Rio Ferdinand: no top world class players in EPL, so sides can't progress in CL

[alex_front2]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3493956/The-Premier-League-none-world-s-best-players-says-Rio-Ferdinand-s-clubs-fail-Champions-League.html


The Premier League has none of the world's best players, says Rio Ferdinand... that's why our clubs fail in the Champions League
Rio Ferdinand said none of the world's best players play in England
Ferdinand believes lack of quality has hampered European success
Former Manchester United defender won Champions League in 2008
Only three English teams have made quarter-finals since 2012
Manchester City became the fourth....

He likes Kun Aguero but does not recognize him as a top top world player.

[Mystic Mock]

Tbf Aguero isn't a world class player, his a very good player, but not what you would call world class.

[alex_front2]

Seeing Arsenal dominated by a luckluster Barca is depressing.

Now see that if you have Welbeck, and Giroud as forwards you will be just too poor in CL. Don't have a 28 goal a season centre forward.

[GiRTh]

Ozil is world class he just needs better players around him. No one can look world class when they've got Giroud and Walcott as targets.

[Crimson Dynamo]

the Spanish league is utter sh1t

lets see messi, suarez and nemar survive a few seasons in the prem (not just one suarez you knob) and then we will judge

[alex_front2]

the Spanish league is utter sh1t

lets see messi, suarez and nemar survive a few seasons in the prem (not just one suarez you knob) and then we will judge

That's just an excuse. Barca would dominate ANY league. They would win title by less points but still win. In fact I think teams like Sevilla, Celta Vigo and Eibar would finish above Arsenal.
I actually think the problem with English football is English players like Welbeck, Cameron Jerome, Andy Caroll, the Ox, Jessie Lingard. They would not get into mid table Bundesliga or La Liga club.

[GiRTh]

Cameron Jerome? Is that a joke? :joker:

Anyway if it not a joke then I disagree. I think he would get into teams in the middle or bottom of La Liga. I think people are a bit blinded by the quality of the top teams in those leagues they dont realise there is also a alot of dross.

[Crimson Dynamo]

That's just an excuse. Barca would dominate ANY league. They would win title by less points but still win. In fact I think teams like Sevilla, Celta Vigo and Eibar would finish above Arsenal.
I actually think the problem with English football is English players like Welbeck, Cameron Jerome, Andy Caroll, the Ox, Jessie Lingard. They would not get into mid table Bundesliga or La Liga club.

i doubt it

they look good BECAUSE of the sh1t leagues

[GiRTh]

I think the teams in the middle or at the bottom of the Premiership would beat the teams in the equivalent position in la liga. It has been said time and time again that beating struggling teams in the Premiership is much harder than in La Liga, Serie A etc. At the top its a differnet matter.

[Shaun]

Amazing what money can buy I suppose

[Brother Leon]

Aguero and Ozil would get in World Squads. De Gea would start....struggling to think of much else really. The league is weak, but anyone can see that really. Says it all when the three I mentioned won't even be in the league in a couple seasons probably.

[alex_front2]

Aguero and Ozil would get in World Squads. De Gea would start....struggling to think of much else really. The league is weak, but anyone can see that really. Says it all when the three I mentioned won't even be in the league in a couple seasons probably.

And yet EPL has the greatest share of money but LA liga has better players. Odd.:conf:

The best current EPL players IMHO are:


De Gea
Bolassie
Mahrez
Cabaye
Luke Shaw (when fit)
N'golo Kante
Kane
Dele Alli
Ozil
Sanchez (despite being a bit crap since February)
Aguero
Kompany
Fuchs
Lukaku
Barklay
Arnautovic
Mane
Courtinho
Lloris
Wijnaldum


None are world class IMHO.

[Crimson Dynamo]

And yet EPL has the greatest share of money but LA liga has better players. Odd.:conf:

The best current EPL players IMHO are:


De Gea
Bolassie
Mahrez
Cabaye
Luke Shaw (when fit)
N'golo Kante
Kane
Dele Alli
Ozil
Sanchez (despite being a bit crap since February)
Aguero
Kompany
Fuchs
Lukaku
Barklay
Arnautovic
Mane
Courtinho
Lloris
Wijnaldum


None are world class IMHO.

payet?

