Tories plan to bring back National Service

[Denver]

Sunak has confirmed if the Tories pull up an unlikely win at the next General Election they will put plans in motion that will see all 18 year olds face 1 year national service

[Crimson Dynamo]

:dance2:

[Black Dagger]

Officially ran out of ideas

[Denver]

Officially ran out of ideas

The UK has thousands of problems but National Service isn't one and should have been bottom of any list of pledges

[joeysteele]

I wouldn't support that.

The Cons certainly seem to like TELLING people what to do in their lives rather than ASKING them.
I went to University at 18, there's no way I'd have been impressed if I'd had to go into National Service.
No way, not a chance.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I wouldn't support that.

The Cons certainly seem to like TELLING people what to do in their lives rather than ASKING them.

asking young people?

that is a massive mistake

they don't know their rear ends from their elbows

have a look at the twats at our unis

total woke mind virus rockets

[UserSince2005]

smart to give a load of 18 year old jihadis a gun.

[joeysteele]

asking young people?

that is a massive mistake

they don't know their rear ends from their elbows

have a look at the twats at our unis

total woke mind virus rockets

UK citizens are considered adult at 18.
So yes, consulting and asking first is the decent thing to do.

When we had National Service before when the adult age was deemed to be 21.
It had to be between 18 to 21.
Not at or after 21.

I hear from younger people often far more sense than from more bigoted people who are a lot older and actually delude themselves into thinking they're an example to others.
Huh!

[Denver]

It's funny how everyone who is supporting this didn't actually do national service themselves, maybe we should backdate it and have them go first

[bots]

people need to wake up. We have war on our doorstep. We will have to move to a war footing whatever party wins the election

[Mystic Mock]

It's a good thing that they're not winning the Election then.

And I can tell that David Cameron is back in the party with this policy rearing it's ugly head again.

[Mystic Mock]

It's funny how everyone who is supporting this didn't actually do national service themselves, maybe we should backdate it and have them go first

:clap1:

[Mystic Mock]

people need to wake up. We have war on our doorstep. We will have to move to a war footing whatever party wins the election

Do you think it'll be fought like it was back in the WWII days?

Russia can barely handle Ukraine, they'd be crazy to come for the UK in the same manner.

[joeysteele]

It's a good thing that they're not winning the Election then.

And I can tell that David Cameron is back in the party with this policy rearing it's ugly head again.

You're dead right on that Mock.

[arista]

:dance2:

He has left it too late.


Should have done it a year ago


He will not win the Election.

[arista]

people need to wake up. We have war on our doorstep. We will have to move to a war footing whatever party wins the election

Yes would help all 18-year-olds



Of Course,
Sunak is not going to win.

All polls taken, say he is to be kicked out


Also this is just a Weekend or so.

[Mystic Mock]

He has left it too late.


Should have done it a year ago


He will now win the Election.

The National Service policy is too divisive to ever win a party the Election.

[arista]

The National Service policy is too divisive to ever win a party the Election.


Yes a dream


Thank You Wise Katy Balls
who said it would not start until 2029


WW3 is likely before then

[MTVN]

The actual plan is this:

It said 18-year-olds would have a choice of either joining the military full-time for 12 months, or volunteering one weekend every month carrying out a community service.

The party is proposing a Royal Commission to consider the details but would plan for the first teenagers to take part in September 2025.

The cost is expected to be around £2.5bn per year.

Under the plans, young people could choose a full-time placement in the armed forces or UK cyber defence, learning about logistics, cyber security, procurement or civil response operations.

Their other option would be to volunteer one weekend per month - or 25 days per year - in their community with organisations such as fire, police and the NHS.

Which is not quite as onerous. Interestingly it is still used in the majority of countries in the world including many of those which are seen as quite progressive. Denmark recently expanded their national service to also include all women of the relevant age

[Ammi]

…I would say that he’s just alienated many potential votes of many young people…as well as their parents…and grandparents…and aunts and uncles and etc…

[arista]

If you refuse

NO jail.

Home Secretary On Trevor Phillips SkyNewsHD

[arista]

…I would say that he’s just alienated many potential votes of many young people…as well as their parents…and grandparents…and aunts and uncles and etc…


But you can refuse

[Ammi]

…so it’s not really National Service, then…

[joeysteele]

Now after his announcement he's clouding the issue again.

This PMs deceit is unbelievable.
It cannot be National Service if any kind that has to be done but still can be voluntary.

So just what is this useless and incompetent proposing.

