Budget 2016

[MTVN]

Coming up after PMQs at 12.30, most people predicting quite a boring budget but old George might have a rabbit in the hat

[Ammi]

...but will that rabbit be taxed more tomorrow than it was yesterday hmmmm..great stuff though, I have the day off especially..(not really but good timing anyway...)...

[Crimson Dynamo]

Coming up after PMQs at 12.30, most people predicting quite a boring budget but old George might have a rabbit in the hat

hopefully that rabbit wont be disabled or its fckd

[user104658]

He has a fox in his hat. And a couple of hounds in a neaby cage, which will be released for the amusement of Tory MPs.

[bots]

if he was going for gold it would be producing a pig from his hat :joker:

[_Tom_]

Cannot stand the constant "nyeaaaah, yeeeah, yeeeah" :umm2:

[Crimson Dynamo]

if he was going for gold it would be producing a pig from his hat :joker:

:joker:

[arista]

Cannot stand the constant "nyeaaaah, yeeeah, yeeeah" :umm2:



Put Subtitles on

[_Tom_]

Put Subtitles on

Subtitles are useless on live programmes :laugh:

I can't watch this anymore it's driving me insane. http://www.pic4ever.com/images/4fvgdaq_th.gif I'll watch the summary later.

[arista]

Subtitles are useless on live programmes :laugh:

I can't watch this anymore it's driving me insane. http://www.pic4ever.com/images/4fvgdaq_th.gif I'll watch the summary later.


OK

[arista]

Nice to 3 Channels Choice

ITV1HD Tom Bradby with Robert Preston
BBC2HD Huw Edwards and his team
SkyNewsHD Adam Bolton and his team

[bots]

The downgrade on growth forecasts means the economy will be stagnant now until at least 2020

[arista]

No Business Rates for small shops

Thats Good


Stamp Duty Down


and up on deals over £5million from midnight tonight

http://news.images.itv.com/image/file/928084/top_category_img.jpg

[arista]

"We Are The Builders" he says again

Feck me
CassetteBoy on YouTube
please do a new remix.

[MTVN]

Severn tolls to be halved :clap2:

[arista]

Sugar Tax comes in
Soft drinks but in 2 fecking years time



I would have given them 6months

[smudgie]

:fist:
Someone please turn Mr Shouty man's microphone down...and while they are at it, tell him to discuss the Budget, not a load of crap written well before that has not a lot to do with it.

[MTVN]

Yeah not heard Corbyn actually say much about the budget yet

[Cherie]

Cut off from the life time isa :fist:

[smudgie]

I really want to know how all these people on PIP are going to lose £150 a week when the highest payment is less than £140 .:shrug:
Get your facts right or your argument is hollow.

[_Tom_]

I personally think the sugar tax is a fantatastic idea.

[Cherie]

I really want to know how all these people on PIP are going to lose £150 a week when the highest payment is less than £140 .:shrug:
Get your facts right or your argument is hollow.

Must be a month :suspect:

[arista]

I personally think the sugar tax is a fantatastic idea.


Yes but two years away
is wrong

[arista]

Yeah not heard Corbyn actually say much about the budget yet

Yes he made it Total Politics
his Left
our Right.


Crazy - nothing to do with this

[arista]

[George Osborne unveils his Budget for the 'next generation'
as he stuns MPs with a sugar tax, offers a lifetime of tax free savings to the
young and spends £1.5billion to extend the school day

Growth forecasts from the OBR are sharply down and debt has not fallen
But Osborne said there would still be a £10billion surplus by 2020
He announced a sugar tax on soft drinks to be imposed in two years time
Overhaul of corporation tax cutting rate but raising £9bn from big firms
Councils and courts could be cut while disability benefit due to be slashed
Chancellor has already revealed £1.5billion to fund a longer school day
He will also back new railways, roads and a tunnel under the Pennines
Fuel, beer and spirits duty all frozen but wine and cigarette taxes up ]


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3494714/George-Osborne-warn-storm-clouds-gathering-economy-today-s-Budget-generation-money-schools-infrastructure.html#ixzz434ibSHBy

[billy123]

Ouch i will be interested in hearing what Tory voter The Truth has to say about the capital gains tax changes for second home owners. This is the second time in 6 months Osbourne has smeared faeces in the face of Landlords after raising stamp duty in the Autumn.
I wonder if The real Truth is hitting home yet what money grubbers the Tories are.

