Morgan Freeman accused of harassment by 8 women

[Shaun]

:(

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/05/24/entertainment/morgan-freeman-accusations/index.html

A young production assistant thought she had landed the job of her dreams when, in the summer of 2015, she started work on "Going In Style," a bank heist comedy starring Morgan Freeman, Michael Caine and Alan Arkin.
But the job quickly devolved into several months of harassment, she told CNN. She alleges that Freeman subjected her to unwanted touching and comments about her figure and clothing on a near-daily basis. Freeman would rest his hand on her lower back or rub her lower back, she said.
In one incident, she said, Freeman "kept trying to lift up my skirt and asking if I was wearing underwear." He never successfully lifted her skirt, she said -- he would touch it and try to lift it, she would move away, and then he'd try again. Eventually, she said, "Alan [Arkin] made a comment telling him to stop. Morgan got freaked out and didn't know what to say."

Freeman's alleged inappropriate behavior was not limited to that one movie set, according to other sources who spoke to CNN. A woman who was a senior member of the production staff of the movie "Now You See Me" in 2012 told CNN that Freeman sexually harassed her and her female assistant on numerous occasions by making comments about their bodies.

"He did comment on our bodies... We knew that if he was coming by ... not to wear any top that would show our breasts, not to wear anything that would show our bottoms, meaning not wearing clothes that [were] fitted," she said.
At 80 years old, Freeman is one of Hollywood's biggest stars, with a movie career that spans nearly five decades. His starring roles in movies like "Driving Miss Daisy" and "Shawshank Redemption" in the late 1980s and early 1990s made him a household name. He won an Oscar for Best Supporting Actor for 2004's "Million Dollar Baby," and has earned four other Oscar nominations. His voiceover work has also become iconic, including his narration for the Academy Award-winning documentaries "The Long Way Home" and "March of the Penguins."

In all, 16 people spoke to CNN about Freeman as part of this investigation, eight of whom said they were victims of what some called harassment and others called inappropriate behavior by Freeman. Eight said they witnessed Freeman's alleged conduct. These 16 people together described a pattern of inappropriate behavior by Freeman on set, while promoting his movies and at his production company Revelations Entertainment.

Of those 16, seven people described an environment at Revelations Entertainment that included allegations of harassment or inappropriate behavior by Freeman there, with one incident allegedly witnessed by Lori McCreary, Freeman's co-founder in the enterprise, and another in which she was the target of demeaning comments by Freeman in a public setting. One of those seven people alleged that McCreary made a discriminatory remark regarding a female candidate for a job at the Producers Guild of America, where McCreary is co-president.

Four people who worked in production capacities on movie sets with Freeman over the last ten years described him as repeatedly behaving in ways that made women feel uncomfortable at work. Two, including the production assistant on "Going in Style" whose skirt he allegedly attempted to lift, said Freeman subjected them to unwanted touching. Three said he made public comments about women's clothing or bodies. But each of them said they didn't report Freeman's behavior, with most saying it was because they feared for their jobs. Instead, some of the women -- both on movie sets and at Revelations -- said, they came up with ways to combat the alleged harassment on their own, such as by changing the way they dressed when they knew he would be around.

CNN reached out to dozens more people who worked for or with Freeman. Some praised Freeman, saying they never witnessed any questionable behavior or that he was a consummate professional on set and in the office.
Several other times during this investigation, when a CNN reporter contacted a person who had worked with Freeman to try to ask them if they had seen or been subjected to inappropriate behavior by an actor they had worked with -- not initially even naming the actor they were asking about -- the person would immediately tell them they knew exactly who the reporter had in mind: Morgan Freeman. Some of those people were sources for this investigation while others declined to comment further or did not want what they said used in this story.

The pattern of behavior described by those who spoke with CNN shows another example of the systematic problems that exist in the entertainment industry. The allegations against Freeman are not about things that happened in private; they are about things that allegedly happened in public, in front of witnesses -- even in front of cameras. Before #MeToo, many men in the industry could behave without fear of consequences, because many times when a powerful man did so, it was the victim who suffered repercussions.
CNN reached out to Freeman's spokesperson for comment and then, at his request, emailed him a detailed list of the accusations against Freeman. The spokesperson did not respond to multiple follow-ups by email seeking comment on the accusations.

CNN also reached out to a spokesperson for McCreary, and then provided her with a detailed list of accusations regarding Freeman's alleged behavior at Revelations and details of the accusation against her as well as a number of questions for her regarding Freeman's alleged behavior at Revelations and the environment there. The spokesperson did not respond to multiple follow-ups by email seeking comment.

The allegations of inappropriate behavior by Freeman are not limited to the confines of his company or to movie sets. Three entertainment reporters who spoke to CNN said Freeman made inappropriate remarks to them during press junkets, which are publicity events for journalists who cover new films, typically attended by the movie's biggest stars.

One of the three, CNN entertainment reporter Chloe Melas, the co-author of this article, says she was subjected to inappropriate behavior by Freeman more than a year ago, when she interviewed him at a press junket for "Going in Style." According to Melas, who was six months pregnant at the time, Freeman, in a room full of people, including his co-stars Arkin and Caine, shook Melas' hand, not letting go while repeatedly looking her up and down and saying more than once a variation of, "I wish I was there." She says he also said to her, "You are ripe." Cameras were on and recording during one of Freeman's remarks to Melas -- "Boy, do I wish I was there" -- but not for the rest. As is common practice with such junkets, Melas was the only CNN employee there at the time.

Afterward, Melas reported what had happened to her supervisor, who instructed her to inform CNN human resources. According to Melas, she was told that CNN HR contacted their counterparts at human resources for Warner Bros., which produced and distributed the movie, and which like CNN is owned by Time Warner. Melas said she was also told that Warner Bros. HR could not corroborate the account because only one of Freeman's remarks was on video and the Warner Bros. employees present did not notice anything. Melas and her supervisor agreed that she would not cover the movie.

Asked for comment, a spokesperson for Warner Bros. confirmed that what Melas was told was accurate, but declined to comment further. A representative for Caine declined to comment. A representative for Arkin said he was not available for comment.

After the encounter with Freeman, Melas started making calls to see if other women had experienced anything similar, or whether this was an isolated incident. She soon learned that other women had similar stories -- and so she, and later her co-author, began this months-long reporting process.

Freeman and Lori McCreary founded Revelations Entertainment in 1996. Variety reported last year that Freeman started the company with McCreary because he was frustrated by the lack of choice roles for black actors and because he wanted to reveal the truth about serious issues -- a mission that inspired the name "Revelations."

The company's credits include a list of ambitious films about religion, apartheid, astronomy and stem cell research. Revelations also produced the film "Along Came a Spider" and the hit CBS show "Madam Secretary," both of which feature strong female leads.

But former staffers who spoke with CNN say that behind the façade of a progressive and artistic agenda the company's two founders created what one called a "toxic" work environment. Six former staffers said they witnessed Freeman's questionable behavior around women, which they said included sexual comments and one said included an incident of unsolicited touching. One female former staffer said she was the target of sexual comments by Freeman.

The female former employee at Revelations told CNN that Freeman was flanked by a group of men on the set of "Through the Wormhole" when she met the actor for the first time. He "looked me up and down," she said, and then asked her, "How do you feel about sexual harassment?"

"I was stunned," she told CNN. "This is the person that I worked for, this is his company, I didn't expect it at all ... I said timidly, 'I love it' in a sarcastic way hoping to make light of the situation because I was so confused and then he turned to the guys on the crew ... and said, 'See guys, this is how you do it.'"
One woman who was a manager at Revelations told CNN that sometimes Freeman would "come over to my desk to say hi and he'd just stand there and stare at me. He would stare at my breasts."

"If I ever passed him he would stare at me in an awkward way, would look me up and down sometimes stopping and just staring," she said. "One time he stopped, looked me up and down as I walked into a room of people, and everyone burst out laughing. And I literally froze feeling very uncomfortable and one of the people in the office said, 'Don't worry, that's just Morgan.'"

"That sort of interaction was when I stopped wearing a skirt around the office when he was there," said the former manager. "I can't say it was an accident that I'd be wearing a potato sack and a ponytail on certain days when he was there and do my best to avoid him when he was in the office."

Freeman was not in the office on a daily basis, the former employees said. But when he did show up, he behaved like a "creepy uncle," in the words of a male former employee. "One time I witnessed Morgan walk up to an intern and start massaging her" shoulder, he said. "The intern got visibly red and wiggled out of his grasp, it was awkward." The incident stood out to him because Freeman was using only one hand to touch the intern, as his other was injured in a 2008 car accident that was widely covered by the press. Another former employee told CNN she was present when the male former employee told several people about this incident shortly after it occurred.

CNN spoke to two male witnesses who each saw a separate occasion in which Freeman asked women to twirl. One instance occurred at the office, while another happened at an off-site company event.

Another incident stood out to people who spoke with CNN who witnessed it.
Two former staffers who were there, and a writer for the show "Madam Secretary" who also attended, each described the scene to CNN.

For his 79th birthday, Revelations threw Freeman a party in the office. According to the sources, roughly 30 people attended the party, some of whom were new to the company and had never met the actor. McCreary was among those in attendance, the sources said.

People at the party had to stand in a circle, a former executive at the company who attended the party told CNN, and tell Freeman who they were and what they did. Then, the former executive said, Freeman went up to women in the circle and would "stand maybe within an inch of their face and just look them up and down and not say anything, and then would move on to the next woman and he'd stand like within an inch of their face and look them up and down and not say anything, and it was really, really strange." The former executive added, "It was really weird and he did it to every woman but of course he didn't do it to any of the men. He didn't speak to any of the men."

The writer for "Madam Secretary" who was at the party said, "We saw Morgan go around to the girls in the circle and get really close to their faces, he didn't do it to the men. I don't know what he said but we all thought it was strange and couldn't wait to get the hell out of there. Absolutely there were sexual undertones to it." After the #MeToo movement began, the same writer said, writers on the show joked -- with that incident in mind -- "that Morgan would be the next person to be called out."

McCreary herself has also been the subject of demeaning comments by Freeman. In front of what was reportedly an audience of 400 people at 2016's Produced By conference, Freeman described what she was wearing during their first meeting, saying, "She had on a dress cut to here."

"She wants to be thought of as serious," said Freeman of McCreary, who was on the same panel. "But you can't get away from the short dresses."

Freeman stood by his comments when he appeared a few days later on the "Today" show and host Savannah Guthrie said some people were "surprised" by the remarks he made on the panel.

"It was just something I said in jest about when I first met her, it was more than 20 years ago," he said to Guthrie. "How is that news?"

The Hollywood Reporter reported at the time that McCreary "did not visibly react to the comment." One of the former Revelations executives told CNN that McCreary was visibly upset when she returned to the office.