I say again.
Dictating to people who are adults that they must do something like this is neither good governing or even respectful.

I was at Uni at 18.
I'd have refused to do any of this whatever he's proposing.
So if I had, what would he have done about that.

This is what he does, fires a badly thought out idea then confuses and divides afterwards.

If it's mandatory then it's not voluntary.
Surely even Fishy Sunak can work that one out.

[Crimson Dynamo]

send them to Israel for 12 months to get trained up and help there

[joeysteele]

…so it’s not really National Service, then…

Who knows Ammi ???

Where Sunak's thinking comes from who can REALLY know how his mind works.

It cannot however be ANY service that's voluntary if it's going to be mandatory.
Surely Sunak isn't that stupid that he cannot realise that .

[arista]

…so it’s not really National Service, then…


It is an Old War type one


You can help on other things (unpaid)

Or

Military (get paid)

[joeysteele]

It's badly thought out nonsense.

[DemRed]

Fishi sunak is following israel footsteps... Force teenagers into army.

[DemRed]

It's funny how everyone who is supporting this didn't actually do national service themselves, maybe we should backdate it and have them go first

Oh I don't know. I think some people on here likely did, going by their attitude.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Oh I don't know. I think some people on here likely did, going by their attitude.

sigh

ageism is a nice look

[Mystic Mock]

Tbf it is hypocritical for people who never had to go through National Service when they were teens, to now want to push National Service onto the current generation of teens.

You should never wish for something to happen to people that you wouldn't want to have happened to you.

[Glenn.]

It's funny how everyone who is supporting this didn't actually do national service themselves, maybe we should backdate it and have them go first

.

[arista]

Fishi sunak is following israel footsteps... Force teenagers into army.


Its OK
he (Sunak) can not.

Focus Groups gave Sunak the idea


Wasted From pages on it
I had to chuck them on the Election thread

Sunak not going to Win

[Ammi]

It's funny how everyone who is supporting this didn't actually do national service themselves, maybe we should backdate it and have them go first

…with any mandatory service, lead by example …?…

[Ammi]

Fishi sunak is following israel footsteps... Force teenagers into army.

…it kind of manipulates unemployment figures, doesn’t it…:laugh:…actually it’s probably manipulative of lots of things…/statistics…

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GOdmZniWkAEOZ41?format=jpg&name=360x360

[Cherie]

Its great being old for a change :dance:

[Cherie]

They should have rebranded, its not National Service per se he is proposing as it is voluntary... I was listening to a debate on this a few weeks back and its not about going into the trenches, its more about cyber attacks and modern warfare and utilising peoples skills in a way that would protect the country in the event of war

[arista]

Does not need to be rebranded

It is all after the Election

[arista]

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2024/05/25/23/85341573-0-image-m-3_1716677731104.jpg

[bots]

we are a whisker away from nato being dragged in to a war. What do people think happens then?

Both labour and the tories have committed to increases in defence spending. What do people think that means?

We need to be prepared, because we are a small country with a tiny armed services. Would people rather that people got some training, or would they prefer what Russia have been doing, anhd sending 18 year olds, completely untrained, to the front. line.

I get it, it is a scary thing to think about, but would people really rather bury their heads in the sand and wait till it happens? or get prepared now

[AnnieK]

The threat of something happening is definitely increasing. My son goes to Army cadets and they have now been told not to travel to their parade nights each week in their uniform as it raises their threat of being attacked.

I'm not in favour of National Service but we do need investment in our military.....the world is a scary place at the moment

[joeysteele]

As for James (not so) Cleverley interviewed this morning, well he made a right mess of trying yo explain it.

Obviously he's just had this plucked out of the air idea foisted on to him.

Then he says it wouldn't be criminal to refuse it.
What on earth?
Do they really listen to themselves.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I think the Swiss have it and Nordic countries and Germany are also set to introduce it

[arista]

I think the Swiss have it and Nordic countries and Germany are also set to introduce it


Yes they all need to
While Putin is alive

[Livia]

I bet the Army is shuddering thinking about taking in the average 18 year old. Heaven knows who's going to fight our wars in the future.

[Cherie]

I think we have to be realistic its going to happen whatever government get in

[Kate!]

It's badly thought out nonsense.

It is, and a lot of people even of that young age are either not physically or mentally fit for service. Even something minor can preclude people from signing up. My brother enlisted in the army at 18 and was discharged due to hay-fever. Just one example.

