The Local Election Results - Bye Bye Labour

[Wizard.]

Counting is going on and already Conservatives have gained 114 seats, Labour have lost 129 seats, UKIP have been totally wiped out :joker: Go you blues!

[Wizard.]

John McDonnell, Labour Shadow Chancellor, said that it's okay because they haven't been totally wiped out :joker:

[Greg!]

Kind of sad that people think Tories are a good choice to be in charge of local services but whatevs!

[Wizard.]

Kind of sad that people think Tories are a good choice to be in charge of local services but whatevs!

Because they are.

[joeysteele]

Kind of sad that people think Tories are a good choice to be in charge of local services but whatevs!

Too right,it is really sad.

[Black Dagger]

WOOO GO ON THE PARTY THAT ARE KILLING DISABLED PEOPLE xoxo

[Wizard.]

I don't know, maybe people are sick of opposition parties like the SNP & Labour using the NHS as a political pawn and the incompetence of Labour with the London metropolitan like Jeremy Corbyn and Dianne Abbott heading the party is a laughing stock.

We want strong and stable leadership and that's what we'll get!


P.S you can't complain if you didn't vote.

[Wizard.]

WOOO GO ON THE PARTY THAT ARE KILLING DISABLED PEOPLE xoxo

A bit drastic don't believe Labour tripe!

[Kizzy]

I don't know, maybe people are sick of opposition parties like the SNP & Labour using the NHS as a political pawn and the incompetence of Labour with the London metropolitan like Jeremy Corbyn and Dianne Abbott heading the party is a laughing stock.

We want strong and stable leadership and that's what we'll get!


P.S you can't complain if you didn't vote.

Hat's off to you Paul Mc Kenna! :/

The elections were held in mainly predominantly conservative areas, I'm not worried.... Yet.

[user104658]

Surely it's pretty much already set in stone that England is intent on self-destructing. People on low and middle incomes merrily trotting out to vote for people who look at them like something they're trying to scrape off of their shoe... it's hilarious :joker:.

Still holding onto vague hopes that Scotland can escape from this ****ing madness before you drag us down with you :worry:. No results declared yet for Scotland but I am (mostly) confident that it will predominantly be a nice warm yellow :hee:.

[Wizard.]

Hat's off to you Paul Mc Kenna! :/

The elections were held in mainly predominantly conservative areas, I'm not worried.... Yet.

Idk where you get that from? Sweety Labour lost 150 seats and counting hasn't even finished yet. That's Labour areas.

[Wizard.]

Surely it's pretty much already set in stone that England is intent on self-destructing. People on low and middle incomes merrily trotting out to vote for people who look at them like something they're trying to scrape off of their shoe... it's hilarious :joker:.

Still holding onto vague hopes that Scotland can escape from this ****ing madness before you drag us down with you :worry:. No results declared yet for Scotland but I am (mostly) confident that it will predominantly be a nice warm yellow :hee:.

Yes enjoy independence I'm sure you'll enjoy the nice big divorce bill that comes with it :hehe:

[reece(:]

Rather tragic but only the oldies really vote on Local elections

[Wizard.]

Rather tragic but only the oldies really vote on Local elections

Yeah I'm sure Labour voters were out fulfilling charitable work, feeding the children, so couldn't vote. And young people will talk about how their lives have been robbed but obviously, snapchat takes priority.

[Black Dagger]

A bit drastic don't believe Labour tripe!

I can read my own figures thanks. It's hardly drastic to think that the government's stance on disabled people being supposedly 'fit for work' and them clearly not being to the point where they die is totally abhorrent then that's not my problem.

But it's fine because Jeremy Corbyn is just a bit incompetent xoxo

[Wizard.]

I can read my own figures thanks. It's hardly drastic to think that the government's stance on disabled people being supposedly 'fit for work' and them clearly not being to the point where they die is totally abhorrent then that's not my problem.

But it's fine because Jeremy Corbyn is just a bit incompetent xoxo

Okay but it's not the Conservatives aim to kill people, nobody wants to do that. Every decision is made with positive change, some have bad results. NO government is perfect. People would die on Jeremy Corbyn's watch, it wouldn't be all be a communist heaven like his supporters want.

[joeysteele]

WOOO GO ON THE PARTY THAT ARE KILLING DISABLED PEOPLE xoxo

The sad thing is,this Woman and her current party will now after June 8th,if they win with a much greater majority.
Things will get endlessly worse as to their heartless and cruel aims towards the sick and disabled.

The really worrying thing however is there are voters who will help ensure they do win and are more able to do stressful,unnecessary and downright cruel actions against the sick and disabled.

An awful indictment on what is becoming now acceptable in the UK.
That any Party which has already done truly heartless acts towards the Nations Ill and disabled already,is deemed worthy of any support for that and will be able to carry out even more.

Too late to complain,(once thisvWoman and her current Party get that greater majority),with probable crocodile tears for the much added suffering added to those sick and disabled.

[Wizard.]

The sad thing is,this Woman and her current party will now after June 8th,if they win with a much greater majority.
Things will get endlessly worse as to their heartless and cruel aims towards the sick and disabled.

The really worrying thing however is there are voters who will help ensure they do win and are more able to do stressful,unnecessary and downright cruel actions against the sick and disabled.

An awful indictment on what is becoming now acceptable in the UK.
That any Party which has already done truly heartless acts towards the Nations Ill and disabled already,is deemed worthy of any support for that and will be able to carry out even more.

Too late to complain,(once thisvWoman and her current Party get that greater majority),with probable crocodile tears for the much added suffering added to those sick and disabled.

It's a shame but disabled people are not on the top of everyone's list and it's not a one issue election.

[user104658]

Yes enjoy independence I'm sure you'll enjoy the nice big divorce bill that comes with it :hehe:

Typical Tory nastiness :idc:

[user104658]

It's a shame but disabled people are not on the top of everyone's list and it's not a one issue election.

No, for example, Tories for whom "money" is at the top of every list, just above "bigotry" and "ignorance". Disability comes somewhere near the bottom alongside other silly namby-pamby things like "the environment" and "human rights".

[Kizzy]

Okay but it's not the Conservatives aim to kill people, nobody wants to do that. Every decision is made with positive change, some have bad results. NO government is perfect. People would die on Jeremy Corbyn's watch, it wouldn't be all be a communist heaven like his supporters want.

Is it just a happy accident of all the cuts then.. What did they think would happen?

[user104658]

The really worrying thing however is there are voters who will help ensure they do win and are more able to do stressful,unnecessary and downright cruel actions against the sick and disabled.