[alex_front2]

Of course, he was the one I was thinking of writing last as I would remember, then forgot altogether. :laugh:

[Tarryn]

There are very few truly amazing players right now.
The likes of Ronaldo & Messi don't come along very often & when they do even if they play in the PL Madrid or Barcelona come knocking.
Leicester have proved that you need a group of good players with belief & team spirit rather than that one big name to be at the top.
As a Man U fan I would like to see my club do this rather than try to buy their way out of trouble, which clearly is not working.

[Denver]

You forgot Firmino who is one of the most in form Players right now

[alex_front2]

There are very few truly amazing players right now.
The likes of Ronaldo & Messi don't come along very often & when they do even if they play in the PL Madrid or Barcelona come knocking.
Leicester have proved that you need a group of good players with belief & team spirit rather than that one big name to be at the top.
As a Man U fan I would like to see my club do this rather than try to buy their way out of trouble, which clearly is not working.

Agree. You can't beat team spirit. Barcelona have it, Real Madrid don't.

Sadly for you, Man U no longer build teams like as you described. LVG stumbled across the youth team starlets. Rather than adding cheap canny signings like Leicester have done with Mahrez, Kante, and Vardy you buy big name expensive names like Schweinsteiger, and luxury kids Martial and Memphis.

[alex_front2]

You forgot Firmino who is one of the most in form Players right now

Nope, thought about him and actively decided to omit him. He's currently on form but he needs a longer string of good games to convince me.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Nope, thought about him and actively decided to omit him. He's currently on form but he needs a longer string of good games to convince me.

Mane?

he is crap this season

[alex_front2]

Mane?

he is crap this season
He's playing crap on purpose (with deliberate flashes of brilliance) to bring down his transfer fee. He wants to leave, but iirc in the game v Arsenal he was brilliant

[Denver]

He's play crap on purpose to bring down his transfer fee. He wants to leave, but iirc in the game v Arsenal he was brilliant

Where is the sense in that? If he is playing crap to bring down his fee them no big team will have interest in him as he is underperforming

[alex_front2]

Where is the sense in that? If he is playing crap to bring down his fee them no big team will have interest in him as he is underperforming

Nope, look at the downward trajectory of Eden Hazard. Player of the year last season, useless this season. It's deliberate. He wants a dream move to Real Madrid (but PSG 1970 will do) but knows his £60m fee would not be met, so plays badly to bring it down. Ditto Saido Berahino to move to Spurs. Was valued at £22m- £28m last season, sulks and has stand off with WBA, now worth £15m. Bingo.

[Tarryn]

Agree. You can't beat team spirit. Barcelona have it, Real Madrid don't.

Sadly for you, Man U no longer build teams like as you described. LVG stumbled across the youth team starlets. Rather than adding cheap canny signings like Leicester have done with Mahrez, Kante, and Vardy you buy big name expensive names like Schweinsteiger, and luxury kids Martial and Memphis.

Most United fans I know would rather build the team from youth again rather than splash out on another Di Maria which was a total disaster.
But we won't do this as money talks & they seem to think big signings mean big business.
We are losing ground big time with other teams but only have ourselves to blame.
We have one world class player & he will be going to Madrid in the summer.

[alex_front2]

You have to find a way of keeping hold of De Gea of else Man U is seriously screwed. There was a time when Man U was the ultimate football team but it's now the Spanish giants and Bayern Munich. Man U are just big in global fans and cash, but in football it's those three teams. So if you lose DDG to Real, you might as well accept Man U is now 'just another team.'

[Tarryn]

You have to find a way of keeping hold of De Gea of else Man U is seriously screwed. There was a time when Man U was the ultimate football team but it's now the Spanish giants and Bayern Munich. Man U are just big in global fans and cash, but in football it's those three teams. So if you lose DDG to Real, you might as well accept Man U is now 'just another team.'

