David Walliams dressed as Kim Jong-un for Halloween

[Oliver_W]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNgTXTFXcAEp0f1.jpg

Funny or "racist" ?

[Morgan.]

I don't really see the issue, I mean people praised and applauded 'The Interview' so

[Morgan.]

I can see why the offence would be there but I personally don't see the issue.

[Cherie]

Can't see the issue, people take him off all the time, and I haven't heard anyone complaining, he is a scary character so perfect for Halloween

[Brillopad]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNgTXTFXcAEp0f1.jpg

Funny or "racist" ?

Maybe we should all get our knickers in a twist about that as well. Maybe that could be considered ‘racist’ by some too. For me it’s funny, but I don’t jump on the ‘racist’ bandwagon at every opportunity.

[smudgie]

:laugh: very funny.
To be honest I find him a bit creepy without the make up aswell.

[waterhog]

fantastic - what a make over.

[Amy Jade]

Neither really

[Locke.]

I don't really see the issue, I mean people praised and applauded 'The Interview' so

It was a Korean actor that played Kim in that though.

But yeah, wouldn't say it was racist.

[Crimson Dynamo]

This stole the show. Gemma from towie

https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/nintchdbpict000363896767-e1509526280325.jpg?strip=all&w=654

[Oliver_W]

This stole the show. Gemma from towie

https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/nintchdbpict000363896767-e1509526280325.jpg?strip=all&w=654

But why didn't she go in fancy dress?

[Eddie.]

Nah. Don't think its racist...he didn't do anything racially offensive, it was all for good fun...

[Marsh.]

Dressing as him is fine.

Giving yourself hooded eyes is crossing the line. Would blackface be accepted?
No. So I don't see why Asian eyes would either.

[LukeB]

It’s more offensive than funny.

[Crimson Dynamo]

if you were dressing up as OJ Simpson you have to black up if you are white?

[Marsh.]

if you were dressing up as OJ Simpson you have to black up if you are white?

Which is probably why it's not much of a good idea?

[Tom4784]

The prosthetics crossed the line into yellowface. Simply dressing as him and wearing a wig would have been fine.

[Jordan.]

I am OFFENDED

[Josy]

Don't see a problem

[Kizzy]

It's intentionally offensive, he wants to mock and offend him that's the difference.

[Niamh.]

It's intentionally offensive, he wants to mock and offend him that's the difference.

I guess the question is, is it racist towards Koreans/Asians not necessarily Kim Jong-un, you know with the eyes and skin tone etc (I doubt anyone cares if Kim is offended tbf :laugh: )

[Shaun]

He's so much of a ridiculous caricature and a hideous political figure that it sort-of transcends any kind of racial sensitivities. I can't see many Koreans getting upset at people taking the piss out of him (unless they live North of the border, of course :p)

[Matthew.]

I don’t like David Walliams apart from when he’s on Britain's Got Talent, but I found this pretty hilarious ngl

Think I retweeted it as well

[Kizzy]

I guess the question is, is it racist towards Koreans/Asians not necessarily Kim Jong-un, you know with the eyes and skin tone etc (I doubt anyone cares if Kim is offended tbf :laugh: )

Are you saying they all have the same eyes and skin tone?... David isn't saying that.

He is a caricature of one man not a race of men.

[Marsh.]

Are you saying they all have the same eyes and skin tone?... David isn't saying that.

He is a caricature of one man not a race of men.

But that would be like saying "blackface" isn't racist because there are so many varying skin tones, wouldn't it?

[Kizzy]

But that would be like saying "blackface" isn't racist because there are so many varying skin tones, wouldn't it?

no it wouldn't because that is a generalisation this isn't, it focuses specifically on one man

[Niamh.]

Are you saying they all have the same eyes and skin tone?... David isn't saying that.

He is a caricature of one man not a race of men.

But that would be like saying "blackface" isn't racist because there are so many varying skin tones, wouldn't it?

Pretty much ^

[BBUK-Fan]

Nothing wrong with it

[Kizzy]

Pretty much ^

I had already answered this when you posted
http://rs1131.pbsrc.com/albums/m544/myemoticons1/Smileyswatchingyou.gif~c200

[Marsh.]

no it wouldn't because that is a generalisation this isn't, it focuses specifically on one man
Hooded eyes do not apply to one man.

[LaLaLand]

This is amazing

[Crimson Dynamo]

The reason he included the epicanthic fold was that he is rich enough to do so. It's nothing to do with racism, it's vanity. He wants people to like his costume and him.

Racism my arse

[Marsh.]

The reason he included the epicanthic fold was that he is rich enough to do so. It's nothing to do with racism, it's vanity. He wants people to like his costume and him.