"I tried to console her and she was clearly upset and I think she was surprised and found it hurtful and embarrassing," said the former executive. "She was devastated."

Five sources told CNN that there was no formal human resources department at Revelations at the time. There was a rotation of executives who served as the point of contact for HR issues, but former staffers said they did not feel comfortable talking to senior personnel about their workplace grievances. This prompted some staffers to form a "survivors club" where they gathered to vent about their experiences at Revelations, according to five sources who have been to the gatherings, which take place outside of the office.

Publicly, McCreary champions the #MeToo and Time's Up movements. Two days before January's Screen Actors Guild awards, at which Freeman accepted a Lifetime Achievement Award, McCreary released a statement on behalf of the Producers Guild of America (PGA), to say that its board ratified new anti-sexual harassment guidelines for its members. "The PGA is indebted to Time's Up as a resource in creating our protocols," she said in a press release issued with her co-president Gary Lucchesi, referring to the initiative aimed at fighting harassment and discrimination against women.

Yet the former Revelations employee who said Freeman asked her how she felt about sexual harassment also alleged that on a phone call with a member of PGA, McCreary said of a candidate vying for a position at PGA East, "she'll never be able to do a good job, she has a family."

Two former senior level Revelations employees said McCreary would openly mock women who had to leave work early for family commitments and school functions. McCreary also allegedly said that some employees couldn't handle big workloads because they had to "run home" to their families and therefore couldn't stay late at work, according to one of the sources. She openly advocated for work-life balance, that source said, but she would make "snide" remarks to those who left work early.

A spokesperson for the PGA said in a statement, "The Producers Guild of America is an Equal Opportunity Employer that does not question or consider marital or parental status in its hiring practices. As soon as CNN notified us about the allegation, we investigated the matter and have found that it has no merit. Lori McCreary is an outstanding PGA President. In all of her work with the Guild, she has been a consistent, vocal, and proactive advocate for women and all who are underrepresented in our community."

A spokesperson for McCreary did not respond to repeated follow-up requests for comment regarding the allegations against McCreary.

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One of the former male Revelations employees recounted to CNN what he called the "shocking" remarks that Freeman made while he was on set for a number of Freeman's movies. What he says he witnessed follows the pattern described by the women who said they were harassed by Freeman.

"[He'd say] things like 'I'd like to have an hour with her' or make vulgar and sexual comments about women," the former employee said. "He would be verbally inappropriate and it was just shocking. You're more shocked than anything because it's hard to have the wherewithal to say to him 'That's inappropriate.' You're just like 'whoa.' It's hard because on any set he is the most powerful person on it. It's weird because you just don't expect it from Morgan Freeman, someone who you respect."

The female production assistant (PA) mentioned at the beginning of this story who worked on "Going In Style" said she was in her early 20s when Freeman, then 78 years old, harassed her. She said the experience led to her decision to leave the movie industry.

"It was constant comments about the way I looked," she said, adding that Freeman often made the comments within earshot of others on the production staff. She said she frequently came home from work in tears.
The woman recalled a time when she went to the set wearing a dress with a t-shirt over it to cover her exposed back, but "Morgan said to me that I shouldn't be wearing the shirt over my dress."

Another female production assistant who witnessed this particular alleged incident told CNN that Freeman's behavior towards the younger female production staff was an unchecked and persistent issue during filming. Both women said the t-shirt incident took place in front of a group of people and that they heard at least one other woman publicly chastise Freeman for that particular comment. The behavior was discussed among the women he targeted, the female production assistant said.

A third woman who worked on a recent movie of Freeman's recalled an incident at the film's wrap party. "He was looking at my breasts, and I told him, 'My eyes are up here.' Then we went to take a group photo and he pressed himself up against me. It was inappropriate."

CNN spoke to one of the woman's colleagues on the film, who said that as soon as the photo was taken, the woman walked over and told a group of people what Freeman had done to her.

Another production assistant, who worked with Freeman on "The Dark Knight," told CNN that although she was never personally targeted by Freeman, she witnessed some inappropriate comments Freeman made to female members of the crew. She also said that female members of the crew would at times discuss how Freeman had made them feel uncomfortable.

"Morgan did things in a way that an older more established person can get away with because they have that power," she told CNN. "They can't be replaced, but you can be replaced very easily, that's just kind of the dynamic on set. PA's can be replaced, grips can be replaced, electricians can be replaced, but the actors -- once they're in, they're in. Had it been somebody else on the crew... I would feel comfortable reporting them because I wouldn't feel like my job would be in danger by reporting them, but if you report somebody like Morgan Freeman that the movie would lose a lot of money by replacing them or getting them in trouble, then you're the trouble maker and you'll get fired because you're just a PA."

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Freeman's alleged fixation on how women dressed was apparent when he hit the road to promote his films, as was his alleged pattern of looking women up and down while making sexually suggestive comments to them.

As the entertainment producer at Chicago's WGN-TV, Tyra Martin spent hours interviewing Freeman at various press junkets. Over the course of a decade, she said, she sat down with him at least nine times and grew accustomed to his comments about her appearance. But Martin made it clear in an interview with CNN that she was always "in on the joke." WGN produced videos featuring some of Freeman's remarks to Martin, describing it as him flirting with her. But Martin felt that one incident crossed a line.

"When I stood up, I pulled my skirt part of my dress down and he did say, 'Oh, don't pull it down now.'" Martin said. "That gave me pause but I never felt uncomfortable."

It is unclear whether video of that incident exists.

An entertainment reporter who is a member of the Hollywood Foreign Press Association said Freeman made comments about her skirt and her legs during two different junkets. Much like many of the women in this report and those who declined to go on the record, the reporter said Freeman's fame and power kept her from speaking out.

"I was just trying to do my job and I brushed it off," said the reporter, who did not want to be identified for this story because she's fearful of losing out on interviews with other celebrities.

"You don't want to put him on the spot because one, he's famous and two, it's on camera and three, you just want to do your job."

[Amy Jade]

Oh bloody hell

[Twosugars]

:facepalm:

[RileyH]

</3

[Barry.]

Aww not Morgan Freeman.

[Kazanne]

I 'm shocked ,I really rate him as an actor too, please not our Morgan.

[Shaun]

I didn't quite realise how long the text was but there's a video report in the link if that's preferable :laugh:

[arista]

I 'm shocked ,I really rate him as an actor too, please not our Morgan.


Yes sad news

[bots]

So many seem to be hiding in plain sight. I'm still waiting on anyone going to court for this so that they can be judged by the law

[kirklancaster]

A shock - a great shock. Morgan Freeman. :shrug: Who next?

[arista]

Morgan Freeman sorry after harassment allegations
https://news.sky.com/story/morgan-freeman-sorry-after-harassment-allegations-11384177

[Amy Jade]

Must be accurate if he's saying sorry?

[arista]

Must be accurate if he's saying sorry?



Yes its the numbers of the women,
Caught him out.

[kirklancaster]

Must be accurate if he's saying sorry?

I think so, but it could be that he is just trying to contain a 'Weinstein/Cosby shetstorm because he's frightened of it being a career-ender.

No doubt we will learn a lot more as the days pass.

[Crimson Dynamo]

hmmmmmmmmmmmm

[Mokka]

I think so, but it could be that he is just trying to contain a 'Weinstein/Cosby shetstorm because he's frightened of it being a career-ender.

No doubt we will learn a lot more as the days pass.

He's in his 80s.... is a career ender the issue? I think it's more about the ego and name he's built over the years at this point. It could all be swept away.

[user104658]

We live in a society.

[bots]

We live in a society.

indeed we do TS, possibly the first thing we have ever agreed on :laugh:

[kirklancaster]

He's in his 80s.... is a career ender the issue? I think it's more about the ego and name he's built over the years at this point. It could all be swept away.

He's still working but you are probably right, he may be wanting to protect his legacy and the admirable body of work he has built up, but it really does not matter to me Mokka, I was merely responding to A.J and theorising why he may have apologised.

[kirklancaster]

We live in a society.

Can you expound T.S because I do not really understand what you mean? It must be me because I see that BOTS does understand it.

[user104658]

Can you expound T.S because I do not really understand what you mean? It must be me because I see that BOTS does understand it.

We live in a society where sometimes there's a hell of a lot to say, and yet absolutely no point actually saying it.

[Tony Montana]

I’m sorry to hear if it’s true, But why didn’t anyone say anything at the time?

[Marsh.]

I’m sorry to hear if it’s true, But why didn’t anyone say anything at the time?

Why do you think?

[kirklancaster]

We live in a society where sometimes there's a hell of a lot to say, and yet absolutely no point actually saying it.

Got it. Thanks, TS.

[Strictly Jake]

Noooooo not Morgan freeman he seemed like the coolest guy ever who iou would love as a grandad.

[bots]

US film star Morgan Freeman has apologised following allegations of sexual misconduct made by eight women and several others.

One production assistant accused Freeman of harassing her for months during filming of bank robbery comedy Going in Style, CNN reported.

She said the 79-year-old touched her repeatedly, tried to lift her skirt and asked if she was wearing underwear.

Freeman apologised to "anyone who felt uncomfortable or disrespected".

"Anyone who knows me or has worked with me knows I am not someone who would intentionally offend or knowingly make anyone feel uneasy," he said in a statement.

Making women feel uncomfortable was "never my intent", he said.

He is the latest well-known Hollywood figure to be accused of sexual misconduct after allegations of sex attacks by producer Harvey Weinstein led to the development of the #MeToo campaign against sexual harassment.

The production assistant told CNN that during the harassment another actor, Alan Arkin, "made a comment telling him to stop. Morgan got freaked out and didn't know what to say".

Meanwhile a woman who worked on the 2013 film Now You See Me said staff knew "not to wear any top that would show our breasts, not to wear anything that would show our bottoms" or any close-fitting clothes if Freeman was around.

Morgan is also said to have stared at women's breasts and asked women to twirl for him.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-44247166

------

doesn't seem to me that he is admitting anything

[Tony Montana]

Why do you think?

Let me guess, because they were Terrified, traumatized and That nobody would believe them? Seems to me that’s the Excuse people use all the time. I’m sure it was a Difficult and Unforgettable Experience to Witness and I obviously can’t relate at all. However, Somebody should have at least had the Willpower to Confess straight after the Sexual Assualt. It could have Easily have Prevented Countless Women from Suffering the Same Fate.

[kirklancaster]

Let me guess, because they were Terrified, traumatized and That nobody would believe them? Seems to me that’s the Excuse people use all the time. I’m sure it was a Difficult and Unforgettable Experience to Witness and I obviously can’t relate at all. However, Somebody should have at least had the Willpower to Confess straight after the Sexual Assualt. It could have Easily have Prevented Countless Woman from Suffering the Same Fate.

