How patriotic are you?

[Withano]

?

[Underscore]

Not very much at all.

[JerseyWins]

Somewhere between somewhat and not really

[RileyH]

Not really

[Withano]

I'm not either, but I've just been wondering for the last ten minutes if the word has just been hijacked by nationalists and has just became a dirty word by association? And maybe thats why I think that I'm not.. hmm

[Jack_]

With the exception of sport (cause that's different and fun), not at all.

[Oliver_W]

Somewhere between Somewhat and Very.

As it is, there are very few better places than the UK. We might not have the Constitution like the USA or the weather of Canada (yeah I like the cold) or its mountains, we're pretty good.

We don't really have dangerous weather conditions, we don't have m/any animals which are likely to kill us, we have lovely countryside,and we're not in a warzone.

[Smithy]

Not really with England but if someone comes for the north...:fist:

[Oliver_W]

Not really with England but if someone comes for the north...:fist:

Guernsey is northern?! I coulda sworn it was like, below Southampton?

[Smithy]

Im from the north originally :fist: drag Guernsey for filth idgaf_dua_lipa.mp3

[Firewire]

Not really, I mean even at Eurovision I normally support other countries so...

[Firewire]

I get worked up when English people attack Scotland though

[Withano]

I get worked up when English people attack Scotland though

Whats a Scotland?

[Smithy]

Whats a Scotland?

It’s where they make Iron Brew :)

[Niamh.]

Not very

Just kidding :hee:

[Withano]

It’s where they make Iron Brew :)

Oh cute, like a factory?

[Firewire]

Yeah it's just five minutes down the road :)

[Toy Soldier]

Iron Brew

"Iron Brew" :umm2:

[hijaxers]

I get worked up when English people attack Scotland though

Yeah i get annoyed when the Scots attack the English.

[Firewire]

Well we're a minority

[montblanc]

not really

[Tom4784]

Not at all, patriotism is vile.

[Greg!]

I am patriotic for SCOTLAND. Not the flop UK

[Twosugars]

I feel quite patriotic about Europe, that's it.

[Wizard.]

ME! I'm singing God Save The Queen for my Britain's Got Talent audition

[Oliver_W]

ME! I'm singing God Save The Queen for my Britain's Got Talent audition

I'm sure it'll be up there with Fergie's patriotic display

[Jason.]

Not at all.

I sneer whenever I see a house that has the England flag hanging out of the window.

[MTVN]

I chose extremely. I bloody love this country and can never imagine myself living anywhere else

[AnnieK]

I don't know what is wrong with patriotic...we have a great country, its pretty ****ed politically and economically but fundamentally we have so much freedom. Its unfortunate that the St Georges flag has been hijacked by people like the EDL and so now has very negative connotations.

Having said all that, I'm not a staunch patriot.....but come for Manchester :fist: I am most definitely Manc and Proud

[LaLaLand]

Welsh, extremely.

"British" - not arsed tbh.

Like if I'm abroad and someone asks where I'm from I say Wales, not UK? Once I said Wales to an American couple in Spain and they said "Where in England is that?" and I literally just walked away fumed.

[James]

I enjoy a lot of the sports at the Olympics more because of it, so I am yeah.

[reece(:]

Not very, I want to move to America

[GoldHeart]

I'm not either, but I've just been wondering for the last ten minutes if the word has just been hijacked by nationalists and has just became a dirty word by association? And maybe thats why I think that I'm not.. hmm

There's nothing wrong with being patriotic, but I know what you mean.
But nationalism is different .

[vixenk99]

I answered very patriotic. I'm proud to be Canadian.

[Brother Leon]

Outside of the Football Tournaments, I’m not really.

[Maru]

For better or worse, I am proud to be an American.

I'm not so patriotic that I can't see things from another culture's perspective... I think that's important to know one's place in the world and to be able to form genuine bonds with other people who come from different cultures. Which is kind of a big deal too when you live in a multicultural area.

[Alf]

Being British is part of my identity, part of who I am, and nobody could ever make me ashamed of that, because I have nothing to be ashamed of. I like my life and no Marxist will change that.


God save the Queen

[Underscore]

I’m probably more patriotic for Europe than Britain.

[Toy Soldier]

Having said all that, I'm not a staunch patriot.....but come for Manchester :fist: I am most definitely Manc and Proud

I think that's quite common in the UK, people have a lot of "regional pride" even if they're not particularly patriotic (Scottish, Yorkshireman, N. Irish, Londoner, etc etc).

I think the same also happens in the US? Lots of "state" / "City" patriotism.

[Nicky91]

not at all patriotic towards my crap country :hehe:

[Wizard.]

Not at all.

I sneer whenever I see a house that has the England flag hanging out of the window.

Why? I’ve never understood why people see it as nationalist or even racist if someone flies the St. George’s flag yet people have no problem with the Americans doing it or the EU flag...

[Withano]

Why? I’ve never understood why people see it as nationalist or even racist if someone flies the St. George’s flag yet people have no problem with the Americans doing it or the EU flag...

I think it does have a lot of negative connotations now. Like any anti-islam protest will be flying the flag, any edl or bnp rally will too.. its most prominent usage (apart from sports) does seem to be hate-groups, and it isnt that way with most other flags in the world. I think thats probably why. Too many twats using the flag as a tool to promote their hate. Whereas I'm sure the average American would see their flag multiple times a day for every reason under the sun.

The Union Jack flag doesnt have that assosiation as much, thats a lot more aesthetically pleasing to me, an English guy.

[Babayaro.]

Not at all.

