When posts are deleted without an explanation

[Cherie]

If posts are deleted and the reason is not due to an infraction would it be possible that a general comment is made on the thread by the mod who deleted it as to why? It seems to be happening more and more in ...yes ...SD :laugh:

[Jessica.]

I'm not known for abiding by the rules very well, but with the condition of SD at the moment, it's quite obvious why a mod would delete some posts. They are obviously trying to either prevent something escalating into an argument, removing something off-topic or it's something worthy of a warning or infraction and they're actually giving you a chance..

[Cherie]

I'm not known for abiding by the rules very well, but with the condition of SD at the moment, it's quite obvious why a mod would delete some posts. They are obviously trying to either prevent something escalating into an argument, removing something off-topic or it's something worthy of a warning or infraction and they're actually giving you a chance..

That's the point some times it's not obvious at all? If posts are removed as off topic, it's not difficult to give a quick explanation, Niamh generally goes bold for it, it's a system all mods should adopt this approach in my view.

[Kizzy]

I can't say I've noticed.. My posts don't go missing :idc:

[Jessica.]

That's the point some times it's not obvious at all? If posts are removed as off topic, it's not difficult to give a quick explanation, Niamh generally goes bold for it, it's a system all mods should adopt this approach in my view.
Well my posts have been deleted for stupid reasons before but when it comes down to it, the mods can only use their own judgement to take the action that they think is right. Yeah, I've complained about it but I'm not going to ask them to post a reason every time they delete a post. :joker:

[Crimson Dynamo]

I can't say I've noticed.. My posts don't go missing :idc:

:think:

[Cherie]

Well my posts have been deleted for stupid reasons before but when it comes down to it, the mods can only use their own judgement to take the action that they think is right. Yeah, I've complained about it but I'm not going to ask them to post a reason every time they delete a post. :joker:

So you have complained about it? So why did you bother complaining if you didn't want anything done about it :unsure: I'm sure the mods can take on board suggestions, if they can't why do we have a suggestion thread :laugh:

[Mokka]

I'll be honest... I would rather take an infraction if I posted something wrong rather than censorship without explanation. That being said... I don't want my infraction reasons to be riddled with sarcasm...just a direct reference to what it is for would be nice.

[Josy]

A lot of the time posts are removed for being part of an argument or quoting a post that is part of an argument, when something like that has happened in a thread most members taking part in the discussion will know why posts have been removed.

[Josy]

I'll be honest... I would rather take an infraction if I posted something wrong rather than censorship without explanation. That being said... I don't want my infraction reasons to be riddled with sarcasm...just a direct reference to what it is for would be nice.

Having just looked through youre entire list of infractions I can say there is not one sarcastic comment there, just some detailed reasons letting you know exactly what a warning or infraction is for.

[Mokka]

Having just looked through youre entire list of infractions I can say there is not one sarcastic comment there, just some detailed reasons letting you know exactly what a warning or infraction is for.

Well that is simply not the truth

[Josy]

Well that is simply not the truth

No it is the truth Mokka, we've been here before if I remember correctly and I had to then posts some of youre deleted comments to prove that I was telling the truth, you had nothing to say afterwards if I recall.

The fact is you possibly see something sarcastic due to not agreeing with the reasons, as I mentioned before it's only some detailed reasons as to why the infraction or warning was given in the first place.

[Cherie]

I'll be honest... I would rather take an infraction if I posted something wrong rather than censorship without explanation.

This


Are you feeling better Josy?

[Mokka]

No it is the truth Mokka, we've been before if I remember correctly and I had to then posts some of youre deleted comments to prove that I was telling the truth, you had nothing to say afterwards if I recall.

The fact is you possibly see something sarcastic due to not agreeing with the reasons, as I mentioned before it's only some detailed reasons as to why the infraction or warning was given in the first place.

No Josy.
I wasn't posting on the site when you decided to release half of my deleted post....edited for your convenience... in the time you referenced. So it wasn't that I had nothing to say... it was that I wasn't here.
Also, I would prefer a mod who is not giving my infractions to read through and decide what is sarcasm and what is an actual reason for an infraction... because you are not very good at regulating yourself...let's be honest

[smudgie]

Only had one post deleted to my knowledge, and on reflecting about it I realised it was probably called for in the interest of keeping the peace.
No complaints here.

[Josy]

This


Are you feeling better Josy?

I'm not too bad thank you Cherie.

I will mention in the admin forum about a comment being posted when posts are removed.

No Josy.
I wasn't posting on the site when you decided to release half of my deleted post....edited for your convenience... in the time you referenced. So it wasn't that I had nothing to say... it was that I wasn't here.
Also, I would prefer a mod who is not giving my infractions to read through and decide what is sarcasm and what is an actual reason for an infraction... because you are not very good at regulating yourself...let's be honest

There's an infraction from plenty of mods on the list, you're hardly being targeted.

I'm as fair as I possibly can be on here, as are all the other mods but there's always certain members that can never accept when they are wrong and then try turning it around on the person infracting them.

I pasted the entire comment that day Mokka, the long one you posted that was clearly designed to cause trouble and unrest in a fun light hearted thread due to you being unhappy at one of your friends being banned, but this is way off topic.

[Mokka]

I'm not too bad thank you Cherie.

I will mention in the admin forum about a comment being posted when posts are removed.



There's an infraction from plenty of mods on the list, you're hardly being targeted.

I'm as fair as I possibly can be on here, as are all the other mods but there's always certain members that can never accept when they are wrong and then try turning it around on the person infracting them.

I pasted the entire comment that day Mokka, the long one you posted that was clearly designed to cause trouble and unrest in a fun light hearted thread due to you being unhappy at one of your friends being banned, but this is way off topic.

More untruths ... you did not post the entire comment Josy. But that's fine. You have the power to spin the tale you want...and I have posts deleted and no proof to show the truth.... which is what the heart of this thread is. The people in control can censor and edit what they want... and the users of the site have no voice.

[Josy]

More untruths ... you did not post the entire comment Josy. But that's fine. You have the power to spin the tale you want...and I have posts deleted and no proof to show the truth.... which is what the heart of this thread is. The people in control can censor and edit what they want... and the users of the site have no voice.

I posted the entire paragraph that you posted and then had removed.

As I mentioned this is off topic so if you can wait til I'm home later I will try look up the thread and actually send you the quotes and a screenshot from it, what you think I have to gain from posting untruths about your comments I have no idea but I generally don't have the time nor the energy to go to all of that trouble tbh.

Can we get back on topic now please.

[Mokka]

I posted the entire paragraph that you posted and then had removed.

As I mentioned this is off topic so if you can wait til I'm home later I will try look up the thread and actually send you the quotes and a screenshot from it, what you think I have to gain from posting untruths about your comments I have no idea but I generally don't have the time nor the energy to go to all of that trouble tbh.

Can we get back on topic now please.

You brought it up in some kind of exposè about me...but sure let's drop it. I honestly don't care. It doesn't take away from my argument in this thread that deletion of posts without explanation is censorship.

[Cherie]

I'm not too bad thank you Cherie.

I will mention in the admin forum about a comment being posted when posts are removed.

.

That's great Josy thanks :love:

[kirklancaster]

Do I address MY contentions that your statement is not true in ALL cases on here Josy? Or in a pm to you?

Not only have I had COMPLETELY INNOCUOUS posts removed without ANY genuine reason, I have had subsequent posts INSTANTLY removed which simply asked "Why has my innocuous post been removed when it has breached no rules at all?"

I recently had 6 posts removed - ONE AFTER THE OTHER - just as soon as I posted them:

The first was a civil rebuttal response to a Mod who had made accusations against me in a post.

When it was removed not a nano second after I had submitted it, I posted a benign post asking why it had been removed.

When THAT was instantly removed, I posted a STILL civil post asking why my posts were being removed and along with them my Right To Reply.

Later on that thread, the Mod involved asked another member for 'proof' to her allegation that he was not 'playing by the forum's own rules' or words to that effect" and in response to his invitation for 'proof', I posted simply that "My proof keeps being removed".

For which simple INNOCENT TRUTH I enjoyed a Warning:

Report Private Message Private Message: You have received a warning at ThisisBigBrother.com - UK TV Forums
28-10-2016, 03:08 PM
TiBB Staff
Junior Member
TiBB Staff

Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 0
Default You have received a warning at ThisisBigBrother.com - UK TV Forums
Dear kirklancaster,

You have received a warning at ThisisBigBrother.com - UK TV Forums.

Reason:
-------
You have been here long enough to know that when posts are deleted you don't keep bringing them up especially just to cause more drama or derail a thread.


-------

Original Post:
http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9033013
Quote:
My PROOF keeps being removed???

Warnings serve as a reminder to you of the forum's rules, which you are expected to understand and follow.

All the best,
ThisisBigBrother.com - UK TV Forums
.................................................. .......

I have kept all relevant threads and can produce the above verbatim if need be, along with Warnings and Infractions for such totally innocent posts as:

posting CIVILLY to a member who I was debating with "I'm sorry, but you are simply not making any sense" - when SHE WAS NOT making any sense.

And again, for posting a good-natured humorous response to a member who had JUST posted the EXACT words I was about to post:

"You took the words right out of my mouth"

Did either of the above REALLY warrant punishment? Especially when so many far more grave and GENUINE breaches of forum rules are seen to be ALLOWED on a daily basis?

Did my posts above really deserve to be removed?

I would welcome a civil answer to be honest.

[Tom4784]

No Josy.
I wasn't posting on the site when you decided to release half of my deleted post....edited for your convenience... in the time you referenced. So it wasn't that I had nothing to say... it was that I wasn't here.
Also, I would prefer a mod who is not giving my infractions to read through and decide what is sarcasm and what is an actual reason for an infraction... because you are not very good at regulating yourself...let's be honest

I've just looked through your infractions, There's nothing wrong with them and I imagine any other mod would say the same.

[Denver]

all my posts were deleted when i told everyone the difference between Panseual and Bisexual

[Tom4784]

Do I address MY contentions that your statement is not true in ALL cases on here Josy? Or in a pm to you?

Not only have I had COMPLETELY INNOCUOUS posts removed without ANY genuine reason, I have had subsequent posts INSTANTLY removed which simply asked "Why has my innocuous post been removed when it has breached no rules at all?"

I recently had 6 posts removed - ONE AFTER THE OTHER - just as soon as I posted them:

The first was a civil rebuttal response to a Mod who had made accusations against me in a post.

When it was removed not a nano second after I had submitted it, I posted a benign post asking why it had been removed.

When THAT was instantly removed, I posted a STILL civil post asking why my posts were being removed and along with them my Right To Reply.

Later on that thread, the Mod involved asked another member for 'proof' to her allegation that he was not 'playing by the forum's own rules' or words to that effect" and in response to his invitation for 'proof', I posted simply that "My proof keeps being removed".

For which simple INNOCENT TRUTH I enjoyed a Warning:

Report Private Message Private Message: You have received a warning at ThisisBigBrother.com - UK TV Forums
28-10-2016, 03:08 PM
TiBB Staff
Junior Member
TiBB Staff

Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 0
Default You have received a warning at ThisisBigBrother.com - UK TV Forums
Dear kirklancaster,

You have received a warning at ThisisBigBrother.com - UK TV Forums.

Reason:
-------
You have been here long enough to know that when posts are deleted you don't keep bringing them up especially just to cause more drama or derail a thread.


-------

Original Post:
http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9033013
Quote:
My PROOF keeps being removed???

Warnings serve as a reminder to you of the forum's rules, which you are expected to understand and follow.

All the best,
ThisisBigBrother.com - UK TV Forums
.................................................. .......

I have kept all relevant threads and can produce the above verbatim if need be, along with Warnings and Infractions for such totally innocent posts as:

posting CIVILLY to a member who I was debating with "I'm sorry, but you are simply not making any sense" - when SHE WAS NOT making any sense.

And again, for posting a good-natured humorous response to a member who had JUST posted the EXACT words I was about to post:

"You took the words right out of my mouth"

Did either of the above REALLY warrant punishment? Especially when so many far more grave and GENUINE breaches of forum rules are seen to be ALLOWED on a daily basis?

Did my posts above really deserve to be removed?

I would welcome a civil answer to be honest.

I think the warning speaks for itself.

We delete offending posts and any posts that reference those posts, you know that if you continue to post about deleted posts after they've been removed then you run the risk of being infracted because it basically continues any deleted drama and derails the thread.

You know what to do if you need clarification on a deleted post and posting about it in the thread itself isn't it.

[kirklancaster]

I think the warning speaks for itself.

We delete offending posts and any posts that reference those posts, you know that if you continue to post about deleted posts after they've been removed then you run the risk of being infracted because it basically continues any deleted drama and derails the thread.

You know what to do if you need clarification on a deleted post and posting about it in the thread itself isn't it.

I was addressing my questions directly to Josy, but perhaps as the Mod in question - you could tell me what to do? Should I pm you?

And the 'warning' most certainly DOES NOT speak for itself - for a start it is a private culmination of a very public and distasteful, unfair and unethical sequence of actions perpetrated by a MODERATOR against me.

You made an uninvited post about me on a thread on this forum which contained numerous wrongful allegations about me and I responded CIVILLY to rebut and refute those allegations.

My RESPONSE was removed.

When I posted to CIVILLY ask why you had removed it. That response was almost instantly removed also.

And so on and so forth - 6 times - until I had no choice but to give up trying to exercise my 'Right To Reply'.

[Tom4784]

Perhaps as the Mod in question - you could tell me what to do? Should I pm you?

Yes, I'll be happy to clarify why posts are deleted. One of the reasons why we often don't often mention why posts are deleted in the thread itself is because it draws attention to the deleted drama and people will talk about that rather than the subject matter.

[Maru]

I appreciate that mods are here to offer up explanations as there does appear to be some dissension on the matter. Personally, I've never had anything deleted, edited or removed on TiBB... so I can't say for sure anything...

