Why aren't people here talking about Marine le Pen more?

[Liberty4eva]

For months people would talk about Trump in the lead-up to the US election. Why not Marine le Pen? France is closer to the UK, afterall. :shrug:

[MB.]

What more is there to be discussed? She's a far right asshat and if she wins the election (which, looking at the polls, I'd like to think she won't, but given the past few major political results and the general ****show that is the current French election, it's bound to happen), France is just as screwed as the rest of us

There comes a certain point where neither ridicule and downplaying nor deep, pseudo-intellectual analysis do anything at all - the outcome will be the outcome, and if we've learnt anything from Trump it's that us loony liberal lefties in our big bubble only galvanize the kind of people who'd vote for Le Pen

[Cherie]

Good question, she far more extreme than Trump, she gets very little coverage in the media here

[Greg!]

Bc she has hardly any chance of winning

[Shaun]

I'd imagine because France is far more insignificant than the US, especially with our removal from the EU looming.

[Toy Soldier]

Ahh yes! The second in line to the world's greatest economic and military power! ... France. :facepalm:

[Northern Monkey]

I think there may be a protest vote.However that protest could be from the left.A pushback against the right and against Le Pen.

[Crimson Dynamo]

France do not produce movie stars or pop stars or TV programmes so will have very little impact on Tibb tbh

[Toy Soldier]

France do not produce movie stars or pop stars or TV programmes so will have very little impact on Tibb tbh

Are you actually going to pretend that France has the same level of global influence as the USA outside of "movies and pop songs" LT? Outdoing yourself today...

[Kizzy]

Because negative press coverage of Jeremy Corbyn is more important than warning of a fascistic uprising obv.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Are you actually going to pretend that France has the same level of global influence as the USA outside of "movies and pop songs" LT? Outdoing yourself today...

No as that was not my point

[Ronald.]

She's not nearly as comedic or interesting as Trump is (whether you like him or not). And she doesn't speak English so I suppose that has something to do with the lack of interest from most Brits. R.

[Niamh.]

She's not nearly as comedic or interesting as Trump is (whether you like him or not). And she doesn't speak English so I suppose that has something to do with the lack of interest from most Brits. R.

What logic is this Ronald? :hehe:

Trump has so much more comedic value. I was driving to work this morning and the radio show I was listening to even had a game called "Fake news" :laugh:

[Withano]

~80% of threads made about famous people are created by those who support them. Maybe nobody on tibb supports her.

[Ronald.]

What logic is this Ronald? :hehe:


What do you mean Niamh? R.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I will look into this paucity of threads in a potential alternative right situation and report back

:pipe:

[Niamh.]

What do you mean Niamh? R.

I mean your post is very logical :laugh:

[Ronald.]

I mean your post is very logical :laugh:

Oh ha ha yes. I thought you were saying there wasn't any! ha ha.

I was in a cafe the other day and heard a table of oaps saying how funny nigel farage was and that they enjoyed seeing him on the piers morgan star stories . I thought bloody hell but they seem to see him more human like. The difference between him and trump compared to marine is that she's not that funny (or at least the media don't think so) and less of an entertaining personality. R.

[Niamh.]

Oh ha ha yes. I thought you were saying there wasn't any! ha ha.

I was in a cafe the other day and heard a table of oaps saying how funny nigel farage was and that they enjoyed seeing him on the piers morgan star stories . I thought bloody hell but they seem to see him more human like. The difference between him and trump compared to marine is that she's not that funny (or at least the media don't think so) and less of an entertaining personality. R.

Nigel farage and Donald Trump are almost like real life cartoon characters :laugh:

[Ronald.]

Nigel farage and Donald Trump are almost like real life cartoon characters :laugh:

That they are. I agree. :joker: R.

[DemolitionRed]

She wants to organize a frexit which would mean pulling out of the euro, so it would have a massive financial impact on Europe.

[ebandit]

Nigel farage and Donald Trump are almost like real life cartoon characters :laugh:

...or that characters parody the likes of trump..........................trumped ya!