[Babayaro.]

I get worked up when English people attack Scotland though

Oh, this as well lol

[Oliver_W]

I get worked up when English people attack Scotland though

It's one of the most beautiful counties in England.

[Livia]

Yes I am patriotic. I'm proud of this country, even though it has done a lot of questionable things in the past - like many other countries who don't beat themselves up quite as much as we do - but we do a lot of good in the world, despite what people think. And this country gave my Grandparents a home when no other country in Europe wanted them, and they were also patriotic and proud and grateful to be British.

[Wizard.]

I’m probably more patriotic for Europe than Britain.

I don't get this either. How can you feel European? You don't see Canadian's saying they feel American as Canada is in North America, or Russians calling themselves Eurasians.

[Wizard.]

I get worked up when English people attack Scotland though

It's usually the other way round? :laugh: Scottish people are more hateful towards the English!

[Wizard.]

Although I would say I'm British I wouldn't really say English.

[y.winter]

I'm more patriotic for the UK than my own country :laugh:

[Twosugars]

I don't get this either. How can you feel European? You don't see Canadian's saying they feel American as Canada is in North America, or Russians calling themselves Eurasians.

Easy to feel European. Basically, be proud of values and achievements of the western civilisation, overwhelmingly created in Europe.

[MTVN]

Seems a bit strange to feel proud of being European but treat British patriotism with disdain though, we've always been one of the most important countries in Europe

I don't really get why the fact that nationalists use the flag means that people don't want to be patriotic either. If anything you are letting extremists have a monopoly on patriotism by doing that and anyway it's not all about flag waving and chest beating, it's about appreciating and enjoying the place that you were born, raised and have probably spent most of your life in

[Crimson Dynamo]

?
well unless you specify what you mean

its open to each member to decide what you mean by patriotic

thus

meaningless

[Cal.]

Somewhat. I love this country and I love living here!

[Withano]

well unless you specify what you mean

its open to each member to decide what you mean by patriotic

thus

meaningless

That was what I was more interested to see, whether people saw themselves as patriotic with their interpretation of the word.

[Kazanne]

I am proud of my country,It may not be perfect,but it's a great place to live,we have much more than some other countries,There are things that need changing that would make it better,but compared to some it's definately Great Britain, Those that aren't proud and happy to be here or think it's a ****hole should maybe go on to pastures new.

[Underscore]

I don't get this either. How can you feel European? You don't see Canadian's saying they feel American as Canada is in North America, or Russians calling themselves Eurasians.

The culture mainly.

[Underscore]

Also I've got roots in multiple places so I've drawn culture from all over Europe.

[Twosugars]

Seems a bit strange to feel proud of being European but treat British patriotism with disdain though, we've always been one of the most important countries in Europe


Sometimes one country can be too limiting with its so-called national interests and hang-ups. I have roots in more than one country and have dual citizenship. I love a lot about Britain, but also detest a lot, especially since Brexit.

[Underscore]

Sometimes one country can be too limiting with its so-called national interests and hang-ups. I have roots in more than one country and have dual citizenship. I love a lot about Britain, but also detest a lot, especially since Brexit.

This sums it up basically.

[odd sock]

Proud to be English. Traced my family tree back to the early 1600's, they originally mainly came from Cornwall and moved to London in the 1830's, was fascinating to see what these people went through and the changes they saw, really gave me a sense of belonging. Bit unsure what the future holds, for our once great country but still proud of my roots.

[TomC]

Not in the least for the UK. Scotland, yes.

[TomC]

I actually find the difference between Scottish and English patriotism quite fascinating.

I read an article that said 'Englishness' has been claimed by the far right, which I found interesting.

[Mystic Mock]

I'm not fanatical but I am patriotic and want us to be the best nation that we can be, and I do get extremely bothered when we don't reach those heights (which is nearly all of the time I guess) but yes I love this country, but not to the point where I'm blinded by it, and not to the point where I can't appreciate what other countries have to offer either.

[Mystic Mock]

I don't know what is wrong with patriotic...we have a great country, its pretty ****ed politically and economically but fundamentally we have so much freedom. Its unfortunate that the St Georges flag has been hijacked by people like the EDL and so now has very negative connotations.

Having said all that, I'm not a staunch patriot.....but come for Manchester :fist: I am most definitely Manc and Proud

Oh I can be extreme with City patriotism (if that's even a term) anyone comes for Birmingham or the Brummie accent and I do get very defensive.:laugh:

[TomC]

Although I would say I'm British I wouldn't really say English.

'Britishness' is a totally false construct IMO.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I am patriotic for SCOTLAND. Not the flop UK

:dance:

[Cherie]

English people are just weird, a lot seem to be ashamed of their country that most people want to come to :crazy:

[Northern Monkey]

Never really think about it but Yes i’d say i am patriotic.Always happy to come back to these green and pleasant lands after being abroad.Love the food,The seaside destinations,The history is cool,Not a massive monarchist but i like that we have them and Buckingham Palace etc,Can’t moan about the weather Atleast it’s not extreme.Will support England in tournaments but will also support other British teams or sports people if i ever watch any sports.
Plus my DNA tells me i’m almost 90% English so this country is in my DNA :laugh:
We live in one of the best countries in the world to live.Yes it might not be the most exciting holiday destination or the best weather but it’s a good place to live.It could be worse,It could be Syria.We’re lucky.