However, on other sites I used to receive PMs when posts were removed, edited, when threads were moved etc... some places the edits were made on the post and an explanation towards the end... (probably should poll users before doing this to see if it is appropriate)

I think this works far more effectively than a non-explanation and even in some cases better than an infraction... doesn't need to be an exhaustive rundown, just short and to the point explanation. Maybe one or two sentences. It invites a response, a little more work sometimes on the front end for a mod :laugh:, but it does give the affected user a chance to explain their problematic post, allowing room for mutual respect to occur, and hopefully to prevent further issues in the future... which imo, is not only is more transparent for user, but for the mod but for the user... makes it easier to mod discussions over time as some users get the message quicker and can build rapport (lead to less micro mgmt)... then you can focus solely on taking care of the true bad guys :laugh:... because you see better the intention of some people's writing styles and can correct them accordingly, and not witnessing an increasingly disaffected user who feels continually impeded when making arguments in highly contested threads.

[Mokka]

I've just looked through your infractions, There's nothing wrong with them and I imagine any other mod would say the same.

Private
Reason: Not sure why you have such a problem with this kid but if you could use the ignore function and stop with the baiting these warnings/infractions would not be needed
16-10-2016 02:56 PM by TiBB Staff 16-01-2017 02:56 PM

I have no problem with the person on question...and they appear to have a problem with me if they are reporting me a lot...but that still doesn't tell me what my infraction was for .... it is just a targeted statement insinuating I have some sort of malicious intent...which I don't

Private
Reason: Seriously uncalled for.
22-08-2016 03:39 PM by TiBB Staff 22-11-2016 03:39 PM

I actually have no idea what I said that was seriously uncalled for?? :shrug: if I did I would never have posted it. How can I alter or change my actions for the better on the forum if I have no idea what rule I broke?

Profile Warning
Reason: No need for pathetic snipes at staff when using the report button, as told to you numerous times before other peoples infractions or the reason for them are nothing to do with you!earlier

Calling my comment pathetic sniping is baiting and insulting and sarcastic commenting. Just say the last part... no need to insult when giving an infraction

These are all examples from my first page of infractions...most recent.
Moderation implies impartiality and decorum....even in the face of nondecorum... this is some of what I am referring to... but I have seen others get far worse then me from the mods on here... and I my comments on here are not just about my account

[Cherie]

I appreciate that mods are here to offer up explanations as there does appear to be some dissension on the matter. Personally, I've never had anything deleted, edited or removed on TiBB... so I can't say for sure anything...

However, on other sites I used to receive PMs when posts were removed, edited, when threads were moved etc... some places the edits were made on the post and an explanation towards the end... (probably should poll users before doing this to see if it is appropriate)

I think this works far more effectively than a non-explanation and even in some cases better than an infraction... doesn't need to be an exhaustive rundown, just short and to the point explanation. Maybe one or two sentences. It invites a response, a little more work sometimes on the front end for a mod :laugh:, but it does give the affected user a chance to explain their problematic post, allowing room for mutual respect to occur, and hopefully to prevent further issues in the future... which imo, is not only is more transparent for user, but for the mod but for the user... makes it easier to mod discussions over time as some users get the message quicker and can build rapport (lead to less micro mgmt)... then you can focus solely on taking care of the true bad guys :laugh:... because you see better the intention of some people's writing styles and can correct them accordingly, and not witnessing an increasingly disaffected user who feels continually impeded when making arguments in highly contested threads.

What Maru said :laugh: that pinpoints my thoughts on the matter beautifully

[Maru]

Profile Warning
Reason: No need for pathetic snipes at staff when using the report button, as told to you numerous times before other peoples infractions or the reason for them are nothing to do with you!earlier

Wow. Yeah. Moderating is certainly a real drag sometimes... but to me this is counterproductive as you've just sniped at the user you told not to snipe (even worse it feels more personal)... no good result can occur. Try saying something like this to a customer or client who is being combatant...(well if you weren't so bitchy with your complaints :nono:).. see if their reaction improves. Spoiler: It won't. The manager will be called (always great when that happens :laugh:) and they will feel even more entitled to their position... which means it'll take more to satisfy them and calm them down... my view.

[Mokka]

Wow. Yeah. Moderating is certainly a real drag sometimes... but to me this is counterproductive as you've just sniped at the user you told not to snipe (even worse it feels more personal)... no good result can occur. Try saying something like this to a customer or client who is being combatant...(well if you weren't so bitchy with your complaints :nono:).. see if their reaction improves. Spoiler: It won't. The manager will be called (always great when that happens :laugh:) and they will feel even more entitled to their position... which means it'll take more to satisfy them and calm them down... my view.

Exactly... I would never say something like this to a client or customer with a complaint... and I deal with complaints on a daily basis as part of my job description

[kirklancaster]

Yes, I'll be happy to clarify why posts are deleted. One of the reasons why we often don't often mention why posts are deleted in the thread itself is because it draws attention to the deleted drama and people will talk about that rather than the subject matter.

To be fair to you, I think you responded to my post just as I was editing it and adding to it, so you may have missed the full post.

I the hope of securing a straight answer, I reproduce it here:

"I was addressing my questions directly to Josy, but perhaps as the Mod in question - you could tell me what to do? Should I pm you?

And the 'warning' most certainly DOES NOT speak for itself - for a start it is a private culmination of a very public and distasteful, unfair and unethical sequence of actions perpetrated by a MODERATOR against me.

You made an uninvited post about me on a thread on this forum which contained numerous wrongful allegations about me and I responded CIVILLY to rebut and refute those allegations.

My RESPONSE was removed.

When I posted to CIVILLY ask why you had removed it. That response was almost instantly removed also.

And so on and so forth - 6 times - until I had no choice but to give up trying to exercise my 'Right To Reply'.

...........................................

[kirklancaster]

Wow. Yeah. Moderating is certainly a real drag sometimes... but to me this is counterproductive as you've just sniped at the user you told not to snipe (even worse it feels more personal)... no good result can occur. Try saying something like this to a customer or client who is being combatant...(well if you weren't so bitchy with your complaints :nono:).. see if their reaction improves. Spoiler: It won't. The manager will be called (always great when that happens :laugh:) and they will feel even more entitled to their position... which means it'll take more to satisfy them and calm them down... my view.

:clap1::clap1::clap1:

[Jessica.]

I don't think anyone complaining in this thread would do a good job at being a mod, in all honesty. The mods are still going to have to use their own judgement and when they tell you the reason you're going to disagree with it anyway, so you'll still see it as a vendetta against you.

[kirklancaster]

I don't think anyone complaining in this thread would do a good job at being a mod, in all honesty. The mods are still going to have to use their own judgement and when they tell you the reason you're going to disagree with it anyway, so you'll still see it as a vendetta against you.

Not being ideal candidates for the Judiciary ourselves, does not preclude us from expecting Justice to be dispensed with impeccable honesty, impartiality, reason and erudition by those who ARE Judges, Jessica.

[Liam-]

Is a Big Brother forum really being taken this seriously?

[Mokka]

Not being ideal candidates for the Judiciary ourselves, does not preclude us from expecting Justice to be dispensed with impeccable honesty, impartiality, reason and erudition by those who ARE Judges, Jessica.

This tbh

[Liam-]

From my time on here, I don't think people get infracted for nothing and in general, if you post something, you're not really going to see what's wrong with it, otherwise you wouldn't have posted it, so obviously when you are told that it's wrong, you're clearly not going to agree that it is.

Just live and let live and get on with your day imo.

[Ammi]

..all I'll say while posting one of the forum rules which are signed up to by all...is that whatever which way, whether an explanation left in the thread or no explanation given, it won't be right for all because it's different personal preferences...and we did have an appeals section which was removed because all it mostly involved was staff becoming involved in the disgruntlements of members and no time left for moderating...and I think personally if an explanation were given for each post removal...again so much time taken away from moderating the forum which is unfair for everyone as that's why we choose to post on a moderated forum...



Staff members on the forum have the right to delete, modify or change the content of any post at any time for any reason without notification to anyone. They can also ban or restrict forum members for any reason at anytime. If a moderator edits your post on the forum do not remove the edits.

[Tom4784]

To be fair to you, I think you responded to my post just as I was editing it and adding to it, so you may have missed the full post.

I the hope of securing a straight answer, I reproduce it here:

"I was addressing my questions directly to Josy, but perhaps as the Mod in question - you could tell me what to do? Should I pm you?

And the 'warning' most certainly DOES NOT speak for itself - for a start it is a private culmination of a very public and distasteful, unfair and unethical sequence of actions perpetrated by a MODERATOR against me.

You made an uninvited post about me on a thread on this forum which contained numerous wrongful allegations about me and I responded CIVILLY to rebut and refute those allegations.

My RESPONSE was removed.

When I posted to CIVILLY ask why you had removed it. That response was almost instantly removed also.

And so on and so forth - 6 times - until I had no choice but to give up trying to exercise my 'Right To Reply'.

...........................................

You could have always sent a PM asking why but you did not.

[Ammi]

I'm not known for abiding by the rules very well, but with the condition of SD at the moment, it's quite obvious why a mod would delete some posts. They are obviously trying to either prevent something escalating into an argument, removing something off-topic or it's something worthy of a warning or infraction and they're actually giving you a chance..

...Jess...:lovedup:...

[Jamie89]

I can see both sides because it's probably really frustrating when you have posts deleted - I remember once I noticed Vicky (I think) edited a post of mine, and she left a comment in the 'edit reason' bit, and I appreciated that, so yeah it's a good idea and everything... but I wonder if sometimes inviting a conversation around posts that have been deleted, through PM or in the thread itself, would sometimes lead to further derailment? And are there the mod resources to increase workload? I know it doesn't apply to everyone but a mod comment about a post being deleted could be seen by some as an invitation to discuss it more instead of drop it after seeing the comment. I don't know if a set rule is the way to go with it, but a judgement call on the part of the mod and maybe PMing them if you're not sure why posts have been deleted?

[Liam-]

Also what Jessica said.

[Ammi]

I can see both sides because it's probably really frustrating when you have posts deleted - I remember once I noticed Vicky (I think) edited a post of mine, and she left a comment in the 'edit reason' bit, and I appreciated that, so yeah it's a good idea and everything... but I wonder if sometimes inviting a conversation around posts that have been deleted, through PM or in the thread itself, would sometimes lead to further derailment? And are there the mod resources to increase workload? I know it doesn't apply to everyone but a mod comment about a post being deleted could be seen by some as an invitation to discuss it more instead of drop it after seeing the comment. I don't know if a set rule is the way to go with it, but a judgement call on the part of the mod and maybe PMing them if you're not sure why posts have been deleted?

..also I think it's the thing as well that it could just encourage negative attention and gossipy stuff from others with...'why was Jamie's post inflammatory then../what did he say../spill the tea..'...that's not good for the general forum vibe I personally don't think....

[Mokka]

..all I'll say while posting one of the forum rules which are signed up to by all...is that whatever which way, whether an explanation left in the thread or no explanation given, it won't be right for all because it's different personal preferences...and we did have an appeals section which was removed because all it mostly involved was staff becoming involved in the disgruntlements of members and no time left for moderating...and I think personally if an explanation were given for each post removal...again so much time taken away from moderating the forum which is unfair for everyone as that's why we choose to post on a moderated forum...



Staff members on the forum have the right to delete, modify or change the content of any post at any time for any reason without notification to anyone. They can also ban or restrict forum members for any reason at anytime. If a moderator edits your post on the forum do not remove the edits.

In reference to the rule we all signed up for... is it then to much to ask for some accountability and checks for the mods themselves? If I miss step with a client in my job...I expect there to be a conversation around that... an opportunity to explain myself... an admittance on my part of making a mistake...and a direct corse of change to be implemented. Here, if you ask why, or suggest the mods are stepping outside of their part in decency and decorum in that rule... then you get slapped back... and telhe mods get their backs all arched as opposed to stepping back and looking at the situation from a different perspective.
It can't just be....they are mods... so screw you.

[Jessica.]

It's not their job though, it's something that they do in their free time. :shrug:

[MTVN]

Wow. Yeah. Moderating is certainly a real drag sometimes... but to me this is counterproductive as you've just sniped at the user you told not to snipe (even worse it feels more personal)... no good result can occur. Try saying something like this to a customer or client who is being combatant...(well if you weren't so bitchy with your complaints :nono:).. see if their reaction improves. Spoiler: It won't. The manager will be called (always great when that happens :laugh:) and they will feel even more entitled to their position... which means it'll take more to satisfy them and calm them down... my view.

With all due respect you do not know the context of that warning or what it was for. It's one thing to complain, its another to be rude and abusive about it and the manager would hopefully not tolerate such attacks on his staff.

At the end of the day none of us are paid to Moderate this forum and we all have lives and jobs outside of it. We take no real pleasure in giving infractions which often results in accusations of bias, abuse of power, pursuing a vendetta etc. etc. Sometimes we do get it wrong and I'm sure there's plenty of members on here who can say they've had an infraction/warning reversed when it was a result of a misunderstanding or after its been reviewed by other Mods/Admins. On the other hand the sheer lack of accountability and the refusal to admit any wrongdoing when some infractions are received often amazes me.

The reason that posts are sometimes deleted without explanation has been touched on by a few people now but it does often just invite more focus on what's been deleted rather than moving on from it. People start asking what was deleted, they speculate about what happened, and it can also fuel misguided claims of bias.

Like Dezzy said, if anyone wants to know why a post was deleted then PM one of the Mods and I'm sure they'd be happy to have a look at it.

[Ammi]

In reference to the rule we all signed up for... is it then to much to ask for some accountability and checks for the mods themselves? If I miss step with a client in my job...I expect there to be a conversation around that... an opportunity to explain myself... an admittance on my part of making a mistake...and a direct corse of change to be implemented. Here, if you ask why, or suggest the mods are stepping outside of their part in decency and decorum in that rule... then you get slapped back... and telhe mods get their backs all arched as opposed to stepping back and looking at the situation from a different perspective.
It can't just be....they are mods... so screw you.