Racism my arse
What on earth has that got to do with being Rich? :joker:

[Jordan.]

It is quiet funny he has dressed up as other races for years in his comedy shows but when he does an evil dictator for Halloween people are fuming.

[Crimson Dynamo]

What on earth has that got to do with being Rich? :joker:

That make up is very expensive and 9999/10000 people can't afford it

[Marsh.]

It is quiet funny he has dressed up as other races for years in his comedy shows but when he does an evil dictator for Halloween people are fuming.
Not really. Little Britain and Come Fly with Me were constantly under fire for their racially insensitive stereotyping at the time they aired. I remember all of the backlash over them dressing as Thai women. So much so Matt Lucas even commented recently that he regrets it.

[Marsh.]

That make up is very expensive and 9999/10000 people can't afford it
Yes because THAT'S clearly the issue here.

However you'd be surprised at the quality when it comes to affordable costumes and make-up. I saw many zombies in town last week that looked like they'd just come off the set of Walking Dead. But that's not really the issue.

[Alf]

Dressing as him is fine.

Giving yourself hooded eyes is crossing the line. Would blackface be accepted?
No. So I don't see why Asian eyes would either.Or spray tan, because that's making people look Brown.

[Alf]

Isabell from Big brother is a massive racsist because she's always Browning up. I can't believe all those people voted for a racsist.

[Alf]

That was called sarcasm by the way.

[Alf]

Nicole Scherzinger went as Cleopatra, how dare she culturally appropriate an Egyptian ruler?

[Marsh.]

Or spray tan, because that's making people look Brown.
Yeah because a sun tan is blackface. Everyone with a tan is doing so to mimic black people.

Do you ever get tired of making stupid comments?

[Marsh.]

Isabell from Big brother is a massive racsist because she's always Browning up. I can't believe all those people voted for a racsist.
Yeah let's ignore the history associated with blacking up to ridicule and humiliate a race and just make their suffering insignificant with pathetic attempts at wit.

Try again.

[Kizzy]

Hooded eyes do not apply to one man.

Are you saying all North Korean people have hooded eyes?... David Walliams isn't saying all North Korean people have hooded eyes.

[Marsh.]

Are you saying all North Korean people have hooded eyes?... David Walliams isn't saying all North Korean people have hooded eyes.
Where did I say David "said" anything at all?

[Kizzy]

Where did I say David "said" anything at all?

Where have I said you said he said that?

[Alf]

Yeah let's ignore the history associated with blacking up to ridicule and humiliate a race and just make their suffering insignificant with pathetic attempts at wit.

Try again.Are you sticking up for this Brown facer? that's not like you Marsh, you're usually one of the offended brigade.

[Marsh.]

Where have I said you said he said that?
Well you declared David Williams wasn't suggesting all Asians have hooded eyes implying that was my issue?

[Alf]

Yeah because a sun tan is blackface. Everyone with a tan is doing so to mimic black people.

Do you ever get tired of making stupid comments?Ooooo! touched a nerve have I?

[Marsh.]

Are you sticking up for this Brown facer? that's not like you Marsh, you're usually one of the offended brigade.
I hope you're saving all this material for the book.

What a riveting read.

[andybigbro]

Really don’t see an issue

[Marsh.]

Ooooo! touched a nerve have I?
No. That's called astonishment that someone is stupid enough to think blackface and a tan are the same thing.

Although it would surprise anyone that Isabelle was attempting to resemble a black lady. The colour was more akin to shrek.

[Firewire]

The eyes make it offensive

[Kizzy]

Well you declared David Williams wasn't suggesting all Asians have hooded eyes implying that was my issue?

What was your issue with this statement?

'Hooded eyes do not apply to one man.'

Hooded eyes do not apply to all Asians ( a step up from all North Koreans I might add)

My mother has hooded eyes, is he targeting her too?

[Alf]

The eyes make it offensiveNot to me they don't, I've got better things to worry about, like have I got enough bog roll for the weekend and putting the bins out.

[Marsh.]

What was your issue with this statement?

'Hooded eyes do not apply to one man.'

Hooded eyes do not apply to all Asians ( a step up from all North Koreans I might add)

My mother has hooded eyes, is he targeting her too?
You implied it was a feature he was using in order to mimic the guy he was dressed as.

As opposed to a gross stereotype about Asian people.

Like him pinning his eyes back to make them thin to play a Japanese character on his sketch show.

People would've seen who he was attempting to ridicule with just the hair and costume, without the offensive prosthetics.

[Marsh.]

Not to me they don't, I've got better things to worry about, like have I got enough bog roll for the weekend and putting the bins out.
What?

