Is it racial?

[Conzors]

I’ve seen a few comments saying it’s racial biased and stuff and seeing it on screen from the likes of Jenkin, Tom, Chanelle and Paul, who are probably from areas where white people outweigh black people, call Trish aggressive for being loud and feisty and strongly opinionated but then not calling Olivia aggressive for being basically the same but not black….

I don’t think they are ‘racist’ but personally I think it is subconscious racial biased and I can’t believe this stuff happens, it’s so unfair and I’m shocked that more people do not see this.

What are your thoughts?

[vesavius]

No.

Moving on.

[Conzors]

No.

Moving on.

Why do you not think so?

[Jessica.]

The micro-aggressions are clear as day to me.

[GoldHeart]

What annoyed me was how Olivia was loud especially with the smack talk' in the ant task ,yet Trish got all the blame :bored: .

[Billy]

I’m not saying this as a Chanelle supporter (have gone off her in the past week or so), but I don’t see how it’s racist or bias - if anything, the bias comes from Trish’s own group continuously perceiving her as strong and therefore not in need of support.

Chantelle’s problem with Trish comes from the fact she believes Trish labelling Paul a bully was damaging; whether we agree with that or not, she lives with them and is entitled to that opinion which will then impact how she sees Trish and distrusts her.

[Ithinkiloveyoutoo]

I’ve seen a few comments saying it’s racial biased and stuff and seeing it on screen from the likes of Jenkin, Tom, Chanelle and Paul, who are probably from areas where white people outweigh black people, call Trish aggressive for being loud and feisty and strong but then not calling Olivia aggressive for being basically the same but not black….

I don’t think they are ‘racist’ but personally I think it is subconscious racial biased and I can’t believe this stuff happens, it’s so unfair and I’m shocked that more people do not see this.

What are your thoughts?

Yes it is racial and black women and men live this out all day in all spaces. At work we actually had sessions where we had a people talking about not being able to be themselves around predominantly white work spaces because they knew that acting anything less than serene or "proper" meant that they would be labelled agressive or difficult to work with, where as assertiveness for example is received with much tolerance from the white race. It's a thing.

[Parmy]

It's a free card for a black BB contestant to use. Shes doing it well

[vesavius]

Why do you not think so?

Because I have seen zero reason to and I absolutely refuse to look at everything through a racial lens.

Because once you do everything then looks racist and that's extremely toxic and self destructive.

[Swan]

It's possible for a white and a black person to not get on in life, without it being anything to do with race, believe it or not.

[jones89]

I’m curious.. if it was an all-black cast and someone was being called aggressive this really wouldn’t be an issue would it? The whites be evil :joker:

[Zizu]

I’ve seen a few comments saying it’s racial biased and stuff and seeing it on screen from the likes of Jenkin, Tom, Chanelle and Paul, who are probably from areas where white people outweigh black people, call Trish aggressive for being loud and feisty and strongly opinionated but then not calling Olivia aggressive for being basically the same but not black….

I don’t think they are ‘racist’ but personally I think it is subconscious racial biased and I can’t believe this stuff happens, it’s so unfair and I’m shocked that more people do not see this.

What are your thoughts?


I would agree entirely


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[Liam-]

The micro-aggressions are clear as day to me.

Yep, it’s just as basic as it comes

[Lostie!]

I’m curious.. if it was an all-black cast and someone was being called aggressive this really wouldn’t be an issue would it? The whites be evil :joker:

But a white person calling a black person aggressive whilst they're absolutely not being aggressive in any form is a textbook microaggression. That happened, this make believe all black cast didn't.

[OnTheRight]

Only two people have mentioned colour, Daryl and Trish.

[Northern Monkey]

The question is, is what racial?
All this seems to be coming from Trish herself. She seems to conflate being called ‘strong’ and being seen as ‘agressive’.

[vesavius]

But a white person calling a black person aggressive whilst they're absolutely not being aggressive in any form is a textbook microaggression. That happened, this make believe all black cast didn't.