Indeed. And I personally hope those same voters quickly become critically ill and then find themselves at the mercy of the cruel system they voted for. I'm not even joking. I quite genuinely hope they have to eat the festering ****-pie they so happily bake.

[user104658]

Okay but it's not the Conservatives aim to kill people, nobody wants to do that.

It's not their "aim" to kill people, they don't "want" people dead. They just don't care when people die. So much better.

[Livia]

Rather tragic but only the oldies really vote on Local elections

True... and that's shameful. Older people are not another species, they are young people who've got older. If only we could engage the younger generation to take more responsibility in this. If all young peolle were engaged as much as the young people on here, the political landscape would look much different.

That said.... this is yet more proof that Corbyn will run Labour into the ground and that his supporters don't really care... or don't understand. He is the greatest weapon in the Tory arsenal.

[Livia]

It's not their "aim" to kill people, they don't "want" people dead. They just don't care when people die. So much better.

What nonsense...

[Wizard.]

Indeed. And I personally hope those same voters quickly become critically ill and then find themselves at the mercy of the cruel system they voted for. I'm not even joking. I quite genuinely hope they have to eat the festering ****-pie they so happily bake.

Typical nasty left-winger. Always want people who don't agree with their policies dead.

[user104658]

What nonsense...

Oh yes I'm sure they weep their crusty little lizard eyes out over every DLA-cut death :hehe:

[Livia]

Oh yes I'm sure they weep their crusty little lizard eyes out over every DLA-cut death :hehe:

You know they're not really lizards, right?

[user104658]

Typical nasty left-winger. Always want people who don't agree with their policies dead.

I don't want them dead, I want them on full term disability under Tory cuts. No point if they die :nono:, they have to live in misery in order to appreciate exactly what they were advocating.

[user104658]

You know they're not really lizards, right?

Yes, it's wishful thinking that they're soulless alien reptiles. I do know that they're just ghastly human beings.

[Kizzy]

True... and that's shameful. Older people are not another species, they are young people who've got older. If only we could engage the younger generation to take more responsibility in this. If all young peolle were engaged as much as the young people on here, the political landscape would look much different.

That said.... this is yet more proof that Corbyn will run Labour into the ground and that his supporters don't really care... or don't understand. He is the greatest weapon in the Tory arsenal.

OR... That older people don't understand or care what young people want.

What don't Corbyn supporters understand?

[Livia]

Yes, it's wishful thinking that they're soulless alien reptiles. I do know that they're just ghastly human beings.

Ghastly, yeah... I guess that's why so many people have voted for them. And not just rich people, there aren't that many rich people in the country.

And the "ghastly human beings"... is that the politicians or all the people that voted for them? The majority are ghastly? Well, they probably have a similar description for Labour supporters. If they're childish enough to reduce this down to silly name calling.

[Wizard.]

OR... That older people don't understand or care what young people want.

What don't Corbyn supporters understand?

How ridiculous that old people should vote for what young people want. I'm 21 and every one has the right to vote for what they want, if they don't vote, they shouldn't have older people voting for them - do young people want them to wipe their arse as well?

[user104658]

Ghastly, yeah... I guess that's why so many people have voted for them. And not just rich people, there aren't that many rich people in the country.

And the "ghastly human beings"... is that the politicians or all the people that voted for them? The majority are ghastly? Well, they probably have a similar description for Labour supporters. If they're childish enough to reduce this down to silly name calling.

The policy-makers are ghastly. The people voting for them are mainly just uncaring (in the "well it doesn't apply to me so..." sense, hence me hoping they do end up having to navigate that system) or, at present, jumping on a bandwagon. For some utterly bizarre reason, it's become "popular" to vote Tory simply because there's a feeling that "everyone else is" and people like to be on the "winning team" :idc:.

Of course, also, some of them actually are indeed just ghastly and do look at the disabled with disdain / disgust... so there's also that.

[Wizard.]

Word in the air is that some Scottish councils are losing SNP council seats to the conservatives. Woohoo!

[user104658]

How ridiculous that old people should vote for what young people want. I'm 21 and every one has the right to vote for what they want, if they don't vote, they shouldn't have older people voting for them - do young people want them to wipe their arse as well?

No no no :nono:, it's young people who have to wipe the old people's arses. Oh wait... no... because the Tories are dismantling healthcare brick by brick. So no one will be wiping their senile old arses and they'll just have to live squirming in a heap of their own ****. But they knew what they were voting for sooo :hee:.

[smudgie]

Indeed. And I personally hope those same voters quickly become critically ill and then find themselves at the mercy of the cruel system they voted for. I'm not even joking. I quite genuinely hope they have to eat the festering ****-pie they so happily bake.

Well I am still quite happily voting Tory this time around, and more or less fit all the above.
We can only go by what happens to us personally and what our expectations are, it's obvious we can't trust anything ANYof them tell us as its like wading through treacle to define the difference between what they say and what they do.

[user104658]

Word in the air is that some Scottish councils are losing SNP council seats to the conservatives. Woohoo!

Sort of inevitable, we have The Brexit Effect to thank for that. Brexit / Union supporters tactically voting Tory as the "respresentative party" of that decision. Tory local councils will be a disaster for Scottish towns, I'm honestly quite concerned about people's drive to self-harm.

[user104658]

Well I am still quite happily voting Tory this time around, and more or less fit all the above.
We can only go by what happens to us personally and what our expectations are, it's obvious we can't trust anything ANYof them tell us as its like wading through treacle to define the difference between what they say and what they do.

You're on disability benefits and voting Conservative? Bizarre. Just bizarre.

[smudgie]

You're on disability benefits and voting Conservative? Bizarre. Just bizarre.

Not really bizarre, I was brought up not to expect to rely on the state.:shrug:
The main reason for the Tory vote is that even with the cuts, I can see hope for the future, not my future, my kid's future.

[user104658]

Not really bizarre, I was brought up not to expect to rely on the state.:shrug:
The main reason for the Tory vote is that even with the cuts, I can see hope for the future, not my future, my kid's future.

Hmm. I can only imagine that, despite pretending that you "more or less fit all of the above", you are in fact not reliant on disability benefits for your survival. In which case, you are lucky, not morally superior to anyone who is.

[user104658]

I would also offer the flipside; my youngest daughter (aged 4) is disabled and will have to navigate this system throughout her entire life, and honestly, under a Tory regime I really struggle to see the "hope for her future".

[Wizard.]