I don't think losing DDG will make us "Just another team", I don't think that will ever happen.
We are a massive brand like Liverpool. We are more well known around the world than most clubs.
Money talks.
Plus, you can just as easily get to the top again as you can drop down the league. That's just the way it is.
Some like to make out we are over but with a new manager & a few good signings everything could change.
I would not be cheering for our demise just yet, I think you are getting ahead of yourself :laugh:

[alex_front2]

I don't think losing DDG will make us "Just another team", I don't think that will ever happen.
We are a massive brand like Liverpool. We are more well known around the world than most clubs.
Money talks.
Plus, you can just as easily get to the top again as you can drop down the league. That's just the way it is.
Some like to make out we are over but with a new manager & a few good signings everything could change.
I would not be cheering for our demise just yet, I think you are getting ahead of yourself :laugh:

Being a massive brand with a big history but no current success is pointless and empty (like a pretty girl with no personality), Liverpool, Valencia, Milan, Inter, Lyon and Newcastle are also massive clubs with massive fan bases. Hardly setting world on fire now are they. Truth is clubs like PSG 1970 are more enticing than Man U. You are more likely to hear players saying 'I dream of playing for Barca/ Real Madrid/ Bayern' than Man U. Man U only get the big names once they are 30+. Hello Schweini. Possibly Zlatan and a return of Ronaldo. Young stars often headed to Spain or PSG 1970. If they have to join a Manchester side then it's City.

Also what's the point in a young player playing for Man U now? Fergies gone, no manager will ever come close not even Mourinho or even a shock change for Pep. For a new player it won't matter what he achieves in the eyes of fans, they will never be as good as Sir Bobby, Best, Law, Cantona, RVN, Beck's, Ronaldo etc. Why be second best to history, when you can make history elsewhere? Rashford and Lingard get game time, but in LVG sides :laugh3:

Any Man U side now regardless of what they do will be unfavourably compared to as Man U 2006, 2009, 1999 (treble) or any thing achieved with Sir Matt. It will take another 10 -20 years for Man U to fully move on from Sir Alex's considerable success, the way you had to after Sir Matt's success. It would just be money to entice players now. Except Sky money means the smaller clubs can hold onto the Payets, Kantes, Bolassies, Mahrezs etc. You can't even steal them and even if Man U could, more and more of these players don't want to go to Man U. Too much 'big club bulls*t'. Man U post Fergie is just not as attractive as it once was. What can Man U give a player that Man City can't. I highly doubt a player from Nigeria, Uruguay or Austria gives a fig about your history, history just isn't important to a lot of young players.

Say what you want about West Ham or Leicester City but Payet , Noble, Vardy, Drinkwater and co can be smug safe in knowledge they are playing at the best ever West Ham and Leicester teams of all time, just as Suarez, Neymar and Messi are playing at best Barcelona side of all time. Will current Man U players be able to say that?

Man U are a team living in the past a club obsessed with past history, sides like West Ham, Spurs and Leicester City are making "future" history.

[Tarryn]

Being a massive brand with a big history but no current success is pointless and empty (like a pretty girl with no personality), Liverpool, Valencia, Milan, Inter, Lyon and Newcastle are also massive clubs with massive fan bases. Hardly setting world on fire now are they. Truth is clubs like PSG 1970 are more enticing than Man U. You are more likely to hear players saying 'I dream of playing for Barca/ Real Madrid/ Bayern' than Man U. Man U only get the big names once they are 30+. Hello Schweini. Possibly Zlatan and a return of Ronaldo. Young stars often headed to Spain or PSG 1970. If they have to join a Manchester side then it's City.

Also what's the point in a young player playing for Man U now? Fergies gone, no manager will ever come close not even Mourinho or even a shock change for Pep. For a new player it won't matter what he achieves in the eyes of fans, they will never be as good as Sir Bobby, Best, Law, Cantona, RVN, Beck's, Ronaldo etc. Why be second best to history, when you can make history elsewhere? Rashford and Lingard get game time, but in LVG sides :laugh3:

Any Man U side now regardless of what they do will be unfavourably compared to as Man U 2006, 2009, 1999 (treble) or any thing achieved with Sir Matt. It will take another 10 -20 years for Man U to fully move on from Sir Alex's considerable success, the way you had to after Sir Matt's success. It would just be money to entice players now. Except Sky money means the smaller clubs can hold onto the Payets, Kantes, Bolassies, Mahrezs etc. You can't even steal them and even if Man U could, more and more of these players don't want to go to Man U. Too much 'big club bulls*t'. Man U post Fergie is just not as attractive as it once was. What can Man U give a player that Man City can't. I highly doubt a player from Nigeria, Uruguay or Austria gives a fig about your history, history just isn't important to a lot of young players.