..I don't think we can equate the forum and moderating/staffing it to our jobs or any job because it's not something that is a paid thing...it's people giving their time for others so a voluntary thing...and I do believe that the staff moderate each other very closely and infractions/bans etc are discussed and if one is thought to be incorrect it will be reversed.../I have known some reversals...

[kirklancaster]

You could have always sent a PM asking why but you did not.

Why did not you - as THE Mod in question then - not pm me as the member whose Right To Reply was denied him by my INNOCENT and perfectly valid posts being repeatedly removed?

In addition, WHY was I given a Warning for simply AND truthfully responding with;

"My proof keeps on being removed"

When YOU yourself invited proof to corroborate Jaxies claim that you were not 'playing by the rules' (or words to that effect) - which you were most certainly not Dezzy.

Should a Moderator leap in and take sides in any debate which he was not previously involved in, by making UNTRUE allegations against one member in defence of another who is on the opposing side of an argument?

WHERE are the lines drawn?

On the subjects of pm's to Mods, I have only ever had the courtesy of TWO replies whenever I HAVE pm'd Mods with a grievance concerning Warnings, Infractions etc; and those have been one from Josy and the other from James.

[Cherie]

I don't think anyone complaining in this thread would do a good job at being a mod, in all honesty. The mods are still going to have to use their own judgement and when they tell you the reason you're going to disagree with it anyway, so you'll still see it as a vendetta against you.

Did anyone on the thread apply to be a mod? I'm asking for a explanation, you never know it might foster some mutual respect, not everything has to be negative

[Jessica.]

Why did not you - as THE Mod in question then - not pm me as the member whose Right To Reply was denied him by my INNOCENT and perfectly valid posts being repeatedly removed?

In addition, WHY was I given a Warning for simply AND truthfully responding with;

"My proof keeps on being removed"

When YOU yourself invited proof to corroborate Jaxies claim that you were not 'playing by the rules' (or words to that effect) - which you were most certainly not Dezzy.

Should a Moderator leap in and take sides in any debate which he was not previously involved in, by making UNTRUE allegations against one member in defence of another who is on the opposing side of an argument?

WHERE are the lines drawn?

On the subjects of pm's to Mods, I have only ever had the courtesy of TWO replies whenever I HAVE pm'd Mods with a grievance concerning Warnings, Infractions etc; and those have been one from Josy and the other from James.

You don't have a right to reply though. :)

[Cherie]

It's not their job though, it's something that they do in their free time. :shrug:

And? That doesn't mean they don't have to do it to the best of their ability

[Jessica.]

Did anyone on the thread apply to be a mod? I'm asking for a explanation, you never know it might foster some mutual respect, not everything has to be negative

You and a few others who have been complaining in this thread have been on a warpath against the mods, especially Dezzy, recently. This thread just contains some of many recent posts which are trying to point out that the mods are biased, unfair and judgemental. Don't start acting like you made this thread with positivity at the forefront of your mind.

[Maru]

I can see both sides because it's probably really frustrating when you have posts deleted - I remember once I noticed Vicky (I think) edited a post of mine, and she left a comment in the 'edit reason' bit, and I appreciated that, so yeah it's a good idea and everything... but I wonder if sometimes inviting a conversation around posts that have been deleted, through PM or in the thread itself, would sometimes lead to further derailment? And are there the mod resources to increase workload? I know it doesn't apply to everyone but a mod comment about a post being deleted could be seen by some as an invitation to discuss it more instead of drop it after seeing the comment. I don't know if a set rule is the way to go with it, but a judgement call on the part of the mod and maybe PMing them if you're not sure why posts have been deleted?

The point of a PM explanation is not resolve all user dissension. That will always occur. It's encouraged by our democracy after all. Uprising against the establishment. :laugh:

I truly believe the PM system is designed to have a ripple effect on rapport... on forums I've been active on and forums I've modded, this worked better because both mods and reasonable users didn't require as many explanations... it means focus on the real hard cases... it also reduced nastygrams between both sides imo because the system tells you pretty much... write a professional alert to the user the decision... if they respond, reply the rule that is significant and why and leave it there. :laugh: Other than that, take it to the admin. I would not have my mods arguing back and forth with users with personal commentary (much less in threads). It can be very well intentioned and they could very well be in the right, but it just looks biased... they after all are only following the rules.

The nice thing about PMs too from a mod perspective. Most complaints could be reduced down to accusations, which were harder to prove on the user end... so then easier to justify escalation (if even just to ourselves) as needed to infractions and possibly eventually be banned... eventually people give up and change their ways and move on.... make it personal and they will never give up. You'll have a counter forum developed behind your back and lots of drama could ensue off-site... I know this from experience! :laugh:

On the front end, it will help filter between the reasonables, the unreasonables and the plain undesirables (trolls who you know will get themselves permabanned eventually). It invites a response, and by no means, does a mod have to respond to that response exhaustively, much do they need to respond to the response of the response... most places that did this, they left a note saying they would take their objections into consideration after the initial response... and if needed, reiterating a stated rule so that they understood that some decisions would be more final than others... nothing personal, nothing exhaustive. Because frankly, mods are a volunteer cast and they can't afford the time to provide an exhaustive explanation to how they mod the forum... most is based on personal judgement and a thick skin and you just sometimes hope you've made the right decision that won't cause too many problems with users.

The work in my field is based on communication through the design of information. So for a living, I have to take into consideration the psychological behind the appearance and presentation of information on websites... small things like changing from infractions to a PM system feels more personal to the user and more inviting than merely leaving a time bomb in the explanation box... it depends on the situation though and eventually some users will exhaust their courtesy PM's and we move to an infraction and then eventually a ban situation... but in general, I think the system is good because it builds rapport with the core user... that's the main benefit from an administrative perspective... not to stop all dissension.

[MTVN]

In all of 2016 I have had two PMs asking about moderation on here and the most recent one was in March

[Cherie]

..also I think it's the thing as well that it could just encourage negative attention and gossipy stuff from others with...'why was Jamie's post inflammatory then../what did he say../spill the tea..'...that's not good for the general forum vibe I personally don't think....

If a post is inflammatory then I presume the poster would get an infraction though :think:

[Mokka]

It's not about whether it is a paid position or volunteer. I volunteer on many organizations and committees in my city... and I still am accountable for my actions there...and have to address concerns from people there as well...and I do it as professionally as if it was my paid job

And I am personally tired of being told I am on a war path against the mods. I have said seversl times i wouldn't want to mod... because I realize it is a sucky job... but those doing it signed up to do so... so they are accountable for their actions in that position. I am against censorship, dictatorship, and abuse of authority.

[Amy Jade]

Just to give a bit of balance a thread I made got deleted a while back and I asked a mod why and they got back to me and as it happened it waspretty fair.

Also I've asked a few mods why I was infracted and gotten a satisfying reply. We all get passionate sometimes and make posts that could be seen as baiting or just causing drama in general.

[Cherie]

You and a few others who have been complaining in this thread have been on a warpath against the mods, especially Dezzy, recently. This thread just contains some of many recent posts which are trying to point out that the mods are biased, unfair and judgemental. Don't start acting like you made this thread with positivity at the forefront of your mind.


I don't agree with your assessment of my state of mind when I posted, :laugh:Josy has agreed to discuss it and that's good enough for me :tongue:

[Ammi]

If a post is inflammatory then I presume the poster would get an infraction though :think:

..that was just an example Cherie of a comment in an edit which may have been made by a moderator...:laugh:../I have no idea what the reason for an edit would be but I'm confident that there would be felt to be a reason...

[Kizzy]

I sent Josy a PM once about a warning... No reply.
https://66.media.tumblr.com/cac9cfbd13028063c7248b1d67751181/tumblr_npc1zpVCel1rw0ifto1_400.gif

[Cherie]

I sent Josy a PM once about a warning... No reply.
https://66.media.tumblr.com/cac9cfbd13028063c7248b1d67751181/tumblr_npc1zpVCel1rw0ifto1_400.gif


:omgno:

[Cherie]

In all of 2016 I have had two PMs asking about moderation on here and the most recent one was in March

Is that because you are never here. :idc:

[Jamie89]

The point of a PM explanation is not resolve all user dissension. That will always occur. It's encouraged by our democracy after all. Uprising against the establishment. :laugh:

I truly believe the PM system is designed to have a ripple effect on rapport... on forums I've been active on and forums I've modded, this worked better because both mods and reasonable users didn't require as many explanations... it means focus on the real hard cases... it also reduced nastygrams between both sides imo because the system tells you pretty much... write a professional alert to the user the decision... if they respond, reply the rule that is significant and why and leave it there. :laugh: Other than that, take it to the admin. I would not have my mods arguing back and forth with users with personal commentary (much less in threads). It can be very well intentioned and they could very well be in the right, but it just looks biased... they after all are only following the rules.

The nice thing about PMs too from a mod perspective. Most complaints could be reduced down to accusations, which were harder to prove on the user end... so then easier to justify escalation (if even just to ourselves) as needed to infractions and possibly eventually be banned... eventually people give up and change their ways and move on.... make it personal and they will never give up. You'll have a counter forum developed behind your back and lots of drama could ensue off-site... I know this from experience! :laugh:

On the front end, it will help filter between the reasonables, the unreasonables and the plain undesirables (trolls who you know will get themselves permabanned eventually). It invites a response, and by no means, does a mod have to respond to that response exhaustively, much do they need to respond to the response of the response... most places that did this, they left a note saying they would take their objections into consideration after the initial response... and if needed, reiterating a stated rule so that they understood that some decisions would be more final than others... nothing personal, nothing exhaustive. Because frankly, mods are a volunteer cast and they can't afford the time to provide an exhaustive explanation to how they mod the forum... most is based on personal judgement and a thick skin and you just sometimes hope you've made the right decision that won't cause too many problems with users.

The work in my field is based on communication through the design of information. So for a living, I have to take into consideration the psychological behind the appearance and presentation of information on websites... small things like changing from infractions to a PM system feels more personal to the user and more inviting than merely leaving a time bomb in the explanation box... it depends on the situation though and eventually some users will exhaust their courtesy PM's and we move to an infraction and then eventually a ban situation... but in general, I think the system is good because it builds rapport with the core user... that's the main benefit from an administrative perspective... not to stop all dissension.

Oh yeah I totally see all that, but do we really have the resources for all of that? Tibbs only a small site so I sort of think if something's not necessary, as much as it would be a nice to have, then is it worth putting mod resource into it? I imagine the infraction system is a much easier method of moderating (granted, I'm sure it also leads to mistakes or unfair judgements on occasion too), but I dunno, what you've described sounds like it would take a lot of mod time that isn't really available, and considering the size of the site would it be worth introducing a whole new administrative process?

[MTVN]

Is that because you are never here. :idc:

If I'm not posting it doesn't mean I'm not here :ninja2:

[MTVN]

Although don't try get me on weekends

[Tom4784]

Why did not you - as THE Mod in question then - not pm me as the member whose Right To Reply was denied him by my INNOCENT and perfectly valid posts being repeatedly removed?

In addition, WHY was I given a Warning for simply AND truthfully responding with;

"My proof keeps on being removed"

When YOU yourself invited proof to corroborate Jaxies claim that you were not 'playing by the rules' (or words to that effect) - which you were most certainly not Dezzy.

Should a Moderator leap in and take sides in any debate which he was not previously involved in, by making UNTRUE allegations against one member in defence of another who is on the opposing side of an argument?

WHERE are the lines drawn?

On the subjects of pm's to Mods, I have only ever had the courtesy of TWO replies whenever I HAVE pm'd Mods with a grievance concerning Warnings, Infractions etc; and those have been one from Josy and the other from James.

It's not down to me to do that. If you have a query you have to PM a mod to get an answer. You've been on the forum long enough to know that.

If you choose not to do that then that's on you. You agreed to follow a set of rules when you signed up, this 'right to reply' you keep mentioning isn't part of it.

As the rules you agreed to stated, We are allowed to make changes without notifying you. It's up to you to get clarification on things you don't understand.

Finally, mods are allowed to have an opinion on things, we're allowed to take part in discussions and that isn't going to change any time soon.

[kirklancaster]

In all of 2016 I have had two PMs asking about moderation on here and the most recent one was in March

Not from me Matt.

I actually keep forgetting that you are a mod.

I am a grown man and can take my bruises, not only when I have deserved them, but also on quite a few occasions when I have not deserved them, but there is a REAL and recurring problem on this forum with unfairness, favouritism, and unethical behaviour from a Mod.

Bitontheslide - an intelligent, knowledgeable and moderate member - has quit the forum because of it , despite my personal plea to him not to, and other 'Senior' members are genuinely so aggrieved by the above and feel so strongly about it, that they too are on the verge of quitting.

For the most part, those who dismiss this problem, and who attack those complaining about it, are NOT even regular contributors to Serious Debates - the 'arena' where most complaints stem from, and they are also basing their dismissiveness and denials of such complaints, on the fact that that the Mod in question is a 'nice sweet guy' who plays games with them and holds similar political and other views.

No ONE is saying that the Mod in question is NOT a nice guy, or that he is constantly at fault, but there ARE problems which need addressing.

[Jamie89]

If a post is inflammatory then I presume the poster would get an infraction though :think:

The one of mine I remember seeing, I think I made a comment within a post that Vicky felt could have been seen as being inflammatory, but not directly, or not intended... or something. Not worthy of being infracted for basically but taken out to be on the safe side in case it caused any unnecessary drama :laugh:

[Maru]

Oh yeah I totally see all that, but do we really have the resources for all of that? Tibbs only a small site so I sort of think if something's not necessary, as much as it would be a nice to have, then is it worth putting mod resource into it? I imagine the infraction system is a much easier method of moderating (granted, I'm sure it also leads to mistakes or unfair judgements on occasion too), but I dunno, what you've described sounds like it would take a lot of mod time that isn't really available, and considering the size of the site would it be worth introducing a whole new administrative process?