Not really bizarre, I was brought up not to expect to rely on the state.:shrug:
The main reason for the Tory vote is that even with the cuts, I can see hope for the future, not my future, my kid's future.

Great for you wanting to stand on your own two feet. Disabled people will not be pushed into a life of living on benefits by Labour.

[smudgie]

Hmm. I can only imagine that, despite pretending that you "more or less fit all of the above", you are in fact not reliant on disability benefits for your survival. In which case, you are lucky, not morally superior to anyone who is.

Yeah we are very well off....not. As you say, you can only imagine and have no idea of our reality.
Hubby was made redundant last July and our son was laid off a month later.
We just get on with it and accept these things happen, without laying blame on or expecting the government or hard working tax payers to keep us in the life to which we were accustomed.
Nothing to do with moral superiority, more to do with the way we were brought up.
Tighten our belts and get on with it.

[user104658]

Yeah we are very well off....not. As you say, you can only imagine and have no idea of our reality.
Hubby was made redundant last July and our son was laid off a month later.
We just get on with it and accept these things happen, without laying blame on or expecting the government or hard working tax payers to keep us in the life to which we were accustomed.
Nothing to do with moral superiority, more to do with the way we were brought up.
Tighten our belts and get on with it.

If you can tighten your belts and get on with it then you are not reliant on disability benefits for your survival. You have some other form of income. Unless you are living on air.

[Denver]

I am astounded at people thinking Corbyn will be the best leader the word has seen

[user104658]

I am astounded at people thinking Corbyn will be the best leader the word has seen

Who thinks that?

[Denver]

Everyone who wants him in charge.

His only plan is to run this country into the ground

[Northern Monkey]

All this blaming the voters is futile.

Why are people voting the way they are?

Because the supposed UK opposition party are not doing their job anywhere near well enough.
It's their job to hold the government to account,It's their job to win the propaganda war,it's their job to attract voters,it's their job to have strong enough policies and it's their job to select decent candidates to lead their party.

If people won't vote for them then they need to change things up and find what works.

I don't want the Tories in power for the foreseeable future but this is the sad reality of having totally weak opposition parties in a democracy.

[joeysteele]

It's not their "aim" to kill people, they don't "want" people dead. They just don't care when people die. So much better.

They don't care.
That is the astonishing and worrying thing,charity after charity,welfare organisations and the CAB have told the govt the stress,the cruel hardship and the despair the sick and disabled have gone and will be going through,due to the changes and cuts to their benefits.

People poo poo the stress and despair the sick and disabled are forced to go through from first the Coalition and now this truly cruel govt.
Heartless and gutless,picking on the very weakest and unbelievably still getting defended and supported by voters to carry on and do likely even worse.

I despair,however when this horrible lot get rewarded for their cruelty and failure with a bigger majority,then all powers that be help anyone who is,or who becomes seriously ill or disabled over the coming years.
It is to me and it should be a disgrace that people in power get away with such heartless cruel policies against people really ill and disabled.

Awful anywhere in the World but to be happening in the UK, is 100% shameful by any make up of govt.

[MB.]

Congrats to Labour on gaining a seat!

https://s29.postimg.org/rzgfv48ef/wp_ss_20170505_0003.png

[Beso]

Surely it's pretty much already set in stone that England is intent on self-destructing. People on low and middle incomes merrily trotting out to vote for people who look at them like something they're trying to scrape off of their shoe... it's hilarious :joker:.

Still holding onto vague hopes that Scotland can escape from this ****ing madness before you drag us down with you :worry:. No results declared yet for Scotland but I am (mostly) confident that it will predominantly be a nice warm yellow :hee:.


scotland should vote tory. like paisley has.

[user104658]

scotland should vote tory. like paisley has.

Fergulsie Park, one of the poorest areas in the entire country. I can only guess they're simply so depressed that they've become suicidal.

[Tom4784]

It's sad that people who do not benefit from a Tory government and will likely suffer as a result of the direction the current government is going in are celebrating the fact that their main opposition is being crushed.

Honestly, if you use the NHS or are reliant on any public service then you should be fearing the fact that the Tories are likely going to go unopposed for years to come. Don't celebrate your oppressors.

[joeysteele]

It's sad that people who do not benefit from a Tory government and will likely suffer as a result of the direction the current government is going in are celebrating the fact that their main opposition is being crushed.

Honestly, if you use the NHS or are reliant on any public service then you should be fearing the fact that the Tories are likely going to go unopposed for years to come. Don't celebrate your oppressors.

Honestly,your 2nd paragraph sums up so much as to the realities of what I make no apologies for saying,'the horrors' for many people in the next 5 years.

Fearing what could come from this PM and her kind of Conservative govt.is no scaremongering.
We have already seen the vicious and cruel policies done from them with no overall majority between 2010 and 2015.
Then also in these last 2 years with a small overall majority.

Fearing what can come if the Cons now get a bigger majority should worry millions and I really hope it does,enough to have them think about how they vote in this general election too.

[Scarlett.]

WOOO GO ON THE PARTY THAT ARE KILLING DISABLED PEOPLE xoxo

Bye Bye NHS :dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance:

[Scarlett.]

All this blaming the voters is futile.

Why are people voting the way they are?


Because they swallow the 'strong and stable leadership' bull**** without even looking into any of the Tory policies or into what they've done to this country in the last 7 years.

[the truth]

Too right,it is really sad.

thank goodness some people with brains are in charge

[Scarlett.]

thank goodness some people with brains are in charge

I'd prefer a conscience and brains, tbh.

[Tom4784]

No NHS has worked out really well for the US so I'm totally glad that we'll be following in their footsteps. I can't wait to not be able to afford healthcare for any kind of serious or long term health issue that I may be unfortunate enough to have in the future!

No need to focus on public services when there's sexier issues such as immigration to divert our attention with! We should be perfectly happy to be treated like toddlers that are being distracted with a set of jingling keys!

[the truth]

I'd prefer a conscience and brains, tbh.

theyve got more of both than labour

[Scarlett.]

theyve got more of both than labour

Tell that to the people who died after being cleared by ATOS for work. Tell that to the hundreds of families falling below the poverty line. Tell that to the junior doctors. Tell that to those people in the ever expanding NHS waiting lists. Tell that to everyone who has suffered because of the selfish decisions made by the Tories over these last seven years. The Tories don't give a damn about what happens to any of us, they just care about maintaining their image.

[Beso]

Because they swallow the 'strong and stable leadership' bull**** without even looking into any of the Tory policies or into what they've done to this country in the last 7 years.