:clap1::clap1::clap1: Great post, Scarface and very relevant points. In my opinion.

[Kazanne]

Let me guess, because they were Terrified, traumatized and That nobody would believe them? Seems to me that’s the Excuse people use all the time. I’m sure it was a Difficult and Unforgettable Experience to Witness and I obviously can’t relate at all. However, Somebody should have at least had the Willpower to Confess straight after the Sexual Assualt. It could have Easily have Prevented Countless Woman from Suffering the Same Fate.

Yes,I kind of agree with this ,terrified or not ,if someone does something that traumatises you,report asap,save other people from the same fate.

[Tony Montana]

:clap1::clap1::clap1: Great post, Scarface and very relevant points. In my opinion.

Thanks for that, Kirk.:love: it seems to me people don’t like to hear the Truth these days.

[Tony Montana]

Yes,I kind of agree with this ,terrified or not ,if someone does something that traumatises you,report asap,save other people from the same fate.

Thank you, Kazanne.

[GiRTh]

This is going to be fascinating. Just had one of the accusers on CNN and showed the incident with Freeman at a press conference with Michael Caine and Alan Arkin. So its not like he was hiding his behaviour and tip toeing around. At least two women are not accusing Freeman of touching or anything further than making sexually charged comments

[user104658]

Thanks for that, Kirk.:love: it seems to me people don’t like to hear the Truth these days.

Yes that's why they banned him.

[Tony Montana]

Yes that's why they banned him.

Who?

[user104658]

Who?

The Truth. They couldn't handle The Truth.

[Tony Montana]

The Truth. They couldn't handle The Truth.

Yeah, Thanks for that

[GiRTh]

It seems most are accusing Freeman of making comments and inappropriate behaviour. At what point do his comments become harassment? This is going to be a fascinating case if it gets to trial.

[GiRTh]

999718612993695744

The interview just on CNN with one of the accusers Chloe Melas

[Tony Montana]

A shock - a great shock. Morgan Freeman. :shrug: Who next?

I’m sure somebody will Accuse De Niro Next

[kirklancaster]

I’m sure somebody will Accuse De Niro Next

:laugh: Who dares to, Scarface?

He'd scare them to death:

"You accusin' me? You accusin' me? What's da ****ing matter with you, you deaf. I said are you deaf? You accusing me?"

.

[Tony Montana]

:laugh: Who dares to, Scarface?

He'd scare them to death:

"You accusin' me? You accusin' me? What's da ****ing matter with you, you deaf. I said are you deaf? You accusing me?"

.

:joker::joker: probably some ‘Poor Soul’ who would jump on the Bandwagon and Taste the 15 Minutes of fame they Crave.

[kirklancaster]

:joker::joker: probably some ‘Poor Soul’ who would jump on the Bandwagon and Taste the 15 Minutes of fame they Crave.

:laugh:

[Marsh.]

Let me guess, because they were Terrified, traumatized and That nobody would believe them? Seems to me that’s the Excuse people use all the time. I’m sure it was a Difficult and Unforgettable Experience to Witness and I obviously can’t relate at all. However, Somebody should have at least had the Willpower to Confess straight after the Sexual Assualt. It could have Easily have Prevented Countless Women from Suffering the Same Fate.

:clap1::clap1::clap1: Great post, Scarface and very relevant points. In my opinion.

Yes,I kind of agree with this ,terrified or not ,if someone does something that traumatises you,report asap,save other people from the same fate.

Yes, let's make the victims the ones at fault here. :clap1: WOOHOO!!!

Justice4MorganSkirtLifterMorgan!!! YASSS GUYS!!! :laugh: GOOD ONE!

[LaLaLand]

Not Morgan!? :(

[Tony Montana]

Yes, let's make the victims the ones at fault here. :clap1: WOOHOO!!!

Justice4MorganSkirtLifterMorgan!!! YASSS GUYS!!! :laugh: GOOD ONE!

Who the **** is Blaming the Victims Exactly? We just pointed out that they should have had the Courage to immediately report the Crimes and therefore Prevent Future Assaults.

[Marsh.]

Who the **** is Blaming the Victims Exactly? We just pointed out that they should have had the Courage to immediately report the Crimes and therefore Prevent Future Assaults.

"Should have had"? Says who?

You've spoken more about what the victim has done wrong and what they "should" be doing or should have done than what the scummy pervert should not have done, you know the one who is actually in the wrong.

But, hey, carry on.

[kirklancaster]

Yes, let's make the victims the ones at fault here. :clap1: WOOHOO!!!

Justice4MorganSkirtLifterMorgan!!! YASSS GUYS!!! :laugh: GOOD ONE!

How the hell do you educe that any of us who you have quoted and who you are berating are blaming the victims?

The point being made is that SOMEONE who he had actually touched SHOULD have formally reported him to the police and perhaps other subsequent victims could have been spared their ordeals.

Despite the fact that in law he is innocent until PROVEN guilty Scarface even makes the presumption of Morgan Freeman's GUILT by stating that: "Somebody should have at least had the Willpower to Confess straight after the Sexual Assualt. It could have Easily have Prevented Countless Woman from Suffering the Same Fate.

THAT is what Kaz and I were supporting.

So where were any of us blaming the victims?

Climb down off your high horse Marsh, I'm getting tired of being misrepresented.

[Marsh.]

How the hell do you educe that any of us who you have quoted and who you are berating are blaming the victims?

The point being made is that SOMEONE who he had actually touched SHOULD have formally reported him to the police and perhaps other subsequent victims could have been spared their ordeals.

Despite the fact that in law he is innocent until PROVEN guilty Scarface even makes the presumption of Morgan Freeman's GUILT by stating that: "Somebody should have at least had the Willpower to Confess straight after the Sexual Assualt. It could have Easily have Prevented Countless Woman from Suffering the Same Fate.

THAT is what Kaz and I were supporting.

So where were any of us blaming the victims?

Climb down off your high horse Marsh, I'm getting tired of being misrepresented.

Bleating about what they SHOULD have done is blaming them.

Dress it up all you want Kirk, it is what it is.

Misrepresented? Maybe watch the words you're using and agreeing with in future. You're blaming the victim in the case.

You know what would have 100% prevented any victims? People like Freeman not being predatory and manipulative arseholes? But, hey, this is about what his victims should have done.

As for his "innocence", he's apologised. You don't apologise for something you haven't done.

[GoldHeart]

I’m sure somebody will Accuse De Niro Next

I doubt it , De Niro is an arrogant untouchable fella that will probably never be accused of anything . But then again anything is possible .

I have to say though i didn't think they'd target Morgan Freeman , i always wonder who's next to be accused though but didn't see it being Morgan freeman who's in his 80's :notimpressed: . I call BS on the whole thing .

Why does it always take them so long to come forward to report these terrible "sexual harassment's" if it's so upsetting and traumatic why not say anything at the time , also i bet at the time Morgan was joking or being friendly and these women have spun the whole thing around with warped accusations .

As i've always said when it comes to these "sexual harassment" claims , what is sexual harassment ? because ever since weinstein it's now got to the stage where men can no longer compliment women , hug them or joke or have banter as it's now considered perverted & wrong.

Of course if these women were flirting with morgan or joking with him it's all ok of course ?? :bored: :suspect: .

[Tony Montana]

"Should have had"? Says who?

You've spoken more about what the victim has done wrong and what they "should" be doing or should have done than what the scummy pervert should not have done, you know the one who is actually in the wrong.

But, hey, carry on.

I'm well aware that the Scummy Pervert is fully in the wrong thank you very much. I was just Pointing out that the Victims had/ Have the Power to Prevent such Horrible and Traumatizing Experiences to Occur to some other Unfortunate Innocent Lives and Rather than doing the right thing and reporting it to the Police and the authorities, They decide to keep quiet , Knowing full well the Psycho is still out there Hunting their next Victim.

If i was the Victim of an Assault, Knowing full well how horrible it is and not wanting a repeat, I would do everything in my power to make sure the perpetrator is Brought to Justice and Behind Bars and i would not rest until i have Accomplished it.

[Marsh.]

I'm well aware that the Scummy Pervert is fully in the wrong thank you very much. I was just Pointing out that the Victims had/ Have the Power to Prevent such Horrible and Traumatizing Experiences to Occur to some other Unfortunate Innocent Lives and Rather than doing the right thing and reporting it to the Police and the authorities, They decide to keep quiet , Knowing full well the Psycho is still out there Hunting their next Victim.

If i was the Victim of an Assault, Knowing full well how horrible it is and not wanting a repeat, I would do everything in my power to make sure the perpetrator is Brought to Justice and Behind Bars and i would not rest until i have Accomplished it.

How lovely for you and your hypothetical scenario.

Meanwhile, people actually experiencing it in the real world know it's far more complicated than that.

[Marsh.]

I doubt it , De Niro is an arrogant untouchable fella that will probably never be accused of anything . But then again anything is possible .

I have to say though i didn't think they'd target Morgan Freeman , i always wonder who's next to be accused though but didn't see it being Morgan freeman who's in his 80's :notimpressed: . I call BS on the whole thing .

Why does it always take them so long to come forward to report these terrible "sexual harassment's" if it's so upsetting and traumatic why not say anything at the time , also i bet at the time Morgan was joking or being friendly and these women have spun the whole thing around with warped accusations .

As i've always said when it comes to these "sexual harassment" claims , what is sexual harassment ? because ever since weinstein it's now got to the stage where men can no longer compliment women , hug them or joke or have banter as it's now considered perverted & wrong.

Of course if these women were flirting with morgan or joking with him it's all ok of course ?? :bored: :suspect: .

Omg??? He's in his 80s????

Well that's ok then. Phew. I thought he was like... 40.

But he's 80+ so he's a saint. Haha.

[kirklancaster]

Bleating about what they SHOULD have done is blaming them.

Dress it up all you want Kirk, it is what it is.

Misrepresented? Maybe watch the words you're using and agreeing with in future. You're blaming the victim in the case.

That is YOUR skewed misinterpretation - READ Scarface's post and then mine and Kaz's responses.

Scarface made a relevant point and THAT point we agreed with.

It is no different to Jimmy The Bastard Saville's case where BBC Officials, Nurses and doctors, even Police Officers, KNEW what he had done and was still doing - in addition to certain MATURE victims - and if SOMEONE had found the courage to actually GO PUBLIC and accuse him way back then all the victims who followed might have been spared.

Even with Weinstein, the fact that some victims did not make complaints to the police through selfish reasons of fear of losing their careers meant that the bastard continued to traumatise later victims.

Ditto Bill Cosby.