You think because people partake in discussing topics in threads on this forum they must be losing sleep over it? :joker:

No. We're simply talking about it. Which is what the forum is about.

David Walliams means nothing to me and tomorrow this ridiculous costume will be forgotten but that doesn't stop us being able to comment on the crassness of it today.

If you haven't got time to discuss it because you've ran out of bog roll then maybe you're in the wrong place?

[Firewire]

Not to me they don't, I've got better things to worry about, like have I got enough bog roll for the weekend and putting the bins out.

I'm happy you aren't offended by something that has no power to offend you

[Marsh.]

Hooded eyes do not apply to all Asians ( a step up from all North Koreans I might add)


So Asia doesn't just encompass North Korea and North Korea only?

Well thank you for letting us know.

[Kizzy]

You implied it was a feature he was using in order to mimic the guy he was dressed as.

As opposed to a gross stereotype about Asian people.

Like him pinning his eyes back to make them thin to play a Japanese character on his sketch show.

People would've seen who he was attempting to ridicule with just the hair and costume, without the offensive prosthetics.

I haven't implied anything..... you're doing all the supposing around here :/

[Marsh.]

I haven't implied anything..... you're doing all the supposing around here :/
Yes you did. You implied every bit of his costume was about Kim Jong-un specifically. "One man" you said.

I haven't "supposed" anything. I'm pointing out the racial stereotyping for which Walliams is known for.

[Kizzy]

So Asia doesn't just encompass North Korea and North Korea only?

Well thank you for letting us know.

Thanks for letting me know having hooded eyes offends the whole of Asia.

[Marsh.]

Thanks for letting me know having hooded eyes offends the whole of Asia.
Where did I say that?

I pointed out a problematic racial stereotype.

It's like me saying it was inappropriate for someone to use the "n" word and you telling me that not all black people across the world were offended. It's a misrepresentation of what I said.

[Crimson Dynamo]

The eyes make it offensive

the eyes tell me he can afford to make it look better by hiring a pro


its all about what you can afford

[Crimson Dynamo]

Where did I say that?

I pointed out a problematic racial stereotype.

It's like me saying it was inappropriate for someone to use the "n" word and you telling me that not all black people across the world were offended. It's a misrepresentation of what I said.

its not a stereotype its an accurate depiction of a fat wanker

[Marsh.]

its not a stereotype its an accurate depiction of a fat wanker

No.

Just as I'm sure this wasn't a gross stereotype of Japanese people.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/5f/42/f1/5f42f1df4235fa5a84290f6bd44b8c98.jpg

The prosthetics on their eyes are character specific, not a race thing. :thumbs:

[Kizzy]

Yes you did. You implied every bit of his costume was about Kim Jong-un specifically. "One man" you said.

I haven't "supposed" anything. I'm pointing out the racial stereotyping for which Walliams is known for.

I stated every bit of his costume was about one man, and it is.

[Kizzy]

Where did I say that?

I pointed out a problematic racial stereotype.

It's like me saying it was inappropriate for someone to use the "n" word and you telling me that not all black people across the world were offended. It's a misrepresentation of what I said.

the intention was to dress and look like one man, it's simply your projection that this is a problematic racial stereotype.

[Marsh.]

the intention was to dress and look like one man, it's simply your projection that this is a problematic racial stereotype.
Clearly. As it's only me to have felt there was a problem with it.

It's wilful ignorance to say that exaggerated eye make-up is not used as a gross stereotype for Asian people. Especially coming from the likes of David Walliams who's literally made a career out of them in Little Britain and other sketch shows.

[Crimson Dynamo]

No.

Just as I'm sure this wasn't a gross stereotype of Japanese people.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/5f/42/f1/5f42f1df4235fa5a84290f6bd44b8c98.jpg

The prosthetics on their eyes are character specific, not a race thing. :thumbs:

gross stereotypes are the mainstay of comedy and that it what it is comedy


Id imagine David used his make-up person to get the Kim look bang on and they did a great job

:thumbs:

[thesheriff443]

Spitting image ripped the piss out of every one.
Its funny nothing more,

[Toy Soldier]

I'll just repeat what I said in the thread yesterday;

I do think that entertainment (TV, films, games etc.) should be a different matter... There should always be a place for satire, that's important, and a place for honesty in reality TV (though most of it is just trash now tbf) and in documentaries.

However I think people need to realise that, to use an example, Basil Fawlty frog marching around Fawlty Towers doing a Hitler salute is very different from Bob doing it round the pub. The South Park kids calling their black friend "Token" is very different from kids in a mostly white school calling the only black kid Token in reality (even as a joke), etc.