It depends on the situation, but in some cases, I've had to modify the forum internally to accommodate for lack of staff. I've gone as far as to modify language/add language/behavior of code to code if needed to make things clearer (some systems make it easier than others)... but again, we don't know the situation with TiBB staff and how many are available to do the job and what is technically feasible with the forum itself as they are running on an older version, so plugins may not even be compatible (though vB is pretty common)... my comments are more consultative rather than critical given there's those unknown circumstances. I think that your concerns are very fair.

[Jessica.]

Ugh, I don't want a notification every time a mod does something, that's so tedious.

[Ammi]

Not from me Matt.

I actually keep forgetting that you are a mod.

I am a grown man and can take my bruises, not only when I have deserved them, but also on quite a few occasions when I have not deserved them, but there is a REAL and recurring problem on this forum with unfairness, favouritism, and unethical behaviour from a Mod.

Bitontheslide - an intelligent, knowledgeable and moderate member - has quit the forum because of it , despite my personal plea to him not to, and other 'Senior' members are genuinely so aggrieved by the above and feel so strongly about it, that they too are on the verge of quitting.

For the most part, those who dismiss this problem, and who attack those complaining about it, are NOT even regular contributors to Serious Debates - the 'arena' where most complaints stem from, and they are also basing their dismissiveness and denials of such complaints, on the fact that that the Mod in question is a 'nice sweet guy' who plays games with them and holds similar political and other views.

No ONE is saying that the Mod in question is NOT a nice guy, or that he is constantly at fault, but there ARE problems which need addressing.




...no one is dismissing and no one is attacking anyone Kirk..and the bit in bold is simply not true at all...and it does actually insult members in saying it, that it factors in at all when we view things on the forum...we often do so as 'observers' in a thread ..(in any section..)...so participating is not really relevant.../in fact observing and non-participation often gives a more balanced perspective rather than involvement...

[Vicky.]

Not only have I had COMPLETELY INNOCUOUS posts removed without ANY genuine reason, I have had subsequent posts INSTANTLY removed which simply asked "Why has my innocuous post been removed when it has breached no rules at all?"

I recently had 6 posts removed - ONE AFTER THE OTHER - just as soon as I posted them:

The first was a civil rebuttal response to a Mod who had made accusations against me in a post.

When it was removed not a nano second after I had submitted it, I posted a benign post asking why it had been removed.

When THAT was instantly removed, I posted a STILL civil post asking why my posts were being removed and along with them my Right To Reply.

Later on that thread, the Mod involved asked another member for 'proof' to her allegation that he was not 'playing by the forum's own rules' or words to that effect" and in response to his invitation for 'proof', I posted simply that "My proof keeps being removed".


I see a pattern here...

For the record posts asking why other posts have been removed will also be removed. If you haven't realised this by now...

[Maru]

Not from me Matt.

I actually keep forgetting that you are a mod.

I am a grown man and can take my bruises, not only when I have deserved them, but also on quite a few occasions when I have not deserved them, but there is a REAL and recurring problem on this forum with unfairness, favouritism, and unethical behaviour from a Mod.

Bitontheslide - an intelligent, knowledgeable and moderate member - has quit the forum because of it , despite my personal plea to him not to, and other 'Senior' members are genuinely so aggrieved by the above and feel so strongly about it, that they too are on the verge of quitting.

For the most part, those who dismiss this problem, and who attack those complaining about it, are NOT even regular contributors to Serious Debates - the 'arena' where most complaints stem from, and they are also basing their dismissiveness and denials of such complaints, on the fact that that the Mod in question is a 'nice sweet guy' who plays games with them and holds similar political and other views.

No ONE is saying that the Mod in question is NOT a nice guy, or that he is constantly at fault, but there ARE problems which need addressing.

Kirk, as you know, I'm a fairly new user, so don't have the time invested that some do... but I've never been modded or had an infraction. Though I do refrain from potential flamewars... (which I think is the true problem more than language issues)... it needs to be made clearer in language the decisions are not personal, so that they can effectively deal with the larger issues... such as verbal abuse that gets tossed around unencumbered.

I remember a time when we used the tools too much and there was so much complaint. Now it seems as if some establishments are afraid to use the tools, fearful of the outcry. There is no perfect solution, but I think that the mods need to be able to put to sleep matters effectively so that they can actually make headway with some of the larger issues in S&D... such as the constant verbal sniping and personal attacks... and not face dissession everytime for choosing a path...

What would have to change to satisfy you and others? There are people who I have seen that float on your side (and often mine as my views are sometimes in line). LT being a big proponent for this (though not the only name I'd name), posting divisive commentary, openly trolling those they perceive to embody the core arguments of opposition and are making weaker arguments (when they are just another innocent user making courtesy commentary)... who are there clearly there purely to cause controversy, not to discuss... those users float hide behind myself and your comments when convenient... then attack others when the coast is clear... and that might be a big reason why you have potentially received infractions, because of a certain crowd....

Imo, not enough has been done about those users, and there needs to be give and take, both sides to resolve the problem... so Kirk, if they ban some of those users and have to act.... and you coincidentally receive infractions from a mod whose comments are not so eloquent, it may still potentially look very biased... but in fact, could be focused on other underlying problems in the forum... and I agree with you, a can of worms has been opened here because some very poor decision making and personal commentary has been made and cannot be undone... and that drives the discussion behind dissension.

We need an agreement as to what the problems actually are so both sides feel safe to post... personally I avoid problem users and their threads like the plague and they're in my squished users list (ignore). It's possibly why I avoid infractions and why your posts are moderated... when we often have very similar viewpoints.

[Vicky.]

However, on other sites I used to receive PMs when posts were removed, edited, when threads were moved etc... some places the edits were made on the post and an explanation towards the end... (probably should poll users before doing this to see if it is appropriate) You realise, with this you would have a full inbox within an hour of it being implemented? :laugh:

[Maru]

You realise, with this you would have a full inbox within an hour of it being implemented? :laugh:

Well, I am a very fast typist. :laugh: Though in all seriousness, again... this has been implemented before and it was in place of infractions at the base level. So maybe only a small handful made it a problem, and again, I would escalate to infractions and bans if that user is stubborn... there should be an unsaid limit of courtesy PM's in my opinion

Edit: Unless you're talking about PM storage limits. Then whoops :laugh::laugh:

[Maru]

You have to keep in mind a lot of the forums I've run or have been to are run by computer gurus and people who ran servers, did web development for a living ... so we used witchcraft sometimes when things weren't going our way :laugh:

[Rob!]

If I'm honest I really don't see the point in deleting posts - what are you trying to protect us from? We're all humans at the end of the day, humans argue, disagree and fight. Sometimes it's nasty but attempting to edit what we're saying because you either don't agree with it or it doesn't coincide with some, in a few cases, red tape type rules is parmount to Orwellian type behaviour imo.

[Vicky.]

Well, I am a very fast typist. :laugh: Though in all seriousness, again... this has been implemented before and it was in place of infractions at the base level. So maybe only a small handful made it a problem, and again, I would escalate to infractions and bans if that user is stubborn... there should be an unsaid limit of courtesy PM's in my opinion

Edit: Unless you're talking about PM storage limits. Then whoops :laugh::laugh:

Ohhh you meant the member whos post had been removed would get a message? I read this as everytime a message was deleted or a thread moved or whatever everyone would get a message :facepalm:

I always try to leave an edit note if I edit posts. And I tend to favour editing over deletions too. But when faced with a thread with 50 posts that are just bollocks arguments and sniping..much easier to delete in one go, which includes any posts quoting the argument. Which tends to then lead to 'why was my post deleted, I only said X' which starts it all up again thus making the deletions a bit pointless, which is why we delete posts of that nature too.

Having said this, a fair few members prefer their posts to be deleted rather than edited. I have had hell on in PM many times for editing peoples posts :S

[kirklancaster]

...no one is dismissing and no one is attacking anyone Kirk..and the bit in bold is simply not true at all...and it does actually insult members in saying it, that it factors in at all when we view things on the forum...we often do so as 'observers' in a thread ..(in any section..)...so participating is not really relevant.../in fact observing and non-participation often gives a more balanced perspective rather than involvement...

I'm sorry Ammi, but the bit in bold is perfectly true in MY opinion though it may not be in yours.

I really think that you need to stand back and take a more objective view of events just lately Ammi, because CLEARLY some people are being DISMISSIVE of our complaints, and still others are being PERSONALLY CRITICAL of us, and their comments amount to attacking us.

I witnessed another thread yesterday, where decent, honourable, and long-serving members were subjected to a barrage of the most unnaceptable immature abusive comments AND mockery by supporters of the Mod in question.

Opinions on here among a huge number of members are driven more by who they are 'friends with' and which 'Celebrity' they are fans of rather than any objective and dispassionate weighing of facts - in my opinion.

Do you think that ANY ONE of us would 'conjure up' these problems which we have experienced just to make waves, when - as mature, intelligent adults - we KNOW that the ensuing tsunami will DROWN US?

I'm sorry, but I really do not hate anyone on here - my life is too full of REAL living for that to be the case, yet I MUST stand up and be counted for what I KNOW is MY truth, and if that truth casts a friend of yours in an unfavourable light, and if you take umbrage because of it, then there is nothing that I can do.

All I ask in REAL life, is that I am treated the same as the next person by those in authority - not better, not worse, but the same - and it is no different upon here.

[Vicky.]

If I'm honest I really don't see the point in deleting posts - what are you trying to protect us from? We're all humans at the end of the day, humans argue, disagree and fight. Sometimes it's nasty but attempting to edit what we're saying because you either don't agree with it or it doesn't coincide with some, in a few cases, red tape type rules is parmount to Orwellian type behaviour imo.

I don't really see it as protecting anyone tbh, unless it is removing bad insults, or racism or something. I see it as keeping threads readable. I swear if you could see some threads with the vast amount of deleted posts restored you would see what I mean. Nearly every SD thread recently descends into petty sniping which has **** all to do with the topic of the tread.

[Kizzy]

You have to keep in mind a lot of the forums I've run or have been to are run by computer gurus and people who ran servers, did web development for a living ... so we used witchcraft sometimes when things weren't going our way :laugh:

Don't we all dear?.... :idc:

[Mokka]

If I'm honest I really don't see the point in deleting posts - what are you trying to protect us from? We're all humans at the end of the day, humans argue, disagree and fight. Sometimes it's nasty but attempting to edit what we're saying because you either don't agree with it or it doesn't coincide with some, in a few cases, red tape type rules is parmount to Orwellian type behaviour imo.
:omgno:
Not a big brother reference about mods on a big brother forum :laugh2:

[Crimson Dynamo]

The nights are fair drawing in....

:pipe:

[Cherie]

Ugh, I don't want a notification every time a mod does something, that's so tedious.


:facepalm: I asked that a general comment be put in the thread, Niamh does it a lot and it's very effective

[Maru]

Ohhh you meant the member whos post had been removed would get a message? I read this as everytime a message was deleted or a thread moved or whatever everyone would get a message :facepalm:

I always try to leave an edit note if I edit posts. And I tend to favour editing over deletions too. But when faced with a thread with 50 posts that are just bollocks arguments and sniping..much easier to delete in one go, which includes any posts quoting the argument. Which tends to then lead to 'why was my post deleted, I only said X' which starts it all up again thus making the deletions a bit pointless, which is why we delete posts of that nature too.

Having said this, a fair few members prefer their posts to be deleted rather than edited. I have had hell on in PM many times for editing peoples posts :S

A lot of places do it mainly for deletions, though some do it for threads moved (it depends on the volume). We escalated to infractions using the preexisting forum tools when we couldn't correct the behavior and just followed that system accordingly to bans which often incremented if we felt justified... so the worst offender... 2 day ban... became a 2 week ban... to a one month ban... to permaban... multis = instaban, and extend the original ban if the user went back to abusing other users... we tended to leave it alone though if they were just trying to PM a mod.

I much prefer editing and notations too, as it leaves the pertinent information and allows the thread to continue, but it depends on the forum... these days some people take it very sensitively. (see Rob's post)

I think some people feel like it's a black mark that makes them feel "punished"... but really, if it's done courteously and across the board (edits for everyone :fist:).. then it can go very well and makes the moderation team appear active and engaged... but I would poll users before changing.... maybe test this in S&D first since they seem to want to be so involved in moderation innovation. :laugh:

[Maru]

:facepalm: I asked that a general comment be put in the thread, Niamh does it a lot and it's very effective

I think this is good for mass deletions that have massively altered the discourse in the thread. Do it after every deletion and the mod team and forum will be a basket cases in a matter of weeks.

Edit: I think sleeping on it is sometimes too if it looks like a questionable endeavor... come back and delete delete delete... sometimes everyone has had their mea culpa... or a chronically insomniac 3am mod will clean it up when it gets particularly nasty. Leaving those threads around can cause issues if there are a lot of thin skins on the board. I'm OK with locked threads in most cases... personally speaking.

Edit2: We actually used to move deleted/edited posts to a hidden forum just in case we needed to bring back a post (with edits) to make clear it was moderated and re-cleared. Something to consider.

[Ammi]

I'm sorry Ammi, but the bit in bold is perfectly true in MY opinion though it may not be in yours.

I really think that you need to stand back and take a more objective view of events just lately Ammi, because CLEARLY some people are being DISMISSIVE of our complaints, and still others are being PERSONALLY CRITICAL of us, and their comments amount to attacking us.

I witnessed another thread yesterday, where decent, honourable, and long-serving members were subjected to a barrage of the most unnaceptable immature abusive comments AND mockery by supporters of the Mod in question.

Opinions on here among a huge number of members are driven more by who they are 'friends with' and which 'Celebrity' they are fans of rather than any objective and dispassionate weighing of facts - in my opinion.

Do you think that ANY ONE of us would 'conjure up' these problems which we have experienced just to make waves, when - as mature, intelligent adults - we KNOW that the ensuing tsunami will DROWN US?

