if you look hard at each contestant you can see the good/God within them. All they need so is worship Jesus and not money/material goods and they will be saved.

You would know alot about that wouldn't you :xyxwave:

Makes you wonder then, why the Catholic Church is so rich while there are people dying in the world because they don't have clean water to drink or enough food to eat.

Human Nature in it's present state of Evolution is such that we are in competition with eachother

All the conflict in the world on a global scale or a local scale boil down to natural urges either being fulfilled or not, where they are not arises conflict

What happened when Marcus did not get his natural (i.e Nature given) urge to have Noirin, conflict.

Bea her Natural, (i.e Nature given) urge to be selfish and placed before all others, is causing all kinds of conflict. I realise i may be subscribing to a different definition of nature than the magority, and that many will see marcus's, and Bea's actions as unnatural and learned behaviour as apposed to nature given, but we have seen Monkeys be selfish and lions be protective of his females, so i think it is pretty nature given, despite the popular concensus.

When i say overcome nature i mean to see it for what it is Nature Red in tooth and claw, cruel, heartless, favouring the strong, disempowering the weak. And to overcome these unwanted, i presume traits. This may happen in the next human evolutionery step, if man realises it's need to overcome Nature, but if he never realises it Nature will continue to dominate us, as always.

I think we are seeing roots of change in this direction, charity workers are a good example, but the thing that makes a rich man keep more money than he could ever spend in the bank, whilst walking past a homeless person in the street is the natural thing man must overcome.

and if the catholic church gave all of their money away are you saying that would help


or perhaps is it a bit more complex than that?

I'm not saying give their money away indiscriminately, but maybe be seen to be using it for good, for setting an example. Or do you think it's right they sit on their cash while people starve because they can't help everyone?

I see what you're saying and agree with most of it. The thing is though, man is part of nature. We are not above it or separate to it.

If you think the state the world is in is because of religion, then you reallly have been ill informed.

Fallen Woman?...

I asked The Salvation Army "Do you Save fallen woman?"
They said "Yes"
I said,"Right! save me 2 for Friday"

Nope it belongs here, People want to box things away to much if you watch BB then you never really talk about it's deeper implications, Freddie is bullied, but we never really get to debate it in anything other than a lighthearted way, because we fear our threads will be packed off to the "Serious debate Forum"

I'm not catholic but realisticly you could say that about anyone. When It comes down to it, the catholic church isn't as responsible as others for the famine and poverty in certain countries.

isnt it about this time that some one posts "religion causes more wars/kills more people than anything else"?


perhaps if Freddie had read the Bible he would not have resorted to buggery?

Personally I want nature to win. The best future for this planet would probably be without mankind it is only one species.

Ha ha ha If you think it's not then you are well deluded.......:thumbs:

:love:

Strikes me religion is mearly a tool used by the minority to control the many same as fudal system was and governments today are but on a more social level.

Considering that statement does nothing in the form of constructive opinion it is easy to see the demise of your logic......Have a nice religious day.......:thumbs:

I chose the Catholics as an example... but I disagree that they aren't responsible. All so-called religions are reponsible. Surely mankind is their responsibility, or what is their message?

I'm eating fish today, I kid you not. All good doctors go to heaven.

Most religions seem to teach peace and that is why they are attractive to so many people. The problem is that organised religions see the opportunity for selfing gain and have been exploiting good nature in people for centuries.

Bang on......Spot on........None deluded logic at last......

As a nock on effect from wars such as the Thirty Year War it has though. Must western conflics have a religious connection based upon the Catholic church.

I'd agree with that.

They do teach (or preach) peace and yet so much blood has been spilled in their name.

Can I just say... what a bloody pleasure it is to have a debate like this with no one flying off the handle? I don't agree with everyone but there have been some excellent posts here.

HAHAHAHAAHA! LMFAO .. I got as far as 3rd sentence!


what aload of gobbly gooch!

I agree. we are part of it but i think we can escape it's undesirable traits

When Nature made Man, Nature made a mistake, Nature allowed for the first time ever, a creature capable of understanding nature, Cows just get on with chewing grass, where as we want to know what kind of grass is this?, is it good for me? and more importantly, how can i change this grass?

How do we overcome this grass, this grass is no good for me and i must improve it. Working with nature will always have us competing, and this will always end in winners, and losers, thus we need to overcome it.