Say what you want about West Ham or Leicester City but Payet , Noble, Vardy, Drinkwater and co can be smug safe in knowledge they are playing at the best ever West Ham and Leicester teams of all time, just as Suarez, Neymar and Messi are playing at best Barcelona side of all time. Will current Man U players be able to say that?

Man U are a team living in the past a club obsessed with past history, sides like West Ham, Spurs and Leicester City are making "future" history.

You are a massive Man U hater. Get over it.
Man City are hardly much better than us right now. Chelsea are going no place & Arsenal are content with just being top four. Are these teams over ?.
This season has been strange with so many so-called smaller clubs doing well.
Nothing major. It happens sometimes.
Get past the Man U hate & move on.
I totally disagree with pretty much everything you have posted.

[alex_front2]

You are a massive Man U hater. Get over it.
Man City are hardly much better than us right now. Chelsea are going no place & Arsenal are content with just being top four. Are these teams over ?.
This season has been strange with so many so-called smaller clubs doing well.
Nothing major. It happens sometimes.
Get past the Man U hate & move on.
I totally disagree with pretty much everything you have posted.

I've obviously hit a raw nerve of reality.

Don't worry I hate all EPL clubs more or less equally. I can reassure you, in these post Fergie era there is nothing special about Man U to hate, don't you worry. :laugh3: In fact I probably hate the more powerful Manchester club, Man City.The Manchester club of the future. Heck, even ex united stars are sending their kids - the future - to the City academy.

Again, dont worry Tarryn, Man U have the monopoly of the past. :laugh2: I think you'll find I am more scathing about Arsenal and Liverpool, but you don't hear those fans whining, playing the "everyone hates us" card. I hate to shatter Man U fans egos but to be fair I dont even hate Man U nowadays , Man U are no longer special, dominant or good enough to hate. Man U are just another club now. I like to think of Man U as being just like Southampton but with a few more fans and a few more trophies.....from the past. You are now closer to Stoke City, and Bournemouth than you are to the new elite of Barca, PSG 1970, Bayern, Atletico and Braga. Welcome to the 'just another club' club.

The day Fergie went was a day I began to feel pity for Man U. Pity is worse than hate IMHO. No Law, no Robson, no Whiteside, no McClair, no Krankelskis, no Irwin, no Keane, no Ince, no Paliister, no Beck's, no RVN, no Ronaldo? No Fergie. But hey, you've got Matteo Darmian and erm Rojo. Man U not even worth hating :laugh2: Nobody really hates Man U It's all about hating Barca and Spurs these days :wink:

Finally, this season isn't strange. Leicester may not be in the title hunt next year, then it might be a Stoke or a Southampton or even a relegation survivor eg Norwich doing a Leicester. The Sky TV money will kick in an everyone will be quite rich and Man U will be even less special. Sorry, mate.

[Mystic Mock]

Man U will pick back up someday, I just think that they're gonna have to go through what Liverpool are going through first before fixing themselves.

Both clubs will fix themselves.

[alex_front2]

Man U will never return to any where near the longevity and successful consistency of the Sir Alex era.

[Mystic Mock]

Man U will never return to any where near the longevity and successful consistency of the Sir Alex era.

It won't be as big as the Fergie era, like Liverpool won't ever be as big as their 70's and 80's eras, but I seriously think it's some weird wishful thinking if you seriously think that these two clubs won't get back on their feet within the next 15 to 20 years.

I honestly could see Liverpool being able to compete in the Champions League soon in particular considering they've been doing okay lately besides the bad result against Southampton.

And all Man Utd need to do really is sort their defense out because the forwards are there as all they need is more experience, they've got plenty of Midfielders already, and De Gea is a world class Goalkeeper that might need a decent number 2 choice just in case De Gea got injured or suspended.

[Tarryn]

It won't be as big as the Fergie era, like Liverpool won't ever be as big as their 70's and 80's eras, but I seriously think it's some weird wishful thinking if you seriously think that these two clubs won't get back on their feet within the next 15 to 20 years.

I honestly could see Liverpool being able to compete in the Champions League soon in particular considering they've been doing okay lately besides the bad result against Southampton.

