Face coverings in England's shops to be compulsory from 24 July or £100 fine

[Samm]

Wearing a face covering in shops and supermarkets in England is to become mandatory from 24 July.

Those who fail to comply with the new rules will face a fine of up to £100, the government is to announce.

The move will bring England into line with Scotland and other major European nations like Spain, Italy and Germany.

Source (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-53397617)

this government has quite the theme on being LATE

[Jigs]

No excuses now

[Beso]

£100 fine....I will sue the shop for letting me in

Minted!!

[Liam-]

Perched for the ‘my civil liberties are being encroached on!!’ Types boycotting the supermarkets

[arista]

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[arista]

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[Brother Leon]

I’ve been doing that anyway. It’s common decency to the people working there.

[Barry.]

I don't get how Boris took so long. Nicola's power?

[Vanessa]

This is good. And about time!

[Mystic Mock]

I’ve been doing that anyway. It’s common decency to the people working there.

This.

[Shaun]

Just shops? Not schools, pubs, office floors, etc?

[Samm]

Just shops? Not schools, pubs, office floors, etc?

most offices aren’t open and will remain close for the rest of the year, schools I guess they’ll tackle that in sept. Pubs are already spaced out, and I think it’ll be a bit of a hassle and useless to keep taking the mask on and off when you’re drinking and eating :/

[Ammi]

...I wonder, will low income families receive help with the cost of masks to help protect them ...or even free masks...as they can be quite expensive and especially to have one for every family member...

[Strictly Jake]

Firstly

We have been told from the start that face masks do not work....so why would they work now?

Secondly

Why the 24th July. Where have they just plucked that date from. If shops are so dangerous without masks then surely it should be mandatory straight away not in a week and a halfs time

Thirdly

It is all to delude us into believing we are safer therefore feeling we are safe to go out and spend and out more money into the economy


They literally are making stuff up as they go along and I think im just gonna use my own common sense as clearly they dont have any

[Ammi]

Firstly

We have been told from the start that face masks do not work....so why would they work now?

Secondly

Why the 24th July. Where have they just plucked that date from. If shops are so dangerous without masks then surely it should be mandatory straight away not in a week and a halfs time

Thirdly

It is all to delude us into believing we are safer therefore feeling we are safe to go out and spend and out more money into the economy


They literally are making stuff up as they go along and I think im just gonna use my own common sense as clearly they dont have any


...welcome to the land of Boris Johnson, Jake...

[bots]

we were told from the start that wearing a face mask does not protect you from getting covid, it protects others from catching covid from you. Nothing has changed

[joeysteele]

It can be any mask or any facecovering.
Even a thick scarf wrapped round.

Nothing needs to be bought.
They can easily be made from items of clothing we have in the home.

I've worn a mask since the end of February really but all the time since early March.

At last this procrastinating government has joined the race.
Too many laps behind to claim any win.

However at last.
This should have been done months ago.

Because we don't know WHO may have or does have this virus.
By the same token, many who have the virus, don't even know they have it either.
Hence, in my view, the need for face coverings.

[Samm]

Firstly

We have been told from the start that face masks do not work....so why would they work now?

Secondly

Why the 24th July. Where have they just plucked that date from. If shops are so dangerous without masks then surely it should be mandatory straight away not in a week and a halfs time

Thirdly

It is all to delude us into believing we are safer therefore feeling we are safe to go out and spend and out more money into the economy


They literally are making stuff up as they go along and I think im just gonna use my own common sense as clearly they dont have any

we were told from the start that wearing a face mask does not protect you from getting covid, it protects others from catching covid from you. Nothing has changed

No, not true the WHO changed it’s advice a few months ago. The risk is significantly lower when you’re wearing a mask.

https://i.imgur.com/1BBabC8_d.jpg?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

[Kazanne]

I think masks probably make people feel safe ,some say they are useless others say they are useful ,as for bringing it in as compulsory there must be a reason for that , firstly they will have been advised which way to go, it has been proven in shops large crowds gather and are in close contact , plus maybe its because the cases have dropped and it may help to keep it down, also people will go out and shop more which is needed and there maybe less queues with the wearing of masks . whatever is decided some people will not be happy with it , The public just need to do what they feel safe with.

[joeysteele]

What I don't get is the outcry of shop staff dealing with this.
When the lockdown came in, staff were at the doors of shops, saying what you have to do.

You had to queue to get in.
Social distancing, with that monitored.

Supermarkets have security staff there.
All that has to be done is have them at the door.
If someone isn't wearing a mask, then they don't go in.
Just as at the start of lockdown,no one could just charge into the Store.
They had to go in, in order.

Near all abided by that and it was successful.

I see no reason why not admitting someone to a shop or store, who isn't or refuses to wear a facecovering, is any different.

It's just looking for irrelevant arguments against, that's just my view.

Yes a facecovering is irritating at first.
It's now just routine to me.

When I think in winter, seeing all these people wrapping scarves round their faces keeping out the cold.
Scarves of any material.

What on earth is the problem?

[Ammi]

What I don't get is the outcry of shop staff dealing with this.
When the lockdown came in, staff were at the doors of shops, saying what you have to do.

You had to queue to get in.
Social distancing, with that monitored.

Supermarkets have security staff there.
All that has to be done is have them at the door.
If someone isn't wearing a mask, then they don't go in.
Just as at the start of lockdown,no one could just charge into the Store.
They had to go in, in order.

Near all abided by that and it was successful.

I see no reason why not admitting someone to a shop or store, who isn't or refuses to wear a facecovering, is any different.

It's just looking for irrelevant arguments against, that's just my view.

Yes a facecovering is irritating at first.
It's now just routine to me.

When I think in winter, seeing all these people wrapping scarves round their faces keeping out the cold.
Scarves of any material.

What on earth is the problem?


...in Spain that’s how it’s always been...you’re not wearing a mask/you’re not allowed in the store...I was thinking about things like clip bags...those reusable shopping bags that we’ve all had with us every time we go out because they somehow magically foldaway to nothing to keep in pockets etc...I wonder if there is a similar thing for masks, a foldaway one that can always be carried everywhere...

[Cherie]

...welcome to the land of Boris Johnson, Jake...

They are not compulsory in Wales or NI as yet ..

[Kazanne]

Well apparently its the WHO that has changed their advice, they said at first face masks were not that helpful ,they have now changed their minds so I don't know what the government is expected to do :shrug:

[bots]

Well apparently its the WHO that has changed their advice, they said at first face masks were not that helpful ,they have now changed their minds so I don't know what the government is expected to do :shrug:

it's not just that, if boris had said a few weeks ago that masks were compulsory, labour and the rest of them would have been saying did you consult industry before doing it etc etc. Face masks make no difference whatsoever if you social distance, thats plain and simple. Making masks compulsory means they will squash more into enclosed spaces, and that will ultimately be worse

[Crimson Dynamo]

If someone coughs near you would you feel better if they had a mask on?. I know I would

[Nicky91]

Well apparently its the WHO that has changed their advice, they said at first face masks were not that helpful ,they have now changed their minds so I don't know what the government is expected to do :shrug:

WHO more are disappointed in certain countries their lacklustre governments, how bad it has gotten in certain countries

USA, Brazil, UK are among those

so yeah i can think of their disappointing reactions having played a part too in Boris's decision to step it up with the face masks being a must in shops too

[Cherie]

WHO more are disappointed in certain countries their lacklustre governments, how bad it has gotten in certain countries

USA, Brazil, UK are among those

so yeah i can think of their disappointing reactions having played a part too in Boris's decision to step it up with the face masks being a must in shops too

what are your thoughts on Wales Nicky, no word from their leader yet on face coverings?

[Crimson Dynamo]

WHO more are disappointed in certain countries their lacklustre governments, how bad it has gotten in certain countries

USA, Brazil, UK are among those

so yeah i can think of their disappointing reactions having played a part too in Boris's decision to step it up with the face masks being a must in shops too

Evidence?

[reece(:]

Michael Gove must feel a fool, as he should.

[Nicky91]

what are your thoughts on Wales Nicky, no word from their leader yet on face coverings?

idk, but everywhere should be a must on face coverings in shops and public transport anyway


i do know info on other countries

Germany has also given advice to its people who are on holiday in other countries such as spain to wear face masks (most do, but some others don't who find them too uncomfortable)

my own country, hmm nothing on this yet, however we are taking other precautionary steps in terms of that upcoming second wave, like what i said in other coronavirus thread here ''local lockdowns, not another national lockdown'' more like strict observation at all times, and immediately contain the infected, since this virus is no longer a surprise now (unlike start of this year)

[Jessica.]

The masks do work, it's a proven fact and has been for a while. I'm sorry that your government messed up so badly, I hope everyone now follows the guidelines and that new cases stop popping up soon.

[Jessica.]

Also it was 37º here yesterday and I wore a mask in the hallway of my apartment building, walking out on the street since I'd be passing a lot of elderly people's houses and in the supermarket of course, there's no excuse.

[user104658]

we were told from the start that wearing a face mask does not protect you from getting covid, it protects others from catching covid from you. Nothing has changed

Off the top of my head, 30% risk reduction if the uninfected person is wearing a mask, 70% reduction if the infected person is wearing a mask, 95%+ reduction if BOTH are wearing a mask. So while it's most important for infected people to be wearing one, it's optimal for both parties to be wearing one, and has SOME protective factor if just the healthy person is wearing one. These studies were carried out quite quickly and extensively in the US because they are desperate for an alternative to closing businesses, so the data has only become available since they started getting many more cases.

Well apparently its the WHO that has changed their advice, they said at first face masks were not that helpful ,they have now changed their minds so I don't know what the government is expected to do :shrug:

That is true however the WHO changed the advice several weeks ago and the UK has been dragging their heels deciding on whether or not to implement it being mandatory. This isn't a Scottish brag either - it was only made mandatory here at the end of last week. It's been mandatory in other European countries for much longer.

[user104658]

Honestly I suspect they were waiting to see how it went in Scotland before deciding. They were worried about the backlash/non-compliance so they waited to see how it went down in Scotland. So far it seems like people are doing it without too much grumbling, so now England is going ahead with it. If there had been a lot of trouble over it up here, I don't think they'd be doing it down sarf.

[Liam-]

what are your thoughts on Wales Nicky, no word from their leader yet on face coverings?

He’s said he’s hesitant to implement a mandate for masks because the behaviour of people wearing them changes, our medical officers have been paying attention to places with mandates and mask wearers show signs on negligence when it comes to social distancing because they feel safe wearing their mask, I personally thinks that’s a dumb move, but we’ve got a significantly lower death and infection rate than England, we’d be better off to still introduce a mandate though

[MTVN]

What I don't get is the outcry of shop staff dealing with this.
When the lockdown came in, staff were at the doors of shops, saying what you have to do.

You had to queue to get in.
Social distancing, with that monitored.

Supermarkets have security staff there.
All that has to be done is have them at the door.
If someone isn't wearing a mask, then they don't go in.
Just as at the start of lockdown,no one could just charge into the Store.
They had to go in, in order.