Increased jobs, built houses, raised minimum wage..3 biggies for me.

[Denver]

Labour only want to borrow money after money and put this country back into the 3rd world

[Beso]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/39806664

:clap1:

[Scarlett.]

Increased jobs? You mean workfare and shelf stacking apprenticeships?

Built houses? That no one can really afford

Raised minimum wage? To match inflation

[Northern Monkey]

Because they swallow the 'strong and stable leadership' bull**** without even looking into any of the Tory policies or into what they've done to this country in the last 7 years.

Which means the opposition aren't strong enough and need to work hard make people swallow their bull****

[arista]

2 Conservative
Metro mayors

and 1 Labour
has Andy Burnham
winning in Liverpool to be Metro mayor

[Scarlett.]

Which means the opposition aren't strong enough and need to work hard make people swallow their bull****

Hard to do when there is a strong media bias toward the Tories.

[Beso]

Increased jobs? You mean workfare and shelf stacking apprenticeships?

Built houses? That no one can really afford

Raised minimum wage? To match inflation

Absolute ****e.

[Scarlett.]

Absolute ****e.

Nice counter arguement.

[joeysteele]

Over the moon for Andy Burnham winning Manchester, excellent result for him.
One of my favourite politicians and after Brown went he would have been my choice for leader too.

Good luck to him in this important new role.

[Kazanne]

Surely it's pretty much already set in stone that England is intent on self-destructing. People on low and middle incomes merrily trotting out to vote for people who look at them like something they're trying to scrape off of their shoe... it's hilarious :joker:.

Still holding onto vague hopes that Scotland can escape from this ****ing madness before you drag us down with you :worry:. No results declared yet for Scotland but I am (mostly) confident that it will predominantly be a nice warm yellow :hee:.

Talk about a chip on the shoulder,:hehe: I am sure most people are savvy enough to realise getting the country back on it's feet will be no easy ride,lots of us find it hard,but better that than plunging into massive debt again.We are lucky in this country things could be so much worse, time to get on with it instead of whining so much.

[Kazanne]

Tell that to the people who died after being cleared by ATOS for work. Tell that to the hundreds of families falling below the poverty line. Tell that to the junior doctors. Tell that to those people in the ever expanding NHS waiting lists. Tell that to everyone who has suffered because of the selfish decisions made by the Tories over these last seven years. The Tories don't give a damn about what happens to any of us, they just care about maintaining their image.

Oh woe is me,try going to live in Syria etc,we should be counting our blessings.

[Scarlett.]

Oh woe is me,try going to live in Syria etc,we should be counting our blessings.

Oh so because things are worse elsewhere, we musn't complain about the country going down the ****ter? Seems a great way for a country to be run.

[joeysteele]

Tell that to the people who died after being cleared by ATOS for work. Tell that to the hundreds of families falling below the poverty line. Tell that to the junior doctors. Tell that to those people in the ever expanding NHS waiting lists. Tell that to everyone who has suffered because of the selfish decisions made by the Tories over these last seven years. The Tories don't give a damn about what happens to any of us, they just care about maintaining their image.


Great post,all very true.

Wait until this awful woman and govt starts on wildlife too when she brings back her adored legalising foxhunting plans too.

Anything weaker to be trampled by the powerful,whether it be human or animal.

[Northern Monkey]

Over the moon for Andy Burnham winning Manchester, excellent result for him.
One of my favourite politicians and after Brown went he would have been my choice for leader too.

Good luck to him in this important new role.

Agree.I've always thought he should be leader.He also understands the issues in the north and was trying to tell JC that he's losing votes up north because he's not addressing immigration.He'd get my vote.As would Chukka.I don't think i'm alone with this opinion.I think many old Labour voters would come back.

[Northern Monkey]

Great post,all very true.

Wait until this awful woman and govt starts on wildlife too when she brings back her adored legalising foxhunting plans too.

Anything weaker to be trampled by the powerful,whether it be human or animal.

I know it's serious but this made me laugh.

[arista]

Rather tragic but only the oldies really vote on Local elections


The Young stay in bed

[Jack_]

The whole thing is just gross and emblematic of an 'I'm alright Jack' attitude sweeping the country. How bad is it going to have to get before people learn?

UKIP's collapse would be something to celebrate if it weren't for the fact the Tories have now pretty much adopted their platform. Honestly I despair, I really do.

Turkeys, voting and Christmas are three words that spring to mind.

[Kazanne]

Oh so because things are worse elsewhere, we musn't complain about the country going down the ****ter? Seems a great way for a country to be run.

We are not down in the ****ter,there are some I agree that have money troubles and there is also a LOT who dont ,they just think they do,for those in genuine trouble there is help and even food on offer,but a LOT of people just abuse the system as proven.

[Greg!]

another iconic victory for Nikki Sturgeon in Scotland :clap1:

[joeysteele]

I know it's serious but this made me laugh.

My family were active in helping campaign to get foxhunting stopped.
It was welcomed by them when Blairs govt banned it.

I think anyone who can support this barbaric form of hunting,watching an animal torn to bits by packs of dogs and sick gross people on horseback,as being near scum.

Theresa May is a strong supporter of it, why however should that surprise me when she has policies that cause weaker humans to suffer.
Animals have no chance to speak for themselves.

So I for one will always look down on and have no respect for, people who would use power to bring back this truly cruel and barbaric hunting,in the name of so called sport.

[joeysteele]

We are not down in the ****ter,there are some I agree that have money troubles and there is also a LOT who dont ,they just think they do,for those in genuine trouble there is help and even food on offer,but a LOT of people just abuse the system as proven.

Actually a lot of people don't abuse the system,it's a small minority who do.
I'd like to see your proof since all documentaries claim it's a minority not lots.

[user104658]

Talk about a chip on the shoulder,:hehe: I am sure most people are savvy enough to realise getting the country back on it's feet will be no easy ride,lots of us find it hard,but better that than plunging into massive debt again.We are lucky in this country things could be so much worse, time to get on with it instead of whining so much.

You can't "get a country back on its feet" with austerity, and things will get much worse.

[Tom4784]

Oh so because things are worse elsewhere, we musn't complain about the country going down the ****ter? Seems a great way for a country to be run.

No differing opinions allowed, Chewy!

[Tom4784]

We are not down in the ****ter,there are some I agree that have money troubles and there is also a LOT who dont ,they just think they do,for those in genuine trouble there is help and even food on offer,but a LOT of people just abuse the system as proven.