I suppose, in a case like this, I would probably extend that to established professional comedians on social media, as it is often used as a platform for an ongoing "show" of sorts in that capacity.

There's also a distinct difference between dressing up as a specific person, and dressing up as a stereotypical archetype of a group of people. Within limits, though.

[Marsh.]

gross stereotypes are the mainstay of comedy and that it what it is comedy


Id imagine David used his make-up person to get the Kim look bang on and they did a great job

:thumbs:
Yeah and also continue to perpetuate Asian stereotypes.

Which if you think that kind of thing isn't or shouldn't be offensive and should be allowed in the guise of comedy then that's a perfectly valid opinion. But let's not pretend it's not there.

[Beso]

Im more worried about him being willing to sit in a chair for 4 hours to achieve the look..****ing americanised bollox.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Yeah and also continue to perpetuate Asian stereotypes.

Which if you think that kind of thing isn't or shouldn't be offensive and should be allowed in the guise of comedy then that's a perfectly valid opinion. But let's not pretend it's not there.

The epicanthic fold is not a stereotype

[Nicky91]

YASSSSSSS David Walliams another iconic comedy character from him then :cheer2:

[Barry.]

It's meh, I can see why it might offend though.

[Crimson Dynamo]

It's meh, I can see why it might offend though.

offend who?

[Marsh.]

The epicanthic fold is not a stereotype
No. Nobody ever uses that feature to mock Asians.

[RichardG]

i think it's fine. i showed it to a korean friend who is an international student in the uk and she thought it was funny. :shrug:

[Cherie]

i think it's fine. i showed it to a korean friend who is an international student in the uk and she thought it was funny. :shrug:

sorry White people know how Asian and Black people feel better than they do themselves, I guess that really is white priviledge :hehe:

[Beso]

Just a case of being allowed to mock one person but not a group of people...

[Crimson Dynamo]

No. Nobody ever uses that feature to mock Asians.

you are confusing playground kids making their eyes slitty to an adult dressing up for a party where everyone is dressed up intentionally

and no one yet has claimed to be offended by Walliams

and frankly noone cares either

[DemolitionRed]

I think the reaction to this is ott. He's taking the mick out of a NK dictator and so mocked himself up to look like him. If he was doing this for a film, makeup artists would be asked to get him as near to the real thing as makeup would allow. This is all he's done here.

[Marsh.]

you are confusing playground kids making their eyes slitty to an adult dressing up for a party where everyone is dressed up intentionally

and no one yet has claimed to be offended by Walliams

and frankly noone cares either
Nothing to do with kids and everything to do with the kind of racially insensitive material that Walliams is known for.

I'm not generalizing or coming out of nowhere. I'm commenting on Walliams and his track record.

No one has claimed to be offended?
How do you know? Unless of course you mean on the forum, which is hardly surprising given the very slim Korean representation. :joker:

[Cherie]

I think the reaction to this is ott. He's taking the mick out of a NK dictator and so mocked himself up to look like him. If he was doing this for a film, makeup artists would be asked to get him as near to the real thing as makeup would allow. This is all he's done here.

true, if someone of any colour did this for Teresa May or Donald Trump would anyone be upset about it I don't think so, political figures have always been fair game :nono:

[Marsh.]

true, if someone of any colour did this for Teresa May or Donald Trump would anyone be upset about it I don't think so, political figures have always been fair game :nono:
Depends. A wig and a costume tends to suffice.

[Marsh.]

I think the reaction to this is ott. He's taking the mick out of a NK dictator and so mocked himself up to look like him. If he was doing this for a film, makeup artists would be asked to get him as near to the real thing as makeup would allow. This is all he's done here.
And said film would get a backlash for whitewashing. As opposed to hiring an Asian actor to play an Asian character.

[Niamh.]

And said film would get a backlash for whitewashing. As opposed to hiring an Asian actor to play an Asian character.

Exactly, remember what happened to that episode of Urban Myths........

https://i.imgur.com/JjExCOH.jpg?1

[Crimson Dynamo]

Nothing to do with kids and everything to do with the kind of racially insensitive material that Walliams is known for.

I'm not generalizing or coming out of nowhere. I'm commenting on Walliams and his track record.

No one has claimed to be offended?
How do you know? Unless of course you mean on the forum, which is hardly surprising given the very slim Korean representation. :joker:

i happen to know we have 2 overweight korean members so they will be chuffed :hee:

[Barry.]

offend who?

Asians.

[Marsh.]

i happen to know we have 2 overweight korean members so they will be chuffed :hee:
Chuffed being the code word? :hehe:

[Marsh.]

