Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet (Post 8508458)

There are plenty of people who think faeries are real and unicorns, people think Yetis exist and Angels and ghosts.

I see no difference - its believing without proper evidence

Originally Posted by Livia (Post 8508470)

The simple answer is, next time you start a thread posing a question it's taken learned people millennia to ponder, and to which there is still no definitive answer, I hope people with faith, such as myself, will steer well clear of the "debate" so that the atheists can just talk amongst themselves.

Let me know if you come up with anything.

Originally Posted by kirklancaster (Post 8508476)

Of course this thread topic was chosen by L.T. to attract the usual piss-taking responses, and of course it has been successful in achieving that objective.

If this forum is a 'Serious Debate' forum, and this subject is a 'Serious' subject, of which the OP asks; "Why are God's always invisible", then why, when I posted a serious and comprehensive response WITH corroboration - as usual - have there been no comment, responses, or even acknowledgement of my serious response, when there HAVE been NUMEROUS piss-taking posts since?

Livia is bang on right.

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 8508484)

Personally speaking, I didn't reply to your post because it was just Bible quotes and I don't really believe stuff written in the Bible so it would have been pointless to reply to your post

Originally Posted by Kizzy (Post 8508483)

That's not an answer, suggesting it's been thought about before shouldn't stop people from thinking or questioning.
Free will gives all the right to do this, god given.
Anyone who feels secure in their faith can rest on their laurels while others wrestle with the big questions then.

Originally Posted by Livia (Post 8508489)

I don't have anything else to say in this "debate".

Originally Posted by kirklancaster (Post 8508488)

Thank you Niamh. I understand.

I was really hoping for a response from LT to be honest. :hehe:

Originally Posted by Kizzy (Post 8508483)

That's not an answer, suggesting it's been thought about before shouldn't stop people from thinking or questioning.
Free will gives all the right to do this, god given.
Anyone who feels secure in their faith can rest on their laurels while others wrestle with the big questions then.

Originally Posted by kirklancaster (Post 8506817)

This thread starts with a false premise in that God is NOT invisible.

There is a difference in being 'invisible' and being 'unseen'.

YOU, my dear 'winder upper' L.T. exist, I exist, Toy Soldier exists, as do all the members of Tibb, but we are 'invisible' and communicate via this forum, only ELECTING to become 'visible' when we choose to, by sending our photos to each other, skyping each other, or even meeting in person.

God 'communicated' via his Angels to many people in the Old Testament, and to his Prophets and many others, by a form of what we now term 'telepathy' which they - in their limited knowledge termed 'dreams' or 'visions'.

Yet God DID physically appear on numerous occasions to others in the Old Testament:
Adam and Eve
Cain and Abel
Noah and his wife and sons.
Abraham
Sarah
Hagar
Ishmael
Rebekah
Joseph
Jacob
Solomon
Job
Isaiah
Micaiah
Jeremiah
Ezekiel
Nebuchadnezza
Shadrach, Meshach,Abed-Nego
Belshazzar and company of ,1000 lords at feast
Daniel
Amos
Jonah
Habakkuk
Zechariah
Elijah
Elisha
David

And let's not forget the most famous example of man meeting a visible God; Moses, who came back down Sinai after receiving the Commandments, and was transfigured and his skin 'glowing' and 'shining':

Exodus 34:29

"29 When Moses came down from Mount Sinai with the two tablets of the covenant law in his hands, he was not aware that his face was radiant because he had spoken with the Lord. 30 When Aaron and all the Israelites saw Moses, his face was radiant, and they were afraid to come near him.

31 But Moses called to them; so Aaron and all the leaders of the community came back to him, and he spoke to them.

32 Afterward all the Israelites came near him, and he gave them all the commands the Lord had given him on Mount Sinai".

And this is NOT the only time those who 'met' God were transfigured and became 'Shining Ones'.

In the New Testament, GOD appears before EVERYONE, from the Israelites to the Romans and others, in the form of Jesus of Nazareth - The Christ or Messiah.

YOU are looking and approching this subject through very ordinary HUMAN eyes, and within the very strict and narrow parameters of knowledge which even the most intellectual and learned of humans are unfortunately shackled by.

WHY - if God exists (and I KNOW that he does) - should we humans dare to know HIS mind, or understand HIS works?