[smudgie]

Must be a month :suspect:

Hmmm possibly, but it keeps getting quoted as weekly.:shrug:

[billy123]

hBTnj1myKWg

[arista]

hBTnj1myKWg


Yes take your Glasses off
misery Taxi Driver


This was recorded before the Budget you Ponce

[Cherie]

In fairness what is the point of that guy shouting : umm2: every government has made unpopular decisions, what can we do about it at the moment :shrug:

[arista]

In fairness what is the point of that guy shouting : umm2: every government has made unpopular decisions, what can we do about it at the moment :shrug:


Sure Cherie

But this Live thread needs a Video "After" the Budget
not before it

Typical of Bob

[joeysteele]

I bit of a non event and again with unspecified cuts to be made in 2 to 3 years time too.
Budgets rarely are exciting events but one thing that does stand out, this guy hardly ever r comes back with his next budget carrying on as to real progress from his last budget.

He always has to downgrade forecasts and warn of difficult times to come,of course there are always difficult times to come,however had he really and properly prepared for them, then he would not need to be downgrading targets, again!!!

However the scene is now set, he is determined to try at least to get a surplus by 2020, which although not necessary and certainly not worth the pain inflicted on and the taking away of benefits from the most vulnerable,he may manage it by his ducking and diving and holding off good revenues for the next 2 to 3 years to give him a higher tan normal intake of revenues at that time.

However, a telling moment was this, which although likely true, is also a possible get out clause for him too.
He stressed these new downgraded targets are based on the UK remaining in the EU.
I think he is right in that they could be maybe achievable in that context.
However if we leave the EU he can come back should there then result in bad figures and say, had we stayed in the EU this would not have happened.

Not then his fault as he based all on our continued membership and success within the EU.

As for the sugar tax, a very selective one a that,I agree with all as to milk shakes and other sugar products too being included.
Pretty much a non event and much of it expected anyway.

[arista]

"I bit of a non event and again with unspecified cuts to be made in 2 to 3 years time too."

Yes Joey thats Wrong , I agree


But Jamie Oliver
loves George for the Sugar Tax

But its in 2 years

I would have given the Coca Cola's fecking 6 Months
they are tough enough to deal with that

[billy123]

This was recorded before the Budget you Ponce



But this Live thread needs a Video "After" the Budget
not before it

Typical of BobWind your neck in with your calling people ponces (that is used as very nasty slur by some people) and and your weird "Typical bob" comments. It was recorded and uploaded today dont be bitter. How embarrassing for you.

[billy123]

In fairness what is the point of that guy shouting : umm2: every government has made unpopular decisions, what can we do about it at the moment :shrug:
Yes god forbid anybody giving a **** and show any anger about the tory scum ripping the heart out of the country and sharing it out between their rich mates :joker:

[arista]

Wind your neck in with your calling people ponces (that is used as very nasty slur by some people) and and your weird "Typical bob" comments. It was recorded and uploaded today dont be bitter. How embarrassing for you.


The Bloke in the Video
is a Ponce.

Not You Bob.



Yes the Video is Today , Bob
AM today well before the Fecking Budget

[Cherie]

Yes god forbid anybody giving a **** and show any anger about the tory scum ripping the heart out of the country and sharing it out between their rich mates :joker:

I'm not saying that, playing the angry cabbie and uploading a video onto youtube is helping how?

[Kizzy]

Mr Joe public cabbie is bang on.
How is it helping?... it isn't, it can't we're bolloxed. He's just showing how he feels. and he's not alone, he's right about the whole lot though.

[Beso]

what about the 3.5 billion uk wide cuts he's hidden in the small print!

[DemolitionRed]

Well, it was a great day for tax avoidance if nothing else. I have a limited company and my accountant is nearly wetting himself with excitement.

[user104658]

Well, it was a great day for tax avoidance if nothing else. I have a limited company and my accountant is nearly wetting himself with excitement.
Reckon your accountant needs to get out more tbh...

[DemolitionRed]

Reckon your accountant needs to get out more tbh...

Yeah accountants tend to get excited easily but this is a biggie...if you want to avoid paying tax that is.

Both him and every accountant and capital gains tax adviser in the land now have something new to sell and come tomorrow their phones are going to be ringing none stop.

[Kizzy]

Yeah accountants tend to get excited easily but this is a biggie...if you want to avoid paying tax that is.

