Should parents of school bullies face criminal charges?

[Matthew.]

They’re talking about it on Loose Women just now, but what do you think?

Vote in the poll ⬆️

I don’t think so.

[Niamh.]

Of course not, what a ridiculous idea.

[Denver]

Yes bad parenting leads to kids being bullies

[Nicky91]

no, of course not

[user104658]

No, because the idea that parents have FULL control over their children's behaviour at ALL times is a complete, and dangerous, illusion. Just because they're kids doesn't mean they're not individuals with free will.

A kid being a (serious) bully can often be an indication of troubles at home. I would add to that that "serious" is important here; the uncomfortable truth is that almost all children will engage in mild non-physical bullying at some point. It is also not ALWAYS an indication that anything is wrong at home.

A kid who is a known bully continuing to bully does not always mean that the parents are unaware or aren't actively trying to do something about it. There's no surefire way to get it to stop. Parents and schools can be doing their best, working together, and still have a child with troublesome behaviour. Frankly... for most it's a phase that most just grow out of. I know that isn't much comfort for those who are being bullied, but it is what it is... and often the best solution to a serious one-on-one (or several-on-one) bullying situation is simply to try to ensure that the opportunity doesn't arise / those kids aren't together unsupervised.

In short it's a ridiculous idea that assumes kids are robots and that if you "do the right stuff" they will be perfect. It's just not the case. By all means take a look at the parents, but if they're genuinely concerned and engaged in trying to sort it out then that's really all there is to it. If they don't seem to care / aren't bothered about finding a solution / are actively doing something that's causing their child to lash out, that's another story, but honestly those cases are nowhere near the majority. Most parents are horrified when they find out their kid is bullying, and even more horrified when they can't figure out why, or how to convince them to stop.

[Ashley.]

That's quite absurd, especially if the child is at an age where they are responsible for their own actions. Home visits to assess quality of parenting and living conditions should be the way forward, that way you're not directly blaming the parent but trying to find the cause.

[Lostie!]

"Blame the parents!!" is such a tired cliché. Of course some bullies are products of their upbringing but any suggestion that all are is nonsense.

[kirklancaster]

No, because the idea that parents have FULL control over their children's behaviour at ALL times is a complete, and dangerous, illusion. Just because they're kids doesn't mean they're not individuals with free will.

A kid being a (serious) bully can often be an indication of troubles at home. I would add to that that "serious" is important here; the uncomfortable truth is that almost all children will engage in mild non-physical bullying at some point. It is also not ALWAYS an indication that anything is wrong at home.

A kid who is a known bully continuing to bully does not always mean that the parents are unaware or aren't actively trying to do something about it. There's no surefire way to get it to stop. Parents and schools can be doing their best, working together, and still have a child with troublesome behaviour. Frankly... for most it's a phase that most just grow out of. I know that isn't much comfort for those who are being bullied, but it is what it is... and often the best solution to a serious one-on-one (or several-on-one) bullying situation is simply to try to ensure that the opportunity doesn't arise / those kids aren't together unsupervised.

In short it's a ridiculous idea that assumes kids are robots and that if you "do the right stuff" they will be perfect. It's just not the case. By all means take a look at the parents, but if they're genuinely concerned and engaged in trying to sort it out then that's really all there is to it. If they don't seem to care / aren't bothered about finding a solution / are actively doing something that's causing their child to lash out, that's another story, but honestly those cases are nowhere near the majority. Most parents are horrified when they find out their kid is bullying, and even more horrified when they can't figure out why, or how to convince them to stop.

I agree with this, T.S.

In my long experience, bullies are generally troubled people who suffer from deep insecurities and a hidden inferiority complex - and this usually begins in childhood.

I also agree with Ashley that 'Official'' home visits to assess the quality of parenting is a must in school-bullying cases.

[Ashley.]

"Blame the parents!!" is such a tired cliché. Of course some bullies are products of their upbringing but any suggestion that all are is nonsense.

I've seen quite a few cases of children who were once bullied ending up becoming the bully of others. In this case it was never the parenting but the child's own feelings towards others based on their own experiences. Other cases, such as a death in the family, the lack of a mother/father figure can lead to frustration that is displaced on to others. I do believe that bad parenting is a major contributor to how a child behaves, but it's nevertheless a complicated area and there's no saying there can't be other reasons too.

[armand.kay]

Ffs where the **** do the loose women find these debate topics

[Greg!]

99% of the time if the kids are scum then so are their parents, so yes they should imo if there's evidence they aren't doing anything to try and stop it

[Northern Monkey]

No.Parents can’t control what their kids are doing at school.That’s what teachers are paid for.

Parents can teach kids not to bully the best they can but they can’t control them when they’re not even with them.

[Ashley.]