I'm sorry, but I really do not hate anyone on here - my life is too full of REAL living for that to be the case, yet I MUST stand up and be counted for what I KNOW is MY truth, and if that truth casts a friend of yours in an unfavourable light, and if you take umbrage because of it, then there is nothing that I can do.

All I ask in REAL life, is that I am treated the same as the next person by those in authority - not better, not worse, but the same - and it is no different upon here.

..I don't know Kirk...(I'm going to bow out of this for the moment because I need to get something to eat...)...but the wording that you're using 'us' seems to suggest a mindset of 'them and us' and I honestly think that might be contributing as well../that mindset...


..I can't always say that I can be completely objective/no one can/and no one is ever not ironic or hypocritical in behaviour at times either ..I see what everyone sees though and with the infractions/bans/warnings etc the ones I'm aware of...whether they be someone I'm close to or not...?...I also see why they were given and most people who receive them also fully understand and accept the reasons why as well...only the occasional things I would say might cause some confusion as to the situation in Cherie making the thread, which Josy has said she'll look into...

[Vicky.]

I think this is good for mass deletions that have massively altered the discourse in the thread. Do it after every deletion and the mod team and forum will be a basket cases in a matter of weeks.

Edit: I think sleeping on it is sometimes too if it looks like a questionable endeavor... come back and delete delete delete... sometimes everyone has had their mea culpa... or a chronically insomniac 3am mod will clean it up when it gets particularly nasty. Leaving those threads around can cause issues if there are a lot of thin skins on the board. I'm OK with locked threads in most cases... personally speaking.

Edit2: We actually used to move deleted/edited posts to a hidden forum just in case we needed to bring back a post (with edits) to make clear it was moderated and re-cleared. Something to consider.we used to have to do this with the old forum. With this one nothing gets 'deleted' it just gets hidden and admin and mods can still read and restore them if necessary :)

[Maru]

:omgno:
Not a big brother reference about mods on a big brother forum :laugh2:

:hehe:

[Ashley.]

If your post is deleted without an explanation, ask for an explanation.


:shrug:

[Crimson Dynamo]

If your post is deleted without an explanation, ask for an explanation.


:shrug:

How do you monitor what gets deleted?
Do you monitor all your posts and check they are still there?

[Ashley.]

How do you monitor what gets deleted?
Do you monitor all your posts and check they are still there?

No. Why would I?

[Withano]

Is a Big Brother forum really being taken this seriously?

Lol, right?!

If your post was deleted, its for a good reason

[Crimson Dynamo]

No. Why would I?

So if u don't know it's been deleted how can you ask?

[Ashley.]

So if u don't know it's been deleted how can you ask?

Well in that case, why fuss over a comment you're never going to look at again anyway? Plus by the looks of things, Cherie is well in-the-know that some of her comments have been deleted.

[Cherie]

Lol, right?!

If your post was deleted, its for a good reason

It's the good reason that needs explaining, if it's not obvious

[kirklancaster]

Lol, right?!

If your post was deleted, its for a good reason

:worship:

Oh Lord my God, when I in awesome wonder
Consider all the worlds thy hands have made.
I see the stars, I hear the rolling thunder
Thy power throughout the universe displayed

I have now come to accept that you are no mere mortal.
That you KNOW with DIVINE and INFALLIBLE certitude
EVERYTHING.

I am especially in awe of your ability to KNOW these things to be absolutes without the direct personal experiences of those of us who you contradict.

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

:worship:

Oh Lord my God, when I in awesome wonder
Consider all the worlds thy hands have made.
I see the stars, I hear the rolling thunder
Thy power throughout the universe displayed

I have now come to accept that you are no mere mortal.
That you KNOW with DIVINE and INFALLIBLE certitude
EVERYTHING.

I am especially in awe of your ability to KNOW these things to be absolutes without the direct personal experiences of those of us who you contradict.

SHFDCHFGJJGH IM ****ING SCREAMING :joker::joker::joker:

[Black Dagger]

Is this forum ****ing serious. I don't know anymore.

[Josy]

Jeez I'm still catching up from earlier...

Posts that members have been infracted/warned for are generally deleted because it's mostly either baiting insulting or an offensive post, so to leave that posts on the thread afterward just causes further arguments, thread derailment and more reports to come in for the same thing that's been dealt with.

Other posts that are included in arguments are normally also deleted because again if not it causes further trouble and leaves the thread a mess.

Posts like that won't have a reason provided because fir most people it's obvious and tbh we would also never have enough time to message everyone involved to tell them why thier specific comment was removed so for that reason alone I would say no way to the notification suggestions

[Kizzy]

:worship:

Oh Lord my God, when I in awesome wonder
Consider all the worlds thy hands have made.
I see the stars, I hear the rolling thunder
Thy power throughout the universe displayed

I have now come to accept that you are no mere mortal.
That you KNOW with DIVINE and INFALLIBLE certitude
EVERYTHING.

I am especially in awe of your ability to KNOW these things to be absolutes without the direct personal experiences of those of us who you contradict.

Hi could someone delete this please? k thanx xx


Jk ( or am I?..... :idc: )

[Withano]

:worship:

Oh Lord my God, when I in awesome wonder
Consider all the worlds thy hands have made.
I see the stars, I hear the rolling thunder
Thy power throughout the universe displayed

I have now come to accept that you are no mere mortal.
That you KNOW with DIVINE and INFALLIBLE certitude
EVERYTHING.

I am especially in awe of your ability to KNOW these things to be absolutes without the direct personal experiences of those of us who you contradict.

I just see it one of two ways.. Your post was deemed inapporpriate by somebody with admin powers, either move on with your life or spend a couple hours complaining like its a big deal (its not a big deal, move on with your life)

[Cherie]

Is this forum ****ing serious. I don't know anymore.

I just see it one of two ways.. Your post was deemed inapporpriate by somebody with admin powers, either move on with your life or spend a couple hours complaining like its a big deal (its not a big deal, move on with your life)

If it doesn't bother you maybe you shouldn't spend time out of your lives commenting :shrug:

[Withano]

If it doesn't bother you maybe you shouldn't spend time out of your lives commenting :shrug:

It does bother me. It bothers me that you think you deserve this.

[Maru]

Jeez I'm still catching up from earlier...

Posts that members have been infracted/warned for are generally deleted because it's mostly either baiting insulting or an offensive post, so to leave that posts on the thread afterward just causes further arguments, thread derailment and more reports to come in for the same thing that's been dealt with.

Other posts that are included in arguments are normally also deleted because again if not it causes further trouble and leaves the thread a mess.

Posts like that won't have a reason provided because fir most people it's obvious and tbh we would also never have enough time to message everyone involved to tell them why thier specific comment was removed so for that reason alone I would say no way to the notification suggestions

No, that makes sense. For notifications, I was thinking more in the case for single deletions... like when a user posts something very baiting and needs to be removed. Maybe a single post and a reminder to stay within the rules for the general thread for mega deletions... (and a lock if necessary).

It's hard to stay on top of unless you have enough mods. S&D, depending on the time of the day, moves very fast.

[Cherie]

It does bother me. It bothers me that you think you deserve this.


Yes Im worth it

[Withano]

Yes Im worth it

I think youre asking too much.. Perhaps if a mods only job was to remove posts then sure, but thats not their only job, you want to give them a new one and its unreasonable.

[Cherie]

I think youre asking too much.. Perhaps if a mods only job was to remove posts then sure, but thats not their only job, you want to give them a new one and its unreasonable.

Niamh does it all the time

[Firewire]

If your post is deleted without an explanation, ask for an explanation.


:shrug:

You get infracted for that :hmph:

[Withano]

Niamh does it all the time

Ive never been given a reason for a deleted post, I wouldnt expect one either. A mods life doesnt revolve around my posts. Assumed this was common knowledge tbh.

[Cherie]

Ive never been given a reason for a deleted post, I wouldnt expect one either. A mods life doesnt revolve around my posts. Assumed this was common knowledge tbh.

You need to expect more in life tbh :laugh:

[Crimson Dynamo]

Ive never been given a reason for a deleted post, I wouldnt expect one either. A mods life doesnt revolve around my posts. Assumed this was common knowledge tbh.

I thought you, having had a lots and lots of posts deleted, would be keen to know why?

:think:

[Withano]

You need to expect more in life tbh :laugh:

I just dont expect a moderator to follow me around in case they need to give me a cuddle every time im sad

[Withano]

I thought you, having had a lots and lots of posts deleted, would be keen to know why?

:think:

No not really, i completely understand that the mods dont sit around in the tibb office all day waiting for somebody to post, figuring out how to make more work for themselves to earn that hefty 6 figure salary. Im not their priority and this is ok, its a free-to-use forum.

[kirklancaster]

I just see it one of two ways.. Your post was deemed inapporpriate by somebody with admin powers, either move on with your life or spend a couple hours complaining like its a big deal (its not a big deal, move on with your life)

I am currently involved in a serious, mature, and reasonable discussion with the only other person who matters - besides myself - about my removed posts, and I need neither your advice nor your decree 'that it is not a big deal'.

I am as aware as many others just WHY you and certain others have so suddenly descended upon this thread, to concern yourselves with something which is 'not a big deal', so do not waste your precious time addressing me, just move on with your life.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I am currently involved in a serious, mature, and reasonable discussion with the only other person who matters - besides myself - about my removed posts, and I need neither your advice nor your decree 'that it is not a big deal'.

I am as aware as many others just WHY you and certain others have so suddenly descended upon this thread, to concern yourselves with something which is 'not a big deal', so do not waste your precious time addressing me, just move on with your life.

:clap1:

[Withano]

I am currently involved in a serious, mature, and reasonable discussion with the only other person who matters - besides myself - about my removed posts, and I need neither your advice nor your decree 'that it is not a big deal'.

I am as aware as many others just WHY you and certain others have so suddenly descended upon this thread, to concern yourselves with something which is 'not a big deal', so do not waste your precious time addressing me, just move on with your life.

Omg. dont quote me if you dont want to discuss something with me. Thats twice in two days youve done this.

[Jordan.]

Here for this thread being deleted without explanation.

[Jamie89]

Here for this thread being deleted without explanation.
:joker:

[Maru]

Here for this thread being deleted without explanation.

Feel free to PM us all when you see that happen, o' sightseer.

See, there's an idea. We should crowd-source our moderation notifications. :laugh:

[James]

If posts are deleted and the reason is not due to an infraction would it be possible that a general comment is made on the thread by the mod who deleted it as to why? It seems to be happening more and more in ...yes ...SD :laugh:

I have not read this whole thread but if a post gets deleted, posts that quote it or refer to it usually get deleted also.

The quote could be edited out of the following posts but that is too much work.

It can cause problems when mods identify they are the ones who delete things, and also it is usually obvious the reason for the deleted post.

[Josy]

You get infracted for that :hmph:
No you don't not if you pm like you are supposed to.

[James]

I have deleted some posts from this thread.

(:hee:)

[Josy]

I have deleted some posts from this thread.

(:hee:)
[emoji23]

[Firewire]

:joker:

[Shaun]

:fist: *makes a new thread about this*

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

how do you post emoji's on here

[Shaun]

There was a list and it goes something like

[ emoji 50 ]
(with no spaces)

But idk where the list was

[emoji50]

[Crimson Dynamo]

I think one of the main issues occurs when A Mod is involved in a heated debate in SD and during the debate they decide to delete posts and ( and I may be wrong) the deleted posts tend to be from the people who this particular mod (could be anyone) does not like or respect their political views..

just saying


because, lets not pretend that all mods are paragons of virtue as they aint (they are fragile humans like us commoners:flutter:)

and if that happens a lot then "some" members who use SD notice.what with them being observant

again, just saying..

:)

[Benjamin]

:joker:

[Benjamin]

That smiley was at James' post I forgot to quote.

This whole thread is ridiculous to be honest.

[Crimson Dynamo]

That smiley was at James' post I forgot to quote.

This whole thread is ridiculous to be honest.

no ben its not

and if you have not been on the end of it its unfair to comment tbh

[Cherie]

I just dont expect a moderator to follow me around in case they need to give me a cuddle every time im sad


Nobody is asking for that :suspect:

[Withano]

no ben its not

and if you have not been on the end of it its unfair to comment tbh

Ive been on the end you speak of, and it is. It is a ridiculous thread

[Cherie]

That smiley was at James' post I forgot to quote.

This whole thread is ridiculous to be honest.

No Ben it's not, when did you last post in SD?

[Cherie]

Ive been on the end you speak of, and it is. It is a ridiculous thread

If it's that ridiculous why are you posting?

[Withano]

If it's that ridiculous why are you posting?

Did you forget what forums were? More than half the people who have posted agree that this thread is ridiculous. A thread isnt a safe place for you to post hings for people to agree with.

[Cherie]

As usual people who NEVER contribute to SD descend to poke fun and make trite comments like get a life, time to bow out, I expect Josy will come back on this as agreed at some point

[Cherie]

Did you forget what forums were?


:joker:you were the one who said move on etc. maybe you forgot :think:

[Benjamin]

no ben its not

and if you have not been on the end of it its unfair to comment tbh

Yes it is ridiculous the way some of you are carrying on. You're better than that, and the manner in which some of you (not all) have over the concerns has been immature and comes across as more of just rebelling for the sake of it. There are ways to find a resolve and throwing in digs here and there, as one example, is not one of them.

And I have been on the end of it before, I've had posts deleted. I knew exactly why too. I wasn't happy but really, I knew why they had been removed.

Also just to point out, if you do not wish for people to comment then may I suggest not posting it on a public forum. Rather take it to a private message to the mods and admin as a collective. Because at the moment all I see you as is portraying yourself as wanting the attention and to just cause trouble, which means I can't take your concern seriously.

[kirklancaster]

As usual people who NEVER contribute to SD descend to poke fun and make trite comments like get a life, time to bow out, I expect Josy will come back on this as agreed at some point

:clap1::clap1::clap1: Spot ON.

[Cherie]

Did you forget what forums were? More than half the people who have posted agree that this thread is ridiculous. A thread isnt a safe place for you to post hings for people to agree with.