...to the OP pre US election interest was not just about trump but the

ongoing clinton v trump mud slinging

Mark L

[Ronald.]

...or that characters parody the likes of trump..........................trumped ya!

...to the OP pre US election interest was not just about trump but the

ongoing clinton v trump mud slinging

Mark L

Is your full stop button broken Mark? R.

[the truth]

What more is there to be discussed? She's a far right asshat and if she wins the election (which, looking at the polls, I'd like to think she won't, but given the past few major political results and the general ****show that is the current French election, it's bound to happen), France is just as screwed as the rest of us

There comes a certain point where neither ridicule and downplaying nor deep, pseudo-intellectual analysis do anything at all - the outcome will be the outcome, and if we've learnt anything from Trump it's that us loony liberal lefties in our big bubble only galvanize the kind of people who'd vote for Le Pen

its 100% the lefts fault

[the truth]

Nigel farage and Donald Trump are almost like real life cartoon characters :laugh:

yes heroic ones who actually tell the truth and dont sell everyone out to corporate corruption

[Niamh.]

yes heroic ones who actually tell the truth and dont sell everyone out to corporate corruption

Unlike Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck :nono:

[Withano]

yes heroic ones who actually tell the truth and dont sell everyone out to corporate corruption

(Trump made most of his money on the basic foundation of corporate corruption).

[Niamh.]

(Trump made most of his money on the basic foundation of corporate corruption).

ssshhhhh :hehe:

[Withano]

Superheroes yayyyyy

[Livia]

I don't think she'll win. I think she may come close... but then if the political results of the last couple of years have taught me anything, it's that anything is possible. Le Pen wants the French Franc back.... if she did win it could well be the end of the single currency. And then in the Autumn we've got the German election where Merkel is probably finished. Before all that though, we've got the Dutch general election on 15th March. It's going to be an interesting few months.

[Crimson Dynamo]

yes lets hope she loses and the other ones, you know the good ones, win

:umm2:

[Withano]

yes lets hope she loses and the other ones, you know the good ones, win

:umm2:

Makes sense to me, cant argue with this logic.

[Brillopad]

Makes sense to me, cant argue with this logic.

Can't argue with the logic that too much PC and the radical left are responsible for an increase in far-right support.

Dictatorships of any kind won't be tolerated in the West.

[Withano]

Can't argue with the logic that too much PC and the radical left are responsible for an increase in far-right support.

Dictatorships of any kind won't be tolerated in the West.

Why are far-right people basing their beliefs on the opposite beliefs of others? Wouldnt that make them really stupid? Do you know any of these people personally? Do they jump off cliffs because others avoid the edges, or does it only work with their political stance? Seems very odd.

[Brillopad]

Why are far-right people basing their beliefs on the opposite beliefs of others? Wouldnt that make them really stupid? Do you know any of these people personally? Do they jump off cliffs because others avoid the edges, or does it only work with their political stance? Seems very odd.

Wasn't left wing politics created from a reaction to social and political injustice!

Wasn't that basing their beliefs on the opposite beliefs of others!

Pushing too far one way tends to lead to a reaction the other way - a metophorical tug of war.

[Withano]

Wasn't left wing politics created from a reaction to social and political injustice!

Wasn't that basing their beliefs on the opposite beliefs of others!

Pushing too far one way tends to lead to a reaction the other way - a metophorical tug of war.

What beliefs did these far-right people have before their reactionary switch? I'm very interested in this, seems bizarre. Do you know any of these people?

[Brillopad]

What beliefs did these far-right people have before their reactionary switch? I'm very interested in this, seems bizarre. Do you know any of these people?

A different one to those of the far left. I know many people whose views vary from left to right, but not many on either extreme I am pleased to say. Does that satisfy your inquisive mind?

[Withano]

A different one to those of the far left. I know many people whose views vary from left to right, but not many on either extreme I am pleased to say. Does that satisfy your inquisive mind?