Micro aggressions are nonsense created by specific people seeking power over other specific people.

[OnTheRight]

I’m curious.. if it was an all-black cast and someone was being called aggressive this really wouldn’t be an issue would it? The whites be evil :joker:

Only white people can be racist, didn't you know?

[GoldHeart]

But a white person calling a black person aggressive whilst they're absolutely not being aggressive in any form is a textbook microaggression. That happened, this make believe all black cast didn't.

What I hate is the double standards
Olivia is loud yet has never been labelled "aggressive" . But Tom especially loves throwing around the word "aggressive", while he cries over the word "bully".

Trish was absolutely right tonight, the garden group are hypocrites .

[OnTheRight]

Jordan put the aggressive, bully in her place.

[CocaColin]

No.

Moving on.

This is a discussion forum. I don't know who you think are to shut down a conversation.

The micro-aggressions aren't apparent and Trish clocked them. Proud of her.

[Conzors]

Because I have seen zero reason to and I absolutely refuse to look at everything through a racial lens.

Because once you do everything then looks racist and that's extremely toxic and self destructive.

I don’t think comparing Trish and Olivia’s personality traits (which are quite similar) but looking at only one being labelled aggressive is looking at EVERYTHING through a racial lense, it’s looking at one specific example which is evident of some sort of bias

[Zizu]

Hopefully just a coincidence that the downstairs crew have been all white from the get -go


Whilst the upstairs have been multicultural


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[Zizu]

What I hate is the double standards
Olivia is loud yet has never been labelled "aggressive" . But Tom especially loves throwing around the word "aggressive", while he cries over the word "bully".

Trish was absolutely right tonight, the garden group are hypocrites .


Double standards


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[vesavius]

Only white people can be racist, didn't you know?

According to the redefintion of the term by those that absolutely do not gain power by redefining that term, that is true.

[Atake25]

I’ve seen a few comments saying it’s racial biased and stuff and seeing it on screen from the likes of Jenkin, Tom, Chanelle and Paul, who are probably from areas where white people outweigh black people, call Trish aggressive for being loud and feisty and strongly opinionated but then not calling Olivia aggressive for being basically the same but not black….

I don’t think they are ‘racist’ but personally I think it is subconscious racial biased and I can’t believe this stuff happens, it’s so unfair and I’m shocked that more people do not see this.

What are your thoughts?
No not racist at all just different personalities clashing

[Zizu]

Only two people have mentioned colour, Daryl and Trish.


Dylan … just Dylan


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[vesavius]

I don’t think comparing Trish and Olivia’s personality traits (which are quite similar) but looking at only one being labelled aggressive is looking at EVERYTHING through a racial lense, it’s looking at one specific example which is evident of some sort of bias

But, I suspect that you actually do look at everything through a racial lens.

Which is why you have arrived at this one thing.

BTW, looking at everything a racial lens is a form of bias.

[Swan]

Must be just a coincidence that the downstairs crew have been all white from the get -go


Whilst the upstairs have been multicultural


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Do you think friendships should forced based on race?

That's also not true, as it was discussed in tonight's episode that Noky was hanging around a lot more the "downstairs" crew pretty much all the way through until this week. She's now spread her wings a bit around the house, which is great to see.

[hijaxers]

Only two people have mentioned colour, Daryl and Trish.

Forgot about Dylan or he don't count ?

[jones89]

But a white person calling a black person aggressive whilst they're absolutely not being aggressive in any form is a textbook microaggression. That happened, this make believe all black cast didn't.

Ok soo… a black person calls another black person aggressive whilst they’re absolutely not being aggressive, still a textbook microaggression? Probably not eh?

[vesavius]

Ok soo… a black person calls another black person aggressive whilst they’re absolutely not being aggressive, still a textbook microaggression? Probably not eh?

This

And, honestly, this should end the thread. But it won't.

[Conzors]

This

And, honestly, this should end the thread. But it won't.

Why are you so uncomfortable discussing race and potential racial bias?

[Lostie!]