That is MY opinion, and evidently, Scarface's and Kaz's and we are entitled to it for the most logical of reasons, so no one is dressing anything up.

[Marsh.]

That is YOUR skewed misinterpretation - READ Scarface's post and then mine and Kaz's responses.

Scarface made a relevant point and THAT point we agreed with.

It is no different to Jimmy The Bastard Saville's case where BBC Officials, Nurses and doctors, even Police Officers, KNEW what he had done and was still doing - in addition to certain MATURE victims - and if SOMEONE had found the courage to actually GO PUBLIC and accuse him way back then all the victims who followed might have been spared.

Even with Weinstein, the fact that some victims did not make complaints to the police through selfish reasons of fear of losing their careers meant that the bastard continued to traumatise later victims.

Ditto Bill Cosby.

That is MY opinion, and evidently, Scarface's and Kaz's and we are entitled to it for the most logical of reasons, so no one is dressing anything up.

I've read them. I know it's your opinion, no need for capitals.

You're blaming the victims and let's hope you learn from this moving forward.

People covering up a man's sick rape of children is absolutely no comparison to rape and assault victims not reporting their own attacks. Well done on attempting to demonise them more.

[kirklancaster]

I've read them. I know it's your opinion, no need for capitals.

You're blaming the victims and let's hope you learn from this moving forward.

People covering up a man's sick rape of children is absolutely no comparison to rape and assault victims not reporting their own attacks. Well done on attempting to demonise them more.

A debate I will have, a sober discussion I will have, but I am not into futility and flogging dead horses.

Goodnight.

[GoldHeart]

Omg??? He's in his 80s????

Well that's ok then. Phew. I thought he was like... 40.

But he's 80+ so he's a saint. Haha.


Hilarious i forgot to laugh :notimpressed: , the point i'm making is why is all this only coming out now ?? if he's been doing it for a while .

It's a sad world we live in , it use to be innocent until proven guilty but these days it's always 'GUILTY ARREST HIM ARREST HIM' :bored: .

[Marsh.]

A debate I will have, a sober discussion I will have, but I am not into futility and flogging dead horses.

Goodnight.

Saying you're not blaming victims and then blaming the victims is nonsensical Kirk.

Maybe you'll see that in the morning.

[Marsh.]

Hilarious i forgot to laugh :notimpressed: , the point i'm making is why is all this only coming out now ?? if he's been doing it for a while .

It's a sad world we live in , it use to be innocent until proven guilty but these days it's always 'GUILTY ARREST HIM ARREST HIM' :bored: .

2015 is hardly that long ago.

Why now? Because the current climate is supporting the victims of this kind of systematic abuse.

[GoldHeart]

Saying you're not blaming victims and then blaming the victims is nonsensical Kirk.

Maybe you'll see that in the morning.

But what about people who get falsely accused all the time?!:nono:

[Marsh.]

But what about people who get falsely accused all the time?!:nono:

So... he's innocent until proven guilty.... but you can say they're "falsely accused"?

Who's falsely accused all the time? Names? Proof?

You can't have it both ways.

In this specific case with Morgan Freeman, he's apologising. You don't apologise for things you didn't do.

[GoldHeart]

2015 is hardly that long ago.

Why now? Because the current climate is supporting the victims of this kind of systematic abuse.

Again why is it only just coming out now ? and it wasn't just 2015 apparently in 2013 on the set of now you see me he leered at women and told them to "twirl for him" seriously it all sounds ridiculous and it sounds like any little thing is being blown out of proportion :facepalm:.

We've gone from inappropriate touching to just looking at a woman? and both are considered "harassment" ? :rolleyes: Hmm i wonder if Michael Cain will be in trouble next .

[Marsh.]

Again why is it only just coming out now ?

I answered that.

[GoldHeart]

So... he's innocent until proven guilty.... but you can say they're "falsely accused"?

Who's falsely accused all the time? Names? Proof?

You can't have it both ways.

In this specific case with Morgan Freeman, he's apologising. You don't apologise for things you didn't do.

But what is he apologising for exactly though !??? it isn't as straight forward as that , he could be just apologising incase he's worried he made women feel uncomfortable . As like i said men are afraid to compliment or joke with women as they get accused of being a pervert etc .

Sometimes people just apologise in general even when they've done nothing wrong as they feel it shows respect .

[Marsh.]

But what is he apologising for exactly though !??? it isn't as straight forward as that , he could be just apologising incase he's worried he made women feel uncomfortable . As like i said men are afraid to compliment or joke with women as they get accused of being a pervert etc .

And making women feel uncomfortable isn't a bad thing?

Where has anyone been accused of being a pervert for giving a compliment?


Sometimes people just apologise in general even when they've done nothing wrong as they feel it shows respect .

He's publicly apologising for sexual assault even when he's done nothing wrong as he feels it shows respect?

Yeah, ok.

[GoldHeart]

And making women feel uncomfortable isn't a bad thing?

Where has anyone been accused of being a pervert for giving a compliment?



He's publicly apologising for sexual assault even when he's done nothing wrong as he feels it shows respect?

Yeah, ok.
Well as the whole thing unravels more maybe more light will be shed on it . It just doesn't sound right .

You love twisting people's words don't you ? , of course it's not ok to make people feel uncomfortable :nono: .

His apology sounds vague is all i'm saying , he hasn't actually mentioned the things he's accused of :conf: . Anyone can apologise for upsetting & making people feel uncomfortable and it's left for us to interpret it whichever way .

Also looking at someone and telling them to twirl is not on the same level of physically trying to pull someones skirt up .

when 1 person decides to come forward then all of a sudden these other ones come out the wood work exactly the same time . the whole thing is weird.

[Marsh.]

Well as the whole thing unravels more maybe more light will be shed on it . It just doesn't sound right .

You love twisting people's words don't you ? , of course it's not ok to make people feel uncomfortable :nono: .

His apology sounds vague is all i'm saying , he hasn't actually mentioned the things he's accused of :conf: . Anyone can apologise for upsetting & making people feel uncomfortable and it's left for us to interpret it whichever way .

Also looking at someone and telling them to twirl is not on the same level of physically trying to pull someones skirt up .

when 1 person decides to come forward then all of a sudden these other ones come out the wood work exactly the same time . the whole thing is weird.

Well, no, because wouldn't his first reaction be to deny any criminal wrongdoing?

Apologise if he's caused offence or made someone feel uncomfortable but also stress that he's not guilty of any harassment or assault. He isn't. That speaks volumes.

But your post highlights exactly why they're damned if they do and damned if they don't. They keep quiet, they're blamed for any future victims or for selfishly thinking of themselves, they come forward and they're automatically accused of jumping on bandwagons and gold digging. Either way, it's their fault.

[GoldHeart]

So... he's innocent until proven guilty.... but you can say they're "falsely accused"?

Who's falsely accused all the time? Names? Proof?

You can't have it both ways.

In this specific case with Morgan Freeman, he's apologising. You don't apologise for things you didn't do.

Michael Jackson was FALSELY accused by several kids & their parents
Cliff Richard was WRONGLY accused
Michael Le Vell (Kevin Webster)

And recently there was a guy on tv (he wasn't a celebrity) but he was wrongly accused of rape just because he wouldn't date some psycho woman that was obsessed with him ,so she destroyed his life by reporting him to the police and it took a few years for the police to finally realise she was lying and they finally investigated and found evidence to prove his innocence.

Turns out she was harassing him in text messages i think .

[Marsh.]

Michael Jackson was FALSELY accused by several kids & their parents
Cliff Richard was WRONGLY accused
Michael Le Vell (Kevin Webster)

And recently there was a guy on tv (he wasn't a celebrity) but he was wrongly accused of rape just because he wouldn't date some psycho woman that was obsessed with him ,so she destroyed his life by reporting him to the police and it took a few years for the police to finally realise she was lying and they finally investigated and found evidence to prove his innocence.

Turns out she was harassing him in text messages i think .

So, now anytime someone comes forward they're automatically lying?

You've provided 4 examples over a 20 year period out of how many?

[GoldHeart]

Well, no, because wouldn't his first reaction be to deny any criminal wrongdoing?

Apologise if he's caused offence or made someone feel uncomfortable but also stress that he's not guilty of any harassment or assault. He isn't. That speaks volumes.

But your post highlights exactly why they're damned if they do and damned if they don't. They keep quiet, they're blamed for any future victims or for selfishly thinking of themselves, they come forward and they're automatically accused of jumping on bandwagons and gold digging. Either way, it's their fault.

By that logic it makes no difference if they deny it aka these celebrities or whoever get's accused as people will always say they're GUILTY .

Bill Cosby denied it but obviously people still think he's guilty and he's going to jail , as there's too many women that have come forward .

[Marsh.]

By that logic it makes no difference if they deny it aka these celebrities or whoever get's accused as people will always say they're GUILTY .

Bill Cosby denied it but obviously people still think he's guilty and he's going to jail , as there's too many women that have come forward .

Eh? Nobody's said anyone is guilty unless they've been convicted.
Morgan Freeman is apologising for what he's been accused of so it isn't looking good.

You keep bringing Bill Cosby up, do you know something the courts don't? His trial has started, give them a call.

[GoldHeart]

So, now anytime someone comes forward they're automatically lying?

You've provided 4 examples over a 20 year period out of how many?

Listen Marsh

i'm not going to spend all night writing a list of the past 20 years of men being FALSELY accused :facepalm: , if you want more evidence then maybe google some more cases when you have time . Those were just a few at the top of my head of ones that stick in my head the most .

And lets not be silly , of course any serious accusation has to be investigated but just as long as ACTUAL JUSTICE happens and we find out the truth .

[Marsh.]

Listen Marsh

i'm not going to spend all night writing a list of the past 20 years of men being FALSELY accused :facepalm: , if you want more evidence then maybe google some more cases when you have time . Those were just a few at the top of my head of ones that stick in my head the most .

I wouldn't want you to because it's irrelevant.

I could also list dozens of convicted rapists and convicted assaults.

Listing people falsely accused in the past has **** all to do with Morgan Freeman. Also, you seem to confuse "not guilty" with "proven innocent" anyway. They're very different things.

[GoldHeart]

Eh? Nobody's said anyone is guilty unless they've been convicted.
Morgan Freeman is apologising for what he's been accused of so it isn't looking good.

You keep bringing Bill Cosby up, do you know something the courts don't? His trial has started, give them a call.

I'm pretty sure i mentioned him once but OKAY :rolleyes:. You totally misunderstood what i was saying, you used the example of "they're damned if they do and damned if they don't"

So i merely said what about the other way around when the accused denies it but people still think they did it regardless ? .

Courts have the final say but people will always have their doubts even if someone is acquitted as mud sticks .

[Marsh.]