No.Parents can’t control what their kids are doing at school.That’s what teachers are paid for.

Parents can teach kids not to bully the best they can but they can’t control them when they’re not even with them.

Teachers are paid to educate children, not care for them.

[Northern Monkey]

Teachers are paid to educate children, not care for them.

Who’s responsible for their wellbeing while they’re at school then?

[Niamh.]

No.Parents can’t control what their kids are doing at school.That’s what teachers are paid for.

Parents can teach kids not to bully the best they can but they can’t control them when they’re not even with them.

Yep, I think if the parents of bullies are not cooperating or helping the situation when informed by the school then maybe it's worth thinking about but if they are then you can't punish them for it imo

[Northern Monkey]

Yep, I think if the parents of bullies are not cooperating or helping the situation when informed by the school then maybe it's worth thinking about but if they are then you can't punish them for it imo

Yeah,There’s only so much a parent can do.You can teach them the best you can but then what can you do when you’re not with them?

[Ashley.]

Who’s responsible for their wellbeing while they’re at school then?

Whether they're responsible for a child's wellbeing is a whole different topic - teachers shouldn't be held accountable or be seen as at fault for the behaviour of a child when they have about thirty other children to teach and grade. You can't expect a teacher to do a parent's job, especially when they may have children of their own.

I think people ask too much of teachers, these days.

[Tom4784]

I think the home life of bullies should be investigated to make sure the problem isn't down to the bully's home life but to charge every parent of a bully is ridiculous.

Some kids are naturally just awful and it's not something that you can always blame the parents for. If a parent provides a loving home and support but the child still turns out to be a twat then it's not on the parents.

[Vicky.]

No, its a silly idea. Tbh the current 'rules' about a parent being able to be prosecuted for attendance is quite stupid too. My parents could not have made me go to school once I passed about 13..I mean they could literally take me into class, but I still would have ****ed off at the first opportunity. There was really nothing at all my parents could do about my behaviour. I still passed all my exams though, despite hating school so much I only really went in 2/3 days, and even then only with lessons I liked :S

[Livia]

As someone who was bullied, I have to say I'd be surprised if the parents were aware of what their little angels were doing to other kids. A parent is responsible for their child until that child reaches 18, I think the parents should be more involved in what their kids are doing, not just with bullying but with other stuff, knife crime, drugs... I'm a little tired of seeing people on the telly saying how awful it is for kids, no youth centres, not enough youth workers, teachers should take some responsibility... the only thing I haven't heard yet is that parents should take some responsibility for the actions of their own underage offspring.

[Kazanne]

I have seen some awful videos on FB of kids being bullied it's horrible to see, many of the bullies are feral little thugs who gather in groups to pick on one girl/boy, I do think parents if they are doing their job properly will be aware where there kids are , who they are with, and if they are found to be bullying would give them the punishment they deserve and all through their life just teach them to be kind and to understand feelings aswell as physical stuff hurts. parents cannot be with kids all the time but good parents will be alert , sadly a lot of parents don't give a **** who their kids are harassing and bullying, and sadly some other poor kid suffers. So I do think lazy parents should shoulder some of the blame.Criminal charges might be a bit much unless it happens over and over by the same kids.

[smudgie]

No, but I do think it should be brought to the attention of the parents who could then have the opportunity to stop it.
If it persists then expel the little twats.

[Beso]

The parents of the bullied child should be able to file charges against the school, imo.

[user104658]

The parents of the bullied child should be able to file charges against the school, imo.Not straight off the bat because it can be covert bullying in some cases; BUT when it has been brought to the attention of the staff, if they then fail to protect the child adequately then I agree parents should have a way to take action against the school.

I remember kids being picked on mercilessly... And not just by "bullies" - I'm more talking about the unfortunate kids who were picked on by almost EVERYONE... Teachers saw it, knew about it, and turned a blind eye. Which is really pretty awful.

[ethanjames]

if the parents recognise what the kids have done is wrong and the bullying has nothing to do with the upbringing just the kids personal problems then no but otherwise yes. ive been bullied a lot and its different with every situation

[Mystic Mock]

No they shouldn't face criminal charges for what their child does at School.

However I'd consider letting the School fine the parents if their child is constantly in trouble, it might make the parents teach their child right from wrong if they're being hit financially by their child's bullying antics.

[armand.kay]

No they shouldn't face criminal charges for what their child does at School.

However I'd consider letting the School fine the parents if their child is constantly in trouble, it might make the parents teach their child right from wrong if they're being hit financially by their child's bullying antics.

This seems incredibly unfair to poorer families.

[Mystic Mock]

This seems incredibly unfair to poorer families.

If they've got a child who's constantly bullying kids (and I mean about 10 separate cases of bullying) then the parents (as well as the Teachers) have not done their jobs to make sure that the kid isn't a psycho and as it's very hard to punish the School, the only people that can be hit financially is the parents.