God save the Queen

[Crimson Dynamo]

Driving through the heart of Scotland as i did last weekend its hard not to be patriotic

All the cleared valleys and hillsides that once had thriving communities - burned, destroyed and the occupants shipped off to the colonies never to see their homeland again - and for why - to let sheep on and make a few landowners even richer


:flutter:

[Cherie]

I also find it a bit odd that some people associate flying the English flag with far right groups, the IRA used the Irish flag at their funerals, the Irish didn't let that get in the way of retaining their flag, during the World Cup and the Euros I see all sorts of flags flying from windows, Greek, Italian, Spanish, no one points at them or calls them chavs, but if an English person flys their flag they are looked down on by some

[Crimson Dynamo]

I am patriotic about all the British teams in the world cup and support them almost as much as Scotland ( and that includes Eireland)


I even support England in a sort of "as long as they dont do something daft like win the tournament" sort of thing

[Niamh.]

I am patriotic about all the British teams in the world cup and support them almost as much as Scotland ( and that includes Eireland)


I even support England in a sort of "as long as they dont do something daft like win the tournament" sort of thing

**** off, we aren't British :nono:

[Crimson Dynamo]

**** off, we aren't British :nono:

Yes that is why i added Ireland South to say I support them as well as the British teams :nono:

[Niamh.]

Yes that is why i added Ireland South to say I support them as well as the British teams :nono:

Apology accepted :hee:

[MTVN]

I also find it a bit odd that some people associate flying the English flag with far right groups, the IRA used the Irish flag at their funerals, the Irish didn't let that get in the way of retaining their flag, during the World Cup and the Euros I see all sorts of flags flying from windows, Greek, Italian, Spanish, no one points at them or calls them chavs, but if an English person flys their flag they are looked down on by some

Yeah I don't get it either, every far right and nationalist group uses their country's flag but we seem to let that affect us more than anywhere else.

[smudgie]

Somewhat.
I have been known to go the whole hog with the hats and flags when watching England play.
I love the Union Jack as well.

[Kizzy]

Depends who's in charge, right now no not really.

[Cherie]

Depends who's in charge, right now no not really.

Patriotism has zero to do with who is in government

[Kizzy]

Patriotism has zero to do with who is in government

I don't feel proud to be British right now, that said I can't say I never will be proud to be British again so to my mind it very much depends
A. on how many living here view our country
B. how the rest of the world view us.

To me right now neither of those are very positive.

So to me it does, I don't really care if you don't agree to be frank. That is my view.

[Tom4784]

I hate patriotism for the same reasons why I don't support the Poppy campaign. People use both as a stick to beat others with.

[Withano]

Patriotism has zero to do with who is in government

Everything to do with the country in every sense imaginable could effect someone's sense of patriotism. :shrug:

[Withano]

The most patriotic I've ever felt in my life was watching Farage not win his seat in 2015

[Cherie]

Everything to do with the country in every sense imaginable could effect someone's sense of patriotism. :shrug:

If you are proud of where you are born, who is in government doesn't come in to it, you can't switch on and off depending on who is in no 10, half the time I have no idea who is in power in Ireland, does it make me love my country less nope

[Withano]

If you are proud of where you are born, who is in government doesn't come in to it, you can't switch on and off depending on who is in no 10, half the time I have no idea who is in power in Ireland, does it make me love my country less nope

Some people are proud at times, and not proud at other times? If thats down to their government at any particular time, then thats their opinion?

[Cherie]

I don't feel proud to be British right now, that said I can't say I never will be proud to be British again so to my mind it very much depends
A. on how many living here view our country
B. how the rest of the world view us.

To me right now neither of those are very positive.

So to me it does, I don't really care if you don't agree to be frank. That is my view.


For one who moans about baity comments you are quite adept yourself at churning them out. I never said you couldn't have a view, I just don't agree with it.

[Cherie]

Some people are proud at times, and not proud at other times? If thats down to their government at any particular time, then thats their opinion?

What has the government got to do with being proud, if you didn't vote for the current government then why would it colour your view of your Britishness?

[Withano]

What has the government got to do with being proud, if you didn't vote for the current government then why would it colour your view of your Britishness?

You're telling me if Ireland voted Hitler into power tomorrow, you'd still be just as proud tomorrow as you were last week? (I'm not calling the Tories hitler lol, just making a point of how odd your argument is, of course it can effect a sense of patriotism).

[Cherie]

You're telling me if Ireland voted Hitler into power tomorrow, you'd still be just as proud tomorrow as you were last week? (I'm not calling the Tories hitler lol, just making a point of how odd your argument is, of course it can effect a sense of patriotism).

I would still be proud to be Irish yes, because unless it was a 100% vote in favour there would still be a percentage who didn't and I would count myself as one of those

[Withano]

Think you just assumed everyone else has a stable sense of patriotism because you do? Thats not really the case, my sense of patriotism fluctuates, I think a lot of others' do as well.

[Cherie]

Think you just assumed everyone else has a stable sense of patriotism because you do? Thats not really the case, my sense of patriotism fluctuates, I think a lot of others' do as well.

Well you are assuming I must fluctuate because you do

[Withano]

Well you are assuming I must fluctuate because you do

Not at all, the beginning of the post you just quoted suggests the complete opposite of this actually. Weird summary.

[Cherie]

Not at all, the beginning of the post you just quoted suggests the complete opposite of this actually. Weird summary.

If you say so, you can interpret it any way you want, I know what I mean

[Withano]

If you say so, you can interpret it any way you want, I know what I mean

Yes. your sense of patriotism stays pretty constant, youve made that clear. I think the people in the thread understand that, Cherie. I was just pointing out the point you missed a feck load of times, in that what applies to you doesnt apply to everybody.

