And we all lived happily ever after :hee:

i think they knew exactly what they were doing when they nailed him up there, it couldn't exactly be described as an oops moment :laugh:

Well when he sang always look on the bright side of life the Centurians looked surprised so I dont think you are right

I’d say the latter .. I certainly see things as either right or wrong - no in between.

That said .. I give youngsters a bit of a pass as they are still learning and evolving and as such don’t really know any better .

I’ve never knowingly or intentionally broke any rule or hurt someone’s feelings .

I still pay for our TV license and I’m probably the only person who hasn’t had their FireStick Jailbroke

I’ve still got a clean licence after 44 years of driving - not even a parking offence .

That said I feel that I am kinda naive as I don’t always believe when someone does something wrong as it’s something I’d never do , personally


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I don’t even pay my BBC iPlayer tax fee. You’re a don.

But no, (on a more serious note) I think I have the opposite problem to you (I have my fair share of internal baggage/quirks but Asperger’s isn’t exactly one of them). I play the game for a whole (sometimes not even that intentionally) and see too many shades of grey in-between and wait for people to really cross lines with me (depending on how close they are to me, obviously) before I let them go and at that point there really is no turning back. I like to think of myself as a nice guy at the core but I definitely don’t forget even if I do forgive eventually.

Interesting


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So you haven’t broken a single law?

How much active personal value do you put on forgiveness (and what are your limits?)
 

Not intentionally

It’s just the way I am .. it’s also partly the way I was brought up ( to be honest and hard working - the old fashioned way )

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Going back to the thread topic, the most painful thing about the most recent experience of betrayal I had with people who actually meant something to me (last year) is that we actually mostly got on just fine in the beginning (after a dodgy first few weeks getting to know these two guys) and there was a point where I gave a lot (way more than I needed to) and was low-key planning a mutual holiday for the three of us between Amsterdam and Florence (Italy) but then they went and did what they did over the course of several months and a lot of drama came out of it so it all went very sour. Only one of them properly apologised for what he did but the funny thing is the other one still had the audacity to chime at me one of the last times I saw him (I probably wouldn’t have forgiven him or wanted anything to do with him generally even with an apology). There was this other mutual person known to two of us who got involved in my life last September/October (who ended up really pissing me off and very much violating my boundaries) but he was just a random face I never gave a monkey’s about in the first place so when he got the guilt-hint (I think he did try and genuinely patch things up prior but I didn’t care) and deleted me off one of my socials I really wasn’t bothered. I just wish I’d have had a chance to have told him what-for in person but being the flakey fly-by-night he was he wasn’t even worth that. I hope I never see the bastard again.

Last year was far from my easiest but it taught me a thing or two about self-validation, boundaries and realising that it’s okay to just walk away from people who haven’t proved themselves to be worth your time and attention if they lack the most basic respect. I’m not even a boundary-buss like that but so many people out there don’t even know the basics of it,

Fool me once, shame on shame on you, Fool me you can't get fooled again

What about when people pretend they did nothing wrong,and act normal with you again .

I always feel like it's a soap opera with a script change,when that happens.

It just depends what they did. I can overlook certain things (quite a lot, actually) but when the gaslighting’s about something serious or involved you going deep/pouring your heart out (in a way) only for them to be like, ‘I haven’t got a clue what you’re talking about’ and then go on to gossip about you, I’m so done. I might play along for a bit but they’re sure to get the hint soon enough that I don’t want anything to do with them ever again (unless they acknowledge the seriousness of what they did and apologise properly).

The guy who roped me into his nonsense last autumn (I wasn’t interested in having anything to do with him in the first place) was like that. Not once did he acknowledge his foolishness and he wondered why I didn’t want to go within a 90-foot-bargepole radius of him (and on top of that he was just a shallow, freckle-faced so-and-so who did little to sustain my interpersonal interest after the first two times I met him anyway). As far as I’m concerned no apology, no friendship (if it’s that deep). You can’t just brush your nonsense under the carpet and expect me to carry on as normal with you (I’m socially-selective as it is so you really have to earn at least a bit of my trust and affection if you want to come anywhere near my bubble). I almost went out with him on New Year’s Eve (I was just about starting to warm to him around then but it still felt really, really awkward) but eventually I sacked it off and just let him observe me staying in my lane for the next few months. I heard a fair bit of guilt was involved in his part throughout the way but he never actually came back from his gaslighting and gossip and just got bored of me grey-rocking him in my authenticity after a while. Up until then he didn’t even come vaguely-close to seeing me for who I really was.

At what age would you hold someone fully-accountable, out of interest?

I’ve never really thought about it ..

More of a generalisation , I guess


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Also if you want to get deep , forgiveness doesn't necessarily mean you forget or become best pals with the person . But it's more about your growth & not letting it eat away at you .

But i guess it depends what the person has done etc .

True. After the stuff that’s gone on in my own space over the past 2 years I don’t trust people enough to become super-tight with anyone new in the first place anymore (not that I was that much of an open book in the first place) so I’m probably not going to have to have to weigh up my options and figure out how close we can be to them after potential forgiveness anymore but I guess with people I had history with before 2020 it just depends on a lot (like you said).

Perfect


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Instead of going back-and-forth thinking all sorts of dark, negative energy (not that I don’t still have those days) at worst I tend to just block (sometimes re-block because I go through those phases) and move on so in the line of progress that’s something, I guess.

And even having said all that stuff about the past 2 years I’ve still met some very cool people within that time-frame but I’ve only interacted with them in a limited capacity so it’s hard to say too much when it comes to that. I’m sure there’ll be a time when I become more trusting in a generalised sense but it’s going to take a specific form of therapy for me to get to that point and I’m just not there yet. I know I’m not.

A cheek for a cheek makes the whole bum fall off.

What are your thoughts on the whole concept of forgiveness, Ollie? I can’t remember what you said nearer the top of this thread (if you did comment).

Everyone has their own mileage and I can accept that, but I just can't be bothered with harbouring grudges, I don't want to give such negativity the headspace. Plus I'm quite laid back in general, which results in me being mostly forgiving. I've not really been at the wrong end of any serious transgressions, so I've not been in a position where forgiveness is not an option.