Near all abided by that and it was successful.

I see no reason why not admitting someone to a shop or store, who isn't or refuses to wear a facecovering, is any different.

It's just looking for irrelevant arguments against, that's just my view.

Yes a facecovering is irritating at first.
It's now just routine to me.

When I think in winter, seeing all these people wrapping scarves round their faces keeping out the cold.
Scarves of any material.

What on earth is the problem?

Its only really supermarkets who have had the luxury of having security staff and even a lot of those have had their hours cut recently so they're only on at peak times, tbh most major retailers have cut back staffing so much over the last few years that they can't have someone on the door at all hours of the day. In any case retail staff are not law enforcement: most are minimum wage, part time and predominantly female with many in their 50s and older or are very young with little experience in managing confrontation

[Cherie]

He’s said he’s hesitant to implement a mandate for masks because the behaviour of people wearing them changes, our medical officers have been paying attention to places with mandates and mask wearers show signs on negligence when it comes to social distancing because they feel safe wearing their mask, I personally thinks that’s a dumb move, but we’ve got a significantly lower death and infection rate than England, we’d be better off to still introduce a mandate though

I tend to agree, if people are wearing masks they feel invincible and seem to forget about distancing

[MTVN]

Honestly I suspect they were waiting to see how it went in Scotland before deciding. They were worried about the backlash/non-compliance so they waited to see how it went down in Scotland. So far it seems like people are doing it without too much grumbling, so now England is going ahead with it. If there had been a lot of trouble over it up here, I don't think they'd be doing it down sarf.

Think this is probably true, plus the latest figures are showing that retail is not recovering as hoped for and they think this might help people feel reassured although it could just as easily put people off shopping

[joeysteele]

Its only really supermarkets who have had the luxury of having security staff and even a lot of those have had their hours cut recently so they're only on at peak times, tbh most major retailers have cut back staffing so much over the last few years that they can't have someone on the door at all hours of the day. In any case retail staff are not law enforcement: most are minimum wage, part time and predominantly female with many in their 50s and older or are very young with little experience in managing confrontation

Even the local small shops where I am had no problem.

They only had a notice outside saying things like one or two in the shop at any time.
With markings showing 2m distance.

All I saw was that complied with and people queueing correctly to get in.

I see no problem, if someone is genuinely shopping, they'll be willing, even if not happy to do what are the rulings.

Some places have refused to handle cash, saying non contact payments only, if they can manage that, they can surely manage facecoverings too.
I just don't get the opposition to them.

I didn't like it at first, now it's just routine for me.
Anything in my view that may save even just one life unnecessarily lost is worth that little inconvenience to me.

If someone threw a stink bomb in a shop, people would be looking for anything to cover their noses then, I dare bet.

[user104658]

He’s said he’s hesitant to implement a mandate for masks because the behaviour of people wearing them changes, our medical officers have been paying attention to places with mandates and mask wearers show signs on negligence when it comes to social distancing because they feel safe wearing their mask, I personally thinks that’s a dumb move, but we’ve got a significantly lower death and infection rate than England, we’d be better off to still introduce a mandate though

I think that's a valid concern and some research needs to be done into "passing" social distance. IIRC the risk of infection just walking past someone is very low, 2m distancing becomes important when you're in more prolonged contact (having a conversation, queueing etc.) and so it would be good to know if mask wearing does indeed mitigate that risk for it still to be "on balance" better to be a bit closer to someone WITH a mask than 2m from someone WITHOUT a mask.

Completely hyporthetically, I think there's probably a good argument for that, as the virus is mainly transmitted through droplets. I'd rather be 1m from someone coughing into a mask than 2m from someone coughing into the air.

[user104658]

Its only really supermarkets who have had the luxury of having security staff and even a lot of those have had their hours cut recently so they're only on at peak times, tbh most major retailers have cut back staffing so much over the last few years that they can't have someone on the door at all hours of the day. In any case retail staff are not law enforcement: most are minimum wage, part time and predominantly female with many in their 50s and older or are very young with little experience in managing confrontation

Throw 'em a couple of experienced Bookies staff on exchange for a few months; I've seen grown men run in terror from part-time female employees in their 50's :joker:.

[Cherie]

shop workers will be exempt

[Jessica.]

shop workers will be exempt

That is so stupid

[Captain.Remy]

During the traditional Bastille Day interview with the President, Macron announced the masks will be mandatory in shops and closed spaces on August 1st. Excellent news!

[joeysteele]

That is so stupid

It is indeed.

Not surprising if it's the case, from all the previous confusion in near all guidance from the government.

They just seem to get worse.

[reece(:]

1282939137646112769

Such a farcical :joker:

[The Slim Reaper]

I'm just glad covid has agreed to a 10 day moratorium to allow us to just chill for a bit first.

[MTVN]

I can understand it as most shop staff who are serving will be behind screens and they have to converse with customers all day and that will include people who rely on lip reading. Wearing a mask for eight hours throughout which you are almost always talking is a different matter to wearing one for five minutes popping into a shop. Notice all the politicians taking their masks off the moment they have to do an interview or answer a question. I'm sure shop staff are far more vigilant about hygiene and distancing than your average customer as well as they are much more at risk.

That said I expect the majority of shop staff will voluntarily wear them

[MTVN]

During the traditional Bastille Day interview with the President, Macron announced the masks will be mandatory in shops and closed spaces on August 1st. Excellent news!

France following behind the UK again eh :smug:

[Ammi]

I can understand it as most shop staff who are serving will be behind screens and they have to converse with customers all day and that will include people who rely on lip reading. Wearing a mask for eight hours throughout which you are almost always talking is a different matter to wearing one for five minutes popping into a shop. Notice all the politicians taking their masks off the moment they have to do an interview or answer a question. I'm sure shop staff are far more vigilant about hygiene and distancing than your average customer as well as they are much more at risk.

That said I expect the majority of shop staff will voluntarily wear them

...I was thinking that when Boris took his mask off to speak to camera...I don’t know anyone in a school who wears one when addressing a classroom when the distancing can’t always be applied anyway ...but in September obviously, it’ll be full classrooms with no distancing measures at all...if masks are worn then hearing and understanding will be an issue for sure...

[GoldHeart]

Firstly

We have been told from the start that face masks do not work....so why would they work now?

Secondly

Why the 24th July. Where have they just plucked that date from. If shops are so dangerous without masks then surely it should be mandatory straight away not in a week and a halfs time

Thirdly

It is all to delude us into believing we are safer therefore feeling we are safe to go out and spend and out more money into the economy


They literally are making stuff up as they go along and I think im just gonna use my own common sense as clearly they dont have any

Exactly
The government don't have a clue ,and they've gone back and forth .

It's definitely down to our own common sense , despite the confusion .

[Cherie]

That is so stupid

why? they are behind a screen for the most part, they are not like Health workers who get up close to people, if they choose to wear one that is not going to be an issue I guess.

[joeysteele]

why? they are behind a screen for the most part, they are not like Health workers who get up close to people, if they choose to wear one that is not going to be an issue I guess.

Staff filling the shelves or doing other work in a store aren't behind any screens or shields.
They are there in the aisles where all the customers are going.

Yes, those behind screens and behind counters, fair enough.
However there's all other staff such as those mentioned above and cleaning staff too, who are among the customers.

[arista]

1282926286319620096

[joeysteele]

1282926286319620096

Not surprisingly I agree with Dr Hilary Jones here.

[Cherie]

Staff filling the shelves or doing other work in a store aren't behind any screens or shields.
They are there in the aisles where all the customers are going.

Yes, those behind screens and behind counters, fair enough.
However there's all other staff such as those mentioned above and cleaning staff too, who are among the customers.

You don’t see that many shelf stacking and in my experience they step aside if you need to access otherwise avoid the aisle, for me its not a huge deal, never seen cleaners while shopping tbf

[Cherie]

I guarantee if they said do it tomorrow there would be some group moaning about lack of notice :laugh:

[Tom4784]

It's a good move but I imagine it'll lead to a lot of **** for retail workers if they are expected to police it themselves.

It should have happened earlier.

[joeysteele]

You don’t see that many shelf stacking and in my experience they step aside if you need to access otherwise avoid the aisle, for me its not a huge deal, never seen cleaners while shopping tbf

I see many shelf stackers with their cages of various stock.
Every time I go in.

There's always cleaners in the entrance too when I go.

Anyway, it takes seconds to transmit this, so I'll always go for being safer than sorry.

[Captain.Remy]

France following behind the UK again eh :smug:

We have less cases and deaths than the UK though, so it's not a last minute thought but mainly to make sure the curve keeps being flattened. Wise choice by Macron.

[user104658]

To be frr, they need to give it time for word to get around (not everyone follows the updates closely) and for people to actually get a suitable covering. They can't just implement immediately and stop people from buying their dinner.

[Beso]

I might pick up a raw steak and shove it on if they stop me.

[joeysteele]

I still just can't understand the fuss.

Again I stress, no need for Police involvement unless someone gets violent.
Really.

At lockdown.
Shop staff were ensuring trollies were wiped, that you went into the store in order.
Not in groups.

That all worked.
A store near me had people queueing in very long queues, as did Banks, waiting to get in.

That all worked.

The smaller shops did the same, only letting up to 2 people in at any time.

No real problems.

Just do that same format again now except on one aim.
No one admitted to shop or store who hasn't a facecovering, even just a scarf around their nose and mouth.

Where on earth is the problem.

If shops and stores were able to control how many even entered the store and had them queueing up outside for quite long periods.

How on earth can it be that difficult to just have it adhered to, as to no mask or facecovering, then no entry.

They could even have at the door scarfs or masks on sale outside, with a card payment set up for people to buy a scarf or mask before going in who hadn't them

As for those deaf, well they can usually see and talk.
Since staff won't have to wear masks, although some staff do I noticed yesterday for the first time.
They can still lipread and answer back.
What about sign language too.

Really though, who'd object to someone deaf just easing the facecovering if absolutely necessary.

I'm sorry however, anyone with serious health breathing problems, should be having their shopping done for them.
They shouldn't be in these environments at this time anyway.

Why do simple things need to be made so complicated.

[bots]

The big difference between then and now is that lockdown has ended. People don't like restrictions imposed upon them in a democracy. Lockdown was always only going to be effective for a few weeks and I predict that masks will be ignored more and more as confidence returns.

[Cal.]

It's a good move but I imagine it'll lead to a lot of **** for retail workers if they are expected to police it themselves.

It should have happened earlier.

I don’t think they have to enforce it.

A shop down the road from me put up a post on Facebook saying they won’t be enforcing it but if you’re caught by an enforcement officer that’s on you.

[user104658]

The big difference between then and now is that lockdown has ended. People don't like restrictions imposed upon them in a democracy. Lockdown was always only going to be effective for a few weeks and I predict that masks will be ignored more and more as confidence returns.This is the crux of the issue though. Wearing a mask doesn't really inconvenience anyone, most of the whining about it is really petty, and "what about deaf people!!" is just about the most disingenuous argument I've heard against it. It would be very easy and sensible to make an exception for deaf customers, ensure 2m distance, and lower the mask.

But you're right, it's about people not liking" another restriction"even though this one is barely restrictive. Just people feeling like powerless children, rebelling against what "mum and dad" are telling them they have to do.

This is the first thing they've asked us to do that will have NO negative effect on our free-falling economy and this is the one people have decided is a step too far? Pff. Derp.

[Vanessa]

It doesn't have to be a mask.
It can be a scarf of something similar.

[Cherie]

This is the crux of the issue though. Wearing a mask doesn't really inconvenience anyone, most of the whining about it is really petty, and "what about deaf people!!" is just about the most disingenuous argument I've heard against it. It would be very easy and sensible to make an exception for deaf customers, ensure 2m distance, and lower the mask.

But you're right, it's about people not liking" another restriction"even though this one is barely restrictive. Just people feeling like powerless children, rebelling against what "mum and dad" are telling them they have to do.

This is the first thing they've asked us to do that will have NO negative effect on our free-falling economy and this is the one people have decided is a step too far? Pff. Derp.

yes during lockdown they wanted the government to hold their hand..

and they were constantly confused, mainly because they didn't avail themselves of the information freely available but took their info off twatter.

[MTVN]

The big difference between then and now is that lockdown has ended. People don't like restrictions imposed upon them in a democracy. Lockdown was always only going to be effective for a few weeks and I predict that masks will be ignored more and more as confidence returns.

Everyone was very on board with distancing and capacity limiting as well whereas there is a significant minority very opposed to masks and its currently something only a minority of people are doing. This law will increase that no doubt but I still think compliance will only be around 75% and that would leave a shop turning away a quarter of its custom, a portion of which would be quite aggressive about it. Look at Desmond Swayne in Parliament yesterday calling it 'a monstrous imposition'. And again as I said earlier, permanent door staff are not a feature of the vast majority of shops. By all means there should be notices in the windows and inside but I would not put staff in a position where they had to refuse service to anyone not wearing a mask

[user104658]

Everyone was very on board with distancing and capacity limiting as well whereas there is a significant minority very opposed to masks and its currently something only a minority of people are doing. This law will increase that no doubt but I still think compliance will only be around 75% and that would leave a shop turning away a quarter of its custom, a portion of which would be quite aggressive about it. Look at Desmond Swayne in Parliament yesterday calling it 'a monstrous imposition'. And again as I said earlier, permanent door staff are not a feature of the vast majority of shops. By all means there should be notices in the windows and inside but I would not put staff in a position where they had to refuse service to anyone not wearing a mask

Losing a quarter of their custom? ... are they so opposed to masks that they'll starve? I just don't see it.

Even if 25% don't want to do it at first (which I think is an over-estimate) it'll be once. They'll go without their mask, be told they need a mask, kick off a bit, go away, and come back muttering under their masks while they buy their pot noodle.

I can't see any more than a TINY percentage being so adamant about it that they just "don't go to shops any more". This is Britain. People like to talk a big talk and mouth off on Facebook but when it comes down to it, we're apathetic and compliant. They'll wear masks.

[MTVN]

Losing a quarter of their custom? ... are they so opposed to masks that they'll starve? I just don't see it.

Even if 25% don't want to do it at first (which I think is an over-estimate) it'll be once. They'll go without their mask, be told they need a mask, kick off a bit, go away, and come back muttering under their masks while they buy their pot noodle.

I can't see any more than a TINY percentage being so adamant about it that they just "don't go to shops any more". This is Britain. People like to talk a big talk and mouth off on Facebook but when it comes down to it, we're apathetic and compliant. They'll wear masks.

I'm not just talking about supermarkets, in fact those are the ones I'm least talking about as they probably would find it easier to enforce as they do still have door staff a lot of the time and people do need to visit them. The problem will be the shopping that's done more for pleasure than for necessity and those are the shops that can least afford to lose out on any custom.

I might be wrong on this and it might actually help if more people now feel comfortable going out shopping but it could go either way. Tbh if compliance is 75% I think that would be a reasonable success as it'd more than double the number currently wearing masks, I don't think this is a law where its absolutely imperative that its enforced to 100% compliance

[bots]

Losing a quarter of their custom? ... are they so opposed to masks that they'll starve? I just don't see it.

Even if 25% don't want to do it at first (which I think is an over-estimate) it'll be once. They'll go without their mask, be told they need a mask, kick off a bit, go away, and come back muttering under their masks while they buy their pot noodle.

I can't see any more than a TINY percentage being so adamant about it that they just "don't go to shops any more". This is Britain. People like to talk a big talk and mouth off on Facebook but when it comes down to it, we're apathetic and compliant. They'll wear masks.

in a free market economy, there will be shops that will not refuse people not wearing masks, so the ones that refuse entry will lose revenue. Money talks

[Ammi]

I'm not just talking about supermarkets, in fact those are the ones I'm least talking about as they probably would find it easier to enforce as they do still have door staff a lot of the time and people do need to visit them. The problem will be the shopping that's done more for pleasure than for necessity and those are the shops that can least afford to lose out on any custom.

I might be wrong on this and it might actually help if more people now feel comfortable going out shopping but it could go either way. Tbh if compliance is 75% I think that would be a reasonable success as it'd more than double the number currently wearing masks, I don't think this is a law where its absolutely imperative that its enforced to 100% compliance


...yeah, if shop customers decrease because of the mask having to be worn as opposed to shopping online, it’ll be the non essentials which have just re-opened again...the supermarkets have always and would always thrive, regardless of restrictions...

[joeysteele]

It doesn't have to be a mask.
It can be a scarf of something similar.

I know.
It's crazy.

To go into a shop or store for a few minutes or half an hour whatever.

It's such a difficult thing to just have an even in courtesy to others, facecovering on while in there.

As things get eased and relaxed, this should be more important.
The level is still at level 3.
That means the virus is out there and transmissible.

With more back to work,school, and out and about now, it is in my view, and should be, an essential requirement to have a facecovering as you even outline..
Even just like a fashionable scarf.

If only out of respect for and courtesy to others.

Why there's a fuss astounds me.
When less people were out during lockdown, that's when facecoverings were less needed.
Now, opening things up.more, it's moreso needed.
In my view.

[Jessica.]

All of the shops here have signs outside saying "do not enter without a mask" and they turn people away if they're not wearing them.

[Liam-]

1283378279056134145

[Cherie]

1283378279056134145

No arguing with that

[user104658]

It doesn't affect your oxygen intake, it does make your breathing "feel" stifled though, it's more a psychological/instinctual thing. You get used to it, eventually your subconscious will realise you're not suffocating and the panicky feelings will stop. People just don't like to be psychologically uncomfortable :shrug:.

[bots]

It doesn't affect your oxygen intake, it does make your breathing "feel" stifled though, it's more a psychological/instinctual thing. You get used to it, eventually your subconscious will realise you're not suffocating and the panicky feelings will stop. People just don't like to be psychologically uncomfortable :shrug:.

my glasses do steam up a bit, so i have to fiddle with mask positioning quite a lot to get the sweet spot

[Cherie]

Wear a bandana its much more comfortable

[Amy Jade]

I swear I'll go off if I pop into say tesco and some Karen is saying it's her right to not wear a mask when people in the NHS wear one for 10 hour shifts and even the shop workers who run around babysitting customers who forgot their tin of beans so needs someone to get it for them wear masks too.

I hate them, If I have to wear glasses to fill in forms it makes them steam up but I do it and so can everyone else.

[joeysteele]

I swear I'll go off if I pop into say tesco and some Karen is saying it's her right to not wear a mask when people in the NHS wear one for 10 hour shifts and even the shop workers who run around babysitting customers who forgot their tin of beans so needs someone to get it for them wear masks too.

I hate them, If I have to wear glasses to fill in forms it makes them steam up but I do it and so can everyone else.

Well said.
I agree with all of that.

[Vanessa]

Wear a bandana its much more comfortable

Yes, or a scarf.

[Tom4784]

If surgeons can wear masks AND visors to perform heart surgery, people can wear face coverings for a ten minute jaunt around Aldi.

[Smithy]

Can’t wait for all the people that won’t wear a mask to kick off in November when we don’t want to wear a poppy :idc:

[Cherie]

I swear I'll go off if I pop into say tesco and some Karen is saying it's her right to not wear a mask when people in the NHS wear one for 10 hour shifts and even the shop workers who run around babysitting customers who forgot their tin of beans so needs someone to get it for them wear masks too.

I hate them, If I have to wear glasses to fill in forms it makes them steam up but I do it and so can everyone else.

I saw two melt downs during the 'no couples' rule and they were both Asian men, and their wives were being perfectly reasonable about it, so not sure why women are being singled out here, men go shopping too!

[Niamh.]

Can’t wait for all the people that won’t wear a mask to kick off in November when we don’t want to wear a poppy :idc:

:laugh:

[user104658]

I saw two melt downs during the 'no couples' rule and they were both Asian men, and their wives were being perfectly reasonable about it, so not sure why women are being singled out here, men go shopping too!:nono: No one said it was just women Cherie, men can be Karens too, because schrodinger's gender does not exist and is simultaneously the most important aspect of identity. Its 2020, you're lagging behind.

[Cherie]

:nono: No one said it was just women Cherie, men can be Karens too, because schrodinger's gender does not exist and is simultaneously the most important aspect of identity. Its 2020, you're lagging behind.

:laugh:

[Livia]

Who could possibly have a problem with covering their face in shops until the threat is over, or at least much diminished. People can be sooo stupid and selfish.

[LukeB]

Who could possibly have a problem with covering their face in shops until the threat is over, or at least much diminished. People can be sooo stupid and selfish.

There’s some

Apparently not wearing a mask is better because it’s nice and social...

It’s about time this is happening and i think it should have been done weeks ago tbh, people should start getting use to them because this threat isn’t going anywhere anytime soon and there’s a potential second wave.

[Marsh.]

There’s some

Apparently not wearing a mask is better because it’s nice and social...

:joker:

[Cherie]

I have always worn a mask :angel:

[Marsh.]

I have always worn a mask :angel:

Not 6 inches of makeup. :omgno:

[user104658]

There’s some



Apparently not wearing a mask is better because it’s nice and social...



It’s about time this is happening and i think it should have been done weeks ago tbh, people should start getting use to them because this threat isn’t going anywhere anytime soon and there’s a potential second wave.

To be fair, I think that's why it is happening now, while cases are low and there's actually a very low risk of infection in the community anyway. If (I'm trying to be optimistic and stop saying "when") cases start to increase again towards winter, people will be used to the idea of wearing masks.

[bots]

are we all going to need new passport photos taken wearing a mask? :think:

[user104658]

are we all going to need new passport photos taken wearing a mask? :think:I think obviously at airports, you'd simply lower the mask for a few seconds. It does pose an interesting question shen it comes to ID in shops for age verification, though. An awful lot of mask-touching going on if you have to remove it for an age check.

[Cherie]

Not 6 inches of makeup. :omgno:

7 :hmph:

[Cherie]

I think obviously at airports, you'd simply lower the mask for a few seconds. It does pose an interesting question shen it comes to ID in shops for age verification, though. An awful lot of mask-touching going on if you have to remove it for an age check.

isn't age check done with actual ID :think:

oh ignore me I get what you mean now, blue eyes with a brown eyed DL would be a bit of a giveaway though

[Liam-]

Can’t wait for all the people that won’t wear a mask to kick off in November when we don’t want to wear a poppy :idc:

So much this

[Beso]

KNOW THE LAW!

Remember, according to social distancing, shop staff cannot “touch” you or come within 1 metre without breaking guidelines, (but of course they touch everything you’re buying) and if you refuse to wear a mask in their shop they cannot physically throw you out, but can only call the police to enforce a government 'guideline'. The big problem for the police is that that would be breaking the Law if they tried to enforce a 'guideline', because police can only legally enforce Criminal Law.

If the police detain you, or arrest you because, naturally, you have refused to cooperate, they are then guilty of unlawful detention, which comes under the criminal code of 'kidnapping'.
If they try to fine you, without first 'kidnapping' you, you are not obliged to give them any information, not even your name, and without your name they cannot issue a fine.

If they find out your name, by whatever means and then issue a fine, you can simply state that you refuse to accept or pay any fine and they will then be obliged to caution you, which would be totally illegal since you will not have committed any crime (guidelines being optional to follow) and again, they would not be enforcing any law.

Know the difference: Guidelines come under 'civil law' and crimes come under 'criminal law'. The police are not allowed to enforce 'civil law' - only the local authority and the civil courts can attempt to do that. So, demand that the Court issue you with a date for an appearance, and when/if you go to court your defence will be illegal detention and kidnapping, and in the civil court you will be able to demand substantial compensation as a counter-claim from the police, plus insist that criminal charges are brought against the arresting and detaining officers.

Now, nobody says that it will get to that stage, indeed it would be very unlikely to, but can you imagine how the Courts will be clogged up for years, perhaps decades, trying to process those bloody awkward bastards who had the bald-faced cheek to know the Law and also know their civil rights.

PS: Ensure you use your phone and record the whole even, to be used as leverage and evidence. But just remember this one fact - the police cannot enforce civil Law and therefore have no rights in determining whether or not you have to wear a mask, just because the government says so. That process would be called a 'dictatorship' and we are not quite there yet, despite this government's valiant attempts to make it so.

[Tom4784]

KNOW THE LAW!

Remember, according to social distancing, shop staff cannot “touch” you or come within 1 metre without breaking guidelines, (but of course they touch everything you’re buying) and if you refuse to wear a mask in their shop they cannot physically throw you out, but can only call the police to enforce a government 'guideline'. The big problem for the police is that that would be breaking the Law if they tried to enforce a 'guideline', because police can only legally enforce Criminal Law.

If the police detain you, or arrest you because, naturally, you have refused to cooperate, they are then guilty of unlawful detention, which comes under the criminal code of 'kidnapping'.
If they try to fine you, without first 'kidnapping' you, you are not obliged to give them any information, not even your name, and without your name they cannot issue a fine.

If they find out your name, by whatever means and then issue a fine, you can simply state that you refuse to accept or pay any fine and they will then be obliged to caution you, which would be totally illegal since you will not have committed any crime (guidelines being optional to follow) and again, they would not be enforcing any law.

Know the difference: Guidelines come under 'civil law' and crimes come under 'criminal law'. The police are not allowed to enforce 'civil law' - only the local authority and the civil courts can attempt to do that. So, demand that the Court issue you with a date for an appearance, and when/if you go to court your defence will be illegal detention and kidnapping, and in the civil court you will be able to demand substantial compensation as a counter-claim from the police, plus insist that criminal charges are brought against the arresting and detaining officers.

Now, nobody says that it will get to that stage, indeed it would be very unlikely to, but can you imagine how the Courts will be clogged up for years, perhaps decades, trying to process those bloody awkward bastards who had the bald-faced cheek to know the Law and also know their civil rights.

PS: Ensure you use your phone and record the whole even, to be used as leverage and evidence. But just remember this one fact - the police cannot enforce civil Law and therefore have no rights in determining whether or not you have to wear a mask, just because the government says so. That process would be called a 'dictatorship' and we are not quite there yet, despite this government's valiant attempts to make it so.

The Karen energy in this copy and paste, far too much.

[The Slim Reaper]

:joker:

Don't shops have the right to serve who they want, Dezzy? As long as it's not discriminatory in nature, of course, and public health/safety of their staff most definitely couldn't be labelled as such.

[Cherie]

funny how no one had an issue with being paid their wages by the government to stay at home, but cover your nose and mouth, I don't think so, the government wont tell me what to do :nono:

[Tom4784]

:joker:

Don't shops have the right to serve who they want, Dezzy? As long as it's not discriminatory in nature, of course, and public health/safety of their staff most definitely couldn't be labelled as such.

Pretty much, if someone refuses to leave, shop workers can and will call the police and no karen interpretation of the laws will save them from being arrested.

There's gonna be a lot of fines issued out to morons when this comes into effect.

[user104658]

Just so that no one takes Parmy's terrible advice:

Yes whichever Facebook smart arse wrote that is technically correct, however, they only gave you half the story. After one incident, the shop (because shops are private businesses, not public spaces) can take out a trespass order against you, and once served with the trespass order (the next time you try to enter the shop) if you go onto the premises you absolutely can be arrested and charged with trespassing.

That is if you're being respectful.

Next up; what happens if you kick off? Because whilst the above applies to ALL shops and stores (clothes and tech stores etc) - supermarkets and most convenience stores sell alcohol, so they are licensed premises. Refusing to leave a licensed premises on request of those responsible for said premises, when that person believes that you are engaging in disorderly conduct, IS a criminal offense and you can be physically removed from the property by premises security or by the police. If you resist, you can be arrested.

In 10 years working for the ol bookies (which is licensed because of gambling, not alcohol, but the same rules apply) I have had COUNTLESS individuals physically removed from the premises by police, at least 5 arrested, and had two court trespass orders issued banning people for life.

So by all means go ahead if it's a shop you never intend to go to again. If its your local supermarket, I'd suggest that getting banned for life isn't worth it, and you should put on your mask ;).

You've been given dud advice Parmy.

[The Slim Reaper]

Just so that no one takes Parmy's terrible advice:

Yes whichever Facebook smart arse wrote that is technically correct, however, they only gave you half the story. After one incident, the shop (because shops are private businesses, not public spaces) can take out a trespass order against you, and once served with the trespass order (the next time you try to enter the shop) if you go onto the premises you absolutely can be arrested and charged with trespassing.

That is if you're being respectful.

Next up; what happens if you kick off? Because whilst the above applies to ALL shops and stores (clothes and tech stores etc) - supermarkets and most convenience stores sell alcohol, so they are licensed premises. Refusing to leave a licensed premises on request of those responsible for said premises, when that person believes that you are engaging in disorderly conduct, IS a criminal offense and you can be physically removed from the property by premises security or by the police. If you resist, you can be arrested.

In 10 years working for the ol bookies (which is licensed because of gambling, not alcohol, but the same rules apply) I have had COUNTLESS individuals physically removed from the premises by police, at least 5 arrested, and had two court trespass orders issued banning people for life.

So by all means go ahead if it's a shop you never intend to go to again. If its your local supermarket, I'd suggest that getting banned for life isn't worth it, and you should put on your mask ;).

You've been given dud advice Parmy.

I mean on one hand this, but on the other is facebook. I don't know what to believe.

[user104658]

Come to think of it, I don't think it would be hard to argue that trying to force entry past door staff without a mask in the first place could be argued as disorderly conduct.

What happens when you try to enter a club with a dress/footwear code in the wrong clothes and argue with the bouncers when they turn you away?

Its exactly the same principle. You don't have a legal right to enter a licenced premises.

[Niamh.]

https://scontent.fdub5-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/109729003_3553050004726311_3142972384678452477_n.j pg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_sid=9267fe&_nc_ohc=2gc9mzhwRPwAX8iNtOz&_nc_ht=scontent.fdub5-1.fna&oh=d0cb24c3207381da543613cfe82b4fbf&oe=5F377B6A

[Beso]

The Karen energy in this copy and paste, far too much.

That actually came from a lefty.

[The Slim Reaper]

Niamh being a "watersports" advocate is certainly new information. :smug:

[Niamh.]

Niamh being a "watersports" advocate is certainly new information. :smug:

:oh:

[Beso]

You cant get fined 100 pound for not wearing a mask by the police.. nor can you be arrested for not wearing one by the police.

My advice is good advice..as long as you dont get aggresive with the supermarket staff.

[Jessica.]

https://scontent.fdub5-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/109729003_3553050004726311_3142972384678452477_n.j pg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_sid=9267fe&_nc_ohc=2gc9mzhwRPwAX8iNtOz&_nc_ht=scontent.fdub5-1.fna&oh=d0cb24c3207381da543613cfe82b4fbf&oe=5F377B6A

That is a very good metaphor, it works exactly like that. I am sick at the moment with a high temperature and I am so glad I wore my mask the whole time when I was out the other day. It's probably not covid-19 but it's quite nice that if I am contagious then there's a lower chance that I passed it on to anyone.

[Niamh.]

That is a very good metaphor, it works exactly like that. I am sick at the moment with a high temperature and I am so glad I wore my mask the whole time when I was out the other day. It's probably not covid-19 but it's quite nice that if I am contagious then there's a lower chance that I passed it on to anyone.

Oh hope you're OK Jess

[Jessica.]

Oh hope you're OK Jess

Thanks, I called the covid-19 helpline for Portugal and they gave me advice, I am okay, they aren't worried that I have it.

[user104658]

You cant get fined 100 pound for not wearing a mask by the police.. nor can you be arrested for not wearing one by the police.

My advice is good advice..as long as you dont get aggresive with the supermarket staff.

A supermarket is a licensed premises and you can be asked to leave by staff. If you refuse to leave, you can be removed by police. It doesn't matter if you're aggressive or not. I worked in licensed retail management for nearly a decade Parmy.

Whether or not you can be arrested or fined is another matter but if the police come to escort you off of the premises they can do so physically and if you fight them you can then be arrested.

[Niamh.]

Thanks, I called the covid-19 helpline for Portugal and they gave me advice, I am okay, they aren't worried that I have it.

That's good, do you need to self isolate now or not?

[Cherie]

Lots of very long posts on this ...the only law you need to know is shops are private property so they can deny you entry...like they have done for topless men and people in PJs

[Beso]

Do you have to wear one if it effects a health condition you suffer from?

[user104658]

Do you have to wear one if it effects a health condition you suffer from?They've been proven not to affect the oxygen sats of people with asthma and COPD etc. so what sort of health condition?

[The Slim Reaper]

Do you have to wear one if it effects a health condition you suffer from?

I don't get this, Parm. You were quite critical of Boris acting slowly when it kicked off, and now you're looking for loopholes so you don't have to wear a mask and work with everyone else to try and keep folks as safe as possible.

[Beso]

They've been proven not to affect the oxygen sats of people with asthma and COPD etc. so what sort of health condition?

From the source in the op.


list of exemptions has not yet been published, but the rules for face masks on public transport exempt anyone who cannot wear one "because of any physical or mental illness or impairment, or disability", who would experience "severe distress" from doing so, or relies on lip reading, among other reasons

[Beso]

I don't get this, Parm. You were quite critical of Boris acting slowly when it kicked off, and now you're looking for loopholes so you don't have to wear a mask and work with everyone else to try and keep folks as safe as possible.

What's the point in wearing a mask when you are more likely to catch it by touch.:shrug:


All those shop workers not wearing masks coughing on the food packaging and touching it is far more dangerous than me keeping my 2 meter distance from everyone else....

A government telling you what you wear, not on my watch.:nono:

[user104658]

What's the point in wearing a mask when you are more likely to catch it by touch.:shrug:





All those shop workers not wearing masks coughing on the food packaging and touching it is far more dangerous than me keeping my 2 meter distance from everyone else....



A government telling you what you wear, not on my watch.:nono:They're not telling you what to wear - they're telling shops what to require you to wear to enter. Again, you don't have a right to enter a licensed premesis. If the licensee says you can't come in, you can't come in.

You can wear what you want at home - and they wouldn't be able to make them mandatory outdoors.

[Beso]

They're not telling you what to wear - they're telling shops what to require you to wear to enter. Again, you don't have a right to enter a licensed premesis. If the licensee says you can't come in, you can't come in.

You can wear what you want at home - and they wouldn't be able to make them mandatory outdoors.



But if you said you had a condition so didnt need to wear one and they refused you entry, they would be violating your civil rights.

[The Slim Reaper]

What's the point in wearing a mask when you are more likely to catch it by touch.:shrug:


All those shop workers not wearing masks coughing on the food packaging and touching it is far more dangerous than me keeping my 2 meter distance from everyone else....

A government telling you what you wear, not on my watch.:nono:

Sometimes you show such care and consideration for others, then other times, like this, I just don't get what you're fighting against or where you're coming from. It's something easy and painless that we can all do to reduce the risk for everyone and help life get back to normality.

[Beso]

Sometimes you show such care and consideration for others, then other times, like this, I just don't get what you're fighting against or where you're coming from. It's something easy and painless that we can all do to reduce the risk for everyone and help life get back to normality.

Ok..what about all these protests and gatherings where most people didnt have a mask on.wheres the spike in new cases and mass deaths?


It looks like living a normal life like those people were is ok after all.:shrug:

You may argue that that was outdoors unlike supermarkets. But wheres the spikes from the supermarkets during all the weeks we haven't been wearing masks? But all of a sudden you can only catch covid in supermarkets after July 24th:joker:

I'm just not buying this **** anymore, .:shrug:

[Cherie]

Ok..what about all these protests and gatherings where most people didnt have a mask on.wheres the spike in new cases and mass deaths?


It looks like living a normal life like those people were is ok after all.:shrug:

You may argue that that was outdoors unlike supermarkets. But wheres the spikes from the supermarkets during all the weeks we haven't been wearing masks? But all of a sudden you can only catch covid in supermarkets after July 24th:joker:

I'm just not buying this **** anymore, .:shrug:

they were researching the benefits? wouldn't it have been much worse for them to say wear one anyway with no evidence to back it up, no one is asking you to walk round all day and night in a mask, put one one when you walk into a shop, same way as you sanatise your hands before going in with the sanitiser provided, do you do that? , and we have to assume the shop staff will have washed their hands and sanatised before coming on duty? The virus is under control now and these measures are to drive it down further and prevent a further wave?

[Ammi]

That is a very good metaphor, it works exactly like that. I am sick at the moment with a high temperature and I am so glad I wore my mask the whole time when I was out the other day. It's probably not covid-19 but it's quite nice that if I am contagious then there's a lower chance that I passed it on to anyone.

...you take care, Jess..:hug:...

[Beso]

My hands are more pickled than my liver.

Because the hands are important.

[Tom4784]

Anyone that would kick up a fuss about wearing a mask for ten minutes while they do their shopping is a selfish child.

[Tom4784]

That actually came from a lefty.

Doubt but it doesn't matter, a Karen is a Karen and you're listening to a particularly dumb one.

[joeysteele]

Anyone that would kick up a fuss about wearing a mask for ten minutes while they do their shopping is a selfish child.


Absolutely.

Far better to wear a mask or facecovering, than have to be connected up to a ventilator or even help put someone else on a ventilator.

[Jake.]

What's the point in wearing a mask when you are more likely to catch it by touch.:shrug:


All those shop workers not wearing masks coughing on the food packaging and touching it is far more dangerous than me keeping my 2 meter distance from everyone else....

A government telling you what you wear, not on my watch.:nono:

Don’t go shopping until it’s lifted then I guess?

[Ammi]

...this is tongue in cheek, obviously and there are lots of other similar vids...I don’t understand any thought process of not wanting to wear a mask...

..’oh, just pop this on, it could save your life/save the lives of other people..’...

..’no, thank you, I won’t bother, not keen on it tbh...’....


...makes no sense, no sense...


1282376398242410496

[Ammi]

...I can just imagine the conversations that the aliens will have...oh, look at the Earth planet...they were consumed by a virus and all wiped out, poor things...they were asked to wear masks, how awful...but they stood firmly and bravely, bless them...

[AnnieK]

The annoying thing with people who are refusing to wear the fave coverings is that when you wear them they actually protect other people more than the wearer so if they are refusing to wear one it is other people, rather than themselves that they are putting at risk. Its not a big ask to cover your nose and mouth with a piece of cloth just when you're in a shop. People who have been shielding have not been able to leave their homes at all for 16 weeks....they have borne the isolation from family and friends and boredom and loneliness and now want to be safe when they venture to the shops. Don't take away that freedom for them by risking a second, more severe wave in the Autumn.

[bots]

i don't see it as any different from the smoking ban in public places. It amounts to the same thing. Smokers were putting others health at risk now those not wearing masks are doing the same

[AnnieK]

i don't see it as any different from the smoking ban in public places. It amounts to the same thing. Smokers were putting others health at risk now those not wearing masks are doing the same

Agreed. I was talking to my dad about it (he had to shield) and he likened it to back in the 80s when they made seatbelt wearing law. He said that just about everyone he knew then kicked off saying they shouldn't be forced to wear one....now its second nature to get in and belt up. Hopefully people will see that this is the right thing to do for safety and will just do it

[Ammi]

The annoying thing with people who are refusing to wear the fave coverings is that when you wear them they actually protect other people more than the wearer so if they are refusing to wear one it is other people, rather than themselves that they are putting at risk. Its not a big ask to cover your nose and mouth with a piece of cloth just when you're in a shop. People who have been shielding have not been able to leave their homes at all for 16 weeks....they have borne the isolation from family and friends and boredom and loneliness and now want to be safe when they venture to the shops. Don't take away that freedom for them by risking a second, more severe wave in the Autumn.

...I would do anything for life..(...to help preserve it..)...but I won’t do that..?....

srEe6K34DVo

[Beso]

Things just dont make sense to me..

I'm out in the van today and I've passed 2a learner drivers sat with the instructor in a car with the windows up and no face coverings...surely that is more dangerous than a supermarket!

[AnnieK]

Things just dont make sense to me..

I'm out in the van today and I've passed 2a learner drivers sat with the instructor in a car with the windows up and no face coverings...surely that is more dangerous than a supermarket!

My friends husband is a driving instructor and he said all instructors and learners should wear correct PPE. They have to talk when facing forward, not face to face, no air con but the vehicle must be ventilated, no handshakes and the car sanitised between each learner taking extra care where anyone could touch. The ones you have seen are obviously not following the rules. Every learner I have spotted round here have had masks on

[The Slim Reaper]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">BREAKING:<br><br>SAGE called for cloth face coverings on 21st April, less than 2 weeks after we published our BMJ paper and others published similar (<a href="https://twitter.com/KKCheng4?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@KKCheng4</a> in Lancet &amp; <a href="https://twitter.com/Babak_Javid_Lab?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@Babak_Javid_Lab</a> in BMJ).<br><br>Government ignored its own advisory body for *11 weeks*. <a href="https://t.co/b51Y8J0OyY">https://t.co/b51Y8J0OyY</a></p>&mdash; Trisha Greenhalgh 😷 #BlackLivesMatter (@trishgreenhalgh) <a href="https://twitter.com/trishgreenhalgh/status/1283846427815354369?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 16, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Tom4784]

Someone else's stupidity in not wearing a mask when they should doesn't justify selfishness in not wearing a mask in shops.

[Smithy]

I saw a good analogy on Twitter that said during the Blitz people were told to turn their lights off to stop germans bombing them, nobody turned round and said “it’s my right to keep my lights ON”

[Nicky91]

imagine those against face masks bringing up something silly as ''civil rights''

it is either you wearing a face mask, or you stay at home and never leave your home

[James]

Things just dont make sense to me..

I'm out in the van today and I've passed 2a learner drivers sat with the instructor in a car with the windows up and no face coverings...surely that is more dangerous than a supermarket!

My friends husband is a driving instructor and he said all instructors and learners should wear correct PPE. They have to talk when facing forward, not face to face, no air con but the vehicle must be ventilated, no handshakes and the car sanitised between each learner taking extra care where anyone could touch. The ones you have seen are obviously not following the rules. Every learner I have spotted round here have had masks on

If you cover your nose it can cause your glasses to steam up, which isn't a good idea for driving.

[Beso]

imagine those against face masks bringing up something silly as ''civil rights''

it is either you wearing a face mask, or you stay at home and never leave your home

So you would force someone with underlying health conditions to wear a mask even though it could kill them and if they refused you would have them starve at home, yeah?

[AnnieK]

So you would force someone with underlying health conditions to wear a mask even though it could kill them and if they refused you would have them starve at home, yeah?

There are exemptions though for people who are unable to physically wear a mask. The people I have seen saying they won't wear them is not because of medical issues, its because they don't want to.

You do not need to wear a face covering if you have a legitimate reason not to. This includes:

young children under the age of 11
not being able to put on, wear or remove a face covering because of a physical or mental illness or impairment, or disability
if putting on, wearing or removing a face covering will cause you severe distress
if you are travelling with or providing assistance to someone who relies on lip reading to communicate
to avoid harm or injury, or the risk of harm or injury, to yourself or others
to avoid injury, or to escape a risk of harm, and you do not have a face covering with you
to eat or drink, but only if you need to
to take medication
if a police officer or other official requests you remove your face covering

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own

[Cherie]

Things just dont make sense to me..

I'm out in the van today and I've passed 2a learner drivers sat with the instructor in a car with the windows up and no face coverings...surely that is more dangerous than a supermarket!

They are both meant to be wearing face coverings

[Cherie]

I went to get my haircut today and the stylist came at me to put the gown on with no face covering, I told her I would put the gown on myself I hate all that helping with the gown anyway, then she led me to a chair, when I asked where her visor was, she said she had it when she was with clients, I said you are with one now :shrug: and off she went and got it...they haven been open that long to get complacent in my book :fist:

[Nicky91]

So you would force someone with underlying health conditions to wear a mask even though it could kill them and if they refused you would have them starve at home, yeah?

:umm2:

no, i'd say provide them with food, medical supplies, put that in front of their frontdoor

those people need extra care in crisis times like these

[Tom4784]

Masks have been proven not to affect breathing so for the vast majority of people, it shouldn't be a problem.

If the average person is whining about wearing a mask, they're just being a tart about it.

[Beso]

Masks have been proven not to affect breathing so for the vast majority of people, it shouldn't be a problem.

If the average person is whining about wearing a mask, they're just being a tart about it.

Mask dont effect breathing.. what kind of pish is this .

of course they restrict breathing somewhat or there would be no point in bloody wearing one if they didnt.

[Tom4784]

Mask dont effect breathing.. what kind of pish is this .

of course they restrict breathing somewhat or there would be no point in bloody wearing one if they didnt.

https://i.redd.it/smxl1viua6b51.png

It's quite simple, they don't block O2 particles but they help block out far larger Covid particles.

There's no reason for the average person to not wear a mask, it's ignorant, selfish and childish not to.

[The Slim Reaper]

Mask dont effect breathing.. what kind of pish is this .

of course they restrict breathing somewhat or there would be no point in bloody wearing one if they didnt.

They restrict the propulsion of your lurgy, they don't affect your breathing. How many surgeons have you ever heard of that had to be carried out of an operating theatre due to breathing difficulties caused by masks?

[user104658]

They don't physically restrict breathing so the argument that it "could kill you" is just nonsense.

The only valid reason someone might not wear one is if they have an intellectual or learning disability that means they are unable to understand why they need to keep it on and keep touching or removing it (which would be worse than not wearing one at all). My youngest obviously doesn't understand about Covid or infection control for example. Thankfully she is a little copycat so if her sister is wearing one, she would be furious about NOT also wearing one. Not that they come in shops often anyway these days, just if they need to use the bathroom etc.

There are also people who have panic disorders that are triggered by having something covering their face. I have sympathy for that too. BUT it's very rare and the number of people claiming they can't handle it is ridiculous. Feeling a bit uncomfortable/anxious is not the same thing AT ALL as a full-scale panic disorder ffs.

People are just unwilling and being defiant to be honest. Won't try it at all, or won't try various different options etc. For example, my wife (being in community healthcare) has a stash of disposable masks in her car; I find them absolutely awful to wear. They make me feel claustrophobic and they make my face itch. But I have my own cloth masks (decent quality ones) that are fine, don't even notice that I'm wearing one after a few minutes.

[user104658]

Mask dont effect breathing.. what kind of pish is this .

of course they restrict breathing somewhat or there would be no point in bloody wearing one if they didnt.Covid-19 is not an airborne virus, you catch it from droplets and particles. The air passes through, the droplets and particles are blocked.

[user104658]

On the psych side they can make you FEEL like they restrict your breathing because instinctually, if something is covering your nose and mouth, you want to remove it to be "on the safe side". It makes you anxious, you subconsciously start breathing heavily, and that's what makes it feel like it's hard to breathe. If you relax and breathe normally you're fine. It's a mind over matter thing.

Think of "Jimmy" in independence day (Will Smith's pilot friend). He's panicking and feels like he can't breathe, instinctively pulls off his mask (oxygen mask for pilots at altitude) and Will Smith is like "Put your mask back on! Jimmy! Jimmy nooooooOOoooOoOooo!!".... *ahem*... So yeah anyway it's the same principle. Jimmy could breathe with the mask on, Jimmy needed to keep his mask on, Jimmy panicked and felt restricted and pulled his mask off (not really realistic that a trained airforce pilot would to that, but creative license and all that) when actually he just needed to keep it on and breathe normally. Jimmy died :(

Its the same principle.

[Beso]

Well I've had a mask on all day and when I breath in the mask goes in my mouth, when I breath out I get a blast of hot air across my lips and nose..

So somethings stopping it flowing normally.

[The Slim Reaper]

Parmy's a mouth breather :laugh:

[Beso]

And it's done it again when I sighed just now..

[user104658]

Well I've had a mask on all day and when I breath in the mask goes in my mouth, when I breath out I get a blast of hot air across my lips and nose..

So somethings stopping it flowing normally.It's true though, the mask shouldn't go in your mouth when you breathe in because there's no reason you need to be breathing through your mouth when breathing normally :think:. The hot air across your nose and lips when breathing out is uncomfortable, yes, but the amount that could be trapped in a small mask is miniscule - certainly not a lungful - when you next breathe in, the air you're getting is coming from outside the mask. Air being warm doesn't mean it has less oxygen in it. Again its a psychological thing - a nice crisp breath of fresh air "feels" like better quality air but it doesn't have any more oxygen in it.

Like hydration, I guess. A cold glass of water with ice feels AMAZING when you're thirsty, feels like it combats the thirst much better. It doesn't actually hydrate you any better than a glass of tepid water. Or even a glass of hot water.

[Beso]

Ok, I will wear a bloody mask in the shop

[MTVN]

Ok, I will wear a bloody mask in the shop

I too have caved and purchased a £3.99 reusable one today

[GoldHeart]

Let's all be honest , government was more worried about the economy than people's health and well-being.

They make wearing masks compulsory because they don't know how else to control this .

[user104658]

Let's all be honest , government was more worried about the economy than people's health and well-being.



They make wearing masks compulsory because they don't know how else to control this .It's the only preventative measure that has no direct impact economically so I think they understandably hope it's very effective (and we all should). My worry would be that if it proves to be not enough on its own, they're still going to be hesitant to go back into a major lockdown. But then I also think another major lockdown would be an economic catastrophe, so...

Again to bring back ye olde argument; it's not just about "choosing between the two", major impacts to the economy will affect people's health and wellbeing. At the very least, I seriously hope that any future lockdown doesn't include closing "non-essential" medical services... Because there's no such thing and the knock-on effects have been awful.

[The Slim Reaper]

Let's all be honest , government was more worried about the economy than people's health and well-being.

They make wearing masks compulsory because they don't know how else to control this .

SAGE recommended masks in April.

[Dogeatdog]

I’m quite surprised they took so long to make this compulsory in shops. I’ve just bought some new reusable masks instead of having to wear the other cheap ones they provided for us. At the store I work at, they’ve said that all colleagues must wear a mask when on the shop floor at all times. The only time you can remove them is if your out the back in the warehouse or manning the tills because we have the screens up.

They also said that we aren’t allowed to challenge people that are not wearing a mask so I’m guessing that if they are caught by police in the shop not wearing one, then it’s that persons own fault which I think is fair.

[Beso]

I too have caved and purchased a £3.99 reusable one today



They do get foostie if you dont wash them..

I think I might pop down poundland with my ys over my head tomorrow, just to test the waters.:cheer2:

[Beso]

Someone needs to be checking about the worlds governments either making these masks themselves.....or



Or they have bought far too many panicking thier knickers into a twist that they have to make some cash back before I buy one out my own pocket.

[Beso]

I’m quite surprised they took so long to make this compulsory in shops. I’ve just bought some new reusable masks instead of having to wear the other cheap ones they provided for us. At the store I work at, they’ve said that all colleagues must wear a mask when on the shop floor at all times. The only time you can remove them is if your out the back in the warehouse or manning the tills because we have the screens up.

They also said that we aren’t allowed to challenge people that are not wearing a mask so I’m guessing that if they are caught by police in the shop not wearing one, then it’s that persons own fault which I think is fair.

:dance::dance:
Your bottom paragraph.
And that is where I shall take it up with cuntstable whomever

[GoldHeart]

SAGE recommended masks in April.

But it wasn't compulsory until now, wearing masks in shops should of been compulsory from the beginning.

[joeysteele]

A little off topic.
Although related.

I was in a Store tonight for a few things.
A couple were in front of me at the checkout, the lady had a mask on, her husband none.

I heard her husband say, she'd be shopping on her own next week as masks had to be worn.
She replied, she bet if he could go and see his team playing a football match but had to wear a mask that he would.

He stated, he certainly would then.

Unbelievable.

[Beso]

Sounds like you were encroaching thier personal space to me...

[joeysteele]

Sounds like you were encroaching thier personal space to me...

You think you can't hear what people are saying from 2 metres away.
Really!!!
How utterly pathetic a point.

We've all been told even when having people in our gardens, to maintain the 2 metre distancing then.
Do you actually think no one could hear what others were saying then too, unless they were nearer.

Or is it that more, what I posted showed a ridiculously selective point as to some making noises against wearing masks, when they'd have no objection really, if it suited them for another scenario than shopping.

Really though.
You actually think people can't be heard talking when 2 metres apart.
It's only 6 and a half feet apart.
Window cleaners doing upstairs windows can hear what the other is saying holding onto the ladder at the bottom.

Good grief, I'd be worried about that if I was you.

At home I can be in the kitchen and hear my family talking in another room, far more than 2 metres apart as they can me.

Just saying that to highlight how daft your criticism and getting at someone really was.

[James]

Prince back in 1995 on Top of the Pops.

-qHECgP24_w

[bots]

Top tip if you wear glasses like me. Put your glasses on after you put on your mask and they don't steam up :smug:

[Niamh.]

Compulsory in Ireland from today

[Niamh.]

Stole this from Facebook, so much sense

Rubberbandits
32 m ·
I wonder are there construction workers who think that mandatory hard hats are a global totalitarian conspiracy ? Or do they just realise that building sites are dangerous and hard hats keep themselves and others safe?

[user104658]

Stole this from Facebook, so much sense

Rubberbandits
32 m ·
I wonder are there construction workers who think that mandatory hard hats are a global totalitarian conspiracy ? Or do they just realise that building sites are dangerous and hard hats keep themselves and others safe?

It's not even a bad comparison because building sites and building work is hot & sweaty, and hard hats are somewhat uncomfortable and can result in an itchy + sweaty head.

That said, to be balanced, the risk of getting a head injury on a building site with no hardhat is probably significantly higher than the risk of getting Covid without a mask (in the UK, currently).

Part of the problem is simply that people are NOTORIOUSLY bad at accurately assessing risk... it's actually been studied. We're **** at it and should just listen to the stats and experts because our "gut feelings" are usually way off :joker:

[Niamh.]

It's not even a bad comparison because building sites and building work is hot & sweaty, and hard hats are somewhat uncomfortable and can result in an itchy + sweaty head.

That said, to be balanced, the risk of getting a head injury on a building site with no hardhat is probably significantly higher than the risk of getting Covid without a mask (in the UK, currently).

Part of the problem is simply that people are NOTORIOUSLY bad at accurately assessing risk... it's actually been studied. We're **** at it and should just listen to the stats and experts because our "gut feelings" are usually way off :joker:

Is it though?, I wonder how many times people on building sites actually get hit on the head (or on their hard hat) (I have no idea by the way, I'm just curious)

[bots]

Is it though?, I wonder how many times people on building sites actually get hit on the head (or on their hard hat) (I have no idea by the way, I'm just curious)

the whole safety package of boots, gloves, glasses and hat saves an awful lot of serious injuries. I've been in places where they have a counter of serious injuries that week and it was never zero

[user104658]

Is it though?, I wonder how many times people on building sites actually get hit on the head (or on their hard hat) (I have no idea by the way, I'm just curious)

I think the risk from falling objects etc. might be relatively high and that on most building sites on most days there will be various minor injuries but that's just a guess! The Covid risk on the average trip to the supermarket as things are NOW is obviously very low even with no mask, it would be unlikely to even walk past someone who has it let alone catch it, but obviously the masks are there for good reason to try to remove even that tiny risk.

If it's somewhere like the US then it's a much more direct comparison because frankly the risk of catching it there is already moderate, and rising alarmingly.

[Niamh.]

the whole safety package of boots, gloves, glasses and hat saves an awful lot of serious injuries. I've been in places where they have a counter of serious injuries that week and it was never zero

Oh I know that, Gav worked on a building site for years, I was just wondering what the stats might be on people actually getting hit on the hard hat by something. I think in its peak, catching Covid would have been a higher risk :think:

[Ammi]

...I will wear a mask, obviously I will...but so far as supermarkets specifically are concerned...in my experience the mask wearers are the ones who’ve been coming really close and leaning over me...like the mask has given them some kind of super powers or something and social distancing doesn’t apply to them...so, I hope that doesn’t happen more and more...

[Ammi]

...I can only find this, it’s the USA though...



Each day, on average, two construction workers die of work-related injuries in the United States. In fact, one in five workplace fatalities are construction-related. The top causes of construction-related fatalities are falls, struck-by an object, electrocution and caught between objects.

[bots]

...I will wear a mask, obviously I will...but so far as supermarkets specifically are concerned...in my experience the mask wearers are the ones who’ve been coming really close and leaning over me...like the mask has given them some kind of super powers or something and social distancing doesn’t apply to them...so, I hope that doesn’t happen more and more...

yep, thats my biggest worry, there is no substitute for the 2 metre distance. The fact that they are saying no masks in offices is precisely for the reason that they know keeping the 2 metre distance is a must over an extended period, masks just arent good enough

[Ammi]

yep, thats my biggest worry, there is no substitute for the 2 metre distance. The fact that they are saying no masks in offices is precisely for the reason that they know keeping the 2 metre distance is a must over an extended period, masks just arent good enough

...(..I had read or heard on the tv, I can’t recall which...)...that the risk was higher with fleeting contact with lots of people, as in supermarkets/shopping...which doesn’t apply to your workplace office and in school etc because you’re with the same people each day...I know many work places who can’t keep a 2 metre distance and obviously schools can’t, it’s just not possible...but we’re being told that it’s the same colleagues each day, so....

[user104658]

Anecdotally, I don't think there's any question that people have relaxed on the social distancing with masks. BUT - I also think it was slipping quite significantly before the masks, so that's another part of the equation... is it a cause of it slipping, or has it only accelerated the inevitable? And if it's the latter, then obviously, masks are now PROVEN to mitigate a fairly large proportion of the risk even at < 2m. Passing someone in a shop isn't the same as sharing an office space, the risk of catching it that way was already far lower (even with no measures at all).

[Niamh.]

...I can only find this, it’s the USA though...



Each day, on average, two construction workers die of work-related injuries in the United States. In fact, one in five workplace fatalities are construction-related. The top causes of construction-related fatalities are falls, struck-by an object, electrocution and caught between objects.

I do wonder how their health and safety regulations compare to this side of the world though. Gav said that when they did their training in the Fire Brigade that they looked at the USA Fire Service sometimes, and they were very lax when it came to safety rules and procedures compared to Ireland and the UK for example

[user104658]

...(..I had read or heard on the tv, I can’t recall which...)...that the risk was higher with fleeting contact with lots of people, as in supermarkets/shopping...which doesn’t apply to your workplace office and in school etc because you’re with the same people each day...I know many work places who can’t keep a 2 metre distance and obviously schools can’t, it’s just not possible...but we’re being told that it’s the same colleagues each day, so....

That varies based on percentage of population infected, the risk is higher when in contact with more people because of the higher chance that one of them has it... but being in prolonged contact with someone who DOES have it is (far) worse than fleetingly passing 10 people who have it. Currently, the chances of brushing past someone who has it (in the uk) is actually very low.

[bots]

Anecdotally, I don't think there's any question that people have relaxed on the social distancing with masks. BUT - I also think it was slipping quite significantly before the masks, so that's another part of the equation... is it a cause of it slipping, or has it only accelerated the inevitable? And if it's the latter, then obviously, masks are now PROVEN to mitigate a fairly large proportion of the risk even at < 2m. Passing someone in a shop isn't the same as sharing an office space, the risk of catching it that way was already far lower (even with no measures at all).

ive had a couple of deliveries where they stood right at the door. As I had a cam on them I was able to watch and tell them to back off from the door :laugh:

[user104658]

ive had a couple of deliveries where they stood right at the door. As I had a cam on them I was able to watch and tell them to back off from the door :laugh:

I'm not that arsed about deliveries from local places. If the person delivering it has Covid then there's a good chance the person who made the food has it two, meaning keeping a distance from the delivery driver is probably a bit pointless :joker:. I suppose I should always consider that *I* might have it though, and if they get it from me then it could go to everyone in the area who just wanted a curry :worry:.

*edit* Just noticed you didn't even say "food deliveries". I must be hungry :laugh:

[bots]

I'm not that arsed about deliveries from local places. If the person delivering it has Covid then there's a good chance the person who made the food has it two, meaning keeping a distance from the delivery driver is probably a bit pointless :joker:. I suppose I should always consider that *I* might have it though, and if they get it from me then it could go to everyone in the area who just wanted a curry :worry:.

*edit* Just noticed you didn't even say "food deliveries". I must be hungry :laugh:

one was Asda .. who wanted to come in the house with the bags ... i told him to **** right off ... the other was DPD who i gave the evil eye too

Thats the point ... if they do 100 deliveries a day and are up close with everyone ... thats 100 chances they have to catch it from someone else if they don't distance .... i truly believe people are just basically stupid

[Ammi]

That varies based on percentage of population infected, the risk is higher when in contact with more people because of the higher chance that one of them has it... but being in prolonged contact with someone who DOES have it is (far) worse than fleetingly passing 10 people who have it. Currently, the chances of brushing past someone who has it (in the uk) is actually very low.

...but that’s the whole point though, if there is dishonesty then I can see why some are being difficult about wearing them...I don’t agree to not wearing one but i do see both sides...for instance, I’ll just say schools because obviously that’s applied to me more...there have been more children attending but in September it will be a full house, it has to be and most school staff want it to be..so no issue...?...but I wish the government would just be honest and say...ughhhh, we just have to have normality...because we do...instead of saying, oh you’ll be in that same class of children all day so there’s very little risk....which is just not true...their dishonesty is more frustrating for me than the virus is...

[user104658]

...but that’s the whole point though, if there is dishonesty then I can see why some are being difficult about wearing them...I don’t agree to not wearing one but i do see both sides...for instance, I’ll just say schools because obviously that’s applied to me more...there have been more children attending but in September it will be a full house, it has to be and most school staff want it to be..so no issue...?...but I wish the government would just be honest and say...ughhhh, we just have to have normality...because we do...instead of saying, oh you’ll be in that same class of children all day so there’s very little risk....which is just not true...their dishonesty is more frustrating for me than the virus is...

I agree with that Ammi, I wish they would just say "look guys ideally we'd all just stick with distancing for the long term but in practical terms the country is going to collapse so masks are our best option for a half-way point".

They don't think people will accept a compromise though and I'm not sure I even really blame them there, people have not done a good job in recent years in suggesting that they can comprehend or accept shades of gray, they will push HARD for a simple black-or-white answer and that makes honesty quite difficult. When is the honest truth ever easy to swallow?

[Ammi]

I agree with that Ammi, I wish they would just say "look guys ideally we'd all just stick with distancing for the long term but in practical terms the country is going to collapse so masks are our best option for a half-way point".

They don't think people will accept a compromise though and I'm not sure I even really blame them there, people have not done a good job in recent years in suggesting that they can comprehend or accept shades of gray, they will push HARD for a simple black-or-white answer and that makes honesty quite difficult. When is the honest truth ever easy to swallow?

...I’m not sure, I think the majority know the truth of it anyway...we’ve had so much information over the last few months that people know why industry is opening/why schools will be fully open etc...I honestly think there would be less resistance or reluctance if that honesty was shown because most understand, ‘normality’ has to return as much as possible...it’s that dishonesty that’s causing the confusion, which leads to resistance/reluctance and refusal...comprehension comes from honesty and that’s a basic principle we all know ...if we lied to our children, we could expect ‘bad behaviour‘ when their trust and belief is let down...

[James]

Top tip if you wear glasses like me. Put your glasses on after you put on your mask and they don't steam up :smug:

Three tips to stop glasses steaming up when wearing a mask.

Video - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/newsbeat-53406105/how-to-stop-your-glasses-steaming-up-with-a-mask-on or https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=1129800070728286

[Vanessa]

I already wear them when I go into any shop.

[Cherie]

The WHO only updated guidance on 8th June!

June 8, 2020 -- The World Health Organization has changed its stance on wearing face masks during the COVID-19 pandemic.People over 60 and people with underlying medical conditions should wear a medical-grade mask when they’re in public and cannot socially distance, the WHO said. The general public should wear a three-layer fabric mask in those situations.

The WHO also updated their advice for medical workers, saying all of them should always wear a medical mask while in clinical areas, not just people working with COVID-19 patients.

The organization had previously said there wasn’t enough medical evidence to support members of the public wearing a mask, unless they were sick or around people with the coronavirus. The widespread wearing of masks might lead to a mask shortage for medical workers and create a false sense of security in the public, WHO officials had said.

WHO Director General Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, speaking Friday during a media briefing in Geneva, said WHO’s stance was based on new research.

"In areas with widespread transmission, the WHO advises medical masks for all people working in clinical areas of a health facility, not only workers dealing with patients with COVID-19," Tedros said, according to CNN.

"Second, in areas with community transmission, we advise that people aged 60 years or over, or those with underlying conditions, should wear a medical mask in situations where physical distancing is not possible," Tedros said.

Third, he said, "WHO advises that governments should encourage the general public to wear masks where there is widespread transmission and physical distancing is difficult, such as on public transport, in shops or in other confined or crowded environments."

The WHO guidance says people can make their own three-layer masks by using an inner layer of an absorbent material, such as cotton or cotton blends; a middle layer made of a non-woven material polypropylene or cotton to enhance filtration of droplets; and an outer layer of a non-absorbent material such polypropylene, polyester, or their blends. Stretchy, porous materials should be avoided.

The WHO guidance says masks should only be worn by one person and should be changed if soiled or wet. Masks should be washed at high temperatures or, if hot water is not available, boiled for one minute.

Wearing masks isn’t enough to protect a person from the virus, the WHO said.

“The use of a mask alone is insufficient to provide an adequate level of protection or source control, and other personal and community level measures should also be adopted to suppress transmission of respiratory viruses,” the WHO said.

[bots]

yeah, i have medical grade masks, not sure if it will make any real difference, but i would rather get something that at least pretends to be quality

[user104658]

The only major concern I have is that it might make people forget to hand-wash / use sanitiser which is still actually the MOST important thing to be doing. The virus is far more often transmitted through touch (getting it on your hands then touching your face) than through the air.

[Jessica.]

The only major concern I have is that it might make people forget to hand-wash / use sanitiser which is still actually the MOST important thing to be doing. The virus is far more often transmitted through touch (getting it on your hands then touching your face) than through the air.You're supposed to wash your hands before putting the mask on and after taking it off though.

[user104658]

You're supposed to wash your hands before putting the mask on and after taking it off though.

On that front, I imagine very few people will actually do that. Maybe a quick blast of hand sanitizer on the way into a shop.

[James]

How are you supposed to wash your hands when you are out and about?

[bots]

there are more and more sanitation stations around, but i just think of public loos and how washing your hands there is not a germ free experience

[Niamh.]

there are more and more sanitation stations around, but i just think of public loos and how washing your hands there is not a germ free experience

Definitely best to avoid unless an emergency imo

[Ammi]

...I wonder if gloves having to be worn will be something that’s brought in as well.../...it’s been that way in Spain all through, that gloves are given/taken as a shop is entered...


...yesterday, obviously many people were wearing masks as expected...but quite a few were wearing them incorrectly also and wearing them pulled below the nose, which defeats the purpose completely...surely we can’t be at the stage of given information that there’s uncertainty of how to wear a mask correctly to minimise spreading....

[Nicky91]

umm hand hygiëne, and this is what we (me, my parents) had been doing even before covid

anti-bacterial wipes, which is very handy to carry with you in your purse, or also have in your car, we usually use them after grocery shopping, or basically at day out before we touch our lunch for example too

i recommend it to anyone now, however when you get home, make sure you have some hand cream since hands might be bit dry after those wipes

[Beso]

Dont use wipes. Very very bad for the planet.

[Nicky91]

Dont use wipes. Very very bad for the planet.

they are good in terms of health and safety though

[thesheriff443]

Costa coffeee,Salisbury’ and Asda have all said they they will not enforce mask wearing in their stores.

They said it’s not their responsibility to police who comes into their stores.

Yesterday I was out and there where someshops who had some one out side presumably checking.

[joeysteele]

...I wonder if gloves having to be worn will be something that’s brought in as well.../...it’s been that way in Spain all through, that gloves are given/taken as a shop is entered...


...yesterday, obviously many people were wearing masks as expected...but quite a few were wearing them incorrectly also and wearing them pulled below the nose, which defeats the purpose completely...surely we can’t be at the stage of given information that there’s uncertainty of how to wear a mask correctly to minimise spreading....

I always wear gloves and a mask when I head out.
Then wash them after I've been out too.
Touching nothing in shop or store, except what I'm buying.


I just think ANYTHING that may even help restrict the passing on of this virus is worth doing.
I've worn a mask and gloves since March so will as long as this takes to defeat this virus, if it ever is defeated completely that is.

I just believe in being safer than sorry.

[Ammi]

I always wear gloves and a mask when I head out.
Then wash them after I've been out too.
Touching nothing in shop or store, except what I'm buying.


I just think ANYTHING that may even help restrict the passing on of this virus is worth doing.
I've worn a mask and gloves since March so will as long as this takes to defeat this virus, if it ever is defeated completely that is.

I just believe in being safer than sorry.


...yeah I agree, Joey...if mask wearing and possibly glove wearing is the new ‘normal’ for now and into the future, then so be it, it’s a simple adaption...the virus isn't going anywhere, anytime soon so we have to adapt our daily lives to try our best to preserve life ...that’s all we can do, so much is out of our control but those easy steps aren’t...

[Beso]

Havnt worn a mask yet and havnt been challenged yet

[Cherie]

I don't see the need for gloves if people wash their hands and use the sanitiser available in the shop, the way some people discard disposable masks with no thought as to the environment or who will be be picking up their dirty mask, it would be the same with gloves so I really hope that is not the next thing introduced, it seems a bit senseless to me

[joeysteele]

...yeah I agree, Joey...if mask wearing and possibly glove wearing is the new ‘normal’ for now and into the future, then so be it, it’s a simple adaption...the virus isn't going anywhere, anytime soon so we have to adapt our daily lives to try our best to preserve life ...that’s all we can do, so much is out of our control but those easy steps aren’t...

I agree.

I found it irritating at first but to protect myself and others, I wanted to from the start to limit in any and every way possible, transmission of this virus.

It's no hardship to wash gloves after wearing them.
Nor masks.
However, it only needs to be anything like a scarf, headscarf or as I said elsewhere, someone cut the top of a hat.
Then just pull it over their nose and mouth when out..
Much like a muff on your hands.
Then washing it.

Not much needs to be thrown away regularly.
There's lots of positives to use around re-use and washing than always looking for negatives.

I don't think I've ever washed my hands more actually.
I find I do it now even when I've done nothing or been nowhere.

Not a bad habit to get into at all in my view.

[joeysteele]

I have to say too.
I popped out this morning to a Store I use.

It was fairly busy.
All staff had masks or visors on.
Not a single customer hadn't a mask or facecovering on either.

I was impressed to see that.

[arista]

Havnt worn a mask yet and havnt been challenged yet


Lucky you.

[MTVN]

Must say my estimates of 50-75% of people complying with this have proven very far off the mark, I'd say it's more like 95%

[Ramsay]

Havnt worn a mask yet and havnt been challenged yet

You're so cool

[Beso]

You're so cool

Thanks, but you ain't telling me nothing I dont know.:wavey:

[Beso]

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/naked-man-struts-along-busy-22412451

[user104658]

...yesterday, obviously many people were wearing masks as expected...but quite a few were wearing them incorrectly also and wearing them pulled below the nose, which defeats the purpose completely...surely we can’t be at the stage of given information that there’s uncertainty of how to wear a mask correctly to minimise spreading....

I have actually heard that - while not ideal - wearing a mask over the mouth only is still far better than not wearing one at all, at least in terms of protecting others. Most of the infection comes from droplets and those come from the mouth. Far less protective for the wearer. But I guess that's their choice to an extent.

[Ammi]

I have actually heard that - while not ideal - wearing a mask over the mouth only is still far better than not wearing one at all, at least in terms of protecting others. Most of the infection comes from droplets and those come from the mouth. Far less protective for the wearer. But I guess that's their choice to an extent.

...unless that person sneezes near you...:laugh:...

[Tom4784]

People who refuse to wear masks are utter children. It's utter selfishness and it's pathetic.

Wear a mask in shops or stay the **** home.

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/card_img/1286943351393210369/iTKPLH7T?format=jpg&name=900x900

[user104658]

...unless that person sneezes near you...[emoji23]...Most sneeze particles come out of your mouth Ammi, if a sneeze came out of your nose the sinus pressure would pop your eyeballs out of their sockets :joker:.

[Ammi]

Most sneeze particles come out of your mouth Ammi, if a sneeze came out of your nose the sinus pressure would pop your eyeballs out of their sockets :joker:.

....ooops..:laugh:..

[user104658]

People who refuse to wear masks are utter children. It's utter selfishness and it's pathetic.

Wear a mask in shops or stay the **** home.This is sort of my view on it. People can debate effectiveness etc. and there's certainly a discussion to be had there but... It's such a small thing to have to do. It's barely an inconvenience, take the time to try out a few and find one that fits well (as admittedly, as a tall male, I had issues with them riding both up my chin AND down my nose) and after a whole you barely even notice you're wearing them.

So I just think even for those who are skeptical about them, why NOT wear one just in case? Why the defiance? It feels like "teenage rebellion" stuff... Just "I don't wanna because I'm being told I hafta" and that is just childish :shrug:.

Surely the only adult responses are either "Yeah I believe it'll help so I'll do it" or "I don't really know how effective this is... but whatever its not a big deal".

[user104658]

....ooops..[emoji23]..You did remind me that in a school assembly, a girl sat near me and my friend tried to hold in a sneeze, it came out her nose and shotgun-blasted a huge blob of green snot (HUGE blob) on the person sat in front. All up his back. Me and my friend were kicked out assembly because we we had completely lost it, I could barely breathe with laughing. Ahh good times though.

These days it would be a full on biohazard, they'd have to evacuate the school [emoji23].

[bots]

the royal society of nose pickers is not happy :sad:

[Ammi]

You did remind me that in a school assembly, a girl sat near me and my friend tried to hold in a sneeze, it came out her nose and shotgun-blasted a huge blob of green snot (HUGE blob) on the person sat in front. All up his back. Me and my friend were kicked out assembly because we we had completely lost it, I could barely breathe with laughing. Ahh good times though.

These days it would be a full on biohazard, they'd have to evacuate the school [emoji23].

..yeah can you imagine...it would be like something you would see in a movie when a ‘clean up team’ would be brought in within a few moments and with one phone call...


...(...that reminds me of this scene actually..)...

UQNpboSz_6o

[Kizzy]

I met someone yesterday that thinks it's a covid conspiracy his aunt who is a 76yr old ex district nurse was diagnosed with Covid and the worry made her more ill with the stress of having covid... he didn't believe it was an accurate test.

This is what we're dealing with people. ...:/

[James]

I read recently that it is a bad idea to hold in a sneeze.

[Kizzy]

I read recently that it is a bad idea to hold in a sneeze.

My mum says you could bust a blood vessel :/

[Ammi]

My mum says you could bust a blood vessel :/

...I think that your mum was right, Kizzy...also it’s possible to rupture an eardrum through holding in a sneeze...as Elsa (..and your mum would say...)...Let it Go....

[Dogeatdog]

Noticed quite a fair few customers in work haven’t really bothered to wear masks. The thing is though is that we aren’t allowed to challenge them but I do find it a little selfish still I mean, they’ve only got to wear one for about 5-10 mins as opposed to us who have to wear them for 6-8 hours.

[user104658]

...I think that your mum was right, Kizzy...also it’s possible to rupture an eardrum through holding in a sneeze...as Elsa (..and your mum would say...)...Let it Go....My wife always has a go at me for what she calls "performative dad-sneezes". I fully DENY the allegations that I try to make them as unreasonably loud and silly as possible.