[Cherie]

Yes. your sense of patriotism stays pretty constant, youve made that clear. I think the people in the thread understand that, Cherie. I was just pointing out the point you missed a feck load of times, in that what applies to you doesnt apply to everybody.

No I was just giving my stance, I wasn't telling you what to do the concept of which you seem to be grappling with

[Withano]

[/B]

No I was just giving my stance, I wasn't telling you what to do the concept of which you seem to be grappling with

Patriotism has zero to do with who is in government

Backtrack all the way to Narnia if ya like, but this reads more like a statement, not a stance.

[Cherie]

Backtrack all the way to Narnia if ya like, but this reads more like a statement, not a stance.

I don't speak for anyone but myself unlike you who seem to have decided to speak for the people of the thread :skull:

[Withano]

I don't speak for anyone but myself unlike you who seem to have decided to speak for the people of the thread :skull:

You were spouting some BS so I responded lol. You dont have to respond to me if you dont want to discuss your BS.

[Niamh.]

You're telling me if Ireland voted Hitler into power tomorrow, you'd still be just as proud tomorrow as you were last week? (I'm not calling the Tories hitler lol, just making a point of how odd your argument is, of course it can effect a sense of patriotism).Don't be ridiculous Hitler is dead

[Withano]

Don't be ridiculous Hitler is dead

Prove it

[Kizzy]

For one who moans about baity comments you are quite adept yourself at churning them out. I never said you couldn't have a view, I just don't agree with it.

Good for you, I still don't care... My view stands.

[Cherie]

You were spouting some BS so I responded lol. You dont have to respond to me if you dont want to discuss your BS.

happy to own my BS :hee:

[Cherie]

Don't be ridiculous Hitler is dead

Ireland were neutral in the war, does that make you sad to be Irish Neem?

[Kizzy]

I don't speak for anyone but myself unlike you who seem to have decided to speak for the people of the thread :skull:

You spoke for me.... You stated patriotism has nothing to do with who is in govt, what you should have said is 'in my opinion' it doesn't.... Because in mine it does.

You also said 'English people are weird', so you can't speak for everyone but you can speak about everyone? :/

[Cherie]

You spoke for me.... You stated patriotism has nothing to do with who is in govt, what you should have said is 'in my opinion' it doesn't.... Because in mine it does.

You also said 'English people are weird', so you can't speak for everyone but you can speak about everyone? :/

Well they are

Whose opinion other than mine would I be stating? will have to put in a signature like TS


In my opinion...
'

[Kizzy]

Well they are

Whose opinion other than mine would I be stating? will have to put in a signature like TS


In my opinion...
'

How very unBritish of you to say :idc:

Yes, that would help thank you.

[Niamh.]

Prove itI did nazi that coming [emoji43]

[Niamh.]

Ireland were neutral in the war, does that make you sad to be Irish Neem?Nah 🤠

[The Slim Reaper]

Being proud of something that is purely an accident of birth seems meaningless to me.

[Withano]

Being proud of something that is purely an accident of birth seems meaningless to me.

Me too tbf, thats a new one on me too.

[Niamh.]

That's cos you're English :fan:

[MTVN]

I consider being born in this green and pleasant land a fine achievement, congratulate myself on it every day

[AnnieK]

Being proud of something that is purely an accident of birth seems meaningless to me.

Well luckily you live in a country that allows you to have those thoughts and verbalise them and don't force you to salute the flag and bow to the ideals of its leaders without fear of retribution.

[Alf]

The upper class and the working class have traditionally always been patriotic.

It's the left middle class, that embraces everybody else's culture but their own, that have never been patriotic. And as they've dominated our culture in media and academia for the last 30 years, they've influenced a whole generation of people to dislike and feel ashamed of their own country.

[The Slim Reaper]

That's cos you're English :fan:

Bloody colonist. :fist:

[The Slim Reaper]

Well luckily you live in a country that allows you to have those thoughts and verbalise them and don't force you to salute the flag and bow to the ideals of its leaders without fear of retribution.

Doesn't that just emphasise the "accident of birth" bit?

[Withano]

The upper class and the working class have traditionally always been patriotic.

It's the left middle class, that embraces everybody else's culture but their own, that have never been patriotic. And as they've dominated our culture in media and academia for the last 30 years, they've influenced a whole generation of people to dislike and feel ashamed of their own country.

I wouldnt say the 'left middle class' influences my patriotism at all. Its the far right who (negatively) influence it more than anything.

[Maru]

I wouldnt say the 'left middle class' influences my patriotism at all. Its the far right who (negatively) influence it more than anything.

Have you ever been firmly placed anywhere on the right paradigm? If not, it wouldn't nullify Alf's point as your inclination would've been baked in... just sayin'... :laugh:

And maybe we can't be too political earlier on. I didn't really start to "sew" any firm ideas of where I sat until probably around my early 20's, and I was certainly very Democrat... but having roots in an area that allows me to explore a range of political and diversity of thought, I had a little bit more inclination I think to dabble in belief systems.

Though I do think kids are involved in politics much much earlier on... which is quite sad actually :skull: I miss worrying only what I would wear and what music to listen to and if cute boys liked me... surprised to find myself this patriotic later in life, but I guess it was always there... 9/11 stoked it a bit I'm sure.

[Niamh.]

Bloody colonist. :fist:

https://media.giphy.com/media/3ornjTe70ui68AH2Y8/giphy.gif

[Maru]

https://media.giphy.com/media/3ornjTe70ui68AH2Y8/giphy.gif

I'm opening that (http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/showthread.php?t=335466) thread very soon, Nom. I want to see lots of Windows Paint art coming from your pokketts..

