Abortion at ANY stage of pregnancy is murder of an innocent life!

My understanding of the IVF case was that it was fertilised embryos that were destroyed because the man withdrew consent.

For the record I am more sympathetic to this viewpoint

That said

If we did have a circumstance when neither party agreed, what is the default position to be. Terminate or full term

Currently it is what the woman decides. If she decides to terminate and the man does not want her to do so, and there have been cases in the past that went to court, after the deed is done, there is no financial implications for either party.

Reverse that

She keeps it, he does not want to, then the man is placed with a long term financial commitment he did not want. That is the situation today.

This could be why some men would like to force their partners to terminate, to evade the financial responsibility and why some feel aggrieved

There is of course the "He should have thought about that before" argument, which is compelling, and there is no excuse for the man not taking responsibility for contraception.

However there has been one case, where a woman retrieved a used condom and inserted the contents into her so she could get pregnant, even though the man did not want to become a father.

What should happen then? Keep things as they are, forced termination or the man is released from any legal obligation to support the child?

Personally I am not in favour of abortion - As stated if I was the man in this scenario I would be, (If I had one) supporting my wife's / girlfriend's decision to keep the child.

I raise this motion because of something I came across in the media where a man left his wife / partner because she became pregnant and refused to have an abortion, and was resentful because he did not want to be a father

Don't be stupid it's completely different,just because you don't want a baby it doesn't mean your going to kill someone.As for fathers having a say in whether the mother has the baby,what if three weeks after it's born he decides he didn't want to be dad after all.

Excuse me, but i never said that NOT WANTING babies means you will murder someone (I think you're having a blonde moment)
I said terminating a baby you have ALREADY CONCEIVED
IS murder.

Absolutely, I think that the man and the woman should come to a joint decision, they can not be divided or, as Sticks highlighted, it can be grossly unfair. I think if they are divided in opinion:

Mother keep v Father abort = Father should have no legal responsibility to pay money for the child. They can choose to if they wish, but there ought to be no legal responsibility, and I think the best way to prevent abuse of that would be for the father to sign a document saying that that is his position.

Father keep v Mother abort = If the mother just does not want the child but would go through childbirth, then there ought to be some kind of document to say that the father has full legal responsibility of the child. If the mother simply doesn't want to go through childbirth, then I think abortion is the only measure that can be taken.

Father abort, Mother abort = Abort.

Anyone who was reading this could have worked out i wasn't talking about not wanting a baby.I was talking about not wanting a baby that was ALREADY CONCEIVED DUH i think you got all the blonde dye. oh and BTW i'm not blonde i have brown hair, but come on blonde's are not dumb.

But you implied that i'd said someone who doesn't want their baby will go out and kill someone. I never said that, i said that aborting an unborn child is murder.

(BTW, i never said you were blonde. I said you were having a blonde moment)

The only problem with that is you might get some men who will be having multiple partners and getting them pregnant with impunity, then signing that document and not taking responsibility for their behaviour.

Do you mind if i ask are you male or female.

Up to 24 weeks a "baby" is a cluster of cells that has the potential to be a human being.
murdering a two year old and killing a cluster of cells is NEVER the same thing.
What a stupid thing to say.

From conception it is a LIFE, no one has the right to take that away
' a cluster of cells'? how heartless.
Who the hell are you to tell me that it is a stupid thing to say, it is my opinion

I will reply if you tell me what relevance it has

Actually its proven that it isn't a life and is a cluster of cells. Not the same as murdering a two year old.

I agree with you oh and to 08marsh saying that is not heartless

It is not PROVEN at all. We are cells too yet we are lives. It is up to individual people whether or not they believe it to be a LIFE (as in have a soul). Do not call me stupid.

Yet again, her comment being heartless is a matter of opinion. Stop acting like a silly little girl (unless of course you are)

Do you read about the science behind a human life.. do and come back to me. Oh and I didn't call you stupid, but that particular comment you made was. Just like how you thought me saying the fact that a "baby" is a cluster of cells up to 24 weeks was "stupid".

You just said you didn't call me stupid, yet you just did again.
(talking contradiction)
Like i said before it is a matter of opinion behind a life
(ie. breathing organisms and souls) Am i getting through now or is a layer of peroxide blocking the way

I'm telling your "brain" that I didn't call you stupid but that small insignificant comment you made was, you should never compare having an abortion to murdering a two year old... oh and implying blond jokes when you are suppose to be having a serious argument is not clever... I thought more of you.

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you should never compare having an abortion to murdering a two year old... [/quote]

Like i said before it is a matter of opinion about what a LIFE is.
And me comparing it to the killing of a two year old was to illustrate how serious and murderous (my belief) abortion is.

I respect that you may not agree with that, but my opinion is not wrong or unjustified, just like your opinion can't be called wrong.

I am a girl but i take it your man or a boy then, because you would never have to decide whether to terminate a pregnancy or not.Most women and girls do not end there pregnacy without a lot of thinking.They have to do what's best for them.

I have never questioned that there are people who really think about it beforehand. I just said i didn't agree and thought it murderous (that is my opinion).
And on your comment of sexes, you have a very
small understanding of the real world.
Just because it is a woman carrying the child doesn't mean that their aren't couples out there who make these decisions together.

''They have to do what's best for them'' selfish attitude
You're right about one thing i would never have to decide about terminating a baby or not because i wouldn't even consider it.

Yes but is that because your a man?

You're misunderstanding my point (FYI i'm a woman)
I said, regardless of sex, it is narrow minded to think only women have the decision. There are many couples out there who make decisions as big as this together whether good or bad. I said i wouldn't have to make the decision myself because i wouldn't be so cold hearted to even think about terminating an unborn child