UK Farmers, London Protests

[arista]

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BBC News Text:
[Ports and supermarkets could be targeted
by farmers who are threatening
to protest over tax increases,
the Sunday Telegraph reports.
The paper says the chancellor's plans
to place a 20% inheritance tax on farmers' assets
worth more than £1m have received fierce backlash.
The decision has fuelled fears ordinary
family farms will be forced
out of business, it adds.]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/ace/standard/976/cpsprodpb/0b2a/live/3683a030-9ee5-11ef-8538-e1655f5a8342.jpg.webp

[arista]

https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-8991fd14-2f2e-4d6f-8996-2fa570d12d4c.png

[arista]

Sky News Text :
[Farmers have been told by the chancellor
they "must pay inheritance tax" to fund
the NHS despite mass protests
being planned,
The Daily Telegraph reports.]


https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-b59027a7-8033-434b-86f8-39739669319d.png

[joeysteele]

I'm not sure I had much sympathy for the Farmers on this.
However Clarkson on the front of the Sun has only decreased any sympathy I had further.

I'm reminded of one of my Grandfathers, when he said to me, he'd lived over 80 years and all he'd heard and seen over his life from Farmers was more complaining after complaining.
Never happy with anyone or anything.

Thinking over my 30+ years now, I've a feeling he was more correct from what I've seen of them too.

However I don't understand at all why this government, or indeed the last government because the Farmers were moaning at them too.
I don't understand why the government has created a battle with the Farmers.

Since I was about 9 I've wanted to be an MP.
However I've never been so disillusioned across the board as to politics as I am now.
I think the whole political process is one absolute mess.
From the concerning extreme divisive only rhetoric of Reform under Farage, to the chaos of the last run of Conservative governments, now seemingly unbelievable policies from this Labour government, through to the more cranky Greens.

What an unholy and almighty mess.

However I don't see why Farmers shouldn't pay extra when near everyone else seems to be going to have to.
They cannot be exempted from some things always.

[arista]

Clarkson,
has a Doctor who has advised him
not to go on the march

His Heart problem, recent.

Ref: SkyNewsHD newspaper review.

[Oliver_W]

I'm not sure I had much sympathy for the Farmers on this.


You think it's okay that family farms might be forced to close because of ridiculous taxes?

[Crimson Dynamo]

This will lead to food shortages and price rises

brilliant

[Cherie]

Have they not learned anything about not being self sufficient for food? force farmers out of business and we will be in the same boat as we are for gas .... madness.. 1 million pounds is nothing in relation to a farm, a piece of machinery could be worth half a million, farmers are generally asset rich and cash poor, we should be backing the farmers, this is where our food comes from... do we really want to be relying on imports, and as for Reeves saying its needed for the NHS...what an appalling this to say, I think everyone is heartily sick of governments throwing money at the NHS with no visible improvement

[Strictly Jake]

#panicbuyslotsofmilkcheeseandsausages

[MTVN]

So far this government has picked major battles with pensioners and with farmers, two groups that are very valued by society. Who will they go for next?

[Zizu]

So far this government has picked major battles with pensioners and with farmers, two groups that are very valued by society. Who will they go for next?


The party of the people ..


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[joeysteele]

You think it's okay that family farms might be forced to close because of ridiculous taxes?

Many people under the last government had to lose a fair bit too.

I have little sympathy for the Farmers myself, I don't dispute they do a very important job.
Plus this closing of a tax loophole for them has other things to assist.
Which I don't think they've considered enough properly yet.

I think all of paying none of or less tax, loopholes should be addressed.
Who do the Farmers actually think should pay more.
Pensioners AGAIN, or other workers .
You never hear them moaning when others have to pay extra.
They only moan when they are expected to.

It could be argued most taxes are ridiculous but if people want better and decent public services they have to be paid for by ALL not just some.
Farmers shouldn't be exempt, that's my view, fair or unfair.

I'm still stunned this government has created this with the Farmers though.
Then again I'm stunned full stop with the government at present.

[Oliver_W]

Many people under the last government had to lose a fair bit too.

I have little sympathy for the Farmers myself, I don't dispute they do a very important job.
Plus this closing of a tax loophole for them has other things to assist.
Which I don't think they've considered enough properly yet.

I think all of paying none of or less tax, loopholes should be addressed.
Who do the Farmers actually think should pay more.
Pensioners AGAIN, or other workers .
You never hear them moaning when others have to pay extra.
They only moan when they are expected to.

