My friend is a carer and she said [Archive] - ThisisBigBrother.com

michael21

30-08-2019, 11:17 PM

Cherie

31-08-2019, 07:12 AM

Horrendous, you wouldn’t treat an animal like that would you, just leave them lying on their own in pain.

Strictly Jake

31-08-2019, 07:22 AM

Yeah but your not supposed to move someone as you don't know what they might have damaged and may make it worse

Cherie

31-08-2019, 07:26 AM

Yeah but your not supposed to move someone as you don't know what they might have damaged and may make it worse

Of course, but leaving a vulnerable person on their own, is that okay? It’s not the carers fault, it’s the company who have nothing in place to cover incidents like this

AnnieK

31-08-2019, 07:32 AM

I'd be furious if a relative of mine had been left by a carer. It's also awful that the ambulance service is so stretched that it would take 2 hours to get to someone now :sad:

Cherie

31-08-2019, 07:39 AM

I'd be furious if a relative of mine had been left by a carer. It's also awful that the ambulance service is so stretched that it would take 2 hours to get to someone now :sad:

I could never do a job like that, the carer is the one who probably feels the most guilt but she has other people to attend to, the manager sat on their arse in the office should have come out and sat with her

AnnieK

31-08-2019, 07:41 AM

I could never do a job like that, the carer is the one who probably feels the most guilt but she has other people to attend to, the manager sat on their arse in the office should have come out and sat with her

Completely agree Cherie. I'm sure the carer would have been in trouble if she had stayed with the patient. I couldn't do that job either. All about money for the company though, and I guess if she had stayed other "customers" would have missed their visit.

Kazanne

31-08-2019, 07:54 AM

So she goes to old people house and help them

On her round one of the old lady's she care for had a bad fall she not aloud to help her up as its her company policy she rang 999 and they said the ambulance would be 2 hours she phone her office and there said to ut a pillow and Blanket on her and then carry on with her rounds the old lady has a key safe so all 999 people can get in to the house

By friend was sad she had to leave her there

Cant be sure Michael but they might have thought if she moved her it might have made things worse,but to have to wait 2 hours for an ambulance seems too long, could she not have stayed with her ?

thesheriff443

31-08-2019, 08:01 AM

This sort of thing happens daily, I would ask was there not a Relative or friend that could be contacted to come and stay with her.

There is not enough ambulance crews doctors and nurses or even hospitals to handle the ever growing population and one that’s living longer.

Add to the fact nhs is full of repeat wasters like drug addicts and drunks who take up places on a weekly basis.

Cal.

31-08-2019, 08:07 AM

That’s horrendous. The manager on the phones should have taken over the rest of the carer’s rounds for the day so she didn’t leave the patient.

thesheriff443

31-08-2019, 08:24 AM

That’s horrendous. The manager on the phones should have taken over the rest of the carer’s rounds for the day so she didn’t leave the patient.

It’s not their patient but their customer, ambulance dispatch who answers hundreds of calls a week would of catagorised the call.

thesheriff443

31-08-2019, 08:27 AM

There are some great programs on that follow the the ambulance crews and hospitals as they deal with life and death emergencies day and night and you get to see the true picture of what they have to deal with daily.

Cherie

31-08-2019, 08:28 AM

Cant be sure Michael but they might have thought if she moved her it might have made things worse,but to have to wait 2 hours for an ambulance seems too long, could she not have stayed with her ?

the carer will have other 'clients', my neighbour had carers in recently after she came out of hospital, they get 15 minutes to go in and out and are not paid for moving on to the next person, they are not allowed to use the oven or hob, just the microwave, the government pays for 6 weeks, if you need help after that and you have savings or your own home, you start paying

Cherie

31-08-2019, 08:31 AM

It’s not their patient but their customer, ambulance dispatch who answers hundreds of calls a week would of catagorised the call.

Cal is talking about the company the carer works for, their job and what they are paid for is to look after the elderly, so this type of incident will not be uncommon and they should have some policy in place to cover it, apart from anything else it's a safeguarding issue, leaving someone who can move on their own on the floor is not 'caring'

thesheriff443

31-08-2019, 08:33 AM

Cal is talking about the company the carer works for, their job and what they are paid for is to look after the elderly, so this type of incident will not be uncommon and they should have some policy in place to cover it, apart from anything else it's a safeguarding issue, leaving someone who can move on their own on the floor is not 'caring'

These carers are nothing more than cleaners, they provide a limited service, it was the ambulance controller who called the shots.

thesheriff443

31-08-2019, 08:34 AM

Also was there not a relative or friend that could of stayed with her.

Cherie

31-08-2019, 08:36 AM

These carers are nothing more than cleaners, they provide a limited service, it was the ambulance controller who called the shots.

On her round one of the old lady's she care for had a bad fall she not aloud to help her up as its her company policy she rang 999 and they said the ambulance would be 2 hours she phone her office and there said to ut a pillow and Blanket on her and then carry on with her rounds the old lady has a key safe so all 999 people can get in to the house

By friend was sad she had to leave her there

If she had a friend on the company file they would have been called, most people are at work? maybe the carer tried a few neighbours but got no response

the bottom line is the carer company are being paid, either by the government or by the lady herself to look after her

thesheriff443

31-08-2019, 08:37 AM

Real life example of over stretched nhs, a few nights ago a friend went back to a and e in pain after having surgery, there was a seven hour waiting time to be seen she went back home in pain.

AnnieK

31-08-2019, 08:39 AM

thesheriff443

31-08-2019, 08:49 AM

The actual carers are usually amazing. Before my mum was moved to the hospice, we had people come in twice a day. One of them was the nicest man I have ever met, he got my mum washed and changed every day, even washed and styled her hair in her bed, supported my dad and gave us advice on different things......all for minimum wage. I have a lot of respect for the carers themselves but the companies are like every company, in it for profit

There are good and bad carers, a friend who’s dad had Carers coming in, they set up a camera on a lap top after being concerned about the amount of time they were spending with their dad, it turned out they were getting paid for 30 mins twice a day but was spending on adverage ten mins each visit.

thesheriff443

31-08-2019, 08:55 AM

You can’t take nothing as a done deal.

My dad was in hospital for an operation on a broken wrist, they came to take him to theatre for an operation on his spine.

Cherie

31-08-2019, 08:59 AM

thesheriff443

31-08-2019, 09:36 AM

This thread is about how the company who are paid to look after the woman handled the situation given they knew how long the lady might have to wait for the ambulance

its not the NHS's fault that she was left on her own to wait

If there was not a shortage of ambulances she would not be laying on the floor for that long.

The local council that give these companies the care contracts will be well aware of the company’s policy when it comes to falls.

DrunkerThanMoses

31-08-2019, 09:40 AM

My gramps had a fall last year and the ambulance didn’t show up for 6/7 hours as apparently he was not major as he knew his name and dob. They said not to move him buts annoying as what if he fell outside in the cold. He was lucky he was inside but he had vomit and **** all over him because of the fall so had to clean him up without trying to move him too much ;(

Cherie

31-08-2019, 10:53 AM

If there was not a shortage of ambulances she would not be laying on the floor for that long.

The local council that give these companies the care contracts will be well aware of the company’s policy when it comes to falls.

That doesn't mean they can't review how they treat their paying customers, no other age group would put up with this, would you leave a child alone after a fall for two hours? would you even leave an injured animal? unfortunately a lot of elderly do not have anyone to lobby on their behalf, the system is broken it needs fixing

michael21

01-09-2019, 12:41 AM

thesheriff443

01-09-2019, 03:56 AM

That doesn't mean they can't review how they treat their paying customers, no other age group would put up with this, would you leave a child alone after a fall for two hours? would you even leave an injured animal? unfortunately a lot of elderly do not have anyone to lobby on their behalf, the system is broken it needs fixing

I think you are missing the point, even if the lady had a carer or a relative stay with her she would still be on the floor for two hours.

Plus I have a real life comparison, a year ago my partners daughter who is a dancer, fell while doing a dance routine on a solid floor,she got her landing wrong and fell badly, so was on the floor in pain, same thing happened, did not move her because of nhs advise, she spent over an hour on a cold floor waiting for an ambulance to turn up because she was not classed as an emergency.

It’s not about who is with them when they’are in need of medical assistance but the time it takes for them to get medical assistance.

joeysteele

01-09-2019, 06:38 AM

This I have come across many times.
The ambulance wait is fairly standard unless you can say the patient is unconscious or not breathing.
It takes a fair while to go through the questions fired at you for starters.

The carer wasn't to blame.
They are often working to tight timings.
Not much chance to be flexible.

The only possible solution here is if a neighbour could have been able to stay with her.

The whole social care system can be horrendous in circumstances like this.
Far from improving, it appears to be getting worse.

Really it's disgraceful this Lady was left up to 2 hours in this plight.
Really awful.

However it's a far more regular occurrence than is thought or even believed.
Massive improvements are needed across the board as to the social care set up.
Massive.

Cherie

01-09-2019, 07:24 AM

I think you are missing the point, even if the lady had a carer or a relative stay with her she would still be on the floor for two hours.

Plus I have a real life comparison, a year ago my partners daughter who is a dancer, fell while doing a dance routine on a solid floor,she got her landing wrong and fell badly, so was on the floor in pain, same thing happened, did not move her because of nhs advise, she spent over an hour on a cold floor waiting for an ambulance to turn up because she was not classed as an emergency.

It’s not about who is with them when they’are in need of medical assistance but the time it takes for them to get medical assistance.

I am not missing any point Sherriff, the point I have been making from the off is that the company has no policy in place to cover events like this, a policy to ensure that the person on the floor is safeguarded while they are waiting for help to arrive, falls and old people are not uncommon, it part and parcel of the 'care' you are being paid to provide, the company can't control how long its going to take the ambulance to arrive, but they can control how they handle the wait time with their paying customer, if someone was with her, the time would go faster, they could stay in touch with ambulance control to check they were on schedule to arrive, they could hold their hand, must be a horrible experience to lie on the floor unable to get up, never mind being on your own.

As a matter of interest did everyone head off and leave your partners daughter on her own on the floor? and would you have been happy if they did?

Cherie

01-09-2019, 07:27 AM

There lots of ways to look at this you could blam the carer or the carer company policy but why is that policy in places it for the safety of there clients when some one old fall you could pick them up and put then in a bed or chair but what use Is that the hospital we check all things why did she fall what can be done so this dose not happen again

Also with out the carer who know how long she could have been there

When you call 999 2 hours is to long to wait

It's standard policy to not to move someone if they have fallen, as your friend was unaware of this, the company are not providing proper training, its not her fault that she couldn't wait if she had other people to get to, that is what her manager is there to sort out

thesheriff443

01-09-2019, 08:11 AM

I am not missing any point Sherriff, the point I have been making from the off is that the company has no policy in place to cover events like this, a policy to ensure that the person on the floor is safeguarded while they are waiting for help to arrive, falls and old people are not uncommon, it part and parcel of the 'care' you are being paid to provide, the company can't control how long its going to take the ambulance to arrive, but they can control how they handle the wait time with their paying customer, if someone was with her, the time would go faster, they could stay in touch with ambulance control to check they were on schedule to arrive, they could hold their hand, must be a horrible experience to lie on the floor unable to get up, never mind being on your own.

As a matter of interest did everyone head off and leave your partners daughter

on her own on the floor? and would you have been happy if they did?

No she was not left on her own because she was in a college during a lesson.

It’s not about being happy at some one being left, it’s about the time it takes for some to receive medical attention.

The simplest way of saying it is, if an ambulance or even a paramedic was available to attend she would not be left on her own.

At the scene of an accident the doctor/paramedic will treat the person making no noise first, not the one making the most noise.

thesheriff443

01-09-2019, 08:14 AM

It's standard policy to not to move someone if they have fallen, as your friend was unaware of this, the company are not providing proper training, its not her fault that she couldn't wait if she had other people to get to, that is what her manager is there to sort out

His friend was aware not to move someone who has fallen.

thesheriff443

01-09-2019, 08:31 AM

The company’s that look after elderly people in their homes bid for the contracts from the local council and their are lots of companies putting in tenders that are competitive to try and win the contract.

Wot they will provide as a service for the price they will charge is all in the contact that is seen by the council.

Cherie

01-09-2019, 09:52 AM

No she was not left on her own because she was in a college during a lesson.

It’s not about being happy at some one being left, it’s about the time it takes for some to receive medical attention.

The simplest way of saying it is, if an ambulance or even a paramedic was available to attend she would not be left on her own.

At the scene of an accident the doctor/paramedic will treat the person making no noise first, not the one making the most noise.

we are talking about two different things, the ambulance service and the company who are being paid to provide care, the ambulance service will have prioritised the call and if there is no danger to life then she would have gone down the queue, it could have just been a busy day for the ambulance service, we don't know, what we do know is the the Company paid to care for her were aware that there would be a 2 hour wait and did nothing to support her for those two hours

I will ask again, if it had been the end of the College day would you have been happy if everyone said bye now to your partners daughter and headed off, even on a basic human level leaving someone who is injured on their own is wrong, you can blame the ambulance service, or blame whoever, but it comes down to empathy and how we treat our elderly, if you found a dog lying by the side of the road injured and you called the vet and he said he would be two hours would you head off home as your job was done or would you wait for the vet?

thesheriff443

01-09-2019, 10:54 AM

we are talking about two different things, the ambulance service and the company who are being paid to provide care, the ambulance service will have prioritised the call and if there is no danger to life then she would have gone down the queue, it could have just been a busy day for the ambulance service, we don't know, what we do know is the the Company paid to care for her were aware that there would be a 2 hour wait and did nothing to support her for those two hours