Ok soo… a black person calls another black person aggressive whilst they’re absolutely not being aggressive, still a textbook microaggression? Probably not eh?

But was that what happened? But hey, if you need to keep inventing hypothetical scenarios to deflect from a conversation that makes you uncomfortable you knock yourself out

[vesavius]

Why are you so uncomfortable discussing race and potential racial bias?

Why are you attempting to gaslight me?

I have quite clearly discussed it and have been quite clear how I see it.

I am sorry that you feel the need to make it about me rather than staying on topic.

[Alf]

Paul and Olivia were definitely public enemy number 1 on this forum purely based on race.

So yes, it's racial.

[jones89]

But was that what happened? But hey, if you need to keep inventing hypothetical scenarios to deflect from a conversation that makes you uncomfortable you knock yourself out

The answer was clearly no then :joker:

[Zizu]

Paul and Olivia were definitely public enemy number 1 on this forum purely based on race.

So yes, it's racial.


They have been castigated simply for their constant abhorrent behaviour and complete disrespect of their fellow housemates plus the thieving


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[jones89]

Why are you so uncomfortable discussing race and potential racial bias?

No one’s uncomfortable my friend, some people just see through the BS and say it, simple

[Parmy]

Dylan … just Dylan


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Trish mentioned micro aggression tonight, and by now we all know what that buzzword means. Another seed planted by Trish, following on from the bully limbo dancing.

[GoldHeart]

race aside

The point is the double standards is there . And I'm glad Trish called out the garden gremlins hypocrisy .... especially about Chanelle.

[Swan]

Why are you so uncomfortable discussing race and potential racial bias?

Genuinely, do you know what the problem is? It's because nowadays the term/word "racist" and "bigot" is thrown around so frequently that it's hard to know if you're debating actual racism, or if it's just another moron calling everybody a racist in order to dismiss their world views and pander to the victim mentality they adopt.

It's the same on here in serious debates. If a black person is arrested it's automatically "racist", and if you even ask "ok, why was he arrested in the first place" you're branded racist for not following mob mentality.

Society is actually going backwards. My daughter has light brown skin, i tell her often that we're all equal, not matter race or religion, and that she shouldn't let anyone tell her otherwise.

I also think it's just massively insulting when white people tell black people they're being racially victimised when they themselves wouldn't understand racial victimisation if it hit them in the face.

[vesavius]

Trish mentioned micro aggression tonight, and by now we all know what that buzzword means. Another seed planted by Trish, following on from the bully limbo dancing.

I have said before that the part of Trish that I don't like are her Guardianista level of performative barely educated leftist politics, despite being a 90s lefty myself, so I do agree that the use here was jarring.

But, it is hardly a fatal character flaw or one that changes my core view of her.

[Alf]

They have been castigated simply for their constant abhorrent behaviour and complete disrespect of their fellow housemates plus the thieving


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProThat's only because you believe that they should behave a different way because of their race.

[jones89]

Genuinely, do you know what the problem is? It's because nowadays the term/word "racist" and "bigot" is thrown around so frequently that it's hard to know if you're debating actual racism, or if it's just another moron calling everybody a racist in order to dismiss their world views and the victim mentality they adopt.

It's the same on here in serious debates. If a black person is arrested it's automatically "racist", and if you even ask "ok, why was he arrested in the first place" you're branded racist for not following mob mentality.

Society is actually going backwards. My daughter has light brown skin, i tell her often that we're all equal, not matter race or religion, and that she shouldn't let anyone tell her otherwise.

I also think it's just massively insulting when white people tell black people they're being racially victimised when them themselves racial victimisation if it hit them in the face.


:clap1:

[vesavius]

race aside

The point is the double standards is there . And I'm glad Trish called out the garden gremlins hypocrisy .... especially about Chanelle.

I like the combination of the two group names here... Garden Gremlins...

I can live with that.

[Conzors]

Genuinely, do you know what the problem is? It's because nowadays the term/word "racist" and "bigot" is thrown around so frequently that it's hard to know if you're debating actual racism, or if it's just another moron calling everybody a racist in order to dismiss their world views and the victim mentality they adopt.