Both him and every accountant and capital gains tax adviser in the land now have something new to sell and come tomorrow their phones are going to be ringing none stop.

Something to sell?... That's rather cryptic, come on spill :)

[DemolitionRed]

Something to sell?... That's rather cryptic, come on spill :)

Advice on how to avoid tax costs money!

[Kizzy]

Advice on how to avoid tax costs money!

Ah right I get you :laugh:

[arista]

http://media.skynews.com/media/images/generated/2016/3/16/453180/default/v1/sun-1-992x558.jpg

http://media.skynews.com/media/images/generated/2016/3/16/453183/default/v1/thei-1-992x558.jpg

http://media.skynews.com/media/images/generated/2016/3/16/453179/default/v1/mail2-1-992x558.jpg

http://media.skynews.com/media/images/generated/2016/3/16/453170/default/v1/metro-1-992x558.jpg

http://media.skynews.com/media/images/generated/2016/3/16/453168/default/v1/ft-1-992x558.jpg

http://media.skynews.com/media/images/generated/2016/3/16/453185/default/v1/newday-1-992x558.jpg

[Kizzy]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/watch-george-osborne-stay-completely-stony-faced-as-he-is-told-about-the-impact-of-his-disability-a6936161.html

[Cherie]

Fizzy Rascal :joker: the levy will hit the poor most :umm2: who reads this crap

[Cherie]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/watch-george-osborne-stay-completely-stony-faced-as-he-is-told-about-the-impact-of-his-disability-a6936161.html

I never really looked at him before his face is like plastic

[Kizzy]

Omg ... it's from Leeds! He's here Cherie save me!! The attack of the lizard people has begun :(

[arista]

Fizzy Rascal :joker: the levy will hit the poor most :umm2: who reads this crap


Working Class of UK
love the Sun

[Cherie]

Omg ... it's from Leeds! He's here Cherie save me!! The attack of the lizard people has begun :(

Hold my hand Kizzy, I wont let you be sucked in...ahhhhhhh

[arista]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/watch-george-osborne-stay-completely-stony-faced-as-he-is-told-about-the-impact-of-his-disability-a6936161.html


Yes its regrettable
Kizzy

[Kizzy]

Hold my hand Kizzy, I wont let you be sucked in...ahhhhhhh

https://confessionsofasomedaysomebody.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/tumblr_m9ypksodqi1rujapqo6_250.gif?w=430

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view5/2804869/poltergeist-door-monster-o.gif

[arista]

Blame Ed Miliband - Kizzy
he let you down Big Time
no chance of getting Elected

[Kizzy]

Blame Ed Miliband - Kizzy
he let you down Big Time
no chance of getting Elected

No, I I'll blame the people responsible thanks.

[Kizzy]

Working Class of UK
love the Sun

Rollocks

[DemolitionRed]

Blame Ed Miliband - Kizzy
he let you down Big Time
no chance of getting Elected

Eh?
What has Ed Miliband got to do with this?
I love how Tory supporters now want to say "it's labours fault or its Lib Dems fault as well"

[DemolitionRed]

Working Class of UK
love the Sun

Give the working class a break why don't ya. The Sun is purchased mainly by young people because of its high volume of gossip and heavy helping of entertainment news.

[billy123]

Working Class of UK
love the SunWash your mouth out you dirty boy.
I can only put your recent behaviour on here down to boredom arista.
Now pull your socks up and stop being so silly. :joker:

[DemolitionRed]

Please, do shed a tear for Graeme Ellis who voted Tory for 50 years while they were fecking everyone else up and quit when it directly affected him.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tory-disability-campaigner-quits-sabotages-7570599

[arista]

No, I I'll blame the people responsible thanks.


But those Labour people were saying Change Ed.


And because they left Your Ed in Place
they refused to vote him in.

New Labour - Old Labour Confusion

[DemolitionRed]

But those Labour people were saying Change Ed.


And because the Left Your Ed in Place
they refused to vote him in.

New Labour - Old Labour Confusion

:huh:

[arista]

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/03/17/09/32442B7B00000578-3496512-image-a-17_1458205613790.jpg

[billy123]

The howling like monkeys that comes from the tory pigs speaks volumes to me and i hope most people.
They dont want to hear the reality of what they are doing to ordinary people in this country.