I'm pretty sure i mentioned him once but OKAY :rolleyes:. You totally misunderstood what i was saying, you used the example of "they're damned if they do and damned if they don't"

You mentioned him twice.

And, yes, I did say that because in this thread victims have been painted in the wrong for both coming forward and for not.

[Ammi]

I'm well aware that the Scummy Pervert is fully in the wrong thank you very much. I was just Pointing out that the Victims had/ Have the Power to Prevent such Horrible and Traumatizing Experiences to Occur to some other Unfortunate Innocent Lives and Rather than doing the right thing and reporting it to the Police and the authorities, They decide to keep quiet , Knowing full well the Psycho is still out there Hunting their next Victim.

If i was the Victim of an Assault, Knowing full well how horrible it is and not wanting a repeat, I would do everything in my power to make sure the perpetrator is Brought to Justice and Behind Bars and i would not rest until i have Accomplished it.

...the thing is with ‘power’ though...by definition a victim doesn’t feel or have a sense of any power...the harasser or the abuser etc have removed that power as it were...and with things like this in the Hollywood scene with the #metoo movement...it’s only the movement atm that is giving the power I would say...the courage to speak out now...it’s interesting that Alan Arkin asked him to stop with one incident because Alan would have been more of ‘equal power’ I would say...but a production assistant who had her skirt lifted..at that time would have felt fairly powerless to speak out when it involved someone who was of power within Hollywood...she would have felt quite helpless...whereas now #metoo has given and is giving power to victims to find their voices...and obviously there are also victims with these type of accusations for instance who are only finding their power and their courage now because of their own Hollywood standing and also because of the movement...but at the time the harasser or the abuser etc was the one with the ‘power’ which would have made victims feel unable and powerless to speak out ....I don’t think in situations like this, people ‘decide’ to keep quiet as it were...I think it’s more that they feel powerless because their voice has no power over someone like Morgan Freeman’s ...maybe things were voiced and known within the Hollywood industry but it’s taken things like #metoo for public voices to find their strength and power....

[bots]

it's very simplistic to say that victims should have come forward. Woman are raped every day and don't report it with (to them) very valid reasons. Rather than demonizing them and making it even more difficult for people to come forward in the future, they should be respected and listened to. If there is a case for the perpetrators to answer, then get them in front of a judge. Do something about it rather than having a trial by media

[Crimson Dynamo]

and if he wasnt rich and famous...

nothing


pathetic

[Kazanne]

it's very simplistic to say that victims should have come forward. Woman are raped every day and don't report it with (to them) very valid reasons. Rather than demonizing them and making it even more difficult for people to come forward in the future, they should be respected and listened to. If there is a case for the perpetrators to answer, then get them in front of a judge. Do something about it rather than having a trial by media

I totally understand that,the thing that bothers me is even IF someone is found not guilty of such things their careers and reputations are ruined for life, I don't think people should be named unless they are found to be guilty as mud sticks.

[user104658]

Can we just take a second to point out here; no one has accused him of sexual assault. He's been accused of leering / being pervy / making comments / potentially abusing his position of power / occasional unwanted touching (but not groping).

Now while these things are not OK and there should be a definite drive to stamp them out... Can we please stop referring to them as "sexual assault" or making out that someone doing these things is a "sexual predator" rather than just, sadly, a dirty old man?

At the most basic; it's just damn offensive to the victims of actual sexual assault.

[arista]

Can we just take a second to point out here; no one has accused him of sexual assault. He's been accused of leering / being pervy / making comments / potentially abusing his position of power / occasional unwanted touching (but not groping).

Now while these things are not OK and there should be a definite drive to stamp them out... Can we please stop referring to them as "sexual assault" or making out that someone doing these things is a "sexual predator" rather than just, sadly, a dirty old man?

At the most basic; it's just damn offensive to the victims of actual sexual assault.


Yes all true TS.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Can we just take a second to point out here; no one has accused him of sexual assault. He's been accused of leering / being pervy / making comments / potentially abusing his position of power / occasional unwanted touching (but not groping).

Now while these things are not OK and there should be a definite drive to stamp them out... Can we please stop referring to them as "sexual assault" or making out that someone doing these things is a "sexual predator" rather than just, sadly, a dirty old man?

At the most basic; it's just damn offensive to the victims of actual sexual assault.

when Matt Damon suggested in an interview that there should be a spectrum involved rather than one or two words he was attacked

"I do believe there's a spectrum of behavior. … You know, there's a difference between, you know, patting someone on the butt and rape or child molestation, right? Both of those behaviors need to be confronted and eradicated without question, but they shouldn't be conflated."

[Kazanne]

Didn't one woman say he touched her inappropriately ? this is why the media isn't helpful sometimes, they put things in peoples heads that are probably unnecessary, people should only be named if and when they are found guilty imo.

[bots]

when Matt Damon suggested in an interview that there should be a spectrum involved rather than one or two words he was attacked

"I do believe there's a spectrum of behavior. … You know, there's a difference between, you know, patting someone on the butt and rape or child molestation, right? Both of those behaviors need to be confronted and eradicated without question, but they shouldn't be conflated."

yeah, the most infuriating thing is the trial by media with keyboard warriors defining who is guilty and what constitutes guilt. These cases should by processed promptly by authorities so that it can be determined quickly and concisely if there is a case to answer or not.

[kirklancaster]

Can we just take a second to point out here; no one has accused him of sexual assault. He's been accused of leering / being pervy / making comments / potentially abusing his position of power / occasional unwanted touching (but not groping).

Now while these things are not OK and there should be a definite drive to stamp them out... Can we please stop referring to them as "sexual assault" or making out that someone doing these things is a "sexual predator" rather than just, sadly, a dirty old man?

At the most basic; it's just damn offensive to the victims of actual sexual assault.

I totally agree with you T.S. but let's hope that your post is directed at Marsh who is the only member guilty on this thread of labelling Morgan Freeman in such a manner:

"He's publicly apologising for sexual assault"

"People like Freeman not being predatory"

In addition to terms such as 'Pervert' etc.

[Beso]

Dirty disgusting pervert..lock him up.

[Nicky91]

Dirty disgusting pervert..lock him up.

:nono:


for me he is a acting legend, sorry but i can't really believe this from him


:hmph:

[smudgie]

Can we just take a second to point out here; no one has accused him of sexual assault. He's been accused of leering / being pervy / making comments / potentially abusing his position of power / occasional unwanted touching (but not groping).

Now while these things are not OK and there should be a definite drive to stamp them out... Can we please stop referring to them as "sexual assault" or making out that someone doing these things is a "sexual predator" rather than just, sadly, a dirty old man?

At the most basic; it's just damn offensive to the victims of actual sexual assault.

Spot on.
He sounds like a right letch, but I think the phrase sexual assault is thrown about far too much these days.

[kirklancaster]

Bleating about what they SHOULD have done is blaming them.

Dress it up all you want Kirk, it is what it is.

Misrepresented? Maybe watch the words you're using and agreeing with in future. You're blaming the victim in the case.

You know what would have 100% prevented any victims? People like Freeman not being predatory and manipulative arseholes? But, hey, this is about what his victims should have done.

As for his "innocence", he's apologised. You don't apologise for something you haven't done.


I resent your use of the term 'bleating' to describe my rational and civil posts and responses to you because it, and its connotations are needlessly insulting and offensive. I am certainly no 'sheep' because if I were I would be agreeing with populist views such as yours.

I also do not need your advice for me to 'maybe watch the words' I am 'using', Marsh because - by instinct and through long writing practice - I choose my words carefully and say what I mean and mean what I say and I stand firmly behind every logical word which I have written on here about this matter.

In response to your comment: "As for his "innocence", he's apologised. You don't apologise for something you haven't done."

This is pure B.S.

It is crystal clear from reading his apology that he was NOT admitting guilt for perpetrating any of the offences which are now being alleged against him, but was - according to my interpretation of the reported apology - stating that his words and actions were misinterpreted and was apologising for causing distress to those who misinterpreted them as that was never his intention.

I do not KNOW the truth of this unsavoury, unfortunate matter no more than you do, and I am only referring to reportage in addition to speculating, but perhaps his apology had more to do with 'Damage Limitation' through some perception that now these allegations have surfaced and now that he has been named, that 'mud' does indeed 'stick' and that some of the media, some of his peers, and some of the Great American or World public will Charge him, Try him, Indict him, and Sentence him whether or not he is actually guilty.

As I write, reports are already coming in that highly lucrative contracts which Morgan Freeman had are being cancelled, so any fears he may have had as outlined above would seem justified.

Now - in my opinion, and regardless of the type of allegations being now made against him - for a man of his years, his standing, and his reputation - such penalties are wrong when he has not even been charged with any type of offence let alone been found guilty.

Incidentally, history is littered with cases where Celebrities and Politicians and less famous people have paid blackmailers - not for any crimes which these people have committed but merely to STIFLE false allegations being made by the blackmailers from being made public.

All over the world, there are also completely INNOCENT people sitting in jail cells - some on Death Row - despite excellent investigative journalists, detectives, and criminologists conclusively proving their innocence through campaigns and documentary series such as 'Rough Justice and 'The Thin Blue Line', 'After Innocence' and others so even a conviction in a court of law does not always mean conclusively that the convicted is actually guilty.

The above being so, it is wholly inexcusable and wrong for anyone on a Big Brother Forum to not only decry an uncharged man's innocence but also to berate any members who dare to disagree.

I my opinion.

[Marsh.]

I resent your use of the term 'bleating' to describe my rational and civil posts and responses to you because it, and its connotations are needlessly insulting and offensive. I am certainly no 'sheep' because if I were I would be agreeing with populist views such as yours.

I also do not need your advice for me to 'maybe watch the words' I am 'using', Marsh because - by instinct and through long writing practice - I choose my words carefully and say what I mean and mean what I say and I stand firmly behind every logical word which I have written on here about this matter.

In response to your comment: "As for his "innocence", he's apologised. You don't apologise for something you haven't done."

This is pure B.S.

It is crystal clear from reading his apology that he was NOT admitting guilt for perpetrating any of the offences which are now being alleged against him, but was - according to my interpretation of the reported apology - stating that his words and actions were misinterpreted and was apologising for causing distress to those who misinterpreted them as that was never his intention.

I do not KNOW the truth of this unsavoury, unfortunate matter no more than you do, and I am only referring to reportage in addition to speculating, but perhaps his apology had more to do with 'Damage Limitation' through some perception that now these allegations have surfaced and now that he has been named, that 'mud' does indeed 'stick' and that some of the media, some of his peers, and some of the Great American or World public will Charge him, Try him, Indict him, and Sentence him whether or not he is actually guilty.

As I write, reports are already coming in that highly lucrative contracts which Morgan Freeman had are being cancelled, so any fears he may have had as outlined above would seem justified.