I will ask again, if it had been the end of the College day would you have been happy if everyone said bye now to your partners daughter and headed off, even on a basic human level leaving someone who is injured on their own is wrong, you can blame the ambulance service, or blame whoever, but it comes down to empathy and how we treat our elderly, if you found a dog lying by the side of the road injured and you called the vet and he said he would be two hours would you head off home as your job was done or would you wait for the vet?
Cherie you are trying to take me down a path that leads to your chosen destination.
The company won’t wait around as they are running a business, this situation is happening daily.
The world we live in is based around making money not doing what would be considered as doing the decent thing.

Cherie

01-09-2019, 10:59 AM

Cherie you are trying to take me down a path that leads to your chosen destination.
The company won’t wait around as they are running a business, this situation is happening daily.
The world we live in is based around making money not doing what would be considered as doing the decent thing.

So a business purporting to provide 'care' in return for payment, doesn't actually need to do that in your book, I see

you could apply that analogy of yours to any situation where a business provides shoddy service,

no trains today...oh well they need to make money

no bin collection this week...they are a business after all, I expect they stopped the collection to increase their profits , who cares if you paid your council tax and expected a bin collection every week

Lets leave it there, I literally am DONE :laugh:

The Slim Reaper

01-09-2019, 11:07 AM

Cherie you are trying to take me down a path that leads to your chosen destination.
The company won’t wait around as they are running a business, this situation is happening daily.
The world we live in is based around making money not doing what would be considered as doing the decent thing.

This is not actually true, especially when added on to your previous posts on the subject. I know this because this is my area of business. I put these tenders and contracts together, not within older persons services but across the young persons social care/social housing sector, and they all run the same way, with provision for specific needs.

There are emergency procedures to follow in instances like these, and to work with older people, even as an agency worker, you need to have specific training. To leave this person alone is a decision either the carer or the on-call supervisor would have to make intentionally. It's not a money issue.

thesheriff443

01-09-2019, 03:00 PM

[/B]

So a business purporting to provide 'care' in return for payment, doesn't actually need to do that in your book, I see

you could apply that analogy of yours to any situation where a business provides shoddy service,

no trains today...oh well they need to make money

no bin collection this week...they are a business after all, I expect they stopped the collection to increase their profits , who cares if you paid your council tax and expected a bin collection every week

Lets leave it there, I literally am DONE :laugh:

Well you might be donebut im not!

I’m not running these care services so have no control over their policies.

And you trying to put all services in same ball park is not a valid argument.

Do I think it’s wrong to leave someone onthe floor? Yes, am I one leaving someone on the floor no.

michael21

19-12-2019, 09:42 PM

My friend handed in her notices the other day saying she want better pay and more better travel cost they want her to say she finds out there decission tomorrow :cheer2:

Beso

19-12-2019, 09:55 PM

EU red tape I'm afraid.

michael21

19-12-2019, 10:05 PM

EU red tape I'm afraid.

She dose like to be tie up but that a whole diffent thread :hehe:

Babayaro.

19-12-2019, 11:46 PM

With my work, if the person we support has a fall then like your friend, we are not supposed to help them up and instead ask if they can get theirselves up (this is mainly to keep us safe as lifting a person obviously has its physical risks). If they cannot, then an ambulance will need to be called. But to leave the person all alone is very negligent tbh, especially someone that vulnerable. Luckily I haven't experienced it, but if a person I was supporting did have a minor fall, I would probably go against company policy and help them up, just to save the hassle of getting an ambulance out. Obviously if there's clear damage/injury then it would be different.

Kizzy

20-12-2019, 12:32 AM

Agreed, can I see it getting better anytime soon? No

Zizu

06-01-2020, 08:00 AM

So she goes to old people house and help them

On her round one of the old lady's she care for had a bad fall she not aloud to help her up as its her company policy she rang 999 and they said the ambulance would be 2 hours she phone her office and there said to ut a pillow and Blanket on her and then carry on with her rounds the old lady has a key safe so all 999 people can get in to the house

By friend was sad she had to leave her there

Any update on the person in question ?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Livia

06-01-2020, 01:49 PM

It's appalling that people have to call an ambulance if someone falls. Newham has roughly the same number of ambulances as it had forty years ago. They've built Beckton since then and built God knows how many houses on every bit of spare land. The population must have doubled. But they have the same number of ambulances they had back then. So next time there's an inquiry into why the ambulance was late, maybe someone could tell them that they need more ambulances.