Tbh nobody has made any intelligent replies to any of my post as of yet.
What do you want be to back up?
The fact that Scotland is dependent on England or that Irelands economy is a bigger mess than Alex Salmond's face?
Because I'm sure I can find more than a few articles.

I think that's a bit unfair tbh. A lot of English resent the fact that the three other nations all have some form of control over issues in their respective country, free from Westminster involvement when we dont have that. A lot of Scots were unhappy with English MP's being the predominant opinion on matters which mainly affect just Scotland, and so were granted the luxury of deciding those issues for themselves; we have no such luxury in England.

Tom's original post was worded in a way that I think highlights one of the reasons why people generally dislike the idea of a United Kingdom in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland though - that arrogant assumption that England is this weary benefactor of three 'scrounging' nations... On the contrary, we have all been trying to establish ourselves as independent nations who are not reliant on the English to sustain ourselves. That's the point that it comes down to though - in Westminster, the three smaller nations do not get as much of a say yet were affected by nationwide decisions; now that there's been some form of devolution in all three (either through the assemblies or parliament in Scotland's case) that issue isn't as prominent. Therefore the reason the English don't have a separate Parliament, it seems to me, is because by creating one, it signals the end of the United Kingdom as such, and promotes the idea of four separate nations under one banner, and would probably lead to the dissolution of the UK.

Basically I see the lack of an English Parliament as the glue holding the UK together.

That's kind of petty and stupid to be honest, if you think of everything England has done and taken away from other certain countries.

The Lord Zeezus summed it up pretty well in his post.

That's why NI, Scotland and Wales and actually Ireland get pissed with England so much because of the way Tom basically made out like we should all drop our identity because 'England Rules Us'.

Tom seemed more to be dismissing the influence of the Scottish Parliament than their contribution to the Union, a view I would personally disagree with. The view that England are the benefactor of Scotland/Wales/N.I is not one that most of the English hold, I think most would acknowledge Scotland's importance to the Union. Scots could also be accused of the same offence as well, I may be wrong but there seems to be a "they need us more than we need them" attitude among many Scots, particularly when it comes to something like the North Sea oil

I do think you have a valid point though, in that an English Parliament could be a final step toward the breakdown of the Union. Although English nationalism is undoubtedly on the rise as it is and I do think part of that is because of our lack of a Parliament. Scottish, Welsh & Irish MP's can vote on exclusively English issues yet English MP's cannot do the same for matters affecting the other nations, and I dont think that is fair. It's a difficult situation alright, I like the idea of the English Parliament but it could effectively render Westminster pointless so maybe it is necessary to refrain from introducing one

I think the complete devolution of the UK will happen at some point tbh, I really dont know how long it can continue to survive

It isnt petty or stupid at all, it's a serious issue in British politics. It may be necessary for England not to have a parliament so the Union can survive but I cant see how it could ever be considered fair.

Yes its something called the Acts of (the)Union from 1536 (then1707) onward up to and including the various legislature that allowed the reintroduction of regional assemblies, which allows each country its own identity its own boundaries and the certain self determining rights, the Independence of Scottish education and judicial systems to name a couple.

Throwing all four countries back together into one country under one parliament would create more problems than it solves.

The biggest of these would be the people of three of the countries resenting the lack of regional assemblies etc and would probably lead to the dissolution of the union very rapidly.

United together as we are currently the UK can shout fairly loudly in Europe, four smaller individual countries would be ignored more than we currently are, that is if all four elected to stay in Europe, if they were even allowed in Europe as four separate independand nations.

The balance between self determination and collective sovereignity is about right for the current times.

It's ironic that they all have much more affirmed cultures than us.

Dead New Labour made it worse.



North Ireland should join the South
and have both money types for a year,
as they change.

Republic Of Scotland
would be good
but it does not have public backing - enough.

Our economy is none of your concern as we are not part of the UK.

What about the isle of man, Jersey, Guernsey, the Falklad islands and Gibralter. You going to include them in your plan?

Your so dim it's actually hysterical.

I can see N.Ireland being integrated back into Ireland at some point.

But Scotland and Wales is far more complex. They clearly don't want full independence as they currently kinda get the best of both worlds...their own parliament and identity but with the UK safety net.

I don't see it changing anytime soon. Too much effort. Maybe if the monarchy ever gets abolished it may trigger a move towards truly separate countries.

A Nuke in a Van
could do that.
No warning.

just under 10m people in NI, Scotland and Wales with 51.4m living in England...