It's not true, that's basically just a political ploy to get the working and middle classes to turn on each other instead of focusing on the real evil that will ruin us all.

Instead of looking down, try looking up.

[the truth]

It's not true, that's basically just a political ploy to get the working and middle classes to turn on each other instead of focusing on the real evil that will ruin us all.

Instead of looking down, try looking up.

corporate greed destroyed Europe thanks to the eu

[joeysteele]

It's not true, that's basically just a political ploy to get the working and middle classes to turn on each other instead of focusing on the real evil that will ruin us all.

Instead of looking down, try looking up.

You said it much better than I did Dizzy.

[Kazanne]

It's not true, that's basically just a political ploy to get the working and middle classes to turn on each other instead of focusing on the real evil that will ruin us all.

Instead of looking down, try looking up.

No one is looking down,that is what is said of those who support the Tories all the time,you'de think caring and compassion was solely a Labour trait,well it's not,I was always a Labour supporter then Blair/Brown happened,whichever government get in someone will always be stamping their feet about it,no it is not perfect,never will be we just have to decipher who we think is the most honest liar!!! and we should all be working together to help the country,I may not always support the Tories,it depends on their policies,but I certainly wont stop because people try and make me feel guilty over wanting better things by working hard and spending wisely.too many freeloaders spoiling it for others,especially those who REALLY need help.

[user104658]

It's not true, that's basically just a political ploy to get the working and middle classes to turn on each other instead of focusing on the real evil that will ruin us all.

Instead of looking down, try looking up.
The sad thing is that the longer it goes on, the more it pushes the rest of us into selfishness. I have a daughter who have lifelong additional needs... I no longer trust this country to give a **** about her, care what happens to her, look out for her or even really respect her at all in any way. So that leaves our only real path to protecting her as being exactly the same in return; protecting our own interests, and thus her interests, at all costs no matter what that means for anyone else.

[Tom4784]

No one is looking down,that is what is said of those who support the Tories all the time,you'de think caring and compassion was solely a Labour trait,well it's not,I was always a Labour supporter then Blair/Brown happened,whichever government get in someone will always be stamping their feet about it,no it is not perfect,never will be we just have to decipher who we think is the most honest liar!!! and we should all be working together to help the country,I may not always support the Tories,it depends on their policies,but I certainly wont stop because people try and make me feel guilty over wanting better things by working hard and spending wisely.too many freeloaders spoiling it for others,especially those who REALLY need help.

Well you are if you're willing to blame the unemployed for the country's problems when it's more to do with a cruel government that's succeeded to dividng the lower classes while simultaneously preying on the vulnerable parts of soceity by encouraging people who are unfit to work to basically work themselves to death and making help for people who are entitled to it beyond difficult to get it. But anyway who cares about them and their struggles anyway? They're just scroungers, right Kazanne? Better to demonise them rather than to find fault with the government itself. Let's ignore that fact that tax evasion costs this country more money than the benefits system ever will.

You say that we should 'work together to help the country' but judging by other posts in this thread you should add to that statement by saying 'we should work together but everyone should adhere to MY OPINIONS AND VIEWS' given how you dencounced valid concerns and alternative opinions as 'whining.' Collaboration is built upon compromise, Kazanne. Don't preach teamwork if you aren't willing to compromise and expect everyone else to change their views for your sake. That's not working together, that's surrendering to your viewpoint.

[Tom4784]

The sad thing is that the longer it goes on, the more it pushes the rest of us into selfishness. I have a daughter who have lifelong additional needs... I no longer trust this country to give a **** about her, care what happens to her, look out for her or even really respect her at all in any way. So that leaves our only real path to protecting her as being exactly the same in return; protecting our own interests, and thus her interests, at all costs no matter what that means for anyone else.

It's terrible and things are only going to get worse, I've got family and friends in Ireland and abroad and depending on how things go I'm honestly considering just leaving the country. This country's future is growing dimmer by the minute on it's current course and I won't sink with it.

Tbh though, I don't think it's a bad thing to vote selfishly, I wish more people did because if that was the case then the Tories would never get into power again. I don't blame affluent and upper class people voting Tory, they are just doing what I am preaching, to ultimately vote for what's best for your own situation but I honestly despair at how willing the average person will vote against themselves and choose Tory despite the fact that they'll be the ones to suffer from it. It's just masochistic.

[user104658]

I'm not even just talking about voting selfishly, though, I mean being genuinely selfish. If there's a way for us to get ahead at the expense of others, at the expense of community, at expense of the country, I'm in the position of having to take it. I used to care more than I do now, basically. I no longer have the luxury of being able to give a **** about a country / residents of a country that has made it abundantly clear that they do not give a **** about people in our position.

I'm also sure that's exactly how the Tories want it, too. This every man for themselves mentality. But in a world that clearly DOES seem to increasingly celebrate that, what choice is there?

[Kazanne]

Well you are if you're willing to blame the unemployed for the country's problems when it's more to do with a cruel government that's succeeded to dividng the lower classes while simultaneously preying on the vulnerable parts of soceity by encouraging people who are unfit to work to basically work themselves to death and making help for people who are entitled to it beyond difficult to get it. But anyway who cares about them and their struggles anyway? They're just scroungers, right Kazanne? Better to demonise them rather than to find fault with the government itself. Let's ignore that fact that tax evasion costs this country more money than the benefits system ever will.

You say that we should 'work together to help the country' but judging by other posts in this thread you should add to that statement by saying 'we should work together but everyone should adhere to MY OPINIONS AND VIEWS' given how you dencounced valid concerns and alternative opinions as 'whining.' Collaboration is built upon compromise, Kazanne. Don't preach teamwork if you aren't willing to compromise and expect everyone else to change their views for your sake. That's not working together, that's surrendering to your viewpoint.

I'm not blaming solely the unemployed but there are a lot of lazy sods who could get off their arse and work, it would all help, I also blame mismanagement of money , the greed of certain people , the overcrowding which is also impacting the NHS , no one has to agree with me infact I know they wont, but they are my opinions and views and until something happens to change that I will continue to be a terrible Tory supporter. Plus people do whine all the time nothing is ever good enough for them simple as, they always want more.I am no different to you or anyone else who think their opinions are the right ones, BUT I do have an open mind,as I have changed sides before.

[Kizzy]

The results were mixed. We lost seats but we are closing the gap on the Conservatives. I am disappointed at every Labour defeat in the local elections. Too many fantastic councillors, who work tirelessly for their communities, lost their seats.

We have five weeks to win the general election, so we can fundamentally transform Britain for the many not the few.