[Beso]

If they've got a child who's constantly bullying kids (and I mean about 10 separate cases of bullying) then the parents (as well as the Teachers) have not done their jobs to make sure that the kid isn't a psycho and as it's very hard to punish the School, the only people that can be hit financially is the parents.

Being a psycho is an illness.

[Mystic Mock]

Being a psycho is an illness.

Not being an actual psycho, but the child displaying characteristics of a psycho all because they have no discipline put on them by the parents or the Teachers.

[Brillopad]

This seems incredibly unfair to poorer families.

So poorer families shoudn’t be held accountable for any wrong doing. Talk about giving them a licence to behave in an antisocial way.

[user104658]

No they shouldn't face criminal charges for what their child does at School.

However I'd consider letting the School fine the parents if their child is constantly in trouble, it might make the parents teach their child right from wrong if they're being hit financially by their child's bullying antics.Again this assumes that all bullies have parents who are at fault; that kids are robots / pets and if their "owners" teach them "right" then they will behave as they were taught.

But children believe it or not are actually humans with minds of their own completely separate to their parents. Especially teens, which is when the worst bullying occurs. There are all sorts of circumstances that can lead to it.

[montblanc]

no

[Mystic Mock]

Again this assumes that all bullies have parents who are at fault; that kids are robots / pets and if their "owners" teach them "right" then they will behave as they were taught.

But children believe it or not are actually humans with minds of their own completely separate to their parents. Especially teens, which is when the worst bullying occurs. There are all sorts of circumstances that can lead to it.

I think it depends on what we're grading as bullying.

For me I'm thinking of children who think it's okay to beat kids up because of how they look or what they might like, or the bully doesn't like what the child is wearing, and I am thinking of cases where bullies have been so awful that the victim wants to kill themselves because they can't bare the treatment any longer, if a child is making another child feel like that then the parents have to take responsibility for that as it's not like these incidences are normal for a child to display.

[user104658]

I think it depends on what we're grading as bullying.

For me I'm thinking of children who think it's okay to beat kids up because of how they look or what they might like, or the bully doesn't like what the child is wearing, and I am thinking of cases where bullies have been so awful that the victim wants to kill themselves because they can't bare the treatment any longer, if a child is making another child feel like that then the parents have to take responsibility for that as it's not like these incidences are normal for a child to display.They're not normal, no, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the parents aren't trying to stop it or have the power to stop it. The idea that if parents "step in" it'll all instantly stop is simply wrong... And even where it is the fault of a broken home, placing families that are struggling financially under more financial pressure is only likely to compound any problems that are already present.

[armand.kay]

So poorer families shoudn’t be held accountable for any wrong doing. Talk about giving them a licence to behave in an antisocial way.

That's not what I said at all lol...

Also a child misbehaving is not necessarily the fault of the parents. I was just pointing out that a fine wont have the same effect on all families.

[armand.kay]

They're not normal, no, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the parents aren't trying to stop it or have the power to stop it. The idea that if parents "step in" it'll all instantly stop is simply wrong... And even where it is the fault of a broken home, placing families that are struggling financially under more financial pressure is only likely to compound any problems that are already present.

Basically this. To just presume that its the fault of the parents is just a bit stupid and a way of just passing off the blame. Why not try and find out why the child is misbehaving and get to the root of the problem.

[Mystic Mock]

They're not normal, no, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the parents aren't trying to stop it or have the power to stop it. The idea that if parents "step in" it'll all instantly stop is simply wrong... And even where it is the fault of a broken home, placing families that are struggling financially under more financial pressure is only likely to compound any problems that are already present.

If the bully is only doing some mild actions against their victim like silly nicknames/insults then I agree that's not the parents fault, but I honestly do believe that with a basic level of discipline from the parents and teachers that a child would not bully another child to the extent that we've all witnessed when we've been at School.

[Ashley.]

So poorer families shoudn’t be held accountable for any wrong doing. Talk about giving them a licence to behave in an antisocial way.

I believe that such a system is unequal for different reasons - it would actually be more beneficial for poorer families. I'm sure the more well-off parents wouldn't mind paying a "small" fine for their child's behaviour, whereas poorer parents wouldn't want to pay various fines and would be more willing to make an effort.

Again though, it isn't always the parents' fault, so it's complicated.

[Vicky.]

Not straight off the bat because it can be covert bullying in some cases; BUT when it has been brought to the attention of the staff, if they then fail to protect the child adequately then I agree parents should have a way to take action against the school.

I remember kids being picked on mercilessly... And not just by "bullies" - I'm more talking about the unfortunate kids who were picked on by almost EVERYONE... Teachers saw it, knew about it, and turned a blind eye. Which is really pretty awful.