Exactly, remember what happened to that episode of Urban Myths........

https://i.imgur.com/JjExCOH.jpg?1
Perfect example. :clap1:

[DemolitionRed]

Exactly, remember what happened to that episode of Urban Myths........

https://i.imgur.com/JjExCOH.jpg?1

I doubt we are going to have an outcry from Kim Jong-un.

[Niamh.]

I doubt we are going to have an outcry from Kim Jong-un.I was replying to Marsh about his white washing on TV comment

[Crimson Dynamo]

I emailed my South Korean pen pal Hou Flung Dung and he said he saw the Daily Mail and thought it a hoot. He was however horrified that Ed Shearan went as a pimp as the exploitation of women through prostitution and the subsequent violence that female sex workers endure is no laughing matter

but wait

no one saw that so it did not happen

:idc:

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2017/11/01/00/45E0C95800000578-5036641-image-a-389_1509495970316.jpg

[RichardG]

I emailed my South Korean pen pal Hou Flung Dung and he said he saw the Daily Mail and thought it a hoot. He was however horrified that Ed Shearan went as a pimp as the exploitation of women through prostitution and the subsequent violence that female sex workers endure is no laughing matter

but wait

no one saw that so it did not happen

:idc:

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2017/11/01/00/45E0C95800000578-5036641-image-a-389_1509495970316.jpg

:joker:

[Marsh.]

I doubt we are going to have an outcry from Kim Jong-un.

Just like Michael Jackson wasn't around to complain about being played by Joseph Fiennes, but that's missing the point altogether.

[Alf]

Why do lefties want to exclude non-whites from being the punchline? They're just as entitled to be the punchline as anybody.

Why is it always White lefties doing this segregating? Why do they always need to be the spokesperson for non-White people? Is it because they don't think non-Whites are capable? You have to wonder.

I only speak for myself, I wouldn't want some virtue signaller to speak on my behalf for what I want and need.

I'd like to know from non-White people on what they think about these White knights not treating you the same way they treat their fellow White people? Because these go around calling everyone racist, but to me, they look like the real racists

[Marsh.]

Who are the white lefties?

LT says no one's offended, now it's the white lefts fault. :joker:

[Alf]

Who are the white lefties?

LT says no one's offended, now it's the white lefts fault. :joker:The political establishment, the media establishment and the academia establishment.

[Marsh.]

The political establishment, the media establishment and the academia establishment.

And they have done what in response to David's costume?

[Alf]

And they have done what in response to David's costume?How dare conversation evolve? You should speak about what you're told too or be silenced.

[Marsh.]

How dare conversation evolve? You should speak about what you're told too or be silenced.

Who's silencing you? I just asked you a question? If you're uncomfortable explaining your point maybe discussion forums aren't for you? :unsure:

[Alf]

Who's silencing you? I just asked you a question? If you're uncomfortable explaining your point maybe discussion forums aren't for you? :unsure:I was taking about the bigger picture and not this nothing story about Walliams, and that was quite obvious to see, so why ask that question?

[Marsh.]

I was taking about the bigger picture and not this nothing story about Walliams, and that was quite obvious to see, so why ask that question?

Well, it must in someway relate to the topic, maybe not Walliams himself but the actual topic itself otherwise it's not a natural evolution of the conversation is it?

I'm asking the question because you still haven't answered it.

[Alf]

Well, it must in someway relate to the topic, maybe not Walliams himself but the actual topic itself otherwise it's not a natural evolution of the conversation is it?

I'm asking the question because you still haven't answered it.Ok, I said media establishment are these White lefties to your original question, who has this witch hunt on Williams come from? the media. So I hope that answers your second question.

[T*]

I mean it’s not like it’s anything new from him, he’s always done stuff like this throughout his career and Little Britain etc.
http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01782/walus-newtv_1782801c.jpg
Not that it excuses it but it doesn’t feel overly offensive because it’s just David Walliams all over

[Marsh.]

Ok, I said media establishment are these White lefties to your original question, who has this witch hunt on Williams come from? the media. So I hope that answers your second question.

Can you show us the witch hunt?

The only backlash he's had was from other twitter users. Are they all white lefties too?

[Alf]

I mean it’s not like it’s anything new from him, he’s always done stuff like this throughout his career and Little Britain etc.
http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01782/walus-newtv_1782801c.jpgYeah, isn't comedy horrible? I hate laughing too, why can't we all just be miserable?

[Marsh.]

I mean it’s not like it’s anything new from him, he’s always done stuff like this throughout his career and Little Britain etc.
http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01782/walus-newtv_1782801c.jpg
Not that it excuses it but it doesn’t feel overly offensive because it’s just David Walliams all over

That's like saying "Oh, that serial killer's found another victim, but this one doesn't feel too much of a problem, it's just him all over". :hee:

[Marsh.]