And all Man Utd need to do really is sort their defense out because the forwards are there as all they need is more experience, they've got plenty of Midfielders already, and De Gea is a world class Goalkeeper that might need a decent number 2 choice just in case De Gea got injured or suspended.

Agree. I just think some haters sit there wishing for certain clubs demise rather than enjoying watching football.
If a club like Leicester can go from bottom to top in one season then anything can happen with football.
We lost direction when Fergie left but we have some really good young players who can build as a team together. I think the future is bright.

[alex_front2]

It won't be as big as the Fergie era, like Liverpool won't ever be as big as their 70's and 80's eras, but I seriously think it's some weird wishful thinking if you seriously think that these two clubs won't get back on their feet within the next 15 to 20 years.

I honestly could see Liverpool being able to compete in the Champions League soon in particular considering they've been doing okay lately besides the bad result against Southampton.

And all Man Utd need to do really is sort their defense out because the forwards are there as all they need is more experience, they've got plenty of Midfielders already, and De Gea is a world class Goalkeeper that might need a decent number 2 choice just in case De Gea got injured or suspended.

DDG will bugg#r off to Spain, probably Real Madrid, once they get over their financial fair play embargoes. Defensively Man U are OK, Luke Shaw was fantastic at the season start , his play in the CL was surprisingly sensational until that PSV injury. Chris Smalling on his day is brilliant but can also be holy ***e. Cameron Borthwick Jackson is a great prospect. But all in all the standard is way behind Madrid, Minich and Barcelona. Man U just are not in the elite bracket, they are a big brand but small on success and prospects. AC Milan were a big brand....

[Tarryn]

DDG will bugg#r off to Spain, probably Real Madrid, once they get over their financial fair play embargoes. Defensively Man U are OK, Luke Shaw was fantastic at the season start , his play in the CL was surprisingly sensational until that PSV injury. Chris Smalling on his day is brilliant but can also be holy ***e. Cameron Borthwick Jackson is a great prospect. But all in all the standard is way behind Madrid, Minich and Barcelona. Man U just are not in the elite bracket, they are a big brand but small on success and prospects. AC Milan were a big brand....

Find another team to hate. You seem quite bitter.
It's getting boring now :sleep:

[alex_front2]

Find another team to hate. You seem quite bitter.
It's getting boring now :sleep:

Yep really aggressive about a team whose best years are behind them, whilst the new elite eg PSG 1970, Barca, and Bayern dominate football with ease. Whilst Pep G will inevitably and boringly turn City not just into *the Manchester* club, but the English club. But yet I'm still bitter about a mediocre team which has Schneidlin, past it Schweini/ Rooney and Rojo. :joker: Yes, I can feel the bitterness. :joker:

Again Tarryn, I have obviously touched a very very raw nerve about the fall of Man U. But the good news you can always re-hire Fergie :laugh2:

[BBfanUSA]

Nah, my theory is that because the Premier League has so many competitive teams (usually Big 5 and the occasional Everton/Tottenham/etc. in a normal) that they to go all out in those games.

Leagues like Spain, France, and Germany only have generally 1-3 exceptional teams, meaning they don't have to go balls out all the time.

I mean PSG has already won their domestic league.

[Mystic Mock]

DDG will bugg#r off to Spain, probably Real Madrid, once they get over their financial fair play embargoes. Defensively Man U are OK, Luke Shaw was fantastic at the season start , his play in the CL was surprisingly sensational until that PSV injury. Chris Smalling on his day is brilliant but can also be holy ***e. Cameron Borthwick Jackson is a great prospect. But all in all the standard is way behind Madrid, Minich and Barcelona. Man U just are not in the elite bracket, they are a big brand but small on success and prospects. AC Milan were a big brand....

You're confusing what I'm saying here though.

I'm saying that one day soon Man U will be back at the top of the Premier League, the same for Liverpool too.

However it does take a bit longer to do well in the Champions League because the team needs to be in there for a few years to gain experience before having a chance at winning it.

[alex_front2]

But will they? Really interesting debate about how the football power is migrating from North East England to London and South. Foreign players now preceding to play for the likes of West Ham and Spurs, and even younger players preferring Crystal Palace to Man U. The equity of TV revenue will mean Man U, City, Liverpool will have less wage power than 10 years ago.