Not fussed really. There're a handful I'd always say no to because of the scare stories / personal experience with them (family members, etc.) but otherwise I'm quite laidback about it all... there's nothing more miserable than a zealot trying to dampen everyone else's lives because their own sucks :bored:

I agree with Stu's logic; people who take drugs at a low point are asking for trouble, those who take them to enhance a good time, fair play really. I've done drugs, both were legal at the time (one still is), wanted to see what they were like, I did, now I won't do them again. I'd never touch illegal drugs, and having seen the effect hard drugs had on some of my friends, that decision will always be final. One of my friends was doing heroin for "fun", she came dangerously close to going over that line of casual use to serious problem, lost most of her friends because of it and it's taken a year of weaning herself off these things and trying to rebuild her life to get it back on track; and she didn't even have what I'd consider a full blown drug addiction. It's sad to watch, but there's nothing you can do to discourage someone who wants to get themselves in that situation.

Heroin for fun. Jesus christ. Sadly I have seen it happen to those of whom I knew very loosely. The suburb I live in is pretty ... eh ... low class and I can count five people in the past 18 months who went to school with me who overdosed on the stuff. On that note I am really, really against the 'tough on Heroin users' brigade that seek to crucify drug addicts at the weakest point in their lives. Nobody asks to be a Heroin addict. Sure most of us should know the dangers but often your family, social status, mindset, environment, young age etc can combine to push you to it. I have nothing but sympathy for the true victims of Heroin addiction. Because victims do exist and genuine human beings do exist beneath the veins.

Look at smokers. All of us start it KNOWING it will someday more than likely contribute to our death.

This topic has also made clear to me that you lot clearly consider H to be the big one. Which is wrong. It's nothing compared to Crystal Meth, which all loyal Dog The Bounty Hunter [What?, WHAT?] viewers will be familiar with. A far, far more devestating drug than Heroin without a doubt. If it catches hold big time in either of the British Isles we are screwed.

Meth is horrible stuff. Like being wired to a mains horrible.

Dog the Bounty Hunter? Dog the ****ing Bounty Hunter?? Jesus! What kind of plebs watch that ****??

*blushes*

-has watched it from time to time-

His wife is...jesus. I don't know where to start. Those tits could knock out Ali.

She seems to be a bastion of glory to cocksteady males who honestly could not care less what the rest of a woman looks like as long as she has ginormous baps. The son is a little gob****e too. All a pack of gob****es, but it's hard to resist it when you are hungover at 10 in the morning.

I loved it when they all got battered by a load of Ice heads and ran lol

She's looking better nowadays and has lost a LOT of weight but man those breests!! I've never seen anything like them! Good looking face though

My personal favourite is when the ditzy daughter unexpectedly caught the criminal mastermind on her own and armed with her Hawiian charm and bun in the oven attempted to stop him with the force of err ... whatever ... then got pushed slightly as the guy ran away.

Cue The Dawg who bursts onto the scene ten minutes later demanding she press charges for assault.

Ohhh I remember that, she made such a meal of it lol It looked like she pretty much tripped over herself. The Brother that ike dived on him playing hero would be more likely to get done for assault.

That is one thing that annoys me about the show, all the self righteous stuff they babble on about.

I've tried all drugs to the point of over indulgence over many years , but don't touch them at all now....i think cannabis should be legalized and licensed and the tax should go into rehabs for people with other drug problems. In fact if you legalized all drugs it would massively undermine the criminals power. I like that idea

Dooooggg the Bounty Hunterrrrr. My flatmate's obsessed with him, he's hilarious.

Drugs are for the weak minded.

Thats my general view.

Do you include alcohol/cigarettes in that statement Zippy?

Don't see the point of it, but if someone likes it, I'm not going to judge.
Only smoked weed a couple of times, but that's it.

well to some degree. I mean, most people start off on them through peer pressure or a great need to seem cool or mature. The strong minded who know themselves and don't feel any need to impress will just do their own thing.

But with cigs and booze they can start off pretty young so I guess its more forgivable as they are impressionable and easily led.

But more hardcore drugs taken with direct intent to alter your mindset, yeah, weak minded. Music and good company have always been enough to give me a great night out.

I don't think you can generalise. I was never a drinker, and now I don't drink at all. Whereas others my age have serious drink problems.

I used to smoke, but I quit 7 years ago. Others my age are smoking 40+ per day and finding it impossible to quit.

I used to do drugs, but I haven't done them since I was 19/20. I don't consider myself weak minded, or a follower. I didn't do them to impress anyone. I did them because I wanted to. And you could argue that I was young and impressionable, but I think you are wrong to say I was/am weak-minded, because that is one thing I am certainly not.