Yeah, isn't comedy horrible? I hate laughing too, why can't we all just be miserable?

It would've been just as funny with actual Japanese actors playing the sketch.

[Alf]

Can you show us the witch hunt?

The only backlash he's had was from other twitter users. Are they all white lefties too?You think Jack Dorsey is not media establishment?

[Alf]

It would've been just as funny with actual Japanese actors playing the sketch.But Walliams and Lucas play all the roles in their sketches, why change for this sketch?

[Marsh.]

You think Jack Dorsey is not media establishment?

And Jack Dorsey has exactly what to do with @Mary215 tweeting her disgust at Walliams' costume?

[Marsh.]

But Walliams and Lucas play all the roles in their sketches, why change for this sketch?

If they want to play all roles, why write Japanese characters?

[T*]

That's like saying "Oh, that serial killer's found another victim, but this one doesn't feel too much of a problem, it's just him all over". :hee:

I didnt say it wasn’t a problem though, I meant that it just doesn’t feel or look like a problem to some people bc they’re just accustomed to him doing that. Does the problem still remain? Yes. Is it something I’m really going to lose sleep over? No.

[Alf]

And Jack Dorsey has exactly what to do with @Mary215 tweeting her disgust at Walliams' costume?She uses his platform. And has he's proved, he has the power to what goes out on there.

And this story also made the papers so let's not pretend this is just a twitter thing.

[Alf]

If they want to play all roles, why write Japanese characters?Why not? why exclude Japanese or any people from being part of the joke?

[Marsh.]

And this story also made the papers so let's not pretend this is just a twitter thing.

Most of the articles are about the "twitter thing". Sad as it sounds, they actually create articles built around what someone has tweeted.

She uses his platform. And has he's proved, he has the power to what goes out on there.

Sorry, I must've missed the part where he personally approves tweets and opinions. He must be so busy.

[Marsh.]

Why not? why exclude Japanese or any people from being part of the joke?

I never suggested excluding them. I suggested giving some nice Japanese actors the work.

It would be like a director handing the role of "black man" to a white guy in makeup. Why not just hire a black actor?

[Kizzy]

Clearly. As it's only me to have felt there was a problem with it.

It's wilful ignorance to say that exaggerated eye make-up is not used as a gross stereotype for Asian people. Especially coming from the likes of David Walliams who's literally made a career out of them in Little Britain and other sketch shows.

Once again it is your supposition this was a slight on all Asians, anyone with a modicum of perspective can see it was purely satirical.

[Marsh.]

Once again it is your supposition this was a slight on all Asians, anyone with a modicum of perspective can see it was purely satirical.
Maybe you're misunderstanding, I haven't suggested Walliams is purposely attempting to offend asians.

That doesn't make it any less problematic all the same.

[Kizzy]

Maybe you're misunderstanding, I haven't suggested Walliams is purposely attempting to offend asians.

That doesn't make it any less problematic all the same.

Then where is your issue?... There was no intent and you have nothing to base your suspicions that it may or may not offend Asians.

Is this an example of the PC gone mad culture I hear so much about,someone becoming offended over nothing on behalf of others?

It sounds suspiciously like it.

[Marsh.]

Then where is your issue?... There was no intent and you have nothing to base your suspicions that it may or may not offend Asians.

Is this an example of the PC gone mad culture I hear so much about,someone becoming offended over nothing on behalf of others?

It sounds suspiciously like it.

What's my issue?

Read the thread.

It's like Emily Parr in BB, she didn't intend any offence at all but it didn't change the fact that what she said was completely inappropriate and offensive on a few levels.


If you find the likes of blackface and yellowface "nothing" that's your business but that doesn't make my viewpoint any less valid.

[Tom4784]

Kim Kardashian has also been catching heat for dressing up as Aaliyah which I think, in her case, is unwarranted since she only dressed up as her and didn't use prosethetics or black face to look like her.

It's the use of prosthetics and changing of his skin tone that made Walliams' costume offensive.

[Kizzy]

What's my issue?

Read the thread.

It's like Emily Parr in BB, she didn't intend any offence at all but it didn't change the fact that what she said was completely inappropriate and offensive on a few levels.


If you find the likes of blackface and yellowface "nothing" that's your business but that doesn't make my viewpoint any less valid.

The two examples are not comparable, I remember a time it was hilarious to dress as bin laden... that involves changing skintone and accentuating the nose a tad, where was the uproar?

[Marsh.]