I'm not averse however to the voluntary aspect, if they have enough respect to do it willingly.

[Glenn.]

I think just being able to afford food is what people want for the minute

[joeysteele]

It is, and a lot of people even of that young age are either not physically or mentally fit for service. Even something minor can preclude people from signing up. My brother enlisted in the army at 18 and was discharged due to hay-fever. Just one example.

I'm not averse however to the voluntary aspect, if they have enough respect to do it willingly.

Voluntary would be fine.

For me it's a no go at all even if it's not REALLY being in the forces.

As for the other side of it.
It's worrying.
James more Stupidly than Cleverley, says the could be special Constables.
WHAT??

Do they ever listen to the absolute tripe they put in their heads then out to the public.
Honestly, there's never been a government in my view, that has warranted being well and truly booted out as much as this shambolic shower does.

As I said before, I was at Uni at 18 years old.
If they'd tried this then, I'd have taken my chance and told them what to do with it.
I'd have refused point blank to have anything to do with it.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Voluntary would be fine.

For me it's a no go at all even if it's not REALLY being in the forces.

As for the other side of it.
It's worrying.
James more Stupidly than Cleverley, says the could be special Constables.
WHAT??

Do they ever listen to the absolute tripe they put in their heads then out to the public.
Honestly, there's never been a government in my view, that has warranted being well and truly booted out as much as this shambolic shower does.

As I said before, I was at Uni at 18 years old.
If they'd tried this then, I'd have taken my chance and told them what to do with it.
I'd have refused point blank to have anything to do with it.

Yet you are happy to be compelled to pay for a BBC TV license?

[joeysteele]

Yet you are happy to be compelled to pay for a BBC TV license?

Don't start me on that one
Like arista I detest the TV licence
Always have.
I begrudge every single pence of it

However paying a TV licence doesn't take away from me what I want and choose to do with MY own TIME and LIFE.

[Cherie]

I think it could work if they linked it to something, alot of kids come out of Uni straight into Uni and then regret their choice of course and start another the following year, if doing this service was linked to a reduction of Uni fees in the first year or pushed kids up the list for apprenticeships or if it were linked to a definate apprenticeship it might be more palatable

[Crimson Dynamo]

well it wont happen as the Tories are set for a well deserved wipe out (IN England and Wales (wales deserve all the sh1t they get for their socialism and are reaping now what they sow)

The Scottish Conservatives should do ok

[Crimson Dynamo]

https://cdn.images.express.co.uk/img/dynamic/139/590x/secondary/Compulsory-UK-Army-conscription-pledged-by-Rishi-Sunak-5394714.jpg?r=1716703250037

The past few months have provided too much evidence that Britain is a society fraying at the seams. The rise of identity politics – and the associated attacks on
British history and our shared national values – threatens to be a disaster for social cohesion if it is not arrested in time. The anti-Israel hate marches have
exposed the extent to which extremist views have already taken root. This is all happening at a time of huge international insecurity, and warnings of new military
conflicts to come.

So it is extremely welcome that the Conservatives have come up with a refreshingly bold idea to restore a sense of national pride among the younger generation.
The Prime Minister is proposing to introduce mandatory national service for all 18-year-olds, which could see young people choose between a full-time 12-month
placement in the Armed Forces or performing voluntary work one weekend every month. A Royal Commission would be established to design the details of the
programme.

Britain hasn’t had national service since the 1960s, and Rishi Sunak’s proposal is bound to be controversial. The pacifist Left will fret that it represents a
“militarisation” of society when the reality is that Britain has become too distant from its Armed Forces. The dramatic shrinking in the size of the Army, RAF and
Navy has meant that they are not as present in our national life as they once were, outside of ceremonial occasions.

More of the younger generation would benefit from exposure to their values. The Left might consider honour, dignity, discipline, and love of the nation and its
institutions to be “problematic”, but most of the country would not.

Others will complain that young people should not be compelled by the state to participate in particular activities, even volunteering. But freedom comes with
responsibilities, and Britain would hardly be unusual in Europe if it introduced such a scheme.

Other countries consider variations of national service to be a vital tool in inculcating a sense of shared national endeavour, at a time of societal fragmentation,
social media, and international insecurity. Young people would also get opportunities to learn real-world skills they might not find on university campuses.

As Mr Sunak put it in his speech on extremism earlier in the year, “the world’s most successful multi-ethnic, multi-faith democracy is being deliberately
undermined. There are forces here at home trying to tear us apart.” The onus is therefore on our political leaders to come up with creative ideas to counteract
those malign forces. The Prime Minister’s plan for national service deserves the country’s support.

[bots]

this plan on "national service" is designed to take reform voters. Sunak is transparent

[DemRed]

Â…it kind of manipulates unemployment figures, doesnÂ’t itÂ…:laugh:Â…actually itÂ’s probably manipulative of lots of thingsÂ…/statisticsÂ…

Good point Ammi. On top of that, we no longer have the fighting force we once did and Sunak seems to think there's an imminent war looming.
One things for sure, my sons, will not be going anywhere to fight a proxy war, unless its 100% their choice.

[Alf]

Send the little sods to the Russian front.

Give them a machette, they'll be in their element.

[Gusto Brunt]

Waste of time discussing it as the best the Tories can wish for is a hung Parliament and Labour won't agree to it.

It's never gonna happen. Next!

[Cherie]

Waste of time discussing it as the best the Tories can wish for is a hung Parliament and Labour won't agree to it.

It's never gonna happen. Next!

wellllll if the world pivots, it might not be in any manifesto but a reality

[bots]

Waste of time discussing it as the best the Tories can wish for is a hung Parliament and Labour won't agree to it.

It's never gonna happen. Next!

you do realise that we are part of Nato, and if russia attacks any nato country, we have a commitment to come to their defence.

We need to be ready. I think the Sunak government message is wrong, but it doesn't change the reality of the situation in europe. Labour or tories need to be ready for war, because the alternative is unthinkable

[user104658]

this plan on "national service" is designed to take reform voters. Sunak is transparent

Correct and on the slim chance that the Tories do stay in power - they simply won't do it. It will not come to pass. Guarantee it. Hot air for votes, smoke and mirrors, absolute nonsense lol.

[arista]

BBC News Text:
[There's more criticism of the Tories'
national service plan in the Guardian,
with the paper quoting an ex-military chief
describing it as "bonkers". Adm Lord West,
a former chief of the naval staff,
told the paper that
"we need to spend more on defence, and - by doing
what [Sunak is] suggesting, money will
be sucked out of defence".]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/3e4c/live/305f8e90-1ba4-11ef-a13a-0b8c563da930.jpg.webp

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/48a3/live/a8386ed0-1ba1-11ef-a13a-0b8c563da930.jpg.webp

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/989b/live/64cd6910-1ba2-11ef-80aa-699d54c46324.jpg.webp

[Beso]

…it kind of manipulates unemployment figures, doesn’t it…:laugh:…actually it’s probably manipulative of lots of things…/statistics…

It will definitely manipulate the amount of idiotic youngsters who believe they can suddenly become a man after being born female if it's only men who will be doing it.

[Mystic Mock]

I think the Swiss have it and Nordic countries and Germany are also set to introduce it

That doesn't make it right.

[arista]

That doesn't make it right.

He would need to win the Election on Thursday 4th of July.



And no one says they can win?

[Mystic Mock]

He would need to win the Election on Thursday 4th of July.



And no one says they can win?

It's unlikely, but not impossible that he might win.

I mean Starmer isn't exactly beloved himself.

[arista]

It's unlikely, but not impossible that he might win.

I mean Starmer isn't exactly beloved himself.


Yes they (Labour Party)
have lost 4 elections
so they must tread correctly.

[arista]

Don't start me on that one
Like arista I detest the TV licence
Always have.
I begrudge every single pence of it

However paying a TV licence doesn't take away from me what I want and choose to do with MY own TIME and LIFE.


Yes the BBC TV Tax
is wrong in every way

[Ammi]

Good point Ammi. On top of that, we no longer have the fighting force we once did and Sunak seems to think there's an imminent war looming.
One things for sure, my sons, will not be going anywhere to fight a proxy war, unless its 100% their choice.

….’mandatory’ is just another step of removing freedoms and gaining government control, isn’t it …’we fought for our freedoms’…yes, and we’ll have those back, please…it really defines their rule and power abuse so well…

[Zizu]

Can’t wait to see the opening lineup photo showing the first couple of thousand recruits .

There won’t be any young soccer thugs / gang members or immigrants ( illegal or first/second gen) - they will all find a way of avoiding national service !

It will be all the nice , law abiding home grown English lads risking their lives for everyone else


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[bots]

….’mandatory’ is just another step of removing freedoms and gaining government control, isn’t it …’we fought for our freedoms’…yes, and we’ll have those back, please…it really defines their rule and power abuse so well…

there are several things going on here. First, the tories view the reform party as a threat in the election that could suck away tory voters. Suggesting national service, takes away some of their thunder.

Second, if things deteriorate further in europe, we may need to introduce some training to ready everybody for worst case scenarios going forward, however, the only reason to mention it in the run up to an election, is to try and unsettle labour, and force them into making a mis statement on defence. That to me is the main purpose of bringing it up, because they have absolutely no need to mention it. If, in the future, our families are at risk of death from war, there will be plenty volunteers.

[Ammi]

there are several things going on here. First, the tories view the reform party as a threat in the election that could suck away tory voters. Suggesting national service, takes away some of their thunder.

Second, if things deteriorate further in europe, we may need to introduce some training to ready everybody for worst case scenarios going forward, however, the only reason to mention it in the run up to an election, is to try and unsettle labour, and force them into making a mis statement on defence. That to me is the main purpose of bringing it up, because they have absolutely no need to mention it. If, in the future, our families are at risk of death from war, there will be plenty volunteers.

…any ‘deterioration’ of anything is because of our own government and how they’ve approached, well basically anything on any level…policing, fire services/health services etc…remove the budgeting and then ‘draft in’ free or cheap work power under the guise of ‘National Service’ and for the greater good of the Tory party …pffffftttt….theyre beyond outrageous…

[Beso]

…any ‘deterioration’ of anything is because of our own government and how they’ve approached, well basically anything on any level…policing, fire services/health services etc…remove the budgeting and then ‘draft in’ free or cheap work power under the guise of ‘National Service’ and for the greater good of the Tory party …pffffftttt….theyre beyond outrageous…

Tbf, many of our kind and caring nurses and NHS workers just upped sticks and buggered of back to where they came from when we left the EU...and we did that, not our government.

[Crimson Dynamo]

SIR – I was inspired to read about the Prime Minister’s plans for compulsory
National Service for 18-year-olds.

However, I think a similar scheme for MPs and other public servants would be
more useful.

Bill Galvin
Stockport, Cheshire

[user104658]

there are several things going on here. First, the tories view the reform party as a threat in the election that could suck away tory voters. Suggesting national service, takes away some of their thunder.

This part is correct the plan is written on sugar paper and will dissolve as soon as the election is over, either way.

Second, if things deteriorate further in europe, we may need to introduce some training to ready everybody for worst case scenarios going forward, however, the only reason to mention it in the run up to an election, is to try and unsettle labour, and force them into making a mis statement on defence. That to me is the main purpose of bringing it up, because they have absolutely no need to mention it. If, in the future, our families are at risk of death from war, there will be plenty volunteers.

Just nonsense, when there's talk of increasing defense spending it's for equipment, R&D and increased recruitment of professionals.

Bombs, missiles, planes, boats, pilots, engineers. Not feet in boots.

The UK has no need of a militia because we're an island - if enemy combatants are on the ground on UK soil the war is OVER. This was true in WW2 and it's true today.

A modern military like the UK's has no use for barely trained grunts with a rifle in hand. That's just not modern warfare. One attack helicopter is worth thousands of conscripts. War is won by $$$ not numbers.

If you want proof you need ONLY look at Ukraine, where Russian numbers have been bashing up against Western money and resources for well over a year now and making little progress. Ukraine is vastly outnumbered. It's not because of teenagers with peashooters it's because of US/Europe funded and supplied drones, ammunition and tech.

[user104658]

What we do have though is a rapidly aging population and if we do ever need to introduce compulsory national service, it'll be as carers not soldiers. Armed with wet wipes not guns.

[Ammi]

…a modern day ‘war’ conflict would never be in any way about needing a National Service type system…the only reason for that to be adopted and to happen is because the government have squeezed the budgets of all of the country services and this is a form of forcing young people into those services that they’ve stripped within an inch of any type of effectiveness…I mean, is there no low that this government won’t go to…it seems not…they create the monster that becomes almost unfixable….

[Beso]

Oh I don't know. I think some people on here likely did, going by their attitude.

Why isnt this deleted..age falls under the same discriminatory laws as disability and gender.

[Beso]

What we do have though is a rapidly aging population and if we do ever need to introduce compulsory national service, it'll be as carers not soldiers. Armed with wet wipes not guns.

As of now we are still wiping the arses of the nappy wearing 13-25 year olds.(perhaps national service might wake them up to life)...its karma coming collecting when we, get to frail.

[Mystic Mock]

Why isnt this deleted..age falls under the same discriminatory laws as disability and gender.

You can't be anti-disabled?:bawling:

Whatever happened to the good old days where you could mock people in wheelchairs?:nono:

But being serious, I think everyone would probably be banned off of the Internet if we're punishing people for prejudiced comments, especially ageist comments.

We (as a society) need to stop having such knee-jerk reactions towards words.

[Beso]

You can't be anti-disabled?:bawling:

Whatever happened to the good old days where you could mock people in wheelchairs?:nono:

But being serious, I think everyone would probably be banned off of the Internet if we're punishing people for prejudiced comments, especially ageist comments.



Deleting a comment an ageism comment isnt punishing someone. Its protecting someone from feeling punished for being old.

[Mystic Mock]

Deleting a comment an ageism comment isnt punishing someone. Its protecting someone from feeling punished for being old.

I just feel that actions speak louder than words.

I've read some insanely hateful stuff about white men on the Internet over the last couple of years, but I'd never demand for them to be deleted.

1. Freedom of speech.

And 2. You get to know an individual's real views if they're allowed to express more negative opinions, rather than the fake hug a hoodie persona that some people do like to portray on the Internet.

Imo 2 is even more important than the freedom of speech argument, you've got to be extra careful if people are being real with you nowadays.

I feel thankfully that I'm safe on TIBB, but that's because I've known you all for a very long time.

You do have to be careful on YouTube or any Social Media platform.

[Vanessa]

That is something I approve on.

[bots]

This part is correct the plan is written on sugar paper and will dissolve as soon as the election is over, either way.

Just nonsense, when there's talk of increasing defense spending it's for equipment, R&D and increased recruitment of professionals.

Bombs, missiles, planes, boats, pilots, engineers. Not feet in boots.

The UK has no need of a militia because we're an island - if enemy combatants are on the ground on UK soil the war is OVER. This was true in WW2 and it's true today.

A modern military like the UK's has no use for barely trained grunts with a rifle in hand. That's just not modern warfare. One attack helicopter is worth thousands of conscripts. War is won by $$$ not numbers.

If you want proof you need ONLY look at Ukraine, where Russian numbers have been bashing up against Western money and resources for well over a year now and making little progress. Ukraine is vastly outnumbered. It's not because of teenagers with peashooters it's because of US/Europe funded and supplied drones, ammunition and tech.


i don't think you understand our commitment to NATO. I'm not suggesting there will be an invasion on our home soil, but there could easily be one in any of the NATO countries bordering Russia. Who do you think guards and defends those borders? We will, as part of NATO, that's the whole point of it

Russian numbers aren't even an issue yet. They haven't done a proper mobilisation yet.

The biggest issue any country has is replenishing ammo, armour and aircraft and Russia have converted over to a war economy. Unless we move to a similar footing, we will get beaten and the first step of that is getting people trained and prepared. Not just to fight on the front line, but to up our game in intelligence and cyber warfare., drone technology etc etc etc

Preparation for war is as much a state of mind as anything else

[user104658]

i don't think you understand our commitment to NATO. I'm not suggesting there will be an invasion on our home soil, but there could easily be one in any of the NATO countries bordering Russia. Who do you think guards and defends those borders? We will, as part of NATO, that's the whole point of it

Russian numbers aren't even an issue yet. They haven't done a proper mobilisation yet.

The biggest issue any country has is replenishing ammo, armour and aircraft and Russia have converted over to a war economy. Unless we move to a similar footing, we will get beaten and the first step of that is getting people trained and prepared. Not just to fight on the front line, but to up our game in intelligence and cyber warfare., drone technology etc etc etc

Preparation for war is as much a state of mind as anything else

Right but that involves the armed forces upping recruitment of young people who can be trained in cyber warfare and tech (as I said - pilots, engineers). Fund it, and you'll get plenty of applicants.

It's not Jimmy Jackson who failed foundation maths, plonked in army fatigues, handed a rifle and sent into a trench.

A strong modern military is well funded and highly skilled - not overflowing with random kids who don't want to be there. It's just not the reality of modern warfare.

[user104658]

Anyway like I said the reality of it is unworkable. In terms of culture, in terms of infrastructure, in terms of Compliance ("they'll go to JAIL!" :joker: I have bad news folks, those are already fkn full!) and it simply won't happen.

You would maybe - MAYBE - get a small pilot programme going in a few specific areas in around 5 years, that would run for a few more years, then never be expanded.