It's the same on here in serious debates. If a black person is arrested it's automatically "racist", and if you even ask "ok, why was he arrested in the first place" you're branded racist for not following mob mentality.

Society is actually going backwards. My daughter has light brown skin, i tell her often that we're all equal, not matter race or religion, and that she shouldn't let anyone tell her otherwise.

I also think it's just massively insulting when white people tell black people they're being racially victimised when them themselves racial victimisation if it hit them in the face.

Why are you attempting to gaslight me?

I have quite clearly discussed it and have been quite clear how I see it.

I am sorry that you feel the need to make it about me rather than staying on topic.



I agree, people are so quick to use the term racist and ‘cancel’ people however I am not discussing that as a whole, I’m discussing a particular situation where two people are similar in their confidence, bluntness, loudness and honesty and yet it’s the person who is black that is being labelled aggressive.

Im sorry if you feel as though im gaslighting you, I'm simply replying to your comments where you have said ‘moving on’ and ‘this should be the end of it but it won’t be’ in a clear attempt to stop the conversation.

[GoldHeart]

This topic has gone on a tangent now , so I'm bowing out.

The point I was trying to make is the garden gremlins think it's ok for them to say and do whatever,but anything Trish does is seen like she's the ' Big bad wolf' . I'm glad Trish called out their hypocrisy.

[Conzors]

This topic has gone on a tangent now , so I'm bowing out.

The point I was trying to make is the garden gremlins think it's ok for them to say and do whatever,but anything Trish does is seen like she's the ' Big bad wolf' . I'm glad Trish called out their hypocrisy.

I agree, sorry if i enabled the tangent, I was simply stating what I’m seeing and if anyone else is seeing the same thing.

[Maru]

We see what we want to see through the television to a degree is my take. I'm much more interested in hearing what all the HM's would have to say as a group if posed with this question directly since they're all experiencing it. I think the r word gets thrown around too easily as an explanation for when people with differing personality's clash. Trish' main complaint for the most part seems to be she doesn't want to be called 'loud' or 'aggressive' and that's very fair if she feels stigmatized. All of us face certain stigmas/social labels on a very regular basis and it can be very tiring. At best, she's trying to get people to think. At worst, she's playing the game as it is often played and knows full well how these themes will play out in the media. It can be argued she's acknowledged this with the "I am hated more in here" comment since she's clearly interpreted the cheers as massive support. I don't particularly care if it's either or, simply because Trish is a product of modern society regardless and our responses to a TV show in 2023 is about the same.

[Alf]

I agree, people are so quick to use the term racist and ‘cancel’ people however I am not discussing that as a whole, I’m discussing a particular situation where two people are similar in their confidence, bluntness, loudness and honesty and yet it’s the person who is black that is being labelled aggressive.

Im sorry if you feel as though im gaslighting you, I'm simply replying to your comments where you have said ‘moving on’ and ‘this should be the end of it but it won’t be’ in a clear attempt to stop the conversation.Not on this forum it wasn't dear.

According to this forum. The aggressive ones were Paul and Olivia. And the Sun shone out of Trish's arse.

[vesavius]

Im sorry if you feel as though im gaslighting you, I'm simply replying to your comments where you have said ‘moving on’ and ‘this should be the end of it but it won’t be’ in a clear attempt to stop the conversation.

I didn't 'feel 'it, you actively did that. The attempt to persuade me that I simply felt it is further gaslighting.

My comment there, which I see you have focused far too much on rather than addressing my other points, was me simply saying that it said it all.

I stand by that. If you feel differently, address that specific point, not my character.

[GoldHeart]

I agree, sorry if i enabled the tangent, I was simply stating what I’m seeing and if anyone else is seeing the same thing.

On exclusive Chanelle & Trish are clearing the air ,I think it's more genuine on Trish's part ....but we shall see tomorrow I guess.

[vesavius]

On exclusive Chanelle & Trish are clearing the air ,I think it's more genuine on Trish's part ....but we shall see tomorrow I guess.

They will clear the air and then Chanelle and her gremlin gang will come after Trish again.

[GoldHeart]

They will clear the air and then Chanelle and her gremlin gang will come after Trish again.

Exactly my thoughts , I find it suspicious that Chanelle ...is trying to make up with Trish :suspect: . Especially before eviction.

[caprimint]

Why do you not think so?
A better question is why DO you think so?

[Conzors]

A better question is why DO you think so?

I think so because there are two people who are similar in their confidence, bluntness, loudness and honesty and yet it’s the person who is black that is being labelled aggressive.

I want to be clear I do not think anyone in the house is a racist but I do feel as though there are some biases within the house

[jones89]

I think so because there are two people who are similar in their confidence, bluntness, loudness and honesty and yet it’s the person who is black that is being labelled aggressive.

I want to be clear I do not think anyone in the house is a racist but I do feel as though there are some biases within the house

The garden gang are a bunch of d1cks who say so much **** about everyone who ain’t their friend, they obviously ain’t gonna say that about Olivia

[vesavius]

I think so because there are two people who are similar in their confidence, bluntness, loudness and honesty and yet it’s the person who is black that is being labelled aggressive.

I want to be clear I do not think anyone in the house is a racist but I do feel as though there are some biases within the house

I see that you have chosen to now move on from me now that I have exposed your manner of engaging and that you simply cannot refute my points.

OK, I take that as a win.

BUT... " but I do feel as though there are some biases".. We all have biases, including clearly you, but they are not all implicitly racial biases.

[caprimint]

I think so because there are two people who are similar in their confidence, bluntness, loudness and honesty and yet it’s the person who is black that is being labelled aggressive.

I want to be clear I do not think anyone in the house is a racist but I do feel as though there are some biases within the house
Do you mean Trish and Olivia? I think if anything it's the way in which Trish argues with people that triggered the "aggressive" comments (most of all with Paul though and how she labelled him), Olivia is loud in general but she isn't condescending towards people when she talks/argues, whereas Trish always believes she's right and never listens to anyone else, just repeats her point over and over again until they don't answer back...

[vesavius]

I love Trish BECAUSE she is aggressive in the way that she stands up for herself.

[Conzors]

I see that you have chosen to now move on from me now that I have exposed your manner of engaging and that you simply cannot refute my points.

OK, I take that as a win.

BUT... " but I do feel as though there are some biases".. We all have biases, including clearly you, but they are not all implicitly racial biases.

I chose not to reply to you because you because I didn’t want you to think I was insulting your character when I don’t know you to insult your character lol and I wanted to keep the thread on the discussion instead of replies to each other back and fourth getting on each others tits when it’s not personal.

You can take it as a win, it doesn’t bother me :)

I believe they are racial biases, you don’t, I’ve given reasons as to why I think they are and you haven’t given any valid reasons in my opinion.

[Conzors]

Do you mean Trish and Olivia? I think if anything it's the way in which Trish argues with people that triggered the "aggressive" comments (most of all with Paul though and how she labelled him), Olivia is loud in general but she isn't condescending towards people when she talks/argues, whereas Trish always believes she's right and never listens to anyone else, just repeats her point over and over again until they don't answer back...

I feel as though Olivia is condescending when talking to people, especially Yinrun, not so much recently though however

[vesavius]

I chose not to reply to you because you because I didn’t want you to think I was insulting your character

Well, just do that by not making it about me and sticking to the point.

But, AGAIN, I didn't 'think' that you were attacking my character.. You literally did. More gaslighting. You need to work on that.


I believe they are racial biases, you don’t, I’ve given reasons as to why I think they are and you haven’t given any valid reasons in my opinion.

You believe that because you see everything through a racial lens. Your worldview lacks nuance and wider understanding.

You haven't given any valid reasons to support your view. Just your biased perception.

(Yes, this is all me criticsing your character, seeing as you opened that door, but hopefully constructively)

[caprimint]

I feel as though Olivia is condescending when talking to people, especially Yinrun, not so much recently though however
Even Trish as her good friend is still more condescending towards Yinrun :shrug: Last night in the bathroom was a really awkward watch. Olivia is just impulsive I think and she always apologises afterwards in pretty much every situation but Trish NEVER backs down. Trish is also 10 years older than her so...

But realistically there's no need for race to even be a discussion here, nobody has done/said anything racist so to imagine/assume that is racist in itself

[GlitterUK]

Trish herself hasn't said the race thing but it will interesting once she is out to see if she starts to say it.

[Conzors]

Well, just do that by not making it about me and sticking to the point.

But, AGAIN, I didn't 'think' that you were attacking my character.. You literally did. More gaslighting. You need to work on that.




You believe that because you see everything through a racial lens. Your worldview lacks nuance and wider understanding.

You haven't given any valid reasons to support your view. Just your biased perception.

(Yes, this is all me criticsing your character, seeing as you opened that door, but hopefully constructively)

I don’t see it as insulting my character, it’s a forum so questions and opinions are allowed. I don’t think I insulted yours I just asked why it made you uncomfortable talking about it.

Let’s stop conversing here we clearly got off on the wrong foot, let’s keep to the subject :)

[Conzors]

Even Trish as her good friend is still more condescending towards Yinrun :shrug: Last night in the bathroom was a really awkward watch. Olivia is just impulsive I think and she always apologises afterwards in pretty much every situation but Trish NEVER backs down. Trish is also 10 years older than her so...

But realistically there's no need for race to even be a discussion here, nobody has done/said anything racist so to imagine/assume that is racist in itself

I agree with the Olivia thing, she does see where she does wrong and apologises, it’s a good trait she has.

I don’t think anyone is racist either, I just think it’s weird that one is labelled aggressive when I personally feel as though Olivia is more aggressive than Trish.

[GoldHeart]

I agree with the Olivia thing, she does see where she does wrong and apologises, it’s a good trait she has.

I don’t think anyone is racist either, I just think it’s weird that one is labelled aggressive when I personally feel as though Olivia is more aggressive than Trish.

It is very weird I agree .

[vesavius]

I just asked why it made you uncomfortable talking about it.

As I have have said repeatedtly, it doesn't. This is gaslighting.

Let’s stop conversing here we clearly got off on the wrong foot, let’s keep to the subject :)

All you need to do is stop attempting to gaslight me.

But, ok, sure. But first, do you recognise your own bias?

[fitz2k2]

Jordan put the aggressive, bully in her place.

Who has trish bullied? Im all ears

[Mokka]

The micro-aggressions are clear as day to me.

This

[Mokka]

As I have have said repeatedtly, it doesn't. This is gaslighting.



All you need to do is stop attempting to gaslight me.

But, ok, sure. But first, do you recognise your own bias?

I don't think gaslighting means what you think it means. You are using the term over and over to manipulate and shut down the conversation...which is basically gaslighting lol.

[Garfie]

I might be opening a whole other can of worms here, but I’ve always seen more of a social and/or intellectual divide, rather than a racial divide in the house. The upstairs crowd are a culturally mixed group of individuals, whose conversations seem to suggest they are knowledgeable, well-educated and more intellectual than the garden group. From their conversations, I would imagine the majority are university educated.

The garden group do not tend to have deep, intellectual conversations, and their backgrounds seem to be more typically working class.

To me, that is the reason why certain people have connected and why the two groups have formed. (And this comes from someone from a traditional working class background, who independently put themselves through a university education a little later than average).

[Atake25]

Trish can be aggressive in a confrontation The way she told Jordan not to say crap to Chanelle was aggressive, even though she said she didn’t mean it like that the tone and the pointing and the language was aggressive
The loud conversation about not talking to Chanelle was aggressive , I’ve heard her use a tone lots of times that can come across as aggressive
Noki has never been called aggressive because she isn’t She’s the opposite of aggressive
Both black skinned ladies one is aggressive and one is mild tempered
Trish just wanted to be aggressive but people be too afraid to challenge that or be called s racist
I used to love her but she uses the racist card too much

[bots]

I might be opening a whole other can of worms here, but I’ve always seen more of a social and/or intellectual divide, rather than a racial divide in the house. The upstairs crowd are a culturally mixed group of individuals, whose conversations seem to suggest they are knowledgeable, well-educated and more intellectual than the garden group. From their conversations, I would imagine the majority are university educated.