3W7BD4Z6Q4s


Even Tory backbenchers can see what a disgrace this government is and are calling for a rethink.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/mar/16/disability-benefit-cut-budget-sparks-tory-backbenchers-call-for-rethink

[Kizzy]

But those Labour people were saying Change Ed.


And because they left Your Ed in Place
they refused to vote him in.

New Labour - Old Labour Confusion

Still has zero to with what the tories have done/are doing/will do.

[Kizzy]

http://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/styles/story_medium/public/thumbnails/image/2016/03/17/16/ifs-budget-analysis-graph.jpg

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/budget-2016-one-simple-chart-that-shows-who-benefits-most-and-who-loses-out-a6936876.html

[DemolitionRed]

The Institute for Fiscal Studies warned if the Budget forecasts were right we should all be worried.
This will lead to lower wages and living standards, not just lower tax revenues for the Treasury.

http://news.sky.com/story/1661773/britons-face-pay-cut-after-budget-ifs-says

[joeysteele]

Well the sugar and sweetness that may have been contained in this budget has well and truly been removed.
This has surely turned into a pr nightmare for Osborne and the cheering PM at his side.

[DemolitionRed]

An absolute nightmare. Osborne and Cameron are a dangerous cocktail to our economy. Balancing their books on the backs of the poor isn't working and for all his boasting about austerity, Osbourne has borrowed more millions than anybody.

[arista]

Give the working class a break why don't ya. The Sun is purchased mainly by young people because of its high volume of gossip and heavy helping of entertainment news.


Valid Points DR

[arista]

I think this was this on the other thread IDS.

The New DWP man (Stephen Crabb)
has said there will be No more reduction of PIP.
Ref : Local radio (played on SkyNewsHD).

So the budget will have
to find other reductions of something else.


So Cheer Up Corbyn!

[smudgie]

Just a thought, we better keep an eye on our pension pots.next on the list to be raided.
Ring fence will fall by the wayside I think.
Pension reform would have just been the start.
Might be better off taking the beggar out ourselves, probably lose less in the long run?:shrug:

[kirklancaster]

Just a thought, we better keep an eye on our pension pots.next on the list to be raided.
Ring fence will fall by the wayside I think.
Pension reform would have just been the start.
Might be better off taking the beggar out ourselves, probably lose less in the long run?:shrug:

The average pension is pretty useless Smudgie, if inflation doesn't render it valueless, some Government, somewhere at sometime, WILL - as you say - come up with ever ingenious methods of raiding it.

[kirklancaster]

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/03/17/09/32442B7B00000578-3496512-image-a-17_1458205613790.jpg

"OFFICE OF BUDGET RESPONSIBILITY WARNS OF BREXIT RISKS"!!!! WTF!!!!

These self-serving charalatans know no limits to the propaganda they spout to protect their interests, and they love using tax-payers money and Government resources to spread such scare-mongering.

Mind you Arista, 'tis only what a lot of our 'rebate' from the EU gets spent on -- funding Pro-EU companies within the UK who work solely on producing pro-EU propaganda.

Why change a 'Winning Formula' - no matter how 'bent'.

[arista]

Osborne is live on the Parliament Channel only
As the Terrorist Bombs in Belgium is above all news on other channels



http://parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/d32599c4-5705-46f1-be88-ed2a40dd319e
Slight Delay


Live Channel

[Kizzy]

Laughing fool.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/george-osborne-pip-cuts-disabled-disability-laughs-house-of-commons-john-mcdonnell-parliament-a6946176.html

[Kizzy]

http://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/styles/story_medium/public/thumbnails/image/2016/03/17/16/ifs-budget-analysis-graph.jpg

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/budget-2016-one-simple-chart-that-shows-who-benefits-most-and-who-loses-out-a6936876.html

Nicky morgan confronted with this data...

http://www.thecanary.co/2016/03/22/government-minister-lost-words-sees-budget-will-hit-poor-video/

[DemolitionRed]

Nicky morgan confronted with this data...

http://www.thecanary.co/2016/03/22/government-minister-lost-words-sees-budget-will-hit-poor-video/

She was a rabbit caught in the headlights Kizzy.... Silly cow.

[Kizzy]

How do you solve a problem like Maria? :joker:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/angela-eagles-powerful-speech-mauling-7609958

[Kizzy]

How can anyone have any faith in George or this govt....How?

'Government debt has increased by £555 billion since George Osborne took office in 2010, the latest official figures show.