The most intellectal, scientific or creative of us, fail miserably when attempting to understand a concept so unimaginable and unfathomable as God, and we close our feeble minds altogether, or hide behind Darwin's increasingly discredited and flawed 'Origin of Species' or the error-riddled sweeping presumptions of Dawkins, or we fall in 'lock, stock, and barrel' with the 'God was an Alien' types of theories, because Aliens (which I also firmly believe in the existence of) are more 'technological' and therefore dovetail more neatly into our 'scientific' mindsets.

The text of the Bible and other scriptures may at times appear self-contradictory or to paint God as a murderous, wrathful, and positively evil deity, but this is a HUGE error being repeatedly made on here by 'Religion bashers' and 'Atheists', because they are confusing the WORD of God with the word of God as corrupted and altered over thousands of years by countless corrupt MEN for their own very HUMAN ends.

In Walter Millers great post-nuclear dystopian Science Fiction masterpiece "A Canticle for Leibowitz", the monk Liebowitz finds a tattered fragment of an ordinary pre-apocolypse shopping list - including 'pastrami' - and this is subsequently hailed as a 'sacred relic'.

A mistake in perception and translation - yes.

But proof that whoever wrote that list EXISTED and that it had an original purpose.

Do not deny God's message because we are not yet equipped to understand it.

And don't blame God for Man's doing.

Originally Posted by kirklancaster (Post 8508505)

I am physically large enough and skilled in boxing to have 'faith' that I can take care of myself and I am 100% 'secure' in that faith, but if every time I walked out of my door I was attacked - even by 6 stone weaklings - I would not enjoy it, would soon tire of it, and would soon not relish the prospect of venturing out.

It is no different with matters pertaining to Faith or Intellect - constant attack and ridicule do not entice one to join 'debates' - no matter how secure one is in his/her faith. Especially when counter arguments are dismissed without answer, or facts which rebutt are so conveniently ignored.

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 8508484)

Personally speaking, I didn't reply to your post because it was just Bible quotes and I don't really believe stuff written in the Bible so it would have been pointless to reply to your post

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 8508510)

Nobody is "standing outside your door"

Originally Posted by kirklancaster (Post 8508505)

I am physically large enough and skilled in boxing to have 'faith' that I can take care of myself and I am 100% 'secure' in that faith, but if every time I walked out of my door I was attacked - even by 6 stone weaklings - I would not enjoy it, would soon tire of it, and would soon not relish the prospect of venturing out.

It is no different with matters pertaining to Faith or Intellect - constant attack and ridicule do not entice one to join 'debates' - no matter how secure one is in his/her faith. Especially when counter arguments are dismissed without answer, or facts which rebutt are so conveniently ignored.

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier (Post 8508511)

That's pretty much my thoughts on it. You can't back up questions about the validity of religion or the existence of God using quotes from the Bible...

Its like asking Sony to review the Playstation 4.

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet (Post 8508557)

yes I know TS etc exist as this is an internet forum and i am part of it and the evidence is plain and simple that others on here are humans who are on phones or in houses on keyboards posting

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier (Post 8508515)

It's true Kirk.





... ... ... Trumpet's M.O. is hiding in the bushes down the street, ready to strike when you least expect, screeching like a banshee and brandishing an organic lambskin dildo.

"Admit that God isn't real!!" he wails, as he beats your ears with the soft, yet firm, prosthetic phallus.

Originally Posted by Livia (Post 8508470)

The simple answer is, next time you start a thread posing a question it's taken learned people millennia to ponder, and to which there is still no definitive answer, I hope people with faith, such as myself, will steer well clear of the "debate" so that the atheists can just talk amongst themselves.

Let me know if you come up with anything.

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 8508510)

Nobody is "standing outside your door" waiting to attack you though Kirk, this is a topic on an internet forum, it's your choice to read or not to read/to respond or not to respond :shrug:

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier (Post 8508580)

And that is where you have made a fatal error, LT! Muahahahaha

Originally Posted by Niamh. (Post 8508615)

LT and penises have been mentioned far too much in this thread for my liking :omgno:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet (Post 8508625)

er TS do you not recall posting that pic on MTM on new years eve, you took it down quickly but I still have it...


http://images-cdn.9gag.com/photo/azLdx3j_700b.jpg