Hmm, no, not really.. i wanted to know more about the individuals who changed their political beliefs soley on the opposing beliefs of others
You claimed there was lots, so many in fact, that the left are entirely responsible for the far-right prominence, but now youre telling me you dont personally know any?
How do you know about them then? Is there an article about these people that neither of us personally know?

[Brillopad]

Hmm, no, not really.. i wanted to know more about the individuals who changed their political beliefs soley on the opposing beliefs of others
You claimed there was lots, so many in fact, that the left are entirely responsible for the far-right prominence, but now youre telling me you dont personally know any?
How do you know about them then? Is there an article about these people that neither of us personally know?

I base my comments on a mixture of my own opinions and people I know with similar views, generally centre and left to right leaning, and what I read and see and hear around me, just like most people. Those generally pretty sick of PC and its increasingly controlling views.

Have no time for those on either end of the spectrum.

[Northern Monkey]

What beliefs did these far-right people have before their reactionary switch? I'm very interested in this, seems bizarre. Do you know any of these people?

:joker:
You are being deliberately daft because i know you understand what Brillo is saying because i know you are pretty smart from your posts and you know what she is saying is true.

There obviously was always support for far right parties but not on the scale it is now and it is growing.
People with more generally centrist and centre right persuasions are turning to people like Le Pen because the current politicians are not addressing their concerns and are handling the refugee crisis and immigration terribly.
They see no alternative.Not to mention the growing EU scepticism accross Europe.
There are places accross mainland Europe which really are 'no go zones'.Worse than anything we have here fortunately for now.
There is a fair bit of desperation involved for many citizens who are experiencing the effects every day.

[Northern Monkey]

I think there may be a protest vote.However that protest could be from the left.A pushback against the right and against Le Pen.

However,I still think this will be the case

[Withano]

I base my comments on a mixture of my own opinions and people I know with similar views, generally centre and left to right leaning, and what I read and see and hear around me, just like most people. Those generally pretty sick of PC and its increasingly controlling views.

Have no time for those on either end of the spectrum.

yeh, i dont think i have much time for those on either end either, but just to clear things up

too much PC and the radical left are responsible for an increase in far-right support.

You don't know any of these people personally, nor do you have any source that acknowledges their existence?

[Brillopad]

yeh, i dont think i have much time for those on either end either, but just to clear things up



You don't know any of these people personally, nor do you have any source that acknowledges their existence?

So you don't believe that BRexit and Trump were at least in part a protest vote. I believe the votes spoke volumes as do many.

[Tom4784]

Can't argue with the logic that too much PC and the radical left are responsible for an increase in far-right support.

Dictatorships of any kind won't be tolerated in the West.

That's a silly argument.

'You believe in something that's opposed to my views so I'm going to support terrible ideas and candidates to **** everything up and it's ALL YOUR FAULT!'

No, it's the fault of stupid bigots that are mad that they can't be as bigoted as they like without judgement and other ignorant people that are foolish enough to vote without knowing the facts.

People who voted for Trump as a protest are ****ing idiots because now he's laying waste to the Healthcare reform that they depend on and he'll likely give all the power back to the Insurance companies because he's a corporate ***** through and through. But hey, he made some people feel like their racism was validated so who cares about that?

Protest votes as a whole are ****ing moronic.

[Crimson Dynamo]

^^^

classic post

insult member, insult millions

based on unfounded assumptions

unbelievable

[Withano]

So you don't believe that BRexit and Trump were at least in part a protest vote. I believe the votes spoke volumes as do many.

I dont think a protest vote is always anti-left, people vote for the loony party too. Thats probably where your argument is confused, i getchya now.

It is a bit weird you would call Trump and Brexit far right though.

[DemolitionRed]

Most of us are aware that Le Pen has promised to extend the ban on Muslim women wearing the hijab (headscarf) and on halal food in schools and other public settings.

Most aren't aware that she has equally promised to ban Jewish men from wearing the kippah (aka yamulka) and to ban kosher food from the same places.

France has the biggest Jewish population in Europe. I don't know if it is the biggest observant Jewish population, but there are certainly many observant Jews in France.