The two examples are not comparable, I remember a time it was hilarious to dress as bin laden... that involves changing skintone and accentuating the nose a tad, where was the uproar?
I don't recall you making a thread about that.

I also don't recall that being popular or funny.

Maybe that's the issue here, you don't see a problem with Blackface and find it humorous. :shrug:

The two examples were to compare situations where something offensive is done but without actual intent from the person doing it.

[Kizzy]

I don't recall you making a thread about that.

I also don't recall that being popular or funny.

Maybe that's the issue here, you don't see a problem with Blackface and find it humorous. :shrug:

The two examples were to compare situations where something offensive is done but without actual intent from the person doing it.

Please don't put words in my mouth.
I didn't make this thread and yet I'm commenting, it was very popular at one time therefore many must have found it amusing.

Again you can't compare racist slurs to this satirical dig at one dictator in my opinion.

[Marsh.]

Please don't put words in my mouth.
I didn't make this thread and yet I'm commenting, it was very popular at one time therefore many must have found it amusing.

Again you can't compare racist slurs to this satirical dig at one dictator in my opinion.
We're not talking about the dig at a dictator. We're talking about him changing his skin tone and facial features to mimic an Asian.

I haven't put any words in your mouth. You called it humorous. Not me. :shrug:

I've already pointed out the comparison I was making which was about intent not always having to be there for something to be completely inappropriate and ignorant.

[Kizzy]

We're not talking about the dig at a dictator. We're talking about him changing his skin tone and facial features to mimic an Asian.

I haven't put any words in your mouth. You called it humorous. Not me. :shrug:

I've already pointed out the comparison I was making which was about intent not always having to be there for something to be completely inappropriate and ignorant.

You are intentionally misquoting me to fit in with your ridiculous 'yellowface' comment.
The dictator is Asian,that's just a given to look like him you have to look Asian...By no stretch of the imagination could that be seen as intentionally or unintentionally offensive to every Asian on the plant.

I think it's best to maintain some perspective here.

[Toy Soldier]

The dictator is Asian,that's just a given to look like him you have to look Asian...

Well to be fair, that's not entirely true, I don't think his costume would have been any less effective without the yellow makeup or eye prosthetics. Walliams doesn't really have "big round eyes" to start with, and the costume + wig makes him look plenty like Kim Jong-un. It's not like anyone would have been like "I'm so confused, who is he meant to be??"... the hair is pretty iconic :joker:.

[Kizzy]

Well to be fair, that's not entirely true, I don't think his costume would have been any less effective without the yellow makeup or eye prosthetics. Walliams doesn't really have "big round eyes" to start with, and the costume + wig makes him look plenty like Kim Jong-un. It's not like anyone would have been like "I'm so confused, who is he meant to be??"... the hair is pretty iconic :joker:.

What if you wan't to look exactly like someone you don't have to recreate their features on yourself?

[Marsh.]

You are intentionally misquoting me to fit in with your ridiculous 'yellowface' comment.
The dictator is Asian,that's just a given to look like him you have to look Asian...By no stretch of the imagination could that be seen as intentionally or unintentionally offensive to every Asian on the plant.

I think it's best to maintain some perspective here.

I'm not misquoting anything. You're telling me it's perfectly fine because Walliams doesn't intend to be racist and is attempting humour.

It's not a ridiculous yellow face comment, it's perfectly valid. You have yet to give me a reason why it is not.

Blackface would rightly not be accepted, so why should this?

[Kizzy]

I'm not misquoting anything. You're telling me it's perfectly fine because Walliams doesn't intend to be racist and is attempting humour.

It's not a ridiculous yellow face comment, it's perfectly valid. You have yet to give me a reason why it is not.

Blackface would rightly not be accepted, so why should this?

As I have said before blackface is known to be used as a general racial stereotype, this is a visual representation of one man.
Have I to repeat this any more?

Are you telling me it's not fine because you have determined whether intentional or not Walliams is being racist?

[Marsh.]

As I have said before blackface is known to be used as a general racial stereotype, this is a visual representation of one man.
Have I to repeat this any more?

Are you telling me it's not fine because you have determined whether intentional or not Walliams is being racist?

There has to be intent to be racist? :joker: So, I could shout the 'n' word at a black man but I don't mean it in a racist way so it's not racist. :idc:

Maybe you should repeat yourself.

this is a visual representation of one man.

that's just a given to look like him you have to look Asian

So, is he specifically one man, or using makeup to mimic "Asian"?

Because you don't need prosthetics or to alter his skin tone to know who he's dressed as.

As I have said before blackface is known to be used as a general racial stereotype

And yellowface isn't?

