My Ukrainian work mate is being sent home.

[Parmy]

Remember the "can you house a Ukrainian" days. Well he cane over with his wife, set up home. Worked, paid tax, had a beautiful baby girl.


Now all 3 being sent packing because of a visa issue that nobody at the home office can advise him on, they just push him from pillar to post.. passing the buck to other departments.


Reallly sad, and I admit I had a lump in my throat saying goodbye earlier. This government is shameless.

[Livia]

Remember the "can you house a Ukrainian" days. Well he cane over with his wife, set up home. Worked, paid tax, had a beautiful baby girl.


Now all 3 being sent packing because of a visa issue that nobody at the home office can advise him on, they just push him from pillar to post.. passing the buck to other departments.


Reallly sad, and I admit I had a lump in my throat saying goodbye earlier. This government is shameless.

Has he been to the press? I would advise him to do so.

[Parmy]

Has he been to the press? I would advise him to do so.

I wont see him again to ask.

[Dogeatdog]

Remember the "can you house a Ukrainian" days. Well he cane over with his wife, set up home. Worked, paid tax, had a beautiful baby girl.


Now all 3 being sent packing because of a visa issue that nobody at the home office can advise him on, they just push him from pillar to post.. passing the buck to other departments.


Reallly sad, and I admit I had a lump in my throat saying goodbye earlier. This government is shameless.

That’s such a shame. It’s seems like one of those classic cases where you work hard for something, do everything legitimate, by the book, being honest and you still end up getting penalised for it.

[Glenn.]

The moment it’s a real family, a real kid, a real person you’ve met, it stops being political and starts being human. And that’s the hypocrisy of it, empathy only kicks in when people are forced to look someone in the eye. The rest of the time they’re happy to cheer on policies that do exactly this to thousands of others they’ll never see.

[Parmy]

As if today wasn't bad enough.



The youngest of 4 brothers, sent to the UK with his new wife at the tender age of 21, his father and brothers on their way to war. Sent away to uphold the family name if nobody else is left in Ukraine to do so. Does not compare to people fleeing crimes committed in islamic ran hell holes.

The UK government don't care much about the Iranians committing the crime of public protest in islamic ran Iran..so why care so much about people fleeing anything that's a crime in any islamic ran country.

[Glenn.]

So some refugees are valid and others aren’t, depending on whether you personally like their country?

[Cherie]

The moment it’s a real family, a real kid, a real person you’ve met, it stops being political and starts being human. And that’s the hypocrisy of it, empathy only kicks in when people are forced to look someone in the eye. The rest of the time they’re happy to cheer on policies that do exactly this to thousands of others they’ll never see.

The difference being the Ukranians were vetted and came in on work visas and it was mainly women and children who got Visas, they are not illegal, they are not possible criminals and men did not enmass leave Ukraine ...its a shame they cant do similar for other war torn countries but then they are mainly not European countries and have countries nearby who could possibly take them in the first instance

[Glenn.]

The difference being the Ukranians were vetted and came in on work visas and it was mainly women and children who got Visas, they are not illegal, they are not possible criminals and men did not enmass leave Ukraine ...its a shame they cant do similar for other war torn countries but then they are mainly not European countries and have countries nearby who could possibly take them in the first instance

You’re being careful with how you say it, but the meaning is clear. You’re more comfortable with Ukrainians because they’re European and you assume they’re safer. People from other countries get treated as suspicious by default.

The UK could vet people from anywhere if it wanted to. It chooses not to. So this isn’t really about how the system works, it’s about who you feel comfortable letting in.

When you strip it back, you’re just ranking refugees based on where they’re from. That’s the reality of it.

[Livia]

In 2024 less than 900 Ukranians applied for asylum in the UK because of the war with the Russians. In the same year 10,500+ Pakistanis, 8,500+ Afghans, 8000+ Iranians and 7000+ Syrians sought asylum.

[Zizu]

The difference being the Ukranians were vetted and came in on work visas and it was mainly women and children who got Visas, they are not illegal, they are not possible criminals and men did not enmass leave Ukraine ...its a shame they cant do similar for other war torn countries but then they are mainly not European countries and have countries nearby who could possibly take them in the first instance


Excellent !!

[Glenn.]

In 2024 less than 900 Ukranians applied for asylum in the UK because of the war with the Russians. In the same year 10,500+ Pakistanis, 8,500+ Afghans, 8000+ Iranians and 7000+ Syrians sought asylum.

Those numbers don’t show who’s more genuine. They just show who the UK made it easy for, and who it didn’t. You’re comparing two completely different systems and pretending it means something about the people. Spoiler alert, it doesn’t.

[bots]

Most Ukranians I know want to go back to Ukraine. Most other asylum seekers don't want to return to their home country. That is obviously going to affect numbers

[BBXX]

Firstly Parmy, sorry to hear about your friend. That really sucks and I hope they somehow find a way to reverse it or return as soon as possible.

Comparing Ukrainians to those coming from Middle Eastern countries for example is moot but let's do it anyway.

We [rightly] set up bespoke, safe and legal routes for the Ukrainian people to flee here, which is not something granted to other countries. Obviously to seek asylum they have to get to land first and the only way to do that without a visa - often which is impossible for those needing to seek asylum - is crossing the channel The Ukrainian people had the ability to come here under specially set-up routes - they also benefitted from a humanitarian displacement scheme - they had the ability to work straight away, those who did not work received Universal Credit and if they were eligible, regular benefits, and finally and most importantly, men were literally banned from leaving Ukraine at one time.

Yes, most of those coming over on small boats are men but that's because they have the make that journey. If there were easy legal routes like there was for Ukrainians, it would likely be different. But there isn't, there is a horrific journey and then placement in centres which lack integration, creates isolation, with huge delays on ability to work 12 months, and very little in the way of financial help (£10 a week per person or £50 a week if your centre has food). All of that is why women and children stay where they are for the time being because why would you put your wife and kid through that initially?

While I totally understand large cohorts of men coming into the country is unnerving, the idea they "could be criminals" is ignoring a huge caveat, in that once adjusted for situational circumstances, the crime rates for those coming over on small boats are no higher than any British-born man. That is to say the policies surrounding those who land here create an environment where crime festers regardless of nationality. People who cannot work, receive little aid or face financial hardship, are housed in places that do not allow for integration or to set up home are all more likely to turn to crime. That isn't even considering the prejudice that these asylum seekers have to contend with, the media rhetoric around their demographic and the fact they're more likely to be a victim of violent crime than commit one.

If we treated those seeking asylum from Syrian or Afghanistan or Pakistan, etc... like we did Ukraine, the picture would be different. There were studies in Germany that showed refugee inflows do not systematically increase crime rates beyond what you'd expect from demographic difference -- such as age and sex -- so a young German man was no less likely to commit a crime than a young Syrian man even if both were far more likely to commit crime than a young woman.

So it's the policies that are the issue, not the geographical demographic of asylum seekers or refugees, and with more support things would be different. But the rhetoric is that we don't want to give more support, of course. We want to give less, or none. We didn't mind giving the Ukrainian asylum seekers access to benefits, or those they were staying with £350 a month, but we resent shelling out £9.95 a week to a Syrian man who is homed in a communal centre only for people to stand outside with banners telling him to go home. Why?

[BBXX]

Those numbers don’t show who’s more genuine. They just show who the UK made it easy for, and who it didn’t. You’re comparing two completely different systems and pretending it means something about the people. Spoiler alert, it doesn’t.

Also those numbers are cherry picked to ****.

Total arrivals between 2022-2025:
🇺🇦 Ukraine ~220,000+ Arrivals via special legal visa routes (not asylum - because they didn't need to seek it because we created bespoke routes for them to come here)
🇵🇰 Pakistan ~11,000+ (year to Jun 2025) Asylum claimants
🇦🇫 Afghanistan ~8,000+ (year to Jun 2025) Asylum claimants
🇮🇷 Iran ~7,700+ (year to Jun 2025) Asylum claimants
🇸🇾 Syria ~5,200+ (year to Jun 2025) Asylum claimants

[Parmy]

Firstly Parmy, sorry to hear about your friend. That really sucks and I hope they somehow find a way to reverse it or return as soon as possible.

Comparing Ukrainians to those coming from Middle Eastern countries for example is moot but let's do it anyway.

We [rightly] set up bespoke, safe and legal routes for the Ukrainian people to flee here, which is not something granted to other countries. Obviously to seek asylum they have to get to land first and the only way to do that without a visa - often which is impossible for those needing to seek asylum - is crossing the channel The Ukrainian people had the ability to come here under specially set-up routes - they also benefitted from a humanitarian displacement scheme - they had the ability to work straight away, those who did not work received Universal Credit and if they were eligible, regular benefits, and finally and most importantly, men were literally banned from leaving Ukraine at one time.

Yes, most of those coming over on small boats are men but that's because they have the make that journey. If there were easy legal routes like there was for Ukrainians, it would likely be different. But there isn't, there is a horrific journey and then placement in centres which lack integration, creates isolation, with huge delays on ability to work 12 months, and very little in the way of financial help (£10 a week per person or £50 a week if your centre has food). All of that is why women and children stay where they are for the time being because why would you put your wife and kid through that initially?

While I totally understand large cohorts of men coming into the country is unnerving, the idea they "could be criminals" is ignoring a huge caveat, in that once adjusted for situational circumstances, the crime rates for those coming over on small boats are no higher than any British-born man. That is to say the policies surrounding those who land here create an environment where crime festers regardless of nationality. People who cannot work, receive little aid or face financial hardship, are housed in places that do not allow for integration or to set up home are all more likely to turn to crime. That isn't even considering the prejudice that these asylum seekers have to contend with, the media rhetoric around their demographic and the fact they're more likely to be a victim of violent crime than commit one.

If we treated those seeking asylum from Syrian or Afghanistan or Pakistan, etc... like we did Ukraine, the picture would be different. There were studies in Germany that showed refugee inflows do not systematically increase crime rates beyond what you'd expect from demographic difference -- such as age and sex -- so a young German man was no less likely to commit a crime than a young Syrian man even if both were far more likely to commit crime than a young woman.

So it's the policies that are the issue, not the geographical demographic of asylum seekers or refugees, and with more support things would be different. But the rhetoric is that we don't want to give more support, of course. We want to give less, or none. We didn't mind giving the Ukrainian asylum seekers access to benefits, or those they were staying with £350 a month, but we resent shelling out £9.95 a week to a Syrian man who is homed in a communal centre only for people to stand outside with banners telling him to go home. Why?



Thanks for caring.


But your post is ridiculous and not thought out well.


You seem to be saying these young men are courageous for making the perilous journey alone first..leaving their wives and kids at home in the supposed to dangerous to live in country they are fleeing..that doesn't sound courageous to me...leaving them their to then have them travel the same journey alone to cone to you....or are they just going to leave them their languishing awaiting the inevitable in the so called war torn country they fleeed persecution from????


Also you mention these places they get housed in, that doesn't provide the chance to integrate...that's simply not true, large groups of these young men can be found in the surrounding parks and town centres integrating with many different nationalities...they also have commmunual eating areas...so they do integrate..


You also say it's the conditions at fault for making them turn to crime? I wonder then, why does these conditions make them commit sexual crimes... is that simply the victims fault for saying no to these terrtibly ill treated young men? who's wives and kids they left in danger will be surprised to find in jail once they have made the jouney

[Cherie]

You’re being careful with how you say it, but the meaning is clear. You’re more comfortable with Ukrainians because they’re European and you assume they’re safer. People from other countries get treated as suspicious by default.

The UK could vet people from anywhere if it wanted to. It chooses not to. So this isn’t really about how the system works, it’s about who you feel comfortable letting in.

When you strip it back, you’re just ranking refugees based on where they’re from. That’s the reality of it.

Im not being careful about anything just stating fact, say what you like putting groups of young men together from different cultures with no support, no right to work into communities does not end well, of course the UK should support another European country at war, do you disagree?

[Glenn.]

Im not being careful about anything just stating fact, say what you like putting groups of young men together from different cultures with no support, no right to work into communities does not end well, of course the UK should support another European country at war, do you disagree?

You are choosing which facts matter. Saying young men from different cultures is doing a lot of heavy lifting there.

Putting any group of people in limbo, no right to work, no money, no stability, no future, is what doesn’t end well. That’s a policy failure, not a culture problem. Do that to British lads and you’d get the same outcome.

And no one’s saying don’t support Ukraine. Of course we should. The point is we can support them and not treat everyone else like a problem to be managed. It’s not either/or unless you decide it is.

[Zizu]

Thanks for caring.


But your post is ridiculous and not thought out well.


You seem to be saying these young men are courageous for making the perilous journey alone first..leaving their wives and kids at home in the supposed to dangerous to live in country they are fleeing..that doesn't sound courageous to me...leaving them their to then have them travel the same journey alone to cone to you....or are they just going to leave them their languishing awaiting the inevitable in the so called war torn country they fleeed persecution from????






This is the part that always bemuses me

[BBXX]

You seem to be saying these young men are courageous for making the perilous journey alone first..leaving their wives and kids at home in the supposed to dangerous to live in country they are fleeing..that doesn't sound courageous to me...leaving them their to then have them travel the same journey alone to cone to you....or are they just going to leave them their languishing awaiting the inevitable in the so called war torn country they fleeed persecution from????


I didn't say courageous, but making the channel crossing is not safe. The initial journey will to be the journey the families make afterwards... ? Once refugee status has been granted, families used to be able to easily join safely and legally. This was suspended in September but will reignite later this year with stricter rules. The idea is to build a life here in the interim to allow family to follow.


Also you mention these places they get housed in, that doesn't provide the chance to integrate...that's simply not true, large groups of these young men can be found in the surrounding parks and town centres integrating with many different nationalities...they also have commmunual eating areas...so they do integrate.


Sitting in a park doesn't equal integration. They're not able to work and they're not able to be housed in a home allowing for more organic day-to-day integration.


You also say it's the conditions at fault for making them turn to crime? I wonder then, why does these conditions make them commit sexual crimes... is that simply the victims fault for saying no to these terrtibly ill treated young men? who's wives and kids they left in danger will be surprised to find in jail once they have made the jouney

Your reading comprehension needs work. I'm stating a fact - the conditions in which they live under - time and time again, regardless of immigration status or culture - corresponds with higher crime rate. I'm not blaming any victim of said crime, and it's not an excuse, it's just what the crime states show.

What I am saying is that they're not committing crimes because of their immigration status or because of where they originated from, like so many like to try and make out, but because of the situation they live in, situations created by our own policies. It's a reason for improving asylum policies, not a reason to ban them from entering the country.

In the same way British-born men who do not work, live with little support, are ostracised from society and face hardship are more likely to commit crime than someone who is in employment, in financially stable and has a support network is a reason to improve support for those people rather than continue to shun them.

[Cherie]

You are choosing which facts matter. Saying young men from different cultures is doing a lot of heavy lifting there.

Putting any group of people in limbo, no right to work, no money, no stability, no future, is what doesn’t end well. That’s a policy failure, not a culture problem. Do that to British lads and you’d get the same outcome.

And no one’s saying don’t support Ukraine. Of course we should. The point is we can support them and not treat everyone else like a problem to be managed. It’s not either/or unless you decide it is.

I dont decide anything, I am just offering an opinion, these are government decisions, the government needs to get its act together and sort it out, if World War 3 broke out tomorrow, do you think boatloads of unvetted men would be rocking up on our shores....no they wouldn't

[Parmy]

Sitting in a park doesn't equal integration. They're not able to work and they're not able to be housed in a home allowing for more organic day-to-day integration.




I've posted enough videos of immigrants housed in luxury flats for that not to be true.

[Parmy]

What I am saying is that they're not committing crimes because of their immigration status or because of where they originated from, like so many like to try and make out, but because of the situation they live in, situations created by our own policies. It's a reason for improving asylum policies, not a reason to ban them from entering the country.




Give us better facilities and we will stop taking your girls.....Sorry, but that's not how it works.

[Parmy]

didn't say courageous, but making the channel crossing is not safe. The initial journey will to be the journey the families make afterwards... ? Once refugee status has been granted, families used to be able to easily join safely and legally. This was suspended in September but will reignite later this year with stricter rules. The idea is to build a life here in the interim to allow family to follow



You really have been sucked in havnt you..

[Parmy]

A quick question....




Out of the hundreds and hundreds of thousands immigrants in the last 6 years.....where are alll the single no kids, females looking for a safer home?

[BBXX]

What I am saying is that they're not committing crimes because of their immigration status or because of where they originated from, like so many like to try and make out, but because of the situation they live in, situations created by our own policies. It's a reason for improving asylum policies, not a reason to ban them from entering the country.




Give us better facilities and we will stop taking your girls.....Sorry, but that's not how it works.

That's not what I'm saying. If you have to misrepresent the argument, you have lost. Bye.

[Parmy]

That's not what I'm saying. If you have to misrepresent the argument, you have lost. Bye.

So a free roof, and free food with a little on top for treats, and no stress for paying bills, is not enough, so to show their gratitude they turn to crime...blaming poverty and community shunning...?

Is that what you're saying.......if it is, you've forgotten these men have access to their own personal funds, and can often be seeen in Gucci, puffing large cannabis joints in the parks surrounding their housing.

[Redway]

This is the part that always bemuses me

People quoting themselves to re-emphasise their point bemuses you. It doesn’t take that much.

[BBXX]

So a free roof, and free food with a little on top for treats, and no stress for paying bills, is not enough, so to show their gratitude they turn to crime...blaming poverty and community shunning...?

If you're having trouble understanding crime statistics and how societal issues affect it, regardless of nationality or immigration status, then perhaps do some further reading. I'm not here to pander to your lack of knowledge.

Your second point is just dense. Not all asylum seekers own gucci bags and not all asylum seekers commit crime, so unless you have a Venn diagram that shows a circle, your point is moot. Once again you're treating them all the same.

[Livia]

So a free roof, and free food with a little on top for treats, and no stress for paying bills, is not enough, so to show their gratitude they turn to crime...blaming poverty and community shunning...?

Is that what you're saying.......if it is, you've forgotten these men have access to their own personal funds, and can often be seeen in Gucci, puffing large cannabis joints in the parks surrounding their housing.

You're wasting your time Parm. They just don't get it, it's waaay over their head.

[Parmy]

If you're having trouble understanding crime statistics and how societal issues affect it, regardless of nationality or immigration status, then perhaps do some further reading. I'm not here to pander to your lack of knowledge.

Your second point is just dense. Not all asylum seekers own gucci bags and not all asylum seekers commit crime, so unless you have a Venn diagram that shows a circle, your point is moot. Once again you're treating them all the same.





They could all afford the price of a boat trip though, yeah? From the safe haven of France.....

Are we now to believe they would spend the last of what they had to flee the safety of France for a life of crime in Britain...nah...sorrry...you aint right this time budddy...you yourself are cherry picking UK statistics and applying them to illligal immigrants.

[Livia]

They could all afford the price of a boat trip though, yeah? From the safe haven of France.....


Or are we now to believe they would spend the last if what they had to flee the safety of France for a l7fe of crime in Britain...nah...sorrry...you aint right this time budddy...you yourself are cherry picking UK statistics and applying them to illligal immigrants.

He's called you stupid twice because your opinion differs. Seems form rules don't apply to him.

[BBXX]

...you yourself are cherry picking UK statistics and applying them to illligal immigrants.

No, no I'm not.

Home Office and academic studies:
A 2019 UK study (Home Office Research Report 103) found no clear link between asylum seekers and overall crime rates.

Crime rates among immigrants are generally similar to or lower than the native-born population when controlled for age, gender, and socioeconomic status.

A recent University of Bath (UK) and York University (Canada) study examined crime and violent crime across countries with varying refugee intakes:
The study found no evidence that higher levels of refugees per population cause increases in violent crime.

In fact, countries with more progressive asylum policies did not have higher levels of violent crime than those with more restrictive policies

A 2018 study of 22 EU countries (Dumont & Liebig, OECD/European Migration Network) found that immigrants and refugees are not more likely to commit crime than locals when adjusted for poverty, unemployment, and social exclusion.

A large‑scale study published in 2025 by the Ifo Institute in Germany analysed police data from 2018–2023 and found:
No correlation between a higher proportion of foreigners (including refugees) in a district and its overall crime rate.
The researchers noted that migrants — like many people in other population groups — tend to live in urban areas, which already have higher crime rates overall, making it look like migrants are over‑represented when they are simply living where crime tends to be higher for all residents

Independent summaries by migration research networks and academic blogs conclude:
Long‑term, large‑cross‑national studies do not find a strong statistical relationship between immigration and overall crime.

Sometimes localized studies show specific correlations (e.g., property crime in isolated contexts), but these are usually explained by socio‑economic factors like poverty, lack of work, limited integration, discrimination, and settlement patterns, not by migration status per se.

US and Canada comparisons: Immigrant populations, including refugees, often have lower crime rates than native-born populations, especially for serious violent crime.

[BBXX]

He's called you stupid twice because your opinion differs. Seems form rules don't apply to him.

I called him stupid because he is either deliberately misrepresenting what I have written or doesn't understand it, not because he holds a different opinion.

You have also just called me stupid, which is fine for you to think. I don't care.

[Parmy]

He's called you stupid twice because your opinion differs. Seems form rules don't apply to him.


It will be why he and Glenn get along

[Parmy]

No, no I'm not.

Home Office and academic studies:
A 2019 UK study (Home Office Research Report 103) found no clear link between asylum seekers and overall crime rates.

Crime rates among immigrants are generally similar to or lower than the native-born population when controlled for age, gender, and socioeconomic status.

A recent University of Bath (UK) and York University (Canada) study examined crime and violent crime across countries with varying refugee intakes:
The study found no evidence that higher levels of refugees per population cause increases in violent crime.

In fact, countries with more progressive asylum policies did not have higher levels of violent crime than those with more restrictive policies

A 2018 study of 22 EU countries (Dumont & Liebig, OECD/European Migration Network) found that immigrants and refugees are not more likely to commit crime than locals when adjusted for poverty, unemployment, and social exclusion.

A large‑scale study published in 2025 by the Ifo Institute in Germany analysed police data from 2018–2023 and found:
No correlation between a higher proportion of foreigners (including refugees) in a district and its overall crime rate.
The researchers noted that migrants — like many people in other population groups — tend to live in urban areas, which already have higher crime rates overall, making it look like migrants are over‑represented when they are simply living where crime tends to be higher for all residents

Independent summaries by migration research networks and academic blogs conclude:
Long‑term, large‑cross‑national studies do not find a strong statistical relationship between immigration and overall crime.

Sometimes localized studies show specific correlations (e.g., property crime in isolated contexts), but these are usually explained by socio‑economic factors like poverty, lack of work, limited integration, discrimination, and settlement patterns, not by migration status per se.

US and Canada comparisons: Immigrant populations, including refugees, often have lower crime rates than native-born populations, especially for serious violent crime.




Stats from 2018 and 2019 don't count nowadays..we have a backlog of unreported crimes over the past 3 years which are only now being reported on as the perpetrators are appearing in court for sentencing...


And your 2025, German report means diddly squat here in Britain..


Sorry...it don't mean ****...today.....it also does not mention illligal immigrants, who's presence here is in itself a crime..it only mentions immigrants.


So to summarise....You are cherry picking old stats for migrants and applying it to today's illligal immigrants.

[BBXX]

So to summarise....You are cherry picking old stats for migrants and applying it to today's illligal migrants.

I've presented you with the stats we have and am using them to form my opinion rather than... erm... a man on YouTube or GB News.

Learn what cherry picking means.

[Parmy]

I've presented you with the stats we have and is using them to form my opinion rather than... erm... a man on YouTube or GB News.

Learn why cherry picking means.

You seem to forget everything I saying has been captured by camera, it's not a narrative by gb news..it's facts, facts aired on video...the joints, the Gucci, the bank accounts...all from words from the mouths of illigal immigrants themselves.....cameras invited into the new builds, invited in by the occupiers...all documented by cameras who can't lie.


Yours, is dated words, which today, are not worth the piece if paper they are written on.

[BBXX]

You seem to forget everything I saying has been captured by camera, it's not a narrative by gb news..it's facts, facts aired on video...the joints, the Gucci, the bank accounts...all from words from the mouths of illigal immigrants themselves.....cameras invited into the new builds, invited in by the occupiers...all documented by cameras who can't lie.

Yours, is dated words, which today, are not worth the piece if paper they are written on.

Viewing isolated incidents on video and extrapolating it to 'hundreds of thousands of people' is poor form, but a tactic you use over and over as a form of confirmation bias. Sees an example that backs up your opinion and uses it as a benchmark for what's normal. Sorry but that is weak.

[Parmy]

Viewing isolated incidents on video and extrapolating it to 'hundreds of thousands of people' is poor form, but a tactic you use over and over as a form of confirmation bias. Sees an example that backs up your opinion and uses it as a benchmark for what's normal. Sorry but that is weak.

To not see anything on video, and to just use an out dated bit of paper as conformational bias for your opinion is strong I suppose!



It's you throwing about statistics, and reasons for why they commit crime...not me....I'm showing you why your 4easons don't add up..

[BBXX]

To not see anything on video, and to just use an out dated bit of paper as conformational bias for your opinion is strong I suppose!



It's you throwing about statistics, and reasons for why they commit crime...not me....I'm showing you why your 4easons don't add up..

Looking at evidence based reports isn't confirmation bias. I'm not denying that some asylum seekers have money. I'm not denying some live comfortably. I'm not rejecting what is shown on video. I'm saying one thing being true doesn't stop the other also being true.

You, however, are denying reports both recent and historical reports that have studied data from dozens of countries, through multiple researchers, to form factual statistics because it doesn't match your own opinion or what a man with a cam saw on his day trips.

[Parmy]

Looking at evidence based reports isn't confirmation bias. I'm not denying that some asylum seekers have money. I'm not denying some live comfortably. I'm not rejecting what is shown on video. I'm saying one thing being true doesn't stop the other also being true.

You, however, are denying reports both recent and historical reports that have studied data from dozens of countries, through multiple researchers, to form factual statistics because it doesn't match your own opinion or what a man with a cam saw on his day trips.





What about illigal immigrants...You know, the ones who entered illegally(That crime doesn't show up on your bit of paper) the ones being fed and sheltered as my asylum seeking friend is sent home to face Putin's wrath...


It's them I'm discussing...not the asylum seekers you leeep comparing these illigals to..your stats a skewed cause they don't apply the crime of entering the uk illigally

[Glenn.]

I called him stupid because he is either deliberately misrepresenting what I have written or doesn't understand it, not because he holds a different opinion.

You have also just called me stupid, which is fine for you to think. I don't care.


The arrogance and lack of self awareness is through the floor and into the bedrock.

[Glenn.]

[/B]
I dont decide anything, I am just offering an opinion, these are government decisions, the government needs to get its act together and sort it out, if World War 3 broke out tomorrow, do you think boatloads of unvetted men would be rocking up on our shores....no they wouldn't

But that’s kind of the point, they’re only unvetted because the government refuses to create proper routes to vet them. You can’t shut every legal door and then act surprised when people turn up on boats.

And if WW3 broke out tomorrow, yes, loads of men would be fleeing. That’s what always happens in wars. Ukrainians included.

Also let’s be real, plenty of so-called patriots here would be on the first flight out too. Most people don’t want to die for a flag when it actually comes down to it.

The issue isn’t people running from danger, it’s the UK leaving them in limbo with no work, no support and no plan. That’s what creates the problems.

[BBXX]

What about illigal immigrants...You know, the ones who entered illegally(That crime doesn't show up on your bit of paper) the ones being fed and sheltered as my asylum seeking friend is sent home to face Putin's wrath...


It's them I'm discussing...not the asylum seekers you leeep comparing these illigals to..your stats a skewed cause they don't apply the crime of entering the uk illigally

Up to 95% of those who enter the country illegally, such as across the channel, claim asylum.

Between January 2018 and mid-2025, there were roughly 168,000 small boat arrivals recorded. Of those, about 159,000 lodged asylum claims. So they are counted in general crime stats. Does that make you reconsider your stance?

However no, while their crime of entering the country illegally doesn't show up on crime stats, any subsequent crime does. Why do we care about the crime of entering the country illegally if they are a good resident while here? Seriously, what does it matter? Your friend, while he faced a horrific situation, had the benefit of being given special legal routes directly and swiftly into the country for his safety. If that hadn't been in place, he could have easily been someone trying to get into this country 'illegally' but why would you care when he's contributed positively since arrival? You wouldn't.

Anyway the entire conversation has been about safety and violence and now it's been shown asylum seekers make no negligible difference it's shifting to the crime of existing in the country they fled to?? Very convenient.

[Parmy]

Why do we care about the crime of entering the country illegally if they are a good resident while here?




Money.....my money.

[Parmy]

The crime of working illigally, keeping what you want for yourself paying no tax......shown to be happening by these men with camera people poo poo....picked up by channel 4, using said camera man's footage......suddenly police interested in uber delivery drivers....

[BBXX]

Why do we care about the crime of entering the country illegally if they are a good resident while here?

Money.....my money.

Yes, I thought so. All this division because of 50p a week.

What a sad world we live in.

[Zizu]

A quick question....




Out of the hundreds and hundreds of thousands immigrants in the last 6 years.....where are alll the single no kids, females looking for a safer home?


Where are there ANY females or kids more like


Every photo we see on a daily/weekly basis shows boat fulls of young , healthy , strong looking young men …

[BBXX]

The crime of working illigally, keeping what you want for yourself paying no tax......shown to be happening by these men with camera people poo poo....picked up by channel 4, using said camera man's footage......suddenly police interested in uber delivery drivers....

This is a policy issue, they cannot work when they arrive. If this was changed, they would work and they would contribute tax.

[BBXX]

Where are there ANY females or kids more like


Every photo we see on a daily/weekly basis shows boat fulls of young , healthy , strong looking young men …

Yes, about 15% were women and 15% were children.

[Parmy]

Yes, I thought so. All this division because of 50p a week.

What a sad world we live in.

You can feel happy that your paying for a 6 month sabbatical for thousands of foreigners...just shows you up for the doormat you are.

[Parmy]

Yes, about 15% were women and 15% were children.

That was a long long time ago...

[BBXX]

You can feel happy that your paying for a 6 month sabbatical for thousands of foreigners...just shows you up for the doormat you are.

Hey, I helped pay for people like your friend as well! :) I really have no bother in paying for people who need assistance. If that means you think I am a doormat, so be it, your opinion of me means nothing.

[Parmy]

This is a policy issue, they cannot work when they arrive. If this was changed, they would work and they would contribute tax.

Many have worked and kept what they earned...cause they are only here for what they can get.....and how do you know they would work? That's the same as me lumping them alll as criminals, which you said I was when I wasn't..



I would imagine the stats say that most that are available to work now, just simply don't, and prefer the benefit money when the wives and 10 kids come over.

[BBXX]

That was a long long time ago...

No.

2022:
All males (all ages) ~77–79%
All females (all ages) ~21–23%

2023:
All males (all ages) ~78–80%
All females (all ages) ~20–22%

2024:
All males (all ages) ~76–78%
All females (all ages) ~22–24%

[Glenn.]

You can feel happy that you’re paying for a 6 month sabbatical for thousands of foreigners...just shows you up for the doormat you are.

We pay for 1.68m of our own unemployed. And far many more tax dodgers. Selective outrage

[BBXX]

Many have worked and kept what they earned...cause they are only here for what they can get.....and how do you know they would work? That's the same as me lumping them alll as criminals, which you said I was when I wasn't..

I would imagine the stats say that most that are available to work now, just simply don't, and prefer the benefit money when the wives and 10 kids come over.

Nice.

50% of them go to work within a couple of years they're able to. This is lower than the approx 75% of working-age UK citizens being employed in the same period, however it should also be considered the significant barriers they will face when looking for jobs - large gaps on their CV, potential language barriers, they are limited to what jobs they can apply for and of course employer discrimination. And that obviously doesn't mean those unemployed aren't applying.

[Zizu]

Yes, about 15% were women and 15% were children.


Well I have never seen any ..

[BBXX]

Well I have never seen any ..

Oh right.

[Glenn.]

Well I have never seen any ..


It’s a good job for the stats then huh

[Zizu]

Why do we only see photos like these on the BBC and Sky ?

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20260123/f260328ec1cc9e58eca3eb7cceb2c8cd.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20260123/43c14013c619cb335b54e0f02a010b5d.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20260123/1658736c9a2476a97e15b4480004e77c.jpg

[Glenn.]

Why indeed

[Zizu]

It’s a good job for the stats then huh


Anyone can pluck stats that suit their cause from the internet .. you must know that

[Glenn.]

Anyone can pluck stats that suit their cause from the internet .. you must know that

You know what dude. Cool. Sure.

[Redway]

Where are there ANY females or kids more like


Every photo we see on a daily/weekly basis shows boat fulls of young , healthy , strong looking young men …

Not everything you see on the news is conclusive. Even you should be able to know that.

[Redway]

Well I have never seen any ..

I guess they don’t exist, then. If Zizu’s eyes haven’t caught glaze (for-once), they mustn’t exist. Okay. Got it.

[BBXX]

Why do we only see photos like these on the BBC and Sky ?

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20260123/f260328ec1cc9e58eca3eb7cceb2c8cd.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20260123/43c14013c619cb335b54e0f02a010b5d.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20260123/1658736c9a2476a97e15b4480004e77c.jpg

You are so close to getting it. Why do you think?

Anyone can pluck stats that suit their cause from the internet .. you must know that

The stats are from recorded Home Office data.

Anyone can pluck three photos from the internet to suit their cause, you must know that.

[Cherie]

You are so close to getting it. Why do you think?



The stats are from recorded Home Office data.

Anyone can pluck three photos from the internet to suit their cause, you must know that.

Because photos don't lie, we all know the boats moor up out in the water, sometimes too deep for women and children to access and more often than not its survival of the fittest and who gets to the dinghy first, there is no chivalry or women and children first attitude but you know that

[Cherie]

I guess they don’t exist, then. If Zizu’s eyes haven’t caught glaze (for-once), they mustn’t exist. Okay. Got it.

Can you provide any evidence of boats packed with women and children?

[BBXX]

Because photos don't lie, we all know the boats moor up out in the water, sometimes too deep for women and children to access and more often than not its survival of the fittest and who gets to the dinghy first, there is no chivalry or women and children first attitude but you know that

I've outlined the HO data. If you choose to believe otherwise based on carefully selected photos I'm not sure what to tell you. Maybe we can call that Cherie Picking.

Just because we see what we see it doesn't mean what we don't see doesn't exist.

[BBXX]

Can you provide any evidence of boats packed with women and children?

Nobody has said they're packed with women and children. Women and children make up approx 25-30% of crossings. Nobody has pretended otherwise.

Why are you resorting to hyperbole and asking for something nobody has claimed exists.

[Parmy]

We pay for 1.68m of our own unemployed. And far many more tax dodgers. Selective outrage

That's answered simply....

We also have our own criminals, so why on earth would we guarantee that the number increases instead of decreases. That is a government doing nothing but increase its populations chances of being attacked or robbed when it should be doing everything to bring thise stats down.

Heaping more and more on benefits makes no financial sense. So why in earth should the already heavily burdened working population be forced to shell out more or see underfunded facilities like the nhs have to wave bye bye to those much needed funds as it gently floats into those grasping foreign hands.


It's crazy to guarantee this happens by facilitating this boat nonsense.

[Parmy]

No.

2022:
All males (all ages) ~77–79%
All females (all ages) ~21–23%

2023:
All males (all ages) ~78–80%
All females (all ages) ~20–22%

2024:
All males (all ages) ~76–78%
All females (all ages) ~22–24%




Is that the boat figures or people seeking asylum.

[Parmy]

Nice.

50% of them go to work within a couple of years they're able to. This is lower than the approx 75% of working-age UK citizens being employed in the same period, however it should also be considered the significant barriers they will face when looking for jobs - large gaps on their CV, potential language barriers, they are limited to what jobs they can apply for and of course employer discrimination. And that obviously doesn't mean those unemployed aren't applying.




Limited to jobs they can apply for.


Doctors
Teachers
Proffesor.


Sometimes you just have to down grade like the rest of us and get a shovel in your hand.

[Parmy]

Why indeed

But YouTube and the camera don't lie for news is a bad thing....:shrug:

[Glenn.]

That's answered simply....

We also have our own criminals, so why on earth would we guarantee that the number increases instead of decreases. That is a government doing nothing but increase its populations chances of being attacked or robbed when it should be doing everything to bring thise stats down.

Heaping more and more on benefits makes no financial sense. So why in earth should the already heavily burdened working population be forced to shell out more or see underfunded facilities like the nhs have to wave bye bye to those much needed funds as it gently floats into those grasping foreign hands.


It's crazy to guarantee this happens by facilitating this boat nonsense.

If you actually cared about crime, money and pressure on services, you’d want the exact opposite of what’s happening now. Process people quicker, let them work, let them pay tax, let them get on with their lives.

Keeping thousands of people stuck doing nothing, banned from working and living in limbo is what creates problems. That’s how you manufacture an underclass.

The chaos isn’t caused by immigrants. It’s caused by a broken system that seems determined to make everything harder, more expensive and more dysfunctional for everyone.

[Parmy]

Hey, I helped pay for people like your friend as well! :) I really have no bother in paying for people who need assistance. If that means you think I am a doormat, so be it, your opinion of me means nothing.

No...my friend paid his own and his families way himself. By working and paying tax. His money probably helped you more than yours did him.

[BBXX]

Is that the boat figures or people seeking asylum.

Those figures are for all asylum seekers, sorry. Boat crossings it's more like 10-15% as previously stated.

[BBXX]

No...my friend paid his own and his families way himself. By working and paying tax. His money probably helped you more than yours did him.

I said like your friend, not your friend specifically. Ukrainians who did were work were able to collect the same sort of benefits as UK citizens.

[Parmy]

I said like your friend, not your friend specifically. Ukrainians who did were work were able to collect the same sort of benefits as UK citizens.

They are nothing like my friend then. Apart from being foreign..

[Parmy]

If you actually cared about crime, money and pressure on services, you’d want the exact opposite of what’s happening now. Process people quicker, let them work, let them pay tax, let them get on with their lives.

Keeping thousands of people stuck doing nothing, banned from working and living in limbo is what creates problems. That’s how you manufacture an underclass.

The chaos isn’t caused by immigrants. It’s caused by a broken system that seems determined to make everything harder, more expensive and more dysfunctional for everyone.




No...let's not let them.


Them getting all this cash and heating for free, all the food and all the pity has a knock on effect on young working age poor people. They see that and think why should I work..


You stop the boats and send the ones here packing, then the rot stops.

[BBXX]

They are nothing like my friend then. Apart from being foreign..

Ukrainians who did or did not work all could benefit from multiple government funded opportunities - child benefit, pension credit, there were grants to help with housing support, monthly payments to UK residents who housed them.... all of these state funded and none of which I have an issue with paying for... if that makes me a doormat so be it.

[Zizu]

.

[BBXX]

Fair point .. but we can only form opinions on photos that we are shown ..

Or educating yourself with actual data before forming an opinion. That's also an option.

"No women cross the channel because the TV doesn't show pictures of them" is weak thinking. You've lived, what like 5 or 6 decades and you still haven't realised not to believe everything the television shows you? C'mon man.

[Zizu]

Or educating yourself with actual data before forming an opinion. That's also an option.

"No women cross the channel because the TV doesn't show pictures of them" is weak thinking. You've lived, what like 5 or 6 decades and you still haven't realised not to believe everything the television shows you? C'mon man.


We can’t form opinions on things or photos or footage that isn’t shown to us ..

As I see it all these thousands of illegals are just a drain on our resources - we were struggling before they all started ‘drifting in’


Also the notion that the vast majority of these illegals are men of fighting age is also a concern given that they’re unlikely to fight on our behalf if we are attacked further down the line

[BBXX]

We can’t form opinions on things or photos or footage that isn’t shown to us ..

Why do you need a visual aid. You're not a child. Why can't you research if what the news is showing you is reflected in data. I have done that, so have others. If you're only going to take photos from limited sources as evidence, prepare for your opinion to be potentially incorrect, flawed or one-sided.


As I see it all these thousands of illegals are just a drain on our resources - we were struggling before they all started ‘drifting in’


We don't get to decide who is a drain on our resources and who isn't. Humans are humans. The funding for asylum seekers costs the average UK taxpayer about £1.60 per person per month. That's about 5x LESS than it costs the average UK tax payer to fund prisons.


Also the notion that the vast majority of these illegals are men of fighting age is also a concern given that they’re unlikely to fight on our behalf if we are attacked further down the line

I don't understand why it's a concern. Why are we always describing these men as 'fighting age'.

Anyway, around half of the male population (UK citizens) said they would not be willing to fight for this country if we went to war, so it will be a lot of us heading for the shores to seek asylum if the worst was to happen.

Read this: https://www.globalcitizen.org/en/content/five-explanations-to-why-the-majority-of-refugees/

[Glenn.]

No...let's not let them.


Them getting all this cash and heating for free, all the food and all the pity has a knock on effect on young working age poor people. They see that and think why should I work..


You stop the boats and send the ones here packing, then the rot stops.

People aren’t quitting work because someone else gets basic food and heating. That’s just not real life. Most people want a job, money, and some independence, not to be stuck in a hotel with nothing to do.

[Parmy]

People aren’t quitting work because someone else gets basic food and heating. That’s just not real life. Most people want a job, money, and some independence, not to be stuck in a hotel with nothing to do.

It's the real mind. Something you can't grasp. Loads of young people would happily sit in a room on their PlayStation whilst mum brings food. Do you not think that excuse has been uttered from their lips to their servant mum.

[Parmy]

Ukrainians who did or did not work all could benefit from multiple government funded opportunities - child benefit, pension credit, there were grants to help with housing support, monthly payments to UK residents who housed them.... all of these state funded and none of which I have an issue with paying for... if that makes me a doormat so be it.

I have an issue paying for someone who's only taken someone in for the payouts. Opens up avenues to slave Labour that one.

[Glenn.]

It's the real mind. Something you can't grasp. Loads of young people would happily sit in a room on their PlayStation whilst mum brings food. Do you not think that excuse has been uttered from their lips to their servant mum.

That’s not the same thing at all. Sitting in your mum’s house playing PlayStation isn’t the same as being stuck in a foreign country with no job, no money, no freedom and no future.

Most people don’t want to live like that. They want to earn, have their own place, some independence and a life. Being forced to sit around doing nothing isn’t a dream scenario, it’s depressing.

If anything, the only reason people end up idle is because the system forces them to be. Let them work and the problem disappears pretty quickly.

[Parmy]

That’s not the same thing at all. Sitting in your mum’s house playing PlayStation isn’t the same as being stuck in a foreign country with no job, no money, no freedom and no future.

Most people don’t want to live like that. They want to earn, have their own place, some independence and a life. Being forced to sit around doing nothing isn’t a dream scenario, it’s depressing.

If anything, the only reason people end up idle is because the system forces them to be. Let them work and the problem disappears pretty quickly.



Your dreamy mind makes it sound so easy.:joker:


Come into the real world, Glenn.


They want our benefits.

[Glenn.]

Your dreamy mind makes it sound so easy.:joker:


Come into the real world, Glenn.

This is the real world. In the real world, most people don’t want to sit around doing nothing with no money, no job and no control over their own life.

What’s dreamy is pretending humans are happier stuck in limbo than actually working and living normally.

[Parmy]

I've posted videos of illigal migrants laughing as they say britain years ago took over their land, so now its time we took from them..We can't take their land, but we can take their free money.

[Parmy]

This is the real world. In the real world, most people don’t want to sit around doing nothing with no money, no job and no control over their own life.

What’s dreamy is pretending humans are happier stuck in limbo than actually working and living normally.

You missed my edit...please delete the quote part.

[Glenn.]

You missed my edit...please delete the quote part.


It makes no difference to my post. The bit you added as an after thought is purely your own bias which is irrelevant to the discussion.

[BBXX]

I think the thing is, there seems to be this pretence that people on benefits - asylum seekers or not - are living this lavish lifestyle. Which isn’t true. Yes, benefits might allow you to survive, but you’re certainly not living comfortably. Some people are fine with this but most people won’t be.

[Parmy]

I don't think anything described in this thread could be described as lavish.

[Redway]

I don't think anything described in this thread could be described as lavish.

Well. Exactly.

[Glenn.]

I don't think anything described in this thread could be described as lavish.

Congratulations. You’re nearly there.

[BBXX]

I don't think anything described in this thread could be described as lavish.

Thank you.

[Parmy]

Thank you.

They can all still go home though, for all I care.

[Parmy]

What needs to happen is the rest of the world should sort out the countries they are fleeing from, so they have nothing to flee from.


Opinions!

[Zizu]

What needs to happen is the rest of the world should sort out the countries they are fleeing from, so they have nothing to flee from.


Opinions!


Even after that miracle the masses will still come here for a free ride - we have been far too soft for decades

[BBXX]

What needs to happen is the rest of the world should sort out the countries they are fleeing from, so they have nothing to flee from.

Opinions!

Of course the ideal scenario if for every country to be safe for its own residents but that is pie in the sky thinking.

Perhaps the UK shouldn’t have contributed to the many of the conditions from which people are fleeing from in some of these countries in the first place. Both historical and modern British influence, control or actions have helped shape internal conflict, contributed to instability and given people reasons to flee.

We have a moral obligation to some of these nations.

[OnTheRight]

Good.

[Livia]

Massive attack on Ukraine last night, but yeah, send this family back. More refugees from Pakistan than anywhere else... no war there but hey, let's bend over backwards for them. Our civil service is not fit for purpose.