Funnily enough though they have "more quietly" added in the "it won't necessarily be military..." part.

So if it is real, I think the actual intention is to use unpaid/very cheap young "national service" labour to fill out understaffed health services with carers, porters and support workers. IF it ever happens and you fast forward a couple of decades, that's what 90% will be doing. Conscripted care of the elderly. A whole different type of dystopia, but at least no ones getting shot.

[Zizu]

Maybe we should just worry about defending ourselves ONLY ??

Is that possible ??

Then we could concentrate on having an amazing air force … stationed the length and breadth of the island .. and ground defence systems around the perimeter of our island/s


I can dream ..


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[user104658]

Maybe we should just worry about defending ourselves ONLY ??

Is that possible ??

Then we could concentrate on having an amazing air force … stationed the length and breadth of the island .. and ground defence systems around the perimeter of our island/s


I can dream ..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

I mean even if not one bomb falls on the UK, if Europe gets nuked then the fallout means all of our crops die and we get riddled with cancer/starve so the air force won't be much use. Tee hee.

[user104658]

Sometimes I honestly wonder what people have been sniffing though. If Russia actually ever goes to war with NATO it's game over. Not "we need to get on a war footing" but we need to have as much fun as physically possible in the few years we have left before we all die (or worse). Prepping for a war between Russia and NATO. Stop kidding yourself!

[Ammi]

…just to add to this being about trying to think of solutions to pad out essential services that this government has destroyed with lack of funding…(…and rather than just put the funding back in…) …there is no one left to train young people because the services are so bare and minimum and barely getting through their own days, let alone what the training of inexperience would involve…the whole concept is without any logic whatsoever….

[Beso]

1st lesson.

How to iron clothes.

[MTVN]

This part is correct the plan is written on sugar paper and will dissolve as soon as the election is over, either way.

Just nonsense, when there's talk of increasing defense spending it's for equipment, R&D and increased recruitment of professionals.

Bombs, missiles, planes, boats, pilots, engineers. Not feet in boots.

The UK has no need of a militia because we're an island - if enemy combatants are on the ground on UK soil the war is OVER. This was true in WW2 and it's true today.

A modern military like the UK's has no use for barely trained grunts with a rifle in hand. That's just not modern warfare. One attack helicopter is worth thousands of conscripts. War is won by $$$ not numbers.

If you want proof you need ONLY look at Ukraine, where Russian numbers have been bashing up against Western money and resources for well over a year now and making little progress. Ukraine is vastly outnumbered. It's not because of teenagers with peashooters it's because of US/Europe funded and supplied drones, ammunition and tech.

I'm not sure about that actually. Ukraine's army is massive - it always was huge but now with conscription the manpower factor is bigger. It's a real meat grinder of a war where both sides are losing huge numbers. Obviously technology and weaponry are important but troop numbers is also vital

[Livia]

No matter how technological war becomes there will always be a need for infantry.

[joeysteele]

…just to add to this being about trying to think of solutions to pad out essential services that this government has destroyed with lack of funding…(…and rather than just put the funding back in…) …there is no one left to train young people because the services are so bare and minimum and barely getting through their own days, let alone what the training of inexperience would involve…the whole concept is without any logic whatsoever….

Dead right.

[user104658]

No matter how technological war becomes there will always be a need for infantry.

A need for infantry and a need for conscription/national service are completely different things.

[DemRed]

Why isnt this deleted..age falls under the same discriminatory laws as disability and gender.

Wow I didn't know you were part of the cancel culture

[Beso]

Wow I didn't know you were part of the cancel culture

I'm not..

Say what you want in the real world, but this is TIBB. A place where you cant disagree with homosexuality because of your religious beliefs, because it offends other users. :shrug:

Well your agism offends me, and age is covered in the same bracket as sexuality is in the discrimination laws in the outside. I've not reported the comment, just highlighted TIBBS 2 tier moderating system that protects homosexuals feelings whilst at the same time ignoring mine.

[Glenn.]

I'm not..

Say what you want in the real world, but this is TIBB. A place where you cant disagree with homosexuality because of your religious beliefs, because it offends other users. :shrug:

Well your agism offends me, and age is covered in the same bracket as sexuality is in the discrimination laws in the outside. I've not reported the comment, just highlighted TIBBS 2 tier moderating system that protects homosexuals feelings whilst at the same time ignoring mine.

Someone doesn’t like the fact his homophobia isn’t tolerated on tibb :joker:

Bless you

[Glenn.]

I like how parm is suddenly religious to try and get away with his homophobia too :joker:

Perhaps he should read the bible

How bad is drinking in the Bible?
The Bible forbids drunkenness.

God says, "Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit." (Ephesians 5:6) In fact, there are many verses in the Bible which speak out against drunkenness. (For a few examples, see Romans 13:13; Galatians 5:19-21; 1 Peter 4:3.)

You cannot serve both God and money” (Matt. 6:24). Because gambling can put a person into a position of being mastered by addiction and debts, this principle needs to be front and center for any Christian considering gambling. The Bible warns us against the compulsion to strike it rich

Maybe if you’re gonna play that game you should stick to ALL of the rules

[Beso]

Someone doesn’t like the fact his homophobia isn’t tolerated on tibb :joker:

Bless you


It's you that will be answering to God in the end, not me.

[Glenn.]

It's you that will be answering to God in the end, not me.

Lmao I’m not even gonna dignify that with a proper response because we both know you’re full of ****

[Beso]

Lmao I’m not even gonna dignify that with a proper response because we both know you’re full of ****

I dread to think what you're full off.

[Glenn.]

It’s interesting. It’s always the closeted gays that are the most homophobic. I’d say this is a safe space for you parm but it isn’t anymore

[Glenn.]

I dread to think what you're full off.

Don’t hate on me because you ain’t getting any mate. Being a lonely guy with just his hands for company must be really tough.

[Beso]

I suggest you go pay off your rent, Glenn.

[Glenn.]

Don’t understand what you’re saying mate? Am I missing the punch line?

[Zizu]

Sometimes I honestly wonder what people have been sniffing though. If Russia actually ever goes to war with NATO it's game over. Not "we need to get on a war footing" but we need to have as much fun as physically possible in the few years we have left before we all die (or worse). Prepping for a war between Russia and NATO. Stop kidding yourself!


Oddly enough ..

Ukrainian strike on Russian nuclear radar system causes alarm in West
Analysts warn Kyiv should avoid striking nuclear infrastructure after it carries out another attack on Russian territory
James Kilner
26 May 2024 • 5:38pm


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[Mystic Mock]

Sometimes I honestly wonder what people have been sniffing though. If Russia actually ever goes to war with NATO it's game over. Not "we need to get on a war footing" but we need to have as much fun as physically possible in the few years we have left before we all die (or worse). Prepping for a war between Russia and NATO. Stop kidding yourself!

I just think that Russia would be insane to basically detonate themselves, if they were to go for NATO.

I mean I've seen crazy and illogical **** happen before, but that's just begging to be massacred.

I would seriously advise Russia not to attack NATO as they (Russia) would lose.

[Mystic Mock]

Don’t hate on me because you ain’t getting any mate. Being a lonely guy with just his hands for company must be really tough.

It depends on the day tbh.

[Livia]

A need for infantry and a need for conscription/national service are completely different things.
I get that.. But you've said if we go to war with Russia it's 'game over'. I don't agree. As part of NATO, we could be forced to fight for another member and it will be ground forces, slogging it out. National Service soldiers will have 3 months basic training and at the end of their service most will leave, but some will stay. And those who leave will remain on the reserves list. It sounds like good prep to me. WW2 was fought mostly with conscripts, a large number of whom would have been Infantry.

[user104658]

I get that.. But you've said if we go to war with Russia it's 'game over'. I don't agree. As part of NATO, we could be forced to fight for another member and it will be ground forces, slogging it out. National Service soldiers will have 3 months basic training and at the end of their service most will leave, but some will stay. And those who leave will remain on the reserves list. It sounds like good prep to me. WW2 was fought mostly with conscripts, a large number of whom would have been Infantry.

I honestly believe that if Russia openly engages any NATO member in a way that would require that level of conflict, the correct course of action is to plan a few nice picnics before the world ends. It's not the 1940's, the world will not recover from global war on that sort of scale, so there's nothing to fight for. I don't think there's a scenario where Russia and NATO engage in conventional warfare on a level that would need conscripts, without an inevitability of nuclear escalation.

[Livia]

I just don't believe it would escalate to nuclear war. That Russia will nuke NATO and NATO will fire on Russia and China gets involved... and it's the end of the world. I believe that it would slog out like Ukraine but on a larger, deadlier scale and leading the charge will be the Poor Blood Infantry. Let's hope neither scenario is on the cards.