[Niamh.]

I'm opening that (http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/showthread.php?t=335466) thread very soon, Nom. I want to see lots of Windows Paint art coming from your pokketts..

:laugh:

I'll be there

[Maru]

:laugh:

I'll be there

I don't even care if it's Conor McGregor in 2,0000,00,0000 rows of ASCII chars, it's still Nom art to me :love:

[Maru]

brb, going to grab my chi mix and go to Home Depot to exchange a closet rod and then buying the biggest American flag I can find for my castle's grand entrancement to best you .. and I'll be sure to ask some Mexicans to pay for it while I'm there. My chi's common Mexican heritage should help smooth over those negotiations.

[Twosugars]

Though I do think kids are involved in politics much much earlier on... which is quite sad actually :skull: I miss worrying only what I would wear and what music to listen to and if cute boys liked me... surprised to find myself this patriotic later in life, but I guess it was always there... 9/11 stoked it a bit I'm sure.

I think it's excellent kids are getting more politically aware. After all politics today will decide their future tomorrow. They have the most to gain or lose.
Besides, people tend to be more open to new ideas when young and have less patience with bs. Pity this awakening didn't come early enough for the Brexit vote. Instead, OAPs decided on something they won't be around for to "enjoy".

[Underscore]

I wouldnt say the 'left middle class' influences my patriotism at all. Its the far right who (negatively) influence it more than anything.

.

[Maru]

I think it's excellent kids are getting more politically aware. After all politics today will decide their future tomorrow. They have the most to gain or lose.
Besides, people tend to be more open to new ideas when young and have less patience with bs. Pity this awakening didn't come early enough for the Brexit vote. Instead, OAPs decided on something they won't be around for to "enjoy".

I'd argue kids have to do a little bit more living&soul searching before forming constructive opinions on everything from family law to real estate taxes. :laugh: The finer details.

The drawback of this engagement is it's very easy to get into stress/anxiety cycles with social media being in their faces all the time. Which sometimes leads to internet addiction and other anxiety disorders, as they're being told that everything they do, think breath matters and they must act now, pay attention and make their voices heard (insert other ominous platitudes)... and this "action" is usually simply feeling angry and resentful constantly. Not even getting up and doing anything about it usually, just being angry and allowing it to dominate all their personal life decisions and clearly it effects their emotional state in a negative way, given the state of 24hr news cycle(s).

It is also terrible their physical health if they spend hours in a fixed position so stressed. It can lead to chronic adrenaline (think anxiety), which wear the body down over time. Some people also connect the constant stress with feeling attacked, "Oh I feel so stressed... the threat must be real"... and that can become hard-wired if not curtailed, to respond to stress in unhealthy ways rather than spend the time learning to cope with it. Technology already has a huge impact on how our brains and emotions become wired when developing, so adding politics to this I think is more toxic. I think it's OK to allow children to be a little bit involved, like talking with them and helping them to learn to think critically and interpret the information for themselves, but maybe not so much that they become a statistic.

Have Smartphones Destroyed a Generation?
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/09/has-the-smartphone-destroyed-a-generation/534198/

[Twosugars]

I think you paint a somewhat exaggerated picture of that engagement.
I don't know about US, but here not many grownups study family law or real estate taxes before voting. We don't have endless referendums like US has with their state elections.
And re. social media, well, I think that ship has sailed already. Kids spend loads of time on that anyway, they may just as well do something productive with it from time to time.
Also, how young are we talking about? You said kids, I repeated kids. I had 16+ in mind. Here this is the age of consent to sex, they can drive at 17. At the moment they can vote at 18 (some argue it should be lowered to 16).
The days of idealized childhood from the 50s are over. Young people encounter things like environmental issues, immigration etc from an early age.
Besides if we waited for people to be fully mature (emotional maturity) then according to psychologists we'd have to wait until 25.

[Maru]

I think you paint a somewhat exaggerated picture of that engagement.
I don't know about US, but here not many grownups study family law or real estate taxes before voting. We don't have endless referendums like US has with their state elections.
And re. social media, well, I think that ship has sailed already. Kids spend loads of time on that anyway, they may just as well do something productive with it from time to time.
Also, how young are we talking about? You said kids, I repeated kids. I had 16+ in mind. Here this is the age of consent to sex, they can drive at 17. At the moment they can vote at 18 (some argue it should be lowered to 16).
The days of idealized childhood from the 50s are over. Young people encounter things like environmental issues, immigration etc from an early age.
Besides if we waited for people to be fully mature (emotional maturity) then according to psychologists we'd have to wait until 25.

It's probably different in the US given we are so highly dependent on our cars. Public transportation is not widespread unless you're in the city and even then it is limited in comparison to other locales. Also our homes tend to be higher in size, things like consumer elections are cheaper, so it's very easy to give a child a device, tell them to entertain themselves and they can spend days in a room in the summer wrapped up in devices... our kids are quite addicted to consumer electronics and media here and is generally cheaper than outdoor entertainment.

I linked the Atlantic article for this because it cites various statistics, such as kids here passing up on usual rights such as getting a car, having sex, having an active social life, spikes in mental health and depression rates, etc... We're just starting to understand the role tech plays in mental health, but when talking about too young for politics, I am mainly talking about folk <16... near voting age is I think it is good to start paying attention since high school is when we start getting a deeper understanding of civics related materials.

