Its time we stopped pandering to Travellers

[Crimson Dynamo]

Liberal commentator Matthew Parris says travellers must be told their way of
life is over and they have no place in modern Britain after a group takes over a
car park near his Peak District home


Matthew Parris calls to stop 'forcing local authorities to create Traveller sites'
Ex-Tory MP says there is 'simply no place for the true nomad in modern Britain'
He delivered his broadside after a group set up camp in a town near his cottage


https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2021/05/15/23/43035694-9583091-image-a-52_1621118940531.jpg

'There is simply no place for the true nomad in modern Britain,' he writes in
his latest Times column.

'It isn't their fault, it isn't our fault,' he writes. 'But life here involves having
an address, being contactable, keeping children in school, paying tax on your
property, accepting responsibility for a defined patch of real estate as
proprietor or tenant.

The way we live in this country is cruel to the British Traveller.'

He concludes: 'I would have to tell him that his way of life is finished. It
cannot be otherwise.'

He writes: 'We should stop forcing local authorities to create Traveller sites,
phase out the 'ethnic minority' rights of people who are not a race but a
doomed mindset.'

Calling for social housing to be provided for Traveller families, he adds that if
any refuse, there should be 'a gradual squeeze on anyone who tries without
permission to park their home on public property or the property of others'.

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2021/05/15/23/43035666-9583091-image-m-54_1621118997631.jpg

He adds: 'This should be done with as much humanity as is consistent with
telling a group of people honestly that their lifestyle offers them and their
children no future, but their country wants to help them change it. There is a
place for them but no longer for their way of living. Is there a party, is there
a politician in Britain, with the courage to say so?'

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9583091/Liberal-commentator-Matthew-Parris-calls-blanket-ban-Travellers.html

[arista]

Yes over taking a Car Park
they should Dragged out
faster

[Crimson Dynamo]

Yes over taking a Car Park
they should Dragged out
faster

you and i would get a ticket/fine

[Oliver_W]

As long as they don't destroy green spaces or act aggressively, I don't particularly care what they get up to tbh

[Cherie]

Its not ideal to park up in a car park, but what the solution is I don't really know

[Amy Jade]

Yeah they need to crack down on them where I live badly.

My dog went missing and she was seen tied up on a gypsy site barking, I rang the police and they literally didn't want to help at all, my boyfriend and his friends went and just took her eventually. Also I worked in asda for a bit and gypsy's were horrible, I worked on fast lanes and cigarettes and I've been called all sorts for asking for ID or catching them trying to steal.

Not saying all are bad obviously but around where I live they're absolutely awful and the police are scared of them

[Oliver_W]

Its not ideal to park up in a car park, but what the solution is I don't really know

Honestly it's better than ruining a field or park with their tire tracks and littering everywhere.

[thesheriff443]

The man is an absolute dick head
There are simple not enough sites for travelers to live on this is a failure by councils and government

Many many travelers live on established sites they pay rent council tax and their kids go to school

Why do you think travelers get away with pulling onto fields and car parks put simple there is no where else for them to go

I’m not a massive fan of travelers and they should be held accountable like any one else but having a good friend who has worked with them in the past you get to hear another side to the story.

[Amy Jade]

It's not just tire tracks or a bit of littering, when they were in the carpark of the asda I worked at they left a TON of rubbish as well as bags of human faeces and they were shıttıng on paths (they were caught doing it on CCTV) and when they left where was a bag with a dead cat in.

Further to that they were abusing the staff, I and many other female colleagues had to have security walk theme to their cars because they were regularly shouting things at us.

[The Slim Reaper]

The man is an absolute dick head
There are simple not enough sites for travelers to live on this is a failure by councils and government

Many many travelers live on established sites they pay rent council tax and their kids go to school

Why do you think travelers get away with pulling onto fields and car parks put simple there is no where else for them to go

I’m not a massive fan of travelers and they should be held accountable like any one else but having a good friend who has worked with them in the past you get to hear another side to the story.

A good post that I largely agree with.

