect for them. Absolutely not. It is a disgusting viewpoint to have. How do I propose he be prevented from spilling such vileness? Get him away from any kind of platform where he can preach such grossly out of date nonsense.

You didn't answer whether you agreed with what he said though. I'm guessing your campaigning his remarks as a yes. You do agree with his views?

[jet]

He forgot :laugh: c'mon guys lighten up

It's not a light subject though. :shrug:

[jet]

I find anybody that will discriminate against someone based on their sexuality completely vile and disgusting. Someone like that doesn't deserve respect for their ignorant opinions. He is of course entitled to his ignorant opinions which I have already stated. This topic of this thread is whether he deserves respect for them. Absolutely not. It is a disgusting viewpoint to have. How do I propose he be prevented from spilling such vileness? Get him away from any kind of platform where he can preach such grossly out of date nonsense.

You didn't answer whether you agreed with what he said though. I'm guessing your campaigning his remarks as a yes. You do agree with his views?

:clap1:
The idiot is talking about running for the office of Lord Mayor of London now. Not on this planet you creep.

[ThriceShy]

I find anybody that will discriminate against someone based on their sexuality completely vile and disgusting. Someone like that doesn't deserve respect for their ignorant opinions. He is of course entitled to his ignorant opinions which I have already stated. This topic of this thread is whether he deserves respect for them. Absolutely not. It is a disgusting viewpoint to have. How do I propose he be prevented from spilling such vileness? Get him away from any kind of platform where he can preach such grossly out of date nonsense.

You didn't answer whether you agreed with what he said though. I'm guessing your campaigning his remarks as a yes. You do agree with his views?

I do agree with his views. Frustrating that there isn't a single thing you can do about it.:spin:

[Glenn.]

I do agree with his views. Frustrating that there isn't a single thing you can do about it.:spin:

Then all I can do is call you an ignorant homophobic mess and leave the thread. And there's not a thing you can do about it because it's the truth.

[MrWong]

I do agree with his views. Frustrating that there isn't a single thing you can do about it.:spin:

Pointing and laughing's an option.

[jet]

Pointing and laughing's an option.

:hehe: I think I love you.

[wendywillow]

well......that went well

[ThriceShy]

Then all I can do is call you an ignorant homophobic mess and leave the thread. And there's not a thing you can do about it because it's the truth.

Perhaps you should stick to discussing the housemates, as the rules say.:laugh:

[ThriceShy]

Pointing and laughing's an option.

It seems it is all some are capable of. It is certainly easier than actually having a serious debate.

[ThriceShy]

well......that went well

I'm not even going to report the abuse. I think it would be instructive for it to stay here as a monument.


If you have to pitch a fit and flounce from a thread because someone has an opinion you don't like then it is time to take a look at yourself.

[Glenn.]

Can we ban the trolling homophobe please?

[Dollface]

Yes, people are allowed opinions but we do not need to respect those opinions and nor should we if we disagree. I'll never respect someone who would want to deny a child a loving home because they disagree with the parents' sexuality.

this

[MrWong]

:hehe: I think I love you.

:fan:

[Maru]

I think we can respect that other people don't necessarily drive the same car we do or buy the same milk. When we are talking about social issues such as the adoption of children by gay couple and decisions on handling poverty that literally effect lives, the rules change.

Winston is trying to be a politician and I think that amplified the reaction. His poor character showed through poorly on BB, even with editing.

[ThriceShy]

I think we can respect that other people don't necessarily drive the same car we do or buy the same milk. When we are talking about social issues such as the adoption of children by gay couple and decisions on handling poverty that literally effect lives, the rules change.

Winston is trying to be a politician and I think that amplified the reaction. His poor character showed through poorly on BB, even with editing.


So what do you propose we do about Winston and others daring to have an opinion on social issues that you don't agree with?

[Robodog]

"One of the problems with defending free speech is you often have to defend people that you find to be outrageous and unpleasant and disgusting" - Salman Rushdie.

True say Salman.

However the alternative is even worse - no free speech is what happens under a fascist regime such as Nazi Germany etc etc

Better to all talk freely and disagree than to try shut people down and encourage hatred towards them and demonize them for having an opinion that you don't agree with - which is what has happened to Winston in this series by BB.

By the way - I 100% disagree with what Winston said.

BUT - I also 100% disagree with the hate-fuelled Witch hunt mentality that Winston has been subjected to from BB.

If Winston had said those things INSIDE the house - then let them all react to it, they are adults.

But for BB to set him up DELIBERATELY and then crucify him for something he said OUTSIDE the house is a disgusting, mean trick from BB. If they were that offended then they shouldn't have let him in, not lead him in like a lamb to slaughter. That's just foul play from BB.

BB WITCH HUNT - yet again. DELIBERATELY whipping up hatred in the name of 'entertainment' is just as bad, if not worse, than what Winston said outside of the house.

[wendywillow]

the whole thing is tiring a this point....but bb is really screwing themselves out of getting anymore decent celebs in the future....who would want the winston treatment base on something you said in the past

[jet]

the whole thing is tiring a this point....but bb is really screwing themselves out of getting anymore decent celebs in the future....who would want the winston treatment base on something you said in the past

But Winston wasn't a decent celeb. :smug: