Labour pays out six-figure sum and apologises.....

[Livia]

The Labour party has apologised “unreservedly” and paid out a six-figure sum to seven former employees and a veteran BBC journalist, admitting it defamed them in the aftermath of a Panorama investigation into its handling of antisemitism.

The settlement and formal apologies to both the reporter, John Ware, and the ex-employees, which have been read in open court, is believed to have cost the Labour party between £600,000 and £750,000, with about £200,000 in damages agreed for the eight individuals.

The settlement is believed to be an unprecedented case of a political party libelling a journalist and former employees.

Labour conceded it had made defamatory and false allegations against the litigants in the light of their interview with the Panorama programme Is Labour Antisemitic?, broadcast last July.It agreed to retract and withdraw accusations that the whistleblowers were motivated by their opposition to the party’s former leader Jeremy Corbyn and had “political axes to grind” and its accusation that Ware had conducted a “deliberate and malicious misrepresentations designed to mislead the public”.

In a four-page agreement statement made in relation to the former staff’s libel action read out in court 37 of the high court, it said: “The Labour party is here today to publicly set the record straight, and to apologise to the claimants for the distress and embarrassment that it has caused them.”

To Ware, it said in a three-page statement: “The defendant is here today to set the record straight and to apologise unreservedly to Mr Ware.”

Both statements disclosed that “substantial damages” were being paid out while at the same time pointedly referring to the Labour party being led by Corbyn at the time the libel occurred. The apology was handed down after Corbyn and his former head of communications, Seumas Milne, sought legal advice over its wording. Allies of Corbyn believe the case could have been successfully contested.

Louise Withers-Green, one of the whistleblowers who worked in the party’s complaints department, said the former employees had endured a torrent of abuse since the programme had aired.

“It feels like it is closing a chapter where the libel against us has been retracted, but this is only a first step for the party in beginning to tackle antisemitism,” she told the Guardian.

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“I had never expected the party to welcome the Panorama programme with open arms. But I had been expecting them to take responsibility in the long-term for what was happening and truly want to take action. I never expected we would be called bad faith actors.”

She added: “I didn’t see, I still don’t see, that there was another option or another route to clear my name,” she said. Most important was the apology, she said.

“I think politically the apology means a significant amount. And I think, personally, it’s certainly a turning point.”

The comprehensive apology and retraction will be read in some quarters as an attempt by the current Labour leader, Keir Starmer, to draw a line under the episode in the party’s recent history.

A Labour spokesman said the party acknowledged the “many years of dedicated and committed service to the party” that the ex-staffers had given.

“Under the leadership of Keir Starmer and Angela Rayner, we are committed to tackling antisemitism within the Labour party. Antisemitism has been a stain on the Labour party in recent years,” the spokesman said. “It has caused unacceptable and unimaginable levels of grief and distress for many in the Jewish community, as well as members of staff.

“If we are to restore the trust of the Jewish community, we must demonstrate a change of leadership. That means being open, transparent and respecting the right of whistleblowers. We are determined to deliver that change.”

In the programme, eight whistleblowers, seven of whom then sued the party, broke non-disclosure agreements to tell the BBC that they felt fatally undermined by senior Labour bosses in their attempts to tackle antisemitism, alleging consistent interference in complaints.

The ex-staffers, Withers-Green, Sam Matthews, Kat Buckingham, Dan Hogan, Ben Westerman, Martha Robinson, and Michael Creighton, worked in the Labour party’s governance and legal unit and were responsible for investigation of allegations of misconduct by party members.

The party said it accepted that a statement put out ahead of the broadcast “contained defamatory and false allegations about the whistleblowers”, which was sent to national newspapers and broadcasters, as well as “Jeremy Corbyn-supporting blogs and websites including the Canary, Skwawkbox and Novara Media and many individuals on social media platforms”.

Labour admitted it had wrongly accused one of the whistleblowers of “making a false and malicious statement” and accusing them of acting in “bad faith” and working to harm the Labour party.

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“The Labour party acknowledges that these claims about the claimants are untrue, and we retract and withdraw them and undertake not to repeat them,” the statement said.

Lawyer Mark Lewis, of Patron Law, who represented Ware and the whistleblowers, said the case was “unprecedented”. Individual politicians had faced legal challenge by journalists they had libelled in the past, but “I cannot think of a case in which a political party was sued for libel”, he said.

“Labour chose to double down and attack the programme’s presenter, John Ware, and the whistleblowers rather than addressing the truth of the problem. It is ironic that the workers’ party chose to act as disgruntled bosses who had been caught out.”

Ware, 72, launched proceedings after being subjected to what he said was an avalanche of abuse and criticism by Corbyn supporters.

One year later, Labour admitted it had wrongly accused him of having “invented quotes, flouted journalistic ethics and that, in pursuit of a predetermined outcome to the question asked by the Panorama programme … [and] knowingly promoted falsehoods, including by misrepresentations of fact and, by fabricating facts”.

The party said it “unreservedly withdraws these allegations and is profoundly sorry for the distress caused by their publication and republication”.

Counsel for Labour, Anthony Hudson, QC, said the party also acknowledged the claims were untrue. “We retract and withdraw them, and undertake not to repeat them,” he said.

A BBC spokesperson said its journalism had been “subject to an extraordinary and vitriolic attack by the Labour party” and said the apology was long overdue.

“We applaud their strength to take this case forward and are pleased it has been recognised in court that these extremely serious and damaging allegations against them were false and have been unreservedly withdrawn. John Ware is a reporter with an extraordinary record of excellence at Panorama for investigative journalism in the public interest.”

Labour is awaiting the final publication findings of the Equality and Human Rights Commission’s (EHRC) investigation into allegations of institutional antisemitism. The party revealed this week it had received a draft of the report.

Many of the key individuals involved during the period under investigation, including the former general secretary Jennie Formby, Corbyn’s chief of staff, Karie Murphy, the head of complaints, Thomas Gardiner, and the director of communications, Milne, have now left their roles at the party.

The party is also set for further potentially damaging recriminations over a leaked internal report that detailed a “hyper-factional” environment that hampered complaints procedures because of hostility to Corbyn’s leadership.

Several of the whistleblowers involved in Panorama were named in the report, which is the subject of an independent review chaired by the QC Martin Forde.

In the statements read in court on Wednesday, the party said its apology in both cases was not intended to have any influence on the EHRC or Forde’s investigation.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jul/22/labour-pays-out-six-figure-sum-and-apologises-in-antisemitism-row

[arista]

Yes John Ware
is a Guest on LBC 7PM with Ian Dale.


This was Terrible of the Labour Party
to be so Racist against British Jews.

[UserSince2005]

scandalous, can't believe this party has ever held power.

[joeysteele]

This is the issue I have had the most grievance with as to the Party.

I welcome this today, welcome these payments.
However they shouldn't have been necessary.
I really believe, there's still a long way to go to clear the Party of this, well let's call it what it is, scandal.

The Jewish communities have been grossly offended and hurt by the last few years, of negativity from a proportion of the Party that many Jewish people and families supported and felt safe with.

I've always said it had to be sorted and wasn't being so.
Although not every Jewish individual saw things as the media and opponents presented.

This is shocking.
Labour has to and I'm sure will now address this issue and deep hurt to Jewish communities.
I'm also sure, they will implement in full any and all recommendations of this investigation of the Party too.
Under Keir Starmer.
Although I do hold deep sadness, those on the front bench did NOT force much earlier action against this unacceptable prejudice and/ or persecution of any Jewish members, supporters or communities.

I remain resolved too, that if this investigation finds that Labour is near completely riddled all through with antisemitism, then my membership will be ended.

That will be sad obviously as I believe a far more compassionately as to social policies party is vital at this time for ALL communities.

I do believe Starmer is determined to eradicate any antisemitism.
These so called whistleblowers, not the term I'd use for those who'd witnessed any wrongdoing.
I'm glad they have apologies and more.
It's a disgrace it's had to reach this point really.

[bots]

i think it shows the difference it makes who is leader of the party. Corbyn allowed feelings to fester, Stammer does not. It starts to make labour an electable party again

[Livia]

i think it shows the difference it makes who is leader of the party. Corbyn allowed feelings to fester, Stammer does not. It starts to make labour an electable party again

I agree. I think it's very important to have a strong opposition right now, and equally as important for Labour to have got its ducks back in a row before the next general election.

[arista]

Ch4HD news giving a Great Long Report.
Showing How Corbyn is still at it.

[DouglasS]

Can’t say I’m Surprised by this news

[Crimson Dynamo]

And to think this man could have been voted in and was supported on9 this forum...

Chilling

[Kizzy]

And there was no counter claim?...because clearly the labour party is not antisemitic.

[Livia]

And there was no counter claim?...because clearly the labour party is not antisemitic.



That'll be why they paid out all that money. And that'll be why a statement from the Party said "“Under the leadership of Keir Starmer and Angela Rayner, we are committed to tackling antisemitism within the Labour party. Antisemitism has been a stain on the Labour party in recent years,” the spokesman said. “It has caused unacceptable and unimaginable levels of grief and distress for many in the Jewish community, as well as members of staff." I'm not a massive supporter of Sir Kier, but he's head and shoulders above the last old Soviet nostalgist.

And yet still some in the Labour party are in denial.

[Liam-]

A political decision seeing as all labour lawyers said they’d more than likely win the case, it’s Keir’s way of further distancing himself from Corbyn, a wise decision seeing as people have been whipped into an unfettered frenzy over him, he’s a good leader, it’s just a shame he’s bending over backwards to appeal to the easily duped and the scaremongering elites in the process, if it gets the Tories out though idec, that’s the main priority

[Oliver_W]

I like Sir Kier but I agree this was him saying "I'm not Corbyn, and the things you didn't like about his time are over".

I'm not saying the decision shouldn't have been made, just questioning the motives behind it.

[joeysteele]

I like Sir Kier but I agree this was him saying "I'm not Corbyn, and the things you didn't like about his time are over".

I'm not saying the decision shouldn't have been made, just questioning the motives behind it.

I think he genuinely wants to purge this scandal from the Party.

The decision was totally right..
I think his only motive is to stamp his own authority and clear out this really, for far too long, damaging issue.

Actually issue is the wrong word to use, since the incidents that have happened have hurt longtime Labour members and voters who are Jewish..
It's also hurt and left some in Jewish communities feeling hurt and betrayed..

Apologies and compensation for only doing the right thing, after being wrongly attacked for doing so, are all well and good.
However, I want any anti-semitism in the Labour party or in any other party.
Wiped out permanently.

All anti-semitism is a disgrace, and this I can believe is Starmer's aim and my hope too, that he will show his full worth on this by eradicating that scandal once and for all.

[The Slim Reaper]

I think he genuinely wants to purge this scandal from the Party.

The decision was totally right..
I think his only motive is to stamp his own authority and clear out this really, for far too long, damaging issue.

Actually issue is the wrong word to use, since the incidents that have happened have hurt longtime Labour members and voters who are Jewish..
It's also hurt and left some in Jewish communities feeling hurt and betrayed..

Apologies and compensation for only doing the right thing, after being wrongly attacked for doing so, are all well and good.
However, I want any anti-semitism in the Labour party or in any other party.
Wiped out permanently.

All anti-semitism is a disgrace, and this I can believe is Starmer's aim and my hope too, that he will show his full worth on this by eradicating that scandal once and for all.

You will never wipe it out because it's a societal issue. Just like people will always be anti black, anti-immigrant, and anti-muslim etc. There was actually a study done that I posted in a thread on here somewhere that showed anti semitism within labour was actually lower than society as a whole. That doesn't excuse these findings, but the reframing from Corbyn is an anti semite to labour are anti semites is interesting.

I'm no fan of labour these days, and especially starmer who has slotted straight back in as a tory-lite, talking more about being tough on crime, over a citizenry decimated by austerity.

Meanwhile, all the holier-than-thous happily voted in a racist with a laundry list of his own statements proving how racist, homophobic, anti semitic, and islamophobic he is.

[Livia]

The failure to acknowledge and address the problem and to continue to deflect the issue with whataboutery is what got the Labour Party into this problem in the first place and I see it's still going strong.

[The Slim Reaper]

The failure to acknowledge and address the problem and to continue to deflect the issue with whataboutery is what got the Labour Party into this problem in the first place and I see it's still going strong.

Except I just acknowledged it, and the deflection comes from those that refuse to even acknowledge who they voted for. Racism should be stamped out in all forms; well, unless it's the tory leader, of course.

[Livia]

Except I just acknowledged it, and the deflection comes from those that refuse to even acknowledge who they voted for. Racism should be stamped out in all forms; well, unless it's the tory leader, of course.

This thread isn't about the Tory leader, It's about the anti-Semitism in the Labour party that was never really addressed until now. As you know.

People jumped to Corbyn's defence then and they'll jump to his defence now, and given your previous posts on the subject, shall we say that you and I are in totally different corners. You say you're against racism but I have to say our exchanges on the subject have painted you quite differently. So I'll leave it there.

[Livia]

I think he genuinely wants to purge this scandal from the Party.

The decision was totally right..
I think his only motive is to stamp his own authority and clear out this really, for far too long, damaging issue.

Actually issue is the wrong word to use, since the incidents that have happened have hurt longtime Labour members and voters who are Jewish..
It's also hurt and left some in Jewish communities feeling hurt and betrayed..

Apologies and compensation for only doing the right thing, after being wrongly attacked for doing so, are all well and good.
However, I want any anti-semitism in the Labour party or in any other party.
Wiped out permanently.

All anti-semitism is a disgrace, and this I can believe is Starmer's aim and my hope too, that he will show his full worth on this by eradicating that scandal once and for all.

Despite our differences I will say that Joey's stance has never changed on this. He's never deflected nor made excuses.

[The Slim Reaper]

This thread isn't about the Tory leader, It's about the anti-Semitism in the Labour party that was never really addressed until now. As you know.

People jumped to Corbyn's defence then and they'll jump to his defence now, and given your previous posts on the subject, shall we say that you and I are in totally different corners. You say you're against racism but I have to say our exchanges on the subject have painted you quite differently. So I'll leave it there.

You still can't point to one serious racist comment of mine. Not one, but it's not like making false allegations is your thing or anything.

[Livia]

You still can't point to one serious racist comment of mine. Not one, but it's not like making false allegations is your thing or anything.

I have pointed out what you said time and again. You've shown me who you are and I don't like it... so let's not waste any more of each other's time.

[The Slim Reaper]

I have pointed out what you said time and again. You've shown me who you are and I don't like it... so let's not waste any more of each other's time.

I made posts in the thread that you decided to respond to, so you can't really engage and then say I don't want to talk to you. That's nonsensical behaviour.

[Livia]

I made posts in the thread that you decided to respond to, so you can't really engage and then say I don't want to talk to you. That's nonsensical behaviour.

Is this the ten minute argument or do you want the full half hour?

[Liam-]

There were undoubtably anti-semites within the Labour Party, unfortunately they’re everywhere, in every party, in every country and they should all be dealt with accordingly, Corbyn however was not one of them and the Labour Party is not institutionally anti-Semitic, at least the Labour Party welcomed an investigation, whereas the Tories refuse to even consider an investigation into the rife racism within their party

[The Slim Reaper]

Is this the ten minute argument or do you want the full half hour?

I'm not looking for any argument. I made a post, you responded. What you really wanted, was to make a sly dig and have no one question you about it.

[Oliver_W]

Yeah I never thought Corbyn himself was antisemetic, but he was arguably a bit too tolerant of it within his party.

[joeysteele]

You will never wipe it out because it's a societal issue. Just like people will always be anti black, anti-immigrant, and anti-muslim etc. There was actually a study done that I posted in a thread on here somewhere that showed anti semitism within labour was actually lower than society as a whole. That doesn't excuse these findings, but the reframing from Corbyn is an anti semite to labour are anti semites is interesting.

I'm no fan of labour these days, and especially starmer who has slotted straight back in as a tory-lite, talking more about being tough on crime, over a citizenry decimated by austerity.

Meanwhile, all the holier-than-thous happily voted in a racist with a laundry list of his own statements proving how racist, homophobic, anti semitic, and islamophobic he is.

I accept a lot of what you say there.
However I don't believe in those seeking power in the Country, that in their parties there should be racism, xenophobia or antisemitism.

It needs to be wiped out of those parties and organisations.

Now of course, in society generally, that's harder, however there shouldn't be any tolerance at all of it surfacing in Parties putting themselves forward for election.

I believe it should and has to be eradicated.
So there I have to not agree, it cannot be.

I never have believed Labour is riddled with it, and I've been on the receiving end of personal insults as to antisemitism to myself on here.

I learned last year, it's wrong to even just try to defend yourself on here as to those inferences/ accusations and even insults.

However, forward looking is now what's needed.
I always said Corbyn needed to do more.
I think that's recognised by Starmer actually.
I don't think he is Tory- lite myself
However that's for others to make their mind up on.

I never like party leaders anyway usually.
Only one I've time for at present is Nicola Sturgeon.

As for Johnson, well I can't disagree, it's clear he holds worrying unsavoury thinking on race too.
Which slips out once he moves off this controlled script he's been given the last year or more.

I don't think he sees problems in his own party which are there too.
On many issues.

However, a full investigation into antisemitism and Labour has been done.
Which I was really glad to see take place.
I doubt it will and hope it doesn't find that the party is riddled with it.

However the fact it came about is really bad in itself.
It's recommendations,if any, must be implemented in full.
Labour at least though, then has to learn and ensure this is dealt with properly and yes, got rid of anywhere in the Party.

I'm 28, ever since I learned what it is, I've detested antisemitism.
I'll always stand against it through the rest of my life.
As I do any racism of any nature.

[Livia]

There were undoubtably anti-semites within the Labour Party, unfortunately they’re everywhere, in every party, in every country and they should all be dealt with accordingly, Corbyn however was not one of them and the Labour Party is not institutionally anti-Semitic, at least the Labour Party welcomed an investigation, whereas the Tories refuse to even consider an investigation into the rife racism within their party

Labour never had any choice but to agree to the investigation, it wasn't a choice they had. When have the Tories refused an investigation like this?

And yeah, the rest is just whataboutery.

[Livia]

Yeah I never thought Corbyn himself was antisemetic, but he was arguably a bit too tolerant of it within his party.

He enabled it. If he truly isn't an anti-Semite he had only to open his mouth say anything that wasn't a denial.

[The Slim Reaper]

He enabled it. If he truly isn't an anti-Semite he had only to open his mouth say anything that wasn't a denial.

He did.

[Livia]

I'm not looking for any argument. I made a post, you responded. What you really wanted, was to make a sly dig and have no one question you about it.

Sly dig? What was the sly dig? The fact that you didn't think there was much of a problem and prefer the old leader to the new one, or that I called the rest of your post whataboutery. Which it was.

Okay? Bye now...

[Livia]

He did.

Wow.... at last.

But you know, he hates Rangers and he hates the Jews....

[The Slim Reaper]

Wow.... at last.

But you know, he hates Rangers and he hates the Jews....

He did years ago.

Is this the quote from the dossier? :laugh:

[joeysteele]

Despite our differences I will say that Joey's stance has never changed on this. He's never deflected nor made excuses.

I want to thank you for that.
I haven't deflected.

I'm aware of the hurt and betrayal not only to Jewish MPs and members but also voters and those not Labour supporters in Jewish communities which was felt.
You, yourself too have.

The only thing to do with a wrong is put it right.
Not just attempting to by words but by all necessary action too.

Actually I feel that anti-semitism anywhere in UK politics, even moreso in Labour is that scandal I describe it as.
The decision to apologise and compensate shows already more of the action and healing needed to learn from this and rebuild trust.

[Kizzy]

That'll be why they paid out all that money. And that'll be why a statement from the Party said "“Under the leadership of Keir Starmer and Angela Rayner, we are committed to tackling antisemitism within the Labour party. Antisemitism has been a stain on the Labour party in recent years,” the spokesman said. “It has caused unacceptable and unimaginable levels of grief and distress for many in the Jewish community, as well as members of staff." I'm not a massive supporter of Sir Kier, but he's head and shoulders above the last old Soviet nostalgist.

And yet still some in the Labour party are in denial.
Denial.. Apeasement is all this is. Again labour are not and never were antisemitic.
A change in spokesperson isn't going to change that. They settled is all which neither proves or disproves anything. A nice wedge makes it all better though it seems?

The whatsapp messages are swept under the carpet also, which kind of proved the point for the accusations of smears in the first instance. This is an interesting point from novara media.

aAxWFN1DX9o

[Kizzy]

The failure to acknowledge and address the problem and to continue to deflect the issue with whataboutery is what got the Labour Party into this problem in the first place and I see it's still going strong.

By whataboutery are you referring to the opinions of the Jewish Corbyn supporters?...

The 'problem' was not addressed, they threw some money at it is all. That's the tory way, I expected better from Labour.

[Kizzy]

This thread isn't about the Tory leader, It's about the anti-Semitism in the Labour party that was never really addressed until now. As you know.

People jumped to Corbyn's defence then and they'll jump to his defence now, and given your previous posts on the subject, shall we say that you and I are in totally different corners. You say you're against racism but I have to say our exchanges on the subject have painted you quite differently. So I'll leave it there.

How do you end a thread about defamation?. ..By defaming someone of course!

[arista]

[Rapper Wiley MBE ,
dropped by management over Anti-Semitic posts]

[In one tweet he said:
"I don't care about Hitler, I care about black people",
and also compared the Jewish community to the Ku Klux Klan.]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/660/cpsprodpb/14A86/production/_113641648_hi036271084.jpg

[On Instagram, videos of himself were interspersed
with posts of screenshots - which have since
been deleted - including one at about midday on
Saturday suggesting Twitter has suspended
him from tweeting for a week.
He had already been given a 12-hour ban
on Friday night, but resumed tweeting on Saturday.]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53536471

[Kizzy]

How odd, for me saying you don't care about Hitler you hare about black people does not mean you're antisemitic... it means the two issues are not comparable :/

Would be interesting to see the rest of the tweets in context.

[arista]

1287009541947875333

[Brother Leon]

Labour still hasn’t done anything in regards to their own members and MPs bullying and racially abusing their fellow colleagues and they never will. Empty token political gestures like this mean very little when you consider that.

[Beso]

He enabled it. If he truly isn't an anti-Semite he had only to open his mouth say anything that wasn't a denial.

And avoid being photographed in dubious surroundings.

[Kizzy]

And avoid being photographed in dubious surroundings.

Is there a point if reference here?

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/660/cpsprodpb/B6A2/production/_113645764_theguardian.jpg

[Kizzy]

Well well. .. the very group that sought to destroy the party from within have got pound signs in their eyes now.
Love the media framing of this that their social media based collusion should be private!
Labour need to fight this, through the courts it's damned either way though if it does the whole sorry debacle will be out in full and all those he'll bent on preventing labour winning the previous 2 elections will be exposed...if they don't they face financial ruin.

This whole issue was designed to destroy Labour, antisemitism has been used as a weapon. I've stated before how I feel it's disgusting that the genuine cases they have had and the steps they took to tackle the issue have been ignored in favour of a media circus.

Let every little detail come out... Labour has to wash ALL its dirty linen in public now, trying to protect those who have been exposed is not an option .

[Oliver_W]

Yeah, regardless of how much antisemitism really was in the party, there'll be "ambulance chasers" dredging up what they can in order to get money or clout.

Similar to how the #MeToo movement devolved to people moaning about a hand on the knee 40 years ago lol.

[bots]

Corbyn and his cronies have a lot to answer for, that's what I take away from all of this.

I think stammer is doing a good job all round at the moment, and it's better that all the dirt is exposed now rather than interfering at the next election

[Livia]

Labour still hasn’t done anything in regards to their own members and MPs bullying and racially abusing their fellow colleagues and they never will. Empty token political gestures like this mean very little when you consider that.

Maybe if you're part of the community that was abused, ignored, stigmatised etc by Corbyn supporters, perhaps you wouldn't feel like it's an empty gesture.

[Livia]

Corbyn and his cronies have a lot to answer for, that's what I take away from all of this.

I think stammer is doing a good job all round at the moment, and it's better that all the dirt is exposed now rather than interfering at the next election

Exactly. Labour deserve better instead of having their message twisted up in hate.

[Liam-]

A lifelong anti-racist activist, who always fought for equality, was slandered and smeared by the elite so a lifelong racist could run the country for them, it’s shameful that people are still labelling an honest man with a completely false character.

[The Slim Reaper]

A lifelong anti-racist activist, who always fought for equality, was slandered and smeared by the elite so a lifelong racist could run the country for them, it’s shameful that people are still labelling an honest man with a completely false character.

There was no arguing against Corbyn's policies as a better way forward for the country, so smears became the weapons.

[Livia]

There was no arguing against Corbyn's policies as a better way forward for the country, so smears became the weapons.

There's no arguing with the fact that this country will never, ever elect a socialist.

[Liam-]

There was no arguing against Corbyn's policies as a better way forward for the country, so smears became the weapons.

Yep