Was a step worse than that with our school. Teachers did ignore it generally, however with one poor kid, the teacher bullied him aswell as the other kids doing it. I actually reported that teacher to the head of year, and as far as I know nothing happened, and even 16 years on, the teacher still works at the school and kids apparently still say hes ****ing horrid. Not in a 'we hate all our teachers' way but from what my friends kids say, he has not changed one bit.

I do think parents should take responsibility for their own kids, however there is only so much parents can actually do it they have a little ****. And yes, sometimes little ***** come randomly, regardless of upbringing. I do think there could maybe be sanctions for parents who seem to not give a crap even when the schools tells them that their little cherub is a little **** though, but an unsure of quite how that would work as its obviously case by case... I have heard far too many tales of schools being informed of bullying and doing nothing though. Which is clearly very wrong.

[Maru]

Every parent reading this be like... if we could be charged for every wrong our child does, oh God.

[Vicky.]

I believe that such a system is unequal for different reasons - it would actually be more beneficial for poorer families. I'm sure the more well-off parents wouldn't mind paying a "small" fine for their child's behaviour, whereas poorer parents wouldn't want to pay various fines and would be more willing to make an effort.

Again though, it isn't always the parents' fault, so it's complicated.

This reminded me so much of this quote

'The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread.'

[Maru]

I believe that such a system is unequal for different reasons - it would actually be more beneficial for poorer families. I'm sure the more well-off parents wouldn't mind paying a "small" fine for their child's behaviour, whereas poorer parents wouldn't want to pay various fines and would be more willing to make an effort.

Again though, it isn't always the parents' fault, so it's complicated.

I agree with this, Ashley. In my high school, we had a truancy issue. One year, the administration had an idea. The police came and occupied the auditorium for about a week and called students with a certain number of inexcused absences into there by intercom to issue them all citations and fines based on the amount of days they missed without a notice. So all the kids and their parents had to go to court and either bring proof proving the reason(s) for their chronic truancy or they were fined... attendance was better after that, sure, but a lot of parents were distressed by the extra financial strain.

With bullying, I think it would be difficult to tailor a system that is objective enough for what it's meant to dissolve. It may just cause those children being excluded even more hardship in it's interpretation, just because it limits the tools of the bullies. So it will just lead to further pervasive bullying by exclusion, etc, which is far worse... than if folk have a fight and then "work it out after". It's not like they can "compell" students to interact with one another in a friendly manner that isn't purposeful. It may actually worsen the situation for the student and make the bullying more deeply ingrained into the culture of the school... kind of like how it works at internet forums that have really heavy moderation, there is a lot of "exclusionary" behavior(s), etc to such a degree.

Truancy is a bit different, it's pretty black and white when someone doesn't show up to their classes or are caught down the road by a Constable eating a hamburger at Burger King.

[Vicky.]

Truancy is a bit different, it's pretty black and white when someone doesn't show up to their classes or are caught down the road by a Constable eating a hamburger at Burger King.

I don't see what this has to do with parents tbh. Unless we are talking like 10 year old kids who are deposited in school and thats that, or schools with large high fences all around so the kids literally have no freedom at all and thus cannot leave after a parent brings them in :laugh: I do not think truancy is black and white at all, again especially when it comes to teens..and is something else that a parent may be responsible for but most likely is not. So yeah, I disagree 100% that truancy is black and white.

[Maru]

I don't see what this has to do with parents tbh. Unless we are talking like 10 year old kids who are deposited in school and thats that, or schools with large high fences all around so the kids literally have no freedom at all and thus cannot leave after a parent brings them in :laugh: I do not think truancy is black and white at all, again especially when it comes to teens..and is something else that a parent may be responsible for but most likely is not. So yeah, I disagree 100% that truancy is black and white.

Yeah I agree, it's not the parent's direct fault if the child skips school. The only other option would be to homeschool if it doesn't stop, and that's not a possible alternative for most poor folk. The fine(s) though were a one-time thing, so it wasn't like they were there every year fining people. I'm not sure I "agree" with it personally (but it happened so..)

However, when I said truancy is 100% black and white, I meant it in the sense that they would know for sure yes, their precious angel skipped school.. :laugh: We caught 'em... it's absolutely clear in those instances whether or not trauncy has actually occurred and if there was any reasoning to justify it. With bullying, it's not necessarily immediately clear if the situation is/was a result of bullying or not. Sometimes things escalate, the fact of a child behaving like a child for one, that maybe what happens instead is that two kids don't get along, not necessarily that it is a case of bullying in the most generic sense. I think even with clearest of guidelines, it would probably just add more headaches for families of kids who are just going through the process of growing up...

[Vicky.]

Ahhh right, yeah of course thats what you meant by the black and white thing :facepalm: My brain seems to be working very slow today