Now - in my opinion, and regardless of the type of allegations being now made against him - for a man of his years, his standing, and his reputation - such penalties are wrong when he has not even been charged with any type of offence let alone been found guilty.

Incidentally, history is littered with cases where Celebrities and Politicians and less famous people have paid blackmailers - not for any crimes which these people have committed but merely to STIFLE false allegations being made by the blackmailers from being made public.

All over the world, there are also completely INNOCENT people sitting in jail cells - some on Death Row - despite excellent investigative journalists, detectives, and criminologists conclusively proving their innocence through campaigns and documentary series such as 'Rough Justice and 'The Thin Blue Line', 'After Innocence' and others so even a conviction in a court of law does not always mean conclusively that the convicted is actually guilty.

The above being so, it is wholly inexcusable and wrong for anyone on a Big Brother Forum to not only decry an uncharged man's innocence but also to berate any members who dare to disagree.

I my opinion.You write what you mean and mean what you write. It's your opinion. Yeah, I get that Kirk.

You're still shifting the blame and it's really rather sad in this day and age.

[Marsh.]

Can we just take a second to point out here; no one has accused him of sexual assault. He's been accused of leering / being pervy / making comments / potentially abusing his position of power / occasional unwanted touching (but not groping).

Now while these things are not OK and there should be a definite drive to stamp them out... Can we please stop referring to them as "sexual assault" or making out that someone doing these things is a "sexual predator" rather than just, sadly, a dirty old man?

At the most basic; it's just damn offensive to the victims of actual sexual assault.Well tbf I wasn't the one to bring Weinstein, Michael Jackson and Bill Cosby into the discussion. So the conversation has gotten a little muddled in discussing the victims in these types of cases.

[Marsh.]

I totally agree with you T.S. but let's hope that your post is directed at Marsh who is the only member guilty on this thread of labelling Morgan Freeman in such a manner:

"He's publicly apologising for sexual assault"

"People like Freeman not being predatory"

In addition to terms such as 'Pervert' etc.:joker: Bless you.

[Livia]

No one on here knows Morgan Freeman, nor the women accusing him. What's more, if there is a shred of evidence, none of us have access to it. And yet some people have already made up their mind. Makes me worry about trial by jury.

[Livia]

Well tbf I wasn't the one to bring Weinstein, Michael Jackson and Bill Cosby into the discussion. So the conversation has gotten a little muddled in discussing the victims in these types of cases.
... and of course, Michael Jackson was never convicted of anything.

[Marsh.]

Didn't one woman say he touched her inappropriately ? this is why the media isn't helpful sometimes, they put things in peoples heads that are probably unnecessary, people should only be named if and when they are found guilty imo.Yeah. Inappropriate touching repeatedly apparently. Which I would class as assault.

[Marsh.]

... and of course, Michael Jackson was never convicted of anything.I never said he was.

Hence why I said the conversation got muddled.

[Livia]

I never said he was.

Hence why I said the conversation got muddled.

Don't you take that tone with me Marshy, I'll come over there....

[Northern Monkey]

Disappointed in Morgan but i agree with Toy Soldier and Matt Damon.

[Marsh.]

Don't you take that tone with me Marshy, I'll come over there....:hmph:

[Beso]

Im assuming bb housemate bear would be found guilty on here if it were him.

[GoldHeart]

... and of course, Michael Jackson was never convicted of anything.

I brought up Michael Jackson as I was saying look how he was proved innocent ,yet some people still made child molestation jokes :bored: .

The parents & kids that accused Michael Jackson basically ruined his life and it took a toll on his health,poor guy was never the same after that ordeal.

From the beginning I never believed any of it ,they just wanted his money and because he didn't know how to deal with them he just willingly paid them off Hoping it would all go away .

So like I was trying to tell Marsh last night ,once it's been said that's it and people will always doubt the accused even if their name is cleared .

[Mystic Mock]

I totally understand that,the thing that bothers me is even IF someone is found not guilty of such things their careers and reputations are ruined for life, I don't think people should be named unless they are found to be guilty as mud sticks.

This.

[kirklancaster]

I brought up Michael Jackson as I was saying look how he was proved innocent ,yet some people still made child molestation jokes :bored: .

The parents & kids that accused Michael Jackson basically ruined his life and it took a toll on his health,poor guy was never the same after that ordeal.

From the beginning I never believed any of it ,they just wanted his money and because he didn't know how to deal with them he just willingly paid them off Hoping it would all go away .

So like I was trying to tell Marsh last night ,once it's been said that's it and people will always doubt the accused even if their name is cleared .


I agree with every word, GoldHeart. Great points, great post.

[Marsh.]

So like I was trying to tell Marsh last night ,once it's been said that's it and people will always doubt the accused even if their name is cleared .

You're muddying what we actually discussed now, which was the victims.

The victims are not to blame for their complaints or police reports being made public because the perpetrator is a celebrity. That's a separate point.

[Nicky91]

You're muddying what we actually discussed now, which was the victims.

The victims are not to blame for their complaints or police reports being made public because the perpetrator is a celebrity. That's a separate point.

i get your point, anyone could do this, not just celebrities


i think the women did overreact a bit, cause i can't see Morgan being a sexual perv, i think he might've been drunk at that time

[GoldHeart]

I resent your use of the term 'bleating' to describe my rational and civil posts and responses to you because it, and its connotations are needlessly insulting and offensive. I am certainly no 'sheep' because if I were I would be agreeing with populist views such as yours.

I also do not need your advice for me to 'maybe watch the words' I am 'using', Marsh because - by instinct and through long writing practice - I choose my words carefully and say what I mean and mean what I say and I stand firmly behind every logical word which I have written on here about this matter.

In response to your comment: "As for his "innocence", he's apologised. You don't apologise for something you haven't done."

This is pure B.S.

It is crystal clear from reading his apology that he was NOT admitting guilt for perpetrating any of the offences which are now being alleged against him, but was - according to my interpretation of the reported apology - stating that his words and actions were misinterpreted and was apologising for causing distress to those who misinterpreted them as that was never his intention.

I do not KNOW the truth of this unsavoury, unfortunate matter no more than you do, and I am only referring to reportage in addition to speculating, but perhaps his apology had more to do with 'Damage Limitation' through some perception that now these allegations have surfaced and now that he has been named, that 'mud' does indeed 'stick' and that some of the media, some of his peers, and some of the Great American or World public will Charge him, Try him, Indict him, and Sentence him whether or not he is actually guilty.

As I write, reports are already coming in that highly lucrative contracts which Morgan Freeman had are being cancelled, so any fears he may have had as outlined above would seem justified.

Now - in my opinion, and regardless of the type of allegations being now made against him - for a man of his years, his standing, and his reputation - such penalties are wrong when he has not even been charged with any type of offence let alone been found guilty.

Incidentally, history is littered with cases where Celebrities and Politicians and less famous people have paid blackmailers - not for any crimes which these people have committed but merely to STIFLE false allegations being made by the blackmailers from being made public.

All over the world, there are also completely INNOCENT people sitting in jail cells - some on Death Row - despite excellent investigative journalists, detectives, and criminologists conclusively proving their innocence through campaigns and documentary series such as 'Rough Justice and 'The Thin Blue Line', 'After Innocence' and others so even a conviction in a court of law does not always mean conclusively that the convicted is actually guilty.

The above being so, it is wholly inexcusable and wrong for anyone on a Big Brother Forum to not only decry an uncharged man's innocence but also to berate any members who dare to disagree.

I my opinion.

Thank you :clap1:

And let's not forget these are Allegations .

And in past scandals when celebrities have paid off "victims" , how come nobody questions why the victims accept the money from their abuser??.

I sure as hell wouldn't accept dirty money from someone who's supposedly hurt me .

[Marsh.]

i get your point, anyone could do this, not just celebrities


i think the women did overreact a bit, cause i can't see Morgan being a sexual perv, i think he might've been drunk at that time:suspect:


:umm2:

[Nicky91]

:suspect:


:umm2:

i just am a fan of Morgan, he was iconic in Invictus as Nelson Mandela for example and many other really lovely movies

[Niamh.]

Not Morgan too :(

[Marsh.]

i just am a fan of Morgan, he was iconic in Invictus as Nelson Mandela for example and many other really lovely moviesAnd that's the most important thing, Nicky.

[AnnieK]

Trial by media again - this is not helpful to anyone.
People will blame victims and claim they are gold digging OR
People will believe the allegations as gospel even if they prove to be untrue.

Cases like this should be resolved before being released into the media - that is what muddies the waters.

[Kazanne]

Trial by media again - this is not helpful to anyone.
People will blame victims and claim they are gold digging OR
People will believe the allegations as gospel even if they prove to be untrue.

Cases like this should be resolved before being released into the media - that is what muddies the waters.

That is exactly how I feel about it Annie,the media has the power to ruin peoples lives we have seen it time and time again,and things as serious as this need to be dealt with before the media can spread its venom.

[user104658]

Yeah. Inappropriate touching repeatedly apparently. Which I would class as assault.

Inappropriate touching generally means things like a hand on a leg or, I believe, in this case a lower back was mentioned. It's not OK and it should be stamped out, especially where a power discrepancy exists... but it's not sexual assault... it's inappropriate touching. I have no problem with people who have - for example - had an arm put around them or a hand put on their lower back saying not to do it, that they don't like it, that it isn't OK. Respect of personal space is important. But I do have a really major problem with people who have had things like this happen, saying that they were "sexually assaulted", because it lessens the crime and makes it much harder for people who have actually been sexually assaulted - i.e. have been groped, pinned, or worse - to be taken seriously. When someone comes forward and says "I was sexually assaulted" it should be clear that a serious sexual crime has been committed. If you have to ask the question "Well, did he jam his hand down your pants, or did he put his hand on your lower back" then the waters become seriously muddied.

Again that's not to say that people shouldn't speak up and complain about being made to feel uncomfortable, because if anything, all of this MUST have made a huge difference for future generations in places like Hollywood. This behaviour basically hinges on people essentially believing that they "have unquestionable influence" and are "untouchable". I can't imagine that anyone in Hollywood feels untouchable any more, or ever will again... behaving inappropriately in any way has become "a major risk"... as it should be.

But still. Things have to be kept realistic. There has to be a difference between "I felt very uncomfortable" and "I was murdered in my soul and will be traumatised forever!!"

Encouraging people to be as dramatic as possible seems to be the trend these days and I have no idea why. It doesn't help anyone. Not the victim themselves, not other victims, and not future potential victims.