The Office for National Statistics said this week the Government had borrowed £70.7 billion pounds in the first 11 months of the current financial year.
Barring a major last-minute turnaround before the year ends next month, the Chancellor is likely to borrow more than his forecast for this year of £72.2 billion.

With inflation at zero and growth rates far from booming the Government is yet see real public debt falling as a percentage of the economy – the most important measure for assessing the public finances.

The Office for Budget Responsibility – the Government’s spending watchdog – cut its growth and deficit reduction forecasts in new projections revealed in the Budget a week ago.

The fiscal watchdog, which is in charge of official economic forecasts, said GDP would actually only grow by 2 per cent instead of 2.4 per cent in 2016.'

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/the-uk-national-debt-has-risen-by-555-billion-since-2010-under-george-osborne-a6947661.html

[DemolitionRed]

How can anyone have any faith in George or this govt....How?

'Government debt has increased by £555 billion since George Osborne took office in 2010, the latest official figures show.

The Office for National Statistics said this week the Government had borrowed £70.7 billion pounds in the first 11 months of the current financial year.
Barring a major last-minute turnaround before the year ends next month, the Chancellor is likely to borrow more than his forecast for this year of £72.2 billion.

With inflation at zero and growth rates far from booming the Government is yet see real public debt falling as a percentage of the economy – the most important measure for assessing the public finances.

The Office for Budget Responsibility – the Government’s spending watchdog – cut its growth and deficit reduction forecasts in new projections revealed in the Budget a week ago.

The fiscal watchdog, which is in charge of official economic forecasts, said GDP would actually only grow by 2 per cent instead of 2.4 per cent in 2016.'

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/the-uk-national-debt-has-risen-by-555-billion-since-2010-under-george-osborne-a6947661.html

I don't know anyone who does Kizzy. Even my conservative friends want Osborne to resign.

[user104658]

I don't know anyone who does Kizzy. Even my conservative friends want Osborne to resign.

Politically aware people, maybe. The ones who count - the swing votes - the "current casual Tories" who don't really take much to do with politics other than vaguely sometimes reading the papers and then going out to vote are sadly still just as duped as they were when they bought into the bulls**t back in 2010. They believe that the previous Labour government made a big mess and got us into loads of debt, and that Cameron / Osborne / the current Government have "balanced the books" with their austerity measures.

[Kizzy]

Politically aware people, maybe. The ones who count - the swing votes - the "current casual Tories" who don't really take much to do with politics other than vaguely sometimes reading the papers and then going out to vote are sadly still just as duped as they were when they bought into the bulls**t back in 2010. They believe that the previous Labour government made a big mess and got us into loads of debt, and that Cameron / Osborne / the current Government have "balanced the books" with their austerity measures.

Ignorant snobs then? Yeah figured as much.

[kirklancaster]

Ignorant snobs then? Yeah figured as much.

Where do you get the 'snob' part from in what T.S. said?

[DemolitionRed]

Politically aware people, maybe. The ones who count - the swing votes - the "current casual Tories" who don't really take much to do with politics other than vaguely sometimes reading the papers and then going out to vote are sadly still just as duped as they were when they bought into the bulls**t back in 2010. They believe that the previous Labour government made a big mess and got us into loads of debt, and that Cameron / Osborne / the current Government have "balanced the books" with their austerity measures.

Conservatism is a really interesting ideology...well actually its many interesting ideologies and this is why so many 'traditional' conservatives are now standing up against these neoliberal charlatans and saying "enough". Neoliberal conservatism is very much a contradiction of every other conservative ideology and so if they want to survive politically, some changes will need to take place.

I just ignore those who still believe the Labour party brought this country into disrepute and that the conservatives are the ones trying to restore our country because they simply haven't been interested enough to find out the truth and if they are not interested enough to follow general politics from all sides, then they aren't going to be interested in anything I have to say.

[Kizzy]

Where do you get the 'snob' part from in what T.S. said?

That was only my interpretation you understand?

[MTVN]

I disagree with most of the blanket assumptions in the few posts above

[Kizzy]

I disagree with most of the blanket assumptions in the few posts above

Why don't you just pick one and we'll go from there?..

[DemolitionRed]

I disagree with most of the blanket assumptions in the few posts above

That conservatism is an interesting ideology?