We know this is no small task – it is a challenge on a historic scale. But we, the whole Labour movement and the British people, can’t afford not to seize our moment.

The British people have been held back for too long. Labour will put more money in people’s pockets with a £10 real living wage, look after our pensioners by protecting the triple-lock on state pensions and give everybody the care and dignity they deserve by properly funding our NHS and social care system.

I urge everyone to vote Labour because things can – and will – change.

:clap1: :clap1: :clap1:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2017/may/04/council-local-general-election-mayoral-results-england-scotland-wales#590cbe66e4b07939cb6972aa

[jaxie]

The whole thing is just gross and emblematic of an 'I'm alright Jack' attitude sweeping the country. How bad is it going to have to get before people learn?

UKIP's collapse would be something to celebrate if it weren't for the fact the Tories have now pretty much adopted their platform. Honestly I despair, I really do.

Turkeys, voting and Christmas are three words that spring to mind.

The whole thing is a gross shambolic Labour party. There is no serious opposition. There won't be until they get their act together and shake Corbyn loose.

[jaxie]

The results were mixed. We lost seats but we are closing the gap on the Conservatives. I am disappointed at every Labour defeat in the local elections. Too many fantastic councillors, who work tirelessly for their communities, lost their seats.

We have five weeks to win the general election, so we can fundamentally transform Britain for the many not the few.

We know this is no small task – it is a challenge on a historic scale. But we, the whole Labour movement and the British people, can’t afford not to seize our moment.

The British people have been held back for too long. Labour will put more money in people’s pockets with a £10 real living wage, look after our pensioners by protecting the triple-lock on state pensions and give everybody the care and dignity they deserve by properly funding our NHS and social care system.

I urge everyone to vote Labour because things can – and will – change.

:clap1: :clap1: :clap1:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2017/may/04/council-local-general-election-mayoral-results-england-scotland-wales#590cbe66e4b07939cb6972aa

Do you have to keep telling yourself this stuff so you believe it? :shrug:
It's a little out of touch with reality.

[joeysteele]

[QUOTE=Kizzy;9297532]The results were mixed. We lost seats but we are closing the gap on the Conservatives. I am disappointed at every Labour defeat in the local elections. Too many fantastic councillors, who work tirelessly for their communities, lost their seats.

We have five weeks to win the general election, so we can fundamentally transform Britain for the many not the few.

We know this is no small task – it is a challenge on a historic scale. But we, the whole Labour movement and the British people, can’t afford not to seize our moment.

The British people have been held back for too long. Labour will put more money in people’s pockets with a £10 real living wage, look after our pensioners by protecting the triple-lock on state pensions and give everybody the care and dignity they deserve by properly funding our NHS and social care system.

I urge everyone to vote Labour because things can – and will – change.

:clap1: :clap1: :clap1:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2017/may/04/council-local-general-election-mayoral-results-england-scotland-wales#590cbe66e4b07939cb6972aa[/QUOTE


I wish you luck.
I will be voting Labour obviously.

7 years of austerity and hammering the sick and disabled and indeed those unemployed too is more than enough for any to have to put up with.

Like others have said,it brings despair into play that the failure of this govts austerity measures get support,and will be given them again for yet another 5 years.

That's why I am off in part from the UK,I can well understand others looking at the divisive road the UK is being taken down by this deceitful PM and govt.and thinking of possibly leaving the UK.

This govt with a bigger majority will bring much more misery to those who are weakest,as they have for the last 7 years.

If people really agree with that and will support it too by electing this govt again,then the UK is really.turning into a pretty bad place to be,' in my view'.

[DemolitionRed]

You can't "get a country back on its feet" with austerity, and things will get much worse.

:clap2:

[Brillopad]

The results were mixed. We lost seats but we are closing the gap on the Conservatives. I am disappointed at every Labour defeat in the local elections. Too many fantastic councillors, who work tirelessly for their communities, lost their seats.

We have five weeks to win the general election, so we can fundamentally transform Britain for the many not the few.

We know this is no small task – it is a challenge on a historic scale. But we, the whole Labour movement and the British people, can’t afford not to seize our moment.

The British people have been held back for too long. Labour will put more money in people’s pockets with a £10 real living wage, look after our pensioners by protecting the triple-lock on state pensions and give everybody the care and dignity they deserve by properly funding our NHS and social care system.

I urge everyone to vote Labour because things can – and will – change.

:clap1: :clap1: :clap1:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2017/may/04/council-local-general-election-mayoral-results-england-scotland-wales#590cbe66e4b07939cb6972aa

Good try! :joker:

[DemolitionRed]

I'm not blaming solely the unemployed but there are a lot of lazy sods who could get off their arse and work, it would all help, I also blame mismanagement of money , the greed of certain people , the overcrowding which is also impacting the NHS , no one has to agree with me infact I know they wont, but they are my opinions and views and until something happens to change that I will continue to be a terrible Tory supporter. Plus people do whine all the time nothing is ever good enough for them simple as, they always want more.I am no different to you or anyone else who think their opinions are the right ones, BUT I do have an open mind,as I have changed sides before.

Its posts like this that make me think, all is lost, its hopeless. No amount of debating will help, no amount of knowledge will make a difference.

Back in the golden age of capitalism, 50s – 80s, we had a conception about middle class society. If you played by the rules and worked hard, you were going to move up; you were going to be better than your parents, your children were going to be better off than you. You were getting a sense of security. Now all that’s gone. Children are worse off than their parents. We no longer have the same land of opportunity. Our prospects are now more dependent on our relatives than ever before. The price of inequality is undermining our economy. Since the 80s we’ve been growing apart.

Haven’t you noticed that middle class income is going down? Do you understand why that’s happening and why its been happening since the 80s? The gap between the rich and everyone else is becoming critical and that’s because neoliberal/conservatism is fundamentally flawed. Whichever way you look at it, neoliberalism eventually leads to inequality, if not for you, for your children or your grandchildren.

[DemolitionRed]

Do you have to keep telling yourself this stuff so you believe it? :shrug:
It's a little out of touch with reality.

Whatever makes you say that?

[Kizzy]

Do you have to keep telling yourself this stuff so you believe it? :shrug:
It's a little out of touch with reality.

It's a quote so I'll ignore the insult.

[DemolitionRed]

Out of interest Jaxie, what's your reality?

[Beso]

Nice counter arguement.

Cant argue with your facebook mindset.

[Beso]

It's not true, that's basically just a political ploy to get the working and middle classes to turn on each other instead of focusing on the real evil that will ruin us all.

Instead of looking down, try looking up.

I was described as working to middle class on my facebook tonight......THANKS!

[DemolitionRed]

I was described as working to middle class on my facebook tonight......THANKS!

I think many unprofessional working people call themselves middle class now don't they?

[Tom4784]

I'm not blaming solely the unemployed but there are a lot of lazy sods who could get off their arse and work, it would all help, I also blame mismanagement of money , the greed of certain people , the overcrowding which is also impacting the NHS , no one has to agree with me infact I know they wont, but they are my opinions and views and until something happens to change that I will continue to be a terrible Tory supporter. Plus people do whine all the time nothing is ever good enough for them simple as, they always want more.I am no different to you or anyone else who think their opinions are the right ones, BUT I do have an open mind,as I have changed sides before.

Have you been on benefits lately? Last time I was unemployed for long enough to be was a couple of years back but even for the short time I was on it it never felt like the 'lazy' option and judging from what I've heard from people I know who are currently unemployed it hasn't exactly gotten easier. Given ATOS' methods, the benefit cap and the various schemes that get forced onto the unemployed, I have to completely refuse the notion that 'lazy sods' are to blame for the state the country is in. I doubt anyone would want to stay on benefits if they were healthy and capable considering the stories of sanction targets and schemes like SJP in place. The unemployed are simply a scapegoat and they always have been. Like I said before, if you want to be angry at the real scroungers then you look to the politicians, the corporations and the upper class/elite for their tax practices and abuses are where the real issue lies.

As for your point about 'whining'... To simply accept a bad situation just because is truly sad, making do with a bad situation and blaming the wrong people because it's easier than admitting the truth is something that I can do nothing else but pity whoever thinks that way.

[Beso]

I think many unprofessional working people call themselves middle class now don't they?

I better get back to the cheeky twat then.

[Denver]

Even Scotland are turning tory

[user104658]

Even Scotland are turning tory

Stretch. They took almost all of their seats from Labour and Independent candidates, not SNP.

What you're seeing is the Unionists who were traditionally Labour voters turning Tory as a tactical anti-Indy vote. Tories north of the border sold themselves as "The Unionist Party".

https://www.imageupload.co.uk/images/2017/05/05/aaatally.jpg

[Scarlett.]

Cant argue with your facebook mindset.

That's nice.

[Denver]

Stretch. They took almost all of their seats from Labour and Independent candidates, not SNP.

What you're seeing is the Unionists who were traditionally Labour voters turning Tory as a tactical anti-Indy vote. Tories north of the border sold themselves as "The Unionist Party".

https://www.imageupload.co.uk/images/2017/05/05/aaatally.jpg

It was said if the same momentum carries into next month Conservatives will win many seats in scotland including Glasgow

[user104658]

It was said if the same momentum carries into next month Conservatives will win many seats in scotland including Glasgow
It's impossible to predict, the GE and council elections use completely different voting. Local council uses a type of proportional representation and the GE does not. Also, the voting age on local council elections is skewed upwards and older people are more likely to vote Tory.

Local council elections have never been used to accurately predict a GE result. It's entirely guesswork.

[jaxie]

Out of interest Jaxie, what's your reality?

My reality is that I have no one to vote for which is a touch annoying as the vote I have was hard fought for by many brave women.

That Labour are the most unpopular with the general public than they have ever been in my memory.

Articles claiming a potential win in 5 weeks seem unrealistic to me.

What about you?

[Greg!]

It was said if the same momentum carries into next month Conservatives will win many seats in scotland including Glasgow

I can guarantee you right now the tories will NOT win any seats in Glasgow :joker:

[reece(:]

I can guarantee you right now the tories will NOT win any seats in Glasgow :joker:
Not with the Ruth Davidson rape clause mess

[jaxie]

It's a quote so I'll ignore the insult.

I was referring to the quote. You quoted it, do you believe it? :shrug:

[Denver]

I can guarantee you right now the tories will NOT win any seats in Glasgow :joker:
Seeing as many Scottish people favour staying in the UK either Tories or Lib Dems will be taking many seats with both against another Scottish Referendum

[Wizard.]

Sweeties miss Nicola Sturgeon will try to pull a fast one saying she has a mandate for IndyRef2 but the combined votes of unionist parties - Tory, Labour, Lib dems and Greens will outweigh all of her votes so check yourself before you wreck yourself.

[Firewire]

Scottish Greens are pro-independence

[arista]

https://d2kmm3vx031a1h.cloudfront.net/GUf7gAKThuyqkvsJzxsw_i%20Weekend.jpg

https://d2kmm3vx031a1h.cloudfront.net/1uotKjNT2X2FoXz3Foow_The%20Guardian.jpg

[user104658]

arista killed tibb

[Greg!]

I love how anti-SNP chicks like Ruth Big Mooth Davidson are trying to redefine victory. "Ok you got the most seats but we got more gains than you!" "Actually we won if you combine our seats with labour and the lib dems!" Kind of tragic really!

[Firewire]

Ruth is an arsehole

[DemolitionRed]

My reality is that I have no one to vote for which is a touch annoying as the vote I have was hard fought for by many brave women.

That Labour are the most unpopular with the general public than they have ever been in my memory.

Articles claiming a potential win in 5 weeks seem unrealistic to me.

What about you?

My reality is, there is no viable opposition to what looks set to be yet another Conservative Party victory on 8th June and we appear to be heading towards a single party state.

May reminds me of Thatcher, the difference is, Thatcher had the benefit of trickledown economics. As she sold off our social structure, everyone got a piece of the pie. Now apart from the dregs of the NHS, there is little pie left and its only the fringes of society, the elite and those who made investments in the 80s who will benefit from the crumbs.

My reality is, the days of neoliberalism is reaching its end, just as its ideology predicted it would, but the Tories are pushing on regardless, knowing full well that a mild tweaking of the system won’t make our economy more efficient.

[Livia]

The only similarities between Thatcher and May is that they both have two X chromosomes and they're both Tories. When everything else fails, compare her to Thatcher.

It will be a single party state until Corbyn forgets his personal ambition and steps down for a better, more popular leader. The fact that he has refused to do so for so long while his party crumbles speaks volumes about him. It's HIM who is unpopular. Andy Burnham removed himself from Corbyn's shadow and won on the first round of votes in Manchester. It is Corbyn who's the fly in the ointment, not May.

[jaxie]

My reality is, there is no viable opposition to what looks set to be yet another Conservative Party victory on 8th June and we appear to be heading towards a single party state.