[Captain.Remy]

She is currently leading the polls here with 25%, so she will definitely be on the second round of the election.
However though, her party has done well in the recent local and regional elections by winning the first round, but losing the second due to the absence of alliances with other parties.
Her father qualified for the second round in 2002 against Chirac but lost heavily. Same thing will happen here. Either Macron or Fillon is our next President.

What you have to understand is that she is well-spoken, bold, "in your face" attitude, much better than her father was litterally the most offensive people French politics have ever had.
She knows her topics, she knows how to get attention, and due to the recent terrorist attacks and unemployment rate rising, she is chosen by so many people over here and get people to listen to her.

Even muslims and gays are voting for her, they want "France" back, but then France has always been an immigration country. We're in the middle of Europe, our health care system is the best in the world and our values are attracting. She's a b!tch that's all I can say.

[Crimson Dynamo]

She is currently leading the polls here with 25%, so she will definitely be on the second round of the election.
However though, her party has done well in the recent local and regional elections by winning the first round, but losing the second due to the absence of alliances with other parties.
Her father qualified for the second round in 2002 against Chirac but lost heavily. Same thing will happen here. Either Macron or Fillon is our next President.

What you have to understand is that she is well-spoken, bold, "in your face" attitude, much better than her father was litterally the most offensive people French politics have ever had.
She knows her topics, she knows how to get attention, and due to the recent terrorist attacks and unemployment rate rising, she is chosen by so many people over here and get people to listen to her.

Even muslims and gays are voting for her, they want "France" back, but then France has always been an immigration country. We're in the middle of Europe, our health care system is the best in the world and our values are attracting. She's a b!tch that's all I can say.

so who are the "good" french politicians and why have they allowed such uncontrolled immigration, unemployment and terrorism?

[DemolitionRed]

Whatever makes you think its uncontrolled immigration?

Its austerity that has caused unemployment.

[Brillopad]

That's a silly argument.

'You believe in something that's opposed to my views so I'm going to support terrible ideas and candidates to **** everything up and it's ALL YOUR FAULT!'

No, it's the fault of stupid bigots that are mad that they can't be as bigoted as they like without judgement and other ignorant people that are foolish enough to vote without knowing the facts.

People who voted for Trump as a protest are ****ing idiots because now he's laying waste to the Healthcare reform that they depend on and he'll likely give all the power back to the Insurance companies because he's a corporate ***** through and through. But hey, he made some people feel like their racism was validated so who cares about that?

Protest votes as a whole are ****ing moronic.

A whole lot less moronic than open borders.

The extreme left help create an extreme right, hardly rocket science.

[Crimson Dynamo]

The British press were 4.5 times more likely to mention Le Pen than her chief opponent, centrist frontrunner Emmanuel Macron, per an analysis of UK headlines by Buzzfeed News.

As a comparison, Trump got more than twice the amount of nightly news coverage that Hillary Clinton did.


All about the clicks: Buzzfeed found that the top 20 stories about Le Pen had more than 15k engagements on Facebook, while only the top story about Macron broke that number. Again, Trump did the same — getting 3 times as many page views per article than Clinton, according to parse.ly.

One headline that sums it all up from Foreign Policy: "Marine Le Pen Is Donald Trump Without the Crazy

https://www.axios.com/international-media-has-a-cow-over-marine-le-pen-2307665918.html

http://static.euronews.com/articles/359041/684x384_359041.jpg
http://img3.closermag.fr/var/closermag/storage/images/media/images-des-contenus/article/2016-10-06-marine-le-pen-demande-le-respect-de-sa-vie-privee-mes-enfants-ont-le-droit-de-vivre-tranquillement/marine-le-pen-lors-de-l-hommage-national-aux-harkis-aux-invalides.-paris-le-25-septembre-2016.-c-ch/5498522-3-fre-FR/Marine-Le-Pen-lors-de-l-hommage-national-aux-harkis-aux-Invalides.-Paris-le-25-septembre-2016.-C-Ch_square500x500.jpghttp://www.telegraph.co.uk/content/dam/news/2016/05/18/28716964_Marine_Le_PenFrench_far-right_party_leader_Marine_Le_Pen_gestures_as_she_a rrives_at_a_campa-xlarge_trans_NvBQzQNjv4Bq_WJBVU2NMeunfYi934I3reUJC upFXNFmLUo_JcznC10.jpg
http://g8fip1kplyr33r3krz5b97d1.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/GettyImages-540932426-714x422.jpg

[arista]

"centrist frontrunner Emmanuel Macron"

Yes LT
many say he or that Lady will win.


Its a slow slog to May elections
there , though.

[Northern Monkey]

That's a silly argument.

'You believe in something that's opposed to my views so I'm going to support terrible ideas and candidates to **** everything up and it's ALL YOUR FAULT!'

No, it's the fault of stupid bigots that are mad that they can't be as bigoted as they like without judgement and other ignorant people that are foolish enough to vote without knowing the facts.

People who voted for Trump as a protest are ****ing idiots because now he's laying waste to the Healthcare reform that they depend on and he'll likely give all the power back to the Insurance companies because he's a corporate ***** through and through. But hey, he made some people feel like their racism was validated so who cares about that?

Protest votes as a whole are ****ing moronic.I think you maybe slightly missing the point.Most people aren't so obsessive about left/right etc.I don't think they're starting to lean more right wing just to spite the left(although some undoubtedly will be) but because they see what a mess the current politicians are making.They feel let down and disenfranchised so they are reaching out for something new and different.After all if the current governments are already ****ing everything up then what's to lose?Things may actually change.
I think the far right is the wrong choice.I think "far" anything is the wrong choice tbh.
But with such a small choice and no real sensible centre ground options people have to make the best of what they have to work with.

Also politics seems to be like a tug of war.People get sick of the current state and lean the opposite way.
I think that may be a big part of why Corbyn got so many votes.

[Tom4784]

A whole lot less moronic than open borders.

The extreme left help create an extreme right, hardly rocket science.

You're proving me right, I reckon as long as someone takes a stand against immigration you'd probably support them regardless of their other policies and that's the problem with the voters. Trump is pretty much cancer to anyone who isn't a millionaire but he's got a lot of support from the working and middle classes despite the fact that it was obvious he'd do nothing but **** on them from a great height, they didn't pay attention because they were all like 'Yay! He's getting rid of Mexicans and Muslims!'

It's a similar story with Brexit, immigration became the number 1 issue that decided the vote although immigration won't even be affected either way.

The alt right has come about in opposition of a world that's growing more tolerant, to blame the left for them is moronic, nobody made the alt right racist or bigoted, that's on them so stop making excuses and blaming other people for a bigot's opinion.

[Brillopad]

You're proving me right, I reckon as long as someone takes a stand against immigration you'd probably support them regardless of their other policies and that's the problem with the voters. Trump is pretty much cancer to anyone who isn't a millionaire but he's got a lot of support from the working and middle classes despite the fact that it was obvious he'd do nothing but **** on them from a great height, they didn't pay attention because they were all like 'Yay! He's getting rid of Mexicans and Muslims!'

It's a similar story with Brexit, immigration became the number 1 issue that decided the vote although immigration won't even be affected either way.

The alt right has come about in opposition of a world that's growing more tolerant, to blame the left for them is moronic, nobody made the alt right racist or bigoted, that's on them so stop making excuses and blaming other people for a bigot's opinion.

Bigot = a person who is intolerant to people with different opinions, so therefore that definition applies as much to you as to those you accuse, so you are really not in a position to keep throwing the word around willy nilly.

As for your predictions on future immigration I prefer to listen to the experts not those trying hard to convince themselves as well as others. Time will tell.

[Tom4784]

I think you maybe slightly missing the point.Most people aren't so obsessive about left/right etc.I don't think they're starting to lean more right wing just to spite the left(although some undoubtedly will be) but because they see what a mess the current politicians are making.They feel let down and disenfranchised so they are reaching out for something new and different.After all if the current governments are already ****ing everything up then what's to lose?Things may actually change.
I think the far right is the wrong choice.I think "far" anything is the wrong choice tbh.
But with such a small choice and no real sensible centre ground options people have to make the best of what they have to work with.