Its not ignorant or big headded to say that. The UK is a bigger and more powerful entity than the 4 countries together; the UK parliament can overrule any legislation set by the Scottish or N.Irish parliaments.

:rolleyes:

Yes, the United Kingdom is, not England - which is what you said in your post.

Its based in London and is the same parliament that governs England.

Just because it's based in London, doesn't mean England rules over the other three. Your ignorance is a stereotypical view that creates animosity towards the English.

Oh well then if thats the case can we have our 3 and 1/4 billion quid back. Oh and could you drop a line to the bureaucrats in europe and tell them not to ask the UK for any coin to save your failing economy in the future?

I am so glad you understand the inter relationships between international economies.

Sorry which university did you go to?
Oh wait you don't need any qualifications to be a full time druggie.

The implication being that going to University automatically means you are a smart, well rounded individual? That must be one of the most baseless, frighteningly pretentious things you could possibly say in an argument.

I'm doing a course in film and TV production right now, dumbass. And smoking a bit of pot and drinking hardly makes you a 'full time druggie'.

You should know. You went to University. Bottom feeder.

A course in film and tv production, wow I take everything back, you are a little smartie :pat:

Yeah film and tv is so gay. I'm such a looser.

No you just got punk'd the hell out for looking like an absoloute prat parading on about how you went to university therefore you must be an intelligent, ignorance free person not considering that the argument is flawed beyond belief and the person you are talking to might also be attending university. And that's not to mention the wonderful assumption that I'm a 'full time druggie'.

And you wonder why I called you dim. The idea of you schooling someone else on a countrys cultural contributions and self sufficiency is worth more laughing smileys than the limits will allow. You jumped in at the deep end and rightly got attacked by multiple people for having absoloutely no idea what you are talking about. As usual.

Ireland's economic woes have nothing to do with it's independence from England. It has everything to do with the few and the greedy messing it up for the rest of us. Something that happens in plenty of other countries. Before that our economy was on absoloute fire as an independent Republic.

Look up the term 'celtic tiger', special needs.

So if Ireland was part of the UK it would still be in the same mess right now?

It's a question that's impossible to fathom. You cannot possibly begin to try and answer it given so many other factors would have to be taken into account with regard to how it would have affected world history and economics. What you are saying is fucking retarded. I suppose that's what I'm getting at. And I'm certainly no expert on the matter. Difference is I don't pretend to be. You made your original post not out of some intensive economic probing on your part ... but because your just a bit ignorant and can't appreciate Ireland because it doesn't get enough sunlight to produce quality Reality TV ... or we have too many foxes ... or something else daft like that.

You might want to look up Ireland's record during British rule though. We didn't exactly flourish.

Very true, Irelands economic boom from the mid 90's through to 2007 was envied around the world, a great pity that recent governments didnt have a forward thinking economic policies and profits werent wisely re-invested to buffer the economy.

We never kicked Fianna Fail out and it has come back to haunt us. They couldn't capatalize on what they helped start and the small mindedness of the voting majority refued to realize alternatives existed instead of good old reliable Fianna Fail.

Of course this is all meaningless to ILoveTRW who has not even factored in the idea of multiple parties, ideologies and systems of regulation. It's either 'Ireland' runs Ireland ... some abstract shadowy force of control ... or England runs Ireland.

Actually The Real World: Dublin is in the pipeline

That question is a bit like asking what would the world be like if the yanks were still one of our colonies isnt it? One thing is for sure Ireland wouldnt have had the economic success it did.

Why do you think you lending us money gives you a claim to our country?

His not saying that. Just pointing out how our economies are very interconnected. You cant say to someone 'oh well your in England so our economy is of no concern to you'. England are our biggest trading partner. Of course it matters.

I agree with that, I was replying to ILTRW when Shasown decided to interject with his patronizing response.

I still don't really think its all that fair that England don't have its own Parliament like Wales, Scotland and Ireland. It annoys me :bored:

Really?

Awesome, I hope Noirin goes on it or something.
Any idea when we could expect it?

Obviously it won't be in early 2011, 'Cause of Las Vegas :(

It amuses me though how English people can moan about something like this yet through History they've been, quite frankly dick heads to other countries over silly things and stick their nose into everything and then because they don't have a Parliament it's so 'unfair'.


I'm not having a go at you Blitzen, 'Cus we've always got along but your post just reminded me.

eww. why would they want horseface back on it when she was only an extra on the show before?

No doubt she'll try to get on it.

ps; youre mentioned in my siggy btw....feel honoured!