May reminds me of Thatcher, the difference is, Thatcher had the benefit of trickledown economics. As she sold off our social structure, everyone got a piece of the pie. Now apart from the dregs of the NHS, there is little pie left and its only the fringes of society, the elite and those who made investments in the 80s who will benefit from the crumbs.

My reality is, the days of neoliberalism is reaching its end, just as its ideology predicted it would, but the Tories are pushing on regardless, knowing full well that a mild tweaking of the system won’t make our economy more efficient.

We more or less agree then that we seem to have a one party state, but that is a fault at Labour and it's leaders door. I'm not really seeing the similarity with May and Thatcher so far.

[Northern Monkey]

The only similarities between Thatcher and May is that they both have two X chromosomes and they're both Tories. When everything else fails, compare her to Thatcher.

It will be a single party state until Corbyn forgets his personal ambition and steps down for a better, more popular leader. The fact that he has refused to do so for so long while his party crumbles speaks volumes about him. It's HIM who is unpopular. Andy Burnham removed himself from Corbyn's shadow and won on the first round of votes in Manchester. It is Corbyn who's the fly in the ointment, not May.
Soo true.I've been pro Burnham since before the first Labour leadership contest.

[DemolitionRed]

We more or less agree then that we seem to have a one party state, but that is a fault at Labour and it's leaders door. I'm not really seeing the similarity with May and Thatcher so far.

When Thatcher came along she, like May, had no viable opposition and it remained the same for at least three full terms.

Thatcher was the birth mother of neoliberalism in the UK and I’m sure she legitimately thought monetaristic economic policy was a good thing. It certainly helped a lot of people in the UK, including my parents.

May is a child of Thatcher, her policies are neoliberal, but the honeymoons over. Neoliberal ideology only has a short life span. She’s in no position like Thatcher was, to role back the state and give everyone the opportunity to be prosperous. All she can do is assist the already prosperous to further their riches.

[Wizard.]

The only similarities between Thatcher and May is that they both have two X chromosomes and they're both Tories. When everything else fails, compare her to Thatcher.

It will be a single party state until Corbyn forgets his personal ambition and steps down for a better, more popular leader. The fact that he has refused to do so for so long while his party crumbles speaks volumes about him. It's HIM who is unpopular. Andy Burnham removed himself from Corbyn's shadow and won on the first round of votes in Manchester. It is Corbyn who's the fly in the ointment, not May.

Maybe Corbyn is a Tory spy, refusing to step down until he dies.

[Denver]

The only similarities between Thatcher and May is that they both have two X chromosomes and they're both Tories. When everything else fails, compare her to Thatcher.

It will be a single party state until Corbyn forgets his personal ambition and steps down for a better, more popular leader. The fact that he has refused to do so for so long while his party crumbles speaks volumes about him. It's HIM who is unpopular. Andy Burnham removed himself from Corbyn's shadow and won on the first round of votes in Manchester. It is Corbyn who's the fly in the ointment, not May.

Corbyn couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery let alone run a country.

He has single handly destroyed the Labour party and is refusing to allow it to be fixed now were are looking at potentially decades before Labour will become a power to rival Conservatives again

[Tom4784]

If by 'fix' the party you mean return it to the Tory Labour party it was during the Blair/Brown days then may it stay broken forever.

I'd take my chances with a dreamer then suffer another Tory lite Labour Government.

[Denver]

If by 'fix' the party you mean return it to the Tory Labour party it was during the Blair/Brown days then may it stay broken forever.

I'd take my chances with a dreamer then suffer another Tory lite Labour Government.

As it has been said his understudy should be given the job as i have more faith in him

[Brillopad]

Maybe Corbyn is a Tory spy, refusing to step down until he dies.

You may have something there - maybe he is a Tory plant to ensure Labour will never pose a threat to the Conservatives. Would be quite an effective ploy. Find someone totally incapable of the job and help them get elected as leader of the opposition. Win, win all the way.

[Northern Monkey]

You may have something there - maybe he is a Tory plant to ensure Labour will never pose a threat to the Conservatives. Would be quite an effective ploy. Find someone totally incapable of the job and help them get elected as leader of the opposition. Win, win all the way.

Well there were apparently a load of Tory supporters who paid the £3.00 membership to vote for him.They all knew what he'd be like as leader back before the first leadership contest.He's a real asset.....

[Livia]

Well there were apparently a load of Tory supporters who paid the £3.00 membership to vote for him.They all knew what he'd be like as leader back before the first leadership contest.He's a real asset.....

Also, lots of Labour supporters joined the Tories to vote in the Conservative leadership election. But it costs £25 to join the Tories if you're over 23... and you have to have been a member for three months before you're eligible to vote. Labour couldn't even organise a decent leadership election.

[joeysteele]

Also, lots of Labour supporters joined the Tories to vote in the Conservative leadership election. But it costs £25 to join the Tories if you're over 23... and you have to have been a member for three months before you're eligible to vote. Labour couldn't even organise a decent leadership election.

Got to agree here.
I think the current Labour leadership system needs drastic change.

I like the across the whole Party idea but it has failed the last twice unfortunately.
If it had to be a Miliband in 2010,it should have been David not Ed.
Although a good solid Labour man Andy Burnham for me and as you implied,was a better choice.

I now think although I like the idea of wider electorate, Since constituencies pick candidates to be elected as MPs.
That then,as it used to be,those elected MPs are the ones to choose who leads them in Parliament.

Hard in a big Party to have a system that suits all I guess.
However it looks to me like a re think is needed badly.

[Kizzy]

I still have faith, I don't care about the councillors or the media drubbing... He has policies that I feel confident to stand behind and that's good enough for me. This govt is part way through a cull, I've said it before and each passing day it becomes more and more evident.
I cannot think of one single thing that would inspire me to vote tory... there is not one redeeming aspect if their ideology, past, present or future

[Livia]

I still have faith, I don't care about the councillors or the media drubbing... He has policies that I feel confident to stand behind and that's good enough for me. This govt is part way through a cull, I've said it before and each passing day it becomes more and more evident.
I cannot think of one single thing that would inspire me to vote tory... there is not one redeeming aspect if their ideology, past, present or future

And that's why the Labour Party will continue to get a proper drubbing at every election until Corbyn goes.

[Kizzy]

And that's why the Labour Party will continue to get a proper drubbing at every election until Corbyn goes.

Why, because I support them?....:/

I get you don't like him liv, it's fine you don't have to reiterate it on every one of my posts.