80 per cent who never post in SD dear

[Withano]

:joker:you were the one who said move on etc. maybe you forgot :think:

Move on in reply to your thread.. Did you think I meant move on wih every issue youll ever have? Weird.

[Cherie]

Move on in reply to your thread.. Did you think I meant move on wih every issue youll ever have? Weird.

We are in the same thread where should I move to...?

[Withano]

80 per cent who never post in SD dear

Oh right, youve decided theres an exclusion criteria for the public thread on the public forum.

Id imagine posts on the Big Brother forums gets deleted a hell of a lot more than SD forums anyway, so its not like they have no idea what youre talking about haha.

[Cherie]

Oh right, youve decided theres an exclusion criteria for the public thread on the public forum.

Id imagine posts on the Big Brother forums gets deleted a hell of a lot more than SD forums anyway, so its not like they have no idea what youre talking about haha.

I specifically said SD in my opening post, sorry if you missed it

[Crimson Dynamo]

Yes it is ridiculous the way some of you are carrying on. You're better than that, and the manner in which some of you (not all) have over the concerns has been immature and comes across as more of just rebelling for the sake of it. There are ways to find a resolve and throwing in digs here and there, as one example, is not one of them.

And I have been on the end of it before, I've had posts deleted. I knew exactly why too. I wasn't happy but really, I knew why they had been removed.

Also just to point out, if you do not wish for people to comment then may I suggest not posting it on a public forum. Rather take it to a private message to the mods and admin as a collective. Because at the moment all I see you as is portraying yourself as wanting the attention and to just cause trouble, which means I can't take your concern seriously.


Wow

:umm2:

[Withano]

I specifically said SD in my opening post, sorry if you missed it

Public thread on the public forum, its open for praise or critique by literally anybody with an email address.. Maybe you should have made a group or pm'd someone if you wanted to create an exclusion criteria.

[Cherie]

Public thread on the public forum, its open for praise or critique by literally anybody with an email address.. Maybe you should have made a group or pm'd someone if you wanted to create an exclusion criteria.


I could say the same thing to you telling posters to move on with their lives, it's interesting you feel you can say that but I can't counter it, hypocrisy????

[Withano]

I could say the same thing to you telling posters to move on with their lives, it's interesting you feel you can say that but I can't counter it, hypocrisy????

You can say it? I never told you not to? But youre drawing non-existing parallels.

[Cherie]

You can say it? I never told you not to? But youre drawing non-existing parallels.

Where did I tell you not to post? I merely said the thread was heaving with people who never ventured into SD. That's not the same as saying don't post

[Benjamin]

No Ben it's not, when did you last post in SD?

I may not post in there, I choose not to, but I still read the threads and can see for myself what goes on in them.

[kirklancaster]

Where did I tell you not to post? I merely said the thread was heaving with people who never ventured into SD. That's not the same as saying don't post

You are being drawn in to the same wearying B.S. I have endured Cherie.

Just end it.

[Withano]

Where did I tell you not to post? I merely said the thread was heaving with people who never ventured into SD. That's not the same as saying don't post

I think weve both lost track if what youre saying but to recap: anybody can post on a public thread on a public forum and there are ways to avoid this if you dont want certain peoples input. That, and mods lives not circuling around your post should be common knowledge.

Hope that helps but I have the feeling you was only hoping for praise and not discussions.

[Tom4784]

80 per cent who never post in SD dear

Some might say you're being condescending and rude by saying that :fan:

[Cherie]

I may not post in there, I choose not to, but I still read the threads and can see for myself what goes on in them.

Can you see deleted posts :hee:

[Cherie]

Some might say you're being condescending and rude by saying that :fan:

I thought you would appreciate it :fan:

[Benjamin]

Can you see deleted posts :hee:

No, but I can read them before they get deleted. But continue your attitude like that, it'll get you far with the issues you raised in the OP I'm sure.

[Cherie]

I think weve both lost track if what youre saying but to recap: anybody can post on a public thread on a public forum and there are ways to avoid this if you dont want certain peoples input. That, and mods lives not circuling around your post should be common knowledge.

Hope that helps but I have the feeling you was only hoping for praise and not discussions.


Lol I don't want praise, you have no idea :joker:

[Withano]

Lol I don't want praise, you have no idea :joker:

Well you certainly wont take critique haha, theres seven pages worth of "mods should invest more time into me" and "no youre wrong, i know this cos you dont even like SD"

[Benjamin]

Also I apologise for calling the thread ridulous, what I should have said is the way some people are carrying on is ridiculous.

[Liam-]

The 'problem' that people are referring to, doesn't just happen in SD, it happens all across the forum when people can't control themselves and get carried away into personal and offensive slanging matches, like proverbial gorillas and their crap, so I don't see why the people who are regulars in SD are trying to make out like it only happens to them, the way to solve this 'problem' is to not post things that the mods could deem as inappropriate and worthy of removal, easier and more enjoyable time for all.

[Cherie]

No, but I can read them before they get deleted. But continue your attitude like that, it'll get you far with the issues you raised in the OP I'm sure.

Josy has agreed to look at it :hee: any attitude after that post is in response to the attitude I'm receiving

[Cherie]

Well you certainly wont take critique haha, theres seven pages worth of "mods should invest more time into me" and "no youre wrong, i know this cos you dont even like SD"

Depends who is giving the critique :hee:

[Benjamin]

Josy has agreed to look at it :hee: any attitude after that post is in response to the attitude I'm receiving

I never gave you any attitude. So you're aiming it at the wrong person.

[Cherie]

Also I apologise for calling the thread ridulous, what I should have said is the way some people are carrying on is ridiculous.

Okay get personal if it makes you happy

[Jessica.]

This thread..

http://i.imgur.com/lyluRT6.gif

[Cherie]

Also I apologise for calling the thread ridulous, what I should have said is the way some people are carrying on is ridiculous.

I never gave you any attitude. So you're aiming it at the wrong person.

Okay

[Benjamin]

Okay

I said 'some people'. Did not imply it was you, but some people have been. However the last few responses you've made to me see you teetering into that category when I was not at all digging at yourself.

[kirklancaster]

The 'problem' that people are referring to, doesn't just happen in SD, it happens all across the forum when people can't control themselves and get carried away into personal and offensive slanging matches, like proverbial gorillas and their crap, so I don't see why the people who are regulars in SD are trying to make out like it only happens to them, the way to solve this 'problem' is to not post things that the mods could deem as inappropriate and worthy of removal, easier and more enjoyable time for all.

There was no slanging match in my case though Liam - none at all. It just did not happen like that.

[Crimson Dynamo]

This thread..

http://i.imgur.com/lyluRT6.gif

Look forward to your posts in SD jess...

:fc:

[Jessica.]

Look forward to your posts in SD jess...

:fc:

I have posted there a lot of times actually. :shrug:

2% of my posts are in SD apparently :hugesmile:

[kirklancaster]

Well you certainly wont take critique haha, theres seven pages worth of "mods should invest more time into me" and "no youre wrong, i know this cos you dont even like SD"

What do you exactly 'get' out of this Withano?

Cherie is not some ogre, nor am I, nor is LT or BOTS.

If any of us feel that we have a legitimate query, complaint, or grouse, then we should know better than you or anyone else not principally involved.

Cherie - in particular - has every right to create this thread.

You seem to be gaining perverse pleasure out of hounding people for no other reason than 'hounding's sake', or to try to prove how clever you are.

Well, none of us give a drachma for how clever you are, and I think that Cherie has answered enough of your irreverent questions for one night.

Can we give it a rest now please?

[Benjamin]

I have posted there a lot of times actually. :shrug:

2% of my posts are in SD apparently :hugesmile:

Ahh how do you find the percentages? Is it listed somewhere on your profile?

[Jessica.]

Can we give it a rest now please?

You can't just tell anyone to give it a rest, that is censorship. :fist:

Throughout this thread, you and the others have been acting as if nobody else is allowed to have an opinion unless they agree with you. Every post defending the mods has been branded ignored and every person who disagrees with all of you is not allowed to have an opinion because they don't post in SD as much as you. Posts get deleted all over the forum but only your group of special snowflakes has caused such a ruckus about it. Are posts in SD the only ones that matter? If I had an innocent post deleted outside of SD is my opinion still invalid? :joker:

[Ashley.]

You can't just tell anyone to give it a rest, that is censorship. :fist:

Throughout this thread, you and the others have been acting as if nobody else is allowed to have an opinion unless they agree with you. Every post defending the mods has been branded ignored and every person who disagrees with all of you is not allowed to have an opinion because they don't post in SD as much as you. Posts get deleted all over the forum but only your group of special snowflakes has caused such a ruckus about it. Are posts in SD the only ones that matter? If I had an innocent post deleted outside of SD is my opinion still invalid? :joker:

:love:

[Cherie]

You can't just tell anyone to give it a rest, that is censorship. :fist:

Throughout this thread, you and the others have been acting as if nobody else is allowed to have an opinion unless they agree with you. Every post defending the mods has been branded ignored and every person who disagrees with all of you is not allowed to have an opinion because they don't post in SD as much as you. Posts get deleted all over the forum but only your group of special snowflakes has caused such a ruckus about it. Are posts in SD the only ones that matter? If I had an innocent post deleted outside of SD is my opinion still invalid? :joker:

Yes it is invalid because you said you don't care if your posts are deleted...so on the one hand you care on the other hand you don't care ..which is it ..are you a snowflake or not :laugh:

[Jessica.]

Ahh how do you find the percentages? Is it listed somewhere on your profile?

I literally did a search of the SD section only, for posts submitted by my username. Then I calculated what percentage that number is of my overall post count. That's the only way, sorry. :joker:

[Cherie]

8 pages now folks :love:

[caprimint]

Well you certainly wont take critique haha, theres seven pages worth of "mods should invest more time into me" and "no youre wrong, i know this cos you dont even like SD"
This thread isn't one that I've been passionate enough to respond to yet because I don't post in serious debates/rarely have my posts ever gotten deleted, but I don't think Cherie is saying she wants mods to invest their time into her, that's kinda turning the context into something else entirely. :shrug: I get her point, perhaps sometimes clarification is necessary.

In response to what the thread is actually about - I would say that the times I've noticed posts getting deleted are because they engage in or encourage an argument that could potentially or has gotten out of hand so deleting posts essentially stops that. Obviously it can be annoying if your post was 'innocent' but it is probably easier to delete the whole lot rather than leave random ones because people will be curious as to what it was about and the circle starts again.

[Cherie]

I literally did a search of the SD section only, for posts submitted by my username. Then I calculated what percentage that number is of my overall post count. That's the only way, sorry. :joker:

Oh :hehe: waits for the...get a life brigade ...

[Benjamin]

I literally did a search of the SD section only, for posts submitted by my username. Then I calculated what percentage that number is of my overall post count. That's the only way, sorry. :joker:

Oh haha, I thought we had a new function. :laugh:

[Cherie]

This thread isn't one that I've been passionate enough to respond to yet because I don't post in serious debates/rarely have my posts ever gotten deleted, but I don't think Cherie is saying she wants mods to invest their time into her, that's kinda turning the context into something else entirely. :shrug: I get her point, perhaps sometimes clarification is necessary.

In response to what the thread is actually about - I would say that the times I've noticed posts getting deleted are because they engage in or encourage an argument that could potentially or has gotten out of hand so deleting posts essentially stops that. Obviously it can be annoying if your post was 'innocent' but it is probably easier to delete the whole lot rather than leave random ones because people will be curious as to what it was about and the circle starts again.



Thank you...for cutting through the crap and actually getting it

[kirklancaster]

You can't just tell anyone to give it a rest, that is censorship. :fist:

Throughout this thread, you and the others have been acting as if nobody else is allowed to have an opinion unless they agree with you. Every post defending the mods has been branded ignored and every person who disagrees with all of you is not allowed to have an opinion because they don't post in SD as much as you. Posts get deleted all over the forum but only your group of special snowflakes has caused such a ruckus about it. Are posts in SD the only ones that matter? If I had an innocent post deleted outside of SD is my opinion still invalid? :joker:

This is just not true Jessica.

Show me where I have been acting as if nobody else is allowed to have an opinion?

I do not care who posts in SD or who doesn't, or who posts in here.

It is not the ACT of posting which I have a problem with - it is the MOTIVE for posting AND whether what is being posted is relevant and true.

But - you are, of course, free to feel what you want.

I have ALWAYS been civil and polite and friendly to everyone on here - even after I have long become aware that those qualities were not being reciprocated by some, and I only treat others how they treat me when all else has failed.

I am learning lessons over the past few weeks.

[Firewire]

No offence but Clinton vs Trump is not a serious debate

Mariah vs Whiteny IS however a serious debate

[Kizzy]

I have deleted some posts from this thread.

(:hee:)

They better not be mine sonny jim! :fist:





ly rly

[Jessica.]

Yes it is invalid because you said you don't care if your posts are deleted...so on the one hand you care on the other hand you don't care ..which is it ..are you a snowflake or not :laugh:

Please provide a quote where I stated that I don't actually care. :)

I don't want my posts to be deleted as much as anyone else.

I have disputed the deletion of my posts in the past. My point is that I know I can't get everything I want and that is a part of life. I may be bothered for a short time but I move on, Niamh deleted one of my posts recently to prevent it from being misinterpreted and I didn't like that but I have not made a thread to dispute her place as a moderator, I have not encouraged other people who were moderated by her to call her out with me and I most certainly have not rendered everyone outside of C&G, where the deletion occurred, invalid of having an opinion on the deletion of posts, because my own posts and the posts of people "on my side" are more important.

I also think that ganging up on one moderator and victimizing him about this because he participates in the threads he moderates is really uncalled for.

[Kizzy]

Oh :hehe: waits for the...get a life brigade ...