It's interesting you mention voting age though... in the 2016 election, they were so sure the youth vote would come out. I've noticed that being politically engaged doesn't always translate to voting numbers. The youth vote (and the # of ppl voting in general) were much lower than people had hoped. So they did not show for Hillary as was claimed to happen. That's always been a problem. Primary voting numbers are an even bigger dumpster fire, forgetting just the youth vote.

That's why I don't think that engagement translates to votes. So I tend to think the "movement" as the kind of mover and shaker is a bit of a joke. It's largely down to a niche group of folk who spend an inordinate amount of time being stressed about things they can't control, rather than being politically "active"... and a large amount of that emotional energy is spent online tweeting into the ether. Now, that's not to say that's true across the board... I knew some people who were highly well-read, studied intensively in their younger years, would attend debates, seminars and were well-ranged in a diverse set of topics... and they were bound to go to great schools and grab great scholarships. But that is extraordinarily rare and is the outlier.

[Ammi]

...I don’t know how ‘patriotic’ I am...With a nooooo, you really have me thinking and overthinking with this, you sneaky person...’patriotism’ is a difficult one, I think...and not really comparable to RoI and ‘pride’ felt there...because historically, Ireland was the ‘suppressed’, the ‘underdog’ type thing....That’s not something that applies with England and ‘being British’...the huge immigration from Ireland to America and the ‘golden land’ opportunities would hold a huge ‘affection’ with Ireland and America...which is also felt, I think...by some, obviously...because there was fleeing from hunger../..poverty etc and to a better life...which is so entwined with British rule and British ownership...so ‘black and white’ of countries and their patriotism can’t really apply equally...I’m also though of the mindset of...’how long do the ‘sins’ of our fore-fathers apply...:laugh:...so yeah, there lies the rub as well...


..I have huge respect for those who have given their lives ..:love:..for everything we are today, everything we have with all of our choices and freedoms...without all of the ‘bad stuff’ as well, we just wouldn’t be...like a ‘sliding door’ thing, Britain only ‘is’ because of it all, good, bad and ugly etc...I have huge respect for British sovereignty ..:love:...because they devote their whole lives to their country, so to us all...and yeah, they may have quite ‘priveledged’ lives as it were as ‘their payment’...but I’d rather have the freedoms I have as an individual as oppose to ‘a crystal cage’ lifestyle...when we all think about ‘the meaning of life’, type stuff...the Royal meaning is pre-mapped from birth to death...for most Royals anyway....


...I don’t know if I’m ‘patriotic’ but I’m grateful and thankful for everything my life brings...my parents, my children etc...and all those who I’m close to and hold dear, I’m very fortunate and I’m very blessed...nothing would be quite exactly the same if any ‘sliding door’ had not been identical...but then, for those who have suffered through colonisation etc, through ‘British Rule’ ...pride and patriotism doesn’t quite sit snugly either..’I am because other people’s lives were not and were awful’ .but I’m not ‘ashamed’ though in any way because those are things beyond my control or choice...

...it’s interesting though, how Britain is seen with other countries..(...I think something Kizzy touched on...)...with sporting events and such the like...I’ve sometimes heard things like ‘anyone but England’ for the win..that type of thing...which, yeah is quite deflating and sad...we’re a relatively tiny country but not very often seen as the ‘underdog’ in sporting events, so maybe it’s a ‘rooting for the underdog’ thing as well...of Ireland, Scotland, Wales....with Eurovision, it’s hard to feel ‘pride’ and root for the UK, when our songs aren’t up to par in comparison to others...:laugh:...

[waterhog]

is this patriotic enough - every day starts with god save the queen - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4zP0BGWNzI

[Brillopad]

I'm not either, but I've just been wondering for the last ten minutes if the word has just been hijacked by nationalists and has just became a dirty word by association? And maybe thats why I think that I'm not.. hmm

Patriotism is only a dirty word to people who want to force a country to adapt to their ways and abandon it’s own values. If they don’t like the freedoms and protections provided in that country quite frankly they can bugger off and see whether the grass is really greener elsewhere. They probably need their country more than it needs them anyway.

[Withano]

Patriotism is only a dirty word to people who want to force a country to adapt to their ways and abandon it’s own values.


I disagree, I would say one of Britains greatest values is multiculturalism and acceptance, yet those who most regularly use the word (like edl, britain first etc) want the opposite of this quite often. They clearly dont see it as a dirty word, and they clearly do want to abandon some of Britains values.

Good theory, but its not working for me.

[Kizzy]

Recently I don't believe the rights and protections as well as the public services and infrastructure that were the envy of the world are being sufficiently protected, that has impacted also on me. I really would like to see a tidal wave of feeling from the public on social issues and employment rights that would restore my faith in the English.

In the main it is the govt that I feel are working against what it means to be British and that is what is impacting on my feeling towards my country.

[Brillopad]

I disagree, I would say one of Britains greatest values is multiculturalism and acceptance, yet those who most regularly use the word (like edl, britain first etc) want the opposite of this quite often. They clearly dont see it as a dirty word, and they clearly do want to abandon some of Britains values.

Good theory, but its not working for me.

Multiculturalism - what an over-used word by some. Many feel it is a word forced on them and question why British people were never given a vote to decide to what degree the majority were expected to accept it. Whether losing their own way of life and identity was ever any part of any ‘deal’.

Brexit demonstrated just how many feel about this and how ‘multiculturism’ is a word bandied about by those trying to convince everyone else it is what this country is about. If you say so. Maybe assuming was never the way to go which is why we have Brexit now. Consequences.