I don't think there is any difference between drugs, alcohol or cigarettes. All of them ought to be legal. There will always be people who over-indulge, but there will be more who do not.

Anti-drugs campaigners need to get off their high-horse, especially ones who drink and/or smoke. I fail to see how anyone can take the moral high ground when they are indulging in their own brand of legal high.

Well laws are there to set guidelines and send out a message as to what society finds acceptable. Remove them and you are opening the floodgates. Which may not be pretty. And no form of drug taking should be encouraged at this point. Drugs are addictive and drug addicts are pathetic and useless to society; harsh but true.

If we were starting from scratch I think there is a case to be made that they are equal. But cigs and alcohol have been an acceptable part of our culture for centuries. Industries have been built on them. They are an integral part of society. It's just not realistic to now class them as first class drugs and make them illegal. But that doesnt mean we should now make more hardcore drugs as available and acceptable. Thats backwards logic.

Drugs should never be legalised, and as for alcohol the age limit should be raised to 21 years old. Cigarettes are already "illegal" in the sense that smokers can no longer smoke in most public places which protects non smokers from having to breathe in their obnoxious and potentially lethal smoke. Who is going to protect the public from irresponsible alcoholics/binge drinkers and drug users, especially those who get into a lethal weapon and kill people on the roads, or those that can't handle the stimuli and get violent and aggressive? People who use drugs or drink and drive should have the full weight of the law thrown at them if they're caught - absolutely zero tolerance.

Do people really believe the only reason anyone has ever popped a pill is so everyone noticed how cool they were or because they cannot have a good enough time without it? Jesus H. It's 2010, kids.

I agree. Something a large majority of people will continue to do should absoloutely be left in the hands of criminals because I personally don't like it, so other people who do should suffer or be more like me. If we taxed something like Cannabis all we would end up with is a safer product and enough tax money to build enough schools and hospitals to fill the inside of Jupiter.

Those stoner *******. Lol.

I just think it's unfortunate that we live in a culture that is so blase and bored with life, that people need narcotics to make it seem more interesting or at least make us feel sensations we would otherwise have no access to. The extent to which Brits drink alcohol like water suggests an awful lot of lives one would rather escape from.

Not that I would ban people from having the option. Prohibition of alcohol resulted in mass organised crime in the United States, just as banning cannabis, cocaine and ecstasy results the underground sale of recreational drugs today.

actually humanity has a long long history of drugs use in various forms and for long periods drugs now considered bad have been acceptable in some cultures and still are.

I find your comments about addicts being pathetic and useless to society a bit hurtful. actually many addicts hold responsible jobs and also have contributed a great deal to society, including many great philosophers artists, politicians etc.

although i respect your right to have an opinion I'd like to gently encourage you to consider that addicts are individuals who all have different stories. I'll give you an example. A close friend of mine who was generally considered to be one of the most thoughtful kind and considerate people and loved by many was an addict, he fought hard against his problems and managed to achieve considerable lengths of time clean but had various issues , which i wont go into out of respect for his privacy . sadly he relapsed and died, but the world was a better place because of his life, addict or not.

addicts can include all kinds of people from sweet old ladies to children who all have their own stories and reasons for the situation they end up in. The stereotype of dangerous young criminals is just a part of the story.

I wouldn't normally respond so emphatically to someone elses opinion which after all is not really any of my business, but i just wanted to ask you to be a little more open minded.

My attitude towards drugs is that they should remain banned. They degrade people's mental and physical health. I understand that one reason for drugs to be legalised is because they are under the control of criminal gangs but I don't think that mind altering substances should be distributed freely by the government.

However I do kinda think that less dangerous drugs such as weed should be legalised as I saw on TV in Holland how everybody there just treats weed as they would in countries where it is illegal. But drugs like ecstasy, meth and heroin should remain strictly banned.

I think the government should help those taking drugs more so they can ween themselves away from them. I've seen the effects of drugs first hand on my brother and I think its awful.

How many people die a year from Ecstacy? Three? Four? How many people get sick from contaminated pills? How many familys are destroyed by harsh sentences handed down for people dancing like a tit for a few hours? It's just another case where the law against the substance causes more harm than the substance itself. It doesn't take a math major.

The governments leading scientific adviser on drugs - Prof. David Nutt - published a report detailing deadpan how horse riding was a far more dangerous pastime.

He was sacked, of course.