[kirklancaster]

Inappropriate touching generally means things like a hand on a leg or, I believe, in this case a lower back was mentioned. It's not OK and it should be stamped out, especially where a power discrepancy exists... but it's not sexual assault... it's inappropriate touching. I have no problem with people who have - for example - had an arm put around them or a hand put on their lower back saying not to do it, that they don't like it, that it isn't OK. Respect of personal space is important. But I do have a really major problem with people who have had things like this happen, saying that they were "sexually assaulted", because it lessens the crime and makes it much harder for people who have actually been sexually assaulted - i.e. have been groped, pinned, or worse - to be taken seriously. When someone comes forward and says "I was sexually assaulted" it should be clear that a serious sexual crime has been committed. If you have to ask the question "Well, did he jam his hand down your pants, or did he put his hand on your lower back" then the waters become seriously muddied.

Again that's not to say that people shouldn't speak up and complain about being made to feel uncomfortable, because if anything, all of this MUST have made a huge difference for future generations in places like Hollywood. This behaviour basically hinges on people essentially believing that they "have unquestionable influence" and are "untouchable". I can't imagine that anyone in Hollywood feels untouchable any more, or ever will again... behaving inappropriately in any way has become "a major risk"... as it should be.

But still. Things have to be kept realistic. There has to be a difference between "I felt very uncomfortable" and "I was murdered in my soul and will be traumatised forever!!"

Encouraging people to be as dramatic as possible seems to be the trend these days and I have no idea why. It doesn't help anyone. Not the victim themselves, not other victims, and not future potential victims.

:worship: Simply superbly put.

[Niamh.]

Yes good points TS

[Shaun]

People seem to be conflating 'sexual assault' or 'assault' with 'harassment' in here and I think it's dangerous to just put all of them under the same bracket when they're very different crimes with very different perpetrators.

I'm not even 100% sure the claims of harassment made by these women are even technically illegal, they're just something you can be fired and sued for? Like I don't see the room for Freeman to be arrested for this, even if the claims are true.

[arista]

Yes
TS its not like he raped any Lady,
a 80 year old dirty thoughts actor.

Nothing strange, really
Its good he was fast to say sorry.

[arista]

People seem to be conflating 'sexual assault' or 'assault' with 'harassment' in here and I think it's dangerous to just put all of them under the same bracket when they're very different crimes with very different perpetrators.

I'm not even 100% sure the claims of harassment made by these women are even technically illegal, they're just something you can be fired and sued for? Like I don't see the room for Freeman to be arrested for this, even if the claims are true.


Bang On Right Shaun

[kirklancaster]

People seem to be conflating 'sexual assault' or 'assault' with 'harassment' in here and I think it's dangerous to just put all of them under the same bracket when they're very different crimes with very different perpetrators.

I'm not even 100% sure the claims of harassment made by these women are even technically illegal, they're just something you can be fired and sued for? Like I don't see the room for Freeman to be arrested for this, even if the claims are true.

:clap1::clap1::clap1:Well said, Shaun. Great and relevant points.

[GoldHeart]

People seem to be conflating 'sexual assault' or 'assault' with 'harassment' in here and I think it's dangerous to just put all of them under the same bracket when they're very different crimes with very different perpetrators.

I'm not even 100% sure the claims of harassment made by these women are even technically illegal, they're just something you can be fired and sued for? Like I don't see the room for Freeman to be arrested for this, even if the claims are true.

That's why I hate the term "sexual harassment" as it can mean anything from a flirty joke / comment to a hand on someone's shoulder :facepalm: .

It dilutes actual serious harassment & real rape .
It's got the stage where if a guy innocently places his hand on a woman's arm either to say hello or get their attention when talking ,the woman can turn around and say she was "sexually assaulted" it's ridiculous ! .

[Marsh.]

Inappropriate touching generally means things like a hand on a leg or, I believe, in this case a lower back was mentioned. It's not OK and it should be stamped out, especially where a power discrepancy exists... but it's not sexual assault... it's inappropriate touching. I have no problem with people who have - for example - had an arm put around them or a hand put on their lower back saying not to do it, that they don't like it, that it isn't OK. Respect of personal space is important. But I do have a really major problem with people who have had things like this happen, saying that they were "sexually assaulted", because it lessens the crime and makes it much harder for people who have actually been sexually assaulted - i.e. have been groped, pinned, or worse - to be taken seriously. When someone comes forward and says "I was sexually assaulted" it should be clear that a serious sexual crime has been committed. If you have to ask the question "Well, did he jam his hand down your pants, or did he put his hand on your lower back" then the waters become seriously muddied.

Again that's not to say that people shouldn't speak up and complain about being made to feel uncomfortable, because if anything, all of this MUST have made a huge difference for future generations in places like Hollywood. This behaviour basically hinges on people essentially believing that they "have unquestionable influence" and are "untouchable". I can't imagine that anyone in Hollywood feels untouchable any more, or ever will again... behaving inappropriately in any way has become "a major risk"... as it should be.

But still. Things have to be kept realistic. There has to be a difference between "I felt very uncomfortable" and "I was murdered in my soul and will be traumatised forever!!"

Encouraging people to be as dramatic as possible seems to be the trend these days and I have no idea why. It doesn't help anyone. Not the victim themselves, not other victims, and not future potential victims.Well I was speaking generally tbh. It was quite late when I responded to those posts so things got muddled when Weinstein, Jacko and Cosby were thrown into the mix and we were talking generally about victim blaming.

[Northern Monkey]

That's why I hate the term "sexual harassment" as it can mean anything from a flirty joke / comment to a hand on someone's shoulder :facepalm: .

It dilutes actual serious harassment & real rape .
It's got the stage where if a guy innocently places his hand on a woman's arm either to say hello or get their attention when talking ,the woman can turn around and say she was "sexually assaulted" it's ridiculous ! .

That’s true and women are tactile and make flirty/mucky jokes all the time and rub their butt on you etc.

[Marsh.]

That's why I hate the term "sexual harassment" as it can mean anything from a flirty joke / comment to a hand on someone's shoulder :facepalm: .

It dilutes actual serious harassment & real rape .
It's got the stage where if a guy innocently places his hand on a woman's arm either to say hello or get their attention when talking ,the woman can turn around and say she was "sexually assaulted" it's ridiculous ! .

That's why there's a distinction between harassment and assault. They're both very specific things.

If someone's constantly being pestered with inappropriate comments that is harassment, whether they want to claim it's a joke or not.

As for your comment that any woman who has her arm touched can scream she was sexually assaulted... name me one incident of this happening?

[Marsh.]

That’s true and women are tactile and make flirty/mucky jokes all the time and rub their butt on you etc.Who are these women rubbing their butts on you all the time? :umm2:

[GoldHeart]

That’s true and women are tactile and make flirty/mucky jokes all the time and rub their butt on you etc.

As we know there's a lot of double standards , I bet there's women that joked had banter with Morgan Freeman and I bet they were tactile back . I know in general women can be just as rude when it comes to flirting and touching .

[Northern Monkey]

Who are these women rubbing their butts on you all the time? :umm2:

I’ve worked with women who fancied me and used to push themself on me with their ass and stand next to me and hip barge me in a playful manner.Not to mention touching me all the time and putting hands in my pocket etc.
I didn’t take to Twitter to complain.Maybe i should’ve?

[GoldHeart]

I’ve worked with women who fancied me and used to push themself on me with their ass and stand next to me and hip barge me in a playful manner.Not to mention touching me all the time and putting hands in my pocket etc.
I didn’t take to Twitter to complain.Maybe i should’ve?

I doubt many would take you seriously unfortunately , they'd probably tell you to "man up " and they'd laugh and tell you how you should enjoy being chased or some nonsense .

[Northern Monkey]

I doubt many would take you seriously unfortunately , they'd probably tell you to "man up " and they'd laugh and tell you how you should enjoy being chased or some nonsense .

Well I wasn’t complaining.I was young free and single.One of them was U.G.L.Y and she dint have no alibi though.It was all ok if i closed my eyes and thought of fitties.

[GoldHeart]

Well I wasn’t complaining.I was young free and single.One of them was U.G.L.Y and she dint have no alibi though.It was all ok if i closed my eyes and thought of fitties.

Doesn't make it okay though, unless you have that rapport and you're flirting back then they had no right to be touching you like that .

[Marsh.]

I’ve worked with women who fancied me and used to push themself on me with their ass and stand next to me and hip barge me in a playful manner.Not to mention touching me all the time and putting hands in my pocket etc.
I didn’t take to Twitter to complain.Maybe i should’ve?What's Twitter got to do with it?

Maybe you should've filed a harassment complaint against them to prevent them doing it to others?

[Marsh.]

I doubt many would take you seriously unfortunately , they'd probably tell you to "man up " and they'd laugh and tell you how you should enjoy being chased or some nonsense .And 99% of the time that attitude would be coming from fellow blokes.

[Marsh.]

As we know there's a lot of double standards , I bet there's women that joked had banter with Morgan Freeman and I bet they were tactile back . I know in general women can be just as rude when it comes to flirting and touching .But that doesn't mean these women filing complaints were doing anything in return or to invite Morgan's advances.

Anymore than Morgan's behaviour is a reflection on any man but himself.

[GoldHeart]

What's Twitter got to do with it?

Maybe you should've filed a harassment complaint against them to prevent them doing it to others?

Oh yeah because they really would of taken him seriously​? :rolleyes: .
Men experience all kinds of inappropriate touching & harassment but they either brush it off or they know nothing will come of them reporting it .

[Marsh.]

Oh yeah because they really would of taken him seriously​? :rolleyes: .
Men experience all kinds of inappropriate touching & harassment but they either brush it off or they know nothing will come of them reporting it .

How do you know?

Are you familiar with his HR department?

Do you have examples of a man reporting it and nothing being done?

Your tune has changed from last night though when you were joining in chastising these women for not coming forward sooner. Now you're saying why should victims bother? :shrug:

[GoldHeart]

And 99% of the time that attitude would be coming from fellow blokes.

And your point is ?? , If anything it makes it worse when men don't support other men :nono:

[Amy Jade]

Why is this turning into a men v women who gets it worse debate?

Anyone who puts their hands on someone in an inappropriate manner are in the wrong. Gender is irrelevant.

[Amy Jade]

Wait is GoldHeart the truth?

[GoldHeart]

Why is this turning into a men v women who gets it worse debate?

Anyone who puts their hands on someone in an inappropriate manner are in the wrong. Gender is irrelevant.

I agree
But not everyone sees it like that I'm afraid

[GoldHeart]

Wait is GoldHeart the truth?

Excuse me ?

[Cherie]

Wait is GoldHeart the truth?

No :laugh:

[GoldHeart]

No :laugh:

I'm literally giving my opinions like others on here :hee:. We're not all going to agree :idc: .

[GiRTh]

Wait is GoldHeart the truth?:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

[kirklancaster]

Wait is GoldHeart the truth?