This government is targeting travellers in a way no otter government ever has, so this is a concerted effort all round to marginalise another minority group in this country.

[arista]

As long as they don't destroy green spaces or act aggressively, I don't particularly care what they get up to tbh

They are Aggressive
and leave a mess.

[bots]

Society is yet again lacking in consistency. They protect some cultures with a vengeance yet fail to support others that should have an equal entitlement

[user104658]

They are Aggressive
and leave a mess.

Plenty of other aggressive groups so :shrug: that's a separate issue - by all means issues of aggression and violence should be handled appropriately but that's not what this is about.

Leaving a mess, is only an issue because of them using sites they shouldn't be.

I largely agree that there should be adequate official sites with appropriate fees (you could also have paid access to things like electricity and water supply). Absolutely tonnes of uncontaminated brown belt that could be converted for parking up, just sitting there. I remember when I was a kid there was a disused airfield nearby that a group set up on for a while no problem - it wasn't being used by anyone at all previously (other than by teenagers doing donuts in their Corsas) and these sorts of sites are dotted around all over the place - usually closed off and inaccessible.

[Oliver_W]

If action "needs" to be taken, they should be blocked in, and the vehicles not released until they pay everything they owe :d

[Tom4784]

It's a very close minded attitude that you have to adhere to the idea of owning property to have a place in UK society.

I think like all people, travellers come in all shapes and sizes. I've known some that are complete arseholes, I've known some that just want to live their lives the way they want to in peace. There's no point in painting in broad strokes.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I think he is spot on a speaks for the majority

[user104658]

I think he is spot on a speaks for the majority

"Spot on" and "Speaks for the majority" are not one and the same.

Thankfully, democracy and mob rule are not one and the same either.

[Shaun]

Whilst I agree with his sentiment that more affordable housing needs to be built (or made available, and taken off of landlords who are strangling renters), I'm not sure you can really force people to stay in one location. I can sympathise with those who can feel intimidated by them, or are frustrated with the criminal ones... but to single this community out over other anti-social behaviour (let's maybe tackle the droves of Spice addicts first?) seems little more than good old fashioned racism.

[user104658]

Whilst I agree with his sentiment that more affordable housing needs to be built (or made available, and taken off of landlords who are strangling renters), I'm not sure you can really force people to stay in one location. I can sympathise with those who can feel intimidated by them, or are frustrated with the criminal ones... but to single this community out over other anti-social behaviour (let's maybe tackle the droves of Spice addicts first?) seems little more than good old fashioned racism.

I mean, most of LT's pals who invaded & trashed Glasgow over the weekend have permanent homes and jobs. Doesn't seem to make that much of a difference :shrug:.

[Cherie]

Whilst I agree with his sentiment that more affordable housing needs to be built (or made available, and taken off of landlords who are strangling renters), I'm not sure you can really force people to stay in one location. I can sympathise with those who can feel intimidated by them, or are frustrated with the criminal ones... but to single this community out over other anti-social behaviour (let's maybe tackle the droves of Spice addicts first?) seems little more than good old fashioned racism.


its acceptable though, and acceptable to tar all the community with the same brush which would not be tolerated in other communities

[Crimson Dynamo]

WOuld anyone want them rocking up near them?

[Cherie]

WOuld anyone want them rocking up near them?

There is a camp reasonably near here, not had any issues, and we did have some rent a property across the road and they were always cleaning and the place was spotless, the woman and kids were lovely, he was a complete arse.

I think the landlord got rid when he realised they were travellers.

[GoldHeart]

Well unless you live in awfully posh area, I think most of us have had gypsies living in our area or not far from.

And not all gypsies / travellers are the same, they can't all be lumped together. But yes some can be problematic and cause a mess, but like mentioned so does other anti social behaviour from other types of people.

[Swan]

I hate seeing the travellers near me whip their horses constantly while it struggles to run down a slick road, cars scaring it left right and centre. It shouldn't be allowed!

Narrow minded of me to say but i've never met a nice, in a any way, traveller before, and i know quite a few. And the way they treat animals is appalling.