Lets not be glamourising drug addicts now. An addict is a slave to their addiction. Thats not a position of strength no matter how you wanna twist it. It's a position of weakness. Hardcore addicts become all consumed by their addiction, its all they can think about from one day to the next.

It's all very well you bringing sweet old ladies and innocent children into the mix but these are far more likely to be abused children or medical drug addictions. I'm referring to adults who choose to take drugs for recreational use. Lets be clear about that otherwise we're covering a huge minefield of issues.

drugs are nawty

Its not the deaths that ecstasy causes, its the mental illnesses that it causes in people which scares me a lot more.

I dunno, if a government took charge of drugs and made them safe then I'd support it but I can't see that happening.

Nutt's logic is completely flawed though. He said horse riding was worse because more people die of it; he said recently that alcohol was more dangerous than heroin because more people die of it. Both claims may be true but to simplify it down to such an extent that you are solely considering deaths just doesnt hold weight in my mind.

yes maybe to speak of old ladies and children was patronising and manipulative , but these people are addicts as well. i agree that being addicted is not a position of strength, but i disagree that they are necessarily 'pathetic and useless'. and yes addiction does cover an area with a huge minefield of issues, you need to accept this if you're going to enter into the debate with a degree of credibility.

Just because Alcohol has been legal for all this time doesn't make it better than illegal drugs. I'm not suggesting alcohol be made illegal, even though I hold strong feelings about it.

It seems the main reason most drugs are still illegal has more to do with governments aiming to please the people who sip their alcohol and sit in judgement about drug use.

well if an adult chooses to take drugs they are not an addict...many people choose to take drugs , once you are addicted you lose choice. Have you ever been addicted to anything?

er, I was the one who said it so obviously I accept it. :rolleyes:

and Im not interested in having credibility. Im not an expert on drugs...neither are you. I came into this thread stating that I generally see drug users as weak minded. I stand by that but understand there are exceptional cases.

Beyond thinking theyre weak minded I cast no great judgement on them. Everybody knows recreational drugs can lead you to a bad place. If you choose to take that route then you have made your bed.

Again, Im not referring to medication drugs.

But in fairness, you can't ignore medication drugs.... many people are not prescribed them... but plenty take them / procure them for 'recreational' purposes as a choice. Not through necessity of needing them for medical reasons, so I don't think you can dismiss that aspect.

but I mean drugs taken for medical reasons that have then become addictive. That is not recreational use.

Meh.. luckily enough it's something that I've never experienced in life or had around me in my family.

My point is that medicinal drugs are not exclusive on the 'for medical reasons only' stance. They need to be considered in the debate as well. I understand what you are saying, I do, but I also understand what the other poster was saying too.

But Im not referring to any specific drugs. I thought Id made it clear that Im referring to adults who take drugs for recreational use? If you're taking prescribed drugs for anything other than medical conditions then that counts as recreational use.

It's about the intent rather than the actual labels on the drugs.

hi pete doherty

I wouldn't describe myself as an expert either , but i do work in a drug and alcohol rehab and from experience i don't see addicts as weak minded, pathetic or useless in fact many of our clients are highly intelligent, creative and successful people and of those who are not when recovered go on to do amazing things. I believe the bottom line with drug use is that people want or need to change the way they feel, that is the common denominator that is combined with the physical addiction. medicinal drugs taken as prescribed are not considered a problem, but many addicts do abuse them for for the same reasons they would abuse any other drug. It is an interesting job and a real privilege to work with such an interesting an diverse set of clients. there are lots of theories about why addiction takes hold of a person, it's not just peer pressure but that obviously plays a part for many. Out of any group of teenage friends who smoke puff and use party drugs it's normal for one or two to go on to become addicts and it is often the more sensitive ones who for the first time feel more able to socialise or find a relief escape difficult feelings. unconscious self medication for various mental ailments and conditions , from depression, reactive stress (after a bereavement for eg) to mild autistic conditions. To say these people are somehow inherently weak (implying lack of moral fiber) is a common misunderstanding which fuels the stigma about addiction and addicts. I don't mean to sound like a complete soft touch, addicts through their addiction can often be a total pain in the arse and cause untold misery to their families and communities and have to face the consequences for this like anyone else. I'm just challenging the notion of them being completely weak, pathetic and useless. thanks x

well quite. So choice comes before addiction.

which means you have time to back away.

And no, because I approach addictive things with great caution...especially if I know theyre bad for my health. Funnily enough, I don't find that very hard to do. It's called being sensible and actually giving a fck about myself and my body.

Some people just don't care enough about themselves. Weak minded people.