The garden group do not tend to have deep, intellectual conversations, and their backgrounds seem to be more typically working class.

To me, that is the reason why certain people have connected and why the two groups have formed. (And this comes from someone from a traditional working class background, who independently put themselves through a university education a little later than average).

i think that is certainly a factor and it could easily be driving all the conflict

[Jessica.]

Trish herself hasn't said the race thing but it will interesting once she is out to see if she starts to say it.

She literally spoke about it on the podcast task.

[vesavius]

Gaslighting... You are using the term over and over to manipulate and shut down the conversation

How is asking to talk about the topic rather than making personal attacks attempting to 'shut down' a conversation or 'manipulating' someone?

Be serious.

...which is basically gaslighting lol.

This post is ridiculous.

Anyhow, I have zero interest in cluttering up the thread with this any more than it has, so if you want to discuss it with me any more feel free to PM.

[Zizu]

I might be opening a whole other can of worms here, but I’ve always seen more of a social and/or intellectual divide, rather than a racial divide in the house. The upstairs crowd are a culturally mixed group of individuals, whose conversations seem to suggest they are knowledgeable, well-educated and more intellectual than the garden group. From their conversations, I would imagine the majority are university educated.

The garden group do not tend to have deep, intellectual conversations, and their backgrounds seem to be more typically working class.

To me, that is the reason why certain people have connected and why the two groups have formed. (And this comes from someone from a traditional working class background, who independently put themselves through a university education a little later than average).


Yes I’d agree

You make some valid points


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[Zizu]

Who has trish bullied? Im all ears


It was nothing .. a 60 second interaction between Jordan and Trish ..


Let’s just say that they could have both handled it better


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[Conzors]

Yes I’d agree

You make some valid points


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I still think it is slightly racial but I don’t think it’s a conscious thing. I don’t think they think they are better than Trish but they are certainly labelling her as the ‘angry black woman’ because she’s opinionated but they label Olivia as ‘strong minded’ it’s a joke tbh

[Zizu]

I still think it is slightly racial but I don’t think it’s a conscious thing. I don’t think they think they are better than Trish but they are certainly labelling her as the ‘angry black woman’ because she’s opinionated but they label Olivia as ‘strong minded’ it’s a joke tbh


True


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[vesavius]

I still think it is slightly racial but I don’t think it’s a conscious thing. I don’t think they think they are better than Trish but they are certainly labelling her as the ‘angry black woman’ because she’s opinionated but they label Olivia as ‘strong minded’ it’s a joke tbh

See, here is the real problem.

You are arguing a feeling and then asking for people to debate that feeling with you and give evidence to disprove a thing that only exists in your head as your own subconscious bias.

Look, Olivia, and I am NOT a fan... I support Trish, is not seen as angry simply because she hasn't had a meaningful stand up angry argument with anyone in there.

Trish has at least a couple of times.

I like Trish a lot, but this isn't about the two women being 'strong', it's about how they have behaved outside of that. The truth is that Trish can def get angry and loves a fight. I don't even see a problem with that though personally. I quite like that about her.

As I say, if you only see everything through a racial lens then suddenly everying looks racist even when it isn't.

[letmein]

Trish is like a schoolmarm or your mother giving you endless lectures. After awhile that becomes irritating. She loves hearing herself talk. When she’s in the room with a bunch of people, who’s the one talking endlessly to everyone? Trish. The crew outside talk mostly about inane things while Trish is pontificating about the injustices of life. I don’t dislike her. She’s helped a lot of people in there, and I’d even be pleased if she won, however, it’s easy to see how she can become annoying to people, at least after awhile.