Did you say PC brigade....Here I a...Oh, the get a life brigade?

http://i.imgur.com/oOmlbne.gif

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

Cherie is not some ogre, nor am I, nor is LT or BOTS.

http://i.imgur.com/o81rkGV.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/wKIZniP.jpg

[Ross.]

So what's going on

http://i.imgur.com/iFv0MoT.gif

[Firewire]

http://i.imgur.com/o81rkGV.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/wKIZniP.jpg

:laugh2:

[Kizzy]

I said 'some people'. Did not imply it was you, but some people have been. However the last few responses you've made to me see you teetering into that category when I was not at all digging at yourself.

Not 'some people'? I hate 'some people'....'some people' cause 99.9% of the issues in SD!

'Some people' can kiss my arse! :fist:

[Denver]

https://media4.giphy.com/media/ieE0kUX5nanmg/200.gif#37

[Crimson Dynamo]

http://i.imgur.com/o81rkGV.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/wKIZniP.jpg

I perhaps Lol'd a touch

[kirklancaster]

Please provide a quote where I stated that I don't actually care. :)

I don't want my posts to be deleted as much as anyone else.

I have disputed the deletion of my posts in the past. My point is that I know I can't get everything I want and that is a part of life. I may be bothered for a short time but I move on, Niamh deleted one of my posts recently to prevent it from being misinterpreted and I didn't like that but I have not made a thread to dispute her place as a moderator, I have not encouraged other people who were moderated by her to call her out with me and I most certainly have not rendered everyone outside of C&G, where the deletion occurred, invalid of having an opinion on the deletion of posts, because my own posts and the posts of people "on my side" are more important.

I also think that ganging up on one moderator and victimizing him about this because he participates in the threads he moderates is really uncalled for.

That emboldened sentence is just not what is happening in my case Jessica.

And I totally disagree about any 'victimising' - in fact Dezzy's name has barely been mentioned in this thread.

Any thread on any topic will draw to it members who have an opinion on that topic.

I am referring to genuine opinion NOT opportunistic 'veiled' Trolling and Baiting from personal 'axe-grinding' motives.

This subject is no different, and if several members independently feel that they have had a genuine unfair experience at the hands of a 'Mod', and that 'Mod' turns out to be the same person, then that is not 'ganging up' and it is not victimising anyone.

Dialogue is the only way to resolve any problems such as this, and irrational hostile or untrue comments through misplaced loyalty, by people who were not, and are not, 'principally' involved in the individual issues, is tantamount to stifling that dialogue and, if unrestrained, is what actually leads to 'victimisation - of the ones who are claiming a grievance.

A lot has been written and intimated at, that this thread is 'Much Ado About Nothing' but that is wholly dismissive and unfair to the members who feel strongly enough about their claims, that they enter what is after all 'The Lion's Den' to air those claims.

One thoroughly decent and active long-serving member has quit the forum because of his depth of feelings about his own particular issue - Does that lend weight to any argument that this entire matter is spurious?

No one is painting anyone out to be any kind of habitual monster - that is just not the case - but I have a genuine grievance, and I am attempting to resolve it in a mature and amicable manner.

[Black Dagger]

I literally know I'm **** and aim to be hated in life. I don't need to be sensitive girl.

[Denver]

https://media1.giphy.com/media/3Dey49c600IU/200.gif#188

Can we sort out the real problems in life please

[Kizzy]

I literally know I'm **** and aim to be hated in life. I don't need to be sensitive girl.

:( What a strange thing to say.
I hope you're joking.

[Cherie]

Did you say PC brigade....Here I a...Oh, the get a life brigade?

http://i.imgur.com/oOmlbne.gif

http://i.imgur.com/o81rkGV.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/wKIZniP.jpg

:joker:

[Kizzy]

I think we all know why posts are deleted in SD ...

FOR BEING MEAN TO ME!!!

Every god damn day some shmuck has a pop at me and I'm like, 'oh that's not very nice, that hurts my feels'... BECAUSE I AM A DELICATE FLOWER!!!

[Denver]

I think we all knoW why posts are deleted in SD ...

FOR BEING MEAN TO ME!!!

Every god damn day some shmuck has a pop at me and I'm like, 'oh that's not very nice, that hurts my feels'... BECAUSE I AM A DELICATE FLOWER!!!

https://media4.giphy.com/media/d7gjBWon115Ac/200.gif#58

[Cherie]

I think we all knoW why posts are deleted in SD ...

FOR BEING MEAN TO ME!!!

Every god damn day some shmuck has a pop at me and I'm like, 'oh that's not very nice, that hurts my feels'... BECAUSE I AM A DELICATE FLOWER!!!

Well it's either you or Dezzy allegedly...



Disclaimer...other forum members and mods are available

[Withano]

What do you exactly 'get' out of this Withano?

Cherie is not some ogre, nor am I, nor is LT or BOTS.

If any of us feel that we have a legitimate query, complaint, or grouse, then we should know better than you or anyone else not principally involved.

Cherie - in particular - has every right to create this thread.

You seem to be gaining perverse pleasure out of hounding people for no other reason than 'hounding's sake', or to try to prove how clever you are.

Well, none of us give a drachma for how clever you are, and I think that Cherie has answered enough of your irreverent questions for one night.

Can we give it a rest now please?

I have only ever responded to people who first quote me in this thread. Every single time. If Cherie didnt want to engage in a coversation with me, she had a very simple way to do this by simply ignoring any one of my posts. The first of which was in no way aimed at her, she just decided to snipe. Pretty sure I havent talked to Bots at all, and LT and yourself just once in response to your comments on my posts. However the Last time I did this to you, you kicked up a fuss about how my opinion matters less than yours or something, how you was allowed to quote my posts but not vice versa? I dont know, I dont think you know either.. but its starting to be a habit of yours, have a feeling you feel this makes you win arguments.

I dont get anything out of it but i will stand up for myself if people want to quote me in something, wont want to encourage your bullying ways kirk regardless of how many names you throw into this gang of VIP, principally involved people youve made yourself (prinicpally being an odd word choice, i too have had several posts deleted, i just dont feel entitled to a full explanation every single time, or indeed any time, i think this is the general consensus to many outside your VIP gang if you needed the summary youve missed up to now).

And also if people want to set more work for mods to do because they feel under-valued? Mis-treated? Confused? Then thats a topic for the entire forum. My opinion is, lets not give mods more jobs cos lets at least try to sympathise. If you dont want to discuss this, then dont quote it, simple really.

[Withano]

You can't just tell anyone to give it a rest, that is censorship. :fist:

Throughout this thread, you and the others have been acting as if nobody else is allowed to have an opinion unless they agree with you. Every post defending the mods has been branded ignored and every person who disagrees with all of you is not allowed to have an opinion because they don't post in SD as much as you. Posts get deleted all over the forum but only your group of special snowflakes has caused such a ruckus about it. Are posts in SD the only ones that matter? If I had an innocent post deleted outside of SD is my opinion still invalid? :joker:

Exactly true

[Kizzy]

Well it's either you or Dezzy allegedly...



Disclaimer...other forum members and mods are available

Eh?... I can't delete stuff :laugh:

But if you mean posts are being removed for sniping at me specifically, then I only have one thing to say....
https://images.gr-assets.com/hostedimages/1440884764ra/16036767.gif

[Maru]

I think it's pretty evident that quite a few thin skins exist in S&D... maybe some members need to just use the ignore function more often or work on building a thicker skin if they can't tell the difference between baiting and invitations into intelligent discourse. Think of it as an act of self-compassion for yourself and other users... to save yourself the emotional energy and time. Don't force yourself to have to deal with the same arguments over and over especially if you already know have nothing to do with you or your point.... learn from it if you find that you are not hitting the target with your point... then maybe work on the mechanics of debate and separating yourself from your opinions... but there will always be people on the net who don't use the medium properly and are always projecting their own preconceptions onto others. That's not to do with you and I, so I think respectful to add them to ignore or to scan their posts and avoid misunderstandings.

I've been on the net long enough to know certain writing patterns and where it typically goes. I've had my share of humble soup and toughened my skin through plenty of debates and awful flamewars :laugh: when the net was just this new novelty item in our living room. Anyway, some people are just not meant to be engaged in internet discourse together... it's like oil and water. They're too different and can't learn from each other in argument... at least not maybe yet. It's not really a personal thing for me really... I take it a considerate gesture when someone tells me plainly why my posts are not their cup of tea... nothing more valuable to me than my time, so I think also mutually respectful to have respect for their time and energy as well.

[Kizzy]

I have only ever responded to people who first quote me in this thread. Every single time. If Cherie didnt want to engage in a coversation with me, she had a very simple way to do this by simply ignoring any one of my posts. The first of which was in no way aimed at her, she just decided to snipe. Pretty sure I havent talked to Bots at all, and LT and yourself just once in response to your comments on my posts. However the Last time I did this to you, you kicked up a fuss about how my opinion matters less than yours or something, how you was allowed to quote my posts but not vice versa? I dont know, I dont think you know either.. but its starting to be a habit of yours, have a feeling you feel this makes you win arguments.

I dont get anything out of it but i will stand up for myself if people want to quote me in something, wont want to encourage your bullying ways kirk regardless of how many names you throw into this gang of VIP, principally involved people youve made yourself (prinicpally being an odd word choice, i too have had several posts deleted, i just dont feel entitled to a full explanation every single time, or indeed any time, i think this is the general consensus to many outside your VIP gang if you needed the summary youve missed up to now).

And also if people want to set more work for mods to do because they feel under-valued? Mis-treated? Confused? Then thats a topic for the entire forum. My opinion is, lets not give mods more jobs cos lets at least try to sympathise. If you dont want to discuss this, then dont quote it, simple really.

Nice post Withano :)

[caprimint]

I dont get anything out of it but i will stand up for myself if people want to quote me in something, wont want to encourage your bullying ways kirk regardless of how many names you throw into this gang of VIP, principally involved people youve made yourself (prinicpally being an odd word choice, i too have had several posts deleted, i just dont feel entitled to a full explanation every single time, or indeed any time, i think this is the general consensus to many outside your VIP gang if you needed the summary youve missed up to now).

To label 'Kirk and his bullying ways' is kinda a big deal considering I'm 99% sure your post is serious. Kirk is honestly one of the fairest and most civil posters I've seen engage in discussion on here even when things get heated. I've never seen him be particularly rude/unpleasant to anyone, let alone the bully accusation being called up.

[Jessica.]

I have only ever responded to people who first quote me in this thread. Every single time. If Cherie didnt want to engage in a coversation with me, she had a very simple way to do this by simply ignoring any one of my posts. The first of which was in no way aimed at her, she just decided to snipe. Pretty sure I havent talked to Bots at all, and LT and yourself just once in response to your comments on my posts. However the Last time I did this to you, you kicked up a fuss about how my opinion matters less than yours or something, how you was allowed to quote my posts but not vice versa? I dont know, I dont think you know either.. but its starting to be a habit of yours, have a feeling you feel this makes you win arguments.

I dont get anything out of it but i will stand up for myself if people want to quote me in something, wont want to encourage your bullying ways kirk regardless of how many names you throw into this gang of VIP, principally involved people youve made yourself (prinicpally being an odd word choice, i too have had several posts deleted, i just dont feel entitled to a full explanation every single time, or indeed any time, i think this is the general consensus to many outside your VIP gang if you needed the summary youve missed up to now).

And also if people want to set more work for mods to do because they feel under-valued? Mis-treated? Confused? Then thats a topic for the entire forum. My opinion is, lets not give mods more jobs cos lets at least try to sympathise. If you dont want to discuss this, then dont quote it, simple really.
:clap1: Another very good post from you.

[Ammi]

That emboldened sentence is just not what is happening in my case Jessica.

And I totally disagree about any 'victimising' - in fact Dezzy's name has barely been mentioned in this thread.

Any thread on any topic will draw to it members who have an opinion on that topic.

I am referring to genuine opinion NOT opportunistic 'veiled' Trolling and Baiting from personal 'axe-grinding' motives.

This subject is no different, and if several members independently feel that they have had a genuine unfair experience at the hands of a 'Mod', and that 'Mod' turns out to be the same person, then that is not 'ganging up' and it is not victimising anyone.

Dialogue is the only way to resolve any problems such as this, and irrational hostile or untrue comments through misplaced loyalty, by people who were not, and are not, 'principally' involved in the individual issues, is tantamount to stifling that dialogue and, if unrestrained, is what actually leads to 'victimisation - of the ones who are claiming a grievance.

A lot has been written and intimated at, that this thread is 'Much Ado About Nothing' but that is wholly dismissive and unfair to the members who feel strongly enough about their claims, that they enter what is after all 'The Lion's Den' to air those claims.

One thoroughly decent and active long-serving member has quit the forum because of his depth of feelings about his own particular issue - Does that lend weight to any argument that this entire matter is spurious?

No one is painting anyone out to be any kind of habitual monster - that is just not the case - but I have a genuine grievance, and I am attempting to resolve it in a mature and amicable manner.

..it might be personal opinion Kirk but it's still axe-grinding..by the very nature of a few threads in the last few days, it's axe-grinding...and this is not about 'independent voices' because independent voices would independantly voice what they felt they needed or wanted to voice directly to staff/admin...I imagine that many members would have and have thought over time that they had a genuine unfair experience at the hands of a mod, isn't that how it is/how it works that we always think it's unfair and genuine with our own involvement in something/when rules apply to us and we may not be happy about that...but that's just it, I think we also need to look at our own involvement/our own actions and what their contribution has been...and yes, a mod could very well turn out to be the same person on many occasions because of the ratio of staff to members and how active some staff are in general...but again, I just don't think that you're looking at 'the cause' and the need felt for post removal/infractions/bans etc of the same members...why does a specific mod do..?.../is also, why is it necessary to keep doing...time and time again, type thing...and it isn't just one mod anyway which is the reason why the warning at the top of SD has been refreshed so often to highlight it...that in itself is a warning in a way that if it was absorbed and we looked to ourselves, then there would be no need for removal of posts/infractions/bans etc...but we still have those as well which is very evident ...that can't be the responsibility of staff that we do, that's completely the responsibility and ownership of each individual person...and of course, disgruntled voices will group together in their disgruntlement, that my friend is the way it is, whether on or off the forum../negativity and disgruntlement finds 'partners' and like minds...and whether it be in SD or any other section of the forum..that grouping together doesn't give those voices any more credence...