[Ammi]

I hate seeing the travellers near me whip their horses constantly while it struggles to run down a slick road, cars scaring it left right and centre. It shouldn't be allowed!

Narrow minded of me to say but i've never met a nice, in a any way, traveller before, and i know quite a few. And the way they treat animals is appalling.

…we’ve had lots of traveller children/families at the school over time…we’ve also obviously had lots of foster/looked after children because that’s schools….one traveller family in particular/the mum…?…whenever we had a looked after child leave to be with a new foster family or return to their own family or to their new adopted family etc…whatever the reason for their going…?…the traveller mum would always make up a photograph album gift of classmates, special times etc for that child to take to try to give them some childhood memories …?…that most children would naturally have who didn’t have a childhood life in care and often many schools experienced…that’s more my personal experience of many travellers within the community…

…there has been not great stuff occasionally…?…but that’s relatively more rare…and obviously there will always be grim stuff in all communities as well because people are people and very different…

[GoldHeart]

Another sad thing is because they DO travel around alot , the kids usually miss out on an education and usually struggle to read and write.

I'm not sure if many of them have ever been to school often.

[Ammi]

Another sad thing is because they DO travel around alot , the kids usually miss out on an education and usually struggle to read and write.

I'm not sure if many of them have ever been to school often.

…we’ve always had quite a few traveller children with pretty good attendance, tbh…but I’m sure like most things and communities, that probably varies from school to school, GoldHeart…

[GoldHeart]

…we’ve always had quite a few traveller children with pretty good attendance, tbh…but I’m sure like most things and communities, that probably varies from school to school, GoldHeart…

Yeah exactly fair point

[Tom4784]

I hate seeing the travellers near me whip their horses constantly while it struggles to run down a slick road, cars scaring it left right and centre. It shouldn't be allowed!

Narrow minded of me to say but i've never met a nice, in a any way, traveller before, and i know quite a few. And the way they treat animals is appalling.

I'm gonna garble the quote, but it's one I believe in. 'If you meet one arsehole in a day, they're just an arsehole, but if everyone you meet is an arsehole, then maybe it's you.'

I'm not calling you an arsehole, but the point I'm trying to make is that if every traveller you've met has been unpleasant, then maybe your at fault in someway. If you think that all Travelers are unpleasant, people can pick up on it, and they'll react to it.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Ask any POliceman what he thinks of the "traveller" community....

[Swan]

I'm gonna garble the quote, but it's one I believe in. 'If you meet one arsehole in a day, they're just an arsehole, but if everyone you meet is an arsehole, then maybe it's you.'

I'm not calling you an arsehole, but the point I'm trying to make is that if every traveller you've met has been unpleasant, then maybe your at fault in someway. If you think that all Travelers are unpleasant, people can pick up on it, and they'll react to it.

True, but the few i've met actions say it all really. One bullied a younger, scared lad who was a bit 'dim' to the point of near death (literally, bet his mate he could get this young lad to run a 3 mile lane in the dark without stopping while behind him in the travellers truck).

The other used to cold call the elderly, tell them he'd look at their roof free of charge, the come down with a dead Squirrel and tell them they needed thousands of pounds worth of work doing, charge them, but not actually do it. He actually went to prison for 18 months for that.

The ones who unmercifully whip the horse on public roads as previously mentioned.

Or the guy who wouldn't feed his Greyhounds to make them more bloodthirsty when taking them Coursing?

Again, not saying there aren't any good Travellers out there, of course there are, im just saying i've never met one.

[Marsh.]

True, but the few i've met actions say it all really. One bullied a younger, scared lad who was a bit 'dim' to the point of near death (literally, bet his mate he could get this young lad to run a 3 mile lane in the dark without stopping while behind him in the travellers truck).

The other used to cold call the elderly, tell them he'd look at their roof free of charge, the come down with a dead Squirrel and tell them they needed thousands of pounds worth of work doing, charge them, but not actually do it. He actually went to prison for 18 months for that.

The ones who unmercifully whip the horse on public roads as previously mentioned.

Or the guy who wouldn't feed his Greyhounds to make them more bloodthirsty when taking them Coursing?

Again, not saying there aren't any good Travellers out there, of course there are, im just saying i've never met one.

You could find a non-traveller example of each of those things.

[Swan]

You could find a non-traveller example of each of those things.

You could, that's true.

[Ammi]

True, but the few i've met actions say it all really. One bullied a younger, scared lad who was a bit 'dim' to the point of near death (literally, bet his mate he could get this young lad to run a 3 mile lane in the dark without stopping while behind him in the travellers truck).

The other used to cold call the elderly, tell them he'd look at their roof free of charge, the come down with a dead Squirrel and tell them they needed thousands of pounds worth of work doing, charge them, but not actually do it. He actually went to prison for 18 months for that.

The ones who unmercifully whip the horse on public roads as previously mentioned.

Or the guy who wouldn't feed his Greyhounds to make them more bloodthirsty when taking them Coursing?

Again, not saying there aren't any good Travellers out there, of course there are, im just saying i've never met one.

…yeah, I think that it sounds as though you’ve had general bad experiences, Swan…of grim people who happen to also be in the travelling community where you are…but I wouldn’t say that they’re grim because they’re travellers…they’re grim because they’re grim…

[Ammi]

..travelling communities../…travellers are also not portrayed well in the media and never have been so I think before we know any individually…we’re often slanted to look for ‘grim’ as well…look for something and we’ll find it for sure…not that there isn’t grim as you say, Swan…but that’s because of personalities rather than lifestyle I feel…

[Swan]

…yeah, I think that it sounds as though you’ve had general bad experiences, Swan…of grim people who happen to also be in the travelling community where you are…but I wouldn’t say that they’re grim because they’re travellers…they’re grim because they’re grim…

Yeah i can admit that my thoughts are narrow minded on this one, and as you said in a previous post you've experienced the good from some of the Travelling communities. And i admit grim people are just grim, no matter race, religion, creed.

I remember the Travelling community gave that evil scumbag Mick Philpott thousands of pounds after his children died in that fire (before they knew the truth of course). So im not saying there aren't good out there at all. But i do think education is key, and some Travelling communities are notorious for their mistreatment of animals, and intimidating of people because they don't know any better. Whereas some are just bad people, but the same could be said for every walk of life i agree.

[Ammi]

Yeah i can admit that my thoughts are narrow minded on this one, and as you said in a previous post you've experienced the good from some of the Travelling communities. And i admit grim people are just grim, no matter race, religion, creed.

I remember the Travelling community gave that evil scumbag Mick Philpott thousands of pounds after his children died in that fire (before they knew the truth of course). So im not saying there aren't good out there at all. But i do think education is key, and some Travelling communities are notorious for their mistreatment of animals, and intimidating of people because they don't know any better. Whereas some are just bad people, but the same could be said for every walk of life i agree.


…I think that we’re all very narrow in our own personal experiences of travellers and again depending on whether those we know in our local traveller communities mix with the outer community also …and that’s what the media exploit isn’t it when they ‘demonise’…that we do often have a narrow window of personal relationships …so it makes stereotyping and demonising easier for them…

[Crimson Dynamo]

Channel 4's Dispatches looked at figures from the 12 months from December
2018.

Data from around 200 sites in England revealed crime rates there are also a
third higher than the average in a quarter of cases.

The investigation found police in Cambridgeshire, Bedfordshire and other
areas with larger traveller populations claimed they are unable to tackle the
issue head on.

One officer told the programme: "When we see that there is a specific part of
the community in quite large numbers committing crimes and we're almost
not allowed to mention it - that can be frustrating.

"Because they’re such a closed community and there’s usually a fair few in
numbers...if we go in there it is going to be carnage."

Andrew Selous, MP for South West Bedfordshire, revealed some residents
have told him they moved away from these areas as they felt unsafe, adding
"that is completely unacceptable".

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11408376/crime-dispatches-traveller-sites-channel-4/