[Brillopad]

Recently I don't believe the rights and protections as well as the public services and infrastructure that were the envy of the world are being sufficiently protected, that has impacted also on me. I really would like to see a tidal wave of feeling from the public on social issues and employment rights that would restore my faith in the English.

In the main it is the govt that I feel are working against what it means to be British and that is what is impacting on my feeling towards my country.

They stopped being the envy of the world when half the world started to come here and reap the rewards without putting anything in - which has significantly impacted on everyone else.

[Kizzy]

They stopped being the envy of the world when half the world started to come here and reap the rewards without putting anything in - which has significantly impacted on everyone else.

And you say you're not a bigot :laugh:

[Brillopad]

And you say you're not a bigot :laugh:

So do you. :joker:

[Withano]

They stopped being the envy of the world when half the world started to come here and reap the rewards without putting anything in - which has significantly impacted on everyone else.

Let me guess, you're patriotic and English.

@everyone confused at the responses of the poll, this is why Brits are less keen on the word 'patriotic' :joker: how wonderfully demonstrated.

I've just been wondering for the last ten minutes if the word has just been hijacked by nationalists and has just became a dirty word by association?

I'll wonder no more

[Kizzy]

So do you. :joker:

I'm not going to fall down the rabbit hole of asking you to qualify that statement :/

[Brillopad]

Let me guess, you're patriotic and English.

@everyone confused at the responses of the poll, this is why Brits are less keen on the word 'patriotic' :joker: how wonderfully demonstrated.



I'll wonder no more

You wonder away or not. Who cares! :hehe:

[Withano]

Welp, serious debates had a good two or three week run there. Welcome back I guess Brillo.

[Brillopad]

Welp, serious debates had a good two or three week run there. Welcome back I guess Brillo.

Did it really - not from what I have been reading. But of course you would say that in your constant attempts to make me feel unwelcome. Give it up - people know what you are about.

[Withano]

Did it really - not from what I have been reading. But of course you would say that in your constant attempts to make me feel unwelcome. Give it up - people know what you are about.

You wonder away or not. Who cares! :hehe:

They were at least consistently of a high calibre than this. grow up a bit mate.

[Brillopad]

They were at least consistently of a high calibre than this. grow up a bit mate.

Practice what you preach mate and stop trying to misinterpret threads. I have read them so go read them again or keep your unpleasant opinions to yourself.

[Brillopad]

I'm not going to fall down the rabbit hole of asking you to qualify that statement :/

Bigot = intolerance to the opinions of others.

Simple. I am not the only one who meets that criteria. You too have proved it time and again.

[Cherie]

Did it really - not from what I have been reading. But of course you would say that in your constant attempts to make me feel unwelcome. Give it up - people know what you are about.

Welcome back Brillo

[Kizzy]

Bigot = intolerance to the opinions of others.

Simple. I am not the only one who meets that criteria. You too have proved it time and again.

You have even amended the dictionary to make your skewed opinion appear viable! :laugh:

'The fact of having and expressing strong, unreasonable beliefs and disliking other people who have different beliefs or a different way of life:

religious/racial bigotry'

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/bigotry

[Brillopad]

You have even amended the dictionary to make your skewed opinion appear viable! :laugh:

'The fact of having and expressing strong, unreasonable beliefs and disliking other people who have different beliefs or a different way of life:

religious/racial bigotry'

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/bigotry

No I have not - that was the first and main definition. You are the one cherry-picking a definition that suits.

[Kizzy]

No I have not - that was the first and main definition. You are the one cherry-picking a definition that suits.

Sorry Cambridge university brillo doesn't agree with your definition.....back to the drawing board :/

I expanded you definition btw.... You forgot this bit,

'a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.
"don't let a few small-minded bigots destroy the good image of the city"
synonyms: dogmatist, partisan, sectarian, prejudiced person; racist, racialist, sexist, homophobe, chauvinist, jingoist, anti-Semite; informalmale chauvinist pig, MCP'

[Twosugars]

Sorry Cambridge university brillo doesn't agree with your definition.....back to the drawing board :/

Don't you know? Cambridge University is the hotbed of left-wing liberals sabotaging our dictionaries and frigging foreigners coming over here and taking our university posts!:joker:

[Brillopad]

Sorry Cambridge university brillo doesn't agree with your definition.....back to the drawing board :/

I expanded you definition btw.... You forgot this bit,

'a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.
"don't let a few small-minded bigots destroy the good image of the city"
synonyms: dogmatist, partisan, sectarian, prejudiced person; racist, racialist, sexist, homophobe, chauvinist, jingoist, anti-Semite; informalmale chauvinist pig, MCP'

The Cambridge definition is one expanded definition. They all use different wording with the basic definition stating a bigot is intolerant of differing opinions, then going on to state especially in this or that circumstance ie religious intolereNce etc. But basically we each and everyone of us meet the basic definition with you being at the lower end of tolerance of non-socialist views which still makes you a bigot no matter how much you try to deny it.

[Kizzy]

The Cambridge definition is one expanded definition. They all use different wording with the basic definition stating a bigot is intolerant of differing opinions, then going on to state especially in this or that circumstance ie religious intolereNce etc. But basically we each and everyone of us meet the basic definition with you being at the lower end of tolerance of non-socialist views which still makes you a bigot no matter how much you try to deny it.

Nope I expanded YOUR definition... you omitted the rest of the definition in YOUR post :)

[Brillopad]

Nope I expanded YOUR definition... you omitted the rest of the definition in YOUR post :)

BUlly for you - you are still a bigot though. :hehe:

[jet]

If patriotic is simply loving your country of birth, then I'm patriotic about N. Ireland. I wouldn't want to live anywhere else. I also love the Republic of Ireland, where I have lived for a time, have relatives there and frequently holiday there. I also quite like the UK, where I also have relatives in England and Scotland.
N. Ireland people relate more to those in the ROI (we are more alike) than we do to those in the UK, even though we are part ot the UK and most want to remain so - the majority don't really want a United Ireland or are totally against it. It's all a bit mad, isn't it? :laugh:

[Cherie]

Just sat listening to stories of people who have been helped in the snow

residents coming out with food and hot drinks
people offering lifts to hospital appointment
people digging other people out of the snow
people coming out in their tractors and 4 x 4s to rescue people who are stuck
taxi firms getting their drivers to tow people home



amazing :love:

[jet]

Just sat listening to stories of people who have been helped in the snow

residents coming out with food and hot drinks
people offering lifts to hospital appointment
people digging other people out of the snow
people coming out in their tractors and 4 x 4s to rescue people who are stuck
taxi firms getting their drivers to tow people home



amazing :love:

Lovely to hear :clap1:

[Cherie]

Lovely to hear :clap1:

Nice that you want to hear it Jet :laugh:

[GoldHeart]

Just sat listening to stories of people who have been helped in the snow

residents coming out with food and hot drinks
people offering lifts to hospital appointment
people digging other people out of the snow
people coming out in their tractors and 4 x 4s to rescue people who are stuck
taxi firms getting their drivers to tow people home



amazing :love:

Anytime there's hardship and distress , the community always comes together and helps :clap1:. It's nice and selfless :) .

[Twosugars]

Just sat listening to stories of people who have been helped in the snow

residents coming out with food and hot drinks
people offering lifts to hospital appointment
people digging other people out of the snow
people coming out in their tractors and 4 x 4s to rescue people who are stuck
taxi firms getting their drivers to tow people home



amazing :love:
it's nice to be nice
:clap1:

[Cherie]

Anytime there's hardship and distress , the community always comes together and helps :clap1:. It's nice and selfless :) .


True, it would be nice to see a front page headline about it, but I doubt that will happen

[GoldHeart]

True, it would be nice to see a front page headline about it, but I doubt that will happen

They've mentioned it on the news and it's on the internet :shrug: , there was even a story about a Gregg's driver that handed out his pies and cakes to people stranded .

[Cherie]

They've mentioned it on the news and it's on the internet :shrug: , there was even a story about a Gregg's driver that handed out his pies and cakes to people stranded .

Yeah I know, but it would be nice to see the print press running feel good stories for a change

[Twosugars]

Yeah I know, but it would be nice to see the print press running feel good stories for a change

there was a nice piece in the guardian

[Brillopad]

there was a nice piece in the guardian

Do the Guardian do ‘nice pieces’? All they ever seem to do is support the Corbynites who want to overturn a public vote and whinge about Brexit. They whinge and bloody whine at every given opportunity with little to no respect for a public vote. Nasty rag in my opinion.

[Tom4784]

Aaaand another unrelated topic is turned into a Corbyn hate club.

[Twosugars]

Do the Guardian do ‘nice pieces’? All they ever seem to do is support the Corbynites who want to overturn a public vote and whinge about Brexit. They whinge and bloody whine at every given opportunity with little to no respect for a public vote. Nasty rag in my opinion.

I was responding to Cherie about nice stories about people helping each other due to snow. And Guardian published a nice piece about that.

thank you for your input, but frankly whateva

[Twosugars]

Aaaand another unrelated topic is turned into a Corbyn hate club.

managed to squeeze in Brexit as well :laugh:

[Brillopad]

Aaaand another unrelated topic is turned into a Corbyn hate club.

And another post of mine is ridiculed by you - no agendas there then. I know who will be in next doing the same. :shrug:

[Brillopad]

managed to squeeze in Brexit as well :laugh:

Don’t start him off on that one. Lefties do not take criticism of their precious Corbyn or any mention of Brexit very well.

[Twosugars]

Don’t start him off on that one. Lefties do not take criticism of their precious Corbyn or any mention of Brexit very well.
Unlikely, as afaik I don't share your opinions, Brillo. I'm left of centre, open-minded about Corbyn and absolutely detest Brexit and consider myself European before everything else.

[Brillopad]

Unlikely, as afaik I don't share your opinions, Brillo. I'm left of centre, open-minded about Corbyn and absolutely detest Brexit and consider myself European before everything else.

THat’s fine. I was well aware of that. We are both entitled to our opinions.

[Withano]

**** brillo. WHy are you incapable of staying ontopic.

[Brillopad]

**** brillo. WHy are you incapable of staying ontopic.

I was spot on. Following Dezzy as predicted. Not playing today. :wavey:

[Withano]

I was spot on. Following Dezzy as predicted. Not playing today. :wavey:

Or I entered my own thread after seeing it bumped, and saw you were talking ****ing ****e. Again.

[Brillopad]

Or I entered my own thread after seeing it bumped, and saw you were talking ****ing ****e. Again.

If I valued your opinion maybe that would bother me - but I don’t. You were simply as predictable as ever.

[jet]

**** brillo. WHy are you incapable of staying ontopic.

****why are you incapable of staying away from Brillo. You're worryingly obsessed.

[Withano]

****why are you incapable of staying away from Brillo. You're worryingly obsessed.

Its my thread :joker: and I go on many SD&N threads, as does she. I enjoy reading them. Theres no point reading them when shes on them though, cos it looks like we're about to have another ****ing convo about Brillo. Its ridiculous.