:laugh2: I ****ing love you A.J.

But No, GoldHeart isn't. :laugh:

[GoldHeart]

:laugh2: I ****ing love you A.J.

But No, GoldHeart isn't. :laugh:
We all have our opinions , no idea why mine are striking such a chord :joker:

[Amy Jade]

We all have our opinions , no idea why mine are striking such a chord :joker:

Meant no harm your comments just reminded me of another poster. Definately value your opinion I wasn't being a cow

[kirklancaster]

We all have our opinions , no idea why mine are striking such a chord :joker:

No, that's not it, GoldHeart. ''The Truth was a very controversial member on here and some loved him others didn't. He was very outspoken and set in his views.

Amy Jade really did think that you were him in another Username.

It wasn't any kind of slur, Goldheart. :wavey:

[GoldHeart]

No, that's not it, GoldHeart. ''The Truth was a very controversial member on here and some loved him others didn't. He was very outspoken and set in his views.

Amy Jade really did think that you were him in another Username.

It wasn't any kind of slur, Goldheart. :wavey:

:shocked::facepalm: for goodness sake , well I'm most definitely not "the truth" and I wouldn't be posing under a different alias , how strange :joker:

[GoldHeart]

Meant no harm your comments just reminded me of another poster. Definately value your opinion I wasn't being a cow

Hmm ... Okay well I'm Goldheart you sound paranoid :rolleyes:

[Marsh.]

And your point is ?? , If anything it makes it worse when men don't support other men :nono:My point is what I said.

[Marsh.]

Wait is GoldHeart the truth?:think:

[kirklancaster]

Hmm ... Okay well I'm Goldheart you sound paranoid :rolleyes:

:laugh: She's not though. She is one of the nicest members on here.

[GoldHeart]

:laugh: She's not though. She is one of the nicest members on here.

Well I've no idea where that assumption came from. I've seen plenty of people who write similar to other people but I don't suspect them of using a different alias but maybe they are for all I know.
But I only have 1 username ,no idea how many usernames other people have on here :shrug::joker:.

[GoldHeart]

:think:

Yeah I must be someone else as Im not allowed to have a different opinion la la la :sleep: :whistle: .

[Marsh.]

Yeah I must be someone else as Im not allowed to have a different opinion la la la :sleep: :whistle: .

You got all of that from an emoji? Oh dear.

[Kazanne]

Well I've no idea where that assumption came from. I've seen plenty of people who write similar to other people but I don't suspect them of using a different alias but maybe they are for all I know.
But I only have 1 username ,no idea how many usernames other people have on here :shrug::joker:.

You are doing fine Goldheart, you make some good points,I have never thought of you as anything other than a decent poster.:wavey:

[GoldHeart]

You are doing fine Goldheart, you make some good points,I have never thought of you as anything other than a decent poster.:wavey:

Thankyou Kazanne that's kind :)

[Beso]

The truth would definitely have been found guilty in here.

[kirklancaster]

The truth would definitely have been found guilty in here.

:joker: That is one CERT we could put our money on. :laugh:

[Crimson Dynamo]

You are doing fine Goldheart, you make some good points,I have never thought of you as anything other than a decent poster.:wavey:

+1

[AnnieK]

Lol...Goldheart cant be The Truth, I have seen no 6 paragraph post about millions of aborted babies, men losing their houses, the rate of male suicide and women being gold digging horrors :laugh:

[kirklancaster]

Lol...Goldheart cant be The Truth, I have seen no 6 paragraph post about millions of aborted babies, men losing their houses, the rate of male suicide and women being gold digging horrors :laugh:

:joker: I miss him. :laugh:

[Crimson Dynamo]

apart from his pathological hatred of women he did once help an old women at Christmas by not charging her through the nose for a taxi ride on Christmas day

Selfless King of Generosity

[kirklancaster]

apart from his pathological hatred of women he did once help an old women at Christmas by not charging her through the nose for a taxi ride on Christmas day

Selfless King of Generosity

:joker: I meant that I miss the CHAOTIC controversy he caused. :laugh:

[Northern Monkey]

Yeah I must be someone else as Im not allowed to have a different opinion la la la :sleep: :whistle: .

:laugh:

Your posts are actually nothing like the Truths.
He would attack head on saying things like ‘No,Disingenuous nonsense,You’re lying’

I disagreed with alot of what he said but he was hilarious and a huge part of this place.
He was very anti feminist and appeared to be pretty anti anything feminine too.

You just keep giving your opinions.You’re cool.

[Niamh.]

apart from his pathological hatred of women he did once help an old women at Christmas by not charging her through the nose for a taxi ride on Christmas day

Selfless King of Generosity🤣🤣

[Twosugars]

Well I've no idea where that assumption came from. I've seen plenty of people who write similar to other people but I don't suspect them of using a different alias but maybe they are for all I know.
But I only have 1 username ,no idea how many usernames other people have on here :shrug::joker:.

Welcome to the club! Stay strong sis! :laugh:

Leave ha alone :fist:

[Brillopad]

Wait is GoldHeart the truth?

Not the wisest thing to say on here as we all know there are those both quick and keen to ‘suggest’ someone is someone else. Best not to feed them.

[user104658]

apart from his pathological hatred of women he did once help an old women at Christmas by not charging her through the nose for a taxi ride on Christmas day

Selfless King of Generosity"I gave her a 10% discount so it was only £40 instead of £44!"

[Crimson Dynamo]

:joker:

[GoldHeart]

Welcome to the club! Stay strong sis! :laugh:

Leave ha alone :fist:

:joker: thanks
:thumbs:

[GoldHeart]

:laugh:

Your posts are actually nothing like the Truths.
He would attack head on saying things like ‘No,Disingenuous nonsense,You’re lying’

I disagreed with alot of what he said but he was hilarious and a huge part of this place.
He was very anti feminist and appeared to be pretty anti anything feminine too.

You just keep giving your opinions.You’re cool.

I'm trying to think if I've ever seen his posts :conf: he sounds like an old member that must of left the forum then ? , but there's so many different posters on here with different opinions .

[kirklancaster]

:joker: thanks
:thumbs:

:shrug: Twosugars is either being ungenuine GoldHeart or he is being Quixotic and seeing giants in the sails of a windmill where there are none because NO ONE is getting on to you - we ALL love and value you as a member.

ALL this chat and laughter is about Amy Jade genuinely thinking that you might be The Truth and about The Truth himself and his posts.

There was NO need for anyone to say 'Leave Ha alone' :conf:

[Beso]

:shrug: Twosugars is either being ungenuine GoldHeart or he is being Quixotic and seeing giants in the sails of a windmill where there are none because NO ONE is getting on to you - we ALL love and value you as a member.

ALL this chat and laughter is about Amy Jade genuinely thinking that you might be The Truth and about The Truth himself and his posts.

There was NO need for anyone to say 'Leave Ha alone' :conf:

Im sure two sugars will admit he was being jokingly dramatic..

[Beso]

But i understand your sentiments kirky.

[GoldHeart]

:shrug: Twosugars is either being ungenuine GoldHeart or he is being Quixotic and seeing giants in the sails of a windmill where there are none because NO ONE is getting on to you - we ALL love and value you as a member.

ALL this chat and laughter is about Amy Jade genuinely thinking that you might be The Truth and about The Truth himself and his posts.

There was NO need for anyone to say 'Leave Ha alone' :conf:

It's okay :)
Don't worry about it . You all know I'm not "the truth" so it's fine .

[Twosugars]

Im sure two sugars will admit he was being jokingly dramatic..

http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=487&pictureid=3613


:shrug: Twosugars is either being ungenuine GoldHeart or he is being Quixotic and seeing giants in the sails of a windmill where there are none because NO ONE is getting on to you - we ALL love and value you as a member.

ALL this chat and laughter is about Amy Jade genuinely thinking that you might be The Truth and about The Truth himself and his posts.

There was NO need for anyone to say 'Leave Ha alone' :conf:

it was said in jest, though I admit I'm somewhat allergic to the subject...

http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=487&pictureid=3610 let's hug it out, Kirk

[kirklancaster]

http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=487&pictureid=3613




it was said in jest, though I admit I'm somewhat allergic to the subject...

http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=487&pictureid=3610 let's hug it out, Kirk

:hug::kiss: No prob TS2 I was just puzzled.

[user104658]

https://i2.wp.com/i1359.photobucket.com/albums/q798/djdavis516/florida-man-iron-man-robert-downey-jr-1a_zpsf0641117.gif

[GiRTh]

AiEzDHZxDT4

[Vicky.]

Inappropriate touching generally means things like a hand on a leg or, I believe, in this case a lower back was mentioned. It's not OK and it should be stamped out, especially where a power discrepancy exists... but it's not sexual assault... it's inappropriate touching. I have no problem with people who have - for example - had an arm put around them or a hand put on their lower back saying not to do it, that they don't like it, that it isn't OK. Respect of personal space is important. But I do have a really major problem with people who have had things like this happen, saying that they were "sexually assaulted", because it lessens the crime and makes it much harder for people who have actually been sexually assaulted - i.e. have been groped, pinned, or worse - to be taken seriously. When someone comes forward and says "I was sexually assaulted" it should be clear that a serious sexual crime has been committed. If you have to ask the question "Well, did he jam his hand down your pants, or did he put his hand on your lower back" then the waters become seriously muddied.

Again that's not to say that people shouldn't speak up and complain about being made to feel uncomfortable, because if anything, all of this MUST have made a huge difference for future generations in places like Hollywood. This behaviour basically hinges on people essentially believing that they "have unquestionable influence" and are "untouchable". I can't imagine that anyone in Hollywood feels untouchable any more, or ever will again... behaving inappropriately in any way has become "a major risk"... as it should be.

But still. Things have to be kept realistic. There has to be a difference between "I felt very uncomfortable" and "I was murdered in my soul and will be traumatised forever!!"

Encouraging people to be as dramatic as possible seems to be the trend these days and I have no idea why. It doesn't help anyone. Not the victim themselves, not other victims, and not future potential victims.

Fantastic post.

I also agree with many of marshs points on this thread and find it depressing as **** when people find a way to blame the victims no matter what. Its not their fault that he did this to other people. Saying so removes the blame from him.

I am shocked with Freeman though, but I think thats because I expect celebs to be kind of similar to the characters they portray, plus I always view Freeman as 'God'.

[Vicky.]

Also can we just not be accusing random people of being other random people. If you have a genuine reason to think it, PM admin and they will do whatever checks they can. But publicly accusing people just ends badly.

[user104658]

Also can we just not be accusing random people of being other random people. If you have a genuine reason to think it, PM admin and they will do whatever checks they can. But publicly accusing people just ends badly.

Sure thing Niamh. :suspect: