Boris’ Government performs ANOTHER embarrassing U Turn

[Smithy]

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Christ can they get anything right :facepalm:

[Liam-]

This government is an actual embarrassment, I know people will say ‘it’s good they can change their minds!! #BackBoris’ but Christ, wouldn’t it be nice to be run by a government that leads from the front rather than one that is always on the back foot when it comes to important things.

[Strictly Jake]

Again I will post what the gov.uk website says. Yes its embarrassing

[Wearing a face covering or face mask in schools or other education settings is not recommended. Face coverings may be beneficial for short periods indoors where there is a risk of close social contact with people you do not usually meet and where social distancing and other measures cannot be maintained, for example on public transport or in some shops. This does not apply to schools or other education settings. Schools and other education or childcare settings should therefore not require staff, children and learners to wear face coverings. Changing habits, cleaning and hygiene are effective measures in controlling the spread of the virus. Face coverings (or any form of medical mask unless instructed to be used for specific clinical reasons) should not be worn in any circumstance by those who may not be able to handle them as directed (for example, young children, or those with special educational needs or disabilities) as it may inadvertently increase the risk of transmission

[Oliver_W]

While flexibility in the face of new evidence etc can be a good thing ... jeezus-pleezus this government is embarrassing. Almost makes on yearn for the days of Cameron :joker:

[Crimson Dynamo]

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/06/09/09/2976A8F300000578-3116396-Miss_Sturgeon_laughed_when_asked_about_what_is_in_ haggis_and_why-m-15_1433837755767.jpg

[user104658]

I honestly think the solution for teachers in schools is just for it to be allowed, but not required. :shrug:. I've seen teachers wearing them at my daughter's school, and others not wearing them, so I assume that's the case there.

[Cherie]

why is it embarrassing? they listened to concerns and acted on it

The WHO do not advise face coverings in schools

[Strictly Jake]

why is it embarrassing? they listened to concerns and acted on it

The WHO do not advise face coverings in schools

It is embarrassing as they have given schools so many u turns already. It should have been in place in the first place if its not safe to not wear a mask.

[Samm]

why is it embarrassing? they listened to concerns and acted on it

The WHO do not advise face coverings in schools

Constantly going back on their word isn’t quite reassuring in a confident government is it.

[Jake.]

It’s beyond a joke at this point lol

[bots]

i would never criticise the government when they do what best evidence says is the right thing, all this thread shows is political immaturity by the op

[Kazanne]

Not embarrasing at all ,infact quite courageous as they know the backlash they get from some quarters, ,nothing wrong with taking advice and acting on it, a government that does not UTurn just isnt listening, but any old stick to bash I guess.

[Tom4784]

In fairness, when all this began, the medical advice was that masks weren't effective but Boris and co were far too slow on the uptake when that original advice was proven wrong. Masks should have been mandatory weeks before they were made so.

[Smithy]

why is it embarrassing? they listened to concerns and acted on it

The WHO do not advise face coverings in schools

Because it was advised last Friday that children over 12 should wear them but Boris has said all week that it’s not necessary

[Smithy]

Not embarrasing at all ,infact quite courageous as they know the backlash they get from some quarters, ,nothing wrong with taking advice and acting on it, a government that does not UTurn just isnt listening, but any old stick to bash I guess.

The advice was changed last week and yet the government are only acting upon it now. It’s very embarrassing

[Cherie]

Constantly going back on their word isn’t quite reassuring in a confident government is it.

they haven't gone back 'on their word' the WHO and their own Health advisers have not advised it

[Cherie]

Because it was advised last Friday that children over 12 should wear them but Boris has said all week that it’s not necessary

by who? link please.

[user104658]

In all honesty though the science behind mask wearing is still very flimsy. That's inevitable really, it wasn't being properly looked at until less than 6 months ago, and that simply isn't anywhere near long enough for any really robust research to have been carried out. Previous "non-Covid" studies into mask wearing and the effect on the spread of illness has shown that it has little if any significant effect - BUT they have also shown that it doesn't do any harm. We're all sort of operating on "best guess" scenarios with it at the moment... and my take is that, if we know it's unlikely to cause any harm, and the effectiveness of how much good it does is "an unknown", we might as well err on the side of caution and wear them :shrug:.

The data will be available one day and we'll have some pretty robust stats on how effective it was (if at all). For now, there's no reason NOT to.

[Smithy]

by who? link please.

Christ alive maybe read the ****ing article? :facepalm:

[Cherie]

In fairness, when all this began, the medical advice was that masks weren't effective but Boris and co were far too slow on the uptake when that original advice was proven wrong. Masks should have been mandatory weeks before they were made so.

They made masks mandatory on public transport before Scotland (where is the backlash for that?) and as far as I am aware Wales still has a no mask policy, maybe Liam can comment because it might have changed

[Cherie]

Christ alive maybe read the ****ing article? :facepalm:

Stop swearing at me, I am working and didn't see the link,

[user104658]

They made masks mandatory on public transport before Scotland (where is the backlash for that?) and as far as I am aware Wales still has a no mask policy, maybe Liam can comment because it might have changed

To be faiirrrr (and defensive of Scotland) this is mainly because of the public transport situation in London which, in the UK, is pretty much unique to the city. "Mandatory masks on public transport in England" was mainly to mandate it on the London Underground.

[Cherie]

nothing in Labour run Wales I see

The UK government's change in advice came late on Tuesday - hours after the Scottish government recommended the wearing of face masks in secondary school corridors, and the Welsh government said it was reviewing its advice on face coverings for pupils.

[Cherie]

To be faiirrrr (and defensive of Scotland) this is mainly because of the public transport situation in London which, in the UK, is pretty much unique to the city. "Mandatory masks on public transport in England" was mainly to mandate it on the London Underground.

it was mandatory on public transport all over England

[Liam-]

We haven’t got a mandate as such, but masks in public is fully recommended, haven’t heard anything about schools yet though, our government like to wait until closer to anything happening before making decisions so it doesn’t have to make U-turns like Boris

[Cherie]

We haven’t got a mandate as such, but masks in public is fully recommended, haven’t heard anything about schools yet though, our government like to wait until closer to anything happening before making decisions so it doesn’t have to make U-turns like Boris

closer to what happening?

[Liam-]

closer to what happening?

Restrictions being lifted, businesses being opened, schools going back.

They announced the new plan for shielders like, the day before shielding was paused for this very reason

[Cherie]

Restrictions being lifted, businesses being opened, schools going back.

They announced the new plan for shielders like, the day before shielding was paused for this very reason

are school not back next week?

anyhoo the Who changed its guidance on 21st August and as far as I can see the government are allowing head teachers in England to make decisions on masks which is fair enough, and the devolved nations can make their own decisions, so everyone is happy :laugh:

[Denver]

Ive actually put some thought into this and if we had another election tomorrow im certain i would vote labour for the first time

[joeysteele]

It is embarrassing.
However it's also right to have done the u turn..despite days of Ministers saying they wouldn't be changing the original policy.

The problem with this arrogant lot,is the absolute fact, that they are so arrogant, they don't think things through properly or plan properly in the First place.
Hence so many u turns even just on this pandemic.

It would help IF they actually consulted properly in the first place and instead of just hearing opinions, they actually used their ears to actually LISTEN properly and fully.

Then these long run of embarrassing u turns could be avoided.

Any government making a u turn on their instructions or policies, is admitting by that u turn,they were wrong in the first place.

So all these u turns from this lot while they are right but also embarrassing there's so many.
Only really highlights what it really is, and that's sheer incompetence.

[Ammi]

...it isn’t a U Turn, so much as bad leadership...’no masks are required’ and then ‘okay then, some masks are required’....etc and within hours of saying one thing, he says the opposite and before the first registration bell has happened...its just all thrown out there with very little thought and very little little listening, which is very much Boris...it’s the right decision, obviously...to introduce a safety measure like that...but the people who elected him, shouldn’t be the ones telling him that...he’s an awful leader in a time when we so desperately don’t need an awful leader...

[Kizzy]

i would never criticise the government when they do what best evidence says is the right thing, all this thread shows is political immaturity by the op

Your blind faith shows political immaturity for me, we have been living with coronavirus for a long time now. Are you seriously suggesting that the weight of evidence for masks has shifted that dramatically in a day to cause the govt to flip their recommendations?

[joeysteele]

...it isn’t a U Turn, so much as bad leadership...’no masks are required’ and then ‘okay then, some masks are required’....etc and within hours of saying one thing, he says the opposite and before the first registration bell has happened...its just all thrown out there with very little thought and very little little listening, which is very much Boris...it’s the right decision, obviously...to introduce a safety measure like that...but the people who elected him, shouldn’t be the ones telling him that...he’s an awful leader in a time when we so desperately don’t need an awful leader...


Absolutely right.
Spot on.

It's incompetence, however, dangerous incompetence when dealing with lives.

[Kizzy]

In all honesty though the science behind mask wearing is still very flimsy. That's inevitable really, it wasn't being properly looked at until less than 6 months ago, and that simply isn't anywhere near long enough for any really robust research to have been carried out. Previous "non-Covid" studies into mask wearing and the effect on the spread of illness has shown that it has little if any significant effect - BUT they have also shown that it doesn't do any harm. We're all sort of operating on "best guess" scenarios with it at the moment... and my take is that, if we know it's unlikely to cause any harm, and the effectiveness of how much good it does is "an unknown", we might as well err on the side of caution and wear them :shrug:.

The data will be available one day and we'll have some pretty robust stats on how effective it was (if at all). For now, there's no reason NOT to.

It might not have been looked at from a covid perspective but surgical masks have always been worn in surgery to prevent risk to the patient not the surgeon as part of their PPE.

I don't agree the science is flimsy, it's perfectly robust and obvious to me that if you limit the concentration and or reach of air molecules you slow the spread and reduce the risk.

We now have lots of evidence as to how effective they are, it would be pure ignorance to leave it up to individuals to decide as the effectiveness is based on significantly reducing airbourne particles. In the petri dish that is your average high school that would require the involvement of all.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/cloth-face-cover-guidance.html

[bots]

The prime minister has suggested the decision to make face coverings mandatory for secondary pupils in school corridors in local lockdown areas of England was influenced by the experience of pupils in Scotland, who have already started returning to lessons.

"What they found [in Scotland] was that it was raining outside, people were coming in and they were congregating in the corridors and the move to face coverings they thought was sensible," he said.

"What we are doing, following what the WHO (World Health Organization) have said, is we are saying, if you are in a hot spot area where there is a higher risk of transmission then face coverings in those types of areas outside the classroom."

He said wearing them in classrooms would be "nonsensical" because "you can't teach" or "expect people to learn with face coverings".

During a visit to Castle Rock school in Coalville, Leicestershire, he said: "We're being very clear - if you're in a hotspot area, which this place is not, then you should use face coverings in places outside the classrooms where it's a confined space.

"But those are few and far between. Here in Leicestershire, after all, you've seen the people of Leicester come together, make a huge effort in the whole area, to bear down on the virus because there was an outbreak in Leicester and they've done a fantastic job."

He added: "The numbers are down and the incidence in this area is well, well down so that's the way to do it - local measures to tackle the outbreaks, wash your hands and let's get all pupils back into school next week."

[Tom4784]

They made masks mandatory on public transport before Scotland (where is the backlash for that?) and as far as I am aware Wales still has a no mask policy, maybe Liam can comment because it might have changed

We still fell far behind other countries who made masks mandatory as soon as the information changed or shortly after. We've been slow on the uptake for most of this pandemic really.

[user104658]

I've heard rumblings that Boris plans to step down in the first half of 2021, that he despises being PM, and that it was always the plan that he would secure the majority at the 2019 election and then step aside for someone else to be PM (who wouldn't have gotten as many votes). 'tis just rumblings but will be interesting to see if it develops into a real story.

[Denver]

I've heard rumblings that Boris plans to step down in the first half of 2021, that he despises being PM, and that it was always the plan that he would secure the majority at the 2019 election and then step aside for someone else to be PM (who wouldn't have gotten as many votes). 'tis just rumblings but will be interesting to see if it develops into a real story.

But the problem is who takes over? The only one the public would get behind would be Rishi but he is probably to inexperienced to be considered

[Tom4784]

But the problem is who takes over? The only one the public would get behind would be Rishi but he is probably to inexperienced to be considered

The fact that he isn't white and isn't an arsehole would probably go against him as well. I can't see it being anyone who isn't abhorrent.

[Cherie]

I've heard rumblings that Boris plans to step down in the first half of 2021, that he despises being PM, and that it was always the plan that he would secure the majority at the 2019 election and then step aside for someone else to be PM (who wouldn't have gotten as many votes). 'tis just rumblings but will be interesting to see if it develops into a real story.

Apparently this has come from Dominic Cummings father in law, it would be an odd thing to do, not to see a term out, I could see surviving Covid having a profound affect on his life outlook though

[AnnieK]

I've heard rumblings that Boris plans to step down in the first half of 2021, that he despises being PM, and that it was always the plan that he would secure the majority at the 2019 election and then step aside for someone else to be PM (who wouldn't have gotten as many votes). 'tis just rumblings but will be interesting to see if it develops into a real story.

I heard that this story started from Dominic Cummings father in law who also mentioned Boris is still having Covid related health issues too

[Cherie]

I heard that this story started from Dominic Cummings father in law who also mentioned Boris is still having Covid related health issues too

oi Mrs, thats my goss

didn't hear the thing about Covid health issues, but is is fairly well documented that some suffer after affects for sometime

[bots]

i think Boris is putting an optimistic face on everything because that's what he has to do as PM. Who would want to run a country during a pandemic, and pile on top of that a new baby and a near death escape from covid. You don't have to like the guy (which i don't) to understand the effect all that could have on someone. I can see him waiting until Brexit deal negotiations are complete and then disappearing into the sunset, and i wouldn't blame him