[joeysteele]

Politically aware people, maybe. The ones who count - the swing votes - the "current casual Tories" who don't really take much to do with politics other than vaguely sometimes reading the papers and then going out to vote are sadly still just as duped as they were when they bought into the bulls**t back in 2010. They believe that the previous Labour government made a big mess and got us into loads of debt, and that Cameron / Osborne / the current Government have "balanced the books" with their austerity measures.

Good post again TS.
I was more a Conservative in 2010 although I voted Lib Dem, however I did not hold Labour responsible for the financial banking crash that came.
In fact I feel it may have been worse as David Cameron said Labour was regulating the Banks too much.
So he would have regulated them less had he been in power.

I did feel they could have done more in govt to prepare for harder times but that financial crash hit all major Nations around the World.
I thought Labour did the best it could in the circumstances and also did get us out of recession by 2009 and also had us heading back to around 1% growth too by the time 2010 came in.

[MTVN]

Why don't you just pick one and we'll go from there?..

Well the idea that the only Tories who still back Osborne are those who are not 'politically aware'. I also think that its a straw man that people blame Labour for causing the crash - very few people actually think that. There is, however, a very strong case to say that we were very unprepared for it and unable to react accordingly.

That conservatism is an interesting ideology?

Nah don't have a problem with that, every ideology is interesting

[Kizzy]

Well the idea that the only Tories who still back Osborne are those who are not 'politically aware'. I also think that its a straw man that people blame Labour for causing the crash - very few people actually think that. There is, however, a very strong case to say that we were very unprepared for it and unable to react accordingly.




You have to admit they have been shedding voters like lepers lose skin cells, and would have to be a dyed in the wool true blue steadfast tory to back him, have been living under a rock or be incredibly ignorant to suggest he is an effective chancellor.
Many people do think that Labour were instrumental in the crash, ' the mess left by Labour' is a phrase trotted out as often on here as it is on PMQs literally once a week at least.
What are we prepared for now, we've created our own mini recession, who will be blamed for that if not gideon?

[DemolitionRed]

Well the idea that the only Tories who still back Osborne are those who are not 'politically aware'. I also think that its a straw man that people blame Labour for causing the crash - very few people actually think that. There is, however, a very strong case to say that we were very unprepared for it and unable to react accordingly.

Red herring or not, the straw man argument is always the weakest position in an argument/debate. It happens so often that I've named it 'Gideon's Law'.

[DemolitionRed]

You have to admit they have been shedding voters like lepers lose skin cells, and would have to be a dyed in the wool true blue steadfast tory to back him, have been living under a rock or be incredibly ignorant to suggest he is an effective chancellor.
Many people do think that Labour were instrumental in the crash, ' the mess left by Labour' is a phrase trotted out as often on here as it is on PMQs literally once a week at least.
What are we prepared for now, we've created our own mini recession, who will be blamed for that if not gideon?

I'm going to remember that one :joker:

[user104658]

Well the idea that the only Tories who still back Osborne are those who are not 'politically aware'.

Who said the "only" ones? What I said was, the bulk of Tory voters (because, the bulk of ALL voters, though most seem oddly hesitant to admit it) are not politically aware on a day-to-day basis. This is why election campaigning, press smearing, negative politics, etc. happens and why it works. If it's not true, then there are a lot of politicians world-wide wasting a lot of money. A LOT of money. If the majority of people were actually following politics and voting based on real policy, trustworthiness, and each party's actual record of achievements, then these campaigns would be unnecessary and ineffective.

But anyway; what I was actually saying is that there are a lot of people who take only a passing interest in politics, who believed the Tory rhetoric in the run up to 2010, and who still actively believe that Camerosborne has "sorted out the deficit" and "got the country back on the right track" with their programme of austerity and cuts, cuts, cuts. Which is false. But they believe it and voted Tory again, and will do so again next time, because "we don't want that Labour mob getting back in and spending all of the money that the Conservatives have worked so hard to save!!!".


I also think that its a straw man that people blame Labour for causing the crash - very few people actually think that. There is, however, a very strong case to say that we were very unprepared for it and unable to react accordingly.

Really? Very few? Hmm... that must be an inredibly vocal "few", then, because there are an awful lot of people still bleating it. Now, for example, I'd say it's probably true that very few people on Serious Debates and News actually think that, but by necessity the people who are here are generally interested in observing and considering politics in some depth. Not a representative example of the average voter at all. In my opinion :hee: