Why sleep on the streets?

[Always_RiGHt]

Its 2008 and folk still sleep on park benches and the like. There is hostels which shall take these homeless people in and clear up our streets from these dirty/scruffy/horrible people living outside in the sometimes-freezing cold nights and days. How can they do it for god sake?

and the beggars in the streets make me stick too

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/42153000/jpg/_42153110_homeless-203-bbc.jpg

[Shaun]

Because there aren't hostels everywhere?

Because they've seen the movie Hostel?

Because they want to?

I don't bloody know!

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by Shaun
Because there aren't hostels everywhere?

Because they've seen the movie Hostel?

Because they want to?

I don't bl***y know!

It should be made illegal in my opinion.

Clean up the mess which litters our neighbourhood.

I went to London recently and was at Euston station and passed by 5 beggars sittinbg like zombies or something, looking like they had no hope in the world and begging for money off traveling folk just trying to get from a to b.

People shouldnt have to put up with this sort of infestation, should they?

[Princess]

Its not that simple! There aren't enough hostels to take in all the homeless. For the majority of people who are homeless,it is completely beyond their control.

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by Princess
Its not that simple! There aren't enough hostels to take in all the homeless. For the majority of people who are homeless,it is completely beyond their control.

Then why can't the government or even the local councils do something about this neverending problem.

[Fom]

Originally posted by Princess
Its not that simple! There aren't enough hostels to take in all the homeless. For the majority of people who are homeless,it is completely beyond their control.

I actually disagree with you, most homeless people are homeless because they are stubborn and wont accept help. We are not like America, we have a full care system for homeless people. There is no reason why people should be on the streets, there are plenty of hostels and help, they are just not willing to ask for help.

I dont give them money when I walk past them for the sheer fact that they could make life far easier by asking for help. There are more hostels than you think.

I watched a program a while ago and the man actually admitted to being to stubborn to accept help, there are emergency resources for anyone becoming homeless, if you get kicked out of your house you can get help straight away, plus I don't get why they cant go to a friends or families instead of making our streets look untidy.

[Princess]

Well I know the situation over here is worse than England. We definitely don't have sufficent hostels.

[Tom]

There aren't enough free hostels and some have waiting lists. Its just not that simple especially for those without any friends/family.

[Nurse57]

And lets not forget about mental health issues.

[Benjamin]

Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
Its 2008 and folk still sleep on park benches and the like. There is hostels which shall take these homeless people in and clear up our streets from these dirty/scruffy/horrible people living outside in the sometimes-freezing cold nights and days. How can they do it for god sake?

and the beggars in the streets make me stick too

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/42153000/jpg/_42153110_homeless-203-bbc.jpg

How naive and arrogant of you. People do not always choose to live on the streets. Some people are forced to because they have no other choice. Unfortunately they cannot all have wonderful, perfect lives and instead have to suffer out on the streets. And as for the hostels:

1). Most cost money

2). There are not enough hostels for every homeless person



Fine you may not like them "littering" your streets, but I bet you don't harp on about people throwing litter on the ground.

Why don't you go do something productive? Like go offer some help to these people on the streets by donating them some money or buying them some food or a cup of tea? Or are you completely cold hearted like you have portrayed yourself?

I know a lot about the homeless because I have doen a lot of work with them, and I know there is not enough help out there!!!

[Fom]

Well I know that in Manchester there is plenty of help and you see about 1 or 2 homeless people, if there wasn't enough help I dare say there would be more people on the streets. And another thing... why is it always the same people on the streets, when I walk up and down manchester its always the same man with his dog asking for money, never changes.
Something inside makes me think like he isn't even trying. I know that if I was homeless I would be outside that hostel every single day asking for a place. And if they cant help you with a room for the night then the government can certainly help you out with some benefits! Set you up with a temporary address so you can get some income, we are making it seem like they have the worst lives ever. But they just need to get up and help themselves. I disagree 100% that there is absolutely nothing out there for them and that everything is full up what rubbish. If that was the case, it would be such a bigger problem.

And to add to that... I take a good quote from the bible (Although im not religious its still a good point):
"Instead of giving a man a fish, teach him how to fish"
Thats true in this instinct giving them money so they can blow it on what they want... or giving them a tea is never gonna help them out in the long run is it? Sorry to sound cold hearted but what they need is some advice and a push in the right direction, not a load of free money from the public.

[Benjamin]

Originally posted by Fom
Well I know that in Manchester there is plenty of help and you see about 1 or 2 homeless people, if there wasn't enough help I dare say there would be more people on the streets. And another thing... why is it always the same people on the streets, when I walk up and down manchester its always the same man with his dog asking for money, never changes.
Something inside makes me think like he isn't even trying. I know that if I was homeless I would be outside that hostel every single day asking for a place. And if they cant help you with a room for the night then the government can certainly help you out with some benefits! Set you up with a temporary address so you can get some income, we are making it seem like they have the worst lives ever. But they just need to get up and help themselves. I disagree 100% that there is absolutely nothing out there for them and that everything is full up what rubbish. If that was the case, it would be such a bigger problem.

But you have to remember the world from their perspective is different. You say you would try anything to sort yourself out. It is not that easy for them as a lot have given up completely on the world and trying becuase too much negative stuff has happened, and then they become stuck in that way of thinking and it becomes near impossible to change it and find a way out to sort out their life.

Most people cannot understand becauase they will never have to do it or become so despairing. But if you did it for a week and lived alongside other homeless people, you would change your tune, trust me, I did.



and in response to the tea comment, no it's not long term aid, but sometimes compassion (even just tea) is all they need to get them through that day.

[Fom]

Hm... I understand that, and I am probably looking at it from the wrong point of view. But I stick with the idea that there is things for them to help. Maybe I didn't take into consideration their mental health, but really... what can we do? Yet again I think what they need is advice, there should be people specialized in talking to these people and getting them on the right tracks.
I just don't think there should be any reason for someone to be on the streets and that it can always be prevented, maybe I have been a bit naive about it, but to say there is no help for these people at all is a bit out there. If I was on the streets for a while I dare say that I would get to that stage, but I would also take action straight away, from the first hour of being homeless I would go to the council and put my name on the housing list, within a month I can have a flat which could be paid by benefits. Which would then give me chance to find a job and get back on track, I just have a feeling these people have let it go on far too long, and to say its not their fault is silly. I know people who have ended up homeless and got accommodation so quick, so quick in fact that they have not had to spend one night on the streets.

[Benjamin]

Originally posted by Fom
Hm... I understand that, and I am probably looking at it from the wrong point of view. But I stick with the idea that there is things for them to help. Maybe I didn't take into consideration their mental health, but really... what can we do? Yet again I think what they need is advice, there should be people specialized in talking to these people and getting them on the right tracks.
I just don't think there should be any reason for someone to be on the streets and that it can always be prevented, maybe I have been a bit naive about it, but to say there is no help for these people at all is a bit out there. If I was on the streets for a while I dare say that I would get to that stage, but I would also take action straight away, from the first hour of being homeless I would go to the council and put my name on the housing list, within a month I can have a flat which could be paid by benefits. Which would then give me chance to find a job and get back on track, I just have a feeling these people have let it go on far too long, and to say its not their fault is silly. I know people who have ended up homeless and got accommodation so quick, so quick in fact that they have not had to spend one night on the streets.


i never said there wasn't help, there is, but the waiting list is not as easy as just that, and it can take a lot longer (a lot) than one month. Not everyone on the street has the ability to do half of those things, and circumstances are all different as to why people are on the streets.

[Nurse57]

"certainly help you out with some benefits!"

And what address should they send the cheque too?

[Jen]

Originally posted by Princess
Well I know the situation over here is worse than England. We definitely don't have sufficent hostels.

Agreed..

[Fom]

Originally posted by Nurse57
"certainly help you out with some benefits!"

And what address should they send the cheque too?

You can set up a temporary PO box?

[Nurse57]

And what bank account would you then pay it into? You need proof of address to open a bank account.

[Fom]

Originally posted by Nurse57
And what bank account would you then pay it into? You need proof of address to open a bank account.

I am sure you could work something out with the Council, I haven't been in this position so I wouldn't know but I am sure that an office somewhere would allow you to use their address, if you are under 21 Connexions would happily let you use their offices for internet or use their address for letters. And I am sure you could work something out with someone, maybe even contacting a hostel and asking that if they cant stay there then at least can they use their address for some letters. I cant imagine someone turning them down.

[Nurse57]

I wish it was that simple. But it is not. There are no doubt some homeless who could help themselves. But like wise there are those who have slipped through the net at now find it impossible to get a foot back on the ladder.

Tell me, why would anyone choose to sleep rough in the middle of winter with little food and no heating?

[Xander]

I don't think anyone deserve to sleep on the streets, no matter what they have doesn't too deserve or there background. Everyone should sleep somewhere inside.
I really don't know why people choose to sleep on the streets, when there iss a hostel in more aless every town or city.

[Benjamin]

Originally posted by Xander
I don't think anyone deserve to sleep on the streets, no matter what they have doesn't too deserve or there background. Everyone should sleep somewhere inside.
I really don't know why people choose to sleep on the streets, when there iss a hostel in more aless every town or city.

They don't choose to though. There are not enough hostels for all tyhe homeless and a lot work on a turn sytem where if you have stayed at it, you can not stay again that week, to keep it fairer and so more homeless have a chance of at least one night in a bed.

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by ukturtle


http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/42153000/jpg/_42153110_homeless-203-bbc.jpg

How naive and arrogant of you.

I am neither naive nor arrogant mate, I'm stating my opinion on the subject of homeless people littering our streets instead of themselves finding somewhere to live or the councils/government doing something about it mate.

People do not always choose to live on the streets. Some people are forced to because they have no other choice.

I am not saying that if a person gets kicked out of their house/flat that they may not end up on the street temporarily. That is always a hazard. Only recently a girl that I know got kicked out of her boyfriends house and was forced to rough it outside for just one night till she could do something to change that situation which she did do quickly, like the next day. Sadly the skirmish which I'm talking about is those dirty scruffbags that live on the street and walk and sit and lie around begging and sleeping around towns and cities, it's disgusting and you should realise that.

Unfortunately they cannot all have wonderful, perfect lives and instead have to suffer out on the streets.

Thats rubbish mate. and you know that. Many of us don't have wonderful, perfect lives but we still don't end up living like pigs on the uk's streets, dowe?

And as for the hostels:

1). Most cost money

2). There are not enough hostels for every homeless person

Thats just a cop-out

Fine you may not like them "littering" your streets, but I bet you don't harp on about people throwing litter on the ground.

What kind of comment is that mate?

Get real for **** sake.

I use the word littering as a descriptive noun which pretty much fits with homeless scum

Nothing to do with litter which goes in bins, where I throw rubbish by the way, not people.

Why don't you go do something productive? Like go offer some help to these people on the streets by donating them some money or buying them some food or a cup of tea? Or are you completely cold hearted like you have portrayed yourself?

I know a lot about the homeless because I have doen a lot of work with them, and I know there is not enough help out there!!!

God sake mate, runs to :sleep::sleep::sleep::sleep::sleep::sleep::sleep:: sleep::sleep: smileys

Get some coffee and wake up and smell it because I'll tell you straight that 99% of the members on here will do exactly what I'm doing and thats **** all mate.

This is just a debate mate and I'm giving you and the rest of the bunch here my opinion about beggars and homeless residing on our streets and don't you dare talk down to me in that way saying that I am naive and arrogant and just because I don't go out there and try and help homeless folk who in my opinion should be trying more to help themselves get themselves out of the mess their in rather than living and staying in that disgusting world.

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by Tom
There aren't enough free hostels and some have waiting lists. Its just not that simple especially for those without any friends/family.

Thats true and do you know what?

Something needs to be done about it and soon.

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by Xander
I don't think anyone deserve to sleep on the streets, no matter what they have doesn't too deserve or there background. Everyone should sleep somewhere inside.
I really don't know why people choose to sleep on the streets, when there iss a hostel in more aless every town or city.

I think many people enjoy that type of life, mixing with the filth and germs and like the smell of unwashed clothing and the stench of an unwashed body.

I think it's vile and I'd do anything and I mean {Anything} to prevent myself from staying there.

[Benjamin]

Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
Originally posted by Xander
I don't think anyone deserve to sleep on the streets, no matter what they have doesn't too deserve or there background. Everyone should sleep somewhere inside.
I really don't know why people choose to sleep on the streets, when there iss a hostel in more aless every town or city.

I think many people enjoy that type of life, mixing with the filth and germs and like the smell of unwashed clothing and the stench of an unwashed body.

I think it's vile and I'd do anything and I mean {Anything} to prevent myself from staying there.


Fair enough that is your opinion, but sometimes it's best to keep your gob shut! You are offensive by calling them disgusting pigs and such. You know nothing about the subject, so maybe to a little first hand research before spouting off. But you wouldn't do that, thats too much effort i suppose?

I rest easy knowing that Karma comes around to bite people back in the arse, what goes around comes around. A person without compassion, sincerity or sympathy will be worse off than most.

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by ukturtle
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
Originally posted by Xander
I don't think anyone deserve to sleep on the streets, no matter what they have doesn't too deserve or there background. Everyone should sleep somewhere inside.
I really don't know why people choose to sleep on the streets, when there iss a hostel in more aless every town or city.

I think many people enjoy that type of life, mixing with the filth and germs and like the smell of unwashed clothing and the stench of an unwashed body.

I think it's vile and I'd do anything and I mean {Anything} to prevent myself from staying there.


Fair enough that is your opinion, but sometimes it's best to keep your gob shut! You are offensive by calling them disgusting pigs and such. You know nothing about the subject, so maybe to a little first hand research before spouting off. But you wouldn't do that, thats too much effort i suppose?

I rest easy knowing that Karma comes around to bite people back in the ****, what goes around comes around. A person without compassion, sincerity or sympathy will be worse off than most.

Glad you finally respect my opinion. I'm actually keeping my gob shut, even though you can't hear me from where I'm typing right now, but it is true that I'm typing out stuff which you find to be disgusting, well thats just tough ain't it.

If a person lives on a street for some length of time, then it is well true to say that their clothing shall come to stink as well as themselves. Some even choose to urinate without taking their penis out of their trousers as they become so low and simply don't care about life anymore. When human beings get to that stage then they can be compared to a farm animal like a pig because pigs are dirty, are they not? once again a loose description which may offend, but then if so, get out of the gutter in which you find yourself and move onto pastures new which should be into some sort of accomodation.

I don't really care about your so-called education in relation to first-hand knowledge regarding homeless people. What makes you think that I haven't been in contact with homeless people, or know something or nothing about it. You actually don't know me, so you shouldnt say stuff like that which is in itself a nonsequetor ( i think thats how its spelt)

I lost a Karma point actually (speaking of Karma) :tongue:

Hardly nothing to do with this debate as it happens

[Benjamin]

Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
Originally posted by ukturtle
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
Originally posted by Xander
I don't think anyone deserve to sleep on the streets, no matter what they have doesn't too deserve or there background. Everyone should sleep somewhere inside.
I really don't know why people choose to sleep on the streets, when there iss a hostel in more aless every town or city.

I think many people enjoy that type of life, mixing with the filth and germs and like the smell of unwashed clothing and the stench of an unwashed body.

I think it's vile and I'd do anything and I mean {Anything} to prevent myself from staying there.


Fair enough that is your opinion, but sometimes it's best to keep your gob shut! You are offensive by calling them disgusting pigs and such. You know nothing about the subject, so maybe to a little first hand research before spouting off. But you wouldn't do that, thats too much effort i suppose?

I rest easy knowing that Karma comes around to bite people back in the ****, what goes around comes around. A person without compassion, sincerity or sympathy will be worse off than most.

Glad you finally respect my opinion. I'm actually keeping my gob shut, even though you can't hear me from where I'm typing right now, but it is true that I'm typing out stuff which you find to be disgusting, well thats just tough ain't it.

If a person lives on a street for some length of time, then it is well true to say that their clothing shall come to stink as well as themselves. Some even choose to urinate without taking their penis out of their trousers as they become so low and simply don't care about life anymore. When human beings get to that stage then they can be compared to a farm animal like a pig because pigs are dirty, are they not? once again a loose description which may offend, but then if so, get out of the gutter in which you find yourself and move onto pastures new which should be into some sort of accomodation.

I don't really care about your so-called education in relation to first-hand knowledge regarding homeless people. What makes you think that I haven't been in contact with homeless people, or know something or nothing about it. You actually don't know me, so you shouldnt say stuff like that which is in itself a nonsequetor ( i think thats how its spelt)

I lost a Karma point actually (speaking of Karma) :tongue:

Hardly nothing to do with this debate as it happens

I'm not talking about online Karma. Just try showing a bit of compassion mate. these people on streets cannot help being there (some can, yes that is true), but some cannot. I'm not even talking about education either, I have had first hand experience.

It is so difficult to get back into society when you become taken out of it. If somebody who was homeless came to you for work and housing, chances are most turn them away. People want the homeless to sort themselves out, but when push comes to shove, realistically, they would not offer any help to the person who wants to sort their life out.

If you lived like them for a week you would understand the stigmata they recieve and how hard it really is to live, survive and get yourself out of that situation.

But they do not choose. sometimes people have no choice at all and are forced to become homeless.

[Leonine]

Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
Originally posted by ukturtle


How naive and arrogant of you.

This is just a debate mate and I'm giving you and the rest of the bunch here my opinion about beggars and homeless residing on our streets and don't you dare talk down to me in that way saying that I am naive and arrogant and just because I don't go out there and try and help homeless folk who in my opinion should be trying more to help themselves get themselves out of the mess their in rather than living and staying in that disgusting world.

(Punctuation. Google it.)

Can I talk down to you then instead and tell you you are a naive, arrogant, stupid, big-mouthed, pig-headed little child?

Why do the British public feel this incessant need to bang on & on about subjects they know jack $hit about?

Tell you what Always Right - let someone physically, mentally & sexually abuse you day in, day out for 10 years, then develop schizophrenia, then lose everyone you've ever cared about ever, then turn to Class A drugs to numb some of the pain you're feeling and get addicted to them, then lose every last bit of the identity, self esteem and self worth you ever had - THEN & ONLY THEN post on here about "what should be done" about those disgusting homeless people.

I wouldn't even know where to start answering the many idiotic things you've posted. You obviously haven't got a clue about the many reasons people end up homeless in the first place or the hostel / move on system & how it works. So I won't waste any more time on you.

You are a d1ck.

Source: me a.k.a. homeless project worker for last 10 years.

[Nurse57]

Go Leonine.

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by ukturtle
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt

Glad you finally respect my opinion. I'm actually keeping my gob shut, even though you can't hear me from where I'm typing right now, but it is true that I'm typing out stuff which you find to be disgusting, well thats just tough ain't it.

If a person lives on a street for some length of time, then it is well true to say that their clothing shall come to stink as well as themselves. Some even choose to urinate without taking their penis out of their trousers as they become so low and simply don't care about life anymore. When human beings get to that stage then they can be compared to a farm animal like a pig because pigs are dirty, are they not? once again a loose description which may offend, but then if so, get out of the gutter in which you find yourself and move onto pastures new which should be into some sort of accomodation.

I don't really care about your so-called education in relation to first-hand knowledge regarding homeless people. What makes you think that I haven't been in contact with homeless people, or know something or nothing about it. You actually don't know me, so you shouldnt say stuff like that which is in itself a nonsequetor ( i think thats how its spelt)

I lost a Karma point actually (speaking of Karma) :tongue:

Hardly nothing to do with this debate as it happens

I'm not talking about online Karma. Just try showing a bit of compassion mate. these people on streets cannot help being there (some can, yes that is true), but some cannot. I'm not even talking about education either, I have had first hand experience.

It is so difficult to get back into society when you become taken out of it. If somebody who was homeless came to you for work and housing, chances are most turn them away. People want the homeless to sort themselves out, but when push comes to shove, realistically, they would not offer any help to the person who wants to sort their life out.

If you lived like them for a week you would understand the stigmata they recieve and how hard it really is to live, survive and get yourself out of that situation.

But they do not choose. sometimes people have no choice at all and are forced to become homeless.

I know you're not talking about online karma. Notice the :tongue: smiley after the comment. It was just funny and ironic that I lost a couple of karma points, one straight after my reply to you.

I can understand if you have worked beside homeless people and listen to their many sob stories that you can find yourself being drawn into their world of understanding their predicaments. Of course each homeless person will have their own story to tell and each one will be a different situation (with the odd lie or twenty thrown in for good measure I guess?) as they want you to feel sorry fopr them. Well you can feel sorry for them if you like, but you can also accept the fact that their existance on our streets is intolerable in this day-and-age. The government and councils should do a lot more about it. In fact, living on the street for anymore than a week should be illegal, after that point a homeless person should be brought in by the police and placed into some sort of accomodation, by law.

There is this theory that if you are a woman and have a kid, then you jump to the top of the list for a flat/council house simply because the child is a priority. Thats one of the reasons why women have kids today. It's not about loving kids, it's about having an easier life with guaranteed accommodation for themselves/boyfriend and god knows how many kids too, it's a really bad state of affairs in my opinion and that is another reason why the majority of street skirmish is men, not women.

But placing the governments/councils resposabilities to one side for a moment, as they are basically a bunch of tossers anyway who can hardly run a bath let alone a country, there is still the responsability of the individual, ie: homeless person, to make more of an effort to get themselves out of that mess in which they are in.

I shall give you one example of how a homeless person could get themselves out of this mess, as I guess you'd prefer for myself to give you some answers rather than just an opinion which you just don't find pleasurable. Plus the fact that your last reply to myself was more dignified and polite, than the other one :rolleyes:

Lets just imagine a homeless person walks into a police station and asks how they can get off the streets and into some form of accomodation (any), I would then imagine that the police would simply hand them some **** leaflet or some **** phone-number and then send them on their way. Basically passing the problem from pillar to post, probably/maybe because that homeless person is stinking out the police station and the officer is feeling revulsed. So then after that visit to the police station, the homeless person then attempts to phone a number (hopefully a free number otherwise he's/she's screwed) but if it is free, then I would imagine he or she would then still not get into some sort of accomodation unless they have a kid :rolleyes: So that person has to remain on the streets and starts to lose faith.

The only way he or she can get some help is to turn to crime. Smash a shop window, then get arrested, then when in custody explain to the officer in the police interview that he or she was forced into that situation due to severe depression and desperation due to residing on the streets. The officer would then be told by that homeless person that if something can be done immediately to get that person off the streets and into a hostel or something, then another shop window won't be broken. I guess then the police would have to do something? They would have to.

I guess if every homeless person followed that course of action, the government would do something about it. May even fit that into their budget. That would be nice, wouldn't it?

I certainly don't condone crime and this is the last-resort type of action I'd want, but like you say these are desperate times and sometimes desperate measures need to be taken.

I'd also stress that the only shop windows which should be damaged are big name stores who can afford it and also make a lot of noise with their solicitors and links to the media, to make a serious pledge to the government to make change.

It's people-power you need and if all these homeless people fought together as one and created a mass-smashing of big name store shop windows countrywide, it would make a difference.

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by Leonine

(Punctuation. Google it.)

Why would I need to Google the word punctuation, when I know what it means? It's also nothing to do with the homeless

Can I talk down to you then instead and tell you you are a naive, arrogant, stupid, big-mouthed, pig-headed little child?

If you must :rolleyes:

Why do the British public feel this incessant need to bang on & on about subjects they know jack $hit about?

:laugh::laugh: You'll have to get rid of messageboard forums to do that, as most folk know very little about many subjects up for debate and for those that do know quite a lot, either turn uppity like you are displaying above, or never get heard.

Tell you what Always Right - let someone physically, mentally & sexually abuse you day in, day out for 10 years, then develop schizophrenia, then lose everyone you've ever cared about ever, then turn to Class A drugs to numb some of the pain you're feeling and get addicted to them, then lose every last bit of the identity, self esteem and self worth you ever had

You are giving a horrible example of what can happen to a person who then ends up on the streets and lives that life because everything beforehand was a life of hell, so they no longer care anymore about anything. I truly feel sorry for folk like that and I can only say that they need serious help. and the sort of help they need is not on the streets of the UK. It is in the doctors/psychiatrists sergury

- THEN & ONLY THEN post on here about "what should be done" about those disgusting homeless people.

I think you are overstepping the mark.

I am giving my opinion on homeless people and what I think should be done, have a broken a rule or something?

I wouldn't even know where to start answering the many idiotic things you've posted. You obviously haven't got a clue about the many reasons people end up homeless in the first place or the hostel / move on system & how it works. So I won't waste any more time on you.

Yeah Yeah, whatever, whateever...

You are a d1ck.



I could report that, but I'm in a good mood today.

Big Brother's on in under 10 hours :hello:

[kerri]

Have you ever been homeless? I have for 8 months an not by choice an you have made me angrier than anybody ever has its not as simple as gettin accomadation its very hard wen homeless an i was always clean an i'm prepared to discuss my experience with anybody by u2u but you get your facts before openin your mouth in future!!

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by kerri
Have you ever been homeless? I have for 8 months an not by choice an you have made me angrier than anybody ever has its not as simple as gettin accomadation its very hard wen homeless an i was always clean an i'm prepared to discuss my experience with anybody by u2u but you get your facts before openin your mouth in future!!

I'm sorry that you don't like what I say, but you must surely admit that in this day and age it is disgusting to see a country in the state it is. Loads of homeless folk residing on park benches and sitting on the street begging and in train stations, it is just awful to see and something needs to be done about it.

I don't wish to upset you by talking about your personal story publicly on this forum, as I can see that you'd rather do it in a private message instead. But can I ask you one question?

Did you live on the streets and sleep on the streets for the whole 8 months, without having anywhere to stay? not even any friends or family who could put you up?

[kerri]

the whole 8 months through circumstances like i say i wont discuss here and it is a sad state of affairs but running them down doesnt help its not there fault flats and bedsits are being passed over them for other people or that they get forgotten about by the authoritys its them who need taking to task not the actual homeless and begging i never did it but i had a drink and so would anybody who had to live that way, lucky for me i got out 10yrs ago but still remember it like it was yesterday.

[kerri]

maybe i was a tad harsh saying i wouldnt discuss it with you privately so if you wanna then your welcome to u2u me.

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by kerri
maybe i was a tad harsh saying i wouldnt discuss it with you privately so if you want to then your welcome to u2u me.

Will do

[Leonine]

Originally posted by Always_RiGHt

Why would I need to Google the word punctuation, when I know what it means? It's also nothing to do with the homeless

No, but an occasional comma / full stop makes your posts easier to read. And gives a little more weight to your arguments by making you at least seem a tad more intelligent.

:laugh::laugh: You'll have to get rid of messageboard forums to do that, as most folk know very little about many subjects up for debate...

Then "folk" shouldn't try to debate then until they do know something about a subject. Unless they're humble enough to admit they know nothing & are posting to learn more, that is. Otherwise message boards become clogged with pointless posts like "Dunno" or ones like yours that are just ill-thought out and, in my opinion, also pointless.

You are giving a horrible example of what can happen to a person who then ends up on the streets and lives that life because everything beforehand was a life of hell, so they no longer care anymore about anything.

My point being - those horrible examples - child abuse, mental illness, traumatic life events, addiction etc - feature very heavily & very frequently in the background of many, if not most, street homeless. That's fact. I don't need to study 'Shelter' statistics to know it's a fact as I work with homeles people & get to know their histories very well.

I truly feel sorry for folk like that and I can only say that they need serious help. and the sort of help they need is not on the streets of the UK. It is in the doctors / psychiatrists sergury

That's all very well "Mr/Mrs StateTheObvious" but do schizophrenics, for example, always recognise that they are ill & in need of psychiatric help? When suffering paranoid delusions that everyone is out to harm them - their doctor, if they have one, included - do they simply tell themselves to "stop being silly and go and get some help"?

Your point to UKturtle about people who work with homeless people falling for sob stories (or words to that effect) is also wrong. Most people I work with are pretty streetwise and pretty (it must be said) world-weary, jaded people. We're really not the type to be hoodwinked by mere 'sob stories', trust me.

I think you are overstepping the mark. I am giving my opinion on homeless people and what I think should be done, have a broken a rule or something?


Could you explain why I'm overstepping the mark please? You're giving your opinion which, in my opinion, is misinformed and stupid. So I'm telling you to educate yourself on the matter more before you make your wild claims & statements. What's wrong with that?

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by Leonine

No, but an occasional comma / full stop makes your posts easier to read. And gives a little more weight to your arguments by making you at least seem a tad more intelligent.

I don't wish to spend too much more time in this debate, so I'll keep it as brief as I can.

I'm not too interested in your opinions regarding my punctuation, spelling or even how I choose to word a sentance/paragraph, although I shall certainly let your opinions on that subject go in my left ear and out of my right.

As to your final snide quip, I won't even bother as that is just how you find it, not that I care much as my opinions speak for themselves.

Then "folk" shouldn't try to debate then until they do know something about a subject. Unless they're humble enough to admit they know nothing & are posting to learn more, that is. Otherwise message boards become clogged with pointless posts like "Dunno" or ones like yours that are just ill-thought out and, in my opinion, also pointless.

Tut Tut :nono:

messageboard forums are filled with all types of folk with all different degrees of knowledge. Some will have a very high IQ and know a great deal about a number of subjects and some fall below that or have a very good knowledge about a specific subject but not a lot about a majority of subjects. ie: a girl I know is an expert in the singer Duffy, and there ain't many out there that could educate her (except Duffy herself) of course :tongue: I guess if she made a contribution to this debate and she fell short to what You would call "Dunno folk", you'd show her the door. Well life just ain't like that, accept it!

My point being - those horrible examples - child abuse, mental illness, traumatic life events, addiction etc - feature very heavily & very frequently in the background of many, if not most, street homeless. That's fact. I don't need to study 'Shelter' statistics to know it's a fact as I work with homeles people & get to know their histories very well.

Finally we get back to basics/debate.

I know that these types of people will without doubt end up on the streets and getting them off the streets can be even harder because the government and local authorities are certainly not doing enough. One of the reasons why I have been ranting the way I have in this debate. I would rather see these people seeking help and certainly off our streets. In fact, they can be a serious danger to the public leaving them where they are.

That's all very well "Mr/Mrs StateTheObvious" but do schizophrenics, for example, always recognise that they are ill & in need of psychiatric help? When suffering paranoid delusions that everyone is out to harm them - their doctor, if they have one, included - do they simply tell themselves to "stop being silly and go and get some help"?

Your point to UKturtle about people who work with homeless people falling for sob stories (or words to that effect) is also wrong. Most people I work with are pretty streetwise and pretty (it must be said) world-weary, jaded people. We're really not the type to be hoodwinked by mere 'sob stories', trust me.

I know somebody with schizophrenia, so I need no lesson there. I hate the bloke :mad:

You can accuse me of stating the obvious, and you'd be right! You then accuse me of making an incorrect statement that people who work with homeless people fall for sob stories. Well, like you say (from your own experiences) you claim (which may be true/a porky-pie:wink:) that homeless people are streetwise (which makes sense, since they are on the street) "stating the obvious yourself", then you say that they are pretty. I wouldn't agree generally! Pretty dirty and grubby perhaps :laugh: then you ask me to trust you, well I don't know (thats my answer)

I'm sure my reply won't satisfy you, but there you go.

[kerri]

In cities theres places for the homeless were they can go to buy a cheap meal and im talking pence sometimes even free theres also places were you can shower there only open a few hours but still its summat but if your in town theres nothing i was lucky enough if ya call it lucky to be in a city not a town that would have harder alot harder, they are streetwise they have to be alert and watch there backs 24 7 especially at night as the homeless turn on the homeless and i wouldnt wish it on my worst enemy thats the gods honest truth xx

[Chrizzle]

I agree with most of the posts here. I think that there is no need for them to be on the streets, and surely they know someone to stay with?

We have this one guy here who is like famous in our town. He pretends to play instruments and stuff- hes hilarious. Apparently hes actually really rich and someone spotted him in a posh resturant with friends wearing nice clothes LOL. Hes on YouTube!

Homeless people make me uncomfortable anyway, because if they are asking for money and I dont have any, I feel bad. They should go to a hostel or set up somewhere in an empty area instead of pestering the public.

[Leonine]

Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
I don't wish to spend too much more time in this debate, so I'll keep it as brief as I can.

Well pardon me for breathing but you did start this debate. Did you start it and then realise you actually don't care either way? Or realise you're embarrassing yourself? Or are you just leaving the debate now because nobody else agrees with you?



Tut Tut :nono:

messageboard forums are filled with all types of folk with all different degrees of knowledge. Some will have a very high IQ and know a great deal about a number of subjects and some fall below that or have a very good knowledge about a specific subject but not a lot about a majority of subjects. ie: a girl I know is an expert in the singer Duffy, and there ain't many out there that could educate her (except Duffy herself) of course :tongue: I guess if she made a contribution to this debate and she fell short to what You would call "Dunno folk", you'd show her the door. Well life just ain't like that, accept it!

If she was talking about Duffy I'd let her be & have nothing to do with her debate. If she was acting like a little Hitler and saying homeless people are filthy & disgusting & should be removed from our streets I'd argue with her & expect her to be able to back up her opinions.

Finally we get back to basics/debate.

I know that these types of people will without doubt end up on the streets and getting them off the streets can be even harder because the government and local authorities are certainly not doing enough. One of the reasons why I have been ranting the way I have in this debate. I would rather see these people seeking help and certainly off our streets.

But some don't know how to go about seeking that help. Or some know it's there and aren't ready to accept it. For someone already dependant on alcohol/drugs, & living the chaotic lifestyle that comes with that, adhering to rules in a hostel, for example, isn't something all of them can do.

You also have no understanding of the fact that for many street homeless, sleeping on the street can actually be a lot safer than spending a night in a rough night shelter. Often the only choice they have is between hiding themselves away in a park or empty building for the night or sleeping in a dorm style hostel amongst others who may rob them, beat them up or worse. It's a much more complex issue than just "getting them off the streets".

In fact, they can be a serious danger to the public leaving them where they are

Care to elaborate on that? Are you always tripping over homeless people in shop doorways or something? Are they more dangerous to the public than the idiots pi$$ed up & out for a fight every weekend in every town centre in the country? What do you think we should do about them?

I know somebody with schizophrenia, so I need no lesson there. I hate the bloke :mad:

Why do you hate him?

You can accuse me of stating the obvious, and you'd be right! You then accuse me of making an incorrect statement that people who work with homeless people fall for sob stories.

And your point is?

Well, like you say (from your own experiences) you claim (which may be true/a porky-pie:wink:)...

Why would I come on a BB-led forum & pretend to have experience of working with homeless people? If I were sad enough to pretend anything I'd come on here & pretend I worked for Endemol or C4 wouldn't I!?

...that homeless people are streetwise (which makes sense, since they are on the street)

Well yes that, in most cases, would be true. Except I didn't say that. I was talking about "people who work with homeless peole". Read my post properly.

...then you say that they are pretty. I wouldn't agree generally! Pretty dirty and grubby perhaps :laugh: then you ask me to trust you, well I don't know (thats my answer)

Again I wasn't talking about homeless people. And I wasn't saying they were pretty either. Even though many are. :sleep:

I'm sure my reply won't satisfy you...

Correct. Try harder.

[kerri]

it takes years for the council to house people and even though homeless people get given extra points when they first go on the list it still takes years so no alot of them dont have somebody who will put them up indefinately and alot of them there only friends are other homeless people, when on the streets your in a vicious circle and anybody thinking its easy to get off the streets are sadly deluded, i was lucky and it wasnt the authoritys that helped me either xx

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by Leonine
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
I don't wish to spend too much more time in this debate, so I'll keep it as brief as I can.

Well pardon me for breathing but you did start this debate. Did you start it and then realise you actually don't care either way? Or realise you're embarrassing yourself? Or are you just leaving the debate now because nobody else agrees with you?

I just felt that I had said my piece and now it seems to have turned from a debate to a bit of a slagging match to be honest. If you don't agree with me then fair enough, make your point. But in fairness, it's rather a hostile experience debating with you, read back your posts

Originally posted by Leonine
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
Tut Tut :nono:

messageboard forums are filled with all types of folk with all different degrees of knowledge. Some will have a very high IQ and know a great deal about a number of subjects and some fall below that or have a very good knowledge about a specific subject but not a lot about a majority of subjects. ie: a girl I know is an expert in the singer Duffy, and there ain't many out there that could educate her (except Duffy herself) of course :tongue: I guess if she made a contribution to this debate and she fell short to what You would call "Dunno folk", you'd show her the door. Well life just ain't like that, accept it!

If she was talking about Duffy I'd let her be & have nothing to do with her debate. If she was acting like a little Hitler and saying homeless people are filthy & disgusting & should be removed from our streets I'd argue with her & expect her to be able to back up her opinions.

I doubt you'll ever get that luxury, she's addicted to another forum. Can you guess the subject? :tongue:

Originally posted by Leonine
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
Finally we get back to basics/debate.

I know that these types of people will without doubt end up on the streets and getting them off the streets can be even harder because the government and local authorities are certainly not doing enough. One of the reasons why I have been ranting the way I have in this debate. I would rather see these people seeking help and certainly off our streets.

But some don't know how to go about seeking that help. Or some know it's there and aren't ready to accept it. For someone already dependant on alcohol/drugs, & living the chaotic lifestyle that comes with that, adhering to rules in a hostel, for example, isn't something all of them can do.

You also have no understanding of the fact that for many street homeless, sleeping on the street can actually be a lot safer than spending a night in a rough night shelter. Often the only choice they have is between hiding themselves away in a park or empty building for the night or sleeping in a dorm style hostel amongst others who may rob them, beat them up or worse. It's a much more complex issue than just "getting them off the streets".

You place a lot of obstacles in the way of all these homeless people don't you. All the problems which prevent a homeless person from getting off the street you sure found them. Well rather than telling me all the reasons why people should sleep on park benches and on some park or empty building (which is safer that some rough night shelter) by your reckoning :conf: why don't you try and tell me a way out of their mess. It is a mess, isn't it? a terrible one. Just look at a homeless person sitting begging on the streets and tell me whether or not you like seeing it, like that homeless person to remain there because it is the only way for people like that. The majority (from your reckoning) being druggies and alcoholics and the like.

Originally posted by Leonine
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
In fact, they can be a serious danger to the public leaving them where they are

Care to elaborate on that? Are you always tripping over homeless people in shop doorways or something? Are they more dangerous to the public than the idiots pi$$ed up & out for a fight every weekend in every town centre in the country? What do you think we should do about them?

I am aware of what goes on during weekends in town centres and if this was a debate about that I'd be happy to share a view on that, but as you can see it is about another subject, ie: homeless folk. I don't trip over homeless folk either cause I keep my eyes open while walking. That helps generally. I do however know that many homeless people can be quite a nuisence and also commit crimes/theft mainly. It's a jungle for them and surviving is hard. Best get them off the streets and into somewhere nice and warm and safe

Originally posted by Leonine
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
I know somebody with schizophrenia, so I need no lesson there. I hate the bloke :mad:

Why do you hate him?

It's a long story and theres a lot more to it

Originally posted by Leonine
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
You can accuse me of stating the obvious, and you'd be right! You then accuse me of making an incorrect statement that people who work with homeless people fall for sob stories.

And your point is?

My point is that I feel that it is indeed true that homeless people shall give a homeless helper (or whatever there called) a sob story or twenty. I think you read that before?

Originally posted by Leonine
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
Well, like you say (from your own experiences) you claim (which may be true/a porky-pie:wink:)...

Why would I come on a BB-led forum & pretend to have experience of working with homeless people? If I were sad enough to pretend anything I'd come on here & pretend I worked for Endemol or C4 wouldn't I!?

Not necessarily true. I joined here to talk about other subjects and a portion of Big Brother. Like I said in another topic, my fave housemate went out early on

Originally posted by Leonine
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
...that homeless people are streetwise (which makes sense, since they are on the street)

Well yes that, in most cases, would be true. Except I didn't say that. I was talking about "people who work with homeless peole". Read my post properly.

Yes sir :rolleyes:

Originally posted by Leonine
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
...then you say that they are pretty. I wouldn't agree generally! Pretty dirty and grubby perhaps :laugh: then you ask me to trust you, well I don't know (thats my answer)

Again I wasn't talking about homeless people. And I wasn't saying they were pretty either. Even though many are. :sleep:

I shall have to check your post again then. If I remember, you mentioned they were pretty, not ugly

Originally posted by Leonine
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
I'm sure my reply won't satisfy you...

Correct. Try harder.

I doubt anything will please you (and thats just on first impressions.) ain't I intuative :wink:

[Always_RiGHt]

Originally posted by kerri
In cities theres places for the homeless were they can go to buy a cheap meal and Im talking pence sometimes even free theres also places were you can shower there only open a few hours but still its summat but if your in town theres nothing i was lucky enough if you call it lucky to be in a city not a town that would have harder alot harder, they are streetwise they have to be alert and watch there backs 24 7 especially at night as the homeless turn on the homeless and i wouldnt wish it on my worst enemy thats the gods honest truth xx

I know about these places where food and washing fascilities are available, like you said they are in a city. One of the reasons why London seems to be homeless/beggar central, which I can understand.

I wouldn't like to be in that position either, I would do almost anything to get myself out of that position and for those that can't or won't it's just a sad sorry mess which we all have to see day in day out.

In Charlie Chaplin times it was fashionable to be a tramp. Well he was one :tongue:

[Glenn.]

By reading everyones posts I can only agree with Leonine. AlwaysRight I think, doesnt know what the **** hes talking about.
My cousin encountered a tramp down an alley one night and the tramp actually shook my cousin for money, to which he punched him in the face and ran, because there was two of them.
I try not to get involved in this area of the site because I tend to get warnings. The number of homeless people in this counrty is disgusting, but these people need pity, not abuse. I wouldnt go up to a homeless person and say 'Your a disgusting pig', and I think neither would AlwaysRight, the phrase 'All Mouth, No Trousers' comes to mind.

[kerri]

it amazes me how so many people havent got a clue about the real world im glad i have xx

[Benjamin]

Originally posted by Always_RiGHt
Originally posted by ukturtle
Originally posted by Always_RiGHt

Glad you finally respect my opinion. I'm actually keeping my gob shut, even though you can't hear me from where I'm typing right now, but it is true that I'm typing out stuff which you find to be disgusting, well thats just tough ain't it.

If a person lives on a street for some length of time, then it is well true to say that their clothing shall come to stink as well as themselves. Some even choose to urinate without taking their penis out of their trousers as they become so low and simply don't care about life anymore. When human beings get to that stage then they can be compared to a farm animal like a pig because pigs are dirty, are they not? once again a loose description which may offend, but then if so, get out of the gutter in which you find yourself and move onto pastures new which should be into some sort of accomodation.

I don't really care about your so-called education in relation to first-hand knowledge regarding homeless people. What makes you think that I haven't been in contact with homeless people, or know something or nothing about it. You actually don't know me, so you shouldnt say stuff like that which is in itself a nonsequetor ( i think thats how its spelt)

I lost a Karma point actually (speaking of Karma) :tongue:

Hardly nothing to do with this debate as it happens

I'm not talking about online Karma. Just try showing a bit of compassion mate. these people on streets cannot help being there (some can, yes that is true), but some cannot. I'm not even talking about education either, I have had first hand experience.

It is so difficult to get back into society when you become taken out of it. If somebody who was homeless came to you for work and housing, chances are most turn them away. People want the homeless to sort themselves out, but when push comes to shove, realistically, they would not offer any help to the person who wants to sort their life out.

If you lived like them for a week you would understand the stigmata they recieve and how hard it really is to live, survive and get yourself out of that situation.

But they do not choose. sometimes people have no choice at all and are forced to become homeless.

I know you're not talking about online karma. Notice the :tongue: smiley after the comment. It was just funny and ironic that I lost a couple of karma points, one straight after my reply to you.

I can understand if you have worked beside homeless people and listen to their many sob stories that you can find yourself being drawn into their world of understanding their predicaments. Of course each homeless person will have their own story to tell and each one will be a different situation (with the odd lie or twenty thrown in for good measure I guess?) as they want you to feel sorry fopr them. Well you can feel sorry for them if you like, but you can also accept the fact that their existance on our streets is intolerable in this day-and-age. The government and councils should do a lot more about it. In fact, living on the street for anymore than a week should be illegal, after that point a homeless person should be brought in by the police and placed into some sort of accomodation, by law.

There is this theory that if you are a woman and have a kid, then you jump to the top of the list for a flat/council house simply because the child is a priority. Thats one of the reasons why women have kids today. It's not about loving kids, it's about having an easier life with guaranteed accommodation for themselves/boyfriend and god knows how many kids too, it's a really bad state of affairs in my opinion and that is another reason why the majority of street skirmish is men, not women.

But placing the governments/councils resposabilities to one side for a moment, as they are basically a bunch of tossers anyway who can hardly run a bath let alone a country, there is still the responsability of the individual, ie: homeless person, to make more of an effort to get themselves out of that mess in which they are in.

I shall give you one example of how a homeless person could get themselves out of this mess, as I guess you'd prefer for myself to give you some answers rather than just an opinion which you just don't find pleasurable. Plus the fact that your last reply to myself was more dignified and polite, than the other one :rolleyes:

Lets just imagine a homeless person walks into a police station and asks how they can get off the streets and into some form of accomodation (any), I would then imagine that the police would simply hand them some **** leaflet or some **** phone-number and then send them on their way. Basically passing the problem from pillar to post, probably/maybe because that homeless person is stinking out the police station and the officer is feeling revulsed. So then after that visit to the police station, the homeless person then attempts to phone a number (hopefully a free number otherwise he's/she's screwed) but if it is free, then I would imagine he or she would then still not get into some sort of accomodation unless they have a kid :rolleyes: So that person has to remain on the streets and starts to lose faith.

The only way he or she can get some help is to turn to crime. Smash a shop window, then get arrested, then when in custody explain to the officer in the police interview that he or she was forced into that situation due to severe depression and desperation due to residing on the streets. The officer would then be told by that homeless person that if something can be done immediately to get that person off the streets and into a hostel or something, then another shop window won't be broken. I guess then the police would have to do something? They would have to.

I guess if every homeless person followed that course of action, the government would do something about it. May even fit that into their budget. That would be nice, wouldn't it?

I certainly don't condone crime and this is the last-resort type of action I'd want, but like you say these are desperate times and sometimes desperate measures need to be taken.

I'd also stress that the only shop windows which should be damaged are big name stores who can afford it and also make a lot of noise with their solicitors and links to the media, to make a serious pledge to the government to make change.

It's people-power you need and if all these homeless people fought together as one and created a mass-smashing of big name store shop windows countrywide, it would make a difference.


THAT MAKES ME ANGRY and you sound so pathetic. No wonder you have such niave views in your life, you have a lot of growing up to do!!


It's not falling for homeless people's sob stories at all, you insensitive swine! Yes, I have worked alongside the homeless, but i also have first hand experience of being homeless!!! So i know how goddam hard it is, especially when people like you exist in the world, and put everyone down. I was lucky and managed to pull myself out and get to college and uni, but I know why and how some people cannot.

So next time you want to spout off your inconceivable and spiteful drivvle, take it somewhere else mate.


So until you actually experience being homeless or seeing or working with homeless people, your points are incorrect, stupid and damn well unitelligent. Shame, really, but I suppose not everyone can have rational thinking.

[hannah.]

I've always wanted to live on the streets for just a few days, to see what it's like. I mean it pisses me off when every few metres people are begging for change, or asking for cigarettes, but I think my opinion would change dramatically if I had the experience myself

[kerri]

its a complete different experience doing it when u can go home at anytime theres no comparing the two imo xx