It could be argued most taxes are ridiculous but if people want better and decent public services they have to be paid for by ALL not just some.
Farmers shouldn't be exempt, that's my view, fair or unfair.

I'm still stunned this government has created this with the Farmers though.
Then again I'm stunned full stop with the government at present.

So where do you think food should come from? Do want farmland to be built on just so the government has some more pennies to waste?

[arista]

So far this government has picked major battles with pensioners and with farmers, two groups that are very valued by society. Who will they go for next?


Something is wrong with Labour
they say it will only affect around 175 Farmers


But around 30,000 Farmers or much more
are on their way to London.

[joeysteele]

So where do you think food should come from? Do want farmland to be built on just so the government has some more pennies to waste?

That's a gross over sensationalism.

Oliver, I don't support the Farmers on this issue.
That's my view which I've posted and you have yours.
I find the Farmers I've come across very uncompromising.

They haven't considered the whole package properly, IN my view
Plus the tax rate will be HALF the 40% everyone else has to pay anyhow.

I think the government unwise and even wrong to do it this way but it was elected to STOP ALL tax loopholes which this is.
Plus improve public services too.
That's what they'll be eventually judged on more in years to come.

If pensioners even have had to lose out then I don't see why anyone else should be special cases and not pay some extra too.
Not that you'll likely hear Farmers moaning at cuts to pensioners.

I'm sure however Farmers can find ways to avoid paying this tax.
.... .and they will I'd dare bet.

[Cherie]

So far this government has picked major battles with pensioners and with farmers, two groups that are very valued by society. Who will they go for next?

well by stealth they are screwing everyone NI rises will be passed on to the employee in lower wages or to the consumer in higher prices...

[joeysteele]

Something is wrong with Labour
they say it will affect around 5,000 Farmers


But around 30,000 Farmers or much more
are on their way to London.

Something is wrong with all the analysis but the independent estimate is apparently nearer the governments figures.
According to analysts this morning on the news.

However this awful Chancellor has presented this really badly.
It's the other part of the package that seems to be where the confusion is
That needs detailing much more clearly.

However I cannot support Farmers myself on this, so won't.
I'm far more concerned at the struggle some pensioners have right now, not Farmers.

[arista]

Jeremy Clarkson
speaking Live on SkyNewsHD

Said Labour must back down


As he walked into a Building


Westminster

[arista]

Something is wrong with all the analysis but the independent estimate is apparently nearer the governments figures.
According to analysts this morning on the news.

However this awful Chancellor has presented this really badly.
It's the other part of the package that seems to be where the confusion is
That needs detailing much more clearly.

However I cannot support Farmers myself on this, so won't.
I'm far more concerned at the struggle some pensioners have right now, not Farmers.


Could she not go Live on TV news?


Right now

[Beso]

Absolutely disgusting.

So you can buy a farm and get away scot free on these taxes, but if your family has ran a farm for decades and sometimes centuries as it's their way of life, handed down to family members who will have worked on the farm as children and adults. Getting up early every morning to care for and feed the animals in order to fill the supermarket shelves. A century of a families hard work and determination spat back in the faces of these hard working families by this inept and dangerous government, whilst the opportunists buying farms to make a quick killing are let off Scot free.

Disgusting.

[joeysteele]

Could she not go Live on TV news?


Right now

She's not really accessible to anyone she doesn't want to see arista.
She has closed her ears to anyone negative towards her.

[Liam-]

Rich guy leads horde of tories to protest Labour for taking away his tax avoidance scheme he publicly bragged about

[Cherie]

Absolutely disgusting.

So you can buy a farm and get away scot free on these taxes, but if your family has ran a farm for decades and sometimes centuries as it's their way of life, handed down to family members who will have worked on the farm as children and adults. Getting up early every morning to care for and feed the animals in order to fill the supermarket shelves. A century of a families hard work and determination spat back in the faces of these hard working families by this inept and dangerous government, whilst the opportunists buying farms to make a quick killing are let off Scot free.

Disgusting.

Yet again like the pensioners the threshold is too low, who will suffer....we know who....wont be the rich anyway

[Livia]

This will lead to food shortages and price rises

brilliant

Yes, it will. Some of my local farmers are protesting today and if I wasn't busy, I'd have gone too. Trying to blackmail the farmers into thinking this tax is for the NHS when they're sending billions abroad every year and cossetting illegals... Some small farms will disappear forever. I don't know how Labour doesn't understand just how awful and damaging this tax will be.

[arista]

LibDem Leader Ed Davey MP
spoke on TV news from the march.


The Conservative Leader spoke on the stage
there, as well.

[MTVN]

Something is wrong with Labour
they say it will affect around 500 Farmers


But around 30,000 Farmers or much more
are on their way to London.

Yes there's major discrepancy in the figures which is why they shouldn't have rushed this through with zero stakeholder consultation

Absolutely disgusting.

So you can buy a farm and get away scot free on these taxes, but if your family has ran a farm for decades and sometimes centuries as it's their way of life, handed down to family members who will have worked on the farm as children and adults. Getting up early every morning to care for and feed the animals in order to fill the supermarket shelves. A century of a families hard work and determination spat back in the faces of these hard working families by this inept and dangerous government, whilst the opportunists buying farms to make a quick killing are let off Scot free.

Disgusting.

Well said parm

[bots]

not wishing to cloud anyones thinking, but i believe the farming community has always predominantly voted tory

[Zizu]

Didn’t things go wrong when the farmers started getting paid to NOT to grow crops


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[joeysteele]

not wishing to cloud anyones thinking, but i believe the farming community has always predominantly voted tory

In my view, that doesn't matter too much
They moan at Conservative governments too.
They were at odds with the one just put out.

Like my Grandad said, all he'd ever heard or seen of Farmers was them constantly moaning about all governments and never happy on much at all..
For him that was from the 1920s to the 2000s.

Looks to me like he was more right.

[Oliver_W]

not wishing to cloud anyones thinking, but i believe the farming community has always predominantly voted tory

... okay?

So Tory voters deserve to be hit by unfair taxes?

[bots]

... okay?

So Tory voters deserve to be hit by unfair taxes?

Pensioners are predominantly tory voters too, starting to see a pattern?

[Alf]

They put thousands and thousands of illegals in Ritzy hotels for hundreds of millions of your pounds. But they keep smirking in your face that they don't have any money.

[MTVN]

Pensioners are predominantly tory voters too, starting to see a pattern?

Yes you're right but now Labour are in a position of actually having a lot of rural MPs. Trouble is none of those MPs are in positions of influence because they're all very new so have been left just trying to defend this to their furious constituents

[Oliver_W]

Pensioners are predominantly tory voters too, starting to see a pattern?

Ahh, gotcha.

[Cherie]

The way the world is turning, food security should be up there as the highest priority, if we are all starved there will be no one to use the NHS, what if Chinese investors come in and buy all the small farms up when they have to sell....

Very disingenous of Rachel Thieves to mention the NHS as the beneficiary

[Zizu]

Have they not learned anything about not being self sufficient for food? force farmers out of business and we will be in the same boat as we are for gas .... madness.. 1 million pounds is nothing in relation to a farm, a piece of machinery could be worth half a million, farmers are generally asset rich and cash poor, we should be backing the farmers, this is where our food comes from... do we really want to be relying on imports, and as for Reeves saying its needed for the NHS...what an appalling this to say, I think everyone is heartily sick of governments throwing money at the NHS with no visible improvement


We should have enough food for half of Europe if we had all the farmers working their land flat out .. thousands more in employment


Its pure madness how much food we import


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[UserSince2005]

As a person from a family of farmer I glad about the changes. Dirty cousins stole the farm from me because their dad was the first child and my mum didn’t want to put up fight. **** em

[Oliver_W]

The way the world is turning, food security should be up there as the highest priority, if we are all starved there will be no one to use the NHS, what if Chinese investors come in and buy all the small farms up when they have to sell....

Very disingenous of Rachel Thieves to mention the NHS as the beneficiary

They're either stupid, or spitefully greedy.

Stupid, because they can't see how these tax hikes will impact the UK's ability to produce its own food, and how losing farmland and therefore importing even more will have a massive carbon footprint... as well as costs increasing for everyone, which always hits the poor the hardest...

Or spitefully greedy because they know but don't care about any of that, and just want more money in their coffers, whatever the cost for living standards.

[arista]

https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-696c05a1-6086-4f91-9b73-30e4368c9303.jpeg

[arista]

https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-7f5b18ad-ab02-4faf-b426-fa2e2ea80b43.jpeg

[Oliver_W]

I wouldn't go so far as to call anyone stupid, there certainly are a lot of ignorant "city folk" involved in and commenting on this issue.

The alleged value of farming land doesn't truly represent how much money the farmers have or make, it's how much they'd make if they sold the land to developers.
They're not sitting on the money it would cost to pay the inheritance tax, they'd literally have to sell their land to pay it.

But some people don't see that, they just assume farmers are literal millionaires when they're working physically demanding and largely thankless jobs - to feed the country.

The politicians just don't seem to understand or care about food security.


This new tax will just kill family farms, and for what? A few extra pennies which will just be pissed up the wall like all the other tax money?

Better to focus on efficiency reforms - Whitehall and the likes are way too bloated, think about how much tax money could be saved by making cuts there.

[arista]

While Parliament had their Final PMQ's
yesterday.
The Farmers were in Central London with another protest.


https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-b87b0312-2c58-47b9-a977-01ec00c8e664.png

[The Slim Reaper]

Make them pay the same inheritance tax as everyone else who qualifies. I've seen tractors blocking Ambulances today, so i wonder why this forum doesn't consider them to be on a level with JSO protestors?

Imagine defending the financial interests of wealthy land owners over your own abilty to breath clean air.

the serfdom and feudalism of the dark ages is alive and well in 2024.

5 years in prison for every farmer, blocking in traffic, eh lads? Lads?

Farming has been most hurt by Brexit in recent years, but yet they overwhelmingly supported that.

[James]

Make them pay the same inheritance tax as everyone else who qualifies. I've seen tractors blocking Ambulances today, so i wonder why this forum doesn't consider them to be on a level with JSO protestors?

Imagine defending the financial interests of wealthy land owners over your own abilty to breath clean air.

the serfdom and feudalism of the dark ages is alive and well in 2024.

5 years in prison for every farmer, blocking in traffic, eh lads? Lads?

Farming has been most hurt by Brexit in recent years, but yet they overwhelmingly supported that.

According to polling the numbers voting for Leave in the Brexit referendum was about the same as the general population.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S074301671930436X

[bots]

Farmers can avoid inheritance tax by registering their business as a private company. What they want is to have their cake and eat it. They want to be seen as property owners to avoid the tax associated with running a company. They can't have their cake and eat it, no-one else does

[Beso]

Sign me up.

[Livia]

When farmers can't afford the inheritance tax they will be forced to part with land. Watch as that land is covered with solar panels and wind farms.

[bots]

When farmers can't afford the inheritance tax they will be forced to part with land. Watch as that land is covered with solar panels and wind farms.

the government need land to build houses on, so it's win/win for them

[The Slim Reaper]

According to polling the numbers voting for Leave in the Brexit referendum was about the same as the general population.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S074301671930436X

Thanks for the info. I thought it was wildly different to this.

[Oliver_W]

Imagine defending the financial interests of wealthy land owners


How are they wealthy land owners? Farmers aren't rich, and they'd have to sell that land to pay the inheritance tax.

Why are Labour targeting the people who want to feed the country, and keep it green?

[Livia]

I know farmers whose farms are worth millions but the farm makes around £50k annually. That's for a 365 day working year. It's a myth that they're all rolling in wealth like the Left would have us believe.

[Oliver_W]

I know farmers whose farms are worth millions but the farm makes around £50k annually. That's for a 365 day working year. It's a myth that they're all rolling in wealth like the Left would have us believe.

The land is only "worth" that amount if they were to sell it to developers, when all it's doing now is making food.

What a waste of space, eh.

[Livia]

The land is only "worth" that amount if they were to sell it to developers, when all it's doing now is making food.

What a waste of space, eh.

Yeah... I mean, we could import all our food. Chlorinated chicken and fruit and veg smothered in dangerous pesticides that are banned in the UK... Yummy.

[The Slim Reaper]

How are they wealthy land owners? Farmers aren't rich, and they'd have to sell that land to pay the inheritance tax.

Why are Labour targeting the people who want to feed the country, and keep it green?

70% of the land in the UK is owned by farmers, who produce around 50% of our food.

I've just sat through 15 years of austerity, where the absolute poorest and the disabled in society have had their meagre existences made much worse, as the tory government revelled in taking from the poor to ensure none of these people would ever have to pay more.

The refusal to take money from the top for nearly 2 decades has left this country on it's absolute arse. No country has ever cut it's way to prosperity, and unfortunately, folks need to start ponying up.Living standards in the UK are now worse than the poorer EU countries we had a brexit to stop coming here.

They pay considerably less inheritance tax than general citizens and they are given a decade to pay off the bill. At some point, harsh taxation needs to start redressing the imbalance before the country really slides into a period of extreme right wing politics.

[The Slim Reaper]

I know farmers whose farms are worth millions but the farm makes around £50k annually. That's for a 365 day working year. It's a myth that they're all rolling in wealth like the Left would have us believe.

Labour is a centre right party, not the left.

i thought "the right" believed in free markets? if a business model is unsustainable, markets dictate that we should let them die,so innovators can come in and do it better. That''s how capitalism and free markets work.

[MTVN]

Thing is the farming sector is quite deeply woven into the social fabric of a nation. Agriculture is pretty much the original human occupation and before the days of wide scale trade everywhere was totally dependent on their farmers to sustain their populations. Even now we do still grow a lot of our own food and our welfare standards are incredibly high. It's also one of the proper goods producing industries we have left while most of the economy has become services based. And many farmers only do it as a labour of love, they don't do it to make a fortune. It's one of the last true vocations left which people work their whole lives. Also an industry which isn't governed by a 9-5 and a work-life balance because there's basically no separation between the two.

All of which is a bit rambling but is basically to say - the farming sector is pretty unique and take it on at your peril.

[The Slim Reaper]

To be clear, there are way more deserving folks to go after in this country when it comes to taxation, but the fact that both major parties (neither will reform tax their donors) have absolutely zero interest in it, means that money has to come from somewhere.

Rejoining would put £40b back into the economy, but again, neither this or the next PM will tackle that white elephant.

We're currently a failing nation, and revenues need to be increased.

i'd rather tax the uber-wealthy and corporations, but our grubby political system of proto-oligarchy, makes that an impossibility in the current climate.

[Oliver_W]

70% of the land in the UK is owned by farmers, who produce around 50% of our food.

Wow they sound pretty important, better tax them into selling that land, what?

[The Slim Reaper]

Wow they sound pretty important, better tax them into selling that land, what?

Errr...what?

[joeysteele]

I've no sympathy for the Farmers at all on this one.
Sorry but I haven't.

They haven't cared one jot about others subject to paying this tax all the time they, the Farmers were exempted from it by the Thatcher government.
Now they're up in arms even though it's a reduced rate for them too.

I've no time for the Farmers at present at all.

[Livia]

Farming means owning land to farm. They're in a totally unique position. If people want to eat imported food at hiked up prices, Labour is going to make that not just a possibility, but a necessity.

[Oliver_W]

I've no sympathy for the Farmers at all on this one.
Sorry but I haven't.

They haven't cared one jot about others subject to paying this tax all the time they, the Farmers were exempted from it by the Thatcher government.
Now they're up in arms even though it's a reduced rate for them too.

I've no time for the Farmers at present at all.

What do you think they do with their land?

[MTVN]

Farming means owning land to farm. They're in a totally unique position. If people want to eat imported food at hiked up prices, Labour is going to make that not just a possibility, but a necessity.

And generally produced to lower standards along with increased risks of pests and diseases etc.

[arista]

Again,
in London with the Massive Tractors

the 3rd time there.


Labour has stated no changes
to there policy

[Oliver_W]

Again,
in London with the Massive Tractors

the 3rd time there.


Labour has stated no changes
to there policy

Hope they get a grip and drop this ridiculous idea.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I wonder if the MSM will cover this
:think:

[arista]

https://liveblog.digitalimages.sky/lc-images-sky/lcimg-6a5b3ebb-80e4-4f93-aae0-118cdfd47443.png

[Crimson Dynamo]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Gj1ZWhlWsAAiAP0?format=jpg&name=small

[arista]

Yes
Farmers are not the enemies
of the public.


Labour has no change
for this mess.

[arista]

Yesterdays Frontpage

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/ace/standard/976/cpsprodpb/bc3f/live/acdf58c0-f3c5-11ef-8c03-7dfdbeeb2526.jpg.webp

[arista]

Today, they are
Marching on Foot.

Tractors not permitted

Just on SkyNewsHD Live

[Livia]

Today, they are
Marching on Foot.

Tractors not permitted

Just on SkyNewsHD Live

I don't know why tractors would not be permitted If they're road legal, road tax paid, how can they ban them? The police are very firm about these marches. Pity they aren't as firm about people carrying terrorist banners and swastikas.

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/ace/standard/976/cpsprodpb/5604/live/2cee6ca0-fe01-11ef-b50e-9d086302645f.png.webp

[Zizu]

https://x.com/ericldaugh/status/1933227784941236615?s=46


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[Livia]

https://x.com/ericldaugh/status/1933227784941236615?s=46


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How does this relate to the farmers?

[Zizu]

How does this relate to the farmers?


Thread title says London protests


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