..I'm very sorry that BOTS had made his decision not to post on the forum anymore or for the moment, he's someone who I enjoyed reading his thoughts and contributions and I hope he'll reconsider his decision with reflection (and distance..)...but there are lots of thoroughly decent and long serving members on the forum and in this thread who disagree with what is being accused...those voices have to be equally heard as well...anyway I think this thread is becoming exhausted..(in my opinion of course..)..I do agree with you completely that dialogue/communication is the best way to resolve...but I think that the starting point is very much to look at our own dialogue in threads and whether that contributes as well and how much it does...mods will have different ways of doing things as has been said, Niamh is prone to bold etc when she removes/warns etc because everyone is individual in methods and that's what makes a team gel together, their differences/but still a consistency of feeling a need to moderate more actively...but there is still the same theme running through...that theme of Josy having to refresh warnings, Niamh having to bold and Dezzy and Niamh having to warn/remove and infract/and for the same consistent things and with the same consistent members...(as well as other staff who may not participate but still observe and moderate..)...


..Kirk you said to me that I should step back or needed to and you inferred 'favouring' for a friend...well you also are a friend, I don't 'favour' with the voice I have..I only speak as I see, whether a friend or not...

[Ammi]

...actually just a quick add on...:laugh:...I have seen other mods be deemed as 'inappropriate' in their individuality...in fact actually most other mods...Nathan because he was non confrontational and tended to try to joke to diffuse was often criticised..Marc when he would post a funny gif/pic in 'heated threads'..Ben as well received lots of criticism, Josy has been targeted so much because of her 'moderating style' and has received constant criticism...Niamh as well has also been accused of bias and unprofessionalism...and all completely different personalities but one familiar with them all is that lack of taking responsibility and looking at the part played by the 'disgruntled'....


...also again it feels like not wanting to have an individually quashed in some way or edited in some way and then trying to do just that to someone else for who they are when they're posting a member...and not looking at the threads that have become familiar sadly../the vein of them has become aggressive and hostile by so many, targeting one person or a select few is unfair and wrong....

[Kazanne]

This thread isn't one that I've been passionate enough to respond to yet because I don't post in serious debates/rarely have my posts ever gotten deleted, but I don't think Cherie is saying she wants mods to invest their time into her, that's kinda turning the context into something else entirely. :shrug: I get her point, perhaps sometimes clarification is necessary.

In response to what the thread is actually about - I would say that the times I've noticed posts getting deleted are because they engage in or encourage an argument that could potentially or has gotten out of hand so deleting posts essentially stops that. Obviously it can be annoying if your post was 'innocent' but it is probably easier to delete the whole lot rather than leave random ones because people will be curious as to what it was about and the circle starts again.

:clap1::clap1::clap1::clap1:

[Withano]

To label 'Kirk and his bullying ways' is kinda a big deal considering I'm 99% sure your post is serious. Kirk is honestly one of the fairest and most civil posters I've seen engage in discussion on here even when things get heated. I've never seen him be particularly rude/unpleasant to anyone, let alone the bully accusation being called up.

I think he baits people into arguments a lot so I wouldnt go as far as you have at all. the word bully is more paraphrasing him, ive made the point to him before that its odd to cry bully on a debates forum.. but then again, it seems a few agree with the post so maybe it was appropriate.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Hopefully a very important point has been made and noted in this thread, and now we can all march off hand in hand to a bright new event horizon.

:)

Also maybe we will have some new people contributing to SD as they have taken a keen interest in this debate so it's a win win scenario

[Cherie]

4]Hopefully a very important point has been made and noted in this thread, and now we can all march off hand in hand to a bright new event horizon.[/B]

:)

Also maybe we will have some new people contributing to SD as they have taken a keen interest in this debate so it's a win win scenario

:)

[kirklancaster]

To label 'Kirk and his bullying ways' is kinda a big deal considering I'm 99% sure your post is serious. Kirk is honestly one of the fairest and most civil posters I've seen engage in discussion on here even when things get heated. I've never seen him be particularly rude/unpleasant to anyone, let alone the bully accusation being called up.

Thank you Caprimint. I sincerely appreciate this.

[Jessica.]

Hopefully a very important point has been made and noted in this thread, and now we can all march off hand in hand to a bright new event horizon.

:)

Also maybe we will have some new people contributing to SD as they have taken a keen interest in this debate so it's a win win scenario
How many times does it have to be said that this isn't just about SD before you get it into your brain? :worry:

[Kizzy]

To label 'Kirk and his bullying ways' is kinda a big deal considering I'm 99% sure your post is serious. Kirk is honestly one of the fairest and most civil posters I've seen engage in discussion on here even when things get heated. I've never seen him be particularly rude/unpleasant to anyone, let alone the bully accusation being called up.

Yeah? Well when you've been on the receiving end of one of his 'deleted scenes' mocking your politics and rubbishing your character, we'll talk.
Just because you haven't witnessed it does not mean it hasn't happened, I've never witnessed a murder, but I know they happen.

The reason you don't see them is because they are removed from the thread, either when a moderator sees them or I or another member reports them.

[caprimint]

Yeah? Well when you've been on the receiving end of one of his 'deleted scenes' mocking your politics and rubbishing your character, we'll talk.
Just because you haven't witnessed it does not mean it hasn't happened, I've never witnessed a murder, but I know they happen.

The reason you don't see them is because they are removed from the thread, either when a moderator sees them or I or another member reports them.
Well I haven't seen proof of it either so I'll continue to speak only based on my own experience rather than believing one side of the story. :) People can get pretty defensive over opinions/views when it comes to serious debates...I see Kirk as being a respectful person who puts forward a good argument and I don't think he would intentionally offend/insult someone.

[Crimson Dynamo]

How many times does it have to be said that this isn't just about SD before you get it into your brain? :worry:

well Jessica if you read what I said I did not connect the two, I just said that I hoped that we would get new people into SD as many of the "younger" members have been excitedly talking about it in the chat thread, mainly ones who never post there so wouldnt it be great to have them involved in SD.

Like yourself, I am sure you have some views on politics and world events like you have lots of views about moderation in this thread?

:)

[Kizzy]

Well I haven't seen proof of it either so I'll continue to speak only based on my own experience rather than believing one side of the story. :) People can get pretty defensive over opinions/views when it comes to serious debates...I see Kirk as being a respectful person who puts forward a good argument and I don't think he would intentionally offend/insult someone.

What side? there isn't a side...
Posts have been removed, it is not in question whether those posts deserve removal rather that the member who has had a post removed be informed of it.

Perhaps the offending comments were purely unintentional, that is a matter to be discussed between member and mod/admin isn't it?

[Jessica.]

well Jessica if you read what I said I did not connect the two, I just said that I hoped that we would get new people into SD as many of the "younger" members have been excitedly talking about it in the chat thread, mainly ones who never post there so wouldnt it be great to have them involved in SD.

Like yourself, I am sure you have some views on politics and world events like you have lots of views about moderation in this thread?

:)

I'm sure that's exactly what you meant. :rolleyes: You're so welcoming.

[Kizzy]

Hopefully a very important point has been made and noted in this thread, and now we can all march off hand in hand to a bright new event horizon.

:)

Also maybe we will have some new people contributing to SD as they have taken a keen interest in this debate so it's a win win scenario

http://images5.fanpop.com/image/photos/30100000/scar-and-the-hyenas-scar-30188660-350-279.jpg


:worry:

[Cherie]

http://images5.fanpop.com/image/photos/30100000/scar-and-the-hyenas-scar-30188660-350-279.jpg


:worry:

:joker:

[thesheriff443]

for the most part the forum works but members will also question mods descisions because mods are also members so there could be a conflict of interest, after all people in positions of trust abuse their positions. I'm not saying this is happening, but a persons personality comes across in the posts they make.
If you choose to post on a the forum you agree to accept the rules and that mods are members.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I'm sure that's exactly what you meant. :rolleyes: You're so welcoming.

Thank you and i wish you all the luck going forward to the future

:)

[caprimint]

What side? there isn't a side...
Posts have been removed, it is not in question whether those posts deserve removal rather that the member who has had a post removed be informed of it.

Perhaps the offending comments were purely unintentional, that is a matter to be discussed between member and mod/admin isn't it?
I'm talking about how you're describing Kirk's posts towards you. I've never seen this so I'm not about to believe it because you say so. :shrug:

Sure, unless you are willing to sort it out with him yourself because I am assuming that you have reported him based off what you are saying.

[Josy]

Can we not keep discussing other members please.

[Livia]

I don't have a problem with my posts being removed. I do have a problem with the fact that the appeals system was taken away from us because it was abused. I know how time consuming it must be to battle with an aggrieved FM but if you're going to censor you have to allow an appeal for mitigating circumstances. I'd like to see a reintroduction of appeals, something that can't be abused and take up a whole load of time... say, a 100 word maximum appeal followed by a final decision from mods/admin with no other correspondence being entered into.

Probably not the right place for this suggestion but I got on a roll...

[Mokka]

I don't have a problem with my posts being removed. I do have a problem with the fact that the appeals system was taken away from us because it was abused. I know how time consuming it must be to battle with an aggrieved FM but if you're going to censor you have to allow an appeal for mitigating circumstances. I'd like to see a reintroduction of appeals, something that can't be abused and take up a whole load of time... say, a 100 word maximum appeal followed by a final decision from mods/admin with no other correspondence being entered into.

Probably not the right place for this suggestion but I got on a roll...

I would like the same...at least the concept of appeal... in a format the mods can manage

[Josy]

I think its been brought up a few times and weve said each time there wont be another appeals section or the like, it just did not work and members can pm any mod to appeal something they aren't happy with.

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

a lot of the time when you pm a mod about an infraction all you get is "i didn't give that one" so like they can't do anything about it :unsure:

[Crimson Dynamo]

a lot of the time when you pm a mod about an infraction all you get is "i didn't give that one" so like they can't do anything about it :unsure:

not a mod - passing the buck - expose bombshell now?

:omgno:

Its like Watergate never happened


:ninja2:

[Mokka]

a lot of the time when you pm a mod about an infraction all you get is "i didn't give that one" so like they can't do anything about it :unsure:

And further more .. how likely if they were the ones to give it, are they to consider your argument. Especially if your post was deleted or you got an infraction during a debate they were involved in... ie) serious debates and let's say Dezzy.

[Vicky.]

And further more .. how likely if they were the ones to give it, are they to consider your argument. Especially if your post was deleted or you got an infraction during a debate they were involved in... ie) serious debates and let's say Dezzy.

I have overturned bans I have given, along with infractions too :shrug:

[thesheriff443]

I have overturned bans I have given, along with infractions too :shrug:

I can confirm this.

[Cherie]

I have overturned bans I have given, along with infractions too :shrug:

Queen :love:

[Crimson Dynamo]

end bans

and never ban again




where is alex?

[Denver]

I have overturned bans I have given, along with infractions too :shrug:

I appealed my ban to by pm to other mods and i didnt even get a response

[Firewire]

This is what I don't get....if it was at you...and you were not offended and didn't take issue with it... why is it infraction worthy?? Maybe it's an inside joke between you two :shrug:

Because mods know best when it comes to infractions

You should know this by now smh

[Crimson Dynamo]

I appealed my ban to by pm to other mods and i didnt even get a response

I got a 7 day ban earlier in the year and by the time I had walked the dog it had been revoked (true)


so I would get a dog

[Denver]

I got a 7 day ban earlier in the year and by the time I had walked the dog it had been revoked (true)


so I would get a dog

I already have one

[Mokka]

Because mods know best when it comes to infractions

You should know this by now smh

Yes... I suppose I should :idc:

[kirklancaster]

This is what I don't get....if it was at you...and you were not offended and didn't take issue with it... why is it infraction worthy?? Maybe it's an inside joke between you two :shrug:

I suppose that someone else reported it, but it certainly was not me. I'm used to Scott. :hee:

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

I suppose that someone else reported it, but it certainly was not me. I'm used to Scott. :hee:

queen of getting used to me

[Josy]

I have overturned bans I have given, along with infractions too :shrug:
Yeah same and I've also overturned bans and reversed infractions that others have given out when i feel it was unjustified after discussing it in admin forum.

I'm adding this here for the last time also stop using this and other suggestions threads to discuss your own infractions and bans.

And more importantly this targeting of certain mods stops now, some of you are doing the exact same thing you are accusing the mod of and even worse doing it with a pack mentality. Any problems you have should be taken to another mod or admin of your choice through pm or the contact us option.

We have this section for suggestions so we can discuss them in a civilised manner we also welcome constructive critisism about the forum but we will not tolerate blatant insults aimed at us.

[Kizzy]

Yeah same and I've also overturned bans and reversed infractions that others have given out when i feel it was unjustified after discussing it in admin forum.

I'm adding this here for the last time also stop using this and other suggestions threads to discuss your own infractions and bans.

And more importantly this targeting of certain mods stops now, some of you are doing the exact same thing you are accusing the mod of and even worse doing it with a pack mentality. Any problems you have should be taken to another mod or admin of your choice through pm or the contact us option.

We have this section for suggestions so we can discuss them in a civilised manner we also welcome constructive critisism about the forum but we will not tolerate blatant insults aimed at us.

Joz check your inbox there's a love...

[Josy]

Joz check your inbox there's a love...
I'm at work atm I'll answer any pms I have when I'm home

[Vicky.]

I appealed my ban to by pm to other mods and i didnt even get a response

How did you appeal it? I find it hard to believe more than one mod ignored a polite message about an unfair infraction/ban. However I can see why it would be ignored if it was full of 'omgs I am right, why wasn't X banned, *insert insult here*, biast, leaving the forum, rargh'