[Kizzy]

There has to be intent to be racist? :joker: So, I could shout the 'n' word at a black man but I don't mean it in a racist way so it's not racist. :idc:

Maybe you should repeat yourself.





So, is he specifically one man, or using makeup to mimic "Asian"?

Because you don't need prosthetics or to alter his skin tone to know who he's dressed as.



And yellowface isn't?


Blackface is just that ....a black face.
This is very specifically Kim Jong-un, I don't know how to explain that in any simpler terms for you.
He is Asian, that is a fact.
As the joker smileys have come out I'll leave it there, I've stated my point till I'm blue in the face anyway (no offence intended)

[Marsh.]

Blackface is just that ....a black face.
This is very specifically Kim Jong-un, I don't know how to explain that in any simpler terms for you.
He is Asian, that is a fact.
As the joker smileys have come out I'll leave it there, I've stated my point till I'm blue in the face anyway (no offence intended)

I've clearly asked you what makes black face unacceptable to you, and yellow face is.

You clearly don't have an answer because there isn't one.

[Kizzy]

I've clearly asked you what makes black face unacceptable to you, and yellow face is.

You clearly don't have an answer because there isn't one.

Are you being deliberately obtuse? I would have thought it obvious by now that I don't consider this 'yellowface' as it isn't a generalised representation of any one ethnicity.... He's Kim Jong-un.

[Marsh.]

Are you being deliberately obtuse? I would have thought it obvious by now that I don't consider this 'yellowface' as it isn't a generalised representation of any one ethnicity.... He's Kim Jong-un.

In what way is it not generalised?

Kim Jong-un has the most unique skin tone on the planet to not be associated with any specific race? REALLY?

[Toy Soldier]

What if you wan't to look exactly like someone you don't have to recreate their features on yourself?He doesn't look "exactly like him", he looks like David Walliams with eye prosthetics and a wig. :shrug: I'm saying it would have been just as effective as a Kim Jong costume without the eyes and makeup.

[Toy Soldier]

As I have said before blackface is known to be used as a general racial stereotype, this is a visual representation of one man.

So if someone was to dress up as, let's say, Frank Bruno... It would be OK for them to black up and slap on a big ol' nose prosthetic?

[Brillopad]

So if someone was to dress up as, let's say, Frank Bruno... It would be OK for them to black up and slap on a big ol' nose prosthetic?

So you think a black man has a big ol’ nose - sounds racist! :hehe:

[Toy Soldier]

So you think a black man has a big ol’ nose - sounds racist! :hehe:No, but Frank Bruno does have quite a wide nose, and that's my point really. I think blackface + nose widening prosthetics to look like Frank Bruno would get a lot of flak... So why is yellow makeup + eye prosthetics any different :think:.

[jet]

If some people didn't have the opportunity to be offended at least a half dozen times a day they'd lose the will to live.

[Marsh.]

Which doesn't add anything to the discussion. Instead of rubbishing others opinions, offer your own as to why you believe them to be wrong.

[Kizzy]

In what way is it not generalised?

Kim Jong-un has the most unique skin tone on the planet to not be associated with any specific race? REALLY?

It's not generalised because it's specific, specifically Kim Jong-un.

[Kizzy]

So if someone was to dress up as, let's say, Frank Bruno... It would be OK for them to black up and slap on a big ol' nose prosthetic?

Why would anyone dress as Frank Bruno for halloween?
The point was he was dressing as a dictator, it's political satire and nothing else.

[Marsh.]

It's not generalised because it's specific, specifically Kim Jong-un.

We're talking about his use of yellowface. That's not specifically Kim Jong-un.

If someone dressed as Mike Tyson and painted their face black would you defend it as "specific to Mike Tyson"?

[Marsh.]

The point was he was dressing as a dictator, it's political satire and nothing else.

Yes, very true. And looking back I don't think many (if anyone) are arguing he couldn't dress as Kim Jong-un. And that he wasn't ripping the piss out of a specific dictator.

But drawing the line at his use of makeup and prosthetics to portray the "yellow face" stereotype.

[Kizzy]

He doesn't look "exactly like him", he looks like David Walliams with eye prosthetics and a wig. :shrug: I'm saying it would have been just as effective as a Kim Jong costume without the eyes and makeup.

He would have looked like David Walliams in a wig then?

[Marsh.]

He would have looked like David Walliams in a wig then?

Well I'd say "David Walliams taking the piss by dressing up as Kim Jong-un" would be more what he was going for than falling into the offensive yellow face trope. But Walliams doesn't seem to think anything through. Watching him on BGT you can see he's very much a do it now and think later kind of person.

Still, at least Matt Lucas learned from his years on Little Britain.