Also politics seems to be like a tug of war.People get sick of the current state and lean the opposite way.
I think that may be a big part of why Corbyn got so many votes.

There's not much of a point to miss, I was responding to Brillo's fatally flawed logic that the left are responsible for the Alt right movement which is just plain silly. the Alt Right came about because racists and bigots were mad that they couldn't be as racist and bigoted as they could before without judgement. That's the long and short of it.

In the case of the US election there was a centre ground nominee but she didn't win because people ignored the warning signs that came with Trump and voted for him because of his stance on immigration. Trump is an extremist and he was the only extremist candidate of the two, Hillary was anything but a member of the extreme left so I reject that there were no 'centre ground options' in that case. People CHOSE the extremist option because they want to believe that taking a stance against people of different skin colour to theirs' will fix their problems.

I don't think that Corbyn is comparable as a protest vote really, Labour is the Tory's only real opposition so if Corbyn brings it back from the brink it'll likely be because Labour (especially under Corbyn) will likely defend public services from privatisation and plus Labour has a history of treating the working class better than the Tories.

[Tom4784]

Bigot = a person who is intolerant to people with different opinions, so therefore that definition applies as much to you as to those you accuse, so you are really not in a position to keep throwing the word around willy nilly.

As for your predictions on future immigration I prefer to listen to the experts not those trying hard to convince themselves as well as others. Time will tell.

Ah, that tired old argument. It was a stupid argument then and it still is now. To accuse me of bigotry is truly desperate and laughable.

You'll only listen to experts when they'll tell you what you want to hear which is never. The leavers certainly didn't listen to the experts when it came to Brexit....in fact I remember the Brexit camp saying that they were 'tired' of experts (more like tired of not being told what they want to hear).

[Brillopad]

Ah, that tired old argument. It was a stupid argument then and it still is now. To accuse me of bigotry is truly desperate and laughable.

You'll only listen to experts when they'll tell you what you want to hear which is never. The leavers certainly didn't listen to the experts when it came to Brexit....in fact I remember the Brexit camp saying that they were 'tired' of experts (more like tired of not being told what they want to hear).

That's the definition and you are clearly intolerant of people with different opinions. You can't argue with the dictionary.

What experts on Brexit - there weren't any.

[Tom4784]

That's the definition and you are clearly intolerant of people with different opinions. You can't argue with the dictionary.

What experts on Brexit - there weren't any.

How am I intolerant of other people's opinions? My entire mantra in serious debates is basically that anyone can have an opinion and anyone can disagree with that opinion. I've literally said that a thousand times. My opinion is that both the Brexit and the recent US election were decided by ignorance, that's not being intolerant of other opinions, that's simply having my own. The only intolerant person here is you given how hard you're trying to shut my opinion down. Brillo being proven to be a hypocrite once again *takes a shot.*

There were plenty of experts of all walks of life who were critical of Brexit, once again you're proving me correct because you obviously didn't pay attention to what the experts were saying in regards to Brexit when it isn't something you want to hear.

[Brillopad]

How am I intolerant of other people's opinions? My entire mantra in serious debates is basically that anyone can have an opinion and anyone can disagree with that opinion. I've literally said that a thousand times. My opinion is that both the Brexit and the recent US election were decided by ignorance, that's not being intolerant of other opinions, that's simply having my own. The only intolerant person here is you given how hard you're trying to shut my opinion down. Brillo being proven to be a hypocrite once again *takes a shot.*

There were plenty of experts of all walks of life who were critical of Brexit, once again you're proving me correct because you obviously didn't pay attention to what the experts were saying in regards to Brexit when it isn't something you want to hear.

We are all entitled to our opinions but you often get quite aggressive in your comebacks which demonstrates intolerance. You may well be able to say the same about me but I am not the one continually calling others bigots.

There were 'experts' on both sides in the Brexit debate so at the end of the day it comes down to opinion and who you agree with. There is no defined right or wrong in this.

Personally I am still firmly of the opinion that long term Brexit and independence from Europe and all its controlling rules and regulations will be good for Britain.

Despite your protestations you have proved nothing.

[Tom4784]

We are all entitled to our opinions but you often get quite aggressive in your comebacks which demonstrates intolerance. You may well be able to say the same about me but I am not the one continually calling others bigots.

There were 'experts' on both sides in the Brexit debate so at the end of the day it comes down to opinion and who you agree with. There is no defined right or wrong in this.

Personally I am still firmly of the opinion that long term Brexit and independence from Europe and all its controlling rules and regulations will be good for Britain.

Despite your protestations you have proved nothing.

It's Serious Debates, love, I'm debating. Intolerance is intolerance, I've not been intolerant of anyone else's opinions, you are allowed to have them and I'm allowed to disagree. You call me intolerant yet you try to shut my opinion down regularly because it doesn't suit you. Once again you are showing that you are strangely sensitive to people using the word 'bigot' then WHY they are using it.

Oh? Last post you said this 'What experts on Brexit - there weren't any.' and now you are saying there were experts on both sides? What's the truth? Do you even know?

[Brillopad]

It's Serious Debates, love, I'm debating. Intolerance is intolerance, I've not been intolerant of anyone else's opinions, you are allowed to have them and I'm allowed to disagree. You call me intolerant yet you try to shut my opinion down regularly because it doesn't suit you. Once again you are showing that you are strangely sensitive to people using the word 'bigot' then WHY they are using it.

Oh? Last post you said this 'What experts on Brexit - there weren't any.' and now you are saying there were experts on both sides? What's the truth? Do you even know?

Supposed 'experts' - hence the inverted commas. Thought that was clear love. I know that I know thanks.

There you go with your aggressive sexist put-downs. I'm not sensitive to them but will point out double standards when I see them especially when directed at me.

[Tom4784]

Supposed 'experts' - hence the inverted commas. Thought that was clear love. I know that I know thanks.

There you go with your aggressive sexist put-downs. I'm not sensitive to them but will point out double standards when I see them especially when directed at me.

I love it when you try to paint me as sexist when I'm probably more of a feminist than you are.

As for the experts point, it was only the remain side that had spoken out about experts simply because most of them thought that Brexit was a bad idea. Your whole generic statement which is basically a desperate attempt to regain footing doesn't change the fact that the Remain camp encouraged voters to disregard experts and their research because it didn't suit their agenda.

[Brillopad]

I love it when you try to paint me as sexist when I'm probably more of a feminist than you are.

As for the experts point, it was only the remain side that had spoken out about experts simply because most of them thought that Brexit was a bad idea. Your whole generic statement which is basically a desperate attempt to regain footing doesxn't change the fact that the Remain camp encouraged voters to disregard experts and their research because it didn't suit their agenda.

You amount of times you throw out words such as love, darling , dear etc when in disagreement with female posters suggests to me you aren't as feminist as you like to think you are.

Why would I need to regain footing in this argument - as far as I can see you haven't provided any arguments that would require any loss of footing in any argument against your arguments.

You have an agenda, I have an agenda, we all have agendas - and we all argue accordingly. So just a pointless jibe that proves nothing.

[Tom4784]

You amount of times you throw out words such as love, darling , dear etc when in disagreement with female posters suggests to me you aren't as feminist as you like to think you are.

Why would I need to regain footing in this argument - as far as I can see you haven't provided any arguments that would require any loss of footing in any argument against your arguments.

You have an agenda, I have an agenda, we all have agendas - and we all argue accordingly. So just a pointless jibe that proves nothing.

Except I call male members that as well, you've tried to paint me as sexist before and it didn't work because the accusation is hilariously wrong. Try again to shut my opinion down with faux outrage that you try to use like a weapon to beat others with . It's quite fun to show you how wrong you are.

I've provided arguments, you just don't respond to them because, like I said before, you don't acknowledge anything that you don't want to hear. You ignored the fact that it was the Remain side that said to ignore the experts and that's just the latest example.

Yes, everyone has an agenda, I never said differently so, at this point, I'm not even sure you know what you are talking about. Like I said before, it's not the agenda but the fact that the remain camp encouraged voters to ignore things that didn't suit their agenda. You should honestly read posts twice before responding, it's not the first time you've misread my posts and made an argument on what you think I've said instead of what I actually said.

[Brillopad]

Except I call male members that as well, you've tried to paint me as sexist before and it didn't work because the accusation is hilariously wrong. Try again to shut my opinion down with faux outrage that you try to use like a weapon to beat others with . It's quite fun to show you how wrong you are.

I've provided arguments, you just don't respond to them because, like I said before, you don't acknowledge anything that you don't want to hear. You ignored the fact that it was the Remain side that said to ignore the experts and that's just the latest example.

Yes, everyone has an agenda, I never said differently so, at this point, I'm not even sure you know what you are talking about. Like I said before, it's not the agenda but the fact that the remain camp encouraged voters to ignore things that didn't suit their agenda. You should honestly read posts twice before responding, it's not the first time you've misread my posts and made an argument on what you think I've said instead of what I actually said.

Quite Frankly I think your whole post makes no sense and comes across as a pretty desperate attempt to convince yourself as well as me that you know what you are talking about. I remain unconvinced.

For the record quantity does not necessarily equate to quality.

[Livia]

I don't support Marine le Penn. But I have to say this... she takes more hysterical bullsh1t on this forum and in the wider world than all the despot African leaders who say EXACTLY the same stuff about white Europeans, only worse.

[Alf]

She's not very sexy is she? and there's a very good chance that she'll smell of onions.

Not the sort of leader we want to see, but she'll take the French people out of the pit that is the EU, and that's reason enough right now.

[Tom4784]

Quite Frankly I think your whole post makes no sense and comes across as a pretty desperate attempt to convince yourself as well as me that you know what you are talking about. I remain unconvinced.

For the record quantity does not necessarily equate to quality.

Ah, the ol' Wombai strategy of 'I know you are but what am I?'

You say that I'm not speaking sense but your 'quality over quantity' line has literally no bearing on this discussion.

[Tom4784]

I don't support Marine le Penn. But I have to say this... she takes more hysterical bullsh1t on this forum and in the wider world than all the despot African leaders who say EXACTLY the same stuff about white Europeans, only worse.

Again, you keep bringing this argument up despite the fact you get the same answer every ****ing time.

Comparing a democratic and generally free country potentially getting a totalitarian leader to the latest despot ruler of a dictatorship run country is a bad comparison. It's more worrying that our neighbours and allies are becoming extremist than the fact that some African countries that we aren't allied with and can't do anything about are ruled by a dictatorship.

It's like saying that you can't complain about Trump because Kim Jong Un is a thing.

[DemolitionRed]

She's not very sexy is she? and there's a very good chance that she'll smell of onions.

Not the sort of leader we want to see, but she'll take the French people out of the pit that is the EU, and that's reason enough right now.

I don't see how she can take France out of the EU. The euro currency is a real sticking point. If France chooses to walk away from its enormous debt, that will throw all the surrounding countries into financial meltdown. If it doesn't walk away from its euro debt, how one earth could France financially survive? borrowing on the euro insured countries like France would have enormous difficulty pulling out of the union.

[Brillopad]

Again, you keep bringing this argument up despite the fact you get the same answer every ****ing time.

Comparing a democratic and generally free country potentially getting a totalitarian leader to the latest despot ruler of a dictatorship run country is a bad comparison. It's more worrying that our neighbours and allies are becoming extremist than the fact that some African countries that we aren't allied with and can't do anything about are ruled by a dictatorship.

It's like saying that you can't complain about Trump because Kim Jong Un is a thing.

Since when has your opinion been elevated to an answer. :shrug:

[Tom4784]

Since when has your opinion been elevated to an answer. :shrug:

You are not making any sense. Stop trying to desperately score points and come up with